Gandor
Gandor
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@Bradcore said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3464492#Comment_3464492
Since I primarily play Survivor and I remember when someone could be taken down immediately after being unhooked, it was very fun. People had to be much more methodical about unhooking their teammates and not just blindly run in right in front of the killer. The instant takedown risk made for a much more enjoyable and tense game than it is today.
Right. And I remember time, where 4 survivors could dip via hatch or time where there were infinites in the map and that was fun and now the game is boring for it. And I am saying it totally as a killer main /s
No. It was totally unfair. Everyone either had borrowed time, or killer got very free tunneling - and all the killers knew it so the abuse factor was huge (which was mostly felt in case of selfish soloQ)
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@HugTheHag said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3464368#Comment_3464368
I wouldn't mind those suggestions if there was an option to not display them.
I'm a ######### player and a slow learner. I don't want people to see my game time and mmr and mock me. I don't even want to know my own mmr because then I'd compare mine to my friends and it would put tension in something that should just be a game and fun.
I firmly think mmr should stay hidden if the player does not want it broadcasted.
sure. Make it optionally hidden
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I was afraid this topic would be about shortening time interval between screams (to again create issue of uncleansable hexes), but this idea actually sounds good. A good buff. I am all for it
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All of the mentioned plus MMR, hours of each player and every other kind of information that could possibly be gotten. A history of played matches (at least last 10) would be nice - especially if they updated to fill in killer perks/addons/offerings once the game ends.
In endgame screen the match is over. It does not matter for that game any more - so all the other information serves for me to reflect on things (and to correct some biases expectations - like I won because it's soloQ or I lost because it's SWF).
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1, there never was killer-repeat-prevention system. There's such a system only for maps (and even this I suspect does not work very reliably).
2, wesker is actually fine. The reason why you see him so often is, that he's very well designed (unlike most other killers). Meaning he's much more fun to play so many more people play him. The only thing that devs could look at is his infection mechanics after unhooking (but it's not being abused too much, so it's not super-burning thing).
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He's super hard killer, but (arguably - nurse exists) also the strongest. If you make him easier ("fix" his collisions), he most definitely needs huge nerf.
Think about what you actually want out of him
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At this time I have no idea what's the argument for hiding this number. If I tunnel, I don't need hook count. I am searching for freshly unhooked person no matter how many hooks he has...
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@JustAShadow said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3463788#Comment_3463788
Zoning survivors in the part of the map you've trapped is basically the same as Trapper and Hag who are some of the worst killers in the game and survivors can just communicate the pods positions and disable them.
Again, I didn't say he should guarantee a hit on every tile but what is the point of using your power if it can do nothing half of the time? Why would you play a killer who he can only get hits when survivors are mispositioned and using your power can just be a placebo?
Getting rid of pallets is not such a strong power as you make it appear, yes he can get rid of the pallets quicker than most killers, but so what? Bubba forces quick pallet drops and even has an instadown, but is he a strong killer? By the time you get rid of a decent amount pallets it might be already too late to capitalize if the survivors are efficient on gens. Let's say you got to a point where you have a barren map but there's only 1 gen left and 4 survivors alive. At this point survivors can just go die in a corner and the gens will be done anyway despite the lack of any pallets(also windows are still a thing). I still wouldn't say that Singularity is weak(I consider him slightly above average), but having a lot of your power be just getting rid of pallets faster is just not as strong as you make it out to be.
Also I think you underestimate how map dependent this killer can be. Using your power on indoor maps(apart from Midwich), newly reworked Red Forest and the new map is a detriment most of the time with all the LOS blockers and wonky camera detection.
Using singularity in azarov's too strong. Nerf the killer...
See? The killer has strong and weak maps. You can't balance him around Lery's, because then it's perfectly valid to wanting him balanced around open maps w good visibility.
Also the killer is already strong and can apply his powers very reliably also mid chase. There was already a tournament with best comp players and the killer did not do bad (like he wasn't nurse-level good, but we are talking about relatively complex killer that has been live for about 2 weeks - give him more time and he will dominate - same as wesker with his bounce techs and hug tech and all that)
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Now you are more then cherry-picking. Give more info to killer and remove surv-favoring offering. How would you like it swapped on you - survs can choose map without offering and killer does not see anything about survivors? Not fair - right?
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1, legion is very much fine. If anything, he needs tiny buff - but I am afraid of giving him anything, because he's already very close to very good state.
2, I take issue with saying survivors have just 2 choises - those being pallets and windows. Especially against legion you can very well use lockers, corner techs, window techs and even 360s work well. Not to mention all the other stats (like teamplay/game sense of spreading around, bodyblocking ability when mending for other teammate, running corners away from your team when being chased in ability, 99-ing mend).
