Nobsyde
Nobsyde
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- Nobsyde
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@Peanits said:
If they're running around throwing all the pallets for no reason (i.e. not in chase), just be sure to report them. That would be considered griefing and they would be banned for it.
is it enough to make a post game report, without video proof?
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@fengsad said:
I've been playing for 7 months and I already have 1500 hours in dbd. When I put $200+ in I expected to be able to actually play your game. It crashes regularly for me but I put up with it because I love the game. But now I'm getting hit with penalties that don't let me play at all for increasingly long stretches of time. It's so frustrating to be penalized when I haven't done anything wrong, and there's nothing I can do. My drivers are up to date and all that stuff, and my other games don't crash so I think we know who is to blame.
I still see people DC because they get downed or frustrated. They will wait their little 5 minute penalty and move on - not hurt at all. Meanwhile I'm penalized for playing for any considerable length of time. It feels downright insulting to be told i'm being banned because I "disconnected."
No. I didn't disconnect.
Your buggy glitchy game crashed and you are blaming me. Everyone knows this is one of the buggiest games in existence. Instead of solving that problem which would require time and money, you penalize the players who are affected by the bugs. Nice.
How can I get my money back since I can't play what I payed for?
what are your computer specs?
what kind of connection do you have (optical fiber, ADSL, satellite...)?
how do you connect to your router (ethernet, wi-fi, usb..)?
what OS version are you running?
what error do you get when the game crashes?
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Hey, nobody thanked @Almo , which from what I see is the most active Dev with technical duties in BHVR here.
He exposes himself a lot by explaining certain balance changes / decisions, I myself criticised a few of those replies but hey, better to communicate and disagree than to shut down and... disagree anyway because people assume the worst :P.
So yeah, thanks @Almo !
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I agree in principle to remove the struggle phase: it is only an annoyance which doesn't add anything to the player experience - in fact it just adds to the frustration of the hooked survivor especially if there's a lag spike or a fake unhook which could lead to an abrupt end of the struggling.
This being said, it wouldn't solve the suicide problem at all - players would just run straight to the killer to get downed again (...robbing you of a safe unhook in the process), or even become spiteful to other players.
The only solution to avoid throwing / suicides is a good ranking system, that's what I think.
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@KingOfBadRNG said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1084277#Comment_1084277
There were really good idea in your old post on the forums, but seemed a bit to strict. Now I'm now wondering if this post will be moved.
it was meant to be a change to promote dynamic play style and killer-survivor interaction, plus to avoid a stale mate in 2v1 situations, or even 3v1 with stealthy low ranked survivor. It's really a different concept of the crows: instead of afk crows they become effortless crows or something like that :P.
When I play as survivor I like as well to be stealth, but not at the expense of the game progression.
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Some time ago I made a long post about how to change the AFK crows mechanic ( https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/107256/noise-indicator-crows-change-suggestion ), but for some reason the post was moved by mods in the feedback section, hence noone ever read it :P.
Give it a look.
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PS4 south Europe here.
The game is currently in a downward spiral fuelled by long queues or very unbalanced matchmaking, gen rushing or slugging with infectious fright at 5 generators, moris and keys every other game, NOED everywhere.
Game mechanics are the same as always though, the Oni update didn't introduce anything too new.
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@ScottJund said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1071081#Comment_1071081
1.) 50%. Only generators. I am not balancing it for "4 brand new parts and prove Thyself" because that situation is ridiculous.
2.) Thats not a problem either. If survivors are spending all their time saboing hooks no one is doing generators which means you have an unlimited time to win.
3.) This part sort of implies Trapper doesn't need a buff which almost no one will agree with, no matter how good you are at him. It doesn't really make high mobility killers stronger at all because the effect will end with them immediately due to the fact they can actually get to survivors quickly. The solution of just "changing every non mobility killer" is completely unrealistic and will not happen.
4.) I didn't mention SWF anywhere in this and I'm not sure why you brought it. Even so, four people being in a group or being solo doesn't change the fact that it takes almost an entire generators worth of time to traverse some maps, which is what this is for.
5.) Yes, except Corrupt Intervention, which would start after the Warmup. I am also not sure how you see it solely as a buff for totems because nothing about the totem breaking speed is changed. Hell, it might actually be an nerf for totems since people wouldn't immediately go on generators and instead look for totems.
I'm not sure where the lack of 'creative problem solving skills' comes in. I assure you I have thought about almost every counterargument to this, and in doing so, learned some flaws that had to be addressed (like stalking with GF and Myers, for example)
I really like your idea and I sincerely hope they will eventually implement something similar, but I still think there is some tinkering to do regarding the triggers to end the Trial Warmup: for example, what about The Map, which is on two levels and you, as a killer, don't necessarily have the ability to go from one floor to the other immediately? The 4 meters could be already too much to trigger the end of the Warmup without having an idea of where a survivor may be.
At the same time, if you lower the radius you risk giving an unfair advantage to instadown killers like Hillbilly or Bubba, and, similarly, other killers could be able to induce potato survivors to drop pallets even when not in a chase but very close to the killer.
Again, a killer could induce survivors to waste their sprint burst without triggering the end of the Warmup, catch up with them and when close enough finally start the chase, adding valuable seconds to the slow down.
I think with your current implementation there could be a lot of exploitable potential by killers, which could be very nasty against low ranked survivors - and that's why I think they'll never implement this :P
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short version: in the stalking mechanic (Ghostface and Shape powers), how does the game know when a survivor can be stalked?
(long version, because I would like a somehow precise answer here :P: a survivor can be located not only behind a wall, but also behind see-through grass / half-way behind a generator / between the shack planks etc. - meaning that only a part of the survivor can be seen. I assume you raytrace from the killer POV to the survivor location, but what are the points that you use in the raytracing?)
