Akumakaji
Akumakaji
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@ASurvkillivorer said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2702883#Comment_2702883
yeah I just opemed a file and would type the result
Nurse, Dead
Blight, Survived
Then tally it up later.
Last 42 matches have gone way crazy in my favor. 13 deaths 29 escapes.
I started my own little statistics suevey today. So far I got 7 games in and I also take notes how many DH, BT etc I encounter
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@dugman said:
I think it’s important to distinguish “Boons” from “Circle of Healing”. Circle of Healing is the specific perk that the broad consensus holds as being overpowered. The other two Boons are much less popular and don’t get nearly as many complaints.
So if the devs slow Circle of Healing down enough that should address what’s described in this post. They may not even have to do anything at all with the other two Boons.
Thats true. What still utterly boggles my mind is how anyone thought that it would be ok to stack +100% healing speed AND self healing in one neat little package. I mean, Botany Knowledge has something like +33%, right? I know that that also got efficiency added, but CoH is sorta +100% efficient because it never runs out.
So if CoH did +25% healing, that would still be good, just not braindead auto-unclude good. If they find a decent balance with some cooldown mechanic, then it wouldn`t be that aggrevating to play against.
Oh, how about CoH sharing the exhaustion timer? I know that this would make it unpopular, but this way you would have to give something up to bless one, and it mindless reblessing wouldn't come without a cost, ie the blesser would be rather exposed for a while. I dont know if this would be enough to curb its power, but it would be a start.
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@Olokun said:
if 42% Kill rate is True it must be at low mmr. at Higher MMR when she is mastered i highly doubt it s 42% so its a big NO until we got more data.
I guess that's the thing? She is one of the starting killers, so everyone can and will play here at one point, abd probably lose miserably the first few matches. Those who stick around with hrr will discover her true power, but all the dip players just pull her numbers down.
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Had this problem in one of the swamps, Midwich school and TBD Eyrie. Big empty zones were I just couldn't hook anyone and had to either drop the surv, or 100% lose them due to wriggling out.
On the Eyrie I feel it got much better, but especially Midwich can be a barren wasteland sometimes.
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@jesterkind said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2703100#Comment_2703100
...It's really, really not. Shadow Step is strong, but not overpowered, since it's relatively easy to play around even if you're chasing someone in its radius. Circle of Healing, by contrast, completely removes whole playstyles and tactics, and is absurdly strong compared to any other healing perk in the game. CoH is way stronger than Shadow Step.
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2703107#Comment_2703107
So, you do raise a point where there are niche scenarios that make Shadow Step more of a pain- still nowhere near as powerful as CoH, of course, I'm not sure why "you can't chase anyone" while Shadow Step is up, but it is a lot more annoying and a lot more powerful than that perk is elsewhere. The problem here is twofold, though- it once again bumps up against hard nuking the entire concept just because of outliers (CoH being the strength outlier, RPD being the outlier for making Exponential usable and Shadow Step more annoying), and it's also not actually the solution to that problem.
Instead of effectively completely removing boon totems from use by making them incredibly limited, why not look into whether or not the effect should get to permeate through floors? That'll handle the outlier situation that you're describing here without making Shadow Step and Exponential quite literally useless on any other map in any other scenario.
Breaking boon totems is not only not the only solution, it's not a solution, it's only a brief step above saying "just delete them from the game". There are actual solutions to these problems, like reworking totem spawns, making boons travel far less vertically, and nerfing the absolute ######### out of Circle of Healing, so why not push for that?
Would you argue that passionate about Hex totems, though? I know, I know "boons and hexes aren't the same, not even remotely, they just share a single ressource together"; I would argue that they are the most comparable ability between Killers and survivors that we ever got.
I read a lot boon discussions in the last weeks and something that creeps up every now and then is "if they were destroyable, they would become useless to me and I won't play them anymore" and I think that's a good thing! If something is so strong that (nearly) everyone can see its value, or it even becomes a no-brainer/auto-include in most cases (*cough* dead hard *cough *), then its probably mechanical too strong.
If it got its ups and downs, but at least some peeps see its worth or wanna put in the effort to make it work, then its probably right on the power level.
Yes, corner cases and outliers like RPD shouldn't be used as a strong argument, and yes, the CoHs AoE +100% heal speed +self heal is way stronger then practically every other option, but I think that boons in their current state were definitely a poor designed element.
Coming back to Hexes: they were designed around the concept that they should be stronger then normal perks, but could be removed from the game with some effort from the survivors. Over the years the strength outliers have been curbed down (Ruin and Undying), but by now many counter options exist, and many survs have memorized their spawns, that a lone Hex without support will practically always die within the first min of the game.