This whole post feels just like someone got destroyed by legion and instead of taking note what was done bad in a match - came to forum to complain instead
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@Dream_Whisper said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3464099#Comment_3464099
If anything, making it only a offerings exclusive to the survivor or killer using it on their own would be better; and it can grant extra 200% BP instead of the usually 100% bonus BP; to reward players with the crazy scenario that they do not have their own exclusive perks and they something completely different.
I don't think there should be a offerings that exclusive punished the other sides, like map offerings specifically. Giving killers or Survivors the ability to throw in a offering and they away their precious build would be smart; especially when their is perk related challenges they need to do or adept challenges involved; if anything they might want to DC because of it.
I am all for adding possibility to randomize MY OWN build. For both sides. But not an offering that screws over the other side.
As for map offerings - I think it's balanced by the fact that killer sees lobby before start (checking items, hours played, ...). Remove both or keep it the way it is.
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I like this event stuff for both sides. The only thing I did not enjoy is the fact, that you can't do enduring on yourself during bubba chain sprint. But overall it creates more depth and more unpredictability and in the end - more fun
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Bound envelope does exist if you need that so much. Otherwise take personal offerings.
However this idea has 0 merits. It punishes all killers for no reason at all.
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@Hernancito said:
I think what DEVS could do on this is to create an OFFERING that makes all survivors starts the game with random PERKS, this will help a lot. :D
Absolutely not. That's about as stupid as having offering where killer can't do anything for first minute of the match. You would also not like it. Would you?
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@Zenislev said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3464011#Comment_3464011
Do you think the average killer is going to be getting 1000 wins in a row? Look man, I can't speak for the experiences of content creators. It's their job to play this game. Like I said before time =~ experience =~ skill, and who has more time to play this game than someone who's literal job it is to do so.
I will never reach the point where I'm getting a 1000 win streak, and neither will most people, so I can only speak to my own experiences playing the game as an "average" killer.
Not really sure where you're pulling your solo queue survivor streak number from, but let's say it's true. And? What's your point? Someone losing their escape streak doesn't mean that the game they personally lost in was a loss for the team as a whole. It's a 4 v 1 game. If a person loses their streak but they did so while looping the killer for 5 gens, then they did great and that killer lost.
The devs claim that they aim for a 60% kill rate, which means they expect the average game to be about 7 hooks, with 2 of them being death hooks. I don't believe that for a second. If that were true than they would have implemented something to incentivize hooks over kills, because as it is right now, you can get 7 hooks and unless those hooks manage to kill someone, you can get no value out of them and end the game in a 4 person escape. They also would have pushed the healing nerfs through to give killers some form of pressure after they gutted gen kicking and they wouldn't have allowed DH to be the most broken perk in the game for years and years, while gutting every killer perk that inconveniences survivors. If a meta rolls around that allows survivors to have easy games, it gets to stick around forever. If a meta rolls around that makes things even slightly easier for killers, it needs to be deleted as soon as possible. What would you call that if not a survivor bias?
Ah. So suddenly it's not devs making every game easy for survivors, but your lack of skill.
Highest soloQ escape streak holder is by Ayrun and some German streamer (both at 34 or something close to it). As for killer, there's a blight player with 1000 winstreak, but I don't remember his name. There's also Supaalf with 555+ kill streak on nurse. All of which is on VODs.
As for "average" experience - you said it right. Kill rate is above 50%. So what gives? How can you call the game totally survivor sided, when in fact even weaker killers do good in "high MMR" now. Top ~10 killers do very well even against comp survivors with insane experience and clock callouts and all that.
And yet here we are with people like you that are unhappy with "just" more kills then escapes - calling the game sided for people that has less then 50% survivol rate. Don't you even feel bad for that?
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@DrDucky said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3462030#Comment_3462030
That is not what was said, the mod right now just confirmed basekit unbreakable is scrapped but finisher mori is still being worked on.
I had older information
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@Zenislev said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3463929#Comment_3463929
It's really easy to understand and I don't get how you don't see it. Although it's not a perfect indicator of skill, reaching P100 on a character takes time. Time =~ experience =~ skill. A player that's P100 on a character is more likely to be better at the game than someone who doesn't have one. Again, not a perfect indicator, but it gives you a rough idea of what to expect. The game isn't going to be ruined by not being able to see character levels, but in the absence of better matchmaking or more ways to gauge the overall survivor team's skill, it makes the game worse.
