Dabrownman1812
Dabrownman1812
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@tt_ivi_99 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/401732#Comment_401732
We were also getting 4K when DS was around, that doesnt mean it's balanced...
Why do killers get punished for playing good while survivors can ######### up so many times and get rewarded for it?
And survivor mains say killer is easy... Everyone can get consistent 4k against potatoes, just saying...
It's not gauranteed like ds. Learn and adapt first. The best killers have secondary attacks and instadowns, most which stops mettle of man from charging early anyway. People complain too much instead of being practical. Play it out first then see.
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@[Deleted User] said:
I think a lot of Killers approach trials backwards (a lot of survivors do to). Strategising around getting your kills as quickly as possible to make gen repair/escapes more difficult will only get Killers so far until they start regularly going against smarter, more savvy survivors, ESPECIALLY SWF that will try as hard as possible to sub divide the map. Killers should be treating this more like King of The Hill or Capture The Flag with gens being the hill/flag. Prioritise an area and do not leave it! Make downs, hooks, kills an incidental part of relentlessly guarding an optimal area. Eventually they’ll have repaired the other gens forcing them to come right to the killer (unless one has a key, or finds one in a chest, but that’s an entirely different frustrating topic). If they choose not to heal, fine, that’s just making it much more dangerous for themselves. Eventually pallets will be used up and even the most cunning, skilled survivors will do something reckless enough to get themselves hit or get downed, because they have no choice but to be in the same area as the killer and the remaining gens.
Word, also, I play several killers, faced a full swf mettle of man team rank 5. It didn't help, it doesn't always help. Prepare for a meta change, all games have a meta change. It isn't d strike. When metas shift maybe your tactics should, that's how it is. We also don't know what perks are coming in the future.
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Mom can be countered by
1)grabs
2) instadowns and exposed effects
3) secondary attacks (hatchets, puke, frenzy, chainsaw)
Instadowns, exposed, secondary attacks are heavily used in higher ranks anyway. And if you run plague you don't strike too much with basic attack for example, billy can prevent a 3 basic hit charge for some time, etc. Killers gotta learn, stop freakin out. I play killer myself and I've been doing fine with full swf teams with that perk on playing spirit.
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Mettle of Man rewards survivors for failure and punishes killers for succeeding. Mettle of Man has now become the literal "new pre 2.6.0 Decisive Strike".
People complain without taking into account possible tools in the future. This was a planned perk, and we don't know the killer buffs coming in the future and perks. The meta is give on one side, then give on the other to spice things up if people haven't noticed. The plague can down survivors stupidly fast and make mettle of man barely notable in that case, same for some other killers. Meta shifts with perks as metas shift in every other game. The perk isn't as bad as dstrike and it's pretty fair. The only thing I'd say is make the obsession 3 hits to charge and non obsessions 4 hits to charge.
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@Bongbingbing said:
So It's not just basic attacks, It's attacks out of powers too, wow.
So any Killer that doesn't have an M2 attack has no way to avoid this perk... jesus.
Basic attacks to charge it, non basic attacks are damage dealt with non primary weapons excluding legion.
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The perk is fine, killers flipping out. Who knows what other one hit or strong perks will come out for killers. Stop complaining. There's several ways and builds that make mettle of man not too effective. People whining, let it play out for a couple weeks. It's annoying yes, but if I swept full teams with it on ps4 with a freddy swf, then better killers will do better against it. We don't know about new killer perks, buffs, etc so take your time.
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I'm not sure if this is intended, I went against a Nurse earlier, and every time I would take a hit after she blinked, I wouldn't get a stack.
It's not weak, there's plenty of tech. It's a chase extender that goes off in most matches and can be run by multiple survivors, I wrote some tech above in some posts. It also gives yourself borrowed when you get tunnelee from a hook.
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@nunadventures said:
It’s pretty weak considering you can’t choose when to use it. Like it’s always going to be the third or fourth hit (I forget which one hit) you take
It activates when injured after a third basic attack charges it. Can be paired with insta heal to make a chase require 4 hits to down. If mettle of man is charged by the first chase which can happen with body block and selfcare, the first chase will make you a 3 hit down. Survivors can also body block, selfcare, enter chase with an insta healto be 4 hit down first chase. Many ways to charge it. Can run into locker and get grabbed if you're gonna lose a chase anyway to get grabbed and save Mattle of man. There's lots of tech.
So yeah, any hit after the third that will put you into dying state from injured state, so it doesn't trigger upon 4th hit unless it brings you from injured to dying state, it could trigger on 5th or 6th hit etc
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@Khroalthemadbomber said:
Hmm...I'm curious... Since Billy and Leatherface saws with speed limiters get NOED applied to them does that mean speed limiter saws trigger MoM?
According to the perk, it gives you endurance in the injured state from any attack that deals damage. In the hands of a good looper and competent survivor, mettle of man easily adds plenty of time to a chase. Also, people forget the effect stacks since all 4 players can run it. Mettle of man saves survivors from being hit when through pallets which can easily keep chases going.
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Since the flag is a hint and not a code name it could be more. Dude said it's a hint.
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They said no jeepers due to the controversyArroz said:@RabidWabbitz said:
Pinhead is the only Choice here!Or jeepers creepers!
