zonkednb
zonkednb
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@Gardenof_Eden said:
The way I view survivors wanting to farm (or being a survivor that wants to farm sometimes too) is as follows:
-See if the killer is willing to (little head nods, 'come here' emote, etc) farm possibly. If they shake no or just hit then you SHOULD play normally or d.c right there if you're going to be a sour puss and not play properly or throw. No one wants that. A bot is better than dead weight.-If you all decide to farm… as a survivor DON'T BM after it's over. Two reasons for this. 1) Your little sour ass wanted to farm and got your farm so don't be a dick. 2) They might have an end game build and now you're screwed and get what you deserve.
Play how you want as killer. Neither side is entitled to anything.I try to give them opportunity to run after the first hit too, reply to their head shakes with head nods so they know I'm not going to stop, all that good unwritten communication. I don't want free downs, I want them to make me work for it like a good boy. I do see the survivors often make the request to farm, as you described, but I very quickly let them know that I do not want to. After that, they continue to try and do so anyway.
I know I cannot dictate how people play the game. I'm not moralising them or calling them bad people. I'm just venting the frustration of not having all day to play, and when I do, getting bunk games that were a waste of queue time for someone that wants to play. -
@AbsolutGrndZer0 said:
Try being a Pig Main sometime. We're known for "boops" and all that, and yeah it's fun, but sometimes we just want a serious game and there are times when the survivors at the end of the serious game seem to be not happy you were not friendly with them. Sure, some are joking about it, but a non zero number are totally serious.
Now, that said, I am much more likely to be on the friendly side in an Event queue, because lets face it… no survivor likes going against sweaty tryhard killer after sweaty tryhard killer and barely getting any event points because of it, so I like to be that killer who breaks that monotony for them. Sometimes.Pig is my second most played girly, I love her. She probably gets this the worst though, my experience is similar. I love being a memester, but let me 8 hook first, then we can frolic.
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@Phantom_ said:
I only have this happen if I'm playing as S.T.A.R.S./RE4R Wesker / Ghostface. Which honestly I get and don't mind as much any more. I will play the game normally until the end and then try to be silly, moonwalk, let them get a few pallet saves etc. I know how sweaty games on my servers usually are, so I don't mind being a chill killer lol.
I think I'm seeking some mythical midpoint. I want to play the game as intended, do some chases, win some mind games, make clutch hits with my power, but also recognise a moment worth reacting to and be a bit goofy.
Maybe EU servers are just not sweaty at all though, with over half my recent games having the issue of people refusing to play the game to a varying degree. I don't want to be a miserable sweat, but fitting in games around my job is hard, so mathcing into games like this so often is kinda killing the game a little. -
@Royval said:
I farm whenever I can honestly (when on survivor) when your mmr is not in that low threshold there will be no farming killers for a long time. So enjoy it while you can lol
But in this case I am the killer that does not want to farm :(
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@cogsturning said:
I have a lot of people throwing and giving up, but not like this. More often then not, my killer matches are sweaty as hell lately. Then i have these ones where I gain instant momentum and everyone DCs or gives up. There's been little in-between.
I did have one guy like this yesterday. He'd play normal until I got a hit then he'd crouch and wiggle around. It honestly aggravates me when people do this dumb stuff when it's clearly soloq. You're just screwing your team.
I'll do a little silliness as both killer and survivor, sure, but only in the event that I was going to go down/get a down anyway, or quickly enough that it limits the disadvantage it puts me at. Like if I path into a dead end (still happens ik big noob), I'll let the killer know I'm aware and embarassed of my certified bonehead moment.
That said, I never throw for the purpose of the funny, especially on survivor. I'm in soloQ 99.9% of the time and I don't want to ruin 3 other people's experiences just so I can maybe exhale slightly through my nose when the killer nods at me.
The big early-game DCers I've come across are the wannabe bully squads that play for flashes and sabos and get styled on by simple M1 chases. In those cases, I'm not even mad though, it's gratifying as hell, especially if they were last-second switching loadouts. -
@Skeleton23 said:
I am also tired of this. I was slugged because I was not wanting to farm like everyone else.
https://us.v-cdn.net/6030815/uploads/QC2GYA9MIUMF/1000018145.jpg
I just want to play the game you know
Sorry to hear that, my dude.
As survivor, there's little I have in terms of power to dictate the type of game. I can't force the killer to not be friendly, for example. I don't mind farming with randoms on the odd occasion, but it's just so unbelievably frequent. And, like I mentioned in OP, it's not just in the event queue. I think those in base 1v4 aren't farming though, they just wanna do gens which I mean… Why?
Give me a sabo-happy, flashlight spamming bully squad 1000x over before a team that doesn't even fight back. If I wanted to to ragdoll NPCs for a few hours I'd just spawn a bunch of Dr Breens in Garry's Mod. -
@ShanoaLegendaryPlz said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4071062#Comment_4071062
I find i feel similar when "trying" to play as ghoul. I'm a big fan of Rize from the anime and of that entire show shes the only character i could've wanted, and got real lucky to have her included along with her original voice actress.
But the playstyle is so bad that its too easy to use, and the community of course hates them with a passion unlike anything since 3 gen merchant. So everytime i do try to play as Rize its like im the 10th ghoul theyve seen, and they either always give up, or barely try. Like id want to test just how tough it is to lose against people trying against her so that you don't feel hated or too overpowered, but it never happens lol. And they will never change the ghoul to a more tolerable state.