As far as it being an "us vs them" thing, I mean, that's also obvious. The devs cater to survivors. If survivors want something, they get it. If survivors don't like a thing, they don't get it. The devs have already mentioned that they're talking about this, so it's likely that you're going to be able to hide your character level at some point, despite it making the killer's experience worse because they want to cater to survivors. It's not hard to connect the dots man, and it's hardly a simplification.
Sure. That explains why best killers have literally 1000 wins in a row while best soloQ survivor 34. Or why devs target kill rate to be over fair 50%. And you talk about bias...
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@JoaoVanBlizzard said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3463121#Comment_3463121
you got it wrong, I mean the event pallets, because they are destroyed without the need for the killer to break them, so instead of the pallets serving to protect the surv, they become something for the surv to kill itself, it's more advantageous to take a hit from the killer than to use the event palettes
I don't want the perk nerfed, it is great on killers like Bubba, who suffers in loops and needs to charge the Chainsaw, I apologize for the misunderstanding, I was referring only to the event palettes and not the default game palettes
Yes. I also meant event pallets (just that T got consumed by me not clicking well on keyboard - so sorry - I will edit it now). Actually bubba does not need hubris at all IMO. And event pallets are still useful, because a, you can be already injured b, you can usually make it to next safety a lot of times (sure - not always). I think it's only fair
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@yeeeitsdustin said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3461206#Comment_3461206
If you read the first part of the changes, I mentioned that those addons need to be changed. Whether they're able to be changed or not, this is all just a theoretical suggestion. Just pretend those addons went away, then imagine these buffs for him
provided those addons do not exist, I like your suggestion. It would be just the right buff for the killer. Nothing crazy, but still quite noticable
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If you have problem with your game and ignore it = DC's you are repeatedly spoiling the game for other 4 players. Bans are perfectly deserved. Fix underlying problem (like internet if that's the issue)
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I think it's absolutely fair for Hubris to NOT be an exception. Every stun you can do will trigger hubris - even flashlight save or blast mine. I see exactly no reason why event pallets should be an exception. The perk is not that good as is.
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@LapisInfernalis said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3462701#Comment_3462701
Exactly what I thought. Is nurse the strongest killer in the game? Yes. Has Blight a handful of very questionable addons? Yes. Is Wesker popular because he is fun for both sides? Yes.
I do think that Blight needs his addons looked at. I don't play Blight, but I know that he has about 5 addons which are op or borderline op (Ring, C33, Adre Vial, Iri Tag and maybe Crow/Rat if I am correct). If they change those, he is fine. You are a blight main. What do you think?
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3462793#Comment_3462793
Probably they will come with something like "he can do everything" (inbuilt slowdown, info, mobility, chase and "stealth") or that his power has ######### hitboxes or similar. Or they faced someone who can so the funny stuff XD.
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3462792#Comment_3462792
He just gets played a lot now because he was killswitched for 10 days. And people say the same now as they said when he released. That he is op because he has a high pickrate. There is nothing wrong with him. Some people just want easy games.
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3462707#Comment_3462707
So only because I like how a certain killer plays and play them myself I am a bad person if said killer is on the stronger end? So you are saying I should feel bad if I don't play Clown or Trapper or Myers every match to get stomped by tbagging survivors making fun of me?
Sorry, I'd like to keep my sanity.
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3462686#Comment_3462686
How many hrs do you have? Are you a survivor main? Do you play those killers yourself? Playing these killers yourself would show you a lot about how they work and how you can counter them. Wesker for example has tons of counterplay.
I agree with your whole post (also to other reactions).
The only thing I would adjust is remove iri tag (this one is hard to get value from and there's counterplay once you know + it's iri addon - so it's fine) from list of OP addons and only consider double speed to be OP (survivors have literally 0 reaction time/counterplay and it's entirely in blight's hands if he rushes correctly or not get a hit - literally nothing a survivor can do - maybe predrop pallet if it's strong one). Ofc the rest of the list stands (and he still has very good but not op addons regardless of those already mentioned. Like C21)
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@Devil_hit11 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3462054#Comment_3462054
strong SWF already understand every map to its wireframe and they already use clock call outs to know what part of the map they are in. The amount that it would buff swf is insignificant to amount it buff solo's.
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3462282#Comment_3462282
whenever your playing killer, matches vs swf feel a lot more intense. I don't know what it is about those matches that feel so intense but it just feel different. what your describing is better gsme-sense and soloq should have same game-sense opportunity at base-kit.
Agreed. And yet - you don't have that in soloQ. So no matter how good you are, you will loose A LOT.
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@DaddyMyers_Mori said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3461954#Comment_3461954
If I want to tunnel, I don't need hook counter...
