StarLost
StarLost
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Hmm.
A few questions:
- When is the last time you played (that killer)?
- How long were you in queue?
- Was the lobby full when you joined, or did people trickle in?
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@Nirgendwohin said:
dear
survivorskillers, please stop disconnecting. six disconnects today and every time i get no pip because of that. Half of the time I can't even give a reason why they disconnected.did you have similar experiences? is there something wrong with the servers? is this the work of hackers?
I seldom see killers DC when I play survivor. It does happen at times, but generally only in situations where they are completely outclassed and is getting deliberately clowned on, a survivor has DCd or the survivors have basically taken the game hostage.
Outside of these...I'd say maybe one in 12, if not less.
Survivors on the other hand, especially on the first down, far far too often. Maybe 1 in 3 games, all told, if I include suicides and AFKs in that number.
That said - all of this needs to stop, as it makes the game 100% less fun.
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@TigerSnake said:
-Dead Hard
-Blight moving at 115%
-Wesker’s bounds taking longer to recharge than Nurse’s blinks or Blight’s rushes.
-Dragon’s Grip cooldown applying regardless of if it triggers or not.
-Boil Over
YES to Dragon's Grip.
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@Moxie said:
So when Eruption triggers, is all you can do stand there/run around doing nothing?
Just seems odd and nonsensical.
You can:
- Get into a locker.
- Attempt to interfere with the hook.
- Scout.
The trick though is not to get hit by Eruption.
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@Sycamore said:
Typically it shouldn't be on the player base to bring sportsmanlike behavior. It's within developers ability to design a game to be more enjoying to play, or design it to be more stressful and grow toxicity. Take Final Fantasy XIV for example. The game from the ground up is built to give players an enjoyable experience, and even the most difficult parts of the game doesn't make the most players want to vomit toxic slurs in game chat.
Dead by Daylight I find brings out even the worst in the best of people, and they could be designing the game against that - but won't. Even the simplest steps have not been done in years.
I completely agree that DbD needs substantially better moderation, but FF is the other extreme - I got a warning for politely asking a player in our group to please stop pulling mobs for me (I was the tank) as it was slowing things down to a crawl (literally 'hey mate, please stop pulling for me'), and a 24 hour ban at a later date for using fireworks after we won a very tough PvP match...which I didn't even consider to be in the least bit gloaty or BM.
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@VoidOfMe said:
People were saying the numbers were wrong, they couldn't believe she was up there
But in my experience, I normally don't escape on a match against sadako. I can't recall the last time I escaped her
Got Nurse twice this week and escaped twice, but the only time I faced Sadako she got a 4k, as usual
Maybe she isn't good in top MMR? Cause in the MMR I am right now she's oppressive as #########
Interesting. Why?
I generally pants Sadako when I face her, outside of the strat that shall not be named and will almost certainly get fixed sooner or later, as it's as annoying as AFK pig or Cenobite.
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@GiveMeTheBox said:
I used to play killer a lot. Less so these days when I realized that the effort needed to play well simply isn't worth it, but I tried some killer tome challenges recently, and the whole experience was absolutely miserable. I don't want to claim subtle hacking or anything, but sometimes it felt like the survivors were far faster than how I run when playing survivor, or the killers when I'm survivor are a lot faster than when I'm playing killer. Has it always felt like this? Am I crazy? Or are subtle hackers far more of a problem than I initially thought?
Sorry, this is a dumb pointless vent post, feel free to ignore it. It's just slightly upsetting that the role I started playing this game for in the first place feels terrible to me now.
It's easier in some respects, but some recent/semi-recent survivor perks can be outright nasty - Fogwise is almost as strong as prenerf OoO, Potential Energy is bonkers in SWFs that know how to play around it, Circle of Healing is still nuts and Hyperfocus/PTS make gens fly faster than they ever did, to name a few.
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@Sonzaishinai said:
Play with your food
Not many survivors expect you to be that tiny bit faster that turns a close stun into a hit
It also promotes the good habbit of ignoring one survivor untill someone is dead
I love PWYF, but much like Dark Devotion, it's really frustrating when I can't find the obsession.
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@Edilibs said:
I "told" people that Sadako was bs and she was top tier but no one listened and i got heavily critisized for having her at top 8 at A+ on my tier list. This was 4 months ago!
Now fairly recently the kill rate data was released and what do you know? Sadako had top 3 kills overall! Yeah because i told people i didnt lose with Sadako much at all and i constantly 4k with her. People either ignored this or went on about the same old tired line;
"You went against low mmr bla bla bla lol! (You cant win with this community and its mentality is rigid!)
Sadako is bs end of story like i've been saying for the past several months! You "have" to do the tv's eventually and your gaining condemened during the match and depending on her add-ons this is accelerated through interactions.
She has a walking undetectable and demanifesting is better than Wraiths! She can teleport to tv's with no cool down but people thought this killer was weak and bottom 3 lmao!
This is why i think for myself and dont listen to people!
She's a nasty killer if she uses one of two gimmick strategies around condemned, that could be more accurately described as 'lol we all depip'.
Outside of these...hahaha no. Go watch some of Otz's streak attempts on her to see how much she struggles against solid teams, compared to even 'B' tier killers.
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@[Deleted User] said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3297620#Comment_3297620
How come I end up with almost 4ks each game using random builds? You've set up your mind I believe.
Without actually seeing any of your games, I wouldn't know. It could be a variety of things.
@squbax said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3298067#Comment_3298067
Because people are awfull at the game, if sadako got such a high killrate with the suposed best 5% of the playerbase, it shows maybe that 5% isnt even good at the game, sadako is a free escape, maybe a 1k on shelter woods or if she camps, anything more than that means survivors were memeing/throwing.
Altho I must say the condemned playstyle is one of my favourite things to watch ever, somehow people manage to turn a meme killer into and actual killer by basically designing a new way to play the game, pretty smart tbh.
Again, I'd have to see his games to know if maybe he's in an odd MMR spot, exaggerating or what have you.
Have been watching some CC videos and I'm astonished at how hard it can be to beat a really solid SWF without a tip top tier killer for even the best killers around.
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@GRIG0 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/358545/last-survivor-etiquette-what-do-you-do
I love ending matches in a "friendly" way since it releases tension on both sides. Unless they BM, afk, etc. I give them hatch or gates.
I've even become "friends" with some "bully" squads, you know, the ones that throw the game trying to do fancy stuff xD (i don't blame them since gens are boring as hell). But I don't consider these true BM, more like ppl fooling around.
If someone DCs at 5 gens or suicide on hook, i always chill with the rest.
If someone was particularly good, i try to not kill them and give this person hatch, specially when a good survivor reaches second hook because no one rescued them. And I also try to compliment them during chat.
And if all survivor are cuties or give me their items, i let them live too 😌
I know, i know, I'm too soft, the Entity is always lecturing me 😩
I have the same problem, especially since I started learning survivor earlier this year. I struggle to be sufficiently mean even when it costs me games.
This does set up a bit of an unfortunate feedback loop where other people aren't as nice, and then I end up going extra mean for a few games because I'm now annoyed XD
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@illumina said:
How can you effectively say that you know what the 1 person is doing though? I've had matches where I've completed couple gens, rescued other survivors and still be at 0 hooks. I've even had matches where I've intentionally ran to the chase to try and take chase off but the 1-2 hook injured survivor is the juicier target so I go and recover and work on gens again. So how do you really know who is "hiding" and not doing anything?