I don't believe that boons were designed as a time waster for survs, they were designed as a cool new mechanic and to give the something to do besides rushing gens, but if they were destroyable they wouldn't lose their individual power, they would use their mindless spammability and add a strategic and risk element, quite akin to Hexes.
They wouldn't be attractive anymore to everyone, but some dedicated players would most certainly make them work with a dedicated build. You could easily introduce second tier perks that protect them, or allow you to rekindle them once or something, but then you have to give something up, just like killers who run Hunted Grounds/Undying/Retribution on top of their favorite Hex.
Lastly, time for a killer is at a premium. Every second that you aren't chasing or hooking someone, three others will be doing gens. Even taking a wrong turn or falling down a hole can be impactful in high level killer play, while it would most likely just waste a few seconds for a single surv (unless they expose themselves to the killer). Sniffing totems is nearly never a good idea right now, as they can easily be reblessed and you can never truly be rid of them, heck there can also be up to four active ones on the map. The pressure that even one CoH brings to the table can be overwhelming, 3 can be utterly crushing.
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@zarr said:
Garish Make-Up Kit is a pretty incredible add-on, combine it with Cigar Box and it's absolutely on par with the Ether + Bleach combo. I find people still way underestimate how good the Antidote is, the speed boost makes hits possible on many tiles that simply aren't without it, and it particularly helps on pallet play once the pallet is dropped, something Clown in the past struggled with.
The advantage the Antidote has over the Tonic is that the survivor cannot really play around it since you do not have to try and get the survivor to run into it, you just have to place it such that it is opportune for yourself. Another advantage is that the invigorated effect on yourself regularly lasts longer than the intoxicated effect on the survivor - intoxication only lingers for 2 seconds, invigoration for 5. This often more than makes up for the slightly lower catch-up speed boost that invigoration grants as compared to intoxication. And not only that, but while intoxicated survivors have a fairly easy time judging where they can make it at their reduced movement speed, it is much harder for them to judge when your increased movement speed allows you to catch up. Hell, sometimes they don't even know that you're zooming. And the lack of experience many survivors still have going up against Antidote enjoyers also benefits you, especially once increased invigoration duration add-ons come into play.
Of course, the ultimate Clown combines purple and yellow for maximum effect, but if you are one of the people still skeptical about the value of yellow and find it more comfortable mostly sticking to purple, try sticking mostly to yellow for a few rounds instead, I bet you'll be surprised.
This guy clowns around, and this is the highest of praise in this regard.
Top advise and I hope that this inspires a few more aspiring Clown enthusiasts to learn the deeper secrets of his kit and see how awesome and fun he can be.
Though truth be told, nothing beats his sound design.
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So Tofu as the ultimate survivor is on the table. Interesting...
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Man, this is so cool :)
Now I wanna right click on my desktop and make my own killer list :)
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@CyberDragoon656 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2702821#Comment_2702821
Unfortunately, as long as it keeps being used and abused it's going to keep happening.
Hmm, actually that's not wrong. As long as it's such a problem, it needs to be called to attention.
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@katoptris said:
All I want is Victor with a sweater or a reindeer hat.
Awwww. It's disgusting, but also kinda cute.
In the same vein, maybe give Vommy Mommy a cute apron, rolling pin and let her vomit Eggnog.
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Gosh. Even as a killer main who thinks that DH is a bit too strong and prevalent right now, all this thread's are tiresome and bore me to death.
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I really don't see Snowmen as a problem anymore; as always peeps exaggerate and whine more then they should.
The core problem stands, ie that killers got next to no interaction with the toys and got just a few very limited cosmetics, and that funny snowman stories were mostly confined to the first 2 days of the event, but the killer apocalypse didn't happen, ie every survivor having 3 health states each chase, potentially more, because they can run from loop to loop and the snowman regenerate, oh nuuuu!
Jumping into a snowman mid chase is pretty dangerous and if you don't arrive early, the surv faces a pretty higj chance to get hit and downed. That said, if someone approaches me in a costume, and the game isn't high octane, I will hit ruhen and then ignore them, so that they get away.
Maybe this will benefit us in the long run: one day the snowman will go away, and while we honed our skills in battle with 3 health state and sneaky survivors, they got complacent and will have a rude awakening once their snowy clutch is gone.
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I guess people say this so that she won't get nerfed :P
I haven't played her a lot, but the few times I did, I cleared house. When you dominate with her and get the ball rolling, you stomp the opposition pretty hard.