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Haven't changedSnikers said:Can't you just play other characters and use their bloodpoints to level up Nurse? Is that changed on console?
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Word, just reduce a bitShroompy said:9Huntress isnt a bad killer how ever I do think she's over-rated. She's high mid tier in my opinion. She can end chases faster than any other killer. Personally I think it should stay directional, and maybe reduce the actual humming radius by a small bit.
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Wont work on observant survivors, it will be like a tier 1 meyers almost.HatCreature said:@Dabrownman1812 said:
Yes but how would the cosmetic work? Wouldn't people just know what the killers look like either way?It's impossible for this to completely fool Survivors, basically this would allow you to get really close to Survivors, like 5-10 meters from them before they get what's up and that's if you go through loops and trees and not got to them directly. And their hood would have to be down for this to work.
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If you load in and see a 5th survivor you know something is up lol.
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Yes but how would the cosmetic work? Wouldn't people just know what the killers look like either way?
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Makes no sense for it not to be directional since she makes the sound. Freddy doesn't hum the lullaby so it isn't directional.bendermac said:C'mon devs... get rid of her directional lullaby.
No other change for her. -
Sometimes on the survivor side they are far past the reach, obviously you get hit through windows but sometimes your character model is far beyond a lunge range but due to latency or something you get hit.Master said:@mint said:
What's up with this? you could be so far out the window and still get hit with an M1 tap. Is there a trick or something i should be looking for/doing different? is it latency?"So far"?
Its an intended mechanic that the killer can hit through the window within a certain distance
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On console you can vault, run a few steps and still get hit. Red stain or not. Really bad latencydaLenster said:If you see Red, you will be dead. -
Yup lolMilo said:Invisible Pallets strike again!
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Nvm. Pallet invisible on swamp
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no one used it, was in chase at start of game and there was no pallet, no pallet break or sign of broken pallet.
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Thats a glitch, all add ons burn up without a ward after every match. Add ons and items are glitchy, sometimes survivors will leave with an item and lose it during the end game screen.FoggyDownpour said:
There's also the fact that killer addons don't always disappear after being used. I know they are supposed to, but they don't a majority of the time. I've used the same Iridescent King 5 matches in a row without a ward, and sometimes I get to use it even more than that.@TheLegendDyl4n1 said:@MhhBurgers said:
@TheLegendDyl4n1 said:
again items and add ons for survivor is not guaranteed to survive and items and add ons for killers well the item is your power which i can argue does alot more for than my item and the add ons are so much more powerful then our item add ons so when items/power and add ons are given equal power then they can be one use. and no its not a 1v4 for me its a 1v1v1v1v1LoL, survivor items are pretty much overpowered considering their items should do far less since it's 4v1.
You have friggin instaheals while insta-down addons on killers usually have heavy downsides like for example myers who takes forever to stalk to tier3 with the unlimited EW addon while you can just pack in a brown medkit with the syringe and have an instaheal.
Toolboxes save you 20 friggin seconds per gen if you equip them for speed.
Maps make Hexes redundant altho good maps are pretty rare.
The key with addons is a potential 4man free escape if you play against a killer that has an endgame build like freddy.
Also killers are still weaker than a good survivor unless you're playing nurse/billy.
4v1 but i cant kill the killer? also intaheal is one use while a myers lock of hair gives unlimited tier 3
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I get 4 tokens per game without farming as well. If you take a hit then pull someone off the hook that's 2 tokens in 3 seconds. Taking a hit while someone is being carried, while healing someone from off the floor. Saving someone from a bear trap as well. Running behind someone as the head to an exit gate and taking a hit.Ryuhi said:There should definitely be better ways to get stacks for WGLF (especially since it involves legit sacrificing a perk slot,) but rewarding gen rushing is not it. The theme of the perk is rooted in altruism, so things like pulling the killer away from other survivors or healing others to full (and/or from downed) would honestly be better candidates.
If you want some advice in its current iteration, run borrowed time, bodyblock hits (especially when the gates are open) and go for desperation when its not detrimental to your team. Ive gotten stacks for getting hit while healing other people (even ones who were downed,) so its not exactly impossible in its current iteration.
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I use his perks all the time lol
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Wake up is fine. Why a rework? Good ideas but perks don't need a rework, they are under used not underpowered.
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You cant get it at all from currency, event yoelasticheart said:any change to get it as dlc? i checked the price onebay and its really expensive at least for my currency.
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Oh damn
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Lets agree to disagree, you gotta use it in a certain way and yes it is helpful, I just don't have time to be on forums as much lol.Entità said:@Crizpen @Dabrownman1812 You do real examples, but not very pertinent: the point is not to heal in the Trapper's terror radius in Coldwind Farm, the problem is to cure yourself with the Pig crouched in Lery or with the Wraith in The Game or with Myers in Backwater, to say. The problem is not to be seen with BBQ in the first minute of the game, the problem is not having any hope when you face Hillbilly or the Nurse in Shelton Wood, who has just sacrificed the last of your companions at the opposite end of the map. These are the cases in which stealth can save your life, it is in these circumstances that you need a Distortion worthy of the role. I repeat, they invented Sole Survivor, but it does not work, and nobody uses it: if Distortion protects you in the first minutes of play, when you do not need it, because the killer can choose other targets, because, if targeted, you can count on the rescue of others, but abandons you in the extreme need, it will not make a lot of career in the inventory of players, especially those who play alone, without parties and no friends ready to risk everything for you (yes, they're a race in extinction, but still some unfortunate solitary survivors exist...).
