Finally! Thank you bvhr Sincerely
Sprint burst, thrill, and vigil are all getting confirmed nerfed finally.
They just announced it the livestream. I’m hella excited, finally changing the boring ‘you don’t get to play’ perks.
Sprint burst, thrill, and vigil are all getting confirmed nerfed finally.
They just announced it the livestream. I’m hella excited, finally changing the boring ‘you don’t get to play’ perks.
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I dont care too much about Vigil or Sprint Burst, not having a problem with them and not using them myself. But they get weakened way more significantly (SB 3—>2 seconds, Vigil 66% —> 40%) than TOTH (12 sek —> 10 sek). But if I remember correctly, they said that TOTH will get more changes at a later point and this time it is only a number change.
Not a fan of the Deliverance change tho. Doubling the time to be broken is a bit much for a Perk which I think most people would consider very fair.
I don't think any of these needed nerfs. It's just selective outrage that will find a new target shortly after.
I wouldn't be so excited if I were you. BHVR's definition of 'nerf' is both NUCLEAR WEAPON and Microscopic tweak.
When?
Can we expect it soon or will it be in 3 months with next Midchapter after this rift has closed?
it seems it’s gonna be awhile unfortunately.
Bhvr seems to be moving very slowly for no reason
Massively disappointed by the Sprint Burst nerf but I can't say I didn't expect this coming. Anything that the community constantly whinges about is on borrowed time. I dunno why it's taken them nearly 10 years to nerf this perk if it was really such a problem, but OK I guess…
I'll be swapping my beloved SB out for Lithe whenever this update goes live.
as long as stuff gets changed I couldn’t care less, anything to shake up the meta
vigil and SB nerfs were a long time coming
and they will nerf lithe once the content creators start complaining
I don’t get the deliverance nerf. This perk has been around since 2018, I dont remember people complaining about it then so idk why it’s getting nerfed now
I’m not too sure about that.
Bhvr has always been big data, that’s their while point behind coulrophobia getting nerfed.
So clearly the data finally told them something was wrong, and they also said in the stream that changing the meta doesn’t necessarily mean nerfing the most powerful perks, just the most used stuff. That’s probably why STB wasnt here, because according to their data it’s still underused
As a vigil main, I think the new values are still more than before buff? It's still going to be strong
Sprint burst is the one I'm side eyeing, I don't use it personally, I've always used balanced landing. I'm worried this is going to be a trend of targetting exhaustion perks.
Yet hyper mobility killers still exist in the game, I feel if we are targetting mobility on one side we really should be looking at it on the other also. This is a slippery slope.
They’re really scraping the bottom of the barrel; we’ll barely have 4 decent perks for a survivor build in the near future except for those annoying healing builds.
It’d be best if the reworks for all those perks (they’ve mentioned 45) turned out to be any good, because I don’t know where this is all heading.
you’d be surprised what’s actually viable if you put a little creativity into it.
You’ll be amazed how much better of a player you become when stop using the same 4 perks every game.
Yeah, exactly. I mean, it is a good Perk, nobody will deny that, but I feel that it gets balanced by the fact that you have to earn it and if you are the first person hooked (or simply not fast enough with the Unhooks) that you play with 1 Perk less.
August 25th. they said these changes will be on the upcoming ptb (august 4th) and will coincide with the Grimoire chapter release.
agree. These things go hand in hand, if they’re gonna nerf all the exhaustion perks they have to look at the mobility creep that’s killers have be getting.
But You also should’t feel like you HAVE to run a high mobility killer just to compete.
mobility should an addition, not a requirement
it’s because of vigil probably.
Deli, in a vacuum is fine, balanced even.
But most people who use deli also use vigil and ds to compliment the build thus making it too strong.
Honestly now that vigil is getting nerfed idk why they’re nerfing deli
They've already touched Adrenaline, Hope and now they are going to reduce the Unhook Protection to 10s.
Get ready for the other exhaustion perks to be addressed very soon.
It's so funny to me because we have people being like, "this perk has always been broken" and I'm just like...SINCE WHEN?!
If the common problem is vigil then why not just only nerf vigil?! Why touch the other perks?
Like the main reason why its the focus is because its one of those perks that smart player can use quite decently like I would imagine the main gripe most people have with it is the 99% the exhaustion and then let the killer get close walk a millisecond and then run away while he swings at air. Like that is the thing people remember so even if they don't see it in every match that is still the image they get in their head and why its a problem. In reality its not that much of problem perk but what do I know.
again I agree with the sentiment. Vigil really is the problem child here.
but sprint burst isn’t exactly innocent, it’s current strength most definitely played a part in why Jason was made so strong, if hold w wasn’t so strong I guarantee Jason’s OE would have a much longer cooldown and he wouldn’t get haste after a jumpscare.
sprint burst is balanced, technically. But when against non-mobility killers its value skyrockets. It’s just a feedback loop, something’s gotta give eventually.