It works in the killers favor if all survivors are trying to be altruistic because then no one is working on gens. In solo q, with no aura reading perks, we don't know who is going for saves and who is working on gens. I run distortion so killer's can't see my aura either. So it sounds to me that your decisions are based off of assumptions, emotions, whims. Which is totally fine because you get to decide how you want to play. I just would like to know how you figure which survivor is the dead weight.
I can generally tell, as I tend towards heavy info and aura reading. If you're basically invisible all match or doing the 'locker hopping while avoiding AFK crows' - I'm going to make it a sidequest to end you.
It's also fairly obvious when an 1800 hour Meg gets put onto a team with a 200 hour Ace and two 60 hour Dwights. That Meg will probably get hatch or gate if she survives that long.
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@MaTtRoSiTy said:
If they were a sweaty squad and I had to work hard for the win then I wont give hatch/door... but then sometimes I will.
If they left their team mates to die then I wont give hatch/door...but then sometimes I will.
I cant be bothered slugging for a 4k though unless I am doing an adept or 1 pip off securing rank 1 for the month. But generally I cant be bothered and will just tab out of game while they find the hatch or open the door
One thing that I'll always give hatch/gate for - again, unless you've been BM - is when you get one really cracked survivor and 3 potatoes.
I wish killers could send out a ping, so I don't have to go looking for the person when I want to give hatch XD.
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@AmpersandUnderscore said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3297507#Comment_3297507
It's absolutely throwing off kill rates. BHVR have said multiple times that they don't count games with a DC when calculating kill rates. So those games where no one survives because it's 1v3 at 5 gens aren't being added to the kill counts. But to the players, it's still a win for the killer and usually a hopeless loss for the survivors.
At least in my survivor experience, I get far more DC's in my games than suicides on hook. Genuine AFK from the start seems pretty rare.
I'm convinced that a lot of these disconnects are a symptom of the effectiveness and efficiency of tunneling, which BHVR really needs to address. Having the first person focused out of the game is a common strategy, but it also means that survivor is probably getting basically zero reward/BP for that game anyway.
If players are first downed (also applies to 'unfun' killers), it can feel like the only options are either:
* play out the match, spend five or more minutes, and get maybe 6k BP for it.
* Disconnect, get 0 BP, but wait out a 1 minute timer to get instantly into another lobby.
I still think DC is a ######### reaction, and those players need to take a break instead. But barring individual reactions, the only thing BHVR has any control over is the game balance. Again, I think it's a symptom of game balance if your players commonly start to believe that the only winning move is not to play.
They exclude DC games.
The problem is that they didn't count suicides (even more common from my experience, same effect).
AFK from the start is rare (and I'll confess to occasionally butt queueing, then coming back to play and going 'ah dammit') but I definitely see it - often when someone is suiciding but gets rescued.
As I've said in other threads, quitting has zero to do with game balance, outside of certain hostage situations. You can be the fairest killer in the world, and still constantly see quitters - because, unless there are pretty harsh penalties for doing this, it's just a standard reaction to 'we might lose this and I want an easy win'.
It's also, sadly, something you'll see in every team based multiplayer game I can think of where there aren't strong penalties. Even co-op games.
Get downed early? Play the game out. Try to recover.
The only time that quitting should be an option is the odd RL emergency, or hostage situations.
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@BillsHere101 said:
His power. Stalking is a time burden which let every survivor do their generator at peace. He's also considered an M1 killer despite his exposed status effect in Tier III, making him an easy killer to loop.
How would you change Michael Myers?
Rework his insta-mori stuff, particularly TSP. These two addons are miserable to play against and should be called 'nobody gets pips today'.
Move Scratched Mirror down to brown and Vanity Mirror down to yellow. These are, by a mile, his most fun addons and encourage a lot of healthy play (looping, chases) as well as funny moments (jumpscares and ambushes).
Improve the thematically resonant parts of his kit.
- Dead Rabbit baseline.
- Increase his vault speed further at T2 and 3.
- T3 also gives him faster pallet breaks.
- He also gains stalk when hitting a survivor at T1 and T2.
@AbsolutGrndZer0 said:
I mean, I really wouldn't. In a lot of ways he's a meme killer, as he does what he does in the movie. Nobody plays Myers because he's OP, they play him because they are fans of Halloween and his playstyle. Plus, add that he has the Tombstone and Fragrant Tuft of Hair addons, and.... yeah. He's in no way weak, even without said addons.
...'This killer should be weak because he's a meme killer' is a...take.
I'd say he needs unhealthy addons reworked and then buffed in other areas, because Myers tends to be either pretty weak or a frustrating instant death machine.
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@WoIfie90 said:
Why is it that some survivors and killers begin working together near the end of the match? This seems to be a reoccurring theme where when only 2 survivors remain and one is downed, the killer either begins searching for the remaining player or camping the downed survivor or what have you. However when the remaining player does not assist the downed survivor (which in no way are they required to), said downed survivor and killer begin working together to locate the remaining survivor.
The real point I suppose is, why do survivors think altruism and heroics are obligated of another no matter the circumstances?
*getting points for and being a calculated mechanic of the game does not make altruism a requirement
You are getting the terms 'altruism' and 'sour grapes' mixed up a bit :)
That said, as a killer - if you snitch on another survivor, unless they've been BM or trolly, or just AFK/hid through the match, you're the one going on the hook and they're the one getting hatch or gate.
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@sizzlingmario4 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3297291#Comment_3297291
Except Eruption is not just “slightly above average”, nor would I call the people wanting Eruption to be changed a minority.
Dead Hard never should have existed in its old form for as long as it did. It still amazes me that it was left in the game for that long. But that prior mistake doesn’t justify doing the same with other overpowered perks, that’s just a logical fallacy.
As for the last part, there is too much of a gap between the strongest and weakest tools. Some categories of perks are simply stronger and generally more favored because of what those perks do, regardless of their numbers or actual strength (as long as the effect isn’t so weak it’s nearly useless). We can buff bad perks on both sides to introduce more viable options for players (and they should), but buffing some of those perks up to the level of some of the stronger perks we have is nearly impossible without reworking/adding brand new effects to those perks and/or making them overtuned.
I'm not trying to make a logical point though.
I'm pointing out why the difference in balance philosophy between killer and survivor perks doesn't sit well with me - it does seem like when a killer perk rises up in the meta, it gets smacked down to complete uselessness pretty fast (see: Thana) but when the same thing happens to a survivor perk, even if it's really strong, it'll be a 'wait and see' approach and if it is nerfed, it'll be done gradually and incrementally to ensure that the perk remains viable (CoH, Dead Hard).
The only time it'll get the Thana treatment is when it's literally breaking the game (Boil Over).
Just...yeah. Doesn't sit right with me.
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@NewPlayer100102 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3297600#Comment_3297600
I'm not going to argue endlessly because there isn't a solid argument to back either side, my approach to the DC penalty is just service based. Its dumb to tell your paying people, you can't pay, or use the service I built for you. Thats as far as my thinking goes here. I don't care how they resolve the issue of discouraging DC mid game, and I will acknowledge that it needs resolving, I would just prefer it was a carrot based approach(You get bonuses or enjoyment for toughing it out).