I understand why Ghoul is hated, even though I wouldn't say they're OP, they're fun to play but just not fun to play against in most cases. When I play survivor into a Ghoul I do try my hardest, but often lose because someone else gives up. It's honestly a special game where everyone pitches in for a win.
I don't play Ghoul much myself, so I don't think killer choice is the issue for me. In fact, most killers I play are B tier or below. Think Wraith, Pig, Trapper. I also play Springtrap a decent chunk. It's Wraith that is netting me the majority of these survivors that don't want to play, though, usually after they fail to notice my approach and see me uncloaking on their back.
The only time I've ever had confirmation that someone gave up because of my killer was a Clown game. The justification given in end-game chat was that Clown is too boring. -
@ShanoaLegendaryPlz said:
I wouldnt say the ones i played against wanted to farm. It was either they stood at the hook, disconnected, or went afk for the rest of the round after seeing me. In such rounds id continue to play normally but only 2 hooking everyone except the one giving up. Id kill them off and farm with the rest, if anyone turned to bots id take them out too.
Out of 30 or so killer rounds id have about 23 of these types of 1 person gives up the rest get to farm - rounds.
It could be a give up thing, but I've found these people still want to unhook/heal/do gens.They just refuse to engage in the game unless left alone, and they're not even running stealth builds to avoid me, which at least would provide something for me to interact with.
I've been seeing a lot of improvement in my killer play recently, which has motivated me to, maybe not sweat, but try harder and actively want challenging opponents to give me their best showcase of skill. Winning a game where at least 25% of the enemy team won't meaningfully provide any resistance is boring and a huge waste of time beyond a level on the blood web. It's especially annoying if I bring my favourite addons to that game and end up consuming them for no reason.
I try to have some empathy. Maybe I'm playing a killer they've faced multiple times this session and has trashed them so thoroughly that hearing the same TR saps all motivation for them to even try. I don't agree with what they're doing, still, but there's a human flaw I can at least understand, even if I wouldn't do it myself. -
@Gardenof_Eden said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4070527#Comment_4070527
I'll have o try some of these. Some of them I'll have to buy, but I'll have to try them at some point regardless.
Alright!
Have fun. Insecure trapper is obviously super easy and not going to win you the game. You can also set 4 traps together and stand in front of them patiently, like you're running an emporium that only sells broken tibias. -
@LordHeXaGoN said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4070504#Comment_4070504
Actually, yes.
And for me, that was sad story.
Dude just booped me in the last moment just before their reverse trap blew up.
:(
I prefer never feel so guilty.I've not had that yet but had my party hats go off a few times. I do try to be a polite pig, only pressuring party hat survs if I've no other info to follow up on. I'm not sure if that qualifies as a goofy playstyle or not. I don't think I have that pig rizz tho. So many survivors won't boop me :(
To answer the actual thread question, however:-
I've not done many goofy killer games as I still have to sweat a bit to not get thrashed. Here's a couple:
- Boneclapper fakeout Wraith: One that I've done on occasion. Find a gen with a good view angle from far away where survivors are not likely to look. Uncloack. Experienced survivors will likely react to it because they know you can be anywhere when using boneclapper, run about for a sec, then return to the gen when they realise it's safe after you recloak. Do this enough to give them false confidence, then strike, hook, reset and start the process again.
- Insecure Trapper: Place a single trap in a very obvious area then stand near it. When a survivor sees, swing at the trap to ask them to get in it, as if you're not able to get anyone any other way. You may also approach survivors and place one down near them and make the request. This led me to an 8 hook game.
- Chase nurse: Just commit chases. Get haste from every source. Use her addon to increase speed. This catches people out so much because they just don't expect you to gain ground. Tends to only work early game though. Blinking is for losers.
Some things I've come across in my survivor games but haven't tried:
- CSGO Pro Slinger: Slinger was always ADS, even when not in chase, jiggle peaked for shots and checked his corners.
- Jumpscare Myers: 2-hooked the whole team, then spent the game setting up jumpscares where possible and just being a goober. This one is common enough, scratched mirror is the go-to.
- Ankle-biter Ghostface: Never uncrouch aside from when knocked out of stealth or hooking. Play your best but if revealed you have to scarper away and recrouch ASAP.
- Stealth Pyramidhead: A classic, you can kit him out to get massive value from dragons grasp/make your choice for easy jumpscare downs when paired with undetectable. Also a test of your moral character. Will you be fun, or will you use this to proxy hooks?
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I recently switched to learning Pig after a prolonged period of Chucky play.
I was forced to become a memester because I forget you have to uncrouch to gen grab, so multiple matches I have stealthed right up to someone oblivious on a gen, then proceeded to just grunt awkwardly.
When they turn around and boop, I feel so guilty that my intention was to kill them, and I can't bring myself to stop playing nice after.
Is this how a Pig main becomes what they are? -
@Wezqu said:
You do realize that most people don't have 50 ping even if they have fiber connection as it depends on the distance to the server and if there is people with 460ms they are most likely lag switching as if they had that bad connection it would have cut off already.
To be fair it could just be people with a bad connection. I've had some rough goes of it in the past, and I live in a developed area. Literally today had a Huntress whose ping hit 860, but was fluctuating wildly before she eventually DC'd, likely due to losing connection entirely.
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@ShanoaLegendaryPlz said:
I somehow naturally got much better against weskers being a Rebecca main since her launch lol. There were so many tunnely weskers that i got used to "locking in" against them.
