dugman
dugman
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@miniwengsel said:
It feels like you dont have any power right now. The Hitbox is so ######### small you cant really play wesker right now
Try treating his Bound like Deathslinger’s spear. They probably have comparable size collision boxes on survivors so you may need to lead the Bound at long range the same way you lead the rifle.
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His bound hit-box is absurdly small and unnecessarily punishing to learn.
Sometimes his bound will pass through survivors.
I suspect these two are related. Basically the way I think of it is right now his survivor collision box is maybe more like Deathslinger’s spear size than Demo’s Pounce, so you have to hit the survivor squarely from the server’s perspective for it to land. But also like Deathslinger’s shots it means you probably have to lead the Bounce at long range slightly to where you think the survivor will be rather than aiming directly at where they are at that moment on your screen. Latency then means that sometimes you’ll see Bounds and Deathslinger shots seemingly pass through survivors when they shouldn’t.
Mandy did mention they are still monitoring the survivor collision size in this version to see if they went a bit too far in shrinking it and need too increase it slightly. On PTB it was 40 or 45 cm, now it’s 20, so my guess is eventually given the feedback they seem to be getting so far they’ll raise it to the middle somewhere like 30 or 35 cm.
Meanwhile though I do think it’s worth noting this doesn’t make Wesker’s Bound “useless” like some people say, it just means you need to think about his Bound like you would a spear shot and aim it accordingly. (In fact the Bound’s maximum range is a couple of meters longer than the rifle’s so you can hypothetically land the same sorts of long range snipes with the Bound that you can with Deathslinger if you aim the same way.)
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You know the killer is comboing it with Pentimento.
Hmm, if survivors start thinking like this I might have to run Plaything by itself and survivors will never cleanse it even though there’s no reason not to. 🙂
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As an anecdote Yerv posted a video last night highlighting how he’s having decent results against face camping with Reassurance in solo survivor queue since it gives extra time for either the gens to get done or the killer to get enough out of position to mount a rescue. 30 seconds is not a small amount of time in this game, it’s the equivalent of an extra chase.
It’s not a silver bullet and killers inclined to facecamp will do so regardless of whether or not it’s actually strategically a good idea. But Reassurance does punish it.
https://youtu.be/X60vBz64bSQ -
@soulfire22 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3160722#Comment_3160722
I've been using the terror radius build, with his add on you can swap out sloppy for something else.
Which add on are you talking about?
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It's not anywhere close to being in "90% of builds". It's a popular perk but it still only has about 15% usage.
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@Laluzi said:
Yeah, it's a terrible idea to show prestige in advance. It's basically showing rank again, and we all know why that was removed. It encourages lobby shopping on both sides, tells killers who they should target, and tells survivors which teammates are going to be useless and should be dodged.
Yeah, I hadn't really thought about it but I agree that hiding Prestige or Grades or whatever in the lobby is probably a good idea. Anything to reduce lobby dodging.
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I think I hit someone who had it on them tonight once or maybe twice? 🤷♂️ I'm in the habit from a long time ago of hitting the unhooker first in a hook trade but every now and then I accidentally hit the person who got unhooked and they have to go Mend (assuming they aren't dumb and hang around, if they do that I'll just down them again. If they sprint off though I'll down the rescuer since that survivor didn't get an extra speed boost to get away.)
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I didn't get a chance to tonight unfortunately, I did get him to level 50 though, just barely shy of Prestiging.
As far as builds go, there's a few of my favorites I want to try on him
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Backpack
- Agitation (faster carries)
- Awakened Awareness (see auras while carrying)
- Mad Grit (free attacks while carrying)
- either Starstruck, Forced Penance or Iron Grasp (depending on my mood which one I like better)
Especially where Wesker automatically goes into carries straight out of a Bound this seems like it could be a fun killer to use this build. 🙂
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Bad Medicine
- Coulrophobia (longer heals and faster heal skill dials in terror radius)
- Unnerving Presence (smaller skill checks in terror radius)
- Distressing (25% larger terror radius)
- either Septic Touch or Sloppy Butcher or Huntress Lullaby (depending on my mood)
I've been messing around with Bad Medicine builds on a bunch of killers recently and it's a lot of fun, just tonight I got a 4k with Demogorgon using it. 🙂 And with Wesker's base terror radius being a whopping 40m combined with his decent map mobility from Bound this type of build seems like a natural fit.
