Laluzi
Laluzi
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- Laluzi
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If you're Spirit or Hag, you get to look at yourself regularly.
If you're anyone else... you get the satisfaction of knowing you're killing them with swag.
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What do I get if matchmaking pays more attention to what happens in a match? I'd be able to let people go without tanking my matchmaking, for starters.
Used to be able to play nice and still maintain a rank that let me face off against players my skill level. I enjoy 8-hooking everyone, maybe getting in a few more smacks, and then being friendly for the rest of the match. Now if I do that, I get placed in the kiddie pool and I just feel bad killing newbies to get back where I'm supposed to be, so I sink even lower until I finally man up and pull the trigger on players who had no business being matched with me. You can say "stop smurfing", but the whole point is that this didn't use to be smurfing and now it is, and that's not why I do it.
They said they're looking at addressing this second part, so this is a less pressing issue, but as a solo survivor, it is extremely important to avoid low MMR because you get bad teammates that won't help you, don't take advantage of time you buy them, or even actively get you killed, and this makes the game harder to win even factoring in the easier killers. This makes playing selfishly way more attractive than it used to be, because lower MMR is a punishment, and lower MMR is binary - either you live or you lose. So if you can get out that gate or go back and go down getting that hooked Bill to the gate in your place... the sacrifice play has a cost to it now, and the game doesn't care that you made it to the end of the match and did however many generators/unhooks/got chased for x minutes.
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@Rizzo said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2768423#Comment_2768423
It depends on the gravity of the insult, of course.
Saying "babykiller" to someone is not a huge insult and in any case it's the Support team that takes action if needed.
Moving a little further, let's say we have a player that plays ~40 matches of DBD a week, and while they're careful to never cross the line into hate speech or death threats, they give the "ggez, lmao, trash, play civ because ur [BAD WORD] at this game, imagine being this bad, my dog plays better than u" shtick in every one of those matches and spend three minutes needling every single player who's unwise enough to respond to them - "i know u tried real hard sweetie but maybe u should try farmville instead", "bet u were the kid nobody wanted to play with at school because ur [BAD WORD]", "go [BAD WORD] yourself and cry urself to sleep", "nobody likes u for a reason", "lmao drink some copium". Most of their chat logs end with "EZ" spammed 20+ times.
And yeah, I'm assuming that all of these lines, individually, DBD is okay with. I've never been given any indication otherwise.
But is this something that should be looked at, moderated, and/or chat-banned in an ideal DBD-world, or is that still an acceptable part of the online gaming experience because they never cross the line even though they behave badly in every circumstance possible? Is there a point where you'd exceed the tolerance given for smack talk, or is DBD's stance that they just do not care what players do or say as long as they're not "bad enough?"
Because from where I'm standing, it doesn't even look like there's a point to reporting most of the nasty people I encounter. Some people are awful to everyone, they take pride in being awful to everyone (I've seen some interesting profiles), but they still fall in that "casual trash talk" zone and I get the impression that any reports I make are just considered clutter.
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I mean, screw that Cheryl, she was obviously trying to pawn the killer off on you - but you're just as bad for ditching your other two teammates? Just because two of you got caught really early and one of your teammates is a tool doesn't mean the game is now unwinnable. But it's certainly unwinnable now that you bailed.
My survivor games are almost exclusively solo and I can safely say that despise both of these things equally.
Also, the killer isn't obligated to be nice and let you go. It's nice when they are, but it's not some cardinal sin if they take advantage of it instead. Hell - sometimes when playing killer, some douche survivor will start trying to point out a player that I already knew about. I didn't need the help or formally accept it - do I just have to let that player go now? (I... usually do, but that's because my distaste for sellouts is stronger than my desire to win.) It's quite possible the Ghostface heard your locker open. Or he didn't and Cheryl sold you out because she's the kind of player that flips their ######### if someone isn't doing something for 10 seconds, but he wasn't breaking some honor code by grabbing you. And I've still won games when one of my teammates was a jerk that would try and sandbag me over perceived slights, because unlike a DC, those teammates are usually still doing useful things when they're off on their own.
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Seems like how I normally try to play, minus the part where I have to play every killer (because you can't make me touch Billy or Nurse with a ten-foot pole. I got my achievements; never again.)
But it probably is a good idea to switch up more. I find most of my games these days are Plague, Artist, and Pig, with a smattering of Spirit and Blight since I just got them.
