coppersly
coppersly
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This captures the toxic SWF problem pretty well. I really wish this was a priority for the dev team and not the elephant in the room they refuse to talk about.
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@DelsKibara said:
It's been llike that for ages.
You can thank Dedicated Servers for that. Hopefully they'll have that fixed soon, maybe make grabs a priority same way hit detection is a priority for Killers.
Because the amount of times I got BSed out of a grab is too much to count.
Especially on killers like Nurse or Hag, it really gives survivors such large free advantages when they already get so many from the bugs alone.
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@RockoRango said:
As well as that, it seems they might've given her a shadow buff; her blinks seem to go faster, and don't feel sluggish anymore. I don't know if it's just from the killer's POV, but I can definitely feel the difference.
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I have serious doubts since they only listed one patch for her and it was only to do with a single building on a single map.
I haven't actually played since the patch though so I can't say from experience whether she is better or not.
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@Xzan said:
Floating pallets. It was funny to see the stuff flying to the moon.
Jokes aside:
Nurse basekit nerf. I have adapted to the change. But my muscle memory sometimes make me blink 0.1 seconds before I get my 2nd blink back.
And maybe another addon pass, maybe by people who actually use her more than once in a blue moon...
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@C3Tooth said:
Killer's 2nd chance perk is strong. Such as Noed & Bloodwar. But Noed can be destroyed before it even works, Bloodwar can avoid if no injured survivor get caught in middle of the map when the Gate opened.
If you speak on Survivor. Dead hard can be activated at least 3-5 times each match. DS. Unbreakable. Andrenaline. Borrow time. Tell each of these perk extend 10sec in chase. Now think about x4 Survivors. Its roughly enough time for 2 Gen.
The most 2nd chance perks team I faced as a Killer was 9/16 perks.
Yeah it's really annoying when everyone in the match is running those perks and it takes way more hits to down people because of it :/
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@Milo said:
So, one map fix per update?
One map specific bug fix per update*
Can't be having fixes that work on more than 1 at a time now.
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@ABannedCat said:
Yeah, even if they fix the unblinkable zones on all maps, she is still a bug-fest. Dedicated servers were introduced 12 months ago, which caused the first problems for her, and some of them are still not fixed.
You make a point. Before Dedicated Servers the only bugs I got with her were usually cosmetic like the blink animation bug everyone loves lol.
Rarely did I get a bad blink or stuck in place blink (of course deadzones still happen though) but after the servers I started to notice the visual bugs more frequently, and then the hardcore bugs.
I don't know if DS are a linchpin in her bugs because I like the idea behind DS but idk man. I just want a fun Nurse experience again.
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There are already so many perks that literally show you were totems are. If you're struggling in Solo with totems, run one of those. There is no need to make it even easier to get totems when they already spawn with no protection or right next to a survivor/gen.
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@BigBrainMegMain said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1272979#Comment_1272979
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1272890#Comment_1272890
Thank you.
Glad we got 1 bug out of the way.
Now if only they would fix most of her game breaking bugs that happen on any map...
At least 1 map is slightly more playable now I guess. Thanks devs.
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Corn is such a lazy way to design maps too. The biggest one was easily 85% corn and N O T H I N G else. Like wow great job you made a large area in map editor and put corn on it. Better call it a day for a bunch of different maps!
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@DelsKibara said:
It's certainly much more balanced than before, it used to be a trainwreck.
But, it can be better.
This is where I'm at. Looking back it was a miracle anyone had fun, and looking at our current situation it's also a miracle. But less so than before.
Still long ways to go though.
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That's the community. Toxic.
I'd recommend you just leave the game if you aren't hooked on the gameplay (pun intended) otherwise the payoff and reward for playing won't be more than the downside from the toxic as hell community and unfun games you'll have.
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@CashelP14 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1263882#Comment_1263882
The game is heavily slanted in their favour lol tell that to all the new players who we want to get into this game. Tell that to the many red ranks who are getting squashed by killer pretty easily. The only challenge killers actually have in this game, where they actually have to try is against a good team (usually that's a swf team). The game is forcing players to play swf because if they don't then they'll either die by a good killer or bad teammates.