Well. That was a very fast tl;dr version of my post 😂
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Well no? If u can land your chains, you just win. Hold-W is weak in that case, because walking speed is much slower then killer's speed. There are more killers that suffer from hold-W more then pinhead, then there are killers that suffer less.
It seems you don't know pinhead vety much. Even when going against him - you don't have to wait for 3rd chain. All you have to do is pre-dodge and start to solve the box before flying chain hits something.
To be frank - I really like the state pinhead is in right now. Mostly as him, but he is also ok to go against. But he absolutely does not need buffs (just don't change impailing wire addon as that one feels almost required against better survs).
Right now he's my 2nd most played killer
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@CatnipLove said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/380266/maybe-a-hot-take-but
I'm not sure if Solo Q needs constant aura reading. But if you did have a system like that, maybe it could just show the aura of other survivors briefly at key moments. Like when a survivor gets downed/hooked or a generator pops. Just enough information to know who is in the best position to serve what function at certain times.
Honestly though, I feel like Solo Q falls apart due to bad matchmaking more than it does from the lack of information. When you get a good group of solo survivors the match is usually pretty winnable. In fact, you can do most things, other than being a massive pain to the killer player (chain blinding/stunning ect). But the matchmaking focuses on reducing wait times, so Solo Q is a mess.
Exactly this.
The biggest advantage for SWF is by far not comms. Like sure, it helps. But much more important is, that I can rely on my teammates knowing they will not hide in corner. That someone will take protection hit/whole chase/maybe even deliberate down when a other surv is being tunneled. That I will not hit 2nd stage on hook. That there won't be 1 survivor that will be vastly weaker (a norm with current MMR and 3v1 in this game is super hard). That nobody will throw the game for challenge or hook suicide.
Comms are less then any of the points mentioned above - even though I agree comms do help.
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@Coffeecrashing said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3462023#Comment_3462023
The combination of "everyone slugged = mori" and "basekit unbreakable" was scrapped. I don't think the devs ever said basekit mori would never be in the game, because there's still a chance it might be in the game from some other trigger.
For example, maybe the mori feature will unlock if the killer hooks survivors 6 (or 7 or 8) separate times. This would encourage killers to go for hooks instead of kills, and if it unlocks on 6 or 7 separate hooks, they would be rewarded for playing for hooks, which is what everyone should want, right?
It would be still survivor nerf.
Let me explain - my SWF group verses tunnelers all the time. But we actively try to combat it. My specialty is sabotages - and if you know how, you can still force a trade quite reliably (provided you are not on saloon with it's 1000 hooks per 10m2). This is good idea if you have 0 hooks and killer clearly tunnels someone with 1 hook already. Other teammates play more for flashlights/flashbangs/pallet saves/bodyblocks. But the end result is the same - we force killer to spread hooks + hooking survivor is always something that poses risk.
BTW when I played soloQ (which I don't do any more - as soloQ is just nightmare in conditions the game is in. I rather play killer then going soloQ) - I played exactly the same. The only difference is, that my other teammates a lot of times did not spread hooks the way I did (lowering our collective chance to escape) - but some actually did and the chances were higher if I already made a good play.
However ebony mori and your suggestion rob us of that chance later in the game - which basically makes tunneling that much harder to counter
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@UndeddJester said:
I'm still learning this game, but I watch a lot of streamers to help me learn the game, and I would be against hook stages being on HUD for the killer.
I think if you're playing the game properly on Killer, you don't need a counter, its part of the game to track downs on killer. You should be actively tracking hook stages in your mind to decide which of your targets are more valuable to you. That isn't necessarily a tunneling strategy, but it is important to keep it in your mind so you can effectively pressure by proxy of "you guys should be helping this survivor get away from me because he is down a hook" so that I chase them instead".
The principle I take on tunneling is I try to avoid doing it, but:
- Getting your first hook is a no mercy situation at all times. After hooks you should always move to pressure gens...
- If someone unhooks in your face, or has been stalking you for the unhook and does it while you are close by, let the unhooked survivor go and take the exchange. Another survivor will need to heal them, so that's 3 gens not being repaired currently.
- The unhooked survivor gets a 20s grace period where I will prioritise chasing the unhooker if I see them. If they linger around to help with flashy saves or pallets instead of getting away to heal, they are fair game and I take their second hook.
- Similarly if the unhooking survivor manages to completely remain out of my sight, they should be trying to get my attention to save their teammate, so if all i csn is the unhooked survivor, that is also fair game, I will take their second hook.
- Once at 2 hooks, this survivor should be playing safely, not making risky plays. I will pressure gens and chase other survivors, I will even avoid them if I run into them off hook when they couldn't reasonably help it. However if they are going for saves, trying to rush gens, doing risky heals, or generally running around in the open or into my arms, once again they are fair game.