You say the truth, Sprint Burst, Balanced Landing, Dead Hard and Lithe are very powerful perks for the survivors, and a good majority of players use them, but not me: I do not find any pleasure in mocking the killer, I look for emotional identification, so constant tension, an electrifying challenge for survival, and mocking those who want to quarter you from behind a pallet is not very consistent with the atmosphere of absolute panic that anyone would feel if that situation were real. And we come to your fear that the killer no longer sees any Aura and stays near the hooked guy: as you have recognized, there are other perks of fashion, the stealth style is clearly minority, and there is no risk that everyone uses it, destroying BBQ (without prejudice to the gain of 100% extra blood points, of course): people have fun with the loops, with the flashlights, teabagging the killer whenever a juke is successful, and have no slot to waste with Distortion. In addition, the game was born without BBQ and worked for long months without the imperative need to introduce "spells" to find the prey: you cannot claim that the killer is doomed to defeat if one or two players occasionally shield their Aura reading ability.
Finally, I agree with the killer buffs: I do not like facing an insipid enemy, or being tasteless myself when I impersonate him. Above all, I detest the useless perks: every perk must be a winning card, a special resource that gives powerful advantages to those who choose to invest in it, and this is especially true for those who, with four perks, must deal with sixteen. You will never see me as opposed to the killer perks empowering, unless they give the certainty of victory, destroying the challenge.
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Keep in mind those numbers took into account the hallowed blight event where survivors killed themselves left and right in order to run through vials in terms of survivors escaping.Crizpen said:@Entità said:
@Dabrownman1812 said:
Still an invalid point, horrible math for a 4v1. It's not a simple addition. You see, the killer can still only go up to and chase 1 survivor. So it still forces a 1v1 chase at most and allows the other 2 survivors to save or do gens. You're calculating use vs practicality and impact on the game.Also for smart survivors. They know the map already and get in range or fake bbq reading by mindgaming the aura reading. bbq has counters already before distortion, and not all of the distortions will go off at the same time which you math doesn't calculate. The survivor on the hook will keep the 3 stacks.
You complain about bbq when many still stealth around it. Etc. Not only that, but some maps are since you wanna do the math, too big to look for survivors without aura reading because not every killer can zoom n search. Did you do the math on how fast gens get done? Lol. About 80 seconds at base and add 10 seconds if gen tapping with ruin. If a survivor is competent and keeps a killer busy for even 2 minutes, then there's the hook time before the travel to a survivor with a bbq reading. What does that make? Makes 3 gens done, 1 killer objective done (3 hooks per survivor so 12 objectives) and 3 survivor objectives done (survivors have to do 5 gens and 1 door so that's half done, 3 left).
Aura reading is there simply because at base, time isn't on the killers side. I'm a survivor main saying this, and I stil stealth bbq, still stealth nurses. Survivors aren't randomly having their auras read.
You are forgetting that information is power, that intelligence is the beating heart of every war: you reduce the Auras shown by BBQ to only one, because only one is the survivor you can chase ... It's not like that at all. Seeing all the distant Auras means mastering the map, and knowingly choosing where to hunt: you instantly discover if someone approaches a hex totem, you know if someone is healing or repairing in collaboration (and you make a banquet, if your name is Leatherface) , you realize the strategies of maneuver of your opponents, you can calculate the probabilities that a survivor, after searching a Chest, go to the generator X or Y (which you see, too), in short, you have an exact photograph of the enemy's moves. If all this really were not useful, then the perk would be: "When you hook a survivor, you see the Aura of a random companion over 40 meters", since it is only one that you can follow, right? I don't want BBQ or A Nurse's Calling or Bitter Murmur or other killer detection perks are nerfed, which means a Christmas gift for all survivors: I simply want the freedom to buy a good shield, paying a fair price. Sole Survivor is not a good shield (not only bad, but also broken mechanic: https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/28469/sole-survivor-vs-bbq-chilli ), and nobody uses it: I hope Distortion won't share the same destiny, to be left on the shelves...
Let's speak concretely. What do you find unbalanced in my proposal (the three options are obviously alternatives, with preference for one of the first two)?
1) the largest number of tokens (4/5/6, instead of 3);
2) the reloadability of tokens (the @Robb_Stark proposal can be integrated as a recharge mode, for example: if you want to recover a token, then make the equivalent of a generator);
3) the ability to activate the shield on request.The size of the maps (the swamps have been drastically reduced), the gen rush, the ease of destroying Ruin are all interesting and reasonable speeches, but you cannot mix all the game mechanics in a thread about a single, new stealth perk, however still experimental, under verification and settling (PTB means this: try and let us know your feedback).
There are very few killer perks which cannot be countered, even prior to Distortion. Among those that can be are both Nurse's Calling (don't heal in the terror radius or most killers) and BBQ (hide behind a generator, or rush within 40 meters when someone goes down), which also happen to be two of the most powerful perks killers get.
By comparison, would it be balanced for killers to have a perk that stops ALL exhaustion perks within their terror radius? Of course not. It would destroy Sprint Burst, Dead Hard, Balanced Landing and Lithe, making some of the most powerful survivor perks useless.