Also I never said 5% are toxic. I said only 5% of swf teams are actually good. The rest are pretty meh and not really hard to beat either. Comms aren't the big issue, it's the fact that all 4 players are probably pretty good. Your saying that this 5% needs dealt with, what about the 75% of the player base who struggles against killer and expects a nerf? Your putting your "needs" ahead of the rest of the player base.
No ones ignoring the top of the game. If they were then map changes wouldn't have been made and killers like doctor wouldn't have been buffed. After keys and moris are nerfed the game will be in it's best place in years.
Unfortunately this game is extremely difficult to balance fully. Every nerf and buff has a big impact over the whole game. Sometimes people have to accept that if your not playing the best killer and your facing a team with over 1500 hours each then you'll probably be beat.
Tell that to the many killers in red ranks who have to deal with sweaty toxic groups constantly. I'd like solos to be as strong as SWF and then balance around that going forward instead of having to worry about if solos are going to be ok with something or are the SWFs of the world going to be able to hardcore abuse it x4.
And the game is balanced around casuals, the devs have stated this is their balance philosophy. Yet, we still get changes that are only going to affect red ranks who only play a specific killer that is very rarely played anywhere else... hmmm.....
I'll agree with you though, this game is incredibly hard to balance and I definitely don't have all the answers so I can't expect the devs to be spot on 100% either. I love this game and just want it to be fun again that's why I'm so hard on it tbh.
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@Accullla said:
How do you determine whether someone's "boring" or not? I personally enjoy playing against "meta" builds, because it implies that the person using them will pose some kind of challenge.
I think he's talking more about the staleness of the game. How long has the meta perks been meta for? Like years... I'd like some way to force change in loadouts at least a little bit to get some variation. So tired of seeing the same 4~7 perks and only using a handful on any given killer too.
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@CashelP14 said:
I swear it's like people don't know there are already 110 discussions on ds and swf teams. It's like everyone needs to create their discussion on it.
People just need to understand a few things when it comes to swf teams. Not every swf team is this toxic t-bagging at every pallet or clicking the flashlight at the killer. The same way every killer isn't a tunneller or a camper. I personally love talking so I wouldn't play this game if I wasn't playing with a mate of mine.
Just think logically about this. If I went to play the game later what would I do?
- Play Solo - Chance my luck that my team is good and they aren't all running self care and urban.
- Play SWF - Guaranteed good players who know how to loop and I can actually rely on if I need help.
I also hate this idea that swf teams don't care about their randoms. If we can save them then we will. Unfortunately if they aren't a good player and they are actually a hindrance to the team then I'll not prioritise helping them over the others.
How about another example. Since everyone loves to complain about these bully builds swf teams I'll give an example on that. If I'm killer and I know I'm facing a swf team, what would I rather face?
- Sweaty SWF - Using all the meta perks and beating me in 5 mins.
- Different Builds SWF - All running weird builds to try and have fun. Game will last probably 15-20 mins and I have a good chance of getting multiple hooks and kills.
Playing killer at red ranks against a team of solo players is generally a pretty easy win right now. I wouldn't be against giving killers more bp after the game if they face a swf but I don't want any debuff but on the swf team since only 5% of them are actually good. The killer shouldn't be told if he is facing a swf either since he'll change his build in response to the survivors.
Sorry if this looks like a slight rant but I'm just seeing constant ds/swf discussions and I'm finding it a bit boring.
I find it boring too when a good SWF can just walk over me because the game is heavily slanted in their favor.
No one with a brain wants friends to stop playing together, we're just so ######### tired of having 2 different tiers of survivors (solo & SWF) with 1 having the chance to be waaaaaaay more problematic and game ruining. And I don't care if it's only "5%" of SWF groups that are toxic cancer, that is 5% more than needs to be happening and needs to be dealt with.
When you ignore the problems people are having near the top of the elo, eventually only the people who are abusing the broken ######### will stay and play that shitstorm of a game. Guess where DbD is?
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@supersonic853 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1259239#Comment_1259239
They probably think shes fine because theyve met the like 1-2 rank 1 god nurses you come across randomly who can perfect blink and swing basically.
