PiiFree
PiiFree
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They could balance it by giving Killers chests aswell, with a chance to drop mori's or other ORIGINAL, NEW stuff! Such WOW!
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You shouldn't just look at match results, you should look at the gameplay that resulted in such a match result.
If survivors play like brainless monkeys, it's obvious that the match will result in a quick 4k.
If the Killer plays like a brainless monkey, it's obvious that the match will result in a quick 0k.
Those matches are irrelevant.
Find a match where both the Killer and the Survivors had similar skill, similar loadout and both sides made no major mistakes. That's when a match should end in a 2-2.
For example a SWF like the depip squad against everyones favourite ZubatLEL. Make sure he plays ALL Killers for several matches and compare the match results.
That would reflect balance of Killers in a high skill environment.
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@Broosmeister said:
Laakeri said:
No Mither can be viewed as cocky perk, just like OoO."I dont need 2 health stages to beat you" so maybe thats why you got camped?
Wait what? Is no mither unacceptable too nowadays?Re-read what Laakeri posted and then try to understand the meaning of it.
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@Sinner said:
I haven't said it wasn't a problem. Quite the contrary, I mentioned there were survivors the likes of Ochido that were considered toxic and looped. Than, out of a sudden, few weeks after Leatherface release, everyone started doing it. Did you even bother reading everything I said?I expected you guys will come here laughing. Because you either weren't playing back than, or you just started and you didn't understand the game dynamics yet, either not playing billy or nurse at rank 1, either not playing survivor at rank 1. That's why you have no knowledge on the matter. I do, since I was playing survivor at rank 1 and I remember very well how the game changed.
What are you talking about? People were looping since 2016, they just went from infinites and window loops over to pallet and window loops. It was not needed to loop pallets because there was no bloodlust, slow vault for Killers and literal infinites. Pallets were used to win time or to stun Killers.
The main difference was that Survivors actually knew how messed up all that BS was so they rarely used them in order to provide a fun experience for everyone. These days people just don't care anymore and do whatever it takes to make the match as annoying as possible for the opposite side.
Almost as if it's some kind of payback for taking away their infinites. "Alright, you took our safe spot aka infinites, now we're going to make it as annoying as possible for you in return!".
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Just use Discordance!
LMAO that's ridiculous.
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@Vietfox said:
No, i meant this thread.I'm collecting hate in this thread? Explain.
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@ScottJund said:
If Zubat used omegablink they would lose almost every single time, guaranteedWhat if he played anything other than Nurse?
I get the impression that you think Nurse is the only Killer that can deal with high ranked Survivors?
I'm not sure if we can call the game balanced if there's only one Killer that can actually deal with them.
I'd say Nurse is balanced if not broken (depending on add-ons) but all other Killers are weak when facing competent Survivors.
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@Vietfox said:
The thing is that when people talk about balance they seem to focus more on the perfect survivor squad and ignore the perfect killer.We all know what happened when "perfect Killers" played against the depip squad.
I'd argue that Nurse is capable of creating a somewhat balanced playground but ANY other Killer will be at a massive disadvantage.
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@Vietfox said:
Have it your way then, keep collecting hate.I assume you're refering to another statement of mine regarding profile comments? Let me tell you this:
Violent games were (and still are) often used as a reason for shooting rampages ect. but we all know that it's not the games, it's the society we life in that creates psychopaths. For many gamers, gaming communities are a big part of the society, just like this community.
Profile comment are a good way to represent this community. I don't care what your opinion regarding cyberbullying is but whenever a friend asks how dead by daylight is, I tell them to read through my profile comments and decide on their own.
DbD is not a game for people that are easily affected by words and the amount of kids playing this game is scary enough. The fact that you can wish someone to get cancer or that their kids get raped to death - without any punishment - is simply shocking.
It needs adressing and that's exactly what OP was doing here. Even if it's just a word filter or something like that.
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@Vietfox said:
Actually most of the people who said game should be balanced around good player are killer mains.As far as i know many survivor streamers are derankers, so i would say that doesn't count. And even if it did, it's just one survivor escaping, what about the other 3?