Have to treat him like an m1 killer until he pulls the tentacle out. Then you treat him like a blight that cant curve to hit.
Its also noticeable that he has a rather big lunge attack as thats how he usually gets u when he cant hit with the dashes, so sometimes its better to run through pallets you likely can drop, but the difference would be the pallets dropping and you getting hit anyway, and you running through the pallet for him to swing and miss. Of course it doesnt work every time as its very "rng" as to where hes standing, where you are, when he starts the attack, how close the pallet is n all that.
But yea the main 2 points is to adapt to 2 forms of killer like u would with dracula. M1 form, and blight form. Thats about as easily as i can explain it lol
As for the window vault faking thats just unlucky as they would get sucked into the window if they dashed right at it, so its more about listening if hes ready to fly at the window or not
'preciate it!
I do wonder if I'm not greedy enough sometimes. I'm still getting the distancing down on when to pallet drop and although I've gotten more consistent, Wesker throws me off so badly. I do wonder if his running animation is part of it. He's tilted so far forwards it kind of messes with where I think he is. -
I'm torn on this one. Firmly in the wait and see camp because I can completely understand the worries about stifling creativity, but also understand why there needs to be a level of control over stacking certain buffs, on both sides.
Here's hoping @Rickprado is right though. This may be a way to level out some extremes so they can take bigger swings at overall numbers on less used perks without fearing breaking another combo.
Gonna miss See How They Run + Machine Learning silliness, though. -
@cogsturning said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4069038#Comment_4069038
Honestly I wouldn't dodge so much if I felt the matching was fair. Yesterday I had a survivor in my killer lobby with 9k hours, and another with 400. That was just absurd. I've gotten to where I'm so paranoid I'm checking momo's stream when I'm in lobby to make sure I'm not fed to him again. The matchmaking is so random that I have to police it myself.
The only way to make perks visible in lobby would be to have a dodging penalty timer, like TCM. And the only way they should ever do that is with better matchmaking. So there's a chain of new problems with any change. What they're doing is the logical first step though.
Chat is only available to PC users. If anything, console players will bare the brunt of pregame perk visibility hostilities.
I can certainly agree on matchmaking being an issue. I'd probably take an extra couple minutes queue time just to ease some of the issues that causes. The idealist in me will still push for more lobby info, although definitely never which killer nor seeing the opposing team's perks in any way. I do think ultimately this will make killer harder on average, but will reduce some of the luck involved in how the game is set up. I probably shouldn't play DBD if I prefer minimal RNG in online PvP, lmao.
Chat being PC only would impact me, so I suppose I gotta remember what position I'm speculating from. -
@cogsturning said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4069014#Comment_4069014
Idk actually. Maybe? But again, I'm a serial dodger, and that's exactly why they aren't showing you in the lobby. And I'm staunchly anti-DC and very team-minded. So again, once I'm in, I'm in.
Stealth builds don't worry me so much though. Distortion never really concerned me. I use my build to waste killers' time. They're busy looking for me at the tile and I'm already gone. If anything, I'd adjust a non-stealth build to a stealth one if I saw teammates in lobby running them. One of the most devastaitng losses of my dbd life was to a team running a mix of Lucky Break, Iron Will, Distortion, Shadow Step and some others, against my full aura build. I got like two hooks and just could not track them, and I'd love to try it myself with a team without actually gathering friends together (cause no one wants to play this game anymore.) Solos being able to make builds around each other would be great, better than this, but the lobby timer would have to be extended.
I respect the honesty!
You are right. If a perk preview is only ingame, then it won't change your behaviour at all. What's interesting is in-lobby preview would be another non-voip gap-closer, which it feels like most people are all for. But you state the downside of this and the source of it, people with your mentality regarding dodging.
I suppose it could also lead to a lot of lobbies being held hostage by people complaining about perk choice, demanding certain perks etc. It's not all upsides, but personally I see it as a worthwhile tradeoff. -
@cogsturning said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4069008#Comment_4069008
Was that me that said that? Pretty sure it was. Dodging is my dbd sin. I'll dodge for anything. And yeah, I'd dodge a meme or totem or hatch build in lobby 100% if I could, just like I'd dodge someone with 200 hours. I'm tired of losing because of goofy teammates. But once I'm in a match, I'm locked in. No DCing, no AFKing, no griefing. Most people will act fine. The ones who won't, already weren't. We stand to benefit more than hurt from this.
I currently run what would likely be considered a rat build. Self-Preservation, Iron Will, Lucky Break, hatch at main, and a key. But it's pretty obvious in match that I'm not a rat. The key gives me team aura read and the ability to let my team rummage chests. Hatch at main is a backup, and I rarely need the key for that because killers go to shack when they see the secret offering. And I never get griefed inexplicably, because I show that I'm active and a team player. Most people will continue to judge on that criteria.
Meant in good faith: would you dodge your own build?
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@cogsturning said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4069006#Comment_4069006
The difference is SWF can coordinate in advance. You won't know this until your in-game. Personally, I think this will make little difference to anything for most games. And if I think I'm getting griefed for my build, I guess iI'll change it. We're probably all going to be changing our builds to the what the new meta will be with this diminishing stuff, which I find way more concerning than additional info.
Of course, it's not on the same level as SWF, it's just a minor narrowing of the gap, which is always a step in the right direction, so I don't want to dismiss it off the bat.
