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@Xernoton said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3658549#Comment_3658549
I'm pretty sure his kill rate will drop a bit over the coming months. He got so many changes that he's basically become a new killer altogether and survivors need a bit more time to adjust.
I still see people treat me like old Billy, knowing full well I am in Overdrive. It doesn't work like that. You now actually have to play the mind game and watch out around certain loops. Once that happens, his kill rate will adjust.
Maybe he will drop, people will learn (or relearn) to play against this killer - on the other side, Billy players will get better. We will have to wait and see. I still love him, on both sides, even tho i think he is a bit overtuned.
But my point was not Hillbilly specifically, rather his Winrate on NL as an example. And my question was serious: Am i getting those numbers somehow wrong? Because, like i said, with 62,5% killrate, he sits on 50% winrate and only 30% lossrate. And the crowman claims this is straight up ballanced. Not in a "killer has to have a higher winrate because he should be terrifying" or anything like that - just ballanced. For me, ballanced would look like 40/20/40 or something similar and not 50/20/30.
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MFT's nerf was needed, because it was be a busted perk.
Iron Will was overnerfed. Either leave it 100% and that it only work when not exhausted or 75% and exhaustion is not in play. Both is simply to much.
Survivor in general is a problem right now, and the possible upcoming changes will only make it worse. I feel you, and i say this as someone who playes both sides. BHVR is simply taking the "Iron Will route" across survivor gameplay. Killer mains will tell otherwise, but the reality is, they cause the problem with their constant need for 4K every match, no skill involved.
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@Seraphor said:
Something I find interesting about this whole debate is I've seen many killer mains justify the 60% kill rate and say it's good, but not a single survivor main who says it's good.
Have you tried asking people who play both roles and aren't so biased?
The idea that 50/50 would be balanced is a fallacy. This is an asymmetrical game, with an odd number of players in each game, with different win conditions for each side.
50% is the ideal kill rate for survivors, but the ideal kill rate for killers is about 62.5% (halfway between a 2K and a 3K on average). This is partly why neither side is ever happy with the state of the game. There is a 12.5% overlap where neither side is content. The fairest middle ground, a kill rate at any point between 50% and 62.5%, is less than the ideal spot for each respective role.
It's also why survivor mains and killer mains disagree on where the kill rate should be. Survivors want 50%, killers want more than 60%.
How do you come to that number?
When we look at Hillbilly, who is roughly at 62,5% on NL, he is loosing less then 30% and winning close to 50% of his games.
Am i getting something wrong with the stats?
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@DBD78 said:
They aim for 60% because people hook suicide so 60% means in fair games with no suicides the kill rate is around 50%. So 60% is fair for both sides.
No they dont. Stop spreading missinformation!!
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@I_Cant_Loop said:
Wow - the survivor main bellyaching and entitlement has been off the charts on this forum the past few days! THE KILL RATE IS LITERALLY RIGHT WHERE THE DEVS WANT IT TO BE - SOLO QUEUE INCLUDED. The only exception is high MMR 4-man SWF which (wow what a shocker) has a significantly higher escape rate than all other groups. The only thing that needs balancing is a nerf to the significant advantage that 4-man SWF's have.
Survivor is not supposed to be the power role in the game and you are not supposed to escape every match. You should be escaping about 40% of the time and the devs have proven that you do, unless of course you're playing with your buddies on comms and then you escape closer to 50% of the time. Survivors have gotten free information status indicators, free Borrowed Time and free self-unhooking when killer is camping. No more hand-holding is necessary, and the escape rate stats prove it.
Everyone who is complaining should try playing killer for once (I play about 50/50 each role). You know what? It's actually quite difficult once you get to a level where you're consistently going against competent survivors. Most maps still have a lot of very strong loops and pallets that can allow survivors to extend chases for a long time and make it essentially impossible to win without any camping or tunneling with a vast majority of the killer lineup.
Let's start rallying around what is really broken, and that is the matchmaking. Throw out the awful MMR scoring system and put something in place that actually measures skill - it's not that hard. Quit putting hugely varying MMR scores in the same lobbies.
Nobody says the game is not 40% escape rate (while at this point survivors escape rate probably droped below 40% due to the recent killer buffs). An issue is, that we have already reached that point and BHVR keeps buffing killer. Its nonsense, plain and simple.
