Quol
Quol
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- Quol
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@TheCrookedMan said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/991522#Comment_991522
I'm sorry but with the use of toolboxes and add-ons ON TOP of skill, it's too easy to just power through Ruin and gen rush anyway. I'm not saying it's useless against veteran survivors I'm saying it's useless against survivors who are good at skill checks and there's nothing that the killer could do about having a pause that's less than a second is nowhere near enough to be counted as good. If people really think this pause and a 2% bonus prevention is enough pressure to warrant it being top tier than, the standards are TERRIBLY low.
Yes they can power through it and yes its not an all mighty perk that stops gen progression. There will be teams that make Ruin look like its not even working. Its not even consistent, you are right that there are a lot of flaws to Ruin, even more than you mentioned. Ive seen killers complain about how bad Ruin is more than survivors.
Yet its used in 80%+ of games, dont you think that speak volumes about how desperately killers need/want ANY kind of perk that applies even a slight amount of pressure early game? Ruin wasnt good because it had some game breaking effect, Ruin was good because it patched a flaw in the game.
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He is neat, i wish he kept going after chainsawing a pallet.
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The reason Ruin was so good was because it applied pressure at the very beginning something killer sorely lacked and desperately needed. For example, look at Corrupt Intervention, a lot use it not because it has a fantastic effect (in fact i would call it average) but because it has an effect that applies pressure right at the start.
Killers need perks that place pressure on survivors right at the start. This is why Ruin is used.
You also shouldnt assume Ruin is useless on veteran survivors. While it definitely had less of an effect, when you get a good skill check it pauses gen progress which means unless you AND whoever is doing the gen with you can hit 100% great skill checks you will get screwed over to the constant pausing.
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Devs have decided that tbagging is over performing after statistics reveal over 80% do it. Their solution? Removing Ghostface's ability to tbag.
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I like using it on Spirit. 16m terror radius out of fights letting me get extremely close and at that point it doesnt matter if they hear the whoosh. 32m terror radius in chases means i have more space to phase without wooshing and more mind game potential (whether its against the person im currently chasing or if i want to switch over to someone else mid chase.)
Doctor is also nice. He had 2 add ons reworked where they increase youre tr if your static blast is ready and decrease your tr when your static blast is on cooldown. With M&A you can fire off 52m static blasts and on its cooldown+out of chases have a tr of 12m.
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He is for now and thats because survivors dont complain about him too much. Once they start complaining then the devs will decide he is not in a healthy spot.
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Ive come across this argument a few times these past couple days "They nerfed Ruin so they might look into gens speeds now" and its disappointed me every time. Devs havent even mentioned anything about gen speeds so why assume they will do anything? Because you hope they do?
When something gets nerfed people will get mad and with something so popular as Ruin no matter what they do there will be hate but the flames were blown way out of proportion because they didnt mention anything about why Ruin was so popular.
On the bright side devs cant pretend they are not biased towards survivor anymore.
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I get what your saying and i agree but from the looks of it there is more to it than just "As a killer main i dont like killer nerfs"
- They changed Ruin without changing why Ruin was used, or even acknowledging it to the fanbase
- The PR was handled so badly that a clear and distinct survivor bias was shown to everyone
This whole ordeal was handled badly which just fanned the flames that otherwise wouldve been relatively smaller.
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Keep playing to see how things work, and what i do afterwards depends on how matches work. If i get gen rushed every other game i might just switch to survivor or a new game. Maybe ill start using NOED?
I dont know. I like this game so i dont want to say ill quit 100% or anything. Maybe ill derank myself and just go after the newbies? The sky is the limit.
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It would be a cool idea but unfortunately this would make things frustrating for survivors.
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What about the new killers? Did you see that blog, one of the benefits listed is that killers need to work harder. Hahaha.
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You made it less frustrating for newer survivors by making it easy for newer players. We understand perfectly well. You are splitting hairs with your explanation and going "Well technically..." the issue is that you fail to understand why it was so popular (or at least never mention any understanding) and that insanely biased dev blog.