I do plan on letting survivors do what they need to do for the Lunar Event, as well as the white glyphs (though I'll expect some consideration in return afterwards or it's no more ms. nice killer.)
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Didn't you already make this thread a few days ago?
Bubba, like Billy, has to charge his saw fully before he attacks. The saw has a sound cue. That gives survivors some time to avoid it by dropping a pallet, vaulting a window, jumping in a locker, or even hugging a really tight corner and hoping Bubba bumps or goes wide.
If you're in a dead zone, you're screwed, but then I question why you ended up in a dead zone in the first place. Bubba has a 32m TR; you hear him coming, unlike the stealth killers you brought up. He's a killer that you need to pay attention to your surroundings and flee early if they won't help you when the killer arrives - another example of this would be Trickster.
Plus Myers and Ghostface just lunge and down you, which is harder to avoid when the conditions are active. There's almost no windup time.
Bubba being able to flat out deny unhooks is BS, but his saw itself is fine.
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@TAG said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2768188#Comment_2768188
The way I see it, the Bill thing was them delivering the costume but not the actual young Bill. They didn't actually leave out any article of clothing that wasn't in the trailer.
I can't see them leaving out costume pieces specifically designed for this Tome trailer.
Well, I hope you're right, because it really does look amazing.
(Though I don't think Bill was the only example. Trickster's intro for tome 9 had him wearing the costume he had in the tome, but some pieces of his outfit existed in the animatic that weren't in the tome. I'd be really sad if it was something like we get the Jigsaw mask and not the RBT.)
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Dead Man's Switch looked great at first, and a contender for another strong gen delay perk, but certain killers had the ability to go ham with it and knock people off every gen without having to be there - Artist was the worst of the lot, but Freddy and Doctor can pull it off too with certain builds. I'm not sure how that can be fixed and I suspect it's either going to make it to live with that gaping loophole or it's going to be useless again. I think I prefer useless - nothing should force 30-minute games.
Boil Over was either garbage or you abused it with map + hook offerings and running to hook dead zones, no in-between. It's a perk that has almost no value if you're playing the game normally and might trigger once every dozen matches. Definitely not worth running unless you want to troll.
I'm pretty sure they'll nerf this one from PTB - moreso than I am that DMS will be nerfed. Whether that nerf will fix its problems, who knows.
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@gilgamer said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2768173#Comment_2768173
Honestly, it's probably not a lack of interest and more a lack of competency. Either in management or staff or both, I don't know but something isn't working at bhvr that's for sure.
My assumption is that the amount of resources (staff, code, bandwidth) it would take to fix the issues with the report system are, corporately speaking, better put towards things that will earn revenue and draw in new players.
It's the same reason a game health chapter is never happening. It's just not high enough on the priority list.
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@Shaped said:
Yeah that skin is fire. It might be my fav killer skin in the game.
Are we sure that's going to be the skin, though? It looks awesome, but the trailer image for Bill in Tome 7 wasn't the skin we got. I'm withholding my expectations until the tome itself comes out.
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@gilgamer said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2768144#Comment_2768144
It's honestly a little pathetic like I get not having a replay system for someone to just go and grab the data of since with how many matches happen in this game that'd be a lot of data to hold onto but they should still be detecting the movements and actions of the players in each match.
It's absolutely pathetic. This game is almost 6 years old, has hundreds of thousands of active players, and the in-game report function does nothing unless you're reporting a chat offense. It's not even clear that it does nothing, so most players don't understand that they need to be taking supplemental actions and using third-party software in order to report cheaters and hostage-takers.
That is a huge issue and BHVR has repeatedly demonstrated a lack of interest in fixing it.
You would think they could at least see pure data things like "huh, this guy got hooked 136 times that match, that's not right" or "this survivor moved 60 meters in 2 seconds while in the dying state" or "this survivor escaped the match while 5 generators were left" or "all four survivors died 7 seconds into the match" or "this killer's power was not the one that killer is supposed to have."
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@gilgamer said:
yeah I don't know how they think a reporting system that requires video evidence and manual review for every single ban would ever be sufficient for a game with more than 100 people playing it consistently
Unfortunately, in the last Q&A, they basically confirmed that they will never, ever change this, because they gave a flat no for a match replay system.
If the game won't record that data, then they're going to continue asking the players to do it for them.