Furthermore, countering BBQ in particular is a distinctly bad idea. Most of the time, when hooking a survivor, you can see at least one other across the map. Hooking a new survivor for another stack, as well as having a general idea of where to find that survivor is a lot of incentive to leave the hook. Conversely, survivors generally (and should) assume the killer is running BBQ, and have at least a 40 meter head start on escaping before he gets there. They know where the killer is coming from, and SWF groups definitely inform each other where the killer is headed to give that survivor a better chance of escaping.
On the other hand, if the hook is made and no auras are revealed, there are several possibilities. Just as likely as any, and safer to combat, is that there are survivors within 40 meters, close enough to make a quick hook save. So why would the killer leave? Oh course, he wouldn't. Complaints about proxy camping go up, complaints about tunneling when the hook save is made with the killer nearby go up... no one is having as much fun.
Now, Distortion isn't being added in isolation either, it's also coming with locker changes which can be used in addition to block auras. See someone go down - head for a locker. While it should be a perk, or added to Distortion, it's not.
Having a 3-token cap hardly makes the perk weak. In your average match, the killer might see 3 auras from Nurse's, since people already know not to heal within the terror radius, much less 3 from a specific survivor. And, as for BBQ, it would require hooking 3 other survivors more than 40 meters away, which again, easily countered if you're concerned about your aura showing. Meaning, it will last all, or nearly all of the match if you're prioritizing hiding your aura over getting those extra 30 seconds on the generator when you may be shown. So no, there isn't a purpose in increasing the stacks when it's already entirely too powerful as it stands. All increasing the number of stacks, or allowing you to gain more stacks, will do is encourage survivors to play lazy, not smart.
Activating the "shield on request" is also fairly absurd, for much the same reasons. In effect, you can do this already by moving toward the down'ed player when you see them drop, saving your stack for later in the match. Deciding you're in a safe location to allow the aura to display, and then hiding it when you're in more danger would hand entirely too much power to the survivors.
But let's take the game pre-DLC as the base. According to the dev's roughly half of all survivors escape every match. That isn't true against specific killers, like Truetalent, Monto, TydeTyme, etc... but according to their numbers, it's about the average. In the DLC, survivors are getting this great new perk. They're also getting a nifty perk for sabo teams to utilize, and there isn't a single thing any killer can do to counter any of them.
Killers aren't so lucky. Iron Maiden is crap on anyone except Doctor, Mad Grit isn't worth running, Discordance might be somewhat viable on some builds, but is easily countered by survivors working on different generators. And, best of all, we get a killer who can't kill.
So, exactly how is survivors getting a great perk to help them survive completing their objectives, while killers don't, unbalanced for survivors?
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If you get one hit downed constantly it's the server which is a big reason dedicated servers are good if you juke a saw and it auto aims or you're not ready for billy and you leave yourself open too much.
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Billy isn't broken, I gotta stay off these forums lol.
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9h, but then you risk not even getting 3 tokens, or any. And whispers isn't aura reading so prob not that, whispers isn't accurate so why block whispers? If you don't finish gens but is in chase and helping with altruism you get no use from the perkRobb_Stark said:I would change/buff Distortion as it follows:
Whenever you complete a Generator, you gain one token (something similar to Dark Sense).
Distortion should hide your Aura and your Location. That being said, it now affects Rancor, Doctor's Madness and Whispers.
Change the duration for each tier: tier I - 10 seconds, tier II - 15 seconds, tier III - 20 seconds. This change only helps with Whispers which would otherwise consume tokens way too fast. Also, remove the Scratch Marks part as this would make the perk overpowered.
Note: The Doctor can still hear you screaming, but your location won't get revealed.
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Still an invalid point, horrible math for a 4v1. It's not a simple addition. You see, the killer can still only go up to and chase 1 survivor. So it still forces a 1v1 chase at most and allows the other 2 survivors to save or do gens. You're calculating use vs practicality and impact on the game.Entità said:@DarkGGhost said:
@Entità You forgot one small detail it's sapost to be 1vs4 if one person is equal to the killer then the killer will lose ( and plz don't try to use the database of dbd the are garbage). Second, they say ( if remember correctly) that it's will not counter killer add-ons. Last survivors have way more info than killers ( especial SWF) so in order, killer to play the game they need some kind of info in the game otherwise it's will pointless to try to find another Claudette.@Dabrownman1812 said:
Word, not bout playstyle. It's 4v1 a killer perk is supposed to counter n be more powerful than survivor perks. Jeff comes with aura reading the killer and aura blocking, killer has gen detection and locker juke reveal, seems pretty solid. Also stealth still works, maybe it's just you but I don't use stealth perks and I can still stealth. I'm not the only one.Are you sure you have read my message before replying that the killer perks must be stronger than the survivor perks? I have never compared Distortion vs BBQ, no, I have compared FOUR Distortion vs ONE BBQ, and the result is the following: the maximum potential of 4 Distortion is equal to 2/5 of the maximum potential of 1 BBQ, in ideal, optimal conditions: this means that the entire team of survivors, considered as a whole, cannot even counter half the killer's Aura readings. Adding Bitter Murmur, A Nurse's Calling and other Aura reading faculties, the balance of power is even more unbalanced in favor of the killer. This is unfair: ONE killer perk cannot count as EIGHT survivor perks.