I think we're in for quite a shake up next patch so it'll certainly be interesting. -
@Mushwin said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4068992#Comment_4068992
I doubt it they have made a big mistake.
Basically here's how it is.
SWFs get that info.
SoloQ doesn't.
SoloQ currently either has potential anti-synergy by not knowing what other players are going for, or have to do all the keeping track you're talking about, while relying on guesswork and in-game observations.
In general, this won't impact your game at all. If you're worried about people getting mad that you didn't let them use their perks optimally, turn off chat. -
@Mushwin said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4068978#Comment_4068978
But again how the heck are you going to keep track of EVERYONES perks and their duties and roles while trying to do gens and live and not be chased???
I gotta be real with you dude, that's just gonna come with time.
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Teammates perks is fine tbh. Useful narrowing of SWF/Solo gap.
I'm a bit less certain about the killer visibility, however. Yes, sometimes it'd be nice to know that I'm not bringing a full healing build into Legion, but my bigger concern is killers getting out-perked. -
I like her conceptually. What would you suggest the change be?
Survivors now are experienced enough not to worry about playing injured, especially if doing so relegates the killer to M1 and nothing else.
Perhaps have another stage beyond broken? Wesker's infection applies hindered, which forces your hand. The same kind of thing could work, maybe with some kind of caveat, given cleansing is much more of a trade off for her.
Off the top of my head, have her infection progress beyond broken to another stage that also applies hindered, but only when all survivors are infected at the same time? That would force survivors to cleanse after long enough, but allow them to forego cleansing as long as they can see at least one person is healthy. -
The lack of real onboarding process.
DBD is a simple game by design, but it has lots of unintentional (or retroactively intentional) mechanics that massively impact the outcome of many situations.
A brand new survivor is going to get slaughtered for free every time, often thinking that there was literally nothing they could have done about it.
A brand new killer will rapidly hit a wall when they meet their first skilled survivor, getting humbled by a thousand techs with two-thousand names that they could not possibly intuit.
The game does an extremely poor job explaining why you are losing, with a huge amount of the game being knowledge dependent. It says a lot that the community considers sub 1k hours as a novice general. Basically the game has two layers, one which is the intended, simple experience, and the other which is entirely made within the confines of the game, but by the community, not the developers.
Many new players will drop the game out of frustration, mistaking it's opacity for unfairness. Those that stick around will graduate baby-jail and end up fighting an even more uphill battle as they start to match with very high level players. Honestly, I would not have stuck this game out if I didn't hyperfixate on it.
Honourable mention:
Badham. -
Agree in theory.
In practice, a few concerns:- Killers will go into casual because it'll be a lower stress experience, but will still do their best to win.
- Survivor SWFs may very well do the same. You think a bully squad would ever go comp?
- Casual will have issues where anyone doing too well is told to go comp, regardless of their build/strats. If you think player entitlement is bad in this game now…
- A ranked mode would only be appealing with good incentives, but providing that will make people join and do the minimum required for whatever the incentive is, causing tension with people there for high-skill gameplay.
- Ranked could only be balanced by hard locking matchmaking to keep people facing their own rank or one above/below. Queue times would be very rough.
I don't mean to be cynical but the only outcome I see with this is a half-baked rank system that gets softened over time due to queue times, resulting in MMR mismatches even in ranked queue. The casual queue will remain pretty much unchanged in terms of the general experience, with the unofficial rulebook for fair play being made ever thicker. I'm happy to give hatch or do a slug race if I've already double hooked everyone from time to time, but I would hate that to be the expectation.
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The BP incentive in the event is causing a few attitude issues in game, I am not going to lie. Even playing the game relaxed, while still trying to win, results in people getting uppity about it. They give up and hope for a killer that will BP farm with them, try to act friendly to get me to stop playing the game so they can do their gens/quests etc. etc.
I get it, I do, but also I want to actually play the game with the additional gameplay elements the event provides. I wanna map out blood-pump-to-blood-gen routes so I can intercept people carrying. I want to adjust for how blood gens fill in batches, meaning one having limited progress does not necessarily mean it'll stay that way for long. I want to have other things to defend like pumps. I want to have new reasons to prioritise chasing one survivor over another, such as if one has a full blood can.
Another clear issue is MMR in the event. Dead horse and the beating thereof, I know, but the sheer variation I'm seeing in this event dwarfs regular queue. That's probably leading to people feeling more inclined to give up because killer skill level feels more random and matches feel less fair. -
@Jay_K said:
Maining Vecna going for p100 because i find him very fun to play but wouldn't say he is the "best in the game". Yet if i don't get a 4k im hit with this.
https://us.v-cdn.net/6030815/uploads/A24S4DP44DDX/image.png
Obviously because this one claudette player sais this it must be true right?
I was under the understanding that he is mid at best but curious. Does everyone else think he is the best in the game.
PS playing vecna on swamp is torture with the elevation differences….this is your warning if you play swamp as this killer lolHenry is a funny one. I like playing into a Henry. I don't play him that much myself because his playstyle just isn't for me. Yet I fully get why people don't like him.
I am not saying there is no counterplay - there is, but it's not reactive, it's predictive. You bait a direction and adjust depending on where you think Henry is going to use power. The problem arises if Henry predicts differently to how you expect, messes up his power placement resulting in a hit because you were dodging based on him being accurate or just goes random. By the time the power has a visual indicator, you already know whether it will hit or not. It can be a little frustrating when hits feel unavoidable. However, slowing his power down enough for it to be possible to react to without having to presume where he is aiming would cripple him into unplayable territory, so this 'problem' is a rooted in his design.
