cogsturning
cogsturning
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@terumisan said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/461274/solo-q-is-desolate-right-now
solo q gives swf level of information the problem is the teammates when you read the hud
The HUD is pretty limited. You know someone is on a gen but you don't know which one. You know someone is cleansing a totem but you don't know if it's a hex and, if it is and they get interrupted, you don't know where it is. You know someone is in chase but you don't know where. The HUD is nowhere near comms. If it indicated which gens were being worked on or if basekit Kindred was a thing we'd be closer to SWF for soloq. It wouldn't buff SWF either, as that's info they already have access to.
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@Anniehere said:
I don't know if it's possible, but I wish MMR used an algorithm that looks at your recent matches, your perk choices, and how you interact with each survivor, and chase time. Then it could match you with players who show the same patterns. It could group players with similar playstyles, like meta perks, players who go for hatch, or the more casual ones.
I'd be curious to see how this kind of matchmaking would actually feel in practice.Imagine having four rats creeping around edgemap in the same match though lol
But hey, if it would get them out of my matches then I'm on board.
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The vibe change has grown on me but I'm not really sure it needed to be the priority right now.
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@Pulsar said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4033968#Comment_4033968
It certainly isnt right now.
You could take every pallet off the map and you'll still have people complaining that it's too hard.
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Every effort to help the survivor experience has been axed. As long as popular streamers and upper MMR dictate the convo, nothing will change. We have to hope for the upcoming matchmaking rework to do something instead, but after the last few patches, I can't say my hope is too high.
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@Aven_Fallen said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4033811#Comment_4033811
I mean, I would be happy if they would add the possibility to abandon when only 2 Survivors are left and you are put into the Dying state. Because at this point the Killer will be slugging for the 4K and the game is over and there is 0 reason why the Survivor should be forced to stay in the game. And there is also no disadvantage for the Killer at all, since a Bot will replace the Survivor, so Hatch will not suddenly spawn and the Killer can then prolong the game they already won. (And the remaining standing Survivor can abandon as well, if they want, since all other remaining Survivors are Bots)
The last thing I want is another unengaging way for a match to suddenly end by just pressing a button. If self-recovery isn't going to happen, then I want the option for either a manual fast bleeout or hatch spawning once the second to last person has been down for 30s or some number. I want slugging for the 4k to become a bad idea and for hooking to be necessary. Matches should come to a proper and interesting conclusion, not one where someone just had their agency ripped away because a killer can't fathom a 3k win instead of a 4k win.
And until the abandon feature stops inflating personal survivor stats and ruining the MMR gain-loss system, I sure don't want another way for those things to be further screwed up.
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Survivor is instant for me in the daytime, killer is instant for me at night. There's never any change in this pattern except for during events, particularly 2v8.
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@CrypticGirl said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4033930#Comment_4033930
Ohh. I don't mind butt-slapping teammates, but idk about the Killer. Some of them are just too mean…
We've thawed many an icy heart
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@CrypticGirl said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4033899#Comment_4033899
Mandatory butt slaps? On who?
Each other and the killers
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@BeeZzzz said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4033910#Comment_4033910
That's a game development issue. In the show, Demogorgon is able to cross the dimension anywhere even inside a door. He should be able to do that.
Most of these characters aren't going to be accurate. They'd be too strong. Wesker is a superhuman that can move at teleport-level speeds but in this game a group of teenage delinquents and a deformed redneck are somehow faster than him.
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@Classic_Rando said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4032539#Comment_4032539
Do you not understand that a lot of people that player survivor also play killer? When the devs make changes that affect the survivor experience, it’s not like “killer mains” are unaffected because, despite what you seem to believe, many of them also play survivor. The last people that BHVR should be taking input from are those who exclusively play one side, killer or survivor.
I haven't seen many people that don't display a bias towards one role or the other. Even if you play an exact 50/50, you probably have a leaning. Possibly a strong one.
And yeah, the forum is full of angry survivors right now because that side got the short end of the stick. After numerous promises of a better experience for them, fog vials were destroyed, styptics were rendered useless, and zero of the anti-cheese changes made it to live.
Before that, for the last two ptbs, it was filled with angry killers dooming and glooming and threatening to quit, even though none of the proposed changes even happened and the biggest issue was pallets. The us vs them comes from both sides, it just goes in waves.