The best piece of gameplay advice I learned thus far in this game came from Otz, and its the principle that if you are dead on hook, staying hidden and quiet, not doing much but staying alive is much better than playing risky and getting killed. The fact all 4 players are alive means they MIGHT be doing gens, so passively continuing to exist creates pressure on the killer.
My point is tracking downs on survivors is a huge part of the killers game plan. If you add it on HUD, you encourage tunneling from all killers, and you rob the killer of an important skill in tracking and decision making.
@NerfedFreddy said:
No, it's absolutely not needed feature. It promotes either tunneling/mega efficient plays or farming. Both are bad and shouldn't be incentivized
This is something that comes into play only for starting killers. Anyone with any decent number of hours will have absolutely 0 problem knowing who to tunnel if they wish to. The reason is simple - if you tunnel, only 1 or 2 people will have hooks - so you actually need to remember just 1 or 2 pieces of information. If you want to play nice however - you need to keep in your head hook states of everyone (4 pieces of information). Considering this - I just know that showing hook states in HUD does not influence tunneling one bit after very short time playing this game (say 100hrs).
For me it would be true QOL if killers saw hook states in HUD. All this information does is offload the need to remember 4 numbers if you are trying to play nice (and playing nice is not the same as farming - it just means not using OP/meta things and not camping/tunneling survivors - but killing said survivors in the end is not refusing to play nice any more).
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@DrDucky said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3461269#Comment_3461269
I thought that the devs confirmed the finisher mori feature was still coming to the game but with basekit unbreakable scrapped?
It was one package. If one is scrapped, both are scrapped. That's what I remember devs said.
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I would generally like to see less pre-game and see more post-game. My own and others MMR included. But I presume to be in minority here.
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Here we go again. Meyers does need buffs. He is weak. But he can't get them, because he already has addons that make him OP. As devs are unwilling (or unable? License stuff) to change his tombstones - it means meyers just can't get any buff. He's already OP when he takes those - especially tombstone piece (and underwhelming when he does not)
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@DaddyMyers_Mori said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3461023#Comment_3461023
Isn't it like that? 0-1K loss, 2k draw, 3-4K win? That's how MMR is defined at least.
You want to take kill rate literally to 50% without caring about context.
Then why ignore Nurse kill rate, just because it doesn't fit your narrative?
Unless you are SWF, then 0K is simply unlikely outcome. There is no way to balance this game about 50% kill rate against soloQ.
You have killers like Pig, Pinhead, or Sadako with really high kill rates. Reason is simple, Pinhead is soloQ stomper, because of his box and new players don't understand how Pig or Sadako works, so they die to their power.
So if you want to ignore bad players on Nurse, we should ignore bad players on survivors, right?
Isn't it like that? 0-1K loss, 2k draw, 3-4K win? That's how MMR is defined at least.
Yes it is. That's my whole point. And 50% kill rate means super-average game ends in exactly 2K. Anything about it and we are talking about 2K or more (meaning mostly draws, but sometimes free wins).
Then why ignore Nurse kill rate, just because it doesn't fit your narrative?
Nurse on average is not problematic - but as I said earlier - problem is with distribution. The killer is very tilting if you didn't master it yet (dragging killrate down) and absolutely horrendously stomping everyone if you did (making it unable to play against said killer) - that's the whole point of what I said earlier "those can be spoiled by uneven distribution".
If it really comes to it that MfT has insane impact against higher tier killers (which is the case for nurse vs survivors in top tier) then there needs to be an adjustment - the same way as there actually was adjustment for nurse (which BTW in my eyes makes her now strong, but playable against - I don't feel she's problem any more. Same way as basekit blight and spirit are IMO perfectly fine and only their addons need to be looked at).
But as of now I haven't seen such stats - so I am taking into account the only tools we actually have. And that is nightlight and their usage rate which still shows lithe+sprint are better perks (at least on average) - which BTW corresponds to my experience both as killer (I have had 0 problems with my pinhead and bubba - those 2 I am playing the most these days - in fact I get more screwed over by those other exhaustions, then MfT) and survivor (I judged the perk worse then my standard balanced landing and background player - so I am not using the perk any more).
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@Devil_hit11 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3460925#Comment_3460925
nightlight has to record stats for 14 days and those stats will not be accurate because it is sample. not census. It has only been few days but the perk has decent popularity sitting at 14% usage rate. Dead hard also increased in usage rate from 9% to 10%. It is going to be interesting where DH and MFT sit in popularity. Hope usage rate has also increased from 5.6% to 10%. I wonder how this will affect adrenaline usage rate.