Further, landing the power is also predictive. Less introspective survivors can very easily blame luck for taking a hit over skill, which results in a lot of salt.
This doubles up with the Myers effect, in that you could play super well, but Henry can farm his power off of a teammate having a worse game, then turn around and punish you for it. A lot of people find that unfair.
I'm playing bit of devil's advocate here. I don't find Henry unfair myself. I enjoy playing the mind games and if I'm against a Henry that is fresh enough to be less predictable, it's unlikely he'll land many hits anyway.
Something I will argue about passionately though is this:Henry will always be the true vecna. This other fake may have been here first but Henry just likes to be fashionably late to the party XD
Literally the most incorrect thing I've ever read. Why are you ragebaiting me? :(
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@QwQw said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4067359#Comment_4067359
That's pretty much exactly how I feel as well! There's just something about Wraith and the other killers similar to him that makes it so much easier to focus while playing as them. I get this sense of confidence that I otherwise don't have.
When play Oni, Deathslinger, or Vecna for instance, sometimes I get frustrated because I'm misplaying their powers - which loses me the match. But with Wraith, or Legion, or Trapper, they don't really have powers to misplay in that sense. Obviously you can make mistakes, but for the most part whenever I lose as them it's because either I made a wrong prediction about how the survivors were going to play, or I just get an incredibly well prepared team that you simply need an A or S tier killer to beat. (But that honestly doesn't happen very often)
Yup. I do want to learn more just for variety, and I think if I can get to the level of chill with more killers it'd add a lot of variety to the way I play. Right now, I don't get frustrated per se, but I get a fair bit of anxiety when stuff starts going wrong, because I'm thinking "Oh god I gotta go pressure htem off that gen and also close distance on the guy I just saw but also make sure I make optimal use of my power to accomplish x" and I start to lose focus. With Wraith, stuff goes wrong and I think "bingbong M1" and continue vibing. I'm almost at the same level with Pig, another M1 killer, so you are fully right with your assessment of my preferences.
@cogsturning said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4067357#Comment_4067357
Honestly I haven't met many people who are casually comfortable with any killer. I don't even have a big chunk unlocked and I never will because some are of zero interest to me, or I just downright hate them.
I can't say I'm actively striving towards development, even at thousands of hours. It kind of happens naturally with both roles if you play them and watch how other people play them. I learn more from observing opponents than anything else. I'm also just trying to have a good time, and have other people have a good time. If you're not gearing towards playing comp or streaming or going for a winstreak or something, what's left is enjoyability, and you should do what's fun. I'm on console and so always avoided ranged killers, as the learning curve is much higher, but I found Henry so initially fun that I didn't care I was underpeforming. Now, 400 matches in with him, I'm no longer underperforming, but I'm still having fun. If the fun stops maybe I'll go back to Clown or Vecna or whoever, but for now, I'm having the best time I've had as a killer in a while. And hey, commit to Wrairh enough and you could become a top Wraith player.
I think I'm not aiming for comp or the very tip-top. I made that mistake with Overwatch, focusing so hard on hitting and maintaining T500 that I started realising I was dreading finishing work because I'd have to go play Overwatch again.
However, I think there's a minimum level of competence for DBD that you hit in order to maximise how fun it is, and improving is a good way to get there. Maybe not be good at every killer as a baseline, but be comfortable enough to switch it up between a set of favourites without getting in my own head about how well it's going to go. You do have a great attitude, though. I'm with you. I'll play killer with a hint of memery, especially if some shenanigans happen, because if I know both sides had fun, it kinda makes the whole thing more worth it, even if I'm cleaning house.
Then again, maybe I do become a top Wraith player, be a 2k streaker standing shoulder to shoulder with Blight lmao. -
@QwQw said:
Seems to me like you might just enjoy the M1 killers who rely more on mindgames and macro knowledge rather than sheer mechanical skill.
That's how I've always been. Throughout my years playing DbD I just gravitated more towards that kind of playstyle - I found the "challenge" (since many M1 killers are seen as weak by the community) enjoyable and I liked excelling in the 1v4 instead of brute forcing chases in the 1v1.
Ultimately what matters is if you're having fun! If playing Wraith makes you happy then bing-bong to your heart's content 😊
Goddamn you might just be right. DBD was very stressful when I first started. Now, I switch off the stress parts of my brain as much as I can and keep a good mental.
Wraith is the killer I never get shaken on, even if I'm being ground into paste by every pallet on the map, bagged, flashed, DS'd, head-on'd and every other thing a survivor can do. I got my bell. It bongs. It drowns out the mental warfare.
Maybe that lack of stress is the draw. -
@Abbzy said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4067336#Comment_4067336
Transferrable skill, hard to tell his cloak is quite unique in its effect that other killers dont have very simular power to it.
I would say bodyblocking can be used on others like on ghoul when you leal to some pallet window to block it for survivor but this is mostly wraiths main thing other killers dont use that often. I find his main skill in knowing hos power like from which direction to aproach so you block the way to pallet or window and push them to unsafe position, than his mind games with 99 uncloak shen survivor os camping pallet.