But I agree on the last point: the feedback of people who don't seriously play both roles should, at the very least, be taken with a grain of salt.
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@ShanoaLegendaryPlz said:
Yesterday i grouped with some randoms, had rize for the killer, tried to lure her away from the last generator i was fighting for only to drop near the shack because there wasnt anything to use for miles, and because i didnt have bond on at the time, the generator they were trying to finnish was apparently next to the shack so rize went over and slugged em before they could finnish the last 1%. Whole game gets blamed on me with insults and they leave before i can say anything. So i que again, same 2 people. Nothing said didnt argue just trying again maybe ill do better this time and prove them wrong. We get haddonfield and it ends up being twins with lethal persuer and news to me that victor had an addon to drop your item with weave atunement. I run upstair in the main building thinking there will be a window to jump out of but nope. So i get hooked first upstairs. And watched as nobody would come up there because the weave atunement and her proxy camping due to the current anticamp bug with twins. I died on that first hook with a total of 1200 points. Never even got a chance to "do better this time" and they abandoned once they all got slugged.
Most of the rounds i have in soloque end up hopeless pretty quick and i can really feel there is alllot less to work with even compared to before the pallet density update. It makes me wonder why i don't just play killer since they must be in their prime right now.
I usually won't do survivor without at least one emotional support partymate but last season I realized I was four pips short of fully ranked and had hours left. It took me nine matches to get those four pips. On one, I was the first hooked and I guess everyone voted to just let me die. They got a whole one and a half gens done the entire hook time. Another match was going bad so I died on hook while watching my two teammates tbag in a corner together. The killer came by to hit me on hook right before I died, just to make it better.
Every time I hop on for a few solos to preform some task or unlock something it's so insanely bad I don't know why anyone would want to do it. How can you play if you can't even hope to be unhooked?
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I haven't played a ton of killer since the update but not only have I not seen any (and I used to get them a lot) I've seen a general decrease in medkits and an uptick in toolboxes.
So that BNP nerf is incoming.
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I definitely want the survivor wincon changed to matches won rather than personal ER. We've all had matches where the person who did the most was the only death. They deserve a win, just as the hatch rat who took no aggro all match deserves the loss.
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@Skeleton23 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4033706#Comment_4033706
Ive had a 3 man team Kick my butt when one person died.
Losing one person doesn't mean you lost right off the bat. The killer does that because 1v3 is easier than a 1v4 but if you have 3 god survivors on ur team that are good at looping it will take long to do Gens but it doesn't mean the games over.
The killer will only go after the weakest Survivors to tunnel. So if you notice that ur friend is being tunneled, even in solo q go and get the killer off them. But dont make it obvious. Just also remember the more he chases someone the more time you are on Gens.
Try having 2 loopers, 1 Gen rusher and 1 protector.
This was something I seen in my games that some survivors do in swfs
Defending on ur Swf or even Being Solo Q pick ur roles for ur match.
For my survivor games im a Gen Rusher and Healer. My goal is to make sure the Gens get done and my teammates are healed.
So if ur having issues with something with a Killer maybe become the thing that solves it.
I personally can't ever remember losinga killer match that became a 3v1 at 5gens.
There's a couple ways you can end up with that situation. One is that the killer applied pressure super well or snowballed. In that case, when the one person dies, the others will also have hooks. This is basically unwinnable. The survivors might get 1 or 2 gens done but that's it. These matches are often 4ks at 4 or 5 gens for me, regardless of role.
Another scenario is a hard tunnel at 5gens, and great SWFs are unlikely to let this happen. Some SWFs do have weak link gen jockeys. I've been in such matches. They protect the hell out of those weak links. You'll have the whole team body blocking, flashlighting, and covering that person's trail if you even so much as try to hook them once. Otherwise, everyone is going to be good at looping, and gens are gonna pop while one of them keeps you busy. Even if it's a 3man that doesn't care if their unfortunate random is getting tunneled, they'll be doing gens in the interim.
3v1s at 5gens just aren't something I see happening to good teams. They're something I see happening in soloq.
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This is the biggest thing I want addressed, especially slugging for the 4k.
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I've never even seen this warning before. This means it thought you were AFK in a match? I see you're on PS. You can record your previous match to get evidence and make a bug report next time it happens.