The bushes, the debris, the wheat fields, the trees, the ruined walls and all the structures are not only aesthetic decorations or obstacles for the chases: they are also hiding places, to escape from the killer's murderous rage. The killer has a first-person view and third-person survivors just to allow them to watch their backs, sneak in stealth when the heartbeat increases or something else suggests a strategic retreat. Dead by Daylight is a fatal game of hide and seek: the pallets, vaults, torches, are secondary tools, very useful, for heaven's sake, but the primary purpose of the survivor is to remain crouched, to evade the enemy. If you run, you leave red scratches and ravens flee scared; if you are hurt, the blood stains and the moans of pain betray your hiding place: these mechanics are becoming negligible, irrelevant, because the magic of the Aura shows the killer where you are: three quarters of the killers use BBQ, at least a third A Nurse's Calling , it's much easier to go without fail. I do not want the invisibility for free, I'm ready to spend a perk slot to get it, but give me back the atmosphere of tension, the thrill of the challenge, the fear of the unknown. Too many Auras, the rest is becoming side dish.
Lockers? Find someone in Rotten Fields or Shelter Woods or in the Swamps (four typically stealthy maps, full of open-air hiding places) and we'll talk about it.
Also for smart survivors. They know the map already and get in range or fake bbq reading by mindgaming the aura reading. bbq has counters already before distortion, and not all of the distortions will go off at the same time which you math doesn't calculate. The survivor on the hook will keep the 3 stacks.
You complain about bbq when many still stealth around it. Etc. Not only that, but some maps are since you wanna do the math, too big to look for survivors without aura reading because not every killer can zoom n search. Did you do the math on how fast gens get done? Lol. About 80 seconds at base and add 10 seconds if gen tapping with ruin. If a survivor is competent and keeps a killer busy for even 2 minutes, then there's the hook time before the travel to a survivor with a bbq reading. What does that make? Makes 3 gens done, 1 killer objective done (3 hooks per survivor so 12 objectives) and 3 survivor objectives done (survivors have to do 5 gens and 1 door so that's half done, 3 left).
Aura reading is there simply because at base, time isn't on the killers side. I'm a survivor main saying this, and I stil stealth bbq, still stealth nurses. Survivors aren't randomly having their auras read.
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Word, not bout playstyle. It's 4v1 a killer perk is supposed to counter n be more powerful than survivor perks. Jeff comes with aura reading the killer and aura blocking, killer has gen detection and locker juke reveal, seems pretty solid. Also stealth still works, maybe it's just you but I don't use stealth perks and I can still stealth. I'm not the only one.Entità said:@Dabrownman1812 said:
The point is it would be way too strong if you could choose, also if you have to choose then you don't know what perks they have cause that means you'll have to preemptively activate it. It's great because you can go into a locker when someone gets picked up to avoid losing a token. When you're healing you block nurses for some time automatically. Once your aura is revealed for even 1 second, you already gave the killer info. So yeh, it's good how it is.If I don't know what perks attempted to show my Aura is my business, not killer's or other players'. Who wants to be shielded from the trial beginning can let it active: I don't care to be invisible in the first two minutes, I want to be invisible when I have been hooked twice and I'm in extreme danger. The locker reform is not related to Distortion: it's a new passive mechanic for all survivors, about which my ideas are not clear.
@Dabrownman1812 said:
Ummm only jump scare meyers will do that mostly, which isn't common. Most meyers dont attach aura reading while stalk so yeh, not much mentioning. It also runs freddy through the ground as he has to leave the chase, leave survivor, and wait 10 seconds to see the survivor auraVery good point! I've completely forgotten this, because the Nightmare is the rarest killer I meet, when I play survivor: he can destroy your perk by simply bringing you in Dream World: if you are not able to find a gen or a mate within 30 seconds, Distortion has gone forever...
@friendlykillermain said:
NO its a bit too strong actually it needs a 180 second cooldown instead of token useageEhm... some explanation why it would be too strong? I made mathematical arguments: how can you rebut them in a line?
Look at Iron Grasp vs Boil Over: -75% wiggling effects for all survivors vs +75% wiggling effects for a single survivor, i.e. four Boil Over are equal to Iron Grasp (aside the secondary effects: a longer wiggling time in the killer perk and the disruption of hooks Aura-reading ability in the survivor perks). It's not madness: it's math!
Why do you want to destroy stealthy playstyle? If survivors loop, they are bad; if survivors use pallets, vaults and flashlights, they are bad; if survivors hide, they are bad... what the hell survivor playstyle do you want? All these Aura-reading abilities are destroying the game atmosphere, nobody cares about crows or sounds or blood: no, let's see all people with magic powers... What are the bushes, the dark areas for? What is Yamaoka Estate for? What is the use of the Dark Mist? Do all the maps flat like The Game and we'll finish it, then.
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Yup, also as I said if you have to activate it you would have to know if they have the perk already. That's why it activates to let you know if they have the perk. If you activate it you could use it when not needed or too late getting you revealed anyway. Why does sprint burst not activate on demand by a button press? To prevent it from being too strong. Same for this perk.DarkGGhost said:@Entità You forgot one small detail it's sapost to be 1vs4 if one person is equal to the killer then the killer will lose ( and plz don't try to use the database of dbd the are garbage). Second, they say ( if remember correctly) that it's will not counter killer add-ons. Last survivors have way more info than killers ( especial SWF) so in order, killer to play the game they need some kind of info in the game otherwise it's will pointless to try to find another Claudette.