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Anti-Popular Perk Build
- Discordance (see gens with two survivors, to counter Prove Thyself)
- Hex: Third Seal (Blindness, to counter Windows of Opportunity and other aura perks)
- Fearmonger (Exhaustion and Blindness while repairing gens, to counter various popular Exhaustion perks and also Windows a bit)
- either Terminus, Hex: Undying or Jolt depending on my mood (Terminus would be to counter Adrenaline in the endgame, Undying is to protect Third Seal, Jolt is to give a bit of extra slowdown)
Basically this build uses perks that specifically counter the top six or seven most popular survivor perks at the moment. (It's a little surprising but Windows of Opportunity is currently the most used survivor perk in the aggregate stats.) Even though the loadout sounds a bit goofy and is light on direct slowdown I've been having good results with it.
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There's a bunch of other fun builds to try with him but those are the ones on my mind at the moment. 😄
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Wesker seems to be going through a similar trajectory as Blight. There were a lot of people during Blight's PTB that claimed he was terrible because his collision box was too large. They shrank it for live and he then had some trouble bouncing off objects that it seemed like he should. Meanwhile after Blight hit live there were a bunch of people posting how terrible he was but a lot of it was because people were using his bounces poorly and in loops they shouldn't have bothered. But of course nowadays most people seem to agree that Blight is actually one of the best killers in the game since people finally got used to his mechanics and realized when to use his Rushes and when not to.
So I'm pretty sure Wesker is really similar in that regard. He had a PTB where his collision box was too wide, they narrowed it but maybe a bit too much, and now there's a bunch of people saying he's terrible when in reality it seems like there's also a lot of people misusing his ability or aiming it poorly or using it in places they shouldn't or not using it when they should. I've seen streams now of some people actually using Wesker fairly well though so I'm still convinced he's going to end up being considered mid- to high-A Tier once the dust settles. I can maybe see the devs tweaking his collision parameters a smidge again since they're no doubt monitoring it after the change from PTB to make sure everything works right, but he definitely doesn't seem to need any big overhauls at this point.
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@Percival_nxs said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3159712#Comment_3159712
Hitboxes to obstacles: {^^^^^^^^};
Hitboxes on survivors: {^^^}.
And also, is so frustrating when the power get nullified like you dropped from an high place, even in small descents, like 5 cm.
For example:
The broken wall to the RPD hall that have those rubble, well, those are counted like a drop.
Per the patch notes right now the obstacle collision size and the survivor collision size are both identical (20 cm down from 45 and 40 cm on the PTB). I don't know how that compares to Demogorgon's collision sizes but obviously it means less accidentally hitting objects but also less of a margin or error on Bounds to hit someone.
Anyway given these new parameters weren't on the PTB I'm sure the devs are going to be closely monitoring how he performs on the live server to see if they need to adjust them again slightly. They may end up making survivors 30 cm and keep obstacles at 20, for instance, but who knows? 🤷♂️
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@Deathstroke said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3159476#Comment_3159476
Yrah but also the amount of bonus sometimes it's 100% and other times 50%.
Right, the amount changes based on how big the gap is in the queue between the sides.
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Your screen says you got 84k. The matchmaking would be in that, not the 30k
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On a tangent I love the narrator in the release trailers, but it would nave been cool for this specific chapter if they had gotten the Wesker voice actor to read itl 🙂
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@kizuati said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3159433#Comment_3159433
Yeah I got told on my "you haven't fixed the grind" thread that they would address BP gains... Well. They addressed them,lol.