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@Peanits said:
It'll continue regressing once the Thrilling Tremors effect wears off, but the regression is paused while the blocking is active.
:O!
this is a big (and a bit depressing, to be fair) news, how in the world no one knew this? Someone call an ambulance for Otzdarva..
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@IM_A_COWBOY said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1051102#Comment_1051102
im not native either, im polish, but i find actually learning languages instead of butchering them is a much better way of life lol
to each their own, after the first time they were clearly doing it to troll xD
Well, since you want to do things right: the "I" should always be capitalised. and don't forget the apostrophe for I'm ^^
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@IM_A_COWBOY said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1051013#Comment_1051013
you didn't lose a pip if the killer DC'd. Restart your game, the pip returns. Survivors are protected from pip loss, lol
i make killers DC all the time (its actually a shocking amount, and my survivor team mates still DC more, go figure), and never lose a pip. as for your WGLF stacks and BP, you're not losing anything. you aren't losing something unless you already had it.
also, lose only has one "o" in it, not two. no disrespect, its just one of those words 1/2 the internet seems to get wrong and i have no idea why o.o
OT - about lose/loose, it’s because of lose pronunciation + especially in the past there were a lot of insults like “looooooser!!!”, which led to further errors. For the record I kept on writing it wrong as well, until I figured that “loose” IS a word, which means something else :P.
But well, a lot of us are not native English speakers, so that’s understandable I think... instead I wonder why a lot of them say “literally” when something is not literal, or why they say “I could care less”.. go figure :P
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@Peanits said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1042958#Comment_1042958
I'm not sure what movement you're talking about specifically, but there haven't been any changes to survivor movement in the recent updates. We tested a change on the PTB that would affect both sides, although that never went live.
Doctor movements feel a bit wobbly, is it only me?
Also, did you acknowledge the apparent insta-flashlight bug? I posted a video on it when you asked it, but never replied back.
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@Fibijean said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1042641#Comment_1042641
That's fair, I'm just going off what I believe to be the most logical explanation. Although of course, the type of people who believe that the devs are hiding MMR to deceive us aren't likely to believe them even if they do provide an explanation themselves.
Well, for example I believe that if they want to hide MMR, it's because they don't want to let people know how far the MMR can be between players. They are not doing that because they are malicious, but because they want to avoid a flood of screenshots showing how matchmaking is still flawed.
If they say that this is not the reason why they want to hide the MMR, I'll be glad to hear what the real reason is, and possibly giving my counter arguments. Or just accept them as good and move on.
So yeah, don't assume for us Fib :)
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@Fibijean said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1042593#Comment_1042593
Possibly, but the point isn't that people won't be able to derank, it's that they won't be able to do so as reliably. We don't know what factors the algorithm is based around, and if they can't see the MMR they won't know if it's working or not, which might disincentivise them from trying. Most people are less inclined to put effort into something when they have no assurance that their efforts are paying off.
Also, I mentioned nothing about depip squads. Most people that I've seen who go out of their way to derank do it solo.
I see a lot of might, maybe, if... :P
Truth is: I want a Dev to say why they will keep (if they will keep) MMR hidden, not some speculation, because speculation go both way - you say that's because of the possible abuses, others say it's because they want to hide the fact that MMR doesn't work in the first place. Their track record is not exactly immaculate when we're talking about match making and bugs...
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@Fibijean said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1042503#Comment_1042503
I've responded to all of those points previously in this thread.
But as for the emblem system, people absolutely abuse their knowledge of how it works. The fact that the emblem system is so transparent is why so many people confuse ranking up as being the objective of the game. And there are thousands of people every day that play badly on purpose to derank, and they do it because they can, because they know how the system works and so they know how to play to derank while still maximising their bloodpoint gains.
I'm not saying there wouldn't be advantages to having at least an approximation of one's MMR rating publicly visible, but players abusing that knowledge to game the system is definitely a real disadvantage.
yes I've read your answers but I disagree with all of them to be honest, but since you are not a Dev if our opinions differ it doesn't matter that much :P.
Even the de ranking problem seems to me an over exaggeration: we're always being told that high rank full 4 swf teams are the exception, not the norm, and now we should believe that 4 swf de-pip squads are in fact a common thing? Doesn't make a lot of sense to me.
Also, you can't say that if we play well, we should know that already, no need for MMR to be shown without accepting that purposefully de-ranking will be exactly as easy: just suicide / don't chase / don't hook. Easy peasy.
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@Fibijean said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1041461#Comment_1041461
I intially thought the same as you, but even so I think it's best that it stays hidden. It's only non-abusable as long as players don't know how the system works, and showing our MMR would make it easier for a few smart cookies to figure out the algorithm.
I really don't understand this MMR-abuse hysteria that some people have embraced, especially since nowhere in the Dev post devs say that the MMR is hidden because of that.
Plus, the emblem system was blatant in explaining how one should play to gain emblems, and I don't see abuses there, why things would differ now?
The reality is that knowing both the MMR level of all players and knowing how it works is important because otherwise:
- we won't ever be able to report bugs with it
- no one will know if they're improving
- bugs aside, player feedback should be important
I'm not on the fence here, since the Dev Post was actually very inconspicuous in explaining what will be the changes, they just said there will be some. I hope they'll do the right thing.
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@Peanits said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1039031#Comment_1039031
We actually have in the past (it hasn't changed all too much since then): https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/61114/
in the stream I remember someone saying that Lithe was "much more common than Adrenaline / other exhaustion perks", but it isn't anywhere in that thread, I'm a bit confused now.