The awareness perks I would argue over though, It just looks to me like SWF group already have most of these tools. Need a totem? You have four eyes looking. Which gen is closest to done? Same issue. Same with pallets that are down or are available. I don't feel making new players memorize these things adds enough to the game to deny it to them. I suspect the only reason they aren't base perks is due to a monetization strategy that revolves around selling perceived game advantages. And when playing as a killer, I would not care if they had all these things. New people don't know how to run, lack of spatial awareness defeats them.
I think survivors need to win less. I have no idea how you go about making that happen and making the game tense and fun. I firmly believe most of the in game issues grow out of survivors expecting to have an easy win and the entailment that that breeds.
Eh.
Okay, how's this for an analogy.
I run a restaurant. A customer in the place is being obnoxious. Yes, he's a paying customer, but him being there is annoying my other customers. So I tell him to kick dust.
I actually did a little experiment, and checked over...yeah I forget now, but it was at least 100 games over the space of a week, just before the Halloween event if I recall. I brought flans and I didn't bring flans, also rotating through my killers. There was literally no difference in the rate of quitters.
Incentives don't work. This is an issue that needs to be done through moderation. I think a good solution would be forcing survivors to play games without DCing to get their penalty to decay.
Regarding perks - here's the thing.
SWF aren't hive minds or telepathic. Giving them what would basically be permanent, persistent wallhacks wouldn't do a ton for newbies (it would make some killers, such as Hag and Trapper completely unplayable though) but it would make experienced teams impossible to beat, as now they'll have almost constant eyes on you.
There's a reason why you see Kindred, Fogwise and even Bond in higher end SWFs - because having this information is not only sometimes really useful in chase, but it frees up airtime for other information. Giving them these baseline opens up even more room for scary perks like PTS and Potential Energy.
Remember OoO before they nerfed it? There's a reason why it still probably tops the 'most hated DbD perk of all time' list. Because it gave SWFs...honestly a bit less than what you're asking for. It's not going to happen and it really, really shouldn't.
As for BHVR not giving this to people due to some weird conspiracy...the light from that tinfoil hat you're wearing is giving me screen glare.
Yes, part of what keeps players hooked is unlocking stuff - but A. you can get almost all the perks you need from shards or shrine and B. any player that spends real money for perks is probably already hooked.
Lastly, no. Survivors don't need to win less. What we need is better tools for solo survivors, some of the top end killers brought in line , weaker killers buffed and maps balanced.
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@[Deleted User] said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3297513#Comment_3297513
I look forward to stats, I tend to believe the few dedicated Knights will nail it down on many others but I might be wrong.
Sadako was the same
Sadako's numbers are being thrown off by two very stupid gimmick builds, much like Myers and TSP.
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@Tantamountain said:
I think it's the addons making everything so much more difficult, thanks for the advice.
I think maybe I'm just not a good survivor.
I can't loop well, it always feels like there's nowhere to do it. Whenever I get to a spot, it turns a 10 second chase into a 15 second chase and that doesn't mean much or do anything for the team. Everywhere feels like a Deadzone to me.
As someone who really started putting time into survivor early this year (I'd been a full killer main for ages), you can't go in expecting to melt faces.
Focus on getting incrementally better and practicing the fundamentals, because if you try to get fancy you'll end up outsmarting yourself.
Once you've got about 100 hours, start watching videos and you'll pick up the rest.
After that, it's just about being able to judge what you can do safely, how to handle loops and mindgames and praying your teammates don't quit the second there's a down.
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@Tantamountain said:
Can someone tell me how to survive against the doctor?
I've played at least 20 games against him and lost every single one. Only killer that I can say this about.
Nothing works against him, he has incapacitate on demand.
I need some solid advice.
I do not play in a SWF.
Looping does not work against him.
He's not "just an M1 killer", telling me that isn't going to help me here.
Does any one have any video evidence that goes into depth about this maybe? I can't find a single helpful video on this particular killer. Others yes. Not doctor.
I don't need to watch some guy doing a bunch of tech spins on a doctor playing on controller, that doesn't help. I mean real tactics and advice.
The only people I seem to encounter playing doctor know how to play him well so these kinds of cheap YT video reel tactics don't actually work in a real game.
Sure. I've played a lot of Doctor over the years, and faced at least a hundred.
- If he hasn't shocked recently, anticipate him shocking as you approach a pallet or a window. If you're not confident on the timing, it's better to just keep running.
- However, shock has a delay to it, so if you're at the vault, do it.
- Predrop pallets. Don't get fancy.
- Looping is absolutely the way to handle him, he slows down while shocking.
- If you hear a distant terror radius and he hasn't done it for a while, anticipate his blast and get into a locker. It's got a horrible cooldown.
- If he's camping, you're in for a really, really bad time - as his shocks can stop unhooks. Weirdly, camping doctors are rare, but you'll learn to dread them.
- He has a few different addons - the ones to be scared of are the ones that make his terror radius increase or decrease in size, the ones that make shocks land quicker and the one that makes shocks longer.
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@NewPlayer100102 said:
Increasing DC penalty is not the way to go. You can't force someone to play a game well. You can try to force them to stay at the screen, but all you'll do is generate resentment, and this is dumb for a service provider to do to a guest.
Also, when the DC penalty reaches any intolerable number, the player will go find a new game. That is a bad thing to do to your customers, because it will cost you money. Only SWF groups would put up with it, and few of those DC for trivial reasons.
I think they should make all the survivor map awareness perks base kit, with reduced durations and intermittent activation so new people can learn the maps and key spawns faster, But something will still need to be done incentive wise to motivate survivors to work as a team early in their careers. None of this addresses the underlying issue, which I think is survivors should expect to lose the match, they should be rewarded for entertaining the entity, they should have fun doing that, winning via an escape should be rare and unexpected.
Ahahaha...no.
Every team based MP game I've ever played, co-op or PvP, has been riddled with quitters unless some serious penalty was added. People will quit the second things look like it may get challenging.
Frankly, the game would be better off without these people, because for every DC, that's a game ruined for 4 other people.
This whole 'it's my game so I do what I want' mindset is better suited to singleplayer.
As for all the survivor map awareness perks...also no. Not only would this buff SWF to completely insane levels, but you'd make playing Trapper and Hag completely impossible, and within a few months we'd be back to pre rework kill rates, and they'd have to buff killers to insane levels.
But let's get real here. What you mean is 'survivors need to win more'. Because that's the only way, outside of adding a heavier (or better yet, more elegant penalty - such as making people playing out x matches to make their penalty decline) to reduce quitters.
@VikingDragonXii said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3297576#Comment_3297576
Only reason why they won't give that kind of info is because everyone would say not want to face Spirit then anyone playing Spirit would never find a match and be punished for playing Spirit
Bingo.
@Donleov said:
For more disapointing than it can be, I feel the only solution is to give survivors/killers more information on what they gonna face, if I don't like billy doesnt matter how the match goes, I just don't want to face him, giving me this information before I get into the match, can lead to better matches, because you only will face people that are willing to play that match. Ofc this idea has it's own problems.
I got a laggy lobby with a cenobite forcing lerys (this map is bugged, and some cenobites players force it to abuse the bug), sorry I'm not gonna face 200ms, with 3 randoms, it's just no worth the stress.
That would be awful. You'd...basically never get a match on certain killers. But okay, let the killer see whether they are facing an SWF and what perks they are running. Then...sure?
@[Deleted User] said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3297562#Comment_3297562
I was with you until the bit about survivors expecting to lose. It's one of the things holding the game back a bit: the notion that the power role should be fearsome and successful by virtue of showing up. It was the initial vision of the genre, but it doesn't have to be the guiding principle.