It might be that I played her during the time when she was new and no one knew how to play against her, but I got some games down that were so brutal that I apologized to the survs.
I look forward to play her more in the future, but I also wanna get gud with Spirit, prestige my Clown, finish my Pyramid Head build... There is only so much time every day ;)
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For real! A separate ammo pool would help a lot in making Clown more fun and easier to play. Some people meme with him, but he is actually pretty rare, especially as a main.
Any ideas how to give him some more map pressure? Maybe auto invigorate him when he is out of a chase for 10s or something. Or let the entity drop down a bottle of Tonic on the generator that just got finished :P
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You are exaggerating, to my experience both, CoH and Shadowstep, aren't as that prevalent, as in SWF groups you might have just one dedicated health mage, but you are right that the survivor meta is so condensed, that the perk soup cooked down to just 6-8 perks.
My personal feeling is that if 8 perks are in 85% of the builds, then this perks are too strong, ie so strong that they become no-brainers or auto includes. If all the perks were equally strong, we would see an even spread.
Of course, in such a game some perk or combination there of will always be the mechanical strongest or stronger choice, but in most of my games 3 survivors have DH and I can't remember the last time (ignoring the first few matches after rank reset) were I didn't face at least 2.
DH, BT, DS, IW, Proof Tyself and CoH are probably forming about 70% of the 16 perks you will face as a killer. Sometimes someone has a certain build in mind or favors another exhaustion perk, but this perks are meta for a reason: they are way stronger then tyne competition.
On the killer side you also have meta perks that nearly everyone runs, ie you got a pretty good chance to face a killer who runs any combination of BBQ, Corrupt Intervention, Pop, Tinkerer, Discordance or that Pinhead regression perk that I can't remember right now, but I feel that with killers, you also more often see vastly different builds, like a complete hex build, or a carry build with Agitation/Starstruck/Mad Grit.
Survivors can do the same, and some do, but the vast majority will cluster around that 8 meta perks plus 1 or 2 personal favorites and in my eyes that shows that either this perks are too strong or everything else is too weak.
Normally it feels aweful when cool stuff gets nerfed, so its better to buff everything else, but in this case that would be pretty daunting and maybe things need to be curbed a bit?
Sadly BHVR has a tendency that if they commit to a nerf, they overcommit and often go too far instead of trying something more gradually.
My 2 cents (or 2 bucks)
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Another upside of using the Cigarbox is that it forces you to use the Antidote, something that many peeps struggle with Clown at first, because its delayed and not an easy "plug and play" like the Tonic and its mechanically "weaker", being just a +10% speed boost, contra the - 15% speed from the Tonic.
Still, learning how to employ the Antidote effectively will also teach you how to essentially destroy and walz through normally safe loops and get a hit.
My Clown play fastly improved once I got this down, the basic technique is this: throw down a Tonic one side of the loop, an Antidote at the other, chase the survivor through the Tonic, then change direction, and get invigorated, while the survivor is intoxicated and ideally runs through the Tonic again.
It's a bit awkward to explain, but once you understand the concept it destroys so many loops.
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Very nice guide.
I think that the Cigarbox and Garish Makeup is a very good combo to learn Clown, as it allows you insight into what ways survivors take and how they play certain loops, if essentially cuts down mind games and gives you so much info.
The Redheads Pinkyfinger is indeed ultra strong, but you said it all: it teaches you nothing and you will mostly focus on getting direct hits. The only marginal counter play is running erratically, while Clown will inevitably catch up and get either a hit or a down.
But every once in a while its fun to run it, and if its just for its cathartic effect on a Clown players psyche. If you run it, use it in conjunction with the Gin Bottles and have 6 bottled death at your ready. Your survivors will love you for it and might call you a baby Clown who needs clutch items to get anything done, but that might just be its own reward.
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Update: I reached Lvl P3-50, still no sight of ANY of the aforementioned perks. The grind -- the grind for bloodpoints. It consumes my every waking thought. Its all that matters. The Entity is all that matters. It devours all the (BAD WORDS) perks, till only perfection remains. Must grind. Must kill. Must sacrifice. Once The Entity matters. Must make The Entity smile, so that it smiles on me.
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@ThatOneDemoPlayer said:
What? How would this fix anything
Everyone would be salty and entiteld, yet the game would be perfectly balanced, as all things should be. Some great things need great sacrifices.
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Indeed, the Snowmen are somewhat busted and one half thought through, but they are a real event and I applaud that. The developer got their feedback and I hope that next time we will have a really cool event with something cool to do and interact with for everyone. Lets not always just (BAD WORD) on the developers, but acknowledge that they tried something new.