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Ummm only jump scare meyers will do that mostly, which isn't common. Most meyers dont attach aura reading while stalk so yeh, not much mentioning. It also runs freddy through the ground as he has to leave the chase, leave survivor, and wait 10 seconds to see the survivor auraEntità said:@Crizpen I know how to counter BBQ: I made a comparison between the maximum power of the BBQ and the maximum power of four Distortion, in ideal conditions, and four Distortion are worth 2/5 of a BBQ: this is not a balance. We agree that the reality is different: the ideal consumption of a car, indicated in the instruction booklet, is almost always unattainable under normal driving conditions, but gives an idea of the average consumption of the car you are about to buy, do you understand the meaning of my comparison? In reality both BBQ and Distortion give worse results than expected, but this does not compensate for the initial imbalance.
Now, tell me something: in your opinion, is it different if the killer does not see anyone because of the distance, the lockers or the survivor hidden behind the gen or because of Distortion? The killer goes away from the hook in the first cases and magically becomes a camper and a tunneller in the second? And how do you know why people are invisible? Above all, the first strategies are for free, Distortion is a perk and you pay a slot to get it and it has to live up to expectations, and it's 1 perk among 59: not all survivors will run it, don't speak as if it were a passive protection given to everybody.With the current system, Myers can destroy the perk by simply chasing you and stalking with the right add-ons, you are not master of your perk, it depends exclusively on the circumstances: what kind of protection does it offer? It needs more tokens or a charging system (like Stake Out) or, at least, the freedom of the survivor to activate it when he wants, instead of risking to see the tokens consumed when he does not care to hide. A weak and situational stealth perk would be the bad copy of Sole Survivor: look at it, nobody uses it... ask yourself WHY!@Blueberry I have still to think about lockers reform. -
The point is it would be way too strong if you could choose, also if you have to choose then you don't know what perks they have cause that means you'll have to preemptively activate it. It's great because you can go into a locker when someone gets picked up to avoid losing a token. When you're healing you block nurses for some time automatically. Once your aura is revealed for even 1 second, you already gave the killer info. So yeh, it's good how it is.Entità said:The killer's power should basically match that of four efficient survivors, and so a killer perk should have four times the strength of the opposing perks of the survivors, meaning that all four survivors must equip a given perk to neutralize that of the killer.
If we analyze BBQ and Chili, we notice that it offers up to a maximum of 2 * 4 * 3 = 24 Aura readings (provided that each survivor is hooked twice before someone dies and, at each hook, the killer sees the Aura of the other three people), plus 3 other Aura-readings at the first survivor's sacrifice, 2 at the second survivor's sacrifice and 1 at the third survivor's sacrifice; total: 24 + 3 + 2 + 1 = 30 Aura-readings of the survivors, in optimal conditions, the best possible. All this without considering, of course, A Nurse Calling, Iron Maiden (how many times are the lockers used in a game? And the reading of the Aura in such cases is added to the Exposed status...), Bitter Murmur, Rancor and some add-ons (like Wraith's All-Seing or Shape's Reflective Fragment, Glass Fragment, Mirror Shard, Vanity Mirror), and probably other things I'm forgetting right now.
Well, if all four survivors used Distortion, each would have 3 protections from the reading of their Auras, that is 3 * 4 = 12 shields, and 12 is equal to 2/5 of 30 (without considering the other Aura-reading abilities, listed above). Evidently, this is an absolutely weak, seriously insufficient perk. I do not claim that the initial tokens for any survivor using Distortion are 7.5 (7.5 * 4 = 30), since the killer rarely gets 30 Aura readings in a single game with BBQ, however I find it absolutely reasonable and balanced that Distortion is reworked in one of the following ways:
1) tokens are 4/5/6;
2) tokens can be recharged with some simple actions;
3) if solutions 1) and 2) are rejected, at least the survivor can decide, at their sole discretion, when to activate the shield of Distortion and when instead let the killer see their Aura to save tokens.As it is currently, Distortion is decidedly unfair, and not to be detected is the first and foremost target of every survivor. @not_Queen @Patricia @Peanits Please, fix it!
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People could do better but it depends on the killer. An ok killer gives good points. Bad or too good gives less points.FoggyDownpour said:
In my opinion, the flaw in that logic is that it isn't one account/person with 4 party members to split the loot or experience between, it's four individual accounts/people all putting the time and effort into that match with equal amounts to lose and not enough ways to earn them or just generally not getting enough for what they do do. Each person needs to gain an amount equal to the effort and time they put into the match, not split it. With that logic the killer should be getting 80k+ points(4 times the current survivor amount), not 20k+Raptorrotas said:Nice how everyone is thinking about this issuee in an 1v1 perspective.
There are 4 survivors, each capable of reaching 32ķ, same as killer. Actually survs can snatch items too, increasing their effective gain.