That's exactly what I'm saying.
If you match 5000 hours against casuals with <500 hours, we all know what's going to happen.
Now let for example Zubat play against JenDenise, Ochido, No0b3 and whatever they're all called and see what happens. That's "high skilled". And if you balance around high skilled, you gotta make sure that they're actually skilled and not just some boosted Rank 1 scrubs like the majority of this community.
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@Vietfox said:
And this kind of questions are pointless. What is op expecting from this thread?
PvP games are like that, they shouldn't but it's the way it is. Best thing op can do is to report them and move on.
This thread just promotes more hate towards one side and we are forgetting that we are all players here, meaning that there are jerks on both sides. I've been called toxic, to kill myself or die from cancer just because i survived. Do i come to the forums and complain about it? No, i have a good laugh, report them and maybe post the screenshot in the off topic subforum so everyone can have a good laugh.No, you come to the forum to complain about players complaining about that.
I don't know what's better or worse but both things are useless. It's a discussion forum after all, where people exchange opinions. If the topic is not relevant to you, you can simply ignore it.
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@ForeheadSurviors said:
Based on how you’re assertive on these type of people playing against “ highly skillled killers” while they’re running no perks or anything and they win every match keep in mind their name is “ depip squad” lol meaning they’re jumping down to low ranks to play against noobs,i would assume you’re gullible and wouldn’t be surprised if you believed the earth is flat.I get the feeling that you didn't even take a single minute to check them out.
They are called Depip Squad because they DEPIP Killers. All their matches were played in the red ranks.
The fact that you just claimed those things even though I provided enough informations for you to
a) figure out they were actually playing in highest rank possible and
b) check them out
is just really sad, but it also made me realize that you're not worth my time because regardless of what evidence people provide, you'll stick to your opinion.
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@Vietfox said:
I've seen Umbra_bug, she's a beast with the huntress. She gets 3-4K in almost every match, 2K when survivors are good.
It's funny how people use Tru3's video as an example of poor balance, i guess we gotta balance the game around killers without perks and addons, what could go wrong when using perks and addons?
It's funny that you always pick the top killer streamers to justify balance.
Let's take a look at No0b3, who just managed to get 50 escapes in a row. Let's also not forget all the other Survivor streamers with escape rates of 80% and higher.
It's simple to look at streamers that made it their job to play Dead By Daylight and use them as a reference for balance when you watch them stomping casuals.
Have you ever watched streamers play against each other? Whenever I see that, they play like pussies because they don't want to destroy and embarass the other streamer.
It appears to me that most players in this community simply never played in a coordinated SWF. If they did, they would have realized how broken it is.
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@Vietfox said:
Why killers keep hiting hooked survivors even when no one has BMed them during the whole match?
Anyway, don't let this ruin your post, you guys can keep commenting how evil survivors are.That has nothing to do with this topic.
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@ForeheadSurviors said:
All this shows is how broken nurse is , without perks and add ons and still getting 2kHave you ever heard of the "Depip Squad"? You should take the time to google it.
Basically a team of 4 Players, Killer mains (afaik), that spent a lot of time playing in that team to make a point.
They made 3 experiments and one of those experiments was; playing survivor with no perks and no add-ons.
They streamed 100 matches under these conditions and they won almost all of them.
Now that you have this knowledge, let us look at your statement again. A perkless Nurse that manages to get 2k is the result of a broken Killer. If that was true, then can you tell me what conclusion you get if you see a team of perkless survivors playing over the course of hundred matches while constantly winning matches against fully slotted high rank Killers?
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@Peanits said:
Not really. When the killer immediately leaves after they lose a match (before anyone can even say GG) people just think they're mad. It's not really toxic.If I had to guess, I'd say that Killers that leave the endgame chat quickly had experienced different chat conversations than just a fair "Good game".
Maybe a "gg as in, git gud", "Ez" or "baby killer" are more accurate in case of a 0k match but that's just my wild guess to explain such Killer behaviour.
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@Peanits said:
Post game, where you click the button to go back to the menu.Oh, that's what they meant.
I didn't know that leaving the endgame chat quickly is used as a represenation of my hate. Lol!