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@GoodBoyKaru said:
That's the thing, you're new to the game, and the new player experience is dogshit because nobody explains anything to you. Flashlights, something you despise vehemontly, are actually some of the weakest items in the game (but they're the most fun to a lot of people, so that's why they're common) and can be countered with relative ease (unless you have photosensitive epilepsy in which case, I absolutely cannot blame you for being so frustrated at them). After breaking a pallet, look down and track with ears, and after a while survivor pathing will become second nature and you'll be able to follow after them quite well just by watching them play for a few seconds.
Also, no amount of perks will ever cover for a lack of experience. Even the most boring, switch your brain off build on both sides (survivor and killer) needs some form of skill and experience to be strong, because without any of it then you'll just be wandering aimlessly and failing in chases.
I'd watch some videos on generic tile looping- I know there's this really good one by Scott Jund somewhere- and find some other DBD content creator(s) you click with. You learn a surprisingly high amount in this game by just watching and observing.
Asides from that, uh, this game is meant to be frustrating and it's meant to be annoying. If you have serious anger issues then definitely look into things you can be doing mid-match, or maybe you'll have to accept the game isn't for you, which is fine! Not every game is perfect for everyone.
Except no, Circle of Healing is bullshit OP, I completely agree with you there. That perk needs several tactical nukes.
As you said it, new player experience is dogshit, because you can only try stuff out in the heat of battle. While this is a strong teacher, its also an uncompromissing and overtly harsh one, would it have hurt to give the killer, I dont know, an option to go into his shack from the loadout menu, where he can just use his power a bit without the stress of a real trial?
Or a communication wheel, like most online games employed 10ys ago? Just some basic QoL things that should be plug and play to implement, because they are just the bread and butter solutions of modern gaming and could practically be found in any code archive?
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@ThatOneDemoPlayer said:
You want old DS and Keys? What is wrong with you
Isn't it obvious? Evul survs can never get enough and always want moar, moar, MOAR!!!11 /s
But to be real, that ending was fun, but also very, very brutal on that pior killers psyche. Its good for a chuckle, but its even better that this days are gone.
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"I am holding my breath, everyone!"
Yeah.. And that's how I ended up in the dead book.
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I am confused
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@Marc_go_solo said:
For survivors, it would be great to have a Russian, someone from the Oceania region, a Nordic survivor, and someone from Ireland.
For killer folklore, I'd love to see someone from Brotish folklore, like Herne the Hunter or a bastardised form of faeries. Alternatively, there are some interesting concepts that can be taken from Nordic mythology, such as Mares or Trolls. Also, the Wechuge (a monster made of ice) and Jinn could add neat elemental additions.
Also, as a skin, a Cyclops would be neat.
A Vodyanoi would be cool. Or Koschei...BTW,while re-reading Koschei's story I stumbled over the fact that in some stories he casts sleep spells and you can only wake them up by playing a magical instrument. Sounds like a cool Skin for Freddy. Sad that it's always so hard to get skins for licensed characters.
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@landromat said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2698808#Comment_2698808
Time changes. This game has playerbase big enough to gut SWF without big consequences. SWF is only a half and if you nerf it not everyone will leave. maybe 15% of that half.
That changes is good if you look into the future. More people will enjoy the game and play it longer because of less stressful and more fun games
Even though I am a killer main through and through and have been thoroughly abused by toxic SWF groups, I highly doubt your assertion that gutting SWF wouldn't impact the game much.
They are giving themselves a very big bonus via map awareness, that should actually be gained via perks, but they are also the biggest chunk of the survivor player base, especially in the evening.
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I noticed that, too. It happens, that I just randomly have to drop the survivor or they wriggling free of my grasp, because their is just no hook around.
Midwich is the biggest offender, but Grim Pantry and the Erie have this problem occasionally, too, even though on The Artists map things seem to have been improved.
I got the feeling that in the beginning there were barely enough hooks to hook everyone, not even speaking of getting there in time. Btw, the map has grown on my, and I now win most of my games there. The tower is quite strong, but the map is brightly lit and has long sight lines, so you often spot some survivors from pretty far away. I just wanted to throw that in, because I remember that in the beginning everyone said how survivor sided the new map was because of its massive size, but I am actually always happy seeing it.
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A native American Wendigo killer, who would satisfy out lack of a Werwolf like killer plus some added colt or hungerbased power or perks.
A middle eastern Djinn who commands wind or fire. Maybe even a Ghoul... the original middle eastern Ghul, not the regular carrion eater.