A huge part of survivor frustration is how the devs chose to address the killer buffs in 6.1. They didn't address the root cause of any imbalances (maps). What they did instead was change the balance in a contrived way that boosted lesser skilled players and devalued good plays on the other side.
If you double down on the belief that killers should get kills simply because they're killers, you alienate the survivor players even further.
Maps would be a good start, but some of those changes were also aimed at buffing weaker (see: M1) killers and kill rates overall. There's a reason why a 55% kill rate makes sense, but it's complicated.
Sure, it could have been done more elegantly, but I think the idea was to move towards more of a 'we're balancing around the SWF versus Killer match up' design philosophy. Hopefully solos get some love, but the survivor role really does require teamwork to get the most out of, and balancing around solos makes killer miserable.
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@Iron_Cutlass said:
I think my faith in MMR has dropped a lot over time since Ive just come to realize that it quite literally does not matter what my rating is, or the rating of my teammates, or even the rating of the killer. Yes this is putting it bluntly, but it is straight to the point as to not dig into certain aspects of MMR I dislike that I think are better suite for another post.
MMR does not matter. Allow me to dive a bit deeper.
We've reached the point to where whenever I play Killer, I rarely face survivors that I would say are "cracked" at the game. I rarely face people that can hold a chase for an insane amount of time. And often most of my matches end in 3Ks or 2Ks (I always give hatch so never 4Ks).
As survivor, my teammates are literally licking the paint drying from the wall of Shack, or Self-Caring in the corner of the map against Sloppy Butcher. Every now and then I see people that are decently skilled, not insane, but able to hold their own. I use to escape a lot as well, at least with SWF.
Realistically, in both senses, my MMR would be high, I lose sometimes, but I gain more MMR than I lose in a general sense. Yet, I am paired with people of varying skill levels, borderline no SBMM. MMR doesnt work.
MMR use to work, Im sure everyone remembers the sweaty matches for both sides, but BHVR has changed MMR over it's course and I think I can say with absolute certainty that "Im high MMR" is 100% an awful talking point to use for a debate/argument.
"Im high MMR so I only face Nurse and Blight every game" and "Im high MMR, so survivors only bring second chance perks and 4 BNPs every game" has just reached the point to where I can never really believe those arguments anymore, DBD has more variety than it use to and finding such to begin with is not as common, rather people choose to accept it or not.
Of course, this is just speaking my mind, mere food for thought; but even with these ideas present, I still reckon people might deny it, either that or it will get buried under the large amount of "survivors brought BNPs one match and I exploded, nerf survivors" or "I died to Nurse once and my PC blew up, so remove her from the game" posts.
Interesting.
I started in the middle of ranks, and I find MMR to be much better.
Not perfect, but compared to maybe 1 in 5 games feeling 'fair', it's more like 3 in 5. And 'perfect' is sadly always the enemy of 'better'.
You definitely get the odd 'wut' match, but aside from lobby dodges and people waiting for extreme amounts of time, these aren't the norm.
One thing I will note is that, since the most recent MMR changes, I'm seeing a lot more 'mixed' teams on both ends. 2 decent survivors and two weaker survivors, or one amazing survivor and three potatoes.
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@Raven27 said:
Hey guys, I just want to know your opinion on one quite subtle thing...
In many matches I play as killer I easily can see someone using DH, the animation is visible so I know when to strike, just wait for it to end. Sometimes, on the other hand, it just don't work that way, the survs have DH when the animation didn't even started and just run away to the other tile with deep wound.
"Ok, so maybe they just do it perfectly timed" I thought.
Gone to soloQ as surv as usual, took DH. My observation is - if animation isn't fully started, the DH won't work. See it was used (exhaust), but didn't protect me from the hit, get hooked.
My question is - is this game this bugged with connection issues or other things (like totally bugged dh), or there are so many subtle cheaters with autodh? It wasn't one time, in like 10 matches got at least 3 people who used DH that way, and I don't play killers too often.
There are some really suspicious DHs, but most of the time - they just got lucky, or read you.
The easiest way to test is to wait for them to be a bit away from you and swing. Auto DH will go off, but a human player won't use it.
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@SmolBlob said:
People are not obligated to play a certain way for your sake. They also don’t know how strong of a build you may have. Some people enjoy playing more seriously, others enjoy playing more laidback, both are completely valid. Some people enjoy doing meme builds, other people enjoy playing to win with meta, so on. They are all valid.
Criticizing people for playing "sweaty" or "tryharding" or so on is pure entitlement, and utterly, nonsensically stupid. It is being derogatory to someone because they play more seriously. Want to play laidback? That's great, play as laidback as you want. But people aren't obligated to suddenly stop trying just cause you don't feel like playing seriously.
If people are playing to intentionally anger others, that's pretty childish. But them playing seriously or smart or efficiently isn't the same as playing to piss people off on purpose. Play how you want, and they'll play how they want.* Expecting them to play a different way or being condescending about it is immature and entitled.
* Within the game’s rules.
Yeah...it's tough.
I try to avoid camping outside of EOGC or tunneling unless there's nobody else to chase, and I still get called sweaty.
'Sweaty' is generally just code for 'I lost and am salty about it'.
The only time it's valid is when someone goes out of their way to bleed people out or deny people BP that costs them nothing.
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@JustAnotherNewbie said:
I think I've only found one killer who wanted to play around with Snowmen. Everytime I get in one I get hit out of it.
I had bond on so I knew Dwight was getting chased etc. And while I was doing a gen I see a snowman coming my way (Deathslinger) so I simply decided to join him and then Nea also joined us, later Mikaela as well.
What you can't see is, after Mikaela comes out of the Snowman and goes to do a gen we proceed to shame her in a circle. I don't remember if Dwight ever joined us and if he did it was for a short time, I think he was scared or something.
I was letting survivors play around in them, before I got shouted at in post-game. I guess they get bonus BP plus there's a tome for it.
If I give someone gate, I will let them escape in one though :)
@Grumblephant said:
When playing Killer, I usually screw around in a snowman if I'm way ahead of schedule, multiple hooks, No gens done, etc. Especially during Nightfall as Dredge, you can tell Survivors get spooked when you pop out of snowman in the darkness. I could always get a couple of high fives or whatever.
As survivor. Nope, nothing but smacked around and put on a hook. I literally only use the snowmen to hide from the killer. Oh well, can't expect a serial killer maniac to have festive fun all the time.
I've found a handful of uses for them on survivor. They are basically an extra locker for avoiding aura reading, and you can use them to completely block certain projectiles if you use them as cover.
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@ByeByeQ said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3297500#Comment_3297500
Without the 'concede' option, ragequit and resignation are not a semantic hair apart. A player can get see an unwinnable situation (like a 3gen vs a Knight with CoB, Eruption and Overcharge) and can make a reasonable decision to DC, use the penalty time to spend bloodpoints and move on to hopefully a more fun match. But to you it appears to be a ragequit and you assume most or all of DCs are emotional decisions.
"I almost never see a single quitter in games where I, as the killer, am losing. I almost never see a quitter in games where I, as a survivor, am winning."
Well I have seen DCs in those situations. Had a couple yesterday. It was definitely odd. One was halfway through a game where I was getting destroyed as a Doc.
Anyway this particular discussion and thread derailment with you has run its course. o/
Fair enough.