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@100PercentBPMain said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4033578#Comment_4033578
I met somebody in the wild who I just have an unspoken understanding on a spiritual level. it's almost enough to make me tear up. then I play swf with the mates and we just clash lol
I don't have any irl people that I play with so they're all wild catches for me, and the different dynamics are super interesting. There are people who I know will almost certainly get me killed but they're well-meaning and lighthearted so it's fine. The devil you know, ya know?
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Oh no this just makes me want a set for my main even more!
But Elodie is my #2 so I'll take it. Thanks!
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@CrypticGirl said:
I'm in the same boat that I struggle with socialization, so I don't have anyone to play with. Also I play before dawn, and none of the people I know play at that hour...
I run Kindred, as that's pretty much mandatory for solo play, but other than that, idk how to make my games better...
I've played 100s of hours with people I've never spoken to. No one is obligated to speak. It does wonders for your mindset just having someone with you whose playstyle you come to understand and who has your back.
I also play in the middle of the damn night and that's a trickier issue, as you'll meet people who are on that schedule at the time but then go on a more normal one, and you'll lose them. I also play with people in different time zones, so that helps.
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@ReverseVelocity said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4033422#Comment_4033422
Honestly, if two people die within a 3 gen directly next to basement, there's some major misplays going on there, and I don't think they should be able to get out for free.
Literally just hold W away from the basement and you can avoid that kind of situation.
I was in this match, as you can see. He hooked me first, dragging me across the map with his perks, then positioned himself so he could hurl bottles at anyone who tried to come over. I went second. Right before I died, these other two came to get me and were then hooked. They went from one hook to dead why Hyena and I tried to do gens, but the two of us weren't enough to finish all 3 remaining.
I suppose you could say we misplayed by not expecting such absurdly scuzzy tactics because, despite how many times things like this happen to me, I remain too naive to anticipate such massive levels of dishonorable playing.
And this was one of two matches I went second in a basement in this one playing session. The anti-camp is crap.
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@Reinami said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4033165#Comment_4033165
Yeah, i'm gonna bow out now, no need to be snarky. I saw the charts, i don't remember which one it was, and i'm not replying you at this time anymore. And i don't care enough to argue with a 45 post andy who created a new account because they are too scared to post on their main.
What was it that you said to me when I mentioned dupe accounts on the forum? The Earth is round and we landed on the moon?
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Personally I don't like killers who can get injuries or deaths by doing very little themsleves. Pig's RBTs are the biggest example. Knight's guards as well, and Sadako's condemned. I find this to be uninteresting design and I don't personally play as killers like this. I want to perform the actions myself. Disabling her drones over and over is so lame to me too.
I also think her physical design and lore are cringe as all hell but that's a different issue than gameplay.
That being said, I don't have super strong feelings about her because I've probably seen 10 or less SMs in my last 1000 survivor matches. It remains to be seen how annoying I find her if she gets more use moving forward.
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@tes said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4033473#Comment_4033473
It was an assumption that clearly was “if it is”, without claiming “it is like this more likely”. Without “I place a bet” and male a statement about players who are not even present in the discussion at the moment.
3 four minutes long matches in one day with zero gen progression are still too crazy for me. Can’t remember this even in my worst games for last months. At least two gens done if play was terrible and 4-5 if it was good.
Nothing really special about killer play style when your main killers are own teammates.https://us.v-cdn.net/6030815/uploads/A9CGKLIXQFS4/img-3029.jpeg
Even this people who gave me 4k did one gen. I had full regress. When match lasted 4 minutes. If your team can’t manage do at least one gen, this is just a shame that’s not related to killer. So being tunneled at 5 gens is not a hint on killer being low skill or playing bad. Without fanaticism and shifting responsibility for your own game onto someone else
I didn't say a single gen never got finished the whole match. The matches went on without me. But I wipe whole teams out at 5gens—not just one person—regularly enough. These are all pretty recent:
But it seems like your logic is that if I'm the survivor getting tunneled, the killer is a better player, but if I'm the killer doing well, there must be some external factor, like bad players on a server. Not much more I can say if that's how you feel.
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I have all these same issues in SWF. Having friends around just makes the experience more bearable, doesn't make the game any better.