And as my ultra awesome entry: an Malaysian Pennangalan! This guys are freaking awesome! In essence, they are Malaysias native bloodsuckers, but there is a twist: when they go hunting they leave their body behind, while their head and all their inner organs break loose and float around. So they are a floating head, trailing their whole baggage with them.
Fun tidbit: on order ao squeeze back into their body they soak themselves in vinegar so that they shrivele up a bit, so if you meet a person that smells of vinegar, be careful around them!
If you suspect a person to be a Pennangalan, you might sneak into their house when they are hunting and turn their lifeless body around, so that their head attaches the wrong way and their true nature will be revealed to everyone the next day, when they walk around the city.
There is a Phillipines variety of this evil spirit called the Manananggal, it's somewhat similar in concept, but instead of a floating head with organs, here the torso rips lose and sprouts batlike wings, while the legs keep standing.
In the legends, smearing garlic on the open wound of the legs will kill the Manananggal.
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There is a special place in the dark corner of my heart for Blendettes. If they don't surprise me with fun, normal gameplay but insist on immersing themselves with the environment, I'll make sure that they become officially part of said environment.
But in all fairness, usually the choice of character model means nothing to me, but if you clickety click or t-bag me, I will usually show no mercy and might even tunnel you out.
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Clown can shut down loops and chases short, like brutally short, if you are a bit experienced with him, and this seems to hit a lot of survivors off-guard. Clown suffers from a lack of map pressure and, oddly enough, movement issues, even though one of his powers directly increases his speed. But the Antidote is too awkward to use and too short of effect, to offer any real map traversal, its main purpose is to shut down strong loops, when you can pull off the double whammy.
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@ThanksForDaily said:
Devs look, I made the 154162663 Dead Hard nerf discussion. 👀
You are asbsolutelty right with that one ... but it also shows that it is a constant issue that is causing grief and strive all the time. The amount of all this discussions alone could be a hint that DH is in deed stronger then its competion and/or overperforms. But we will have to wait and see if BHVR will do anything about it, while we bash our heads in in the 154162664s discussion about DH :)
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@RainehDaze said:
What, you think you should be able to do fun things? Blasphemy. Go spend another 100 hours getting back to where you were for some hard-to-see splatters on your first person character.
Ok :<
BTW, Pyramid Heads P3 must be one of the better ones, and I hope I scare a lot of survivors with that look.
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@Munqaxus said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/300495/dead-hard-nerf-or-change
If the developers thought Dead Hard needed a nerf, they would have nerfed it when they were fixing the hit-validation a patch or two ago. They obviously aren't seeing data indicating that Dead Hard is out-performing other endurance perks.
@Munqaxus said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2700758#Comment_2700758
Dead-Hard adds a lot of play value to the survivor side.
Sure, getting out-played is always aggravating for the other-side and Dead-Hard offers a new way for survivors to outplay killers.
But if you look at it from the survivor-side (and game designer perspective), there's very few perks to interact with Killers during a chase. Dead-Hard is one of a very-very limited (I would say less than you could count on one hand) perks that adds a new dimension to chases. Getting rid of Dead-Hard would just be insane from a game designer point of view. Why would you want to eliminate dimensionality from your game. In fact, you would want to add more ways for survivors to interact with killers, not remove them.
Also, let me point out that no-one has EVER shown any data showing that Dead-Hard outperforms the other endurance perks. And of course there is the false equivalence fallacy in which people say that Dead-Hard is an "extra health state". The two aren't the same at all.
I see that you surely love the perk and want to defend it, and you throw up a few good points, like that it adds some gameplay element, BUT (here comes the inevitable but) the past has shown, not just in dbd, but all the other game systems and mechanics out there, that if something is so good that it becomes a sort of instant choice or no-brainer, barring some special build or something, then it is probably too strong.
In such a game there will always be perks or builds that are mathematically better or even the strongest, but DH is actually in a leage of its own. You can prefere Sprint Burst or Lith if you want, but both of this perks take a bit more work and demand somewhat special situations, where as DH will nearly always be a great or even awesome choice, because of its variable ways of employment.
We have no data, thats right, but there is no other perk that you have a good chance of seeing 3-4 in each match; only seeing 2 DH in a match is already rather uncommon or even rare, and seeing it not at all might only be possible in the absolute lowest of the low ranks, its just that good. The other perk that you see very often, but still nowhere near in the same ballpark, is BT, which has its own issues, but BT is mostly ok. People hate that it bastardized and not used as it was originally intented, ie protect the unhooked surv from being tunneled; instead in the modern meta its used quite aggressively by bodyblocking the killer, denying him completely any progress at all. This us aggrevating, but something that most of us can live with.
