fulltonon
fulltonon
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@anarchy753 said:
It definitely feels more like an exploit to me.
Opening the gates yourself as killer is a surrender button. It's saying "I'm done with this game, I'm starting the timer so you have to leave." It seems very unintended that a perk to block either of the exit gates from being worked on activates after one of the gates is already open. The only comparable situation is Blood Warden which the killer can use after opening the gates themselves, and in that case survivors have to choose not to leave for a minute so it isn't anywhere near as abusable like this situation of using both.
I wouldn't be surprised in the least if this was changed in the next patch to prevent No Way Out from triggering after the gates are open, but that being said, you can simply remove noed (as well as have the obsession open the other gate) and make this whole build worthless.
Why you thought opening the gate is a surrender button, though?
It doesn't immediately end the game.
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It's not a problem as you can just cleanse the bone.
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@konchok said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2682696#Comment_2682696
Most games with Blight are a 4k for killer and he has a number of his add-ons blocked from use. The same is true for Nurse and Spirit. And in the most recent tourney every single Oni got a 4k. I don't think it's as one sided as you claim at a competitive level. If anything if competitive groups were allowed to run Blight and Nurse back to back I actually think it's the survivors who would be at a disadvantage.
If you gonna go for "use everything possible", the game is certainly survivor sided anyway.
Killers can 4k them only because of restrictions.
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@Smeagolthevile said:
I'm sorry to tell you, standing next to the hook and staring at the survivor, giving other survivors literally 0 chance to actually unhook even if they try outside of swf bullshit, is toxic. But continue with your bad faith arguments, this forum is full of them
is not.
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This is best complaint thread because complaint is actually going to survivors and not killers.
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Considering this is a horror game, getting killed by tombstone myer is certainly fun.
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@OpenX said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2795735#Comment_2795735
Kinda nuts people are still complaining about NOED when Rancor exists. Rancor might need extra supporting perks to be consistent but it's just straight up deleting people at the endgame instead of hooking them.
Rancor itself is decent information perk because it shows the location of survivors every gens, I don't think it needs anything to kill someone consistently, well at least for securing a kill.
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So I can stare at you as bubba for literally eternity, fun times.
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end results will be removal of gen slowdown perks and even more faster gen speed somehow.
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@Colton147147 said:
Killers hold W more than survivors.
It can reduce that too.
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Theoretically, normal killers have no chance of getting a 4k unless they slug all four players... chasing one takes one minutes minimum no matter what, injuring a survivor is meaningless thanks to CoH, even 3-gening is worthless because survivors can hide and finish up generators.
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@BenZ0 said:
You can argue that this is an "exploit", however you have enough ways to counter it and it also requires a lot of skill, I dont see any issue with it.
With that argument you can also say that CG tech, locker CG or even 360s should be removed cuz its not "normal".
locker CG should be removed because there is pretty much no counter for it, similar to boil over.
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@RakimSockem said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2794422#Comment_2794422
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2794439#Comment_2794439
Correct me if I'm wrong but wouldn't it make sense for the most popular survivor perk to appear more often because there's 4 survivors in a match? this doesn't seem like some argument to claim a perk is busted (which DH is not)
Well you don't even need any argument to claim DH is busted though, just use it for once and you'll know it's thousand times better than anything else.
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@ThanksForDaily said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2795629#Comment_2795629
Im not pretending anything. You said it, again.
I have 5k hours on this game, maybe double or triple than yours. I've learn some things in 4,5 years playing it.
Saying "I've learnt hard way" and "Not addicted in slowdown" is pretty much pretending you are good player, and again you are doing that kind of attitude by using meaningless playtime.
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@Superyoshiegg said:
The 'holding W' argument is so stupid.
Only the DBD community would complain about the opponent running in a straight line.
Wouldn't want to make it actually a challenge to catch anyone now, would we. 🙄
There is no "challenge" or "skill" in shift+w... it's boring for both survivors and killers.