I hope that's not something "toxic" for Killers to do?? I always leave rather quickly because from my experience, not a lot of good stuff is appearing in that chat.
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@White_Owl said:
And killlers that can't kill anyone usually leave asap or complain in chat about gen rush or swf. People hate loosing, it's no news.How can you "leave asap" when it takes the whole match to get to the point where you realize that you can't kill anyone? lol
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@JammyJewels said:
I presumed you were addressing me. But it’s okay. I do not agree with a squad being an example of balance: the Devs have been trying to design the game around solo survival, not having vocal communication and organisation. SWF’s concept was added out of demand for it and has been said multiple times to not be in the game’s original design, and so comparing the power of an organised group to a singular person is not valid, in my eyes. The four, if they are communicating and know what they’re doing, will always be a more powerful force than the singular person. In solo survival the only way such teamwork could be established would be through natural leadership, through the survivors analysing perks and situations (like noticing someone had Prove Thyself) they face. Good survivors will beat bad killers, good killers will stomp bad survivors. But a good group, an already composed and communicating group, will always beat the good killers. It is only when all four survivors are solo when the true powers of killers are revealed.Do you know that 70% of the matches include Survive with Friends?
Now that you know this, do you think it's better to balance the game around a minority and therefore have 70% of all matches rigged and in favour of Survivors?
Or do you think it would be better to balance the game around the majority and therefore have only 30% of all matches rigged and in favour of the Killer?
Keep in mind that the 30% at a disadvantage have a choice, they can always invite friends to play in a SWF while the Killers have no way to consistently avoid the 70% of rigged matches. Plus if they had a way to do so, it would lead to ~70% less matches because not many Killers would want to play rigged matches.
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Sounds like we're getting tons of very interesting matches during the Event! Hehe!
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@weirdkid5 said:
Only one Prove Thyself buff works at a time. They don't stack."Increases the Repair Speed by 10 % for each other Survivor working on a Generator within a range of 4 metres. Gain 50/75/100 % more Bloodpoints for cooperative Actions.
Survivors can only be affected by one Prove Thyself effect at a time."
Does this mean when 2x2 Survivors work on gens and both teams having one Prove Thyself, only ONE would actually work? My bad then, 30% speed buff for an individual Survivor is acceptable.
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@Aven_Fallen said:
@PiiFree said:
@Aven_Fallen said:
Besides that, the only issue I have with the new Prove Thyself is, that it can be very good for organized SWF, but not as effective for Solo players. If I would use Prove Thyself and I am working on a Gen with another Survivor running it, one of us has a useless Perk at this point. Or, I can simply work alone on a Gen and Prove Thyself does nothing. Or, I need to run Bond, to make it effective. All of those things an organized SWF does not have.
But I think with those, there are other areas where actions should be taken.You should read the description for Prove Thyself again because it seems like you don't really understand how it works. If you have Prove Thyself and work with someone else, you get 10% bonus speed. If the other person also has Prove Thyself, they also get 10% bonus speed. If a 3rd Survivor with prove thyself works on that gen, everyone gets a 20% repair speed boost.
That's the MAIN issue. It's a perk that promotes gen rush and it's a perk that can be used at it's full potential mainly by coordinated SWFs - something that's already imbalanced and hard to deal with while it's pretty much useless for solos.
Well done!
Am I stupid or are you stupid?
"Survivors can only be affected by one Prove Thyself effect at a time."Good question. Does it mean that only ONE survivor at a time can be affected or does it mean only ONE prove Thyself effect can be buffed per survivor?
One would result in an individual 20% boost and the other one would result in 3x 10% boosts.
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You killed them, therefore ruined their fun. This means you were toxic and deserve toxic reactions. That's the mindset many Survivors have and that's also why they flame you.
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@Aven_Fallen said:
Besides that, the only issue I have with the new Prove Thyself is, that it can be very good for organized SWF, but not as effective for Solo players. If I would use Prove Thyself and I am working on a Gen with another Survivor running it, one of us has a useless Perk at this point. Or, I can simply work alone on a Gen and Prove Thyself does nothing. Or, I need to run Bond, to make it effective. All of those things an organized SWF does not have.