DH, though, is so prevalent and offers so much. Each of its base abilities, ie gaining ground on command or gaining invisibility frames on command, is pretty strong, yet it combines both into an absolute meta package that few survivors can resist at all. And you can't blame them, but DH is so oppressive in chases/loops/unhooks, that it might actually be a third health state. Yes, technically it doesn`t work like it, but in praxis killers have to deplete it, before they can put 4/5 of all survivors into the dying state, so it factually is a third health state, that you must press a button in the right moment to employ.
I dont really know how to tackle the issue, and it would be wrong to utterly destroy and nerf the perk into the ground, as I can see its appeal, but its power definitely needs to be curbed down, because its so dominant over the whole spectrum of the game. Maybe give it either invulnerability frames OR distance? That alone would do a lot. Or maybe increase its exhaustion timer, I dont know. 40s is long enough that it can regenerate quickly, if you lose sight of the survivor for just a moment and he escapes, and then you have to deal with it again.
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Pro-Tip for next Halloween: use Bubba with the blight serum, its just too much fun when you all of the sudden fling yourself over half the map, bump into a wall next to a shocked and flappergasted survivor and then start sawing.
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@VikingDragonXii said:
The issue is now I cant get any of the items because survivors just hop out of the snow bois before reach them.....I'm missing 2 charms and all but 2 of the cosmetics........now survivors are using the snow bois as mobile lockers to extend chases or to body block hooks and doors.....
Easy: just play surv, jump into the nearest snowman and waddle around. Maybe finish the mission, maybe die on hook, if you just want the items. Repeat one time and you are done. Could go as fast as 3min.
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Interesting info in this thread. Still, I once had this match in the Silent Hill school with several purple oaks burned and I struggled like mad to get anyone on hooks, it was truly nightmarish, and I was the killer :V
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@LoneSlinger said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2698381#Comment_2698381
But the issue with that logic is many other chars have fakes and they are removed
Huntress can fake a hatchet
Demo can fake a leap
Phead can fake a judgement
Doctor can fake a shock
Billy can fake a chainsaw
Plague can fake a vomit
Trickster can fake his knives
Pig can fake a ambush
Don't worry, the nerfs for all of this will be coming :P
Jokes aside, after the rank reset I played him a few games to finally get his Adept achievment, and I found him quite fun to play, so I can't imagine how he must have been before the nerf.
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Hmm, this sounds indeed not that bad. It still has the problem that you need to hook all four survivors and sometimes you don't see one all game, but I guess thats the kind of risk you have with most perks, ie that some game situation might not come up to give them value.
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@Predated said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2699817#Comment_2699817
How are they griefing for crawling away? They simply dont want to give you the kill after you left them on the floor to do something unrelated to that survivor. If you're not picknig a survivor up, they are gonna move away from that spot. Nothing childish about that. It's equally childish to leave a survivor on the floor so long that they can crawl to the opposite side of the map.
Ok, I will elaborate. It was a very sweaty match on Ormond and the survivor in question had BM me all game. I eventually downed him on the chase to the exit gate, had a bit back and forth with the other three, wounded a few and finally chased them through the exit door. On my way back I noticed the hatch and closed it, came back to spot were I had left the BM survivor, and couldn't find him anymore.
By the time I had searched the area around the exit gate in ever widening semicircles, the survivor was nowhere to be found. He eventually bleed out about 20s before the EGC came to an end. I don't know, but to me it feld childish. Yes, he deprived me of that kill, but in doing so wasted both of our time, with nothing to be gained, and this I would consider griefing, but you might decide this is a valid tactic to withold a mediocre ammount of points from to oppisition, if you like.
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I have never let anyone bleed out on purpose. One person was a griever and crawled away, so that I couldnt get the hook, but he couldnt escape because the hatch was closed and only one exit gate was open while everyone else had left. That was really childish, but eh, whatever.
Besides that, I have relaxed my stand on NOED in the DH/DS/CoH/BT saturated survivor meta and now again use it without a bad feeling. Not on every killer, mind you, but when I happen to get it thrown in my face while leveling up some killer I will use it. Interestingly a lot of survivors stil think that NOED is unfair and that its kills shouldn`t count, somehow. Well, you do you, and I do mine.