It was already pointed out earlier with response too. We will see - if the combo is in fact really that OP. But I don't know - I kinda need at least 3 perks to get to endgame - so maybe that hope+mft is actually just "win more" (meaning it's not really an issue as it changes nothing)...
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@1ettuce said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3461089#Comment_3461089
Fair point about my comparison - but still, I don't think it's reasonable to say these things weren't complained about before so they can't be complained about now. Especially when some people were complaining about them before, maybe just not a majority simply because there were indeed more problematic things, and that's what gets focused on. Like as an example, I've found lithe to be incredibly annoying as killer for a VERY long time now, definitely during DHs second coming even
There's always someone who will complain. I saw complains for blast mine or for diversion out of all things. But a single complained is absolutely incomparable to the situation with adrenaline - where virtually nobody complained and now you see thread about it at minimum 1 per weak (and quite some more).
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@1ettuce said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3460243#Comment_3460243
Perfectly ok in YOUR opinion mind you, you can't just say this to every reasonable and explained nerf request. Imagine c33 gets nerfed and wanting alch ring or adren vial nerfed is now "moving the goalpost" and therefore supposedly a bad thing to want even tho its not
The difference is, that people are calling C33, MDR, alch ring, tombstone piece, .... OP for a very long time. Same as BNP's. But Adrenaline was perfectly OK and NOBODY complained about it in times where stronger options were in game. THAT is the reason why it's moving goalpost. Imagine survivors will now start to complain jolt is too much and it definitely needs nerfs - as it's too strong and all the killers know it and use it... You would also say moving goalpost from CoB, OC and eruption. And that's exactly it...
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@tuttoinunavolta said:
Adrenaline is perfectly fine imo. The only thing I'd change about it is the fact that it currently wakes up survivors affected by Freddy's Dream State. I understand the lore accurate part of it, but perks and items affecting only a specific killer are not that fair and most of those interactions have been removed recently (ex. Wraith flashlight burns). Plus it's not like Freddy is a strong killer that needs this weakening interaction lol, especially since at that point of the game he lost his teleport.
This exactly. If it wasn't at least Freddy, but some stronger killer (blight, nurse, spirit) I would say that's OK. But why poor Freddy? This is actually the only nerf to adrenaline I would 100% support
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Sure. OK. I didn't see that. But that still only points to the thing, that the perk is still less used then lithe (21% at the same time https://nightlight.gg/perks/Lithe ) and about the same as sprint (15% at the same time https://nightlight.gg/perks/Sprint_Burst ) . As we are considering brand new perk that people will drop - when they realize they don't like it (new perks always get higher usage rate at the beginning, because people want to try them out) - it's still just worse option. And yet - I don't see so many threads about need to nerf lithe or sprint burst.
Still I wonder how do they really calculate it and nightlight. Like how could these numbers add up into 5% they show in main page (but I guess they take into account longer time frame than just those 14 days).
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@tuttoinunavolta said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3460893#Comment_3460893
imo I think both should stay (they should hide the survivors' prestige, though). The problem with map offerings is that some maps are horribly skewed in favour of one side, and the solution here is simply addressing those problems by balancing those maps better instead of removing offerings altogether. On their own map offerings are fine and sometimes you just wanna see a specific realm you like, you know. I send myself to Haddonfield as Myers more often than not even if I don't do good on it with him - I just wanna roleplay. Or if I get a full RE lobby I'll send myself to RPD just to keep it accurate. Also, removing map offerings completely kills Scratched Mirror Myers.
Lobby-dodging happens because of Prestiges, not items. Perks like Franklin's and Lightborn would never be picked up if there wasn't a visible lobby (and sometimes those perks making it in can be beneficial for survivors. If they realize there's Lightborn involved early on, then the killer has just wasted a perk slot; Franklin's could also be totally wasted if the items all end up being brown crap / the survivors drop them beforehand strategically). No reason to hide the lobby when you could just hide prestiges and solve the lobby-dodging and "tunneling the P100" problems.
I am all for both things to stay. I just don't like cherry-picking. "Buff my side by removing advantages of the other side while keeping mine" is something I really don't like. Map offerings are the other side of coin as killer being able to see whole lobby - even accounts (meaning see comments, hours played and all the other info) - while survivors don't have access to these.
And it's all fine - but to balance this advantage, keep map offerings exactly as they are
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@DaddyMyers_Mori said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3460910#Comment_3460910
Stats and reality are different.
There is a simple example. Nurse has 50% kill rate, so by your standard she is most balanced killer.
If you want 4 escapes, play SWF.