But I think with those, there are other areas where actions should be taken.You should read the description for Prove Thyself again because it seems like you don't really understand how it works. If you have Prove Thyself and work with someone else, you get 10% bonus speed. If the other person also has Prove Thyself, they also get 10% bonus speed. If a 3rd Survivor with prove thyself works on that gen, everyone gets a 20% repair speed boost.
That's the MAIN issue. It's a perk that promotes gen rush and it's a perk that can be used at it's full potential mainly by coordinated SWFs - something that's already imbalanced and hard to deal with while it's pretty much useless for solos.
Well done!
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@Peanits said:
This is correct. It was faster in fact because previously the generator speed penalty for multiple survivors working in the same generator was not working correctly. With 2.5.0, that was fixed and it now applies properly. By default, multiple survivors are slower and prove thyself negates that.Short version is that it hasn't really changed, you just need a perk now to do what you could do without a perk before.
Are you saying that for the past 2.5 years Killers were given the illusion that multiple survivors on gens = slower repair speed but that wasn't even the case?
I'm not sure what to think about that tbh.
If you remove the "multiple Survivors" penalty with Prove Thyself, it turn the 33,3s gens into 26.6s gens.
While this doesn't look like a lot, it's actually 20% faster and if you add those 20% up for 5 gens, you skip a whole generator simply for running this perk. It doesn't require anything else.
As a comparision: A Killer requires 4 hooks to get a similar result with Pop Goes The Weasel.
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@BlackReaper said:
@Detective_Jonathan@ModernFable said:
It’s to visualize the “Co-op Deficiency.”When you work on a Gen you do it at 100% speed.
When two people work on a Gen they do it at 180% speed, or 90% each.
Since you’re not repairing at 100% speed individually, they show a red bar.
You still repair much faster together, but that’s the explanation.
you almost right, if you do a gen alone you do it at 100% speed, (grey bar),
but when two repair a gen they get a 20% penalty for both, 10% for each one but it stake for everyone.
example: -1 doing a gen 100%
-2 doing a gen 80% each one= 160%
-3 doing a gen 70% each one= 210%
-4 doing a gen 60% each one= 240%
its a really hard nerf for gen rushing cooperatively and prove thyself block that penalty, read the new description of prove thyself and you will see its how im saying.Did they just recently nerf that?
It used to be 100% / 90% / 80% / 70%.
Resulting in:
1 Surv = 100%
2 Survs = 180%
3 Survs = 240%
4 Survs = 280% -
I'm just sitting here wondering why the powerrole Killer has to be played rather flawlessly to achieve something while it's enough for Survivors to just sit at gens and hit space once in a while to win the match?
I like playing Killer, I like the pressure and the unforgiving gameplay but I must say; if 2 bad blinks and one "not-so-optimal" decision are enough to throw the match, that's way too harsh. Imagine if that was any other Killer besides Nurse? Most likely would've ended up in a 4x escape.
I said it already in another thread: If Survivors can hit great skill checks and priorize gens, they will make most killer depip. There's not much left that you have to learn as Survivor when you know how to use a keyboard & mouse or controller.
Not to mention that those Survivors didn't even play good and still people think that only a truly high skilled Nurse should be able to beat them? That's ridiculous.
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That is exactly what I thought when I read that line.
Closer to what objects? Lockers? Chests? Hooks? Gens? Windows? Pallets? Hills? Other totems?
Totems should be placed far away from said objects, not closer to them. If you put them next to a main objective or secondary objective, Survivors WILL come across them without even having to look for them.
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@micsan said:
If you played Ark official PvP I don't believe that you have not received a single message, lol. Unless you where a super good guy that never killed anyones dinos or raided anyone. That game is literally the worst in regards to other players messing up your progress, which is why I believe that game is so cutthroat and becomes Toxic because of it. That game is the best worst game I've ever played.I do agree that the toxicity is on a completely different level in DbD, I believe it's because of the reasons you stated but also one more key point, most people don't play both killer and survivor at the same rank. This makes people extremely one sided, and since the difference between surviving and killing is so huge, a lot of hate gets thrown to the opposite side.