Nowhere to Hide and Vigil being nerfed is some of the best news I've heard all week. W changes
Hopefully they finally make Nowhere to Hide aura reveal to stick on the gen. It never even make sense why it gets centered around the killer anyway. It should be killers Wiretap not I will stroll half a map and see every survivor that was not even near the gen in question or touched it.
Thrill will be at the level it was before the buff they added with the BP removal. Nobody ran it back then because it was awful, even with the bonus bp.
Sadly it's just a range nerf. Kinda frustrating tbh, because I despise NTH only because the aura follows the killer. If it just stayed near the generator I wouldn't have any issue with the perk.
it’s so weird they don’t do that.
They already have it coded with 2v8
Yeah same here would have no issue if the aura reveal would stick on the gen. That was what I thought it originally did when it was revealed. Then I realized that the aura follows the killer after the kick I was like that is way too good. Even when I play with it in some of my random builds its information value is ridiculous for how easy it is to activate and use.
Hello!
We really appreciate everyone taking the time to write down their thoughts on today's stream announcements, positive or negative. I know there's some concerns and questions and hopes. I can't answer anything at the moment but I do hope that when the changes do arrive that everyone will continue to provide feedback so we can continue to monitor it!
And of course, as always, the changes will come to PTB first to make sure folks can get a chance to get their hands on them before anything goes Live.
There’s a good reason that sprint burst and vigil are so common - they’re two of the best survivor perks in the game. I started using both a while ago and chases became significantly easier with these perks equipped. Although I’ll be sad that they’re not as strong for my preferred build, I understand the need to adjust the strongest and most commonly used perks. The same should done for the strongest killer perks. Anyone who is complaining about a stale meta should be fine with this.
So the Sprint Burst nerf means that the survivor using it makes 2 meters less distance - so hopefully this helps the killer players who have issues with pallets (less chance to make the next pallet)
It’s not that Vigil and SB are super strong, it’s more like survivors have nothing else to use. You know things are bad when 5 moves ahead is considered meta.
Oh my god, finally.
there’s plenty of good viable options, it’s just people aren’t creative enough to find good builds.
everyone seems to want to pre run the yellow and pre drop unfortunately.
And I can’t blame them, it’s easy, effective, and anyone can do it.
This. Regardless of whether you liked SB or Vigil, they both sat the power station of selection rate for far too long. Alot of perks are due for a fall from grace, on both sides if we're honest.
It always seems to work eventually too.
Their perk balances doesn't make much sense. Nurse's Calling and STBFL are getting buffed even though their already decent, while there are dozens of trash perks like Haywire that will probably get skipped.
For me this is always a pretty bad argument. Because even if Sprint Burst will be nerfed, this does not mean that people will suddenly play their non-mobility Killers. Why should someone who plays Jason, Ghoul or Blight suddenly stop playing those Killers? Only because Sprint Burst gets nerfed does not mean that someone suddenly wants to play Trapper or Hag.
And if I look at my games, I almost never go against non-mobility Killers. So for me, if I would be using Sprint Burst, it would be nerfing a balanced Perk (according to your words).
The problem with non-mobility Killers are the Killers themselves.
I don't really think it ever stopped the people who like those killers anyway. SB is one of my biggest annoyances on my main. Didn't ever make me consider not playing him. People aren't changing their killers cause someone might have one perk.
I think the SB nerf is kinda unjust. 2 seconds of haste? Just delete it at that point, no? Lmao.
You are probably right. Lithe is actually a slightly stronger perk for me, but I think it's fair to say BHVR won't be nerfing any exhaustion perks because of SoloQ players like me. All it's doing is taking away yet another perk that I like to play with.
Low mobility Killers have other things in their toolkit meant to offset a lack of mobility and to help them cut down chase time, though. That might be a ranged attack like Huntress. Or it might be stealth that allows you to sneak up on Survivors + a dash attack like Chucky / Pig or stalking ability like Myers / Ghostie to shorten the chase. Trapper and Skull Merchant want to push Survivors into their set ups and don't care too much about exhaustion while Sadako can use her TVs to catch up or cut off escape routes. There's also Mindbreaker, which is a pretty solid anti-exhaustion perk. I know it feels bad to have to run a perk to counter this or that in the game, but that's how DBD currently works and how we've told the devs we want the game to continue to work.