I wish we could get the reverse treatment for once; The devs play against godly sweaty seal team 6 SWF for a few games and actually do something about SWF for once.
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Well when you said her addon pass was a success and she actually has useful addons is the point where any possibility of you having a point was lost.
It was an abject failure in every aspect. We still have the same amount if not more of useless/meme addons that aren't going to be used an overwhelming majority of the time, and now she only has 2 good addons (cooldown ones.) Most of them were clearly designed by people who don't play her and actually understand what would make her more enjoyable or interesting. An addon that rewards you for using your power... by disabling your power... And if you're not using the cooldown addons you are literally blinking half as much as someone who is, cutting your effectiviness by 50% out the door. Unless you are a GOD and do not miss a SINGLE blink the entire match you are way better off running cooldown over literally anything else.
And her red addons are just a slap in the face. I don't even want to talk about them. The pass was a failure, and she is in the worst state she's ever been in gameplay wise and bug wise.
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@immortalls96 said:
Closest you can get is double blink cd reduction
This. It brings the cooldown to 1.5s/blink.
That means when you fatigue with no swing you are about 1/3 of the way to a 2nd blink charge, and almost ready to have 2 if you do swing. It's still no where near pre-nerf but it's the closest we can get until BHVR realizes using only 2 addons and literally none of the others is stupid and either ######### us over by removing them or just makes her basekit not stupid.
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@Ghoste said:
It won't happen. The devs have stated they want you to be engaged in the game during struggle phase, not just checking your phone until someone saves you.
It's such a dumb reason though. There are a million ways to make it engaging yet not mind-numbingly boring as mashing a single button over and over. Like I could list 10 off the top of my head that would require you to be paying attention but wouldn't be the single most annoying thing you have to do each match as a survivor.
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@Mister_xD said:
i would be interested to learn where he got these numbers from...
9 blink nurse? lmao
He's afraid of Many Blinks Nurse obviously.
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@Bovinity said:
Both.
Good SWF groups just make a mockery of killers.
Solo pub groups get steamrolled by killers.
There's no real middle ground and it'll never change.
I agree, it's a mix of both. SWF has a lot of good elements in it that make the game more enjoyable and even more tactile (to a degree this is good, too much is bad as well) but on the other hand that means a killer who is fared well against SWF are going to destroy solos who don't have the same tools and 9 free perks you get just by using SWF.
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@Aven_Fallen said:
Hex-Perks are a Risk/Reward-System. So you should not rely too much on them. Personally, I feel them more frustrating than good, which is the reason why I did not use pre-nerf Ruin. It stressed me more out to have a Totem to protect and the risk of playing with 3 Perks, instead of just using 4 Perks instead without any Hex.
Also, Totem Spots are improving over time, especially the old Maps have some really poor Totem Spots, but newer Maps or reworked Maps got some more than decent Spots. And I think there should be a mix of both, not really stuff like the Totem Spot right in the Open on Disturbed Ward, but Totems which are easier to find and those who are harder to find.
However, I agree on the fact that the Killer should know which Totem is which. I really dont know why it was never implemented that there are different Colors for each Hex a Killer is using.
The majority of the community just flat out ignores and does not use Hexes because they are too wildly inconsistent and not very useful most of the time. So if a risk/reward system doesn't have much reward but all the risk why should anyone use it? We currently don't. It needs to be changed to be a viable option to use Hexes, instead of a minute-at-best-hex like we have now.
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@ggezbaby said:
this happened to me before as survivor. i didn’t dc but after the billy hooked me, i was stuck on the hook floating in the air with crows over my head. i could only see the killer in third person. was still in the game with killer after EGC finished. even after i dc’d, the killer was still stuck in the game. it’s a bug. I don’t think the survivor is responsible. could be, but in my experience, it was a shi*ty bug for both the survivor and killer.
Ah, after some talking and digging it seems he was watching a twitch stream so maybe there was a lapse in internet at the right time and the server didn't know what to do with him anymore. I guess it's not a bug you choose to activate or not lol. I'm still pissed though.