Saw a reddit thread a while back, "What game has the worst community". DbD was nr 1 on toxicity...It is known that this game has the worst community by people who haven't even touched this game.
Ohh of course there is toxicity in ARK but I didn't get a single profile comment in all that playtime. The toxicity stays ingame, no one cares about your "steam identity". Same in Dota 2 or CSGO, you get flamed in one match but they only very rarely head over to your steam profile to insult you. In DbD it's like normal (almost exclusively for Survivors, I gotta say) to head over to the Killers profile and insult them. A bit cringy imo
...but as I said, that's another story -
Cheaters/Exploiters, Sandbaggers and hook farmers are the only things that can make me DC. Depending on my mood, I probably would've DCed aswell, not even gonna lie.
...either because I assumed it was on purpose or because I thought if it was NOT on purpose, how bad does one have to be to do such things? (no offense, ######### happens all the time but when I'm triggered my tolerance for mistakes is really low)
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First I'd take one of those barrels and use it to climb up an elevated position. Then I'd watch the whole scene from that safe spot right there and when all the work is done I'd roll said barrel to the outter walls, climb it up, do a few squats when the Killer is watching and then I'd escape.
I would do that all day, no probs.
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Allow Killers to disable SWFs and we can do that!
Also, this would affect Survivors aswell, right?
As I see countless Survivors that dodge lobbies to streamsnipe their favourite streamer.A problem I can see with such a punishment: People will just DC during loading screen or even ingame, if that's what you want to promote then go ahead and punish lobby dodgers
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TBH, that survivor loadout isn't sweaty at all. I'd gladly take that over the stuff I get in EU Rank 1. Someone didn't even use an Exhaustion perk, not a single Adrenaline used and only one DS.
As a more ironical note; That killer used a very strong loadout and still didn't manage to kill any of the Survivors that only used regular loadouts? A clear result of the games imbalance!
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@Broosmeister said:
Like i said, i played solo.
There was 1 immersed Claudette, but not immersed in a good way. More like a "i hear 1 heartbeat so i will just hide" kinda way. She rescued me from the hook ( i know, what a brave soul, isn't she? ) she crouched all the way to me and took her sweet time while the killer was after someone else.Players like those are the reason why I can't use any aura reading perks as Survivor. ######### like that triggers me more than anything lol
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You can always trade hooks these days, there is no "idiot proof" camping, especially now with the unhook invulnerability.
Yes, camping is a strategy. Is it a good strategy? Sometimes yes, but most of the time it's not. Is it scummy and unfun? For the Survivors for sure!
...but it's not toxic. It's just a Killer that doesn't give a damn about the Survivors fun / experience, nothing more. Many Survivors don't give a damn about the Killers fun, they do nothing to tune up the experience of the Killers so why should the Killer do that?
Name me one thing that Survivors regularly and intentionally do to increase the fun for the Killer while it actually hurts themselves?
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The only special thing here is that someone actually managed to get a total of 6833 points AFTER escaping.
I've never seen anything THIS low after an escape.
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@Broosmeister said:
It is, killers imply that t-bagging and DS or pointing at the killer is toxic. Why would camping or tunneling not be toxic, i get that a killer sometimes needs to camp or tunnel and i don't say anything about it then. But when there are 5 gens left and your ruin is still up, don't camp and tunnel then. It's just a garbage thimg to do to your fellow dbd player.BuT iTS In tHe GaME. <- ######### argument
No, it's not. Camping and tunneling is the equivalent to gen rushing and looping. Both are valid playstyles that have nothing to do with being toxic. They all serve a purpose regarding the objective. Also, DS is not toxic.
Teabagging and pointing at the Killer are a form of taunting and disrespecting and are therefore toxic. The Killers equivalent is "hitting survivors on hook" or "mori spamming".
You're welcome.
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@micsan said:
This is the case for many PvP games though, if you run a cheesy character or a cheesy strategy that generally requires little skill to pull off compared to how effective it is. Fighting games often suffer from this.This is pretty much what happens to a camper or tunneler.