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@Aztreonam78 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/972423#Comment_972423
What if Ruin will be based on Dull Totems? All dull totems cleansed - new Ruin is purged. Survivors will spend time for cleansing and gens will regress.
A perk like that sounds nice but the problem is why Ruin was used. It was one of the only perks that affected survivors at the beginning of a match when they are arguably at their strongest and can gen rush at their best. Ruin created an artificial pressure that would hold off the survivors until the killer could start generating their own pressure, its why having Ruin work for "only" 2 min was perfectly fine because by then the killer would already have started building their own momentum.
New Ruin lost its early game artificial pressure and became a dime a dozen late game perks. The fact that its a hex which survivors have been trained to remove on sight for years means the majority of games will have it gone before it can do anything that other perks (PGTW, CI, Sloppy, ect) cant do better.
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@Umbrae_pk said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/972405#Comment_972405
absolutely. Because the data and information would prove wether or not it needs further changes.
What data are you looking for? "Yes the data does indeed show this is a nerf, mhmm exquisite."
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Designer Notes say it perfectly.
- "It is less useful in the early game, but very useful in the late game."
- "The Hex effect persists as long as the related Hex Totem is standing."
Devs know exactly what they are doing. This update is centered around making the newbie survivor experience better at the expense of the killer. They want to give Ruin a strong game delaying effect that is kinder to newbie survivors but are worried about making it a non-Hex and arent confident enough in themselves to find the razor sharp line where everyone is happy.
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@Umbrae_pk said:
A lot of people are complaining about new Ruin, and honestly it's annoying.
Yes, the perk got nerfed.
Yes, it was needed.
Yes, you guys are mad, but suck it up. that's what happens in an online multiplayer game.
This might not how Ruin will be released, it's a test for a reason!
The new Ruin isn't even live yet but you guys are already crying. You haven't even tested it out. Just read the description.
In the meantime, stay quiet and wait for the PTB to come out.
So... your fine with us complaining after the PTB is released?
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The biggest reason there is so much outrage is how obviously survivor biased this update is. You can even see the insane bias in how the blog is worded. One of the BENEFITS listed for the new Ruin is that killers need to work harder. I had to do a double take when i read that. Devs, you cant except people to read that and go "No bias on that one :^)"
If there was something to address the reason why its used then there wouldve been less outrage but in addition to the Doc rework it just feels like an obvious "screw you killer, we are making it easier for survivors"
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Thats just raw stats. For example if 1 survivor DC's any red rank killer worth their salt will have a 100% kill rate for that match. I would rather be interested in seeing the kill rates for matches where there are no DCs.
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I dont understand why they made Ruin into a late game perk and a hex totem. In most cases its going to be discovered/removed before late game.
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Ruin is so popular because it has a strong effect that starts right at the beginning of the match. Survivors are at their strongest at the beginning of game since everyone is healthy, away from the killer and are capable of building 'free' momentum.
But Ruin applies artificial pressure early game that stifles early survivor momentum, its not meant to be a permanent perk. Its popular because its one of the only early game perks. Look at CI, its a pretty bad perk imo but because its an early game perk it sees more use than it otherwise would.
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What kind of masochists would the devs need to be to reveal only half of their plan knowing full well this will piss off a lot of the fan base? Its simplier to assume that they have no future plans to fix gen speeds.
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Freddy hitboxes only seem weird because of his size and 115% speed. If Hag was given 115% speed you would see the same complaints about her.
In general, I dont want the devs trying to "fix" the hitboxes because i feel like it will be made worse there will always be times when you feel like thats BS no matter what they do.
How is the killer too fast? They have been at the same speed they have always been.
I agree some perks would be reworked. For example i think We're Gonna Live Forever should be changed to a 20% boost in BP per gen completed so survivors have a perk like BBQ.
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Its fine.