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I had made a long post about new Legion with some useful info, you can see it here:
@Nobsyde said:
Dev stream made this official: this Legion is here to stay. In this case, let’s throw out the window all the negativity and try to learn how to proficiently play them and have some fun - this post will be very long and go in great details on what, in my opinion, is one of the best play styles with this killer.
Disclaimer: an exception
Ok, let’s get this out of the way immediately: while what you’re going to read is a general guide proven right in the vast majority of games, you can always find a super organised swf team in a very survivor sided map - in those cases yes, you could fail, but that’s ok - if you really expect to play a killer that can win every game, what you actually want is a very unbalanced and broken game, so move on, this topic is not for you.
What Legion does not do very well
There has been a bit of a misunderstanding on what Legion power actually does, mainly due to the different iterations of Legion. Basically, it seems a good bunch of the community thinks that Legion is a slow down killer because of the ease in injuring survivors and mending time after Deep Wound has been applied.
While those two things are undeniable, by themselves they are not enough to make the game slow down enough. In fact, the game could even speed up.
Simply imagine: you are a very good looper and you find yourself injured almost immediately against a Legion, what do you do? You heal yourself, wasting your time since Legion can easily injure you again, or just do the generators? Thanatophobia adds a 16% slow down in a best case scenario, that’s just a bit more of 10 seconds of a generator, which is much less than the time needed to heal yourself (especially if multiple times). So yeah, you can’t rely on people healing as a slow down.
You can slow down the game with Legion, but that’s not because of their power per se, it’s more because of map pressure and the perks / add-ons we’re going to see.
What Legion actually does
Legion is probably the best tracker in the game, and one of the few killers able to preserve tokens of Save The Best For Last (STBL). Plus they have a very high mobility, which will be very helpful to move around in certain scenarios.
For who didn’t already know: hits during Feral Frenzy do not count anymore as Basic Hits, meaning that while one can’t apply any debuffs like the Mangled effect of Sloppy Butcher, you also won’t lose tokens of STBL.
With this in mind, let’s finally go into a normal game.
The Build
Hex: Ruin - you need to have a slow down perk for at least a few seconds. The first hit is too important, and if gens are flying before you have found someone, and possibly broke a couple of pallets, you’re in for a very difficult game
Pop Goes The Weasel - you won’t have time to go around and kick generators, that’s why you need something to slow the game quickly and strongly. Also, in extreme cases you can even use your FF to quickly reach a pivotal generator to pop.
Monitor & Abuse - this is a controversial perk for Legion: FF heartbeats are based on your Terror Radius, and M&A increases it during a chase (while it’s reduced when not chasing). You have to keep this in mind, and use it to your advantage. In fact, this downside is actually what will make you quickly understand if and when to go for another survivor or just take the stun and continue the chase. The other reason why we’re going to use this perk is to simply close distance to generators before survivors run away from you.
Save The Best For Last - eventually, you’ll almost become a fully committed M1 killer, and that’s only because of STBL. Without it, your games will be much, much harder.
The Add-ons
There are a lot of add-ons that you can use, not everyone is a game changer, but one that you should always use, if you are not going for a Iridescent Button game, is a Pin. The Legion Pin applies the Broken effect, while the Defaced Smiley Pin applies the Mangled one. In my opinion the latter is the best - as previously stated if survivors can’t heal, they’ll just do generators, if they can, well, that’s up to them. If they want to heal, they’ll be slowed down considerably, if they don’t want to, that’s fine as well, and we’ll see why.
If you want, use add-ons that increase your FF duration, they are very good, but in my numerous games I found out they are not that important, now that FF speed is increased. Also remember that thanks to M&A you’re going to chain hits only on survivors that are close by.
The Goal
In order to win the game Legion needs three things (in order of importance):
- as much tokens as possible of STBL
- false sense of security for survivors
- injured survivors
Everything else is the same as for every other killer: 3 generators close by, keep everyone occupied, don’t waste too much time in a single chase, bait pallets and so on and so forth - but since this is true for every killer, I’m not going to go too much into it.
Early Game
Ok, we spawn and the first thing to do is to find a survivor. I usually go in a somehow distant area where there are a couple or more generators to check - if Ruin is not in my path that’s the best, but I leave it up to you on how to approach this. Once you find the survivor, there are two things to consider
- is the survivor the obsession?
- is the survivor on the very edge of the map? if so, how likely it is that there’s another survivor nearby?
If the survivor is the obsession, the smartest thing to do is to go into FF and hit her, if you see someone with FF go for it, it doesn’t matter if they are very far away, you just want their general position and M&A will help to catch them eventually. Downing the obsession at this point of the game won’t help you at all, so as a general rule, just use her to find other survivors.
If it’s not the obsession, the second point applies: if the likelihood to find another survivor nearby is not the best, you should consider hitting the survivor with a basic hit - it’s 1 token for STBL in your pocket, and you don’t risk missing your FF hit, which would hurt you a lot. However, don’t waste time - if you can’t hit them quickly, you need to go into FF and close the deal.
In any case, let’s assume that you used your FF - what you want now is to lose the chase to decrease your Terror Radius, and go for the nearest survivor, rinse and repeat. If the first survivor is running toward the center of the map then you can consider not losing the chase, but just keep following him - even if you can’t find another survivor to hit, you’ll be in a better spot once your power ends, and you will still have a survivor to chase anyway.
As always, don’t overcommit on a single survivor and cut your losses - if you can bait a couple of pallets but you still don’t see the second hit nearby, just take your loss and move on.
During your first chases try to create a mental map of the generators which are being worked on - if you can interrupt and hit someone that’s terrific, but otherwise don’t bother too much kicking generators: what you really want is your first hook.
From 1-2 tokens to Mayhem (a.k.a. Mid Game)
After your first hook you’ll have gained 1 or 2 tokens of STBL. That’s not a lot, but from now on everything will become much easier.