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I feel like hard tunneling, camping people into second, and egerious slugging have all slowly gone up since the first anti-cheese ptb. Having all three of those happen to me multiple times in one seesion—and many with a very griefing flavor—doesn't really inspire me to play surv.
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@crogers271 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4033352#Comment_4033352
I wonder if their player counts/player quits track things based on their spending. I'm glad there are people willing to buy cosmetics because I never would (like you I recycle auric cells, mine I got for free, and only own about half the licenses), so me leaving is not a huge financial loss. It would be interesting to know if they actually track when someone uninstalls or stops playing how big of a spender they were.
If there's one thing they track properly, I reckon it's money.
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@tes said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4033300#Comment_4033300
I didn’t ask for what killer were doing. Survivors :/ And if they had 4 minutes each match and each of them ended for you on 5 gens — clearly u all was meant to die in any way. Nothing about killer strategy here. They farmed you and made you go next. If that kind of servers and gameplay on NA are, I’m not surprised you having high KR yourself.
Killers just don’t care about idiotic teammates or your level of looping. As much as survivor doesn’t care about killer pick, or nice 8hooking, or “skillful way of play”
If they want to play, they playing the game. They aren’t charity shop or therapist to help with skill and bad team work/unlucky circumstances from other side. Yeah, maybe that’s something that defines skill and what is so unfun for you. The only thing I see - this killer are actually better, because they did something, and your team nothing. They don’t play along with others’ issues and that’s why you dislike them so much. They don’t solve or compensate troubles BHVR accumulated for years.
This is BHVR duty to show people how to do gens and simply play the game, because there are already bunch of players who doing it without struggle and the only challenge they can get is terrible MMR, maps or nasty tunneler. I literally quit DBD because of my teammates and that BHVR doesn’t work on actual QoL, because worked on some request from one half of players only to be it scrapped by other half. It either was extreme lack of challenge and boredom because killer played nice or got unlucky with MMR, or teams fell as soon as game provides some stressful moment. I barely had actually good matches because of MMR and farming, and that’s not about escapes - I stopped care about this after went on 50%. If that’s what DBD is about- playing along players and game not working, while players who actually played are target of contempt by players who even can’t stand in chase against them (aka - just play the game), I don’t need to understand community or devs.
When sentiment “fix x mentality” will cover part of fandom who loves to farm or have allergy on main objectives, then I stop thinking this CC is doomed to poison own game.
You recently got offended when talking to Pulsar about people making assumptions and generalizations about different regions/nationalities yet you did not hesitate to diminish the whole North Americn continent just to insult me.But fun fact, these were mostly EU matches.
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@Classic_Rando said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4032525#Comment_4032525
Can you show us how braindead easy killer is? So many of your posts are just complaining about how hard survivor is and how easy killer. Why do you feel this way? Do you actually play killer? If not, then how do you know it’s easy? If you’re only saying this because you have a hard time playing survivor, and you don’t have any experience as killer, maybe it’s just an issue with how you play survivor.
Think about it this way: what if I can on here and constantly posted about how braindead easy survivor is? How would you respond to that? Would you believe it? I assume that you would either not believe it and/or ask for proof to back up that opinion.what if I can on here and constantly posted about how braindead easy survivor is?
Plenty of people do do this. Someone will complain about the misery and impossibility of soloq only to have multiple people drop thier 50%+ ERs (that aren't accurate anyway) which does nothing aside from make people feel inadequate, while also telling you nothing about what happened in the matches.
I can say for myself that I try harder at survivor but do better as killer with much less effort. As much as people say killer perks are crap, I do very well with non-meta builds. Many killers also have some pretty mindlessly strong add-ons. I was doing fine with the pallet density update and was one of the few people that didn't think it was much of an issue. I maintained good stats throughout and I was mostly playing as Dredge.
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DLCs will never shut me up because I buy almost nothing. I unlock the premium Rifts, but I recycle my auric cells from the previous one. I don't own half the licensed killers and almost no licensed survivors. I haven't gotten any money-only cosmetics. If someone has a perk I want, I wait for the Shrine to have it. This game can drain my time and my happiness, but it's not gonna drain my money.
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Fog vials had a whopping week and half live before getting nuked into oblivion. There's no reason they can't give free-standing pallets the same fast treatment.