Not only is it a totem perk but you need to play essentially the entire match with only 3 perks. The effect needs to be really good to warrant its usage. Though its not like i cant see why survivors get mad when they play a match perfectly and get 1 hooked at the very end.
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I see Nemesis occasionally but never the others. Ive only seen Breakout like twice and both were with swf.
Ive also seen Blood Echo on a few Plagues.
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@Kagari_Leha said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/965094#Comment_965094
Forever Freddy was a huge mistake, but I dont see that much of them anyway. It's like Insidious Camping Bubba, everyone think of them when they see a Cannibal, while actually, not that much of them do that.
Thats true you dont see Forever Freddy that much, especially these days, and even then its not what it used to be. Unfortunately Freddy got stuck with that title and at least for the near future there are people sore about it.
Cant do anything but wait it out, hope DC penalties do their thing, and take solace in the fact that most people dont DC on Freddy.
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@Kagari_Leha said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/965084#Comment_965084
Spirit relates to that post (but Freddy aint as "unfair" as her)
Its the forever Freddy build. Even though its been nerfed/removed people still have the trauma.
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Imo its harder to hear the deeper voices compared to someone like Feng. If they dont make her model bigger she would assume the true power of Blendette.
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Freddy he is one of the better killers and he isnt the only killer that has been put on the "DC on sight" list.
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The fact that you put Spirit at the end tells me you have no taste. You probably think Nea is hot.
Myers and Spirit are the best looking killers for each gender.
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Monitor only works on awake survivors and doesnt do anything to sleeping survivors.
Dream World Freddy's lullaby is not considered a TR therefore TR related stuff dont work with it. BT, M&A, and FC are examples of perks that dont work with Freddy.
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@thesuicidefox said:
I would swap Adren and OOO, then move BT to S tier but yea basically this.
OOO is only really strong in SWF against non-stealth killers. Solo or against stealth killers it is good but definitely much weaker.
Adren is IMO the best survivor perk in the game. DS is a close second. Reason being is that killers can reliably play around DS while they can't do the same for Adren. If you happen to be chasing someone with Adren when the gens pop, that's it. They are gone. It also procs after gens pop if you were on a hook, and it let's survivors ignore healing to rush gens. DS might be more impactful on the game, but Adren is more consistent and negates certain tactics (eg. anti-heal).
Also Spine Chill is easy A tier, maybe S tier. It gives you so much info it's crazy.
Also also, while I love the new Kindred, and it is very good, I wouldn't rate it that high. Top of B tier at best only because there are alternatives like Bond or Aftercare that are really strong too.
I never really liked Adrenaline. Sure its effect is nice but you need to play nearly the entire match with 3 perks for it to activate and even then its situational, you might just get exhausted for a useless speed boost, its really good when it works but otherwise... there are more reliable perks whose effects can be used for the entire match like DH, IW, or Kindred.
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Self Care isnt bad, i get that people say its a time sink but i would rather run that than something like Fixated. Urban Evasion is the worst perk, thats true.
I agree with the general placement for a lot on the list.
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@The_Second_Coming said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/952603#Comment_952603
That was an awful comparison. OOF. Those are two completely different scenarios. A cross map hatchet from Huntress, no matter how good the player, is entirely RNG and luck based. A good Nurse is entirely skill. She is S tier.
With the exception of map RNG, hatchet throwing is all skill and is not RNG reliant. Huntress in theory can be a very dominating killer if you land your hatchets but no one is calling her S tier because most Huntress' are not that skillful. I dont like the idea of ranking a killer so high up because in theory they are really good when in reality most are not. Before her nerf i could understand her high ranking but these days i have never seen an overpowering Nurse. Freddy/Spirit/Billy/Ghostface are all killers that have given me more trouble.
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@The_Second_Coming said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/952569#Comment_952569
No, Nurse is definitely S tier. People not being good with her doesn't negate what she is capable of - and she is still the best and most beast killer in the game.