I'm playing on the same steam account since 10 years and I didn't receive a single profile comment until I started with DbD. I have 3000 hours in Dota 2; 2000 hours in ARK PvP and several hundred hours in other PvP games (CS, CoD,...).
But the toxicity in DbD is another story, not really relevant to the topic (and neither is SWF now that I think about it).
I think we ended up here because people compared "deranking on purpose" with "lobby dodging" which lead to SWF = dodge, which lead to SWF = unfun, which lead to "no one cares about the opposite sides fun".
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Implying that camping and tunneling are toxic :^)
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@ToxicFengM1n said:
yeah, but not always will you be on a gen due to a killer, ######### is this logic you think I follow I said that because the objective is to kill all survivors, not a singular survivor, the survivors objective is do gens and gtfoThat's your logic:
@ToxicFengM1n said:
Camping damages one of your emblems so it is not objective and if survivors know your camping you will loseAnd now I apply the same logic to gen rush:
Gen rushing damages two of your emblems (Evader and Benevolent) so it is not objective and (best part) even if Killers know you're gen rushing there's nothing they can do about it.
EVERYONE is going to lose if Survivors rush the gens.
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@weirdkid5 said:
All this does is further prove that SWF is busted, which you did originally say. However, this strategy is unviable if you are not running in a full 4-stack.Generally most of the time campers are going to get at least one kill, and that's cause Survivors are just stupid.
2x SWF is enough. You don't need to know the hooked guy and the guy at the gate is irrelevant aswell. The only important part is the coordination between the unhooker and the guy that pops the last gen. The guy that gets unhooked should be able to escape because of Borrowed Time and either me or my buddy will get the Adrenaline buff to run away once they're downed.
If we implement such a thing as ingame voice communication, this would be very easy to pull even with 4 randoms.
(That's one of the reasons why I think SWF is incredibly broken and I say that from a SWFs point of view, not even the Killers)
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@weirdkid5 said:
You are still facing Killers who don't know how to counter this, and you yourself are explaining it incorrectly or misinterpreting what I'm saying."Make sure the last guy that goes for the last unhook has adrenaline" Bro that only works for the guy who gets OFF of the hook. You do realize that at least one of you is still going to die right? BT does not activate for the savior anymore, meaning even if you activate BT and Adrenaline on the guy on the hook, YOU are going on the hook because he can hit you twice by the time you unhook the guy, and BT isn't going to save you from that second hit.
The first time you get hit, it cancels your first save attempt, Killer wipes his blade and you save your friend. You get hit again because BT and Adrenaline does not work on the guy who does the saving.
This strat would not work on any Killer that knows what you're trying to do. BT and Adrenaline will save the guy you unhook after the gates are powered, but what do you do for the guy who dies before the gens are done? If you guys just keep swapping out, you will die much faster. And again, since BT doesn't protect the savior, how exactly do you plan to get yourself out after you save the guy who DOES have Adrenaline?
Oh wait, you can't because Adrenaline doesn't work on full health Survivors and BT doesn't work on the savior. So Camping always guarantees at least 1 Kill.
I think you did not understand what I meant.
It's usually me going for the last unhook so this is what's happening:
My buddy is at the 99% gen, the other one is waiting at the exit.
I approach the hook, take a hit (injured), unhook (prog the unhooked guys BT), I get downed again (and the Killer is stuck in "hit reload animation" and at that point they finish the last gen. I get back up again, get a speed boost, run to the (by now open) gate while the others (fully healed now thanks to Adrenaline) can safely take a hit / bodyblock the Killer if the gate is further away.
There is NOTHING they can do unless they're oneshot Killers. In that case we go for the save as 2 guys while one camps the 99% gen. One gets downed, other guy unhooks and depending on the Killers action someone else gets downed aswell and THEN we prog the last gen OR he's going to pick the first guy up, in that case we prog the last gen immediately. It's not hard with voice communication.