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If you make Corrupt basekit, you might see an early game meta of not doing anything for two minutes, hunting totems, opening chests, etc. The only killers that are happy about this are Trapper and Hag. Hexes would become weaker as a result - running Corrupt with hexes is almost always a bad idea, because survivors are likelier to find them at the start if they have to move around from gen to gen.
Bodyblocking with BT would become the norm (well, more than it already is), but mostly, survivors get room to run a fifth meta perk.
I'd rather see fixes to early game gen/chase speeds and hard camping than patchwork solutions that add in their own problems.
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@Astral88 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2768094#Comment_2768094
If you feel insulted by my perspective and opinion then you are eventually a bit sensitive, but that's ok. I've had good matches as Nemesis, Plague and Wraith but I'm not recording matches cause no one watches it anyways, so why wasting my storage? :)
I'm tired of the point that ppl are got used to run into the forum and start a massive cry storm about something which they cannot get rid off by themselves due to the lack of their own experience. Whatsoever. Hankies are everywhere and for everyone. 😊
Your perspective? You immediately started calling everyone babies, crying, bad at the game, etc. That's not how you have an honest discussion. That's what I expect out of endgame chat.
Nemesis is easy mode on the Game. I enjoy seeing Jigsaw map offerings when I'm playing him because T2 just destroys the entire map. He's the best pallet buster in DBD. Plague has a rough early game but goes ham later on and can capitalize harder on the removed pallets more than pure M1 killers can - she catches up damn fast with Corrupt and can take out several people at once. While the Game is an indoor map, it's probably the least cumbersome for Corrupt Purge. Wide middle and all of the low walls work in her favor.
Wraith, though... Wraith depends on the survivors screwing up on this map. He was better before the lunge nerf, but now his antiloop element doesn't work and he doesn't threaten smart survivors into dropping pallets until they absolutely need to. If they'll drop pallets while he's cloaked, you're okay. Same if the survivors are lost, super altruistic, or just bad in general. Otherwise, I'm not buying your "I'm just really good at the game and you all need to get on my level" argument. A Wraith against competent survivors on the Game that greed pallets and prioritize gens is highkey screwed. Blocking the nearest pallet and going for the old hit and run at gens doesn't work with CoH.
I've had good games with Wraith on the Game, but it was never because I was a galaxy brain Wraith, it was because the survivors threw me enough bones to work with.
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@Astral88 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2768065#Comment_2768065
My argument is not pathetic. I'm lining up a point which is pathetic. Crying about something cause you lack the skill and knowledge about it. I have had good matches on this map as killer and as survivor. It's all about putting enough pressure and do correct micro decisions which puts you in advantageous position. If you fail on it, then it's not a reason for a nerf. It's more likely, improve your own gameplay and do better the next time.
I would very much like to know how you put enough pressure and did correct micro decisions while playing against decent survivors on this map. Gameplay would be appreciated.
I can have good matches on the Game as killer, but they require me to either be playing a pallet buster or for survivors to drop pallets immediately instead of taking a few loops around them, and also for survivors to be inefficient on gens. Otherwise, there's an immediately safe place to run everywhere on the map, it's impossible to catch people out of position, and I can't properly chase anyone until I've gotten 10-15 pallets dropped and broken. If I'm playing good survivors on this map and I'm someone like Wraith or Pinhead, my only hope is that the survivors try to crowd around me for saves. Because if one person runs in circles around pallets while the other three do gens, and they rotate roles if I switch targets - by the time I turn the map into something I can have chases on, there's one gen left, if that. There is no mindgaming any of the pallets on the Game; they're either god pallets or they have full visibility. Skill is not a factor in handling such loops (unless you keep trying to switch directions and mindgame yourself.)
Also, your argument is bad because you immediately jumped to insults and strawmen instead of actually having a discussion about the situation.
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@PigMainBigBrain said:
Welp, the problem with the emblem systems were pretty obvious.
You could simply smurf. Be it killer or survivor.
Your killers didn't have different rank scaling meaning if you're a Spirit savant 360 no scope god gamer, but a Trapper lummox your trapper would end up in the same matches as your god gamer spirit. Regardless of how bad you were at Trapper.
You could literally boost your friends by creating inflated scenarios they could profit from.
You could literally just grind your way to the top as survivor while still largely playing like trash.