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@Pepsidot said:
Because it's RNG, very powerful, hard to deal with as solo survivors and once activated it can 100% secure a kill. AKA when the killer hooks a survivor at the NOED totem, there's nothing you can do. Then there's the fact that NOED could be well hidden and even if it's found, survivors then have to find each other, then heal, open the gate AND get the unhook before they die... which isn't realistic really in solo queue.
Also the fact that some killers e.g., Nurse excel with NOED and add Infectious Fright to the mix and there's a big chance of a 4k even if she did poorly the entire match.
Also cleansing all totems before end game as solo against a good killer isn't really viable (it's a very poor tactic for multiple reasons as explained by Pulsar).
That's why it's seen as "unfair".
It CAN'T secure a kill, because any survivors can run around and cleanse the totem if killer camp one, and there is 120(!) seconds to do so.
And if killer is good, they deserve a kill anyway.
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Just dead hard, press E to get one more health state.
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They already did, that's the reason why we have 90% survivor player ratio.
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@ThanksForDaily said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2794641#Comment_2794641
Who said Im a god-tier killer, god tier mmr or I 4k every single time? You said it.
Im doing very good pretty much without slowdowns and Im proud. Survivors also acknowledging that Im not the boring 4 slowdown killer.
Oh well, please don't pretend like you are better then, you are just casual player, there is nothing wrong in it but being "casual player" won't immediately make you any better than anyone else.
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@ThanksForDaily said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2794595#Comment_2794595
No, they don't "need" slowdowns for being good.
I only use pop sometimes on weak killers and corrupt on Myers. Haven't use Ruin like over 3 years now. I'm not addicted to slowdowns, I learnt the difficult way and my games aren't 5 mins because I adapted long time ago.
I'm genuinely interested if you can stream because that's god-tier killer player, as long as you aren't playing against lowest MMR or tunneling/camping ######### outta em or playing facecamp rancor NWO thing.
Since you "learnt the difficult way" and "adapted long time ago", I'm pretty sure you are playing above 99% of killers level at pretty high MMR... right?
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I was expecting something like "This forum is not real, it's a nightmare!" thing.
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@ThanksForDaily said:
4 strong gen slowdowns at the top but DH is the problem. 😭
Add DMS into the mix because everyone uses it.
there is more than 40% difference between usage rate of DH and those slowdown perks.
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It's all about fun and those memento is unique enough to be fun anyway.
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@Raptorrotas said:
Its funny that the possibility of certain survivor perks ( DS, DH, BT, UB ) being used in a trial, conditioned a whole generation of killer players and created the whole " nice" playstyle.
Many killers just play around the possibility of these perks existing, they dont wait till they actually witness those.
NOED has been around way longer and survivors just cant get it into their heads to maybe just prepare for it.
Don't forget deliverance and even kobe, you can't be sure till hook stage 2.
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Why don't you just #########, at least in pig game?
It does same thing as DC, but with BP...
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@Pulsar said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2794540#Comment_2794540
I think you overestimate a lot of players.
Just because they have comms doesn't mean they are going to win. That's a defeatist attitude.
I'm specifically talking about it in comparison to comms and non-comms, it's not about easy win or not.
SWFs in general, are objectively order of magnitude stronger than soloqs.
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@Pulsar said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2794534#Comment_2794534
And what exactly is the Killer doing during that time?
Trying to find someone, hook someone, and camp there or go elsewhere.
if he go to searching others, you can just save hooked one and escape, if he camp there, there is plenty of times to break bone.
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@Pulsar said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2794412#Comment_2794412
Just because people are in a SWF doesn't mean they are good.
95% of players who play this game aren't that good.
Telling "I'm in chase" "they dropped chase" is already broken strong, they don't even has to be good.
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@Pulsar said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2794496#Comment_2794496
We must not play against the same Killers.