They literally just cut all the costs by 1/3 this patch (which was handy since I had 800k saved for Wesker today, got him to about 45 or so. With the old costs I’d still need 500k more.) And when I do play a game or two and get him up to Prestige 1 all my killers get all his perks automatically at level 1, another savings, and Wesker already automatically has every teachable from every killer with nothing needed at all, again a big savings.
This whole bloodweb rework has been a massive bonus for me. 🙂
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@Dustin said:
To me I didn't expect it to work.
Open-handed - Increases aura reading range a survivor has
Wiretap - Gives a GENERATOR an aura reading range
The description of Open-Handed doesn’t specify the center point of the aura has to be a survivor.
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@Deathstroke said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3159401#Comment_3159401
Yeah now it is weird it keeps changing.
It’s supposed to change depending on who’s in the queue.
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They fixed the two bugs I was watching (Wesker’s Bound being interrupted by Any Means Necessary and Sadako phasing into hooks)
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Unless I missed something there’s only two main items left in their 2022 roadmap other than the December dlc chapter - custom matches with bots and automatic mori on the last dying survivor. So it’s definitely possible we could see both in the next midchapter, but we’ll see!
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You could use both? You can get 30 seconds in the first stage and 40 seconds in the second stage of a single hook instance that way if the killer is literally just face camping, plus an additional 30 or 60 seconds if one or two other people use Reassurance also.
That’s all assuming you actually have enough of a pet peeve about face camping to bother using either. 🤷♂️
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@Mandy said:
Wiretap and Open Handed are not meant to work together.
Thanks Mandy. In that case the perk description for Wiretap should probably explicitly say it doesn't work with Open-Handed then or vice versa. Right now there's no indication in game that they don't work together. Otherwise it's really confusing when they don't.
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@GrimReaperJr1232 said:
To be completely fair, there is/was a nurse challenge. Shocked Legion is that high though...
He said it was from 6.1.0 which was after the patch rework but before the Thanatophobia nerf.
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@AnchorTea said:
Open Handed + Wire would be the new meta. That's why it doesnt work
That should be included in the perk description if that’s the case.
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@Ana1661 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3148775#Comment_3148775
It hurts, but it doesn't counter it. 30 seconds is 1/3 of a gen.
Nothing will entirely stop killer players who really just want to facecamp from doing it short or a total overhaul of how player elimination works.
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Just FYI this was fixed in the patch today, that’s probably why they didn’t bother killswitching it.
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@Sumnox said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3158709#Comment_3158709
Well it should honestly stack. Like, if people devote 2 whole perks to extending hook timer, it absolutely should
I agree. Whether it does or not I have no idea, have to see someone test it.
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@Pepsidot said:
For some reason it's returning later today.
https://us.v-cdn.net/6030815/uploads/XINHZKY567GC/image.png
Not sure why they wouldn't release it right away though? Surely you want more players incentivized to play survivor to even out the queue times since with every chapter release killer queue times are slow.
Probably a different backend process from the patch release so they have to do one and then the other.
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@Crowman said:
There's no reason it shouldn't.
Kinship will activate first since it's 16m range and then after you wait out the kinship duration you should be able to reassurance.
Well hypothetically it could be the two timers run simultaneously rather than add together in series. Ideally they should run in series rather than in parallel but I don’t know which way it actually works. 🤷♂️
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I don’t care that much about Blast Mine personally but I am curious why the last second change on it from the PTB. I wonder if there was an exploit or something breaking because of how it worked? 🤷♂️
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@lauraa said:
just out of morbid curiosity....were people running this perk specifically to counter Wesker by any means necessary, or was this some happy accident?
Yes, on the PTB some people were actually running that perk specifically because it hard countered Wesker’s Bound.
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No, they said once per instance last week so I wasn’t expecting anything else. 🤷♂️
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I like that the maps are smaller and also that they added additional entryways so there aren’t dead end rooms now. The dead ends were pretty annoying, they made it a lot harder to get around the map than it needed to be.