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@micsan said:
I mean, in what game does anyone care about other people's fun? Especially in a PvP game.Many players expect you to care, or how do you explain the ~600 comments on my steam profile mainly coming from Survivors complaining about my playstyle? Sounds ridiculous? I've seen Killer profiles with over a thousand insulting comments because the Survivors didn't like their playstyle.
@micsan said:
Some people do think it's fun to be a toxic sabo squad with comms as if they where a SWAT team, but I suspect they are in the minority. I've not spent even close to what you have, I started playing in Oktober and have probably spent 3-4 hours on average every day since then only very recently being turned off due to the [BAD WORD] up queue times for SWF. But, during that time I quickly got to rank 1 and have been playing at this rank for most of my gametime.
My experience with SWFs is the opposite of yours, most of them are just altruistic suicide squads that are farming BP or just goofing around having fun. Also, I play on PS4 so there is no post game chat. This removes a lot of toxicity as people are usually angry or salty after a "bad game"(example being a SWF hugging the hooked survivor and you camp because of this, then they all die because of this) and simply lash out in the post game chat because it's there and available.Fair enough, that's your experience. I can only speak for myself based on my personal experience and that's what I stated in my post. People have to realize that their own experience is not representative for the global dbd players experience. If people refuse to play against SWFs the yobviously have their reason for that. Maybe it's justified, maybe it's not but one thing I can say for sure: Someone that just started playing DbD doesn't even know that SWF exists. They just play the game andone day they'll notice a huge difference in playstyles, that's when they realize SWFs exist and that's the moment when they start to judge them and avoid them based on the experience they leave behind.
@micsan said:
Also a side-note, If the killer is bad enough I know that some players will turn toxic because of this, simply because they are bad themselves and never actually get to be toxic. Friend of mine admitted to this one time and I told him to [BAD WORD] off with that #########.You're the good guy that tries to make DbD a better place but trust me, many friends would join in and give the Killers twice the ######### isntead to not piss off their friend(s).
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@ToxicFengM1n said:
Players enter in and out of the chase when doing generators unless the killers afk or is boosted, really, this is a fact too, I have never entered a match where I don't get into a chase, it just shows that either you are doing gens and playing hide and seek with the killer, and like I said, they are afk or boosted, also wanting to stay rank 1 requires pips I believeDo you know what gen rush means? You're not pointlessly looking for chases, you're doing the gens and gtfo. Any sort of interaction that's not totally required is a waste of time and hurts the gen rush.
One person at a time keeps the Killer busy while the rest rushes the gens. You don't have time to fill up the Chaser points for everyone and don't even get me started with Benevolent. When there's only 1 hook done you won't get ######### in that emblem either.
Gen rush won't make you pip as Survivor and according to your logic, that means it's NOT doing the objective.
Deal with it.
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@weirdkid5 said:
I mean if a Killer just stares at the guy on the hook, and doesn't move unless someone attempts a save, then you aren't really going to get the guy off the hook even with BT. Even if you do, you're going on the hook next because BT doesn't work that way anymore and you're gonna get slapped twice before you even get control of your guy back.Which is exactly what makes you win matches.
You trade hooks to win time and make sure that the guy that goes for the last unhook has Adrenaline. You get hit, unhook (BT activates), you get downed, last gen pops and you get the speed buff and escape.
It's not that hard, we do that all the time in our SWF. We use 4x Adrenaline so the unhooked guy even gets fully healed on top of BT. The last gen is our ticket to a free escape at that point, the Killer has 20 seconds to get the guy down again or we'll escape, which is very unlikely to happen because we'll be ready to bodyblock once the gates are open. Only NOED can counter this, which is also why many players hate it.
That's the flaw of SWF that many Survivor mains refuse to admit.
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@Yamaoka said:
Tru3 chased and tunneled one single survivor for 2.5 minutes without perks/addons. It takes 1 minute and 20 seconds for one survivor to finish one gen. He knows that and even told people to not chase a survivor for too long if you have no ruin. Is this thread some kind of a joke? This isn't gen rush. It's just him ignoring his own advice. 3 people basically didn't notice the killer so of course they're going to work on gens. Now take 3 people and 2.5 minutes. Of course they'll finish 4 gens. That's the result of not letting the survivor go. I never chase for too long if I notice the chased survivor wastes too much of my time. That's how I usually surprise people on gens resulting in quick hooks.It doesn't matter who you chase as good Survivors will easily be able to loop you for 1-2 minutes.