But I will also say that there's a world of difference between quitting out of a hostage situation and the standard suiciding on your first hook because the killer has 2 hooks at 4 gens.
I've seen a couple of likely actual DCs, but again, these are rare.
Most of the time, it's a DC while being carried or suiciding on the first hook. Generally by the first person hooked.
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@[Deleted User] said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3297287#Comment_3297287
I personally do great, others do too. You base that on your own experience that happen to be commonly shared by many others but we are still nailing on the "wider" vs "small" audience. I am just not a fan of your negative perspective even though I see clear feedback.
Shrug. I'm not going to pretend to like something or think it's good because other people do, or because 'negativity'. Only giving positive feedback is seldom productive. We'd have to see what the kill rates look like next time BHVR gives us the stats, but I'd be amazed if Knight isn't really far down.
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@tippy2k2 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3297501#Comment_3297501
I think it's a fun perk to run but like....well...just about everything else, way more powerful in SWF. If for any other reason, they know that if the killer comes, they should be the one to tank the hit if you've stored up a bunch of energy and you can coordinate on when you should store up energy versus just hammer the gen done.
Mm. All I can say is - enjoy the perk before it catches on, because this is going to get nerfed. Two people running it can pop a gen in a matter of seconds, and in a decent SWF you've got plenty of time to charge it.
It's so bonkers that I wouldn't be surprised if we were reported as hackers.
EDIT: The trick is to get a gen to basically 99%, then charge it, then pop the gen the second you smell a killer.
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@wittedhobby said:
I am devotion 34 and have been playing the game religiously since 2019. I have to say I consider myself a fairly good survivor as well as a great killer. but here recently I have been placed with other survivors that instantly dc on their first down or just pull on hook at first hook and give up. this has always been a thing in dbd but here lately its seems like it is alot worse than ever before. so my question is why am I being placed with these types of survivors when i don"t ever dc and i have been playing the game this long. Ppl that plays the game right shouldn't have to deal with this, especially if they have put in as many hours as me. I'm to the point to where i only want to play killer because survivor is so frustrating because of the dc's and the giving up on hook. Something has to change.
Yeah.
But, a few things.
- DCs, AFKs and suicides are their own problem, and should be penalized a lot more strongly than they are. I'm also convinced this is heavily throwing off kill rates.
- This does not seem to correspond to what killer I'm playing, what perks I'm running and happens just as much with streamers/flans than not. All that matters is 'we might lose this'.
- It's almost impossible to balance Solo versus Killer and SWF versus Killer. Yes, a few more communication tools wouldn't go amiss, but they would inevitably used to be toxic, and it wouldn't prevent the aforementioned AFkers and quitters.
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@johnlikesguns2 said:
So first we got another RE chapter after the sucess of the previous chapter with Nemesis, Leon and Jill. This time we got Rebbeca and Ada,and ofc the most exciting part, Wesker, when the PTB released i couldn't wait for the full release of it. Despite it's buggy release, his power is very fun and he is a well designed killer. About the survivors i don't got much to say, only that some perks are good while the others are meh. But i'm glad we got Ada from RE2R. I can't really remember a chapter that hit as hard as this one. Thank you for reading.
Your Wesker Main.
I enjoy Wesker a hell of a lot. The rest...a bit of a damp squib, all told.
Most exciting patches to me were the meta shakeup and MMR.
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@tippy2k2 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3297488#Comment_3297488
While I have some fun with Potential Energy, it's one of those things where I don't run into Eruption THAT often that I'm willing to sacrifice another perk spot to try to get my solo ass on par with SWFs (seeing as I already feel forced to run Kindred and Bond just to compete).
While Eruption is a huge pain to deal with, I've thankfully noticed that many killers don't do the 3 Gen Eruption Defense thing. I imagine they get just as bored "Death by a Thousand Cutting" us survivors are we get being attacked by a thousand cuts...
When I play in a trio/4man, I always run PE - it's so good in so many situations, but you need a team behind you to really get the most out of it.
That said, while I'm not a big fan of the 'use x perk bandaid style to fix y balance issue', Shattered Hope.
That is all.
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@ByeByeQ said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3297486#Comment_3297486
You don't know or speak for everyone. And not everyone is the same. People DC for different reasons.
Not every DC is a ragequit. They can be resignations.
And believe it or not, unintentional DCs do happen.
Ragequit and resignation are a semantic hair apart, and both have the exact same effect on the game. If there was a 'concede' button...firstly, that would be fantastic, and secondly that would be a resignation. Outside of hostage situations, when you click 'ready', you're agreeing to play the match out. Because not doing so basically ruins the game for 4 other people.
All I can say is this much.
I almost never see a single quitter in games where I, as the killer, am losing.
I almost never see a quitter in games where I, as a survivor, am winning.
This also holds true of the games I see streamers playing.
Why do you think that is?
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@tippy2k2 said:
https://us.v-cdn.net/6030815/uploads/TSKHRBKWAVD6/471.jpg
Every time I've seen it, it turns into a boring slog of a game where the killer desperately defends three generators like there is a bomb planted in their necks that'll go off if the gates get powered.
Eruption can take a long walk on a short plank
Easiest way to counter it - Potential Energy (a perk I predict is going to be far more of a problem than Eruption once it starts getting used more). In a SWF, this thing is godly. In solo, it can be used to pretty damn effectively counter Eruption. Keep track of which gets have Eruption, run away after the person being chased gets hit the first time and start storing energy from the nearest gen. As soon as they go down, run back and dump your stacks.
I've yet to see it fail in an SWF situation. This is also mad strong for breaking a 3gen.
@Blueberry said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3289294#Comment_3289294
Isn't everything a solo queue crusher?
If anything is made not to be too strong in solo queue doesn't that end up making it quite weak against swf?
This this this.
Sadly, the game cannot be balanced around both solos and SWF, and SWF has to be the target, otherwise SWF is unstoppable or perks all have to be bad and bland.
What solos need is some of the SWF tools (marks, pings, status icons) and easier methods to put together an SWF.
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@ByeByeQ said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3297397#Comment_3297397
I'm sorry were you replying to me? Because you didn't actually respond to anything in my post that you quoted.
I said "reduce" not "eliminate." You do know the difference, yes?
Anyway back to the topic at hand, Wraith is fine.
Yeah, I did. But okay, let me try again.
In a nutshell - people don't quit games because there's some balance issue or a specific perk being used. People quit because they're losing the game, and because there is nothing to stop them.
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@Tsela said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3296844#Comment_3296844
well every newer survivor becomes not a new survivor after a while right? We can't balance a game over new people, who aren't playing yet, or just started. Only on the current playerbase and how they use things.
Shrug. I was just saying why Self Care is popular - and you didn't just see it on newbies either. Now - it's an actual newbie trap, in that you'd be better off with a brown medkit than an entire perk slot ability.
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@Sycamore said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3297296#Comment_3297296
I mean, people expect a Killer as simple as Wraith, or Legion. Their power makes them good at one thing, and isn't filled with utility that can be used in numerous different ways in many different situations. The Knight has 3 different abilities built into one power, and everyone just expects to use all 3 for the same thing. The first step is using each guards strength for it's intended purpose when you can juggle that and use them efficiently during chases - you wouldn't even have an issue with Knight. From there you learn to adapt his guards to other things. Then the only complaint you will hear is the Survivors couldn't do anything because of too much pressure.