I actually think it's easier to smurf in the current system. You had to truly not contribute, run at the killer and suicide, or afk in order to pip down - even as killer, never hooking anyone and only hitting to slug could often give a black pip. Now you can play the whole game however you like and then intentionally die at the end or let survivors go and nothing else matters, so you can outright smurf while you play - spend the whole game trolling the other team and then die to EGC or force survivors out the gate. The only part of smurfing that's harder is instant DCing, and there was always a cap on how much you could do that anyway.
Also, the killer MMR difference is capped so low that it may as well not exist. It's not very impactful. If I have a base MMR of 1500 but I'm an actual trash heap Nurse, can't land blinks, swing at walls, survivors 4e every time, my Nurse can't go below 1300.
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Gen slowdown to counter base improved efficiency, or map adjustments to weaken chained tiles and increase average chase speed.
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@ChiSoxFan11 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2766667#Comment_2766667
Pretty much this.
I get a LOT of BP normally just through regular play, though the grind definitely needs fixing. But inconsistent matchmaking due to a flawed SBMM system is incredibly frustrating. I played last night and alternated between 3-4 person Iri squads that were playing as if their actual life depended on getting gens done in 5 minutes or less and teams that had players who were multiple Ash IV level players running 0-1 perks who, I actually think, might have been playing their first ever DBD game (at least, by the way they acted, it seemed that way). That type of gameplay wasn't fun for anyone involved.
On a different note, I want to point out that I see your posts on a lot of subjects -- and I'm always impressed by your well-thought out take on things in the game. Just wanted to throw that out there. 👍️
Aww... thank you for saying so. That really means a lot to hear.
I've had a similar experience. Most often the complete mismatches come at night. I can get matched with a 4-TTV Haddonsquad, get completely destroyed, and suddenly the next team is running past pallets and blowing up gens and I just feel bad about killing them. Then, whether I spare them all or pull the trigger and give the last one hatch, the next match is another high-end SWF that makes me sweat for every hook. And I play less survivor at night because of the queue times, but when I do, I'm bizarrely likely to run into obvious newbie killers. Basic perks, lots of whiffing, loop confusion.
It seems like my fairest matches come during the afternoon. I'll get players that make me work for it, but not to such a soul-draining extent that the game isn't fun. Then the moon rises, DBD shifts into were-DBD, and you have no idea what you're going to get except that it's probably going to be a stomp for someone.
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I care more about the MMR because it dictates what my experience playing the game will be. If it's too low, I'll be massacring confused newbies, or getting massacred by confused newbies that crouch in the corners of the map all game. If it's too high, I'll be constantly wrangling with Haddonfield/Badham/The Game sweat squads and I'll be stuck with Nurse/Blight Simulator every survivor match.
Getting BP once a month is nice, but I'd rather have a good experience the rest of the month, you know?
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There were two crucial issues with the emblem system.
-It was great for showing new players the ropes, elevating them when they figured out how to play the game and keeping them low if they didn't, but overall it was much too easy to gain pips by just doing stuff in the match, especially as survivor, and everyone ended up in red ranks eventually. So red ranks meant anything from 'basic competence' to 'actual god' and most players got thrown into an area above their actual skill.
-The matchmaking net was too wide and it'd often match a rank 10 killer with a full rank 1 SWF, or some green and purple solos with a rank 1 killer.
Problem #2 hasn't been fixed at all, and we swapped out problem #1 for a fresh slew of problems (as well as killing the safe zone for newbies that the emblem system was actually good at.)
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@MikaelaWantsYourBoon said:
Game & Dlcs are cheap. So i have not problem with shards. I am using them for cosmetics.
They're... kind of not? Individually, sure, but if you buy the game and all the DLCs, you're looking at $230. That's on the high end and that number climbs four times a year.
I'm almost Devotion 8. I bought all licensed DLCs and also Demise of the Faithful, and I still haven't unlocked every character with shards - I'm missing 2 killers and 4 survivors. That's over 2000 hours of playtime.
Now, the ability to buy what would otherwise be paid content with shards? That's actually really great, and it's generous of them to have it in there at all. Chapters are way more universally appealing to the average player than cosmetics and many more people would and will shell out the money for them. They lose out when people do what I do and take the back route, and obviously they need to be pretty expensive with shards to get people to buy DLC at all.