Im a casul player but i guess even regular redrankers have rounds where all 5 players have around 18-22k Each. (Unless its a stomp)
While I agree my 4v1 view isn't ideal, neither is comparing 1 surv with the killer
It just seems a bit odd to me to compare them. Hopefully I didn't misinterpret what you meant -
Makes an abusable scoring event, what if killer is in chase, killer has no need to look for you and you're getting free points.TheLegendDyl4n1 said:@ChesterTheMolester said:
TheLegendDyl4n1 said:@ChesterTheMolester said:
Its mostly because the survival category needs a rework.
yes it does the only way to get survival points other than surviving is either self healing or self unhooking
And the worst part is that points for self heal should not even exist.
Maybe we should get points for wiggling and stealth.the longer we are not in a chase with the killer we should get survival points. not alot but enough to where it balances bloodpoints and i swear to god if someone says that killers only get one thing of bloodpoints while survivors all get 4 bloodpoints ill just shoot myself
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How is...nvm lol. Noed is nothing, and it isn't a counterpart as killers are limited due to game mechanics. Some anyway.Poweas said:@Mister_Holdout said:
DS needs to be removed from the game immediately.Remove Noed then. You survivor mains and you killer mains want one thing gone but wont bother asking for its counterpart to go .-.
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I agree but trapper to me isn't lower than hag.Crizpen said:I have a few criticisms of the list. First is the sample size you cite: 10 games each for having 40 survivors. That's a very limited sample size, which doesn't necessarily make the list right or wrong, but it is a very small sample. It also doesn't mention if they were random survivors or SWF, which would make a huge difference. For example, if you had 5 groups with SWF against Cannibal, but only 1 game with SWF against the Pig, that would drastically change the results.
Second, you don't describe the tools each killer used. Some killers are very dependent on their add-on's and offerings, where as others are less so. A Nurse without add-ons will do significantly better than The Spirit without them. Again, that doesn't mean your list is right or wrong, but it is important in describing your methods and assessing the accuracy of your list. For example, did you use a Trapper Bag for each game with the Trapper? Did you use Bloody Coils? That will make a big difference compared with not running any add-on's and judging a killer's potential.
On the basis of potential, based on my experience, I would disagree with a few relatively minor placements.
First, Doctor. The Doctor changes how survivors must play the match, but that alone doesn't make him a A-tier killer. He has decent movement speed, when he is in Punishment mode, but his power limits his movement speed. Each time he charges, he slows down, and in a chase he may be able to temporarily prevent a pallet being dropped, at the expense of his movement, and then being forced to waste more time changing back to Punishment mode before he can land a hit. Outside of that, his power forces survivors to take themselves out of Tier 3 Madness before they can interact with generators or heal, which can be very useful, but not overly taxing.
Second, and comparatively, The Trapper can eliminate loops entirely with his traps, and can send Survivors who step into them into dying status. He suffers from an opening time penalty of having to set up his traps to prep for chases, but can otherwise do very well to end chases with the proper prep and herding.
For those reasons, I would personally swap the positions of Trapper and the Doctor on your list.
Next up, The Hag. The Hag is fantastic at defense, and can be effective in ending loops with the placement of her traps. That said, she also moves slower than the standard killer, making her prep phase longer, and her ability to catch survivors lower. Furthermore, her traps can be entirely bypassed by crouching or with a flashlight. Which, compared to the Trapper, is a big disadvantage in her trapping. At the least, no one can move over the Trapper's traps without him getting the disarm notification and at best, injuring a healthy survivor for the disarm, where as survivors can crouch over the Hag's. Her strength is in surprising trap locations, and circumventing loops.
Furthermore, if the Hag is otherwise occupied in a chase, or carrying a survivor, setting off her traps poses no risk to the survivors. For these reasons I would lower her placement on the list.
Lastly, the Shape. If we're discussing the potential of killers, with the ideal addon's and offerings available, the Shape is an absolute menace to any survivor group. Supposing he utilizes permanent or tremendously extended Tier 3, his movement speed, ability to vault quickly through windows, and achieve 1-hit downs makes him extremely difficult to evade for long, or force into an extended 2-hit chase.
On the other side of the coin, utilizing a Scratched Mirror in Lery's enables him to earn free hit after free hit, if not generator / totem pull-offs with devastating ease.
If we aren't talking about potential ability, and simply based on their base power, I would rank him above the Hag for the reasons of her weaknesses. Myers suffers from slower initial movement speed, offset by his tiny terror radius, and in nearly every case, is able to stalk out of tier 1 relatively faster than the Hag can establish her set-up. What's more, survivors can only escape feeding his stalking by evading his line of sight, if possible. Which means his set-up phase, at worst, involves survivors running rather than working on generators.
The Wraith is a difficult one to place currently. Not only is his potential highly dependent on the add-ons and perks he uses, but also on the map he lands in. For example, maps with several generators out in the open make it far more difficult for him to get a surprise hit around a wall or through a doorway. However, if the Wraith is running a double-whirlwind build, stealth is less essential than speed and body-blocking survivors getting to a pallet during the de-cloaking.
So, I would say the Wraith has the potential to be very, very strong, but must rely on both add-ons and map offerings (and the survivors not throwing competing map offerings in) to utilize him to his highest potential. If he doesn't have a map/add-on combo to use, or if the survivors force him onto a map that doesn't work with the build, it can destroy the Wraith's potential. For those reasons, I would place him higher on the list for potential, but lower than most because of the risk of being thrown off by lack of or competing offerings.