You chase Survivor A for 1 minute. Result is Survivor B, C and D were working on gens for a minute. You don't commit to the chase and instead look for the other Survivors. What will happen? You spend time looking for someone else and the story repeats; you chase them for a minute and in the meantime Survivor A, C and D are working on gens.
You're just switching the player but you can't stop Survivors from looping you by switching players. You can find the weak spot this way, but if all 4 Survivors are skilled you're just switching targets without getting anything done.
That's something most survivors fail to understand. You can chase a looper for 1 minute only to find out the other Survivors are going to loop you for 3 minutes.
It's a huge risky gamble, can I find a Survivor that is not competent enough to loop me? If yes, well played! If no? FML, game is over.
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I don't think many Killers camp with the intention to win, they camp to punish someone and they're willing to throw the match to do so.
A camper should never be able to pip. The fact that they still do pip often is a perfect representation of the survivors incompetence. Nothing is more triggering than getting camped and then watch the other Survivors Urban Evasioning around the hook instead of doing gens. At that point I even salute to the Killer for using the perfect tactic against such idiots. They deserve the loss.
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@micsan said:
It's just sad that such a huge percentage of killers don't realize this and base their entire SWF experience on those few games where they were vastly outskilled and it being a SWF. Even at rank 1 you rarely have people sacrificing their teammates, and I suspect that is because rank 1 people don't give a ######### about rank and a lot of them have p3 everything so they don't care about BPs either.Just because the match ends with a 4k doesn't mean it was enjoyable for the Killer. If it takes me 5 gens to get a hook, that match was certainly not a funny experience for me. Yes, I might get lucky and 4k them, this is a very satisfying ending but the overall experience was just ######### because of those SWFs.
I played in and against many different SWFs and they all have one thing in common. They all claim: "We just play for fun!". Thing is, they don't realize that their fun usually comes at the cost of the Killers fun. I'm guilty of this myself, when I played in a SWF with voice communication I always tried to be that guy to run the Killer for ages while keeping everyone updates about their doings and failures. I did it because it's fun for us and I knew that I was playing with competent players that will be there to safe me or push through gens while I get camped. We will win if the Killer tried to ruin our fun. if the Killer was actually skilled and managed to stomp us, we'd get upset and call them sweaty tryhard.
From my experience, that's exactly how most SWFs play like. They might not be toxic per se but they still only care about their own fun, 4x escape is their number one priority and the Killers experience is mostly irrelevant, which is why I understand Killers that dodge them. If the Killer kills them, they're tryhards that don't know how to play for fun ect....
It's my reflection after 2000 hours of playtime. SWFs are more likely to ruin the opposite players experience than the other way around.
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@micsan said:
If you do chase someone for 2 minutes, and they do 3 gens you are still on pace to win in the eyes of Behaviour who has balanced this game towards getting two kills. Getting a 4k is like getting a flawless victory in a fighting game, by getting 4k the survivors never had a chance.If you think otherwise, there is no wonder why you never feel like you can "win" against survivors.
Thanks for the vid, will watch it later.
A lot of 4k's happen randomly due to incompetence or overaltruism of survivors.
I often have matches where I get one hook when the gates are powered and I still ended up with a 4k in the end because they want the 4x escape so badly. It's more that Killers had ONE chance for the 4k while Survivors had 100 chances for a 3x escape but apparently 3x escape is not enough, so they throw the game and end up with no escapes at all. "Survivors never had a chance" is a very rare case in Rank 1, for a 4k it requires 4 survivors to mess up.
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@ad19970 said:
yeah but they play with friends, not with strangers. I wouldn't want to chat with strangers.That's up to them. If they want to put themselves at a disadvantage in order to avoid communication, that's their decision. The base game should still be balanced around the majority and the majority uses voice communication.
It's like that in every team-based multiplayer; if you refuse to communicate, you'll be at a disadvantage.