Recollect your mental map of the generators worked on and get there as quickly as possible. In this early phase I suggest to just walk there and preserve your FF: not only M&A could help and scratch marks will aid you find survivors, you can also expect a very quick save in the early game. That’s what you want, and this is time to get back very quickly.
In any case, if you are not at FF distance from the hook (meaning: you can't reach the hook without going into fatigue with FF starting from your current location), the best thing to do if you find an outpositioned survivor is to basic hit them.
This also applies if you are very near the hooked survivor - you will trade tracking and injuring potential for STBL tokens. Also you don’t really care if the survivor is getting saved under your nose, since a second hit on one of the two survivors is basically guaranteed at this point (3+ tokens).
On the contrary, if you are at FF distance from the hook, consider hitting with FF, and immediately run back to the hook if you see any heartbeat in that direction. If you don’t hear any heartbeat end your FF immediately, you absolutely don’t want to have it on cooldown while a survivor is still on hook.
Quick reminder: before you have maxed out your STBL tokens, always hit your obsession with a FF hit, no matter their distance. The only exception is if the obsession is already injured and a hit will result in a downed survivor.
A brief Chasing Tip
Once you realise the looping skill level of every player, try to use the strongest looper for your first FF hit - he would most likely be able to escape from a chain hit anyway by running away preemptively, and you don’t really want to waste time. It will also help your confidence and decrease the team morale. Plus, when eventually you will strike him, he’ll probably not see that coming.
Considering that this also applies to the obsession, if you think you are in a good spot, consider wasting the strongest looper Decisive Strike. He’ll become the obsession and you will catch two birds with one stone later on.
…and a couple of Feral Frenzy Tips
As said, we want to chain hits only on survivors in our TR while M&A is lowering your TR. Sometimes what will happen is that you start going toward a heartbeat, the chase with the previously hit survivor ends (thus lowering your TR) and the heartbeats will disappear. That’s where you want to make a play: lose sight of the mending survivor (yeah, they will most likely mend right after you hit them…), find the right angle to approach them and end your FF. Most of the time they won’t realise immediately what’s happening, and you can hit them a second time very easily. However, don’t abuse this too much; in fact, try to use it only after you already run away a few times in the past - this will give them a false sense of security, and that’s where punishing them becomes easier.
Another very situational scenario is when you are able to chain hit 3+ survivors: by the time the fourth survivor is going to be hit, the first one will likely have already mended. If you hear his heartbeat, go back to him but end your FF before he can see you. Your goal is to not let them realise you are going again for them, since most of the time Legion will commit to a chase of the last hit survivor - certainly not the first one! You have their general location, they will feel somehow safe, it’s time to strike.
Mayhem (a.k.a. 6+ STBFL tokens)
At this point of the game it is expected that a couple of survivors are constantly injured, maybe because of previous DW hits, maybe because of recent unhooks. In any case we don’t really need them injured (…aside for the obsession): with 6+ STBFL tokens once we hit a survivor there’s a very high chance of a second hit in a very few seconds. This is always true when more than one survivor are grouped together, but it’s invaluable when they are cornered.
This is where you will basically stop using FF to injure survivors, and will start using it to move around and Pop generators or track where survivors are located when someone is hooked (reason being: there’s a high chance more than one will be nearby, but if they aren’t.. you can commit to the chase!).
If you have 8 tokens of STBFL you can basic hit your obsession even if she’s not injured if you are confident you can chain a second hit: yes, you’ll lose 4 tokens, but having someone on hook is a good enough trade-off. Plus, 4 tokens are enough to quickly recover the lost ones from other survivors.
On Borrowed Time
When you are still striving for 6+ tokens go for the hit: it’s better to gain a token now than to maybe down them later but still be unable to hook them due to Decisive Strike.
On the contrary, never ever ever ever hit an Obsession with a basic hit which was just unhooked. Losing 2 tokens to borrowed time is the worst thing that can happen to you. Just do what you are supposed to do: hit your obsession with FF and go for someone else.
Late Game
Actually there’s really not much to say here. You should always have between 5 and 8 tokens of STBFL, survivors are being hit left and right and there’s no peculiar tactic for Legion at this stage of the game, so just do what you would do with every other killer: kill at least one survivor, have a couple of them on death hook, patrol generators and.. just play well :).
On Killing the Obsession
Remember that before the death animation ends, you can still gain tokens for STBFL - you know what to do.
Conclusion
Even if this post was very long, there are a lot of subtleties that I left behind, but you will figure them out as you go. This being said, if something doesn’t sound right to you let me know and I’ll try to explain it better, if I’m able to.
I really hope someone will find this post useful and will be able to have fun with this very controversial (but, in my opinion, very undervalued) killer. Yes, they still have some issues that I hope someday will be fixed, but please leave those considerations for other threads - this is the Legion that we have, and that’s about it for now.
P.S. I'm tagging a few people which may find this post useful, I apologise if that's not what they wanted :P @Sonzaishinai, @EleaticStranger, @Brucecastro81
Note that in the post I suggest to use Ruin, but this info is now outdated. Try BBQ instead.
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@bubbasbasementchest said:
Been running Discordance ever since Ruin nerf and have not been gen rushed a single time, yet I rarely see it in many Killer builds as Survivor. Granted, I’m playing in red ranks as Survivor and green ranks as Killer, so maybe it’s just game sense; higher rank killers don’t need it to prevent getting gen rushed, but what do you guys think? How good/important is Discordance after the Ruin nerf?