Another issue is the overall idea of BHVR to even make one side win more often then the other side. Sure, the killer is the star in DBD in some way, but one player should not have the luxury to win more often, have a better experience and overall more fun while 4 other players dont have that.
Survivor are furious because enough is enough. During the last years, killer got one buff after another, while survivor only (!) received nerfs. Here and there a bad perk got buffed to mediocre, but thats about it. Everything once was decent lies in the dust, while killer shine so bright.
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@Huge_Bush said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3654161#Comment_3654161
Don’t forget they literally just had a Survivor Mid Chapter with Alan Wake and a very strong perk. But I guess they won’t be happy until they get a new broken perk like MFT that rewards them for getting injured or a new CoH that lets them reset as much as they want.
Although he is a brand new character and the Tome is actually forcing people to use his perks, they are already pretty niche.
CoL is played less then 3,77%, Deadline sits on 1,30% and Boon: Illumination has a whopping 1,05% usage rate. If they would be any good, they would be used much more.
Or was this sarcasm?
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Have you even tried out Pig on PTB?
I did, and she received a buff, not a nerf. Traps are still basically the same but her chase power is now much stronger.
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@wsm10 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3656674#Comment_3656674
I think a big reason these "discussions" keep happening and going the way they do is because the majority of all the DbD online communities are overwhelmingly people who mostly play the killer role right now, and they'll justify ANYTHING that makes games easier. Seriously, who in their right mind could POSSIBLY defend any of these huntress changes?!? They aren't needed and, again, almost completely take away counterplay options against her.
It's incredibly frustrating playing survivor right now, almost to the point that it isn't worth it. I don't think most survivor players want anything more than a fun game that they have a chance in. All the changes lately have made that next to impossible, and makes me incredibly concerned for the path this game is going down.
Not accurate.
The majority of players, no matter if killer or survivor standing side by side with this counterproductive incoming change. Every experienced and every objective killer player knows it is busted - on a character that was perectly fine for all players. Across all skill levels even. She is close to perfect and one of the few true highlights this game has.
It is the minority who believes (or pretends) that Huntress needs a buff / or a nerf.
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@Tsulan said:
Could you specify, what exactly is so unbearable in solo queue right now? Since there are so many threads, it should be easy to pinpoint.
Lets say, whats worse, compared to... lets say 2020?
Whats so unbearable compared to 2020?
In solo queue specifically? Nothing. As survivor in general? Everything.
Since solo queue players are also survivor, they have it by far the hardest.
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@kit_mason said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/405791/soloq-win-rate-40-for-now
By "the rest of the killer roster" you mean Twins and Blight?
The six-killer buff set is experimental and realistically will not total to a 5% net kill rate increase on average, because together they only make up for 18% of matches played. They'd have to all increase their kill rates to near-70%, which is only currently achieved by one killer (Skull Merchant), whose unusually high kill rate is attributed to a high percentage of survivors giving up on hook against her.
The implication that this round of buffs (which I agree are, on the whole, fairly unnecessary) will contribute that greatly to kill rates is laughable at best.
The last update (Billy, Grim Embrace, gen tap) boosted NL overage killrates quite a bit (3% and still rising within a relativly short period of time). We are now (NL) at exactly 57%, which is usually pretty close to -5% of reality.
Right now, i am pretty certaint, we surpassed the 60%, getting close to 62% killrate. And then this set of buffs? No way this is going to be 70% or above, but for sure pretty close to 64-65%. Huntress buff alone will be insane, big promise.
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@Exxodus21 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3655673#Comment_3655673
The instances of killers farming is incredibly low, especially if you believe the posts here where EVERY game the killer is sweaty and toxic and tunnels everyone out at 5 gens.
AFAIK a hatch escape still counts as an escape, it just doesn't count toward MMR.
A hatch escape counts - and that is in terms of "ballance through statistics" exactly the problem. The survivor escaped not because they won, but because of RNG. The killer won and it should actually be a 4K, but since hatch is in play, the survivor has a almost 50% chance to make it a 3K instead of a 4K.
60% killrate may be inflated by suizides, but it is also from hatch, friendly killer, afk ect.