Camping on first hook is boring as hell, I give you that, as is getting tunneled 30s into the game. But if you tunnel, that means that someone saved that person, so thats only 2 other survivors on gens, which is valid. Camping one survivor while three others are doing gens, though, isnt a winning strategy. But this is a moot point as I normally play as if i had Devour Hope equiped, unless some cheeky survivor runs past me and tries to go for an unsave unhook.
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@GentlemanFridge said:
I never considered this, but I would presume it has to be with a Mori offering, since PH's Final Judgement is in fact not a mori, but just a special kill, like an RBT popping. His actual mori with an offering is an entirely different animation too.
Which makes me wonder whether Myers' Tombstone behaves the same way...
Dayum, thats a bummer :( I had a feeling that this was lightning in a bottle, I mean I got everyone to hook stage 2 and killed them. I guess with the old mori this was that much easier, right?
Well, after validating my steam files I could restart the game again, but before it gave me about 5x the same error message when I tried to start it up.
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@foxsansbox said:
I personally think Insidious Basement Bubba is healthy:
- Much different playstyle from rest of roster
- True fear if you're caught first, bigger benefits of immersion and stealth
- Will he stay in the basement? Will he come out? Will the non-SWF survivor fall into his web of deceit and treachery? These are all portent realities
- Very real spread of 0, 1, 2, 3-4K based on logic tree of killer and survivor, as opposed to the almost binary 0/4 we commonly see.
- INSTANTLY exposes salty survivors who don't like the killer being a power role for even a single game
This is so good! Cudos!
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@KateMain86 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2689402#Comment_2689402
I think thats probably what a lot of people who do d/c in matches they deem unfun to play eventually do. You don't get any points or experience if you do d/c which means you won't be able to get blood web items and perks to progress your character. I'm of the opinion that most d/cs would stop if killers didn't camp or tunnel. Also hitting survivors on the hook over and over has to go too.
Today I had the most puzzling DC. It was on Lery with Pyramid Head. At the start of the match I had surprised a Nancy and wounded her, but she got away. A bit later I found and hooked a Bill, roamed a bit around, until said Nancy ran straight past me and towards the hook. By the time I got there I saw Bill running away, and not wanting to tunnel him, I turned around, seeing Nancy crouching down just behind me in a corner. So I swung my mighty cleaver, downed her and then she instantly DCed.
I was just flabbergasted at what happened. I mean that was a super unsave unhook and she hid in the most insecure position possible. Did she think that Pyramid Head wanted to camp her out on first hook? Nah, she was just salty that the match started really bad for her, but dayum, I sometimes wish I as killer had the gals to just DC when the first survivor escapes my grasp.
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@The_BiggCheeze said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2699573#Comment_2699573
Oni: Needs to gather blood in order to instadown, Requires survivors to be cuddling each other for warmth in order to down multiple survivors.
Leatherface: M2 to instadown, Press M2 again to make instadown last longer.
Oni takes skill where as Leatherface just shuts his brain off.
Ok, lets try to tackle this. You claim to be a killer main; have you actually played Bubba? I mean outside of Ash or Bronze ranks? I consider myself a pretty competent killer, but I can hardly "shut my brain off" and ez to a 2-3K without any effort. Competent survivors will loop you round strong tiles, so that you have to resort to M1 attacks or through tight standing stones and trees, where going M2 ain't that easy, oh no. M2 is an instadown if it hits, but its far from a guarenteed hit, you still gotta work for that.
BUT Bubba is one of the few killers that are always dangerous, with the looming doom of defeat over the survivors heads. Due to his kit they can't do their cute bodyblocking and borrowed time shenanigans, for he will just cleave through that. Most other killers can be disrespected, but you can't do that with Bubba, which is why he gets so much hate.
Yes, its true that his kit is also very strong at camping, but unless the survivors try to be super cheeky and altruistic, all gens would just fly by, while he camped down a single survivor, so thats you "guranteed 2K while shutting your brain off".
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@The_BiggCheeze said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2699479#Comment_2699479
I got tunneled through RPD while he was using speed limiter and that iri add on. THAT'S AS TIGHT A MAP AS YOU CAN GET!
"I said it in the past and I will say it again: Bubba is very effective roaming about, hooking and pressuring some distant gen, especially when they activate Tinkerer and he can jump right into the fray, chainsaw blazing! Thats so much fun." Is this what it'd be like to see bigfoot riding a unicorn? Because it doesn't happen. Every single Leatherface I play against camps and camps, even letting us do gens in their face because "Gotta baby guard the hook".