With competent survivors discordance has the opposite effect of what you wish: they’ll stay separated and rush you much more efficiently. It’s a good perk in the very early game for when you want to quickly locate survivors, but later on is more of a distraction if anything
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@johnmwarner said:
I am enjoying life without Ruin, although it seems some people still have gen-phobia
But part of me misses the thrill I got when I started a gen and heard that first ding, that 5% of the time I didn't see a red skill check was kind of a treat!
you can create a new thrill:
get to a gen and tap it. If the killer has Ruin and Surveillance you'll be its first prey :P.
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@NullSp3c said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1029454#Comment_1029454
My definition of fun is just have interactions with the survivors and get a lot of bloodpoints each match. Also, being able to win sometimes (2 FAIR kills+) without sweating is also good.
Now compare it to what my experience (and of many people in the forums) is.
Games that last 5-6 minutes (very short time to being able to interact and being able to chill and just play relaxed).
Even if I sweat, survivors are able to escape using the way that i said and i can't get many bloodpoints and interact with them. Most of what i do is break pallets and see people run from tile to tile.
There's no room to play more casually as killer and get some bloodpoints. No one can have fun with strictly losing.
I see. Well, there are a few problems when we compare what you want with what you get: you want to kill more than two survivors, get a lot of bloodpoints and don't sweat, which I would translate to play chill.
The problem here is that you are also high rank because of the killers you play, but apparently your skill currently doesnn't match your rank, meaning that survivors are stronger than you at looping and making you waste time. What I would suggest is to switch up killer, take your time in learning it without caring too much on the outcome of the match. In fact, you should probably be happier if you de-rank while you learn those new killers (maybe use Trapper, it can be very interesting and at the same time it's very easy to mess up).
You will eventually end up in a rank that's better suited for you, and hopefully match making will not screw with you too much (until it is patched out, that is). From there you should be able to have games that are more on your skill level, get more interactions with survivors and bloodpoints.
I'm saying this because at high ranks the game is supposed to be hard, which you see as sweaty though, so it's obviously not where you want to be, and it wouldn't be fair for the players which want to have competitive matches to ask for the game to become easier.
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@NullSp3c said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1029365#Comment_1029365
I also said that i can't have fun if the games can be ended in 5-6 minutes and all im doing is running after someone that simply drops pallets and vaults to another tile.
I play legion and doctor at red ranks and i can't leave the ranks because i pip up and get few bloodpoints at the same time.
A win for me is to have fun with a good amount of bloodpoints (basically BBQ 4 stacks and some more bloodpoints in the middle). I can't do that because when the map becomes a giant dead zone and i can actually go and down people, the gens are already done.
why can't you have fun if a game lasts 5-6 minutes? I can understand why it wouldn't be fun for a survivor, but a killer plays differently.
Why do you consider fun to get 4 stacks of BBQ? Just because of the bloodpoints?
Can you please tell us what is fun for you? It's a serious question, everyone has a different definition.
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@Peanits said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1028884#Comment_1028884
Of course. I'm not trying to convince you otherwise. I actually addressed it with this line: "That's not to say that it can't cause a hit that should have connected to miss- I'm not trying to convince you that it doesn't happen- but it's not "auto aim" or "aim assist"."
It's just an explanation of how it works.
Can you elaborate a bit on your previous explanation?
I mean, you said that there is a collider/trigger cone in front of the killer, and if it hits a survivor, then the camera turns accordingly, correct?
Then you say that this doesn't mean that this doesn't lead to missed hits that shouldn't have been a miss, which I think it would be fair to translate to: sometimes the camera-correction (erroneously called auto-aim) mechanic makes the killer miss a strike even if aimed correctly. Again, am I correct?
Assuming those two previous statements are correct, then is it fair to say that camera-correction doesn't ever help a killer (hence: not an auto-aim/aim-assist), but it can hinder them at times, making them miss?
If that is the case: what is the purpose of the camera-correction?
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@LordGlint said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1029294#Comment_1029294
Never really understood the whole "only works one time" argument. Some of the strongest things in the game only work 1 time. Keys only let you open hatch 1 time and a mori only kills you 1 time.
well that's not really fair, both keys and mori work one time simply because after that the game ends - they wouldn't be able to work more than once in any case.
Other things that work only once.. Decisive Strike and Adrenaline? I honestly think they are strong only in swf scenarios, otherwise they become borderline useless, at least when I'm the killer :P.
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@NullSp3c said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1029306#Comment_1029306
Yeah, I did that in some games but i started to feel bad about it and i wasn't having fun. I want to have fun, but there is no time for it in match that lasts 5 minutes.
So i switched to survivor and started doing what i described and yeah, i can do what i want, basically. I'm a very bad looper so thanks that this is possible.
so yeah, here's the thing: if you want to be competitive that's how you gotta play: merciless. If you don't find it fun, then you should play with a more casual approach, or in other words do what you like.
Maybe you like to chase, maybe you like to jump scare, to snipe with huntress, to deep wound 4+ survivors per feral frenzy... whatever it is, do that. But if what you find fun is to 3-4K then we are back to the start: you have to play with a merciless mindset.
You can't have both, or at least, you can't have both in DbD. You can in Civ 5 though.
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@LordGlint said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1025277#Comment_1025277
Rancor was limited so it wouldnt give away the last person's position. After you close the hatch, the last person still has a chance to open a gate. If rancor gave that persons position away like it does when the last gen pops... they wouldnt have a chance.
I would say that this is a valid reason to actually make Rancor work like Adrenaline/NOED. It's an underwhelming perk on itself, if you can gain a very little advantage in a very peculiar scenario then I would say: go for it.
Plus you can just hide in a locker while waiting for the hatch to be closed anyway :P.
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@[Deleted User] said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1026162#Comment_1026162
Thank you. :D
I need to add like, 200+ windows though, rather than remove any, haha.
it should take exactly 16 hours, don't worry :D
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@[Deleted User] said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1025963#Comment_1025963
Because BHVR is going to nerf toolboxes without fixing the actual problem. It's what they do. It's what they've done for 3 years. Then we're going to have to wait months, possibly up to 6 years, for just a fix on some of the maps. It's very irksome.