We are literally talking here just about stats. Sure enough even those can be spoiled by uneven distribution (which is exactly nurse's problem - it's very beginner unfriendly where a lot of people that did not master her are dragging her winrate down). But ignoring said details - 50% kill rate is the only fair outcome there is. Provided you are not one of those people that consider 2K=draw same as actual killer loss (0-1K)
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@[Deleted User] said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3460991#Comment_3460991
Like I wrote in my other post you don't need to avoid survivors or "run away" from them. You use Static Blast while in chase. So unless the survivors you are chasing escape you are still getting hooks during the match.
@Seraphor said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3460991#Comment_3460991
You don't have to run away from survivors. Survivors run away form you, and there's four of them, chances are at least one is already 'far away' from you at any given moment.
That works with the huge-aura build alternative I didn't think about (which was the reason I admitted I probably did the challenge in a wrong way). If you went at it with dark devotion like I figured the challenge out - then you absolutely have to run away from survivor (and that version is throwing for the challenge). But as I said - this one was probably my mistake.
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@Alionis said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3460997#Comment_3460997
Fair enough, I didn't realize that.
As for your other questions: I don't know, I'm not a dev. I haven't programmed this game. My main issue was that you called this a shadow nerf, which I don't agree with. If you look into the code, everything fits. Default hook sabotage time is 3 seconds and Saboteur's action speed boost is 20%, which cuts that down to 2.5 seconds. Everything matches up.
Why it doesn't apply in-game is a different issue. That is probably a bug that needs to be fixed. But again: not a shadow nerf, because then they would have changed some of the values I just mentioned, which isn't the case.
Shadow nerf part was different issue with saboteur. When I was talking about shadow nerf, I was specifically mentioning not seeing aura of hooks when YOU are being carried. Go back to my previous post and you will see the exact point where I say this perk has yet another issue (outside of shadownerf with auras) of description not being correct...
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@Alionis said:
What I see in that video is the on-screen timer making a sudden jump from 2.59 seconds to 3.00 seconds, goes to show how "reliable" video footage is sometimes, eh?
But seriously, what I said applies to most interactions. Measure anything in this game frame-by-frame and you'll find that all actions take fractions of a second longer to fully complete (i.e. the time between losing control over the character and regaining it).
For most stuff that doesn't matter. Whether it's 16 seconds to complete a heal or actually 16.3, who cares. But when it comes down to something that already has a very minor difference like 3 seconds default sabotage and 2.5 Saboteur-sabotage, then that stuff starts to matter, which is a whole different issue.
I don't agree that this is a bug or even a shadow nerf, because that is not what that is.
Again. It's FRAME COUNTER. The game has standard lock of 60FPS (60 frames per second - or each frame taking about 17 milliseconds). This should make it clear why it jumps from 2,59 to 3 (or to make it more clear - fractional part is NOT number of milliseconds - it's actually number of frames past after full second)...
Another thing - if everything take fraction of second longer - why doesn't that apply to killer's hit cooldown? Why can't I sabotage hook right after being hit?
As for bug - what is it then if the action takes longer, then is provided in perk description?
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@Frogsplosion said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3460275#Comment_3460275
Noed doesn't instantly kill every survivor, adrenaline may as well be an automatic free escape.
Interesting. I have seen MANY games where 4 adrenalines ended up in 4K. I have even heart opinions the perk is overrated and hope does the same thing much better. Especially NOED counters adren very well, because it renders being healthy useless and the extra speed will make hunting person that just got away from adren a lot easier.
Also adren is far from guaranteed ANY value. Not counting the options already mentioned - you can have and be injured in chase. If killer downs you and then the last gen pops, you are screwed because the drop animation will not let you recover in time and get away = killer will get you. If you are being carried while the last gen pops - killer can just drop you and hit you rendering your value nonexistent.
The perk has so many ifs, that it tells volumes of how bad survivor perks have become for adren to be used so much.
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@[Deleted User] said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3460876#Comment_3460876
"now it's clear why "take only no mither" or "blast survivors 56m away" challenges are things I have issue with"
It's not clear what your issue is. Well with the Doc's challenge anyway. You do not have to throw a game to get the Doc's challenge. The No Mither one is debatable.
Maybe I did it in a wrong way - but asking killer to run away from survivors he's trying to catch is clearly throwing from my perspective. And sure enough - it doesn't mean you CAN'T EVER win such a game (no mither included). It means you need to deliberately do "stupid" things to win. But maybe if I went at it with distressing+double calm way, then maybe I could have played "normally" and eventually get it - so this might be debatable and an error on my part.