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@ad19970 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3655935#Comment_3655935
Not sure what you are on about. Killers that farm, and let survivors escape for no reason are extremely rare. Disconnects don't count towards statistics.
And survivors are arguably 4 times as likely to give up in a match as a killer because for every killer, there are 4 survivors in a match. So if you want to count killers that just give up and do not dc, you also have to count all the matches where a survivor gives up by suiciding on hook or going afk, which is definitely more frequent than a killer giving up, especially since survivors can suicide on hook, while killers can't end the match sooner unless they dc, in which case the match doesn't count to the statistics.
Survivor could be in a better state, especially since tunneling and camping continue to be a serious problem, but you are trying to make it look worse than it is with every chance you get, it seems. Killing also isn't easy if you go against a team that knows what tit is doing.
Are you sure that hook suizide is more common then getting hatch for exmaple? You do realise that this also distorte stats quite a bit - arguable more then suizide? I can not speak for everbody but my killer games are almost without suizide and hatch escapes are at least 10 times more common then loss through suizide. I also rarely have this problem as survivor and it usually only occures against SM and when the game is hopelessly lost anyway.
Farming killer is rare, but it happens. Killer giving last survivor hatch or gate is not that rare. I do it all the time and i would say at least 15-20% of the time, the killer also gives hatch or gate.
Killer giving up.. like i said, i have this way more often then survivor giving up. Apparently, we have different experience.
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@Aven_Fallen said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3655919#Comment_3655919
Yeah, I feel that some people really think there is a council of Survivor Mains who decides wich Killrates get boosted now and this council will relay this info to every Survivor Main out there to get it done.
@Topic:
The thing is... Nobody asked for a Huntress-Buff. A Huntress-Buff was not needed AT ALL. Yet, she got a very significant Buff without any Downside, as one of the stronger and very popular Killers in the game.
But, the main reason why people suicide against a Huntress on the PTB is most likely it is not the new Killer. Survivors have instant queues on PTB and no DC-Penalty. They can just go next and queue up again to hopefully play against the new Killer.
Exactly.
It is questionable if PTB stats are even relevant. Most dont play it serious, they just want to explore the map, see the new killer, play the new killer and thats about it. Generators or serious chasing/killing gets ignored by the majority of games and i hope BHVR knows this. Survivor want to see the mori and thats why they die on purpose often times.
About the Huntress: Hopefully this wont go live (it would end there for me a 100%) and i strongly believe the DEVS are aware of this.
But the problem is why stuff like this even goes on PTB. They must have tested it in advance, right? How can they believe this is good for the game? Or needed on Huntress? 😂
Huntress needs no change at all. No extra movement, no extra Hatchets, no extra nothing.
She is one of the most played killer and the reason she has no super high winrate (while being very powerful) is that the majority of Huntress mains DONT CARE! They want to get great shots and not sweat for the 4K.
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@Murgleïs said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3654281#Comment_3654281
40% is very good considering all the suicides on hooks and throwers.
If escaping was easy it would be a very boring game.
40% is very bad considering all the killer that give up, give hatch, let survivor escape, want to farm, disconnect and to top it all off, the fact that we have hatchescapes that are just based on luck and have nothing to do if killer are powerful or not.
Since killing is easy, its a very boring game.
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@mikewelk said:
It's not to skew the data, they just realized how busted Huntress is and there's no denying it. I would do the exact same because I didn't play the PTB to experience huge buffs to an already balanced killer that came from the devs having a brain fart or something along those lines.
https://twitter.com/RNIN_St1v1/status/1759992506056425727?t=YZtjl7BtrgqQfmgcCkML9w&s=19
Try to justify this video.
Yep, i tried this out aswell.
If Huntress goes live like this, i will simply uninstall and never come back to the game. Not because of Huntress, but because of the future perspective of the game.
This huntress change is a testament to how incompetent the ballance team apparently is. It is a shame and an absolute insult to the other workers at BHVR who do a fine job (sound design, graphics ect)
Somebody there must have made the decision that this is fair and ballanced, on one of the best, most played and already most well ballanced killer in the entire game.
Its rediculous.
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Killer already sit on 60% killrate and we are asking for a 5th perk slot?
Survivor may have in total 16 perk slots, but apparently it is not enough for them to have a positive outcome.