I never said fixing the symptom is bad. But the symptom is not the problem and BHVR's pattern always shows that they quietly fix the symptom -- plug the runny nose, like with putting in blood lust and Bamboozle to take care of bad map design and infinites (instead of fixing the bad map design and the infinites) and over two years later, we still have bad map design and infinites rather than them actually being removed from the game.
I say 5 minutes, because it should take 5 minutes. The framework to do such a change, unless the game is very horribly spaghetti-coded, should be there to make such a change, and it should be an easy one.
If I can make a Mirror's Edge map as an art project (Still a big work in progress) without any programming knowledge and using Unreal 3 (which is much worse than Unreal 4 according to one of my friends who does have programming knowledge and works in Unreal 4) then a team of game developers should be able to move or block a damn window or three without any considerable time commitment or resources when the foundation and framework has already been laid to do such a change:
I still disagree with the 5 minutes thing, but I don't want to indulge too much into it, instead I would like to compliment you for your art project, it looks very cool!
..you should remove a window though! :P
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@LordGlint said:
Was fully under the impression that this new ruin would be absolute crap and only useful on killers like Billy who can zip across the map. After watching a monto video however...i decided to try emulating his build and found it to actually work pretty well. I dont know if its the fact that your saving time not having to kick a gen, or the simple fact of being able to know which gen needs your attention now, but I've actually been able to do pretty good with it on Legion. Still havent tried playing on Asylum with it so... wish me luck there. Whats you alls thoughts on this? Have you been surprised with new ruin on a character you didnt expect?
For those curious...this was the monto video I took inspiration from...
in both games Ruin was very close to some generators, but Monto was lucky enough for survivors to not notice it (especially in the first game), plus the early game slow down relies on you finding survivors quickly, otherwise gens will pop anyway.
If you want to mess around with Ruin+Surveillance with Legion I would suggest to try to use the add-on Fuming Mix Tape and do the following (note that I haven't tried it, but I think it would work):
after the first 10-15 seconds of spawning, go into feral frenzy and see which generators are being worked on, then if they are very close by stop immediately FF and walk there normally (to preserve your power and look for scratch marks), otherwise just rush there to apply surveillance. The goal would be to highlight early on the generators where survivors are located and start from there. This way you could apply early game pressure, but relying on a iridescent add-on for that is a bit meh.
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@[Deleted User] said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1025892#Comment_1025892
Toolboxes are a symptom of a problem. They are not the actual problem though. You can alleviate your stuffy nose, but the stuffy nose is not the cold that is infecting your body. You can apply a band-aid over a bleeding wound, but that doesn't make the wound itself magically go away.
Closing up a singular window is not a map rework. Nor does it take months to do. I'm not a programmer by any means, but I've used Unreal Engine before for creating maps. Moving a window or closing it up literally takes 5 minutes to do. It's not hard. I'm not exaggerating. A single person can do it -- let alone an entire team of people. Repeat in 12 maps with problematic windows. Let's pick 12 maps at random in no particular order:
- Rancid Abattoir
- Groaning Storehouse
- Haddonfield (even though it's got like, 8 awful windows, but we're just picking 1 here)
- Grim Pantry
- Fractured Cowshed
- Wretched Shop
- Coal Tower
- Ironworks of Misery
- Torment Creek
- Disturbed Ward
- Suffocation Pit
- Mother's Dwelling
you fix 12 problematic windows in these 12 maps in an entire hour. That's 12 bad maps that are suddenly far less bad with just an hour of work and suddenly the game is much healthier. No entire map redesigns needed. Are they perfect still? No, of course not. But improved? Yes. Much yes.
When the time comes for a redesign, sure, redesign them. But to say "Well killers are just going to have to suffer for 6 years for us to rework 12 maps" is ridiculously unrealistic. A sinking ship doesn't stay afloat for that long.
If it takes them seriously 6 years for them to balance 12 maps instead of an hour, then they should hire me instead since I can apparently do it multiple times faster than them despite not having any programming knowledge.
I see your point, but it's a bit silly that in the same post you say that by nerfing toolboxes you can alleviate the problem, but not fix it, while at the same time stating that changing window layout of certain maps is better than nothing.
Why do you have two very different opinions of the same concept? Especially considering that the big issue is how big maps are (but you are absolutely right, windows and pallets are a component as well), which remains basically unaffected by window relocation, while a toolbox nerf at least addresses the exact issue: gen speed.
P.S. I use Unity, not Unreal, but I'm fairly sure that things work similarly so what I would like to say is: refrain from saying things like "it takes 5 minutes to close a window", because it doesn't, not from a design point of view, not from a technical point of view. We as players can and should be vocal on what we want to see changed, but let's be humble and admit that we don't know what goes on behind the scenes.
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@[Deleted User] said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1025865#Comment_1025865
I may not use them, but I also know how to hit great skill checks. Which is like using a tool box and not hitting great skill checks.
A better band-aid imo would to just stop faffing around and to fix most of the maps. It's not like all of the maps are utterly terrible. But when a map can be just lost as Killer simply because of the spawn of a single notorious window, like Rancid Abattoir or Groaning Storehouse, then maybe, just maybe, spend 5 minutes to close up that troublesome window or at least move it into a less powerful location and that will be one less problematic map to deal with.
@ toolboxes - yeah, and now imagine those players that have toolboxes and hit great skill checks. I honestly don't understand what you are trying to say, that toolboxes are not a problem, because game goes fast anyway? May be, but at least remove / fix something little, instead of nothing, no?
