Twins changes thread
Twins is the least played killer in the game, with terrible performance across the board. But, due to having high killrates when played in high mmr, they haven't received any buffs, changes or reworks for a long time, in fact, they had their addons nerfed a few patches back.
At the third lowest killrate and lowest pickrate by a long shot, down at the bottom of the list you'll find Twins.
I know it's been done to death, and everyone knows what should change, but I've compiled a list of all the buffs I'd give Twins, mainly to make them less clunky to play, and become less reliant on slugging due to how clunky their power feels to use. The issue with them isn't necessarily that they're weak, but that they feel terrible to play due to all the restrictions. Here are the changes.
MOST IMPORTANT:
- Make it possible to swap to Charlotte immediately after successfully downing a survivor with Pounce.
- Reduce Charlottes swap cooldown from 3 to 2 seconds, ideally with only 1 second of darkness and slowdown, and 1 extra second before she can attack, and the hud comes back as normal.
- Rewrite the swapping to be less clunky. Right now it takes a split second where you have to hold the button down to swap. This may be deliberate, but I personally find it unnecessary and makes the character feel just a tad bit less smooth to play.
These two changes alone, small, tiny changes that could be implemented in a day would make Twins infnitely less clunky to play, with little change in their power level. Most of their strength comes from being able to relentlessly slug, defend hooks and tunnel by camping and sending Victor, not in how long it takes to swap between characters.
PICKING UP VICTOR
- Let Charlotte pick Victor up from the ground. If you want Twins players to slug less and hook more, being able to pick up Victor would be a fantastic way to improve this. Right now, if you down a survivor somewhere on the map and go pick them up to hook, you're almost incentivized to leave Charlotte or Victor near the hook because it's not worth it to move both of them away from the hooked person.
OTHER BUFFS AND CHANGES:
- Latched Victor prevents fast vaults. Kind of oppressive on paper, would make for a good addon if it's too strong as basekit. But at the same time it would also incentivize Twins to hunt together and not just slug, which would be good.
- Reduce recall time to 20s. Holding Victor hostage is a smart move, perhaps the long cooldown here is deliberate, but it's still very punishing and unfun for newer players. Doing this may make them a bit too powerful in high level games though.
- Increase regrow duration after being kicked to 10s. Could even be 15s, but we don't want to punish too much. Truth is it feels really bad when you outplay Victor, and another one comes running 8 seconds later.
- Reduce hook penalty radius to 8m. This one is controversial, perhaps not even a good idea. If you could pick up Victor you might not even need to change it. But as it is now, it feels like you're punished for no reason when you just want to send out Victor, or use your power as someone's near the hook. Although this change might cause more camping. Still something to consider. If you've played Twins you know this restriction is tedious to play around.
- Rework their addons. You've done a great job with Legion and Ghost Face, I'm sure you can find some cool reworks to Twins too. An idea I had is that latched Victor prevents pulling down pallets. Again would incentivize them to hunt together instead of just slugging.
I know it's a long post, but if you're one of the 3 Twins players or you have any thoughts, please tell me what you think.
Comments
The twins don't need a buff. She is actually fine as she is, not he strongest but certainly not the weakest. She is however, one of the most boring killers in all of DBD. In a chase, she is a base 115 killer with no actual power, this is really boring. Before you say "ok she needs a power in the chase." This would actually make her massively oppressive. Victor is near unavoidable and you should not be missing often. So you send him out, throw him on a survivor who is now marked and basically run him down. Now you run him down charlotte stands near the hook waiting for the save. You send him back out and and repeat.
What is worse is the best way to play the twins is to down somebody and then send victor out. Slugging is a massive part of the twins power. Where you stand on slugging does not matter, but it always does one thing, massively slow the game down. Every match played by good twins players can slow the game down to an unnatural degree that it just drags. Even the killer gets bored at a certain point, because they just want to move onto the next match. Imagine playing a 20 minute match of twins and still losing? That sounds miserable, now imagine doing that multiple times. She does not need a buff, and she certainly does not need a nerf, she needs a complete redesign.
What if while playing as Victor you could call Charlotte to Victors location. This would help prevent just slugging as Victor.
Some grat ideas overall I agree with,
Reduce hook penalty radius to 8m [...]However I disagree with this. I understand it doesn't feel great to not be able to use the power near hooks, but it will just make camping with twins easier and I don't want that.
One other issue I have with twins is that most twins players play only victor, and charlotte is only there to pickup bodies. Why this happens? Because Victor is super fast. The killer is "Twins", not "Victor", that's why I dislike it.
For this I'd like victor to have a new restriction like the followings (either one):
If there's something of this kind done for twins, I would definitively enjoy more playing against them.
I used to be main Twins before boon totems, but its true, bhvr really needs to rework Twins,they came out in december 2020 e didnt even got any buffs, just nerfs on addons, and they are really fun to play, I wish I could find more Twins in the fog