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@Exxodus21 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3654284#Comment_3654284
It's not accurate because it contains games where survivors kill themselves on hook, so the kill rate is artificially higher than what it truly is.
There are games where the killer is farming, giving hatch, staying afk, giving up, giving exit gate ect.
On top of that, the last survivor has a close to 50% chance to get the hatch escape, which is just a petty escape and does not even count. So technically it is a 4K, but because of luck, its only a 3K. In the perspective of gameplay, the killer was 4king but only got 3k.
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@Ayodam said:
If the escape rate drops to 35% or lower, I’m sure the devs will in some significant way buff the survivor role.. the same way they bolstered killers to reach a 60% win rate.
What a sad sorry version of a once great game we are in now. Survivors are supposed to be happy to even escape 40%.
Lets all unite that it wont fall lower then 30%!
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Those stats were before Billy, Grim Embrace and Gen buff.
I would not be suprised if we are already at that number. At least on Nightlight since this patch, killrate went up almost 4%.
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My guess for killer perks:
1# Hooking the same survivor within 120 seconds 2 times blocks all the generators for 3 minutes and shows survivor auras 12 meters around pallets during that duration.
#2 When hitting a survivor, kicken a pallet or a generator, the survivor who got unhooked the last time is exposed for 2 minutes, suffers from 30% hindred and the aura will be shown to the killer until they are dead.
#3 Leaving the hook for more then 6 meters makes every survivor within 80 meter range of the killer exposed.
Survivor perks
#1 If every survivor suffers from one or more status effects, you are able to open chests 1,5% faster.
#2 The radius of any boon totem is increased by 1 meter. Once a boon gets destroyed, this perk deactivates for the rest of the trial and the survivor who blessed the boom is exposed and suffers from the hindred status effect for 180 seconds.
#3 Flashligh blind duration is increased by 3%, but consumtion rate is also increased by 300%. Blinding the killer will make every hook a scourge hook until the survivor is dead.
Probably close enough.
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The average pallet count is very low, somewhere around 12-13 across all maps i guess, most of them being unsafe. Sooner or later i will crate a statistic for all maps so we get this topic out of the way once and for all.
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@monochromeworld said:
In previous post i sad that this game is heavy survivor sided and last developers update only make it more obvious. I guess you agree that all online games should be balanced or at least not have a favourite kid, so i have ideas of balance changes for this game (if you agree or not let me now your opinion). I only have 300 hours on this game so my opinion woulnd be relevant for old dbd players but for example i think game would be far more balanced with this changes:
1) Deadlock should be base kit for all killers (genrush on of the most biggest problem of this game and make this ability base kit change the problem
2) Toxic perks such as unbreakable and head on should be completly removed from the game
3) All anti tunnel perks such as decisive strike and borrowed time should be heavily nerfed
4) Base kit memento mori for all killers
5) Make one gen done in 120 sec (if only one survivor on it)
6) Make base kit gate open in 60 sec (and being slowly reduced to prevent 99 % gates)
7) After succesful blind survivor who did this should be exposed for 60 sec.
8) Anti face camp should be removed
9) Max 6 pallets on the map
10) Windows being blocked for survivors after 2 jump
11) Breaking the pallet should give killers haste effect
12) Make cleaning totems 50% slower so survivors cant easily remove noed or devour hope
So what you guys think? English is not my 1st language so im being sorry for grammar mistakes
Generally speaking, these are good ideas and a good start. But to make the game ballanced and fair, we have to dive a little bit deeper then that.
Number one issue: Maps!
1) Reduce the size of maps by 50%.
2) Remove LoS blocker so Nurse can actually do something.
3) Make generators spawn closer to each other.
4) Your idea of reducing pallets is fine and important, but what does it matter to have only 5 pallets on the map when they are very safe? First thing to do is to remove shack and every safe pallet on each map. It can not be that there is a thing where survivor have a realistic chance to survivor 10 seconds longer if they play it well.
On the other hand, healing is also an issue. Many survivors dont heal and they wait for adrenalin.
1) Adrenaline does not activate when another survivor is on the hook
2) Adrenaline does not activate when you run DS
3) Adrenaline does not activate when being on the hook or on the ground
4) Adrenaline does not active.