The cosmetics is where the grind starts to get nutty. There are oodles of them, far more than chapters, so you don't need to worry as much about your market drying up. Taking the cost out of the question for a second, most players would want a full outfit for every character they play, and could be tempted to obtain more when new outfits come out. But each full outfit costs roughly an entire devotion level's worth of shards. It's more than buying an entire chapter - both in cell cost and in shard cost. And that's wild. I don't understand how that lines up at all in terms of value. Spending 80% of a new character to unlock Mr. Puddles' head is a bit crazy.
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We're really still asking for Spirit nerfs? Was this post in a time capsule?
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You automatically tainted your argument by making the Bubba who is camping a better chaser than the one who isn't. Like, yeah, that guy's better at the game because he's better at the game. Duh?
If Bubba can down the survivors in <30s each, and he facecamps each of them to death, he'll likely get a 3k or 4k because he was too efficient for survivors to finish generators. It would be odd for him to only get a 2k playing that way. Meanwhile, a Bubba that took 30s to almost 2 minutes to catch people probably isn't even going to get 8 hooks unless the survivors were uncoordinated and very mediocre.
This isn't an even comparison.
The real problem is that Bubba can spend exactly the same amount of time chasing survivors, win the game if he camps, and lose the game if he plays normally. And the problem there is that with the time differential of the game, things like camping and tunneling are more rewarding than splitting chases, which is ostensibly what the game wants you to do for maximum fun. MMR enforces this by rewarding kills over chases, which the old emblem system did not do.
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To me, survivors spawning by an uncorrupted gen is less of a problem because you'll find them pretty quickly (unless you're Trapper or Hag and you were using Corrupt to set up traps.) However, spawning in the middle of the map and having the corrupt gens be far on different sides is pretty much a waste of a perk slot because that doesn't get you a small patrollable area at the start and it encourages survivors to do your best 3-gen, which is the other benefit of Corrupt Intervention.
I don't really know how you'd fix this without changing what the perk focuses on, though.
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@Bardon said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2742722#Comment_2742722
Do you honestly think they'll buff killers across the board to match this? Not a hope in hell.
Call me mad, but I actually still have hope they will, though I also believe it'll come after an obnoxious several month interim period where killers struggle and they take control-set data despite everyone telling them "this is bad" by the end of the first week.
Luckily, it's not going to make the game worse at the high end, because that's almost pure SWF anyway. Solos will have lower MMR simply by dint of random teammate selection. I think you'll see the most difference at medium MMR.
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I think Lightborn is funnier. Starstruck, you'll catch the first guy that runs in for the save, but they all run away after the first time it procs. Lightborn, they keep trying... and trying...
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They should be coming on the 25th, which is when the midchapter update is expected. Can't wait to dust him off and hear them live!
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@SilentShepherd said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2765622#Comment_2765622
you're defending a Bubba who can create toxic gameplay and facecamp with an aoe attack that has no cooldown and lasts a long time
I've already made my stance very clear. His ability to totally prevent unhooks and camp people to death is problematic and needs to be dealt with. Literally everything else he can do is fine, counterable, and it's almost always the survivors' fault for feeding him several downs at once by not splitting the second he shows up. The camp situation bypasses that because survivors need to go to a specific spot and he can effectively block it. Anything else, though? If two survivors are working on a gen and Bubba with Tinkerer revs around the corner, the survivors needed to pay more attention to their surroundings. If three survivors are plastered in front of the gate while the last one pulls the switch, and the survivors stay there when Bubba shows up instead of scattering, the survivors misjudged how much time they had. If two survivors try to finish a heal when Bubba's TR is getting louder - again. This is a survivor misplay, not toxic behavior. You seem to have a problem with all of this and want the killer gutted. I say that you need to understand what you can and cannot get away with against different killers.
An instadowning AOE is not intrinsically a bad thing. It just has one really abusive case, but really, camping is an issue with instadowns in general. Try getting a facecamp save with NOED active or against a Blood Fury Oni or a Billy; it's not much better. Luckily the devs do seem to consider facecamping a problem as of late and are looking into it - unluckily, progress on that front can take ages.
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@SilentShepherd said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2765596#Comment_2765596
I hear what you are saying. But Bubba is a unique case in that he has an AoE attack that INSTA DOWNS THE ENTIRE TEAM.
Freddy can't do that. Wraith can't do that.
Bubba's ability lasts for too long, is too easy to control, and has no damn cooldown. How is this even a question. It's broken.