The issue with that is that someone is already on the ground when we find out NOED is in play. There is very little chance (unless the Killer is horrible) that they are going to let you cleanse the totem. Likewise, going around the entire map takes time and even if you knew the exact spawns, it could still take you over 30 seconds to find the totem, let alone cleanse it.
As for perk builds, sure. You could take an entire build dedicated to hunting totems. Small Game, Detective's Hunch, Inner Strength and DH? You could do that. But again, you are taking a guess that the next Killer might have NOED.
NOED does not lose it's unhealthy aspect just because you can bring a very specific build to counter it. You can make an entire build to counter Dead Hard as Killer, does that mean DH is fine? Of course not.
You don't need to get hit to find NOED though, just look around for totems and if one is lit, NOED is there.
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@CashelP14 said:
I think there's a reason NOED is usually on players that get destroyed.
I don't mind the end game instadown but I think the speed boost is too much.
I also don't like the argument "just do bones" since if a killer is face camping (I.e Bubba) your told to rush gens. So there's no time to waste running around to cleanse all the totems. If he then downs you near the totem, it's impossible to cleanse.
I'd personally remove the hex part of the perk and make it time based. Give the killer 2 minutes of instadown and remove the speed boost.
That's a buff, and problem is not really a "do bones" or noed but bubba and facecamp.
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@Gylfie said:
My main issue with it is that you don't know it's in play until someone gets hit. You could be going for an end-game save and suddenly you're down because whoops the killer has NOED and you didn't know. Now you die too because you tried to be a nice teammate.
That, to me, is the only thing that feels unfair about it.
Those kind of way is pretty norm in survivor perks though, I'm not talking about whataboutism, I'm just saying it's pretty clear dev thinks "pretend existence of a perk and adapt according to it" is fine and fair.
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@MikaelaWantsYourBoon said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2794487#Comment_2794487
Haunted is also does not need skill but it limited with a minute. And you need to bait survivors to cleanse it, using with other hex totems maybe. So Haunted is not problematic perk or bad design.
Devour is stronger than NOED and it rewards you for hooks and non-camp gameplay.
Rancor is giving info to obsession, so you know killer has it and you can play carefully at end game.
NOED is different. Killer does not need to do anything. Lose generators and get your reward. And survivors does not know you have it before first survivor down. This does not looks me good design, sorry.
Rancor is definitely WORSE than NOED, it gives killer the information of where every survivors are in, and if you die WITHIN game, killers can just slug camp obsession and kill it.
even worse if it's paired with nemesis, just eat a stun, kill them, they dead.
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@Pulsar said:
The intended counter-play to NOED is unrealistic for most Survivor groups.
Likewise, you are taking a guess that the Killer has NOED. You never know for sure. Cleansing 5 totems is a fairly large time investment, similar to one gen at the bare minimum.
Additionally, when the Killer isn't terrible and has managed to pressure your team well, but you have the edge when the gens are done, you just lose. There was no opportunity for you to cleanse totems, else you'd have lost the game earlier. That's a damned-if-you-do, damned-if-you-don't scenario.
To top it off, NOED is horrid at it's job. The teams you actually need it against (ie, 4-man squads) can remove it easily, as I've found in my totem experiment. NOED just ends up stomping Solo Q and Duo Q players, whom you shouldn't need it against.
NOED is a crutch for bad Killers, true, but it's unhealthy because of it's unrealistic counter-play that boosts good Killers to unintended heights and it is clearly a relic of a bygone era.
or you can just find a totem after all gens done, I'm not sure if it is that "unrealistic"... no different from cleansing a hex, you don't even have to do gens, and killer will likely to do camp or else pretty much letting everyone to escape.
You aren't even limited by EGC when NOED activates.
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@MikaelaWantsYourBoon said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2794482#Comment_2794482
I never said after last generator is finished killer should not get kills. But yeah, NOED kills are not deserved kills. Just bad design.
Why NOED is issue? Because killer is not doing anything, lose generators and then NOED will activate. This is not skilled play. Remember Me and No Way Out are solid perks. You need hooks for NWO and you need to hit obsession for Remember Me. Both perks are rewarding good plays.