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Man i just checked the roadmap up to june, and i can not lie - it is really depressing. All impactful we will get or already got are killer buffs
Basekit Shadowborn
Hillbilly buff
Grim Embrace buff
Hag buff
Huntress buff
Clown buff
Demogorgon buff
Doctor buff
Generator buff for killer
The rest: Blight addons are maybe a little nerf, but barely. Onryo is still the same in terms of power. Quick gambit, Shadowborn Monitor and Mengled Status are irrelevant.
The only 2 things survivors get instead are a possible UW nerf and a possible DS buff, but even that is questionable. Cool! 2 perks that may or may not be good for survivors for a trillion killer buffs, and i bet Twins will be buff aswell.
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@Rulebreaker said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3653480#Comment_3653480
The anti 3 gen brought something significant to the table.
3 Gen cap is pretty much useless since it will almost never if ever reached - but they removed gen taping and added another 2,5% on regression per kick. I am not saying this is incredible aweful because in my opinion, Gen tap had to be fixed in one way or anther, but calling 7.5 (was it 7.5?) a survivor buff is not correct. Hillbilly buff also was part of that patch. GE was buffed. Overall, besides the unnecessay mini STBFL nerf, clearly a killer favoured patch.
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@Crowman said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3653351#Comment_3653351
Says the guy making a blanket statement in this topic about how survivors aren't getting any buffs in the future.
You just need to chill out and realize that not every patch is going to be what you want.
I am also asking you specificly now because this statement is coming frequently when killer get buff after buff after buff and survivor comlain: "Not every patch is going to be what you want."
Where are those patches in the recent years that buffed survivor? Or brought something significant to the table?
The only thing i can think off were boon totems, but they are so incredibly weak, nobody ever plays them unfortunatly.
So, care to answer?
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@Crowman said:
The addon is currently useless and getting 1 more use isn't going to break the addon.
No, but as @MikaelaWantsYourBoon said, Blight is already broken enough on its own. They either nerf Blight and then buff the addon acordingly or just let it be. Every addon buff, no matter how weak it may or may not be, is overtuning with this killer.
PS i love Blight, dont call me bias ty.
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@Caiman said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3653074#Comment_3653074
The only effective part about Pig is nerfed, while the ineffective part remains ineffective.
This opinion is the result of long time testing?
Dont be to quick about it and lets wait and see.
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@humanbeing1704 said:
Patches favouring one side isn’t new stop whining
Show us those patches that favoured survivor in recent years.
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How out of touch do they have to be with their own product and community to think Huntress needs a buff? Its madness at this point, what are they thinking?
Huntress is one of the most viable killer and insanly strong when played well. Its just the ultimate super fair GET GOOD killer. And those who are good, actually deliver.
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@Crowman said:
what survivor nerf is even happening this patch?
Also mangled is getting nerfed after complaints survivors had about sloppy.
Some of you guys just need to chill out.
None, but killers getting buffed, significantly. Again.
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@WolfyWood said:
Genuine question.
No maps being changed for survivors.
No meaningful perk buffs coming.
No new mechanics that benefit survivors.
No limited game-modes or events that are beneficial to survivors.
No solo-queue changes.
Seems like the only thing survivors can get excited about are skins these days.
If I'm wrong please correct me. But being a survivor main is rough.
How are we feeling about the role?
No maps being changed for survivors.
Nope, only in favour for killer, since years. And no sign of stopping.
No meaningful perk buffs coming.
Nope, nothing meaningful.
No new mechanics that benefit survivors.
Not gonna happen in DBD.
No limited game-modes or events that are beneficial to survivors.
Nope, only easy mode for killer like Lights out.
No solo-queue changes.
Not gonna happen in DBD.
Seems like the only thing survivors can get excited about are skins these days.
That is correct. Punish them by not buying.
If I'm wrong please correct me.
No, you are not wrong. Its insane to believe you are wrong.
But being a survivor main is rough.
It is i guess.
How are we feeling about the role?
I play both, but i feel like a god when i play killer, basically winning almost every game with little to no effort and when i play survivor (while being significantly better) it feels like getting ragdolled often times.
In short: its going into the dumbster, slowly but surely.