Lol maybe I should stream, but I haven't done anything like that since I played competitively.
Yeah, stream. Very curious as to how you're beating a decent 4man on Knight on Mother's Dwelling (yes, that was my afternoon and why I'm fiddling on the forums instead).
Legion? Sure. Pretty simple.
Wraith? Ehh...at the higher end he has a surprising amount of nuance and complexity, in terms of bodyblocking pallets, how to approach and when to decloak.
Do they? The game is pretty up front about what those guards are for - although they could probably be more accurately described as 'use this guy to break pallets', 'use this guy to chase' and 'use this guy on basically anything to get back to the break pallets guy'.
I've not only been playing Knight, I've been watching Otz's and Tofu's Knight videos and...they are obviously better players than me, but they aren't doing anything that different - they're just better at the M1 killer chase thing.
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@ByeByeQ said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3297291#Comment_3297291
You are welcome to your opinion.
When I said "if those core issues were addressed [DCs] would happen less often" I consider it a statement of fact, not opinion.
For one, DbD is coded so poorly that unintentional DCs happen far more often than they should.
I am not even going to elaborate further than that because encouraging negative behavior like DCing is against forum rules and I think some of my points could be interpreted as breaking that rule.
To address your defense of Eruption, it isn't just a problem that Eruption is strong. It's a problem that Eruption got buffed and other slowdown perks got overnerfed. It's that Eruption is top of the meta and also that Pop and Ruin got dumpstered. If killers want to use the best slowdowns they are forced into about 4 different options which is awful for match variety and leads to more complaints because players are seeing Eruption every other game now.
Well yes. Letting survivors win more would reduce DCs by reducing losing games, but that would be hardly fair to killers. Why punish killers for survivors behaving badly?
And no, it's not 'code' and it's not 'Eruption'. Want to know how I know?
I play a lot of DbD. I play maybe 60/40 killer/survivor these days.
On killer, I generally run pretty fun, memey builds, and occasionally switch to something nastier if I'm against an SWF or just a tough looking team. I also bring flans on about 50% of my killers.
I get a DC, suicide or AFK in about a third of my games. That's about the best case scenario - it can be much worse, but seldom much better.
The funny thing - those quitters happen whether I'm playing soft or hard, bring flans or no flans. They'll happen whether I'm playing Artist, Hag or Wraith.
Because it has nothing to do with what I bring - the second it turns out that it might be a loss, or just a difficult game - boom, quitters.
Games with zero DCs? Games I'm losing.
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@Rulebreaker said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3297339#Comment_3297339
We played plenty. On simple decision making (where simple implies less complex mind you) we want you to please explain what you mean.
(Not sure why this is bugging him so much, but surprisingly it is so good job)
Ah, just realized I was being baited.
No worries. Well played I guess.
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@Rulebreaker said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3297319#Comment_3297319
We're gona have to disagree on ring child as we feel we both would end up going round and round if we keep going
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3297296#Comment_3297296
As for complexity, we're going to hard stand that yes, knight is more complex than trapper. Trapper requires brains, but so does knight. Who you have at the ready where you are and what needs done now. Carnifex up and there's an annoying survivor you need to keep busy? Send him and go check other tasks. Stabby man (don't know the name) up instead? Send him and chase. You gotta keep multitasking.
Trapper? Get and set traps where you think you need them then get survivors to the landmine zone. Repeat. This is not taking into account coding complexity. Overall we're calling knight more complex.
We may be crazy, but we do have a point.
Eh.
Trapper is less mechanically complex than knight, but that's not important at all.
In terms of gameplay? Trapper is miles more complex on a simple decision making level.
Uh...not sure how much Trapper you've actually played at a moderate MMR, because that'll only work if you're playing against potatoes.
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@Rulebreaker said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3297287#Comment_3297287
At the risk of going off topic:
While map dependent, sadako is viable without the sluggy condemned build (we don't know what the second build your thinking of is)
The sight and motion sickness is different from person to person. We don't get motion sick from her (though we go blind on Ormond due to it being BRIGHT de manifested)
She has about as much power in chase as gf
Don't think add ons are mandatory, though they make playing her more enjoyable
...hold w happens to everyone who doesn't have mobility for chasesp
What is sucks and doesn't is personal opinions.
All said and done we don't need a 4th knight post as this one is thriving XD
- The maps where Sadako is decent are maps where almost all killers are decent. It's less Sadako being good as the map being bad.
- GF has substantially better chase, because you get a free approach (why does Sadako need a lullaby again?) and, if you're playing right, often an instant down. That's massive.
- No, some things objectively suck. Just because some odd people enjoy them doesn't mean they don't suck (see again, my Adam Sandler Movies analogy).
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@Olokun said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3297117#Comment_3297117
Considering that DH was at 70+% for years without being changed at higher MMRs, surely turnabout is fair play?
Before the patch wich nerfed DH i ve never had a problem with it as killer was counterable , less than now but it was. was nerfed because most killers complained, now with the latency it is miserable. i think the old DH had his place in this new meta.
Was playing some solo queue last night. You see a fair amount of Eruption, but it's certainly not every game.
never said it was every game but i see the same 6 perks every games
i rarely see killers with less than 3 perks generators perks listed above every game while Survivors have more variety of perks unless some like Boons.
Also - people DC'd like crazy before the shakeup. You aren't going to stop people throwing a sulk when they make a mistake, get downed early, face a killer they don't like or just want an easier game. That's not on killers, that's on survivors.
i dont agree totally , there is a lot of more d/c or suicide on hooks now , every 3 games there is a suicide .
Today , 6 hours gaming, never paused the game, i escaped 5 times , Killers mostly done 3 or 4 kills, i counted only escapes.
10 mins a game so 5 games an Hour , around 30 games ,5 escape let you count the escape ratio how this is fair ?
Game was well balanced before new SBMM update for SoloQ than Now .
Okay, going point by point.
- You...don't think that there was anything wrong with the old DH? Well, you're certainly alone there mate. But my point is people keep bringing up how often you see Eruption, without realizing that DH was over triple that rate.
- It was nerfed because *it was dictating the entire meta at any MMR above intermediate*. Again...70% usage rate? Why do you think that was?
- Well...yes? Regression perks are how the killer meta has worked for years now. Because anything that isn't regression is aura reading, and anything that isn't aura reading is - at best - gimmicky and mediocre. About the only lethality perk I can think of worth running on a few killers is STBFL - which, before the Eruption QQ train left the station, was the current topic.
- Also - I almost never see Pop anymore. I'd say I see more Deadlock than DMS/PR, a good few Overcharges and Surges and the rare Pentimento. That's...what? Nine perks? That's the best it has ever been. Do you mean 'I want all regression perks nerfed?' because that's not going to happen without massive buffs to killer lethality or a bigger nerf to gen speeds.
- Let me clarify - I saw as more DCs in *losing games* before as I do now. BHVR wanted to increase kill rates, so the amount of losing games went up and so did the quitters.
- Were you playing solo? If so, that's your issue. This game cannot and should not be balanced around solos, because that makes SWF unbeatable.
- But okay, let me explain the math. Otz did this infinitely better, but I can't find that video now sadly. Basically, kill rate is over 50%, which is where BHVR wants it (of course, if you took out quitter games this number would be much lower, but that's another discussion). This accounts for both solo and SWF. Going by BHVR's numbers, SWFs are about 10% more likely, overall, to escape than solos. So the solo survival rate is about 40%.