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Well at least Mandy informed us there will be some changes to skull merchant which is huge deal for me. Personally I don't mind legions at all. There are much less fun killers to go against and with legion you get quite a lot of standard/fun chases.
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@fulltonon said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3460925#Comment_3460925
Nightlight uses the statistics of last 14 days, do you remember when the patch with made for this released?
You are right. it was released 13th of june = 8 days. If we use those 8 days as the average and prolong it to 14 days (which is not fair, as people want to try new perk at the beginning even if they will never ever use it again), then you still have 4.8%/8*14=8.4% usage rate. That's quite a number, but it's still very far from it's contenders - mainly sprint burst and lithe.
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@Orthane said:
This perk is so overpowered it's not even funny, how this went live at all is beyond me when literally everyone said it would be a problem, and here we are, it's a huge problem. At least it's a problem for killers that aren't Blight, Spirit, Nurse. Playing an M1 or a 4.4 killer when someone has this perk is way too hard. Please just nerf it already, there's no excuse for it even making it out of PTB.
The nightlight annouces the perk usage rate at 4,8%. That about sums it up how "OP" the perk is. For comparison, Lithe has 24% usage rate...
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@DaddyMyers_Mori said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3460879#Comment_3460879
2k is draw, but with 50% kill rate, 2k is not most regular outcome.
Most regular outcome is 1k.
2k doesn't change % balance. If you would want 50% kill rate, then you would need also equal number of 4k and 0k, which is not going to happen.
As I said, 1k is easy against most teams. So for to lower average kill rate you need multiple 1k as replacement for few 0k. Which would mean killer is mostly losing.
Out of 5 possible states (0K, 1K, 2K, 3K, 4K) why would 50% kill rate (middle value) mean the most common outcome is one of the left states (1K is the one a little on left instead of 2K which is perfectly in the middle). This would mean said outcome would need to be balanced with large number of 4K's to be true.
Another thing - why is it OK for "free 1K" to be a thing? If it scews the stats so much, then help survivor team to balance it out with some basegame mechanics. Help survivors get 4 out more often. But I don't even think this is the case, because this one is actually balanced by whole survivor team loosing and last survivor still having a shot at hatch or gate.
To clarify - I don't care about distribution between escapes and kills. I just want them to be fair. If you say securing 1 kill is too easy and killers don't care for this - then let's ask devs to fix the issue and help survivors escape. But keep the target at 50% kill rate - which should be fair outcome for everyone - because 50% means for both sides you have equal chance to live/kill every survivor.
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@DrFrozen said:
New patch, new problems...
I'd like to remind you all about the toolboxes nerf in order not to rush gens and end every single game in 3 minutes... What does BHVR do right now ? They add genrushing perks !
Games are super quick right now... in almost every single game I have to deal with at least 1 brand new parts.
In addition every single regression perk has been nerfed to the ground.
Survivors are rewarded for staying injured... fixing gen with many perks that just speed it up, running permamently 3% faster and get adrenaline after 3 minutes...
At least thanks for pop buffs...
I'd love to see Overcharge which doesn't nerf the killer for 20 seconds.
And I don't blame them. Gen kick meta and skull merchant taught everyone, that genrushing is the only answer. Kicking perks are no more, but self-healing is also no more. Staying injured is only a matter of time before you die - so you need to shorten the game as much as possible. Also there's always a possibility it will be skull merchant, so taking best toolbox with BNP is only sensible thing to do.
Sidenote - I don't find fun in genrushing (meaning taking gen perks and non-sabo toolboxes). But I can very much understand survivors that do. It's the survivor's equivalent for C33+alch ring blight, or MDR+amulet spirit and so on.
@DaddyMyers_Mori said:
30% current is still way worse than 25% maximum.
There is currently no regression perk anywhere near close pop/ruin.
But gens are 10 seconds slower...
25% from 80s = 20s
30% from 90s/2 + 2,25s = 15,75s - so it is nerf considering pre-6.1 version, but not that huge. The thing is that 4,25s is quite important distinction, but killer usually has enough time to see up to 3 gens (plus synergy of aura perks to help him choose better) so that simplification of 90s/2 is probably too conservative making it possibly better then pre-6.1 version.
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Remove map offerings, but at the same time remove killer's visibility of the lobby.
No more seeing who you will go against (but only for killer, because survivors can't decide if they want to go against that wallhacking wraith), no more perks according to survivor items (lightborn if you happen to be in lobby that wants to try multiple flashlights), no more lobby shopping (so matchmaking improves drastically) and both sides loosing their advantage (4 survivor maps against 1 of the killer's) now cancels out.
But don't do cherry-picking. Both at the same time or none at all.