Only simular thing is like when he has speed from uncloak which is like 6,6 m/speed and 6,9 when you attack and this can be kinda used to learn mind game weaker loops and bait with it to get hits which can be simular to other killers with dash power like mayers or pig or chucky but wraiths uncloak speed buff is just haste not fash compare to killers I mentioned and is shorter in time but this is like only thing that comes to my mind, he is more about teaching you how to play m1 and mind game plus his power is specific like survivors can vault over and over some window/pallet and you as wraith must consider if that location can be bodyblocked or you must uncloak and break or push them or if its unsafe loop where you can position yourself so you can bait them there and get hit with uncloak speed.
I dont think there is simular power to wraiths cloak like other killers have powers or forms in which they cant hurt survivor but they arent simular to wraiths like sadako before manifesting pr draculas bat form thats more close to spirit in gameplay or vecnas underground form but that has its own hitbox so on this I think wraiths power is unique and its main skills are around mind gaming and 50/50 situations ( like when 99 uncloak against survivor camping pallet either hd greeds or drops and theres on you to guess it right and get something at best hit and pallet in one move) and positioning so I dont think theres killer whose power is very simular to wraiths. Still he is good pick because many killers play as m1 or they can even the best ones and getting better in understanding survivors in chase and pulling mind games is very good on other killers too.
Thank you. I won't comment on everything you said else we'd be co-writing a novel, but I did read all of it and take out some key points. The approach angle is one I am subconsciously doing already, but I think I forget to do that with other killers because I associate it so strongly with Wraith. I'll keep that in mind. Appreciate the in-depth resonse.
@cogsturning said:
A lot of people hard main a killer. I started the game playing only one and stayed that way for awhile. Then I shifted to playing more and became anti-main for awhile. Out of my top 10 most used killers, I have about the same stats (aside from a couple of drastically lower or higher outliers) with everyone, but I don't think it's bad to have one killer you're great at, or just really love playing. Quite out of nowhere I fell in love with Henry and now I don't want to play anyone else, and I haven't since his release. If you like the gameplay and the results, then you're good. If you get bored or want to expand, change.
I think I want to avoid hard maining anyone and at least be competent with each killer eventually. Just so, if the mood strikes me, I can randomly pick up Singularity or Billy without having to fret. I enjoy Wraith plenty! He's basically what I'd call the standard DBD experience without bells & whistles. I mostly wanted to touch base both about people's own experiences, like yours with Henry (who I suck at, so power to you for gitting gud) and to see if there's a consensus on whether or not defaulting to wraith is costing me development.
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@Abbzy said:
Wraith is overated in my opinion, he is good but with good addons without them only thing that keeps him above water is high speed mobility that player can frealy control and some stealth that can give him hit if survivors dont see him coming because of objects bloking their los.
Wraith is pretty m1 killer for me only thing that keeps his ability good are faster breaking and vaulting addons, faster uncloak addons and faster speed addons they make his ability more versitile and actual threat especialy in chase where without them he is forced to be m1 killer.
He is simple but not easy against people that know how to loop him and he is lot about mindgames so at best like mid b-tier killer maybe high b-tier if that player that plays him is good at mind games and reading survivors moves (this is about wraith running good addons and perks without them he is c-tier that needs perfect execution to get value). Wraith is good pick and great to learn m1 chase personaly I dont play him that much because I dislike killers that need good addons to be mediocre or even viable which wraith to me is so I rather stick to killer like billy, springtrap that have more skilled power harder to use but more rewarding in terms of good use.
Key thing is to play what you like.
Interesting. I think I regard Wraith similarly. Addon-less, he can feel quite sluggish and weak. I tend to like the vault/break speed addon and the other is a free spot that I adjust depending on what I'm feeling. Uncloak speed is the usual, but I switch it up.
What's interesting is I actually played a loooot of Springtrap early on and picked up his power exceedingly quickly. I discovered the holy truth of Guitar Strings, which allowed me to keep pressure on consistently. His traversal mechanics actually taught me a fair bit about gen spawns to boot. I'm a former FPS player, predominantly projectile FPS games including TF2 and Overwatch, the latter of which I peaked GM until I gave up on comp, so projectile killers click well for me in terms of aim. Yet, I just do better with Wraith. It's baffling.
Out of curiosity, is there anything outside of basic M1 chase that you'd consider a transferrable skill from Wraith? -
@Wezqu said:
This was interesting reading but you do you man. We play this game to have fun if you have fun with playing Wraith don't let things make it complicated.
Of course! I play Wraith because I do well, and part of having fun for me is doing well.
I think I'm just interested in other people's development, and if anyone else had an experience like this. I try not to sweat it but given I'm playing catch up to people that have literal years invested into this game, I wanna be cognisant of any ways I might be settling into bad habits. -
I think that this is more MMR being inconsistent.
Were you playing Bloodmoon btw? I've noticed the event is much more lenient when it comes to who plays with whom. I've had matches against 4 babies right next to matches against 4 juicers that are obviously experienced just from the way they move.
Similar survivor experience. Played against a wraith that unironically swung at a dropped pallet with me stood on the other side expecting a hit (I vaulted it like 10s previous so they weren't trying to catch me in vault), then immediately matched into a wesker that crushed us so hard he gave 2 of us the wiggle escape so we could get out because he bad by how lopsided the match was. -
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I clicked skins initially based on what I thought would be more likely in a hypothetical GoT chapter. I'd prefer new survivors and killers for new content, but I would not expect to see it.
Spoilers for GoT book/show below:
Humouring a hypothetical full chapter, there are some options for both roles. Post-resurrection Gregor Clegane (The Mountain) would work, maybe with a legendary that has him still healthy. Abilities, perks and addons would be based around his strength and brutality, with a head pop mori.