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I agree, I wish they would replace the bloodpoint bonuses on those add-ons with an effect that is actually impactful during the match. For instance, replace the bonus on Trapper’s Padded Jaws with something like all his traps reset or even something cool like he can pull traps from lockers and the oldest trap on the map disappears, etc. Or like with Speed Limiter, replace the bloodpoint bonus with something like the chainsaw charges extremely quickly or never overheats. Basically give them a really nice bonus to make up for the downside.
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I never played Resident Evil so I don’t really care about the survivors or the map. Wesker looks like a lot of fun to play though. 🙂
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I like the current version of Ghost Face, got an easy 4k just last night with him.
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The funny thing is the perk is actually worse than having no perk at all if the survivors can consistently hit the skill check and stop the regression before 12 seconds elapse. If you’re against survivors who can do both those things then you’re literally better off having nothing in that slot. Even if you also run Call of Brine, for example, your regression is actually faster for those first 12 seconds if you don’t run Overcharge with it.
So it’s not even obvious the current version of the perk is really much better than the version before the reworks where you just got normal regression the whole time after a kick plus the skill check. And yet very few people complained about that old version of the perk but now all of a sudden Overcharge is getting complaints. I don’t get it. 🤷♂️
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@My_Aespa said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3158338#Comment_3158338
The custom matches versus bots will be awesome! You can practice with any killer you want without looking like a fool 😄
That and I can finally just walk around and explore a map to see all the art assets by myself. 🙂
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I main killer because I have more fun as killer than survivor for various reasons
- There’s a much wider variety of playstyles in killers than survivors. All the survivors are basically the same thing, just with different perks. The killer unique abilities though really change how they play in comparison.
- Killers have a lot less downtime in a match. As a survivor you spend about 1/3 or more of the match either on a hook, on the ground, or on a generator with not much else happening.
- I find I prefer the way chases feel in first person as killer to how they feel in third person as survivor. Obviously third person is strategically superior, it’s just a style preference thing for me.
- I don’t know why but I dislike skill checks. I get more stressed doing the dumb checks than I do during chases, it’s weird. 🤷♂️ Probably just has to do with since I play survivor so rarely I miss skill checks often enough that it still irritates me.
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The big things left on the fiscal 2022 roadmap aside from the next full chapter dlc in December are
- Custom matches versus bots
- Automatic mori on the last dying survivor
I’m really looking forward to both of those. 🙂 With any luck we might even get both next midchapter, who knows?
Aside from that, once those above things are in the game, they’ll probably be getting back to working on the new HUD action icons for solo survivors and on doing a balance pass on Sadako and some other characters.
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@[Deleted User] said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3158296#Comment_3158296
I like that. Where is that art from?
Google search is where I found it? 😄 I think it has a link in the bottom right corner though.
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@HugTheHag said:
Can confirm, Third Seal is underrated by everyone.
Even survivors will sometimes not look for it because it doesn't seem worth, but it works like a charm to delay unhooks/raise and prevent Windows.
The hook thing is definitely true. I had a match last night as Ghost Face on RPD. One of the people I hooked died fairly quickly on first hook in part I think because nobody came to rescue them, they were on a kind of remote hook in a corner of a dead end room and I had hit I think all the survivors (maybe) so it’s possible they just didn’t know where to look on that map for the hook. After that person died my Hex finally got destroyed but by then two people had died and it was game over. (And the irony is one of them used an offering to send us to that map, it really backfired on them!)
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I think maybe the biggest flaw in DbD is they tried to do a semi-cooperative game design with mid-match player elimination and unclear victory conditions. Semi-cooperative design rarely works well and DbD is no exception, it can lead to players sandbagging the game if they feel they personally aren’t doing well and animosity between players who are “out for themselves” and players who think the survivors are an actual team. On top of which the midmatch player elimination means that as soon as one player is downed early it increases the chances they’ll think they’re personally going to be eliminated so it doesn’t matter if they just give up and throw the game for everybody else.