I think you are misunderstanding NOED and rancor? because NOED doesn't make you get "kills" even, it just allows killers to skip a hit.
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@WesCravenFan said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2794472#Comment_2794472
People seem resistant to the idea that end game builds are valid.
I'm not sure if it's about "end game build" in general, NOED is WEAKEST of all the endgame perks because you can simply stops it from activating, but somehow no other endgame perks will be complained much.
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@MikaelaWantsYourBoon said:
It is like Dead Hard for me.
You are winning chase and then survivor is saying "No, bud i have Dead Hard. We will loop more."
You are winning game and then killer is taking it from you with NOED.
NOED is bad design. Perks should not reward bad plays. Before i get what aboutism, yeah survivors have Dead Hard and it needs to go as well.
I mean, is it really "winning game" when you didn't cleansed 5 bones?
lul
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@deKlaw_04 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2793388#Comment_2793388
And then there’s nothing I can do when all 3 teammates suck
You really shouldn't have one, this is team game.
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@ThatOneDemoPlayer said:
It must be deactivated, it's so random there's no way it's actually active. You either get 2 Hook games or get 4K'd at 4 gens
It's deactivated, dev said so.
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At least you can farm pips as a killer.
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I mean generic perk weak nerf noed is 300 IQ move.
Also jolt is from demogorgon, not really a generic perk (or is it, idk)
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@GoshJosh said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2794316#Comment_2794316
Not no matter what. If no one can find a totem to bless, no perk. Killer snuffs, need to bless again. If not near the blessed totem, need to traverse to it. It has its pros over Self-Care, but Self-Care has its advantages too.
If you’re solo queue or cross-platform, you have no idea if a teammate is bringing it or not. Which might lead to multiple CoHs in a lobby to the survivors’ detriment.
If killer snuffs it, they wasted their time.
If killer didn't, survivors always have time advantage thanks to sheer strength of perk.
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@C3Tooth said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2794403#Comment_2794403
1. How do you know youre facing Pig if you dont spawn near a Jigsaw box?
2. How do you know youre having an AFK Pig but not Trapper busying with his traps?
3. Even the most skilled Aayrun would not able to tell if someone else is going for unhook another teammate, especially indoor map. Because there is no INFO in solo.
4. No Info =/= unskilled or low IQ.
Because you have trap in your head, and everyone else have trap in their head, and no one gets injured for entire duration of the gen.
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@Taingaran said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2794426#Comment_2794426
Maybe it's better to remove the collision if the killer has already reached the hook?)
You can always drop survivors to let em slug, chase the one you found anyway.
They buffed wiggling for no real reason, but there is still plenty of time to deal with those things.
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@Warfaredragon7 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2794400#Comment_2794400
But some people just don't have friends to play with at all like myself who have no friends because they quit this game because of how BS it is
More or less, sad or not, those people are actually in minority.
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Because you can just hit him, remove collision and hook as usual.
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@Pulsar said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2794403#Comment_2794403
You vastly overestimate the average Solo Q enjoyer.
The thing is, average Solo Q enjoyer is not the average survivors.
like half the players are SWF, and there is plenty of good soloq survivors in another 50%.
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@C3Tooth said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2793830#Comment_2793830
No solo ever able to know a Pig is gonna afk to do 99% 5 Gen. The first thing a survivor will ever do if they spawn near a Gen is to finish it as quick as possible.
Any solo with two digit IQ can know if pig is afk, and even one digit survivors will understand they shouldn't finish gen when everyone has traps in their head.
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They only works in extremely potato survivors.
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@Barbarossa2020 said:
Dbd is impossible to balance, in your example it's basically swfs, and the rules to try and make it balanced kill it entirely.
Nevermind the normal people play solo, who cop the full wraith of full imbalance on everything.
Normal people won't play solo, especially in this game.
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It should be harder, probably not slower though.