Much less likely (but cooler) in my opinion would be from the books instead of the TV series - Lady Stoneheart. A vengeful, kind of undead version of Catelyn Stark. Less sure on how she'd work in game, but she's cut from the show and effectively irrelevant outside of the books, which is a shame.
Survivor-wise, I'd expect Daenerys, although would prefer Arya Stark. The latter kinda matches the resourceful energy a survivor would have, and has more interesting opportunities for perks. -
@ShanoaLegendaryPlz said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4066847#Comment_4066847
Oh im far from peace either lol its a minimum wage job where im the "favorite" that does twice the work for the same pay as everyone else and the only one who fully understands english lol
Then I'm sorry to hear that :(
Godspeed onto better things, boss. -
@ShanoaLegendaryPlz said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4066836#Comment_4066836
Id love a 9-5 office job lol how do you go about getting those?
By not achieving your dreams!
More seriously though, the grass is always greener… I often fantasise about working a night shift for the peace it could bring, especially as I am fully a night owl anyway. -
@ShanoaLegendaryPlz said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4066833#Comment_4066833
I actually do work night shift and play the game quite often lol. Ran out of achievements n challenges and 8 p100s and no idea who to even put points into anymore. I play the whole roster on both sides. But yea "business hours" for me ends up being right after work (a night shift into morning). im better off not playing till i sleep and wake up at like 3pm lol.
But the fact that the game can get that bad for an specific period of time is probably where most of the crashout/venting posts come from.
I could see it. It's possibly the one reason I'm grateful for my highly generic 9-5 office job, even if I'm messing about on the forums while at it. I don't have to play against daytime players.
Maybe that's what they mean by Dead by Daylight. Playing this game in daylight hours kills you. -
@ShanoaLegendaryPlz said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4061410#Comment_4061410
Ive discovered that playing killer around 8-9am is the most miserable experience the game can possibly give lol. Didnt matter what killer i chose, or what build i used. First round as my 2nd main dracula, was a fully decked out bully team complete with the map they wanted (dead dog saloon) and the old toxic multiple locker stun tactics. I had the patience to whittle them down and win in the end, which was satisfying for that one moment.
But the next 10 rounds was basic swfs with half flashlights half gen rush builds with gens flying faster than i could get hooks lol i mean i can understand losing every once in a while or at most every other game but every. Single. Round. Since i turned the game on was either you bring meta and tunnel or just try to enjoy getting a few hooks and wave as they leave lol.
I don't like using meta builds or tunneling and camping people to death, but the game (during those hours) feels like you literally are supposed to do those things and bring the strongest build u got or you get the same bad result, alllll morning.
I mean this kindly, but any play during "business hours" is going to bias the people you match against towards those that play the game much more. Some people may work night shifts and things so it's not guaranteed, but if you're not at work/college/school at that time and choosing to spend your day like that, you're probably highly committed to the game.
I made the mistake of booting up DBD during a day off at around 12pm, and the difference in how the game played was stark. Every killer was an actual horror antagonist for a change, and every survivor was pathing near perfectly and practically input reading me. -
I think the main reason a lot penalties/punishments for this behaviour don't curb it as much as we'd like is the reason people do this.
It's not just frustration with the game or wanting to go next quicker.
It's not just sabotaging their team out of some perverted sense of justice for a perceived slight.
It's ego.
"If I'm not playing the game, then me losing doesn't mean I'm bad. If I give up under hook, then it's not my lack of skill that cost us the game, it was my choice, which I control."
Killers turning 'friendly' after one bad chase are an example of this, as well as survivors giving up because they got two-tapped after taking the worst lines ever. They can 'undo' the humiliation by convincing themselves they were never trying in the first place.
People will find a way to self-sabotage and avoid penalties. Don't underestimate the time and effort people will expend to preserve their self-image. I've even seen players that I've noticed are particularly good at the game do this because they got downed/looped for too long. Which is a shame, because if they kept trying they'd probably see a good result. -
@cluelessclaudette said:
I've tried
- click top right
- edit profile
- CRTL F "Picture" or "Change", I only found "Change my password"
Am I blind or am I tripping or was the avatar/profile pic change removed?
It is currently missing. It has been missing for a long while now.
I only managed to change mine because I stumbled across a direct link that someone posted: Here.
This has been raised multiple times and not a peep in response. -
There's a… big… problem with Samson that they'd have to sort out first. But I could certainly see it!
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Jackie Estacado has all the makings of a great killer. Great lore, sympathetic story, plenty of character motivations that the Entity could exploit to keep him busy.
Looking back to the old Darkness PS3 game, there's lots of potential for really fun and unique killer powers too.
Also, super obvious Mori - Eating the survivor's heart. -
@100PercentBPMain said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4066553#Comment_4066553
I assume every match will be 4 man swf on comms (not true) but having that expectation helps manage expectations for me. in my case with chuck, I found at the very least it helps manage the amount of pre running a little bit. I had tested his range before the monitor changes and Chuck could basically be at the other end of Eyrie shack and you wouldn't know.
the slower charge on the dash wasn't as big of a deal as I had seen it made out to be(the pillow I think?)
the nice thing about TR Chuck is that survivors are conditioned to be on guard when Chuck goes into hidey ho mode so delaying your power usage until yourw right on top of somebody can throw people off since not many Chuck's do that
I might have to dust this build off myself for a round. maybe I'll try it with Deerstalker just to make sure nobody sees me coming
Taking notes…
I'm only just starting to branch out into stranger builds for killer. Still very milquetoast on survivor though. Considering the effects of things etc. so this is actually super helpful, thanks! -
@tjt85 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4066386#Comment_4066386
Honestly, a moment like that would make me laugh, so I'd call that a win in my book. But yeah, it's not going to work on everyone. You kind of have to accept that it will be a wasted perk slot more often than not.