Note for instance the official DbD board game is intentionally designed to avoid these issues by being both fully cooperative on the survivor side with a clear victory goal and no midgame player elimination. Basically the killer gets tokens every time they hook a survivor and every time the hooked survivor stays hooked for too long, and if they gain enough tokens before the survivors open the Exits the killer wins. In that system everybody gets to keep playing the game the entire time, one player getting downed early isn’t as inclined to just give up, there’s no disputes over whether or not you win as a survivor, it even disincentivizes face camping since standing at a hook will get you less tokens then proactively going and downing people to get more hooks.
Unfortunately this is a design flaw we’re stuck with since it’s so deeply ingrained in so my systems. Maybe someday if they make a sequel to DbD they’ll consider doing a fully cooperative no midgame elimination system more like the boardgame uses? But that’s something that has to be done from the start of the design process so it’s not happening in the current one.
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@[Deleted User] said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3158127#Comment_3158127
Hush now. The fans have been so quiet lately. You'll wake them
Lest they not wake from their slumber…
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I’m definitely buying Wesker, probably with Auric cells versus the full dlc though since I don’t care about buying survivors. (They’re all the same basically aside from perks and I don’t play survivor enough to care about buying perks for them.)
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@Deathstroke said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3158178#Comment_3158178
That not nicely said about demo. He is strong killer high B tier or low A tier.
I think you’re both right, Demo is high B or low A but I suspect Wesker is high A.
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@Sonzaishinai said:
A good one for Jolt is something like Bond so you can avoid going down near teammates working on gens
Overcome i guess so you can absolutely make sure you can get to a area where gens have already been completed to avoid surge
MoM was amazing vs Stbfl but it's dying again today sadly
Another indirect counter I didn’t think of to Jolt is healing perks since if you can get back to full health efficiently then you can be downed less often.
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@Norhc said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3157390#Comment_3157390
Exploits aren't and shouldn't be a bannable offense. It's all devs' fault.
Intentionally using exploits are explicitly one of the main categories of things you can be banned for.
EXPLOITS: ABUSING BUGS OR ERRORS IN DESIGN TO GAIN A COMPETITIVE ADVANTAGE
Advertising exploits
Exploiting bugs, errors in design, or undocumented features to gain access to what otherwise would not be available or to obtain a competitive advantage
In-game report REQUIRED / Customer Support ticket OPTIONAL
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- I think "tunneling" is an ambiguous buzzword at this point that's used in too many different types of situations (e.g. redowning someone off a hook, chasing someone too long without switching targets, going after someone who's injured instead of a healthy survivor nearby, etc). And while I understand how incentivizing killers spreading damage around is good for the game in the sense that it keeps more players active more of the time, a lot of those tunneling scenarios are perfectly fine. That's why I try and stick to talking about things a little more specifically, saying "redowning someone right after an unhook" for instance.
- "Camping" is really just a synonym for "zone defense" and for the most part there's nothing wrong with playing a zone defense in a game like this. The only type of camping that is worth disincentivizing is actual face camping where a killer feels inclined to just stand basically in place near a hooked survivor and not do anything but wait for others to come. It's kind of boring for the killer, definitely boring for the hooked survivor, and the best strategy against it is push the gens until the last possible second before trying a rescue so it's not all that exciting for the people on gens either. I'm sure that's why the devs are experimenting with Reassurance, for example, and why they've talked in the past about trying things out internally to entice killers to be more proactive in seeking other survivors out after they hook someone. So called "proxy camping", though, where a killer is defending a third of the map or so which contains a hooked survivor and some gens is perfectly fine.
- Sadako isn't the worst killer in the game. I put her on par with Wraith, both of them at about 2 out of 5 stars. Her map mobility and Stealth alone keeps her out of the bottom tier. I'm not saying I'd turn down a buff like removing her Lullaby but I think some people underestimate her.