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@tes said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4033246#Comment_4033246
I’m impressed that you had at least two states with opportunity to be on hook for 70 seconds each, had total of 30 seconds of endurance, two opportunities for chases, killers had the cheapest and primitive builds possible, two of killers from roaster are primitive and “low tier”, and non of your teammates wasn't able to complete 90 second gen with zero pressure. And all of this three times within one day.
Your teammates either farmed, or something really funny happened here.
Not sure what this implication is supposed to be but here's some more info.
The Ghoul match:
Badham. Hooks were on the street. He either proxyed or hurled himself back to the hook the moment I was unhooked. The Vittorio had zero caution about unhooking me.
The Demo match:
Hawkins. Proxying. The Nea was the only escape in all three of these matches. He'd downed her too, but gave mercy hatch.
The Legion match:
I was unhooked in the Legion's face repeatedly and they just stood there and waited so they could hit me the moment I got unhooked. So that extra endurance and haste did me zero good. In most cases, I was unhooked almost immediately after being hooked, so that 70 seconds didn’t happen. I was in a duo in these matches. I can't control randoms unhooking me at stupid times. I'd love to never play with another random again, but I'm afraid my weird hours and everyone hating this game has shrunk my friend pool, so I get to deal with both scuzzy killlers and idiot teammates. I'm also not a great looper, something I've never been quiet about admitting.
Out of the 19 matches I played in this session, I was hard tunneled these three times, camped into second stage in the basement twice, and slugged repeatedly by a griefing, aura-reading (and probably smurfing) Nurse who refused to hook anyone until she'd downed all four of us.
So just an overall great time with all these high skill, challenge-loving players I always hear about.
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@UndeddJester said:
Even though I'm British... happy thanksgiving our
traitofriends across the pond 😁🤘I'll throw a box of tea into my local lake in your honor 🍵 🏞
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@Abbzy said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4033246#Comment_4033246
Interesting is the pure chase build but i bet it was ghoul or other strong killer, the slowdowns or endgame perks are still there like corrupt or noed they are better pick for hardcore tunnelers than regression perks tbh with some chase perk to get those survivors faster.
Demo, Legion, and Ghoul, in order. The Legion was a p100 and showed every sign that this is the only way they play. Pretty much a professional tunneler. I don't see why anyone who plays this way would run pain res when they could run chase perks that make their tunneling even easier, especially since pain res is already a perk that works from unique hooks.
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@Abbzy said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4033221#Comment_4033221
Pretty much its same as bringing medkit or flashlight, no one is bringing it to the match as random pick but they bring it because they intend to use it so Idk what these people think if killer wants to tunnel hardcore at 5 gens he will do it always because he is alredy decided before the match even starts to do it (different thing is if killer goes for one survivor straight when 3 gens are done before he can get hook, it happens and I get he just says srew this I go for this one because he doesnt care at this point).
I was hard tunneled at 5 gens by three separate killers yesterday. It was clearly how they intended to play as they either never left the hook long or immediately dropped chase the moment I was unhooked. These were their builds:
Tunneling killers don't care about gen regress. The early tunnel is all they need. The regress is pointless if you have a 3v1 at 5 gens.
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People who hard tunnel at 5 gens go into the lobby intending to do so. They just won't bring pain res if this happens, and many probably already don't. The scope of this would be far too small to have any effect.
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I saw this goofy thing for myself. Killer couldn't believe it either.
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I see lots of varierty consistently. My last survivor session:
- Micheal
- Twins
- Legion
- Skull Merchant
- Doctor
- Deathslinger
- Trapper
- Deathslinger
- Billy
- Legion
- Skull Merchant
Two Legions and two Deathslingers was a surprise, I must say. And yeah, two SMs in one day, which is more than I've seen in probably 300 matches. Not saying it went great for them, but they were present.
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Woooow p100, noed, shoving someone back to the lobby, and still only getting a 2k. I hope I never embarrass myself this hard.
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@ImWinston said:
- No guys, I know you have the best intentions and genuinely want to help, but these must be people who do this for the money, who use "aseptic" methods and have no emotional connection to DBD. People who don't care if Blight gets nerfed or if the number of pallets in "The Game" is halved (I'm just giving two random examples).
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4032784#Comment_4032784
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4032780#Comment_4032780
Where would you find these people? They'd have to be brand new to have no attachments. And how much time would you need in such a high context, info-heavy game before you can give any useful feedback aside from how hard it is to be new? As it is, they're clearly taking feedback from not just loud, emotional players, but ones who make money from the game and thus have massive ulterior motives. There's no where to go but up.