Oh, it was certainly worth it for the moment, but part of me wishes I gave her a spook first.
I'm going to try a small TR build next, methinks. -
@cogsturning said:
Survivor, by far.
I never feel helpless as killer. Even if I get to end game with zero hooks I can (and have) won. I feel I can keep charging forward until the end. I once had the same fatalistic mentality as a lot of people, that survivor is meant to lose more than win so I shouldn't stress, but I no longer agree with that mindset. If you put enough hours into a game you should be able to see better than average results without having to go full sweat comp. Though there's certainly been times when the game has paired me against survivors I shouldn't have been with, I still felt capable of action and a full, whole match. But as survivor, it sometimes takes just 30s to realize the matchmaker has fed my soloq lobby to a p100 Blight CC's winstreak and that's infuriating. Knowing there's nothing I can do is the game's worst feeling, and I only regularly get that feeling as survivor.
I also only really feel anything of value was achieved for me as survivor unless I escape or my team escapes. Having a good chase is not satisfying to me, nor is completing gens. But as killer, each hook and each kill feel like their own little victories, like a meter is filling by up. So my survivor satisfaction is more black and white, while my killer one has a varied range.
That's a valid take. I'm in agreement that a survivor game can feel hopeless, more so than killer. These days I tend not to get frustrated with the game, so while I feel a poorly balanced match when playing as killer (both in your favour and not in your favour) is a worse experience, neither prompts me to abandon.
I think Killer falls into the worse experience for me is because if I'm clearly at a higher level than the survivors, then cleaning house isn't particularly fun. Walking down a Dwight or Meg that is holding forward in a blind panic isn't fun or rewarding, and after I catch them all I'm thinking is that I didn't enjoy the chase, and that survivor is probably another step towards not playing the game anymore.
If I'm the weaker link in matchmaking, then killer can be tiring. Ignoring BM, being unable to accomplish the only thing you're meant to be doing. Dealing with stuns, delays and the sound of gens popping constantly as a little reminder that while all this is going on, you are also losing. It's demoralising.
Survivor is a more relaxed game for me. If we're getting wiped it'll be over quick, and if the killer isn't particularly good, at least I can practice my timings in chase without worrying that I'm going to cost the team the game. -
@Emeal said:
Would people not then just hit an axe and run after them spamming M2 until the nano second they could grab them???
" more agency… " seems to mean more secure grabs, because we have plenty of agency.
I think the reason we don't do this is that it would make it too easy to get grabs and lower the skill floor further.
You could be right, but I don't think I've come across a survivor that dodged a grab as of yet. They're not hard to hit if you commit to walking an axed survivor down at all. The skillshot component is hitting the axe. The grab is a punishment for a survivor that fails to use the boost from being hit to make distance to a safer structure.
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@Hexonthebeach said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4066498#Comment_4066498
Yes exactly I mean that I can still use offerings to get the killer map. I don't saw many killer doing this, tbh.
Definitely don't want the old offerings back.
For me is mostly theme > balance as long it's not too unbalanced, but not everyone want this.
i would love for the balance to be in a place where people can make choices based on theme. I just don't think it is.
I don't tend to sweat much as killer, but I definitely do notice the difference a map can make. So personally Id only be okay with this if maps were revised to make all killers viable.
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@Hexonthebeach said:
Wouldn't mind that some killers have no maps.
And for the other it's a rly tiny chance. Ok, for people playing alot one killer it could be annoying.
Didn't know that Billy and Artist getting more flashbanged on their maps?
The thing is with each map we get (which is nice), the chance for the own map getting smaller. However there still offerings.
Speaking purely from a balance perspective. If Trickster mostly got Delusion as his map by an invisible RNG boost, it'd be devastating. It's a map that specifically punishes ranged killers, on top of being quite difficult in general.
The comment about offerings you make. I'm not sure quite what you mean. If you're saying "Oh well, I can use offerings to get the killer map" then cool. If you're commenting that we have offerings already, so something like killer-specific map matching would be okay, I'd counter that map offerings are a bad system and wouldn't shed a single tear if they were removed entirely. -
I agree with this. It also allows for more control over whether you want to pick or slug in that situation, which would be a nice situational bonus.
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@tjt85 said:
Insidious is actually a permanent fixture in my Chucky build and I'm usually able to get some decent value out of it. The other day I played a game on Midwich and hid just around the corner of that gen in the room near to the bottom of the stairs (the one that pretty much always spawns) and I was able to catch an injured Survivor out who was returning to finish it. I hope it gave them a scare because it certainly gave me a chuckle. In my experience, it honestly doesn't make a difference if he's stood there sniggering away to himself or not because by the time a Survivor realises you're there it's already too late.
Then again, I'm not playing seriously so my Chucky is probably not in top MMR, so I can afford to waste some time hiding out in bushes and around corners for a laugh. I don't care at all about winning or losing with Chucky.
See when I tried an Insidious play I hung around getting ready to scare them off a middle map gen, only for a masked meg to crouch wall around the corner and pat my head.
She knew what I was up to