Huntress is capable of cross map gen shots, doesnt mean it makes her S tier. Just because she is capable of being a beast killer if 99% of Nurses are D to C tier can you really call her an S tier killer?
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I like the idea of having individual ranks but they should scale up slightly with your highest. For example if you are rank 1 Oni your Trapper, who you never use, should be a minimum of rank 10.
Because even if you never touched Trapper in your life a rank 1 is still a rank 1 and would destroy any newbie rank 20.
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Nurse should be A or B. People keep looking at the top 1% of Nurse killers but the other 99% Nurse players are not good. I definitely think Spirit/Freddy are better than Nurse.
I agree with how Oni is rated atm but once he gets his buff where he can turn better at the end of his charge he can be B+ easily.
Hag should be higher, it doesnt take much to learn good trap placement and she can do well with map pressure and shutting down chases.
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Yea i enjoy it, it can be difficult sometimes but the feeling of slowly gaining control of the game and getting the 4k is worth it. Going survivor isnt bad when i want something casual and chill.
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Sometimes, it depends on how fast i can start injuring people and the size of the map.
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From the data that the devs showed it seems that they are content with killers having ~65% kill rate so its slightly killer sided, but they failed to properly take into account/balance highly skilled swf. So you have killer mains looking at the top 10% survivors (highly skilled swf) confused at how this is fair, while the rest of the 90% survivor plebs are looking at killers confused at what they are talking about.
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/106566/stats-november-2019#latest
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Its been a long time since something DBD related was scary but thanks OP for giving me nightmares.
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From what i have read no. Removing the need to switch modes will definitely help a lot (hopefully he sticks at 115%) The thing that will make him A tier or not is what types of basekit debuffs his madness will give.
Reverse skill checks are a neat idea but after a week i doubt they will pose a challenge to anyone that has some experience, which is ironic since this rework is supposed to help tone down how annoying Doc is to newbies, but reverse skill checks will only be useful on newbies.
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My current build is: Ruin, BBQ, Stridor, Sloppy/PGTW
Stridor increases the sounds of pain by 50% (countering Iron Will) and regular breathing by 25%. Some say its a crutch perk but its a very good perk to use with the current sound issues.
Ruin, BBQ, Sloppy, PGTW, Nurse's Calling are all great as well.
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@MrsMaliciousX said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/944935#Comment_944935
its not...if a killer isn't running an obession perk and someone is the obession..EVERYONE gets slugged
Its always funny how the community adapts to certain changes in a way the devs did not intend. The hatch was meant to give the final survivor a chance yet most just slug the third and hunt the 4th. DS was meant to be anti tunnel but people just tunnel and slug for a minute.
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Both side can do "efficient" things that annoy the other side yet arent against the rules. If you dont like it get DS, i hear its an anti tunneling perk, apparently.
Also face camping a hook is penalized... slightly.
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I wouldnt mind it, i was kind of surprised back when i realized they coudnt do that.
Though i doubt anything would change, if your the last survivor left the killer would just face camp you until you go into struggle phase, and if you get lucky they would just down you immediately.
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Because the gens arent scaled to skill level.
The gens are fine for everyone involved when the survivors are new or have a moderate amount of experience. But survivors that have essentially mastered gens can rush through them.
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Mori. In this case i hooked 1 to locate the other via BBQ then mori'd the final survivor infront of the struggling survivor. Merry Christmas to everyone, especially these 2.
https://twitter.com/i/status/1210006348915568640 -
@toxic_clown said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/912592#Comment_912592
to be fair, i dont care about you either, so.
Exactly. I dont care about you ether and i dont hate you, the idea that disagreement/conflict means hate is a bad way to think. No one here thinks BHVR hates us and your wrong to assume we think this way.
BHVR favors money and they do thinks to make more money. No one here ever thought they were doing things out of malice.
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I like Billy's sweater. Though its kinda hard to be in a Christmas spirit when the present the devs give you (which you need to buy, mind you) is followed by them taking bits away. Im not angry or anything but its hard to be in a festive mood.