@ map rework - that's not a band-aid, that's the fix, but apparently it takes time. Point is: let's assume that it is possible to rework everything wrong with the maps in a couple of months. Well, evidence is that BHVR is not able to do it, they need more time, so what else is there?
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@[Deleted User] said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1025833#Comment_1025833
At the rate we're going with one map rework every 6 months, the game will be dead in the water by the time all the maps are properly balanced.
Tool box nerf won't do much. Games go too fast with or without toolboxes. I haven't been using any and most of my games I'm still going through the exit gates by the 7 minute mark, with only some exception to that on some of the killer-sided maps like Hawkins lab. And with a nerf announced, I expect to see the amount of toolboxes being used increase dramatically.
you may not use them, but there are 4 survivors in a game ;).
As far as the very slow rework on maps.. I can't disagree with that, but still, that's what we're stuck with. I suggested in the past to disable from the pick rotation certain maps before their rework, since it's not like we lack variety right now, and I still think it could be a perfectly fine band-aid for the time being.
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@_LC said:
They said they wanted the 4 stages to feel like increasing levels of difficulty and they changed their mind and adapted to the new decision.
I think that the increasing difficulty was a super good idea, what do you think?
From my point of view there were a couple of problems with the from easy to difficult challenges concept:
- some challenges become too grindy the more difficult they become: if in level 1 we have a heal 5 health state, by level 4 it should become heal 20 health state or something like that.
- if you don't want to be grindy, a difficult challenge most of the times becomes situational due to it being a master challenge - 4 sacrifice in the basement, 4 sacrifices during EGC, 2 flashlight saves...
So yeah, I can see why they want to steer away from difficulty increase. I still would have liked a proportional increase in master challenges level by level though - I know a lot of us don't really like those, but I think those are the most interesting to face.
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@NullEXE said:
This was just said in the Livestream, my concern is that it's the lack of early game pressure for most killers is what is causing problems with the Gatekeeper emblem, and scoring. If the developers expect 1-2 generators to be repaired in the first 4 minutes, why does that penalize the Killer in the Gatekeeper emblem?
they also said that there is a memorandum (sorry I couldn't remember the exact word they used) to create maps that aren't too big, and I suppose to rework those that currently are accordingly.
If that is the case I can accept the statement you are talking about - yeah, early game will be much shorter but at the same time it will be more difficult for survivors to go through the mid game, which is arguably the most interactive part of the game anyway.
Plus once they will nerf toolboxes I expect the game to become a bit slower (well, that's depending on how they'll nerf those, though).
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I suspect there are (at least) two issues at the same time:
- not enough players within certain ranks, depending on area / time
- the priority to match ranks goes in conflict with the time priority of people which were already in queue
One thing that I noticed is that as a survivor I may take forever to join a lobby, but once I do even if the killer dodges it, a new killer will come in a very short time. This leads me to believe that a quicker match making is possible, but they are facing very tricky bugs and/or decisions, especially regarding point 2.
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@Fibijean said:
I actually agree with you. Given how difficult shards are to earn, I don't think it's fair to force players to buy particular characters that they might not even want in order to do the challenges. I wouldn't have a problem with it if the rewards were only limited to things like lore and bloodpoints, which aren't on a time limit, but the fact that the challenges are tied to Rift progress puts players who can't buy the characters for whatever reason at a disadvantage when it comes to completing the Rift.
There are 12 challenges in the Tome, from what is currently known about it, which are DLC character-specific, all of which are master challenges, meaning that players who don't have access to the DLC characters miss out on six tiers' worth of progression. The number of missed tiers becomes 10.5 if we include challenges that require DLC perks (which are accessible through the Shrine, but not necessarily to all players, depending on their circumstances).
Personally, I feel that a better solution would be to make relevant DLC characters free to play (but without the ability to unlock their teachable perks) for the duration of the Rift, and then lock them again afterwards. This way, players can use them to complete challenges, even invest bloodpoints into leveling them, but will have to purchase them in order to continue playing with them once the Rift closes.
100% this.
I unlocked via shrine of secrets several perks of dlc survivors, since they are just skins and don’t add anything gameplay wise - now there’s no way I’m spending 9000 iridescent shards on a character which would give me nothing, all her teachable have been given here and there as far as I remember.
I would understand challenges tied to character for killers, since there’s very different mechanics involved, but survivors... that’s cheap.
Yeah everything it’s optional, whatever, it still feels a bit uncalled for. Especially when there were so many free characters still to use.
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@Peanits said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1020948#Comment_1020948
I definitely haven't.
If you have some clips of this happening, please be sure to report them in the bug reports section. I wouldn't rule it out completely, but I would assume that it's more of a delayed feedback on your end rather than being a faster blind across the board (since faster blinds would throw off the timing of flashlight saves, and it would be immediately obvious if that was the case).
Bear in mind that multiple people blinding you with a flashlight at the same time will cause you to get blinded faster.
here's a clip of what I was saying
https://clips.twitch.tv/FairPreciousDolphinMau5 -
I'm not going to use Moris on the killers I master, but when I want to try something new I'm afraid I'll have to. Which is a common complaint by the way: without Ruin it became impossible to learn new killers (or even old ones, if you don't already master them) without being bullied.
And as a rank 1 I should lose something like 40 games in a row to reach a bearable rank anyway, so...
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@LiunUK said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1021133#Comment_1021133
that's why green moris exist
well, that's another story :P - but that's basically cheating, like 3 survivors escaping through hatch with 1 gen left - and now there's also a couple of Tome Challenges "escape through the hatch by using a key" lol.
I'm confident devs will eventually address this, let's say.. in a couple of years.