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Is this legit? I have not been online nore read any news, but those buffs sound a little bit to crazy.
If it is, a big suprise.
Not sure if Hag really needed that. First of all she is already pretty good, and second she is already (for most) really annoying. I like to play and to go against the Hag, but i am in that regard probably a almost one of a kind person. Others i know either dont like to play against her or they dont like to play her. But that has nothing really to do with she beeing to weak or to powerful.
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@Seraphor said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3652677#Comment_3652677
I consider myself more killer sided than survivor sided.
I never run this combo as a survivor.
But I don't consider this a significant problem. The times it does become frustratingly powerful are incredibly rare and would likely have been a struggle for the killer anyway.
There are killer perk combos that are far more "problematic".
There are indeed killer combos that are very problematic (i am not getting tired to call this one out every single opportunity i get: GE+DMS) but that does not mean, survivor should also have problematic combos, right?
The effect is just very gamechanging. Sure, we can say this about a few perks, like Unbreakable and Soul Guard, but with that, the killer at least had the choice to pick up. With BUFTP they simply dont, and there is hardly anything they can realisticly do against it. This becomes especially true since the (questionable) STBFL nerf.
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@concubined said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3652677#Comment_3652677
Exactly when I made this post I really did not expect to have survivor mains under in my comments trying to justify it.
You didn’t use to see a slugging condemn Sadako every single game either back when it was a problem but it did not change that it was an issue?
And as for them saying having someone trail your chase means they’re not on gen, on comms they can easily tell them to rotate towards their gen after the hit and apply FTP+BU that way.
So it’s possible under every and any post on here they’ll be people disagreeing with either willing ignorance or they’re just bored and in need of a debate
I hope i dont get you wrong, but I am not a survivor main, I have plenty of hours on both sides. It may appear sometimes that i am leaning towards survivor but that is only because currently, in my honest opinion, survivors have the bigger problems (while killer also suffer from issues, dont get me wrong)
In this case here, BU+FTP is without a doubt an issue. I ran this combo to see how good it is, and in fact, it can be very good, and very frustrating for the killer.
While it is obivous survivor want to have this combo for anti tunnel reason (a logical reason) i dont think a combo like this is a good solution / justification for having it in the game.
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@CarlAlc7 said:
Kinda funny seeing the people who defend this combo are the same ones who were cluctching their pearls over the Grim Embrace + Dead Man's Switch combo from the killers' side. Kinda puts into perspective where some people's priorities truly lie.
Not really the case, some here including myself even made threads/posts that GE+DMS is overpowered... because it is.
Same goes for BU+FTP. Also overpowered.
Its important to stay objective - for a greater experience for all of us. Entitelment for one side is not really helpfull.
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"I dont see it that often so it is fine"
"It does not have a lot of impact"
Please, it is clearly an overpowered combo. If the majority of survivors use it well or if it is popular or not is not important. The fact that most killer with some exception (PH fe) cant do much about it when they coordinate makes it insanly difficult.
No, i am not a killer main, just an objective person who wants ballanced and fairness.
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@BlightedDolphin said:
Just make FTP not count as a healing action. It would stop this combo while keeping both perks the same strength on their own and any other future healing perk won't have to be adjusted because of a possible synergy with FTP.
This.
FTP is strong on its own and even BU can have some decent value in any sort of anti-slug build.
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@justalilbit123 said:
As someone who plays pretty casual these days, I have to say even from my perspective the anti 3 gen mechanic feels terrible. Especially if you are running any type of kick perks and using them on a highly contested gen. I have had gen blocks occur probably 1 in every 4 games and I genuinely do not even remotely try to 3 gen. A lot of time it triggers on the last 4 gens, even if they are far apart. If survivors are tunneling 1 gen, even if I'm playing well and getting lots of hooks to use pop, pretty quickly the gen blocks.
It feels like the game is saying "No, you are getting too much of an advantage. You aren't allowed to anymore."
Now the survivors are free to work on the gen and I can't interact with it at all. It feels like the worst idea possible to prevent 3 genning. The whole point is to prevent stale gameplay of some dude doing nothing but kicking 3 close by gens. But it's affecting me, a player who just plays normally, doesn't go for 4Ks or 3 gens, generally only runs 1 or 2 gen perks at most.