Maybe add a 20 second cooldown before Bubba can use it again.
Or maybe make it so it's not AOE and just downs -1- person at a time each rev.
Okay, but survivors shouldn't be clumped up like that in the first place. First off, it's inefficient and you should be split up for the most part anyway, but this is only an issue in camping situations. If there is any other situation where he can manage to hit two survivors in one chainsaw, it is the survivors' faults for not splitting up and not respecting that his power can hit through people. You don't greed a gen, stick out a heal, or bodyblock when Bubba shows up any more than you do those things in front of a Plague with Corrupt Purge or an Oni with Blood Fury. You don't cluster up against a Legion, either, you stay the hell away from each other unless necessary. Different killers mandate different counterplay, and if you fail to react properly to the killer in question, you're going to end up in bad situations. Against Trapper, you watch the ground. Against Twins, you avoid staying injured. Against Bubba, you split up and you bloody well respect his terror radius so that you avoid getting caught out of position. You might play chicken with a Legion's TR, but you don't mess around with a T3 Myers nearby. Same principle.
Like, if I get unhooked and Bubba's coming back, me and the unhooker will book it in different directions. That's deliberate. I am not attempting a BT block because it will not work, and one of us is sacrificing the best route in order to prevent a chain down. This is why the basement is as good as it is; it's a bottleneck. If you get unhooked and you chase after the unhooker, and Bubba gets both of you - that's not overpowered, that is you making the wrong play and feeding into his power.
You're acting like this AOE instadown is unreasonable and a surprise, but, like... that's what it is. It's right there on the tin. If I try to loop a Huntress like I would a Trapper and I get downed, and I come to the forums complaining that she can hit me from a distance, it's not fair, I already dropped a pallet in front of her so why can she damage me anyway, she wasn't even close to me - that's ridiculous, right? The onus is on me for playing the game wrong, because there's a right way to do it and the right way actually works, so it's not a matter of the killer's kit being intrinsically overpowered.
I hate to say this, but I really think you need to get more experience at this game before you start dictating balance changes, because it seems to me like you don't have a realistic grasp on how things work, how they rate against each other, and what killers and survivors are capable of doing. 20 seconds between power uses is not only insanely punitive, it wouldn't actually help your survival much (you'd just get backrevved, and the camper won't use his power until the unhook happens so that won't stop him either.) All that actually succeeds in doing is making Bubba much more annoyed by pallets - because when he chases, most of his chainsaw sweeps are going to hit a pallet and not a survivor.
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@SilentShepherd said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2765573#Comment_2765573
I was a Michael Myers main, and yes Myers sucks unless you spend BP to use his addons.
And Bubba is too strong. His ability is : INSTA DOWN FROM HEALTHY TO DYING, AOE so it downs MULTIPLE people in it's path, AND you can use it to close gaps because it swings so many times and lunges forward each time.... AND you can control the direction and turn corners whille doing it. OP as hell
There a reason why so many Bubbas in the game.
The reason why there's so many Bubbas in this game is because camping with him is vogue right now. There will always be a chunk of players that flocks to the strategy that yields the best results for the least amount of skill and effort, and they migrate to and fro as they get tweaked. When I first joined, every third match was a Forever Freddy. When he got nerfed, All-Seeing Wraith got a huge spike. When Wraith got nerfed - that was around the same time as CoH, and suddenly it's basement Bubbas everywhere.
Bubba's simple and easy to play, but he's not the strongest killer in the game. He's not even a contender for S-tier. He has ample counterplay and there are several tricks survivors can do that render him an M1 killer with a quick pallet break. His issue is that he's the best camper in the game, and whether you're his victim or not, he essentially doesn't let anyone play the game when he chooses to camp. When you play against a Bubba that's actually dynamically playing the game, he's a fantastic and very fair opponent. You can avoid the instadown in chase, but you need to know what you're doing. It's like Trickster; new survivors think he's Satan incarnate, better survivors just run to high walls. Bubba's more dangerous than Trickster, but the principle is the same. Hug walls, use windows liberally, use lockers as last resorts to make yourself unsawable and force an M1 hit after the tantrum.
I would suggest playing some Bubba to see what it's like on the other side of the wheel. He's certainly not the hardest killer to pick up, but his chainsaw does require some finesse to avoid bumping (which basically loses you a chase; he's the hardest penalized for failing of any killer shy of Twins) and you'll hopefully learn his counterplay by seeing what survivor movements are easy for you to hit and which moves stymie you.