- I think people are overreacting to the Reassurance change from the PTB version. If a killer is actually face camping someone and they have to stand in place an additional 30 seconds that's a pretty good chunk of time, enough to mean the difference between gens being done and not.
- I think the game is better overall now than it was 3-4 years ago when I started playing and I definitely wouldn't want a return to "the old game" with its dumb emblem system for matchmaking, infinite loops, worse graphics and broken things like the old versions of keys and moris. The game will never be perfect, it's too large a project with too wide a variety of characters and maps, but this year so far is a great example to me of how the game continues to improve. The perk rework is overall better than the prepatch versions of the perks, there are no perks being used by literally 40% or more of players now (the most popular perks seem to be about 20-24%), the bloodweb changes are great, and my two favorite killers to date happen to be two of the most recent ones, Dredge and Sadako. Plus Wesker is looking very promising as well, not to mention they shrunk RPD and opened up the rooms that used to be annoying dead ends in it. 🙂 There's a lot of complaining that goes on, which isn't surprising since it's the internet, but honestly the few things I complain about are mostly minor and if I didn't think DbD was a really solid game I would have stopped playing a while ago.
- Not specific to DbD per se, but when I see someone start off a negative review by saying something like "I played this game for 400 hours and it's garbage" I immediately think they're crazy. If a game is garbage why did you play it for 400 hours? If I don't like I game I stop playing it, I don't continue playing it for months on end and then grouse about how awful it was on forums. I could maybe see an exception if something really, really major changed with a game, like it just stopped working with a new edition of Windows or something, but otherwise I just think people who play games that long and they circle back afterward to same the game is terrible are kind of dumb.
- And on a related note, DbD is the only game I can think of where players unironically call other players with a few hundred hours of play time "n00bs". You're not a newbie if you've played a game for hundreds of hours no matter what anybody else calls you. You might not be as good as people who play for thousands of hours but you're definitely WAY better than actual new players who've played less than 50 hours.
- The so called "soft cap" for MMR isn't a factor in matchmaking. The devs confirmed a little while back that very, very few people in the player pool are at the soft cap, as in 1% or less. If you think you're hitting the cap you're probably wrong.
- Boons are mostly fine, including Circle of Healing. The only problematic part of them is how certain specific totem locations in multistory buildings take a really long time for a killer to reach to snuff them but can still cover a fairly good area of the map. But I think if they tweak those handful of locations to put them on ground level the Boon system in general is ok.
- I think by and large killers are mostly relatively balanced. Even the "worst" killers (e.g. Trapper is usually on the list) really aren't that far off in kill rates from "good" killers outside of maybe tournament level play or something. Really player skill is the largest determining factor in getting wins or losses, if a killer player is actually outplaying the survivors they'll win no matter who they play. Specific killer abilities and loadouts only really come into play when both sides are playing well, if neither side is making mistakes then things like what the loadouts are will be a more important deciding factor.
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@deckyr said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3157241#Comment_3157241
i remember when breakdown permanently broke hooks and i had to deal with 3 survivors running it per lobby and there were no bans.
i don't think this level of bug abuse is ever going to face punitive measures. i just think the devs see it as a temporary issue that they'll fix and everyone will get over it. because we will, tbh. just like we got over breakdown.
On the flip side I think people were banned a while back for exploiting a bug with Legion, I don’t remember the details though.
Nowadays though with the killswitch system I think they simply killswitch anything which is problematic enough that exploiting it would result in a ban. I don’t know the details on this Sadako thing well enough but if it makes it literally impossible to rescue people against her then they might killswitch her until it’s fixed, but who knows? 🤷♂️
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@deckyr said:
killing a survivor is the opposite of holding the game hostage. sucks that there's a bug, but the devs haven't deemed it bad enough to killswitch, which likely means it isn't bannable either. since they can literally ban the character and haven't, you know?
wanting something different won't make it real.
Just FYI "holding a game hostage" isn't the only criteria for being bannable. Intentionally using a bug to gain an advantage is alone enough to get a ban.