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@Meg_Survivor said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4032704#Comment_4032704
They not understanding, you can be the BEST looper and still get tunneled so their arguments make no sense at all
The problem is that the survivor wincon is personal escape and this imaginary badge of honor people want you to accept for getting your teammates out is supposed to be enough, even though all you get is MMR loss and another death on your record no matter how great you were. It's even more frustrating when it was a hard tunnel, because you know it could have been a 4e. Meanwhile, someone with a hatch offering can rat in locker and get no MMR loss and an escape on their personal stats while being skillless. The game doesn't properly reward survivors for skill.
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The power of content creators is a plague on modern gaming.
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I think many would. A volunteer program with parameters to filter out extreme biases would probably be very successful, especially if they gave them in-game trinkets like exclusive badges or cosmetics.
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@YaBoi0215 said:
The gen rushing and bullying is so bad, there's no reason to even play killer
If they are unwilling to dissuade survivors from garbage tactics then they should put the last nail in the coffin.
Do you see how idiotic and childish you sound? You survivor mains are so used to being spoon fed wins that when you can't 4 out in 2 minutes will running the killer around for an additional 5 you just complain the game is dead and unplayable. Why not actually get some skill and stop complaining when killers play the optimal way. Always double standards with survivor mains.
If your opponenets are dunking on you as hard as your describing then take your own advice and "get some skill"
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@[Deleted User] said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4032672#Comment_4032672
you literally cannot be in 4 places at once. the pressure from tunneling comes from the weak link who is unable to loop. But the mindset is « bad killer » instead of « bad survivor »
Because tunneling is easier than countering tunneling. Any new player can tunnel. You shouldn't have to be a good or very good survivor just to counter a bad killer.
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@Daniel_Silva04 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4032659#Comment_4032659
Tunneling is one the most effective ways to pressure gens, so your point doesn't make sense.
If the only way you can pressure is by shoving out a weaker link as fast as possible, that's an inability to engage with the game the way it's designed to be played. You should be able to maintain pressure on four players.
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These were supposed to be the patches that helped the survivor role, and by "help," they meant help motivate you to uninstall and go do something more enjoyable with your time.
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I don't know whose feelings could be hurt here. It's pretty spot-on. And it's nothing short of stunning that this compamy has managed to upset so much of its invested players.
It only seems to get worse and worse too.
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@Deadman7600 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4032516#Comment_4032516
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4032544#Comment_4032544
Less skilled was the wrong word, I was struggling to actually say what I meant. What I was actually trying to say was that a massive portion of the survivor playerbase is the casual 'play drunk with friends on a Saturday night kind' not the dedicated loop for 4 gens kind. When it comes to less involved casual members killer just isnt what they want because it has more perceived stress that a casual player wouldn't want to deal with. That's why I was saying that killers being a lot more outspoken isn't surprising, because they actually notice and take the game more seriously. The casual survivors are less likely to be turned onto this stuff than us more dedicated/involved members of the community (not just the killers but the more dedicated survivor mains). I didn't explain that very well and that did hurt my point a little.
I don't know how anyone new can approach survivor with the drunk-with-friends mindset at this point and end up sticking around unless they either 1) become devoted or 2) are a masochist that enjoys a murder simulator. Because if you're that casual, you're probably dying all the time if killers are actually more intense by default, and no one likes to loose every match no matter how causal they are. This game is so bloated with perks and so info-heavy while having the world's worst tutorial that I don't even know how you can do it. You're generally considered a baby until you have around 1k hours, and that's not a small amount for most people. I tried to get my partner to play this game and, even with me crafting them a baby perk load out and being in full babysitter mode, that experiment lasted about 5-10 matches. It's just not appealing to many new players. 2v8 is where I personally took the plunge into survivor. It's simplified, less intense, low stakes, and you don't have to worry about being a burden so much. I don't love the mode myself, but it's the best tutorial we've got.
And yeah, I agree, we aren't normal casuals here. It's why I always try to advocate for new and casual players because they're unlikely to have much of a voice of their own and I think they're essential to keeping the game alive. The 10ker hour players should be able to roll with the punches, though many can't seem to.