Lots of these Killers can struggle at high MMR but I think that's more to do with the higher percentage of SWFs playing at that level, who can negate a lot of these tools and strategies while generally playing more efficiently. But Entity forbid we ever do anything to nerf SWFs, BHVR would rather continue to ignore that elephant in the room.
I'm just tired of balance changes that make my experience worse while never really touching what I think is probably the biggest obstacle to actually balancing the game (e.g. BHVR continually fighting fires trying to balance around the strongest possible SWF using outside tools to communicate with + whatever their current meta load out happens to be).
Players just want to get decent value from their perks. I feel like that's not too much to ask for. It's not like anyone is suddenly going to start using Thalita's perks now that SB is getting a nerf. The same goes for any other terrible low pick perk in the game. I think it would be a better idea to buff more perks to give players viable alternatives and play styles, so we see certain perks a little less often.
(I do understand some of the other nerfs, however. Vigil probably needed a nerf. Thrill mitigated the gamble of running a hex build a little too much and while Coulrophobia was maybe fine on its own, it's promoting a slug heavy play style that they don't want to encourage).
I think it’s a perfectly valid argument, me personally I am a big fan of trapper and the games I get whooped in it always against people who pre run with sprint to safe non-trapped areas so committing would be an awful idea.
With this nerf not only will I play more trapper, I won’t feel as bad committing to someone sprint bursting away because I know they aren’t gaining as much distance as before. Same applies to other low mobility characters, I’m definitely gonna be playing a lot more ghostface, SM, and trickster for sure.
Now this is just me personally but I highly doubt I’m alone in thinking this way, there’s so many different killers in the game that are people’s favorite that SB/Vigil completely guts. People will get bored of playing the same killer over and over again, it happens all the time unless it’s a content creator whose job it is to main that one killer.
like you said it’s more of killer specific issue, but I don’t envy bhvr’s position when it comes to buffing bad killers, because sometimes what they’re going for not everyone will like, an example being myers. Was the solution really just giving a dash? Idk. I’d rather them deal with the easy problem now being vigil/SB, and when back killers finally get looked at they can be buffed again.
And if blight didn’t just get nerfed I’d fully agree with sprint burst needing to stay strong. But now we have Jason so I don’t know how much that narrative holds up. Idk I just bhvr needs to do a big shake up of everything, because at this slow of a pace with so little changes happening, lots of stuff gets left to to wayside either not used at all or festers into something bad later.
I'm fine with the changes, but if the new boon perk is gonna be unchanged on live release, then I'm taking break for survivor
well said completely agree.
I just wish everyone would stop freaking out so much, vigil/SB have been hard meta for years. I’m not saying to gut them permanently, we can always just buff them back up once swfs and bad killers are finally addressed.
they will probably get buffed again relatively quickly anyway because they’re so popular, when bvhr kills stuff off for years it’s usually things people actively didnt like/aren’t very popular.
Sadly that's just how BHVR functions - if something is a problem they nuke every possible aspect and burn it out of the game.
SB as a perk by itself it really well designed - it trades off having to make decisions about walking to preserve it (but thus wasting time that could be doing something else) or using it to get to gen (but risk it not being recovered when a killer finds you). Its a great measure of game sense on when to use it and as an early player perk helps people learn that skill.
Unfortunate we might lose that.
Balance changes are bit of a mixed bag I feel. Vigil and SB nerfs are great as SB in particular was kind of a brainless perk so having to be a little more selective about it's use is nice. Deliverance being nerfed is just kind of dumb, it never was an issue at all. coulrophobia I don't mind the nerf because I get it being a problem with slugging although I wish bhvr would add in an exemption so it doesn't affect healing downed survivors, WGLF only grants the healing bonus on downed survivors so they can totally do that.
I could name off a dozen good perks that people just turn their nose at. There are absolutely great perks.
Nic Cage. Empathic. Wicked. Strength in Shadows. Bond. Decisive. Finesse. Boons. Fixated. Iron Will. Resilience. Troubleshooter. No Mithers made a Resurgence. Second Wind. Babysitter. Deja Vu. Inner Strength. Lucky Star's cute if you are Leon irl. Flashbangs. Background Player. Wide Open Throttle. ESP. We See You. Object of Obsession.
I haven't even touched on perk synergies like Plot Twist+DS or Flip Flop+ Power Struggle.
5 moves ahead is a really good perk just like WoO. The fact that it’s popular doesn’t mean other perks are bad
That was the change I was hoping for but at this point I'll take the range reduction, it's better than nothing