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@FleshTorpedo said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1021133#Comment_1021133
Thats why you slug. No ds for you.
and that's:
- 59 seconds on first hook
- 60 seconds of slugging
- 59 seconds on second hook
- 60 seconds of slugging
total: 238 seconds + the time to actually lift the survivor (2 seconds * 3), actually hooking (1 second * 3) + eventual first chase / time to reach the hook (I will not count this) ≈ 250 seconds
time needed for 3 survivors to complete 5 generators (no toolboxes, no perks, but optimally separated): 160-200 seconds (I add 40 seconds of idle due to rescue / search for a new generator).
Nah, tunnelling the first hooked survivor and slugging him is an automatic loss, against the survivors @Peanits was talking about.
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@Peanits said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1020948#Comment_1020948
I definitely haven't.
If you have some clips of this happening, please be sure to report them in the bug reports section. I wouldn't rule it out completely, but I would assume that it's more of a delayed feedback on your end rather than being a faster blind across the board (since faster blinds would throw off the timing of flashlight saves, and it would be immediately obvious if that was the case).
Bear in mind that multiple people blinding you with a flashlight at the same time will cause you to get blinded faster.
I don't have a clip, but I can confirm that at least in one occasion (..which was actually the only time I was blinded since the patch) I felt the same effect that @Spooky13 says:
I noticed that as well. Probably a bug. It seems like the light will almost not blind you, but then it instantly blinds you.
I can't know if the time for the blind is the same or not, but since we're used to a certain degree of light on the screen before actually being blinded, the feeling is for the flashlight to blind you quicker.
The visual output is very similar to when survivors try to blind you at an imperfect angle / the killer is watching up or down, but then all of a sudden you are actually blinded.
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@DevourOfSalt said:
Why in the hell is there only 5 killers challenges and 11 fking survivor challenges, i dont enjoy playing survivor, and being force to play it to do these challenges because fking grind is ridiculous to unlock tiers for rift with XP is a joke.
Why isn't there a system to allow you to pick between either a killer only tome or survivor only locking you out of other one i.e pick killer lock out of survivor or something.
because killers queue are too long right now, and they want to incentivise people to play as survivor to balance it out.
...wait...
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@DalauanDivine said:
Me personally I got the game on PS4 when it was free and due to lack of killers I had to take on the burden of being one but I still managed to get a few survivor games.
I then brought the game on xbox one once again buying the movie characters and at this point survivor queues appeared to be taking longer than ps4 so once again I segregated myself to killer. I wish I could play survivor but no I am one of those who can't seem to find survivor matches consistently no matter the platform or year the end.
Honestly: queue times.
If it wasn't for queue times I would play 50/50, but right now I have to play killer if I want to actually play.
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@Konnor24 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1019546#Comment_1019546
Ok well ill add a disclaimer as "ALL TIMES ARE NOT 100% ACCURATE AS IM LOOKING AT A STOPWATCH AND AT THE GAME AT THE SAME TIME"
I said i felt powerless as a killer, not useless.
I have kept playing, i've played another 3 killer games since and gotten the basic same results albeit i decided to tunnel people in my most recent game and surprise surprise i get a 4 kill.
Seems the best way to get a 4k is to be toxic. And the game still took around 6-7 minutes. I got a 4k and i feel genuinely bored and unfulfilled. The only time thats happened to me before is when i got 4ks from when i didnt play for 2 months before and got demoted to brown ranks. (before the new rank system obviously)
I would say: give it a couple of weeks to get used to play without Ruin, and try to remain positive even if you get stomped. Avoid playing toxic, play smartly (tunnelling is smart, if you can do it quickly, so go for it if that's your pick).
Maybe you'll have fun again, maybe not. We're stuck with this change for now, so either wait 3 months, when Devs will change things again, or try to take things with more levity, it could help.
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@GrootDude said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1019199#Comment_1019199
I won’t deal with it, I’ll keep making threads until it gets fixed.
That would be spamming.
Tone aside, he's absolutely right: gen rushing is a very unhealthy way to play the game - note that I'm not saying that you gen rush (nor that you aren't, though :P), but your hypothetical pip rework would just be an incentive to this.
..and that's not to mention a fully immersed survivor that did nothing but managed to escape through the hatch as the last alive survivor.
Exactly as face camping one survivor and getting another with NOED (2K) as a killer, you deserve to depip (I know that you said 3-4k, but if the game is balanced on 2K, that should be the threshold).
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Don't take what I'm going to say personally: the problem with those kind of arguments is that they tend to exaggerate things so much that the whole post becomes difficult to take seriously. Take this for example:
Funnily enough my games lasted 10-15 minutes on the weekend. Hex got found within 45 seconds for the first game, 9 seconds on the second game and 25 seconds on the third
A totem needs 14 seconds to be cleansed, and that's not counting the time to reach it, so yeah, 9 seconds is literally impossible. If you lie there, maybe you are lying elsewhere too, for example in games lasting 10-15 minutes.
Then there's the part of you being useless as a killer without Ruin, and that's absurd especially due to what you said about your previous games (ruin cleansed in 9 / 25 seconds). You had 3 bad games in a row, that's it. I'm sure if you keep playing you'll have very different experiences.
..and note that I've been very vocal against Ruin change without proper compensation (may it be gen speed / toolbox nerf / maps reworks), but I'm sorry to say those kind of posts don't help in any way in improving the current situation.
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@humanbeing1704 said:
like seriously why was this change even put into the game madness is barely even threatning anymore
I asked this question in the Q&A topic and it had a lot of upvotes, I honestly think they'll answer to that officially in the stream.
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I see, you're a Satan follower ah?
REPENT
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Solo
It depends if I need to just escape or escape with an item / with a certain character.
In the latter case I'll just fly away, in the former, since it's not that difficult, I'll go search for Noed.
Swf
I don't ever play swf because I'm a good person and I don't want to condemn my soul to hell.