- This means that you're going to have losing streaks due to bad luck. But...in those losses, do yourself a favor and count how many of those were caused by another survivor either giving up, going AFK, DCing or suiciding. Because my last few survivor sessions, playing solo, when I removed those I had an escape rate of maybe 50%. Which is fine.
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@nexty said:
HI
Is anyone having bad abuse over the mic because your taking down survivors and not allowing them to just run free?
The last month on xbox i've had nothing but abuse due to me not standing there and just allowing players to fix the generators and escape, if i take any down i get "camper" abuse yet i'm not camping, i'm running around taking them down, i've had "i'll report you for abuse and camping" (yes i've just put them on block) Its mainly guys old enough to know how the game is meant to play than the kids.
You can't turn the mic off?
Seriously, I enjoyed this game 100% more after I made my Steam profile private. And now you've got Anon mode.
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@Rulebreaker said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3297001#Comment_3297001
Less complex than trapper or billy? Really? Making a killer who can summon 3 goons with different values and 1 with an extra ability is less complicated than making one who places traps... We must be insane to think knight is complex...
Absolutely, yes.
It's not about the complexity of the numbers. The numbers are easy to work out, and the game basically handholds you with 'this is the breaker guy, this is the chase guy, this is the patrol guy'.
What makes Trapper a lot more complex to play is that you need to know which traps are worth retrieving at any point in time, where to put them on every map, which also depends on tiles and which gens are done, and then how to chase people into them.
Knight's entire playstyle could probably be written as a single If/Then/Else statement.
@Sycamore said:
I still have yet to have an issue playing as Knight. What I am tired of however is how every time they release a Killer that does anything other than Chase, down, hook, chase. It's too hard of a Killer to learn how to play The Knight requires you to be aware of and perform multiple things at once. While you're mid chase with Meg, you're sending Carnifex to beat a gen, pallet, or door. While you're scouting for Survivors, you're sending Jailor to patrol two gens, or a high traffic area. Etc. A lot of people get on knight and think they are just as simple as Find Survivor, drop guard, chase survivor. Like that's gonna do anything - because it won't. The point of the guard isn't to chase survivors the same path as your guards. Use the pincer method, or send your guard off to distract another survivor for a while. Use the guards to force survivors into corners, or push them to unsafe locations.
High utility Killers require more planning through, and out of the box thinking.
Nobody is saying that Knight is too complex. He's not complex at all - and that's the problem.
Yes, a killer that can't hook, down and chase is going to be a bad killer, because *that's literally what a killer does*. It's like saying 'oh, this vacuum cleaner you bought doesn't clean, but we're not taking it back because it's great for holding up your wobbly table'.
Do you stream? Because I'd love to see the survivors you're facing or if you're just doing something vastly different to me.
- You send the Carni off to kick a gen. This does nothing, because survivors will immediately be back on it. So you save it for a pallet break. Only now, you're an M1 killer until Meg drops a pallet. Yawn.
- You send Jailor off to patrol gens. He doesn't last long, and survivors can just avoid him with the massive, visible ring. And you're an M1 until he's done. Your power, once again, has done literally nothing but stall the game out a few seconds.
- I don't think your strawman here is representative of either me or literally anyone I've seen trying to play Knight.
- Pincer method doesn't work unless the survivor is silly and tries to loop you around a large structure and continues to do so while being pursued. A savvy survivor just runs off the second he hears the summon start, and by the time you've caught up you needn't have bothered.
- Yes, maps with unsafe locations are fantastic, aren't they? Tell me, where exactly do you push someone to on Cowshed, Mother's Dwelling, Badham and Eyrie?
Sure, some people can do well as Knight. But those people can also do as well, and probably better, on literally any other killer in the game.
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@ByeByeQ said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3297162#Comment_3297162
DCs are a symptom of bigger core problems that DbD has and that's why DC penalties are pretty light compared to other games.
Yes DCs would still happen if those core issues were addressed but they would happen less often and then could be punished more harshly.
Bloodwebs taking so damn long is even a contributing factor to the DC rate since players can just spend bloodpoints to wait out the DC penalty, time they have to waste anyway.
I completely disagree, because I've played a lot of multiplayer games over the years and any game that doesn't have pretty severe penalties for quitting is completely ruined by them.
I mean, off the top of my head:
- WoW's dungeon finder being almost impossible to do anything on because the second you encountered anything even slightly challenging, or someone came in without being massively overgeared for the instance, you'd have someone quit.
- League of Legends, before they added LeaverBuster.
- Any Starcraft 2 custom multiplayer map inevitably has to add some sort of makeup mechanic for quitters, because...every single game.
I could go on, but basically...Google any team based multiplayer game, and it either has penalties for quitters or massive problems with quitters.
I don't accept that people who DC/suicide/AFK are doing it because there's something wrong with the game. Outside of rare hacking/hostage situations, DCs are entirely because people will always do this if there's nothing to stop them.
Also - blaming bloodweb times for DCs is absolutely bizarre.
@sizzlingmario4 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3297128#Comment_3297128
Pre-nerf Ruin was so much healthier than the current meta. Ruin only gave you as much pressure as you were able to apply yourself through good killer play. It didn’t do much of anything if survivors weren’t forced to leave gens. Meanwhile with Eruption I can commit to some horrible chase and still win games because downing someone eventually is going to give me 9 seconds of regression per kicked gen plus 25 seconds of survivors not being able to progress the game. It disproportionately affects solo players more and has way too high reward for how easy it is to use.
Really though, I just want the game to be less perk-reliant on both sides. The power level of 3 or 4 slowdowns in a build is ridiculous. Fix that, and address all the strong gen-rushing perks and toolboxes too. I’m not saying BNPs and commodious toolboxes are okay either, because they’re not. It sucks being a survivor against multiple slowdown perks with a chill build, but it also sucks being a killer with a chill build and facing sweats who possibly sent you to a bad map too. So both sides are encouraged to bring better tools, not because they want to, but because they feel it necessary to keep up. And that cycle is unhealthy for the game.
That's not really what I'm talking about. Be it healthier or not healthier, there was at least one QQ thread about Ruin on the front page at any given time.
Is Eruption strong? Sure. But things can be strong, and it's pretty damned unfair to nerf every killer perk that is slightly above average while letting Dead Hard rule the game for years and only nerfing survivor perks when they are literally game-breaking.
I'm sick and tired of stuff being nerfed because of the vanishingly small minority of players that complain incessantly on the forums. None of the threads are even really feedback or suggestions, they are mostly 'I lost to this, so nerf it into the ground'.
Yes, as you can probably tell, this gets on my nerves. Because nerfing that perk doesn't end it - it just shifts it to the next most commonly used killer perk.
Your next bit would be fine, if *and only if* BHVR balanced killer perks and survivor perks the same. The game being less perk reliant would be an interesting direction, but it would also probably make the game a lot blander.
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@[Deleted User] said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/358367/the-knight-what-went-wrong
So what is awful about Sadako?
What if I happen to say that Artist is the worst killer ever made (just an idea, not actually giving my thoughts).
Do you understand that BHVR may not hit the nail for a wider audience but smaller for particular chapters and it doesn't make them anyway bad. Bug wise, we can agree.
I've spoken at length about Sadako in multiple threads. But in a nutshell:
- Only viable with one or two extremely unfun gimmick builds that could be better called 'haha everyone depips'.