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You guys this wasn't even the worst of it. Just finished a game that was more bug than actual input on my part. Like literally almost every blink was bugged in some way, couldn't use it when I wanted, etc...
That was just so much unfun but I'm glad many blinks Nurse is at least funny to other people.
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@Dzeikor said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1247923#Comment_1247923
look at old nurse videos on youtube and you cant see its not like that,also her second blink is garbage,pretty much unusable
It definitely suffers from a lot of issues but it's still essential to her gameplay.
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@Dzeikor said:
I hold her blink for over 30 seconds and nothing happend,but I restarted the game and it works now,but compared to old nurse,it takes much longer now to fully charge her first blink,they really watered her down heavily to the point is only usable to players that main her only
I love the negative take on her changes, I agree with a lot of them. However, they did not change her charge time on blinks, only her fancy new cooldown between blinks. It still takes the same amount of time now as it did before her changes to charge a full blink, same for the blink-chain window, as well as the 2nd blink charge itself.
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@NursesBootie said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1247884#Comment_1247884
I love the bug where nurse just throws her hand out and never clenches her fist during charging the blink. Looks demn funny.
I also find the one where she just holds her weapon instead of her fist when charging a blink to be hilarious too.
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@MadLordJack said:
Hag literally has the strongest map pressure in the game. Enter her web, I dare you. Who cares if 4 gens get done before she gets a down, she's HAG.
Other than that, most of the reason killers don't have good map pressure is a complete lack of snowball potential. Easily the best pressure in the game is 2 quick downs, which most killers cannot do without perks or sheer luck.
tbh all you have to do is swarm the traps, she can't hit everyone at once. SWF often destroy my nests in this kind of manner.
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I totally agree with you, they should've just changed her addons and went from there.
However, I have not experienced this bug you speak of unless you count the already existing visual bugs where she doesn't even use her hand at all.
Also wdym if you don't time her 2nd blink you'll miss it? The full distance? You get used to when a fully charged 2nd blink is after a while, or at least a really close to fully charged one...
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Apparently one killers POV was pushed forward so it looks like you're in range when you're really not on them currently, I wonder if that was accidentally applied to more killers...
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I take screenshots of terrible placements like this. Everyday I play more than 5 matches I can easily grab 3+ pics. Like you would have to be literally blind to miss these totems kind of bad. I just want a totem that takes brainwork to find and not something that is literally standing out in the open or right next to the main objective.
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In terms of his bug fixes yeah good luck on that.
In terms of the next "addon pass" that he'll receive what's wrong with him that they want to change? Probably the fact he has no cooldown and can use his power whenever he wants. Don't want too much engaging gameplay or meaningful choices.
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@brokedownpalace said:
I mean even if you don't stop the gen in time you can still take advantage of the zero terror radius. I feel like combined with the killer version of Dark Sense it's pretty decent. I can't think of the name right now
Only if you're near a survivor though. If you're on the way to the gen and are like at least halfway there or more it would be useful to maybe sneak up on someone leaving that gen.
If you're further than that though unless they're running straight to you the TR will return before you even spot someone. I use the sneaky part all the time as Nurse for sweet juicy gen grabs so I definitely understand the power behind it, but only if you're already near someone.
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I'm not sure if that bug is new or not, with Nurse it's so hard to tell. She's super bugged, that's why I NEVER use any other addon except the cooldown ones. They're the most powerful and least buggy by FAR.
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@RockoRango said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1244992#Comment_1244992
You're playing Nurse. On a console.
God bless you
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@RockoRango said:
Sadly, this patch has broke blinks; fatigue times can either be faster than usual or extremely slower, you sometimes can chop around the map instead of a smooth blink because the servers are broke, you sometimes do short blinks even if you charge your blink enough (which has honestly broke my muscle memory), and sometimes your second blink won't even work AT ALL until you either hit someone or perform an action.
When it isn't broke? It's probably not worth it to try to get into her anymore. If you tried to get into Nurse before the rework, you could do it fairly easier than you can do it now because you can learn from the mistakes you made when blinking compared to being punished for missing even 1 blink with a 3-second cooldown instead of being able to get your muscle memory down. It's still possible, but you have to wait so long at this point to get the muscle memory down that its better to use both recharge add-ons just to get a grip on how to use her.