With all of that said, I would place the killers as such:
SS: Nurse, Hillbilly
S: Shape / Spirit / Huntress (These are not in any particular order. In my experience, they're all highly effective with luck being the greatest determination of who is best used in any given game compared with the other. For example, if the Huntress happens to get a Lery's map, the Shape would have had the advantage. If it happens to be Coldwind, The Spirit or Huntress would have an advantage over the Shape. Etc...)
A+: Hag, Clown, Pig
A: Wraith, Trapper
B+: Doctor, Cannibal
B: FreddyPlease don't think of these comments as poo-poo'ing your list. It may very well be that among the entire player-base, your list is more accurate than mine, and it may be that I'm not as skilled with a particular killer as someone else, which lands them lower on my list than it would on someone else's. That said, I feel it's fairly accurate based on firm reasoning.
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Nurse like all killers have counterplay, most people dont know how effectively do it cause of the lack of god nurses.Justicar said:@Weederick said:
Op tier: Nurse
Toptier: Billy, Hag, Spirit, HuntressIf SWF is overpowered and nurse can deal with it, she is...?
Nurse isn't OP, she's utterly broken. But she has to be to counter SWF, which is also broken.
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If he's running spine chill he will leave the corner before you get thereNos37 said:@Skarkio said:
If you are on a gen, put yourself on the side nearest to a pallet or window so that, if you hear his bell or see his uncloaking shimmer, you can reach them quickly and avoid his speed burst.Careful with this; as Wraith, if I can sneak up on a Survivor working the side of a gen, I can usually pin them in and bodyblock for a free hit.
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Due to ranking system, more low skill survivors in deeper ranksVolantConch1719 said:@cTrix said:
@azazer said:
"Wraith has no way to sneak up on anyone"
If you can't sneak up on someone mostly invisible and with no heartbeat then your technique is flawed.That was supposed to say Spirit. Spirit can't sneak up on anyone. Her terror radius doesn't go away when she's invisible, it just sounds differently, also you have to guess at where survivors are. Assuming you hit someone despite those disadvantages, they will sprint away and it will take you so much longer than any other killer to catch up. Then they use a pallet or a window and they're off to the other side of the map again.
Worst killers in the game, Freddy and bubba, have normal movement speed
Worst killers are definitely Hag and Pig
Have you PLAYED Lisa (Hag) lately? I used to hate her with every ounce of hate I had (which is a lot, contrary to how people normally see me). Now she's one of my favorite killers. And Amanda (Pig), well... that one really depends on how nice RNG is to you. She can be either atrocious or an outright monster in my personal experience.
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Stay calm, he is relatively weak. Read the addons and just know how they work. On ps4 many things cause framedrops so he isn't too bad on their as the frame drop causes him to get cheeky hits when coming out of cloak.Eight said:Thank you very much, mate. I really appreciate how much time you spent on that reply and all the advice. GIven me a lot to think about.
Usually I feel like D/Cing when I find out the killer is a Wraith... but hopefully, I'll start to see it as an opportunity for practice now.
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You don't need stats, if spine chill is on you for a steady 2 seconds leave. He gets windstorm out if chase, has universal or silent bell. If you run spine chill it doesn't matter.Eight said:Ok, I'm a Pig. And I also play survivor about half the time. But I'm still going to ask for some advice.
The recent Wraith tweaks seem pretty fair, but my god am I struggling to adapt to playing against him as a survivor. If I had stats, I'm pretty sure I die most often, and most quickly, against Wraiths than any other killer.
Tell me your weaknesses!
How do I escape you, sneaky gits? Should I be 360ing, are you more vulnerable to looping, should I pegging it as soon as Spine Chill lights up etc. etc.? -
Word, mechanical as in not his smile. I see that.Mister_xD said:to be onest, i thought so too at first, but, and this is the part of the story that changed my mind, the storyteller admitted that he beat the "monster" and chained it up on a wall and ran tests on it. the next day, we got the trailer which showed us the trapper who was chained up on a wall and injected with the nectar, until he broke free. after that, the storyteller told us that "he" has escaped, so i am pretty certain he is talking about the trapper.
also the trapper is actually pretty disfigured, or how many people do you see who grow iron hooks out of their bodies? and the mechanical jaw could be related to his mask, as its one big mark would be the smiling mouth, which would kinda fit in this description.
i might be wrong though. -
Coulro on the doc I see. Yeh, good list though man.Blueberry said:@SmokePotion said:
@Blueberry said:
Perk combos that you think go well together for certain purposes doesn't make them "meta". Meta would mean those perk combos are actually ran very commonly of which some of those you said are not. The premise of what you're trying to get across is fine, I just think you're misusing the word meta.They aren't things I think personally work well. they are things I have seen in top ranked killer streams and videos. However, No matter who is using it, the most effective tactic is what it is. It literally does not matter how many people use it, it matters about maths and how it's chances are effectively used.
I don't think Lullaby or Coulraphobia would make any killers core list unless they literally had nothing else, both those perks are quite bad and situational. If it's just a matter of what you happen to see more often then I guess that's fair.
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It's called stridor and bloody hair brooch, so consistent the second hit comes out with little effort. The silent phasing, excellent with gen pulls, and totem builds for that devour hope.