I just feel like there must be a better way. Just saying "Nope, you aren't allowed to kick this ever again" feels so forced and awful. Imagine if you got 2 flashlight saves and the game just disabled your flashlights for the rest of the game. "No, too many flashlight saves. That's enough." Just a terrible idea.
Are you sure the generator is actually blocking from further regression? I also have the warning sign every now and then, but so far the generator never blocked.
Anyway, 8 stages is statistcly a very rare thing, and the fact that anti 3-Gen was actually a massiv killer buff (+2,5% extra on a kick and removal of gen tapping) makes it actually harder for survivors, not the killer.
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This begs the question: Where is the limit? 9999? Is there any?
Anybody knows?
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@[Deleted User] said:
The data is a piece of the broader picture. It's not the end all be all, nor do we have enough context to draw any definitive conclusions from it. The most specific data we got was escape rates loosely separated by SWF and MMR. But again, we lack a lot of context with that.
I don't mean to be overly critical, because any transparency at all about what happens under the hood is a step in the right direction. But they released just enough data without context to allow people to draw whatever conclusion they want from it. I'm not sure why they draw the line at what they released.
Sure, it would be a expensive, but being able to view and sort the data by kill rate, MMR, avg hook count, killer, etc, would be awesome. You already have the database portion.
Well said.
Some more data like Hatch escapes or Hook count would make those datas more useful. What we got now is quite a bit, but as oyu said, it does not draw the full picture of course. Many factors are not included.
@ChuckingWong said:
Knowing just how broken Nurse is and .... seeing SM's kill rate....
I really dont want to be mean, but it says A LOT about the majority of the killer player base. Her kill rate isnt just average.... its one of the lowest as well. And its been that way twice for stats.
Eye opening
We have to keep in mind that this data is across the whole playerbase, including beginners and low MMR, which is most likely a far bigger pool then high MMR - where Nurse (probably) is winning more in comparison.
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@Xernoton said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3652115#Comment_3652115
So, if I understand correctly you are talking about how consistent the different skill levels of all survivors on a team are and that these lead to issues. I definitely agree that this is far from ideal. Sometimes 1 player ruins the game for everyone else. But MMR doesn't really consider them worse at the game because they escape a lot.
It's kind of similar to how according to MMR, the perkless Freddy that got 8 hooks but no kills on GoJ is a worse killer than the quad meta Blight on Midwich, that got one hook thanks to Noed in end game and camped it.
If they found a way to work around these issues, I'd like that very much. It would probably also help a bit with how bad solo queue can feel at times.
I just don't want my matches to be like in that one MMR test (back when we still had ranks) where every single game felt incredibly sweaty. If I wanted that, I'd play a lot more serious and try my hardest to win every game I can.
So, if I understand correctly you are talking about how consistent the different skill levels of all survivors on a team are and that these lead to issues. I definitely agree that this is far from ideal. Sometimes 1 player ruins the game for everyone else. But MMR doesn't really consider them worse at the game because they escape a lot.
Yes, you understand correctly.
Thats the problem with the MMR and its escape=skill philosphy. It is simply not true. Getting carried by a strong looper and eventually escape, or hiding for hatch is not considere to be skillful but rather relying on luck and teammates. And when i see survivors in my lobbies, it is often times obvious how they landed there.
If BHVR wants to stick with escapes, then it has to be teambased.
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@Alex_ said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3652146#Comment_3652146
I do not quite understand what you mean with "press 1 button and win mechanic"... what killer has this in your opinion? Why are there so many people in this threat who just cant do anything but complain. Do you realise that many of the recent Killers are not amongst the best Killers? Why do you say that Wesker is so good because he has fair counterplay, if there are Killers like Dredge and Artist who also have fair counterplay?
Knight and SM are typical press 1 button and get a hit killer.
Its not about best killer or not, its about fun killer or not. And recent killers are mainly unfun for the majority of survivors. Thats the topic here.
Dredge and Artist counterplay is Hold W (if you can). Pretty awesome! Just how interactive chases should be, right? I played enough Dredge to know that this is a fact.