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I find it really ironic that a month ago you were complaining about how playing killer sucks and feels awful and survivors are abusive and toxic, so you're quitting killer forever, and now you've flipped on your head.
Bubba is an exceptionally fair and balanced killer when he's not using his power to camp. I wholly agree that the ease and effectiveness with which Bubba can camp is stupid. But apart from that, his design is great. He's strong and dangerous in chase, and he punishes getting caught in the open, but he has ample counterplay and using his chainsaw as a true antiloop tool is only the wheelhouse of the most skilled Bubbas. If they were to clean up his ability to make a hooked survivor his prisoner and 100% deny saves unless the Bubba actively screws up, I think he'd be in a perfect state. What you need to do is learn how to use windows and lockers to your advantage, or hug structures so tightly that you negate his speed boost and potentially get Bubba to bump. It is not hard to force him to stop chainsawing and go for M1s by simply chaining windows together.
In the meantime, please stop screwing over your poor teammates and play the game. Not every Bubba's a camping troll, and against the ones that are, your ragequitting is ensuring that they get the easy 4k they want.
(And if all three of you rush into the basement to unhook the hooked player - what did you think would happen?)
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I can understand it. That match was a bust when the Meg insta-suicided and the other three want to move onto a match they can play properly.
That said, those three were in accord, but it's rude to give up when the rest of your team is still trying to win (exception when there's two people left, because dying opens up hatch for the last guy.) The first person to ragequit or give up and run at the killer - they'd better have a really good reason why they need to exit the match, or they're a giant tool. Subsequent surrenders are much more understandable; it's ditching a lopsided game instead of dragging it out to its inevitable conclusion.
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@Oiry said:
I do believe Plague is one of the best-designed killers in the game. She is versatile, strong, and has several counterplays, each with its own throwbacks. She has to adapt to the style the survivors choose to play, too. I really like her.
Fully agree. She's got the most dynamic playstyle in the game. Playing her well requires flexibility and also knowing what to do in a constantly changing situation. There's also an element of resource-management with the fountains - for instance, if I have 5 fountains and no survivors are infected, I don't want to infect anyone else until I use some of the fountains.
Lots of people dislike playing against her because she negates traditional healing, but I agree she's one of the best-designed killers in the game. Both the survivors and the Plague have the opportunity to try to play to their strengths when it comes to playing and looping M1 and ranged, aggressive or stealthy/patient, et cetera.
What are everyone's favorite perks to use on her? Stuff like Infectious Fright and Discordance will always play to her strengths, but lately I've developed a love of Plaything on her. It's a good timewaster perk that temporarily bypasses the "you get a fountain and every survivor starts respecting your TR" issue.
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@Canas said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2765442#Comment_2765442
That's a very nice look you got for her. They really should consider giving her a healthy skin, it'd sell insanely well. I legit simp for this killer, I own all her skins with the exception of the one which has her all cloaked up (never went on sale and isn't pretty enough). I'd looove to see a modern day skin for her, though - some diversity from the whole priestess theme would be very welcome.
She absolutely needs a chase-theme, she's criminally underrated.
I actually really like the cloaked skin. It doesn't necessarily match too well with her headdresses, but I did buy the brown version. It was a neat part of her lore that they incorporated. I guess her tome set is a 'more healthy' version, but I actually wasn't too big of a fan - the outfit itself is not my style and I feel like they changed the cast of her face. Like if you inspect the healthy side of her face on most of her bodies and inspect the healthy side of her face on that one, something's off about it - the eyes and set of the mouth, the color and texture of her hair. She looks weirdly like Meg, actually.
Totally agree about a modern-day skin. She has gorgeous cosmetics, but they're pretty samey with a few exceptions. And while it wouldn't fit her theme - we've got Victorian Doctor, mermaid Spirit, tuxedo Wraith. There's precedent for deviations. I wonder what her eventual Greek Legends outfit will be? Also excited for her glacial one.
She used to be criminally underrated, but ever since her QoL buffs and the reign of CoH, more people have been seeing the light.
Fellow simp! I've been waiting for the DBD funkos to come out so I can get her and her alone. I've got to ask, are you at all interested in fan works? There's this one 100k-word Adiris-centric story I found earlier this year - character examination, hypotheticals about her relationship with the Entity, some interactions with survivors - that I'm absolutely in love with (though it was pre: her tome lore and doesn't hold as well now.) But if not, I quite understand - I know most aren't.