- Janky teleporting that is extremely reliant on RNG.
- So small that it's impossible to see anything on grassy maps unless you set the game to Low and gives you motion sickness.
- Weak power that's almost useless in chase unless you equip mandatory addons.
- Mandatory brown addons to make her feel even slightly decent.
- Completely incompatible with the current Hold W then use Ex perk meta.
Not saying she's the worst killer ever made (that's probably Trapper) or even the worst recent killer (that goes to Knight). But she still sucks.
And yes, some people might be okay with a killer that sucks, because they like the visuals or being a snowflake, but some people like Adam Sandler movies, and that doesn't mean Adam Sandler movies aren't terrible.
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@FlameGNG said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3296594#Comment_3296594
Well yes 10 minutes was a little over exaggerating but its still minutes and not seconds we're talking about 2 - 5 minutes. However i had two 10 minutes queues yesterday...
Were surviors ridiculously overpowered? Well i dont really think so. I mean yes if you go back to 2016 - 2019 sure but 2020 2021 was much better. Its way more balanced now the problem i think is lack of communication. If they manage to get the communication right they could even nerf survivors a little more. With communication i dont necessairly mean voice chat it can be as little as seeing when a teammate is on a gen (the HUD) or healing. Something that gives you a rough idea if you should go for the save or anyone else.
Yes its hard to balance because if you buff one thing you might affect every other killer in the game even thos who dont need it yes.
the BM well. I dont see that many teabags. i also miss the clicky clickys becuase it was so fun to ignore them and watch them try their best to get a chase :D. But i'd say that survivors BM more than killer however BMing as a killer is more "toxic" depedning on how you do it i mean teabagging at the exit gate whatever chase them out hitting someone on the hook well... Slugging them for 4 minutes tho thats just a waste fo your and their time
I started playing in early 2020 (I think - Pyramid Head was coming out) and survivors were absolutely, brokenly overpowered far beyond anything right now. I mean, off the top of my head:
- OoO gave any SWF permanent wallhacks.
- DS was basically an extra life.
- Any lobby with more than 1 key was an automatic 'nope'.
- Every map had 2 or 3 spots at least where a survivor couldn't be picked up (but could still be healed), and you'd have to either slug camp them or give up, because they'd do this deliberately, all the time.
- A few maps had spots where survivors could get and be unhittable.
- Pseudo-infinites, especially on Haddonfield and Badham houses.
It was awful to be a killer, which is why killer queues...honestly, until recently, were always instant.
Yeah, 'clicky clicky' was fun unless you had even mild photosensitivity issues and had to stop playing because of the migraine.
Slugging...whatever. It's being changed soon, and yes it's annoying. But at least you can just grab a coffee, it's not like 2020 where a survivor could essentially prolong the game forever because they'd found a spot where you couldn't hit them and two people climbed in and went AFK.
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@Omans said:
Even when Wraith was at his strongest he was fine. What isn't fine are the perks mentioned (Eruption being the main culprit). They give wins to killers who perhaps didn't deserve to win the game due to how oppressive they are.
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3296514#Comment_3296514
Wraith is criminally underrated. It is becoming more and more apparent you don't actually understand the game as well as you think you do. And please stop saying Eruption is fine. It is as foolish a thing to say as if you had said old moris and keys were fine.
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3297133#Comment_3297133
Sort of like posters pretending mass D/C's have been the game's biggest issue rather than its real problems.
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3297060#Comment_3297060
Not even remotely true. Like, at all.
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I'm rather tired of posters who don't know what they are talking about being confidently incorrect. Like, if you aren't sure then just don't say anything. Why make things up?
Oh, boy, where do I start here?
- Eruption isn't old moris and keys, which I've never defended.
- Eruption is strong against solos, but completely fine against SWFs. And this game cannot be balanced around solo play.
- Let's be honest here though. BHVR nerfs Eruption due to the forum QQ, as they always seem to with killer perks. Do you think that this stops the complaining, or will people just move on to whatever the new meta killer perk becomes? We both know the answer to that.
- Mass DCs/suicides/AFKs are absolutely the biggest problem in the game - they cause a ton of losses that should not have happened and inflate kill rates to an insane level. I run weird perks, play weird killers and generally bring flans. I don't tunnel or camp outside of EOGC. I still see a suicide or a DC in...honestly, maybe 30%+ of my games. How is that not a problem?
- Wraith is a 'C' tier killer. He's incredible at stomping newer players, but experienced teams can run rings around him. With the right flashlight addons, you can burn him before he decloaks.
- He's not Trapper or Knight levels of bad, but he's still very mediocre.
@Omans said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3297139#Comment_3297139
The ability for one side to choose to have a decided advantage before the game even begins (OP killer with best addons, strong swf team with map offering, 4 toolboxes/medkits, etc).
Maps (mostly favor survivor, but some configurations favor killer too)
MMR being absolutely terrible. I have over 6k hours and I was recently matched with someone who went down in under a minute on an outside map to a Myers who hadn't yet powered up to stage 2 (was not grabbed off a gen).
Hackers (the asian server is absolutely littered with hackers.)
Maybe I'm missing another big one, but the reasons listed above certainly contribute to any D/C's that may happen.
No one has fun in games that are already all but decided before they begin. I don't D/C unless I meet a definite hacker, but I don't completely blame players who do. The game, even after all these years, is in such a sorry state.
- Yes. But that's been the game since it's inception, and probably not something you can change. Like...how would you even fix that? Let survivors see killer perks/offerings and vice versa?
- Maps...sure? But I'd say that for every time I lose because I got sent to Badham, I win 3 games because the first person I downed either suicides, goes AFK or DCs.
- MMR will never be perfect, but it's a million times better than RBMM. Yes, there are some weird matches here and there - but these tend to be a product of a long queue time or lobby dodges.
- Dodge any 'full' lobbies you get dropped into, or lobbies where someone leaves and you'll see what I mean.
- MMR was a little bit more consistent before the changes, but people were complaining about queue times.
- Again, most of the time you can't blame DCs on anything besides players sulking and being BM. Again, I'm probably the nicest, fairest killer you'll run into all day, and I still get DCs, AFKs and suicides out the wazoo. This is a matter of there being either only really petty penalties or none at all for quitting and spoiling the game.
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@Tsulan said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3297128#Comment_3297128
Imagine how those people would feel playing back in 2017 with omniblink Nurse, insta kill Moris (no hook required) and the old Ruin that required perfect skillchecks to continue with normal repair speed.
It really looks like people ran out of things to complain about.
Wraith being OP... i can´t even...
I started in 2019, I think (or was it 2020? Pyramid Head was just about to release) and the game was a mess then on both sides.
- Prenerf DS acting as basically an extra life.
- Every map having 2 or 3 spots where you can't pick up survivors, and they always go down there deliberately.
- OoO in every premade.
- RBMM with the monthly reset was absolutely horrible as a new player, especially a new killer.
- Old Iri head Huntress addon.
- Old Haddonfield with the old infinite.
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@kisfenkin said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3297125#Comment_3297125
Here's how it works from my perspective as survivor. I am the only person that has been hooked. Meg, who has bond, is being chased and leads the killer to my location. The killer drops her chase and chases me to tunnel me out.
Meg is working with the killer. It is a reportable violation of the rules and the evidence showing she has bond proves she knew exactly where all survivors are.
Shrug. If that's really the case, report them with footage.