@MalekithHatesSnow said:
Every "X killer is boring" comment should be thrown in the bin (unless its SM) because no matter which killer you play someone somewhere is gonna call them boring from Pig to perkless addonless no hatchet huntress
"Every complain should be ignored, unless those i agree with"
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@Caiman said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3652084#Comment_3652084
Survivors want killers to stop tunneling and spread hooks, but then get mad if killers are rewarded for spreading hooks.
I am not a survivor main, i am leaning towards killer. And still i want it to be nerfed. It is simply to strong of a perk. Bring it to a ballanced level and i am all for it. PS. I run this perk on every killer all the time right now.
As if this perk would stop killer from tunneling. It only makes it more effective.
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@GentlemanFridge said:
I have to wonder if people aren’t blinded by a hate boner, cause this trend was a thing from the very moment she got her first ‘rework’.
Did people even try to learn how she works? I’m getting the impression very few people cared to. Which is unfair regardless.
Nope, not a thing.
Just look at Legion, all it took was a decent adjustment to their power, and survivors were fine with him, sorta.
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@GeneralV said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3652146#Comment_3652146
I still don't see it.
It is a dash and a countdown towards the Hindered status effect. I don't think this is a kit that provides an enjoyable experience for the survivors.
He might be fun to play as, I do not know. But against?
Pass. There are way better options.
I guess it is a personal taste, not everybody is the same. I will most likely never understand how you could possible find Dull Merchant fine, arguably the least skill expressive killer.
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@Chocolate_Cosmos said:
Anti-loop killers are what makes killers good and viable againts good Survivors.
What you are asking in other words is "I want killers to have more counterplay and be more easy to win againts". You would remove all S,A and like majority of B tier killers.
I dont think the OP said that.
We need more killer where skill expression is for both sides a thing. Wesker, Huntress, Billy, Blight ect... you get the idea.
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@GeneralV said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3652138#Comment_3652138
To be honest, I still don't get what people find fun about Wesker. Except his chase music, but that could have been given to any other killer.
To me he is a contender for worst killer to go against, and I was really surprised when I learned most players do not hate him.
He is very strong but at the same time has absolutly fair counterplay. His anti loop is not a silly press 1 button and win mechanic what we usually get now but rather he must play well to perform well. And so do have survivors. A bad survivor wont last more then a few seconds against a good Wesker. Skill expression at its finest we have.
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Since Blight, they released one single well designed killer: The Mastermind. Ironically he is among the strongest so its not a skill issue of survivors.
The rest of the bunch? Trickster, Alien, Twins, Artist, Ceno, Skull Merchant, Knight and Scamper Doll.
Its so bad that i did not even mentioned Dredge or Singularity, because compared to those above, they actually look pretty solid. What a shame.
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@Xernoton said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3652064#Comment_3652064
In my opinion, MMR feels a lot like old ranks. My games are mostly all over the place but that's probably for the best.
As much as we would like games to be more even, none of us like the feeling when all our matches are super sweaty and the game feels more like work than a way to have some fun and relax. So the only thing they can do is to try and reduce the range in which these games can swing in either direction.
Changing the way MMR is calculated could have some positive effects but I'm not sure how much good it would do. The average team would probably be a bit more consistent in strength though.
In my opinion, MMR feels a lot like old ranks. My games are mostly all over the place but that's probably for the best.
Agree, MMR is often times (especially on killer for me) very wild.
As much as we would like games to be more even, none of us like the feeling when all our matches are super sweaty and the game feels more like work than a way to have some fun and relax. So the only thing they can do is to try and reduce the range in which these games can swing in either direction.
Not sure if i can fully agree. Personally, there is no problem with old rankish style games where you never know what you get, the issue is, that we get those type of games because MMR is apparently not good enough to seed out the true weeklings. And that is a problem for many people, most likely also the issue for our OP @Krazzik
Like said, the survivor(s) who escape are by no means always (not even most of the time) the best of the team! It is more often then not the opposite, at least in my games. The weakling who cant stand a chance in chase gets the lucky exit game while the good players die trying doing the gens. Same can be said about confident players who go for the risky yet difficult save, while the weaker player is to scared and waits out hatch.
At the end of the day, often the good survivors derank (and get worse killers), while the bad players actually uprank and gets even better oponents.
I am not saying that it is ALL that, but those wild MMR most likely comes from that circumstances i experience in my killer games.