Is it worth it in the end? It depends on how long you plan to spend your days playing DBD. This is because you have to spend hours now just to get some basic concepts down compared to before, when someone who has things they need to do every day could sit down and ENJOY PLAYING HER. It's not enjoyable being punished for trying to learn a killer (or servers screwing you over) in such a demeanor that you could lose a lot of chases just by being unlucky.
TL;DR:
Nurse will always be the strongest killer in the game if you know how to use her.
She is now extremely hard to get down due to how long you now physically need to train your muscle memory.
She isn't fun to learn, and it's arguable that it's fun to play as her depending on if the servers have a good day or not.
fatigue times can either be faster than usual or extremely slower
Wow I thought it was just me thinking sometimes it took forever to go into fatigue on some hits, glad to see it's a bug.
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It really is only good on a few killers: Freddy, Nurse, Billy, Spirit?, Oni...
Yeah if you can't get to a far away gen in under 8 seconds you won't be getting much use out of it.
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As long as the survivor wasn't already good at evading Nurse before the rework I can usually 4k. If they were good though they can make a 400+ hour Nurse feel like a 2 hour Nurse with all of her bugs, limitations, and bullshit from dedicated servers.
I would say keep going if you really like the character from top to bottom like me, but that was if you were on PC. On console? Give up? Learn someone else, like Freddy or a non-aim sensitive killer. She's really a M&K killer.
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If he's gonna get treated like Nurse prepare to keep those bugs for years to come.
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You're not entirely wrong. We do need the game to function better but outside of redoing the entire game from the ground up I doubt we'll get more than general bug fixes instead of vast improvements.
But we should never ignore game balance. As someone who plays near the top of the ladder if the game is left unbalanced it becomes a nightmare to play against other experienced players and that will kill any game that doesn't depend upon a few whales to live.
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It's extremely strong and versatile to the point where I would be ok with it being limited uses per match, considering it's invincibility during a chase.
If every single survivor is running it it's either something that should be basekit or nerfed, tired of seeing it x4 every game tbh.
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@xEa said:
Why do you give a f if it is a bully fest or not? You want to practice the Nurse, so just dont care if you win or loose. Play your game, learn the blinks and expect that you will loose.
On top of that, the best way to practice is to verse people who know how to play against Nurse. Getting stomped as a Nurse beginner is totally normal.
Hmmm I wonder why someone playing a game to have fun is not enjoying the game when people are literally abusing him in it?
HMMMM
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MY best bit of advice is to not put traps right on pallets or windows, put them far enough away so when they get triggered and you teleport there's still time to get moving before you lunge for the hit.
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Yeah corn maps are bad. The one that is 85% corn is extremely lazy map design, and corn is just weak sauce as a free get away from some killers.
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@LALYTHIA said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1232305#Comment_1232305
Are you really suggesting someone use No Mither as a legitimate perk, not a meme? 🤣
Oops, I meant Bills. Yeah I would never suggest no mither unless you're playing against a killer who is trying to play fair and not abuse that perk lol. I try not to but sometimes it's unavoidable.
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@Peanits said:
I just chase them as normal. They're realistically not relaying every little thing I do. They can't constantly tell each other every single time I change directions in a chase, and if they're relying on it that heavily, the info is going to reach them way later than if they had just used their eyes. Outside of a chase, they might run a bit sooner when you head their direction, but I never found it to be a deal breaker.
You've got to admit, OoO is poorly designed and leads to way too many toxic interactions. I'd like a rework that still gives information, but not constantly and a literal wall hacks on the killer.
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She was left in the trash with Legion.
Game breaking bugs that only got more numerous AFTER her REWORK
TERRIBLE addons (at least half) that was THE ENTIRE POINT OF THE ADDON PASS
Her gameplay is awful. I hate waiting to use my power, I hate walking the slowest in the game while survivors barely rub 2 brain cells together and they can get away from me now
the list goes on
She needs help, and she needs it bad. As badly as someone like Legion? No, but pretty damn close.