It is 100% his fault because that's the way he was designed, to down multiple survivors if not ALL survivors. It's basically the fine print saying "Hey camp with this one"
So because he can easily down multiple survivors, the fine print reads "Hey camp with this one"? Sorry, but you lost me there. Is Oni then also made for premium camping? Because last time I played Oni, I rushed to the hook from the other side of the map and surprised the unhooker and down both with a (non-planed) perfectly executed Oni-smash, so I guess Onis fineprint also reads "HEy camp with this one".
Bubba is kinda plug and play, after you tried out the chainsaw two or three times and understand how it works, so a lot of new killers might use him for their first power fantasy fix, but to get a 4K with him you cant camp. If you want to be a successful Bubba, you have to roam the map, surprise peeps at gens and then rush back to defend the hook. Defending a hook isnt camping, btw, but by the nature of his power you often down both: the unhooker and the unhooked survivor. So Bubba can snowball pretty hard, but thats actually something that he shares with all other insta-down killers.
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As a killer main I normally dont tunnel, but actually play by your survivors playbook and behave like I have Devour Hope, even if I dont run it. BUT I might change gear when I play my jolly game and then three gens finish back to back during the first unhook. Thats the sign that the kids glove are off and I go all in. Oddly enough slamming gens isnt something that survivors acknowledge, but they will 2/3 cases throw salt in the after game chat and call me the worst killer ever for camping and tunneling. Geeze, then dont bring BNP and slam gens like there is no tomorrow. What do you want, a game that lasted 3.5min?
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I have, oddly enough, prestiged Legion to P3 first, because I just love the high octane mad chases with feral frenzy and dealing out even punishment. Legion is also very good at casually farming blood points, so I never regretted the P3. My others are P2 and soon P3 on Pyramid Head, whom I might main, P1 on Leather Face and I might P1-3 Clown, because I love him.
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I said it in the past and I will say it again: Bubba is very effective roaming about, hooking and pressuring some distant gen, especially when they activate Tinkerer and he can jump right into the fray, chainsaw blazing! Thats so much fun. I prectically never camp with him, besides certain EGC situations, and I have a jolly good time with him. Last time my spidey senses tingled and I chose the right gen at the start and surprised all four survivors. Due to target saturation I got confused and downed no one, but it was still super fun with them running panicked in all directions :D
So while some lazy bums might play camping Bubba, thats not Bubbas fault, but 100% this players. Still, in every game the meta will dictate that one character is the best at something, and Bubba is the best at camping, but that doesn't mean that camping is the only playstyle thats viable with him. And while Bamboozle is super effective with him, that doesn't mean that it 100% shuts down his only weakness, you can still run tight turns around rocks or trees and, even though I am quite good at navigating this mazes by now, I will routinely hit one of the obstacles and throw a tandrum. But more often then not I will successfully navigate and down a cheeky survivor, I mean thats just experience with a killer and his kit, and experience should never be punished, right?
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@Jago said:
I just hope its Sadako and not the american remake.
We will get Sadako as the main one, but Samara as a premium skin; 100%!
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I mean, you can say that BM at the exit gate is just not that bad and that you should just chase the survivors through it and move on to the next game, but IT IS a sort of ritualized humiliation of the killer. Of course you as the killer know that you have lost and that you can catch no more survivor, baring some very bad play of them, so why do so many survivors have that vitriolic urge to rub it in as deeply and thorough then possible?
I totally understand that you might linger till everyone is there, in case you want to go for an altruistic save, but its really SO annyoing to drudge through half the map, because you went to the wrong exit gate, just to have 2 or 3 survivors proudly tease you for your effort. So nowadays once its clear I can't catch anyone, I watch some youtube videos on my second monitor, while amusing myself about how desperate some of the survivors are about getting their killer salt.
When I stand in sight of the exit gates some come out and try to tease you, clickspamming their flashlights or massively vaulting pallets, just to get you to move, and wasting even more of everyones times, but they never get far enough out that they actually put themselves into danger. This ones are usually extra toxic in the after game chat, so they are definitely no nice persons to play with or being around. And yes, they show some lack of basic empathy for the other side and I would not wish to engage with this kind of persons on a personal level.
Maybe once everyone is secured give them some kind of laceration meter that fills up, standing in the exit gate zone and that only declines when they move back into the map, forcing them to either leave, or really play with fire, if they so much desire to do so. Another possibility could be to give them some kind of token for lingering too long in the exit area that makes it impossible to leave for or at least not crawl out for while; I dont know, this are just some quick shots and probably all have big abusable holes in them that I didnt think about, but BM at the exit gates is just one big time waster and just one more stress and frustration factor for the already stressful and frustrating role of the killer.