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Absolutely love those pre-plague renders for Adiris. The day BHVR releases that as a skin is the day they get all of my money.
In the meantime, have my current Vommy Mommy cosmetic.
Sometimes when I've got 8 hooks early on and I'm goofing around with her, I'll chase a survivor and vom on them nonstop - like, they're fully infected, but I just keep ineffectually puking at them and farming teensy bits of Deviousness. I make a game of it to see how long it takes for them to stop running away and react. Lots of people will eventually stop, pivot, and point at me or shake their head. It's great.
Eagerly awaiting the day she gets her own chase music - the default theme doesn't suit her and I'd love to see what they could do with hymnals, chanting, and perhaps eerie organ or wind instruments. Some Deviousness points QoL would be much appreciated too - her score events are pretty bad and even farming isn't enough to max the category. You need ~20 hits with Corrupt Purge on top of the meager infection score events to do that.
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I do it as killer sometimes to force the survivor to give me their item or boop me for entry. If they don't approach for too long a period of time, I'll assume they know where I am and they're too afraid to approach, so I close it.
I'll also sit on the hatch to encourage the survivor to do the last gen and get Left For Dead, because screw that achievement.
For survivor, nah, I'm out of there.
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@AngyKiller said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2765375#Comment_2765375
'Whaaa! People disagree so the forums are biased!'
If a Killer camps with NoED; The non-hooked Survivors can...oh...I don't know, this is just a WILD idea; GO FIND AND CLEANSE NOED! 😮
But here comes the vague statement on how a camping Killer can somehow not only defend a hook, but all 5 gens and the totem as well. Because NoED is that magically powerful. 🙃
Actually, there is one killer that can do that with NOED - Artist. She can camp the hook and shoot a bird at NOED every 5 seconds. Every other bird will injure you, so you can only reach the 10 second mark max before you get pushed off and the totem resets.
Only thing to do in that situation is run out the gates. Or do all the bones in advance, but that's its own risk when Pentimento is one of her native perks.
Still, there's cheaper tactics out there. She can only guarantee one kill that way.
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@dictep said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2765364#Comment_2765364
ANd noed promotes camping also, before and after it activates. You see less noed comments here because this is a killers forum, and when anyone say something they dislike they come here in hordes
Eh, endgame promotes camping in general. If anything, I prefer a camping NOED killer because it means I can do the bone in peace and then waltz in with BT for the full escape. A NOED killer that's patrolling is way scarier.
I do agree that NOED goes hand in hand with camping, but I think that's actually a tangential thing. Part of NOED's infamy is that unlike Dead Hard, its usage falls off in high level play (because there are more consistent and reliable perks and because good teams deal with hexes efficiently, lessening its usefulness when it does proc.) As a result, the stigma is that it's used by killers who can't get kills without it, because it's most common to find it on new or mediocre players. Those players also tend to hard camp because they're not as good at chases.
It appeals to the same kind of player, is what I'm saying. A killer that's confident they can 4k the survivors probably isn't going to bring NOED except for a funny endgame build; they're going to bring perks that will help them within the match itself, not only the endgame.
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I suspect NOED is a lot like Dead Hard in why people hate the perk. You're in a situation where it feels like you've won and suddenly the floor gets yanked out from under you because your opponent was running a perk. You might recover from the perk quickly, or it might lose you something crucial.
I don't think NOED needs a nerf (it has several forms of counterplay), but it does not feel good to play against and I don't enjoy it. Also, obligatory solo queue suffering when your teammates just bail instead of hunting the totem (or worse, run straight into the meat grinder without any form of strategy.)
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@GodDamn_Angela said:
I'm mainly confused by the fact that they don't seem to take into consideration that the Twins are partially doing so well at high levels of play because they are the least used Killer and rarely encountered so many high level survivors have little practice against them and many of their usual tricks just don't work.
Seriously though, when was the last time most of us actually encountered the Twins?
This, but also, Twins attract so few float players or new Twins looking to learn the killer (because their QoL is horrible and their skill ceiling is generally not considered worth the stress of playing them), so a few dedicated Twins masters can skew the data more than dedicated other-killer players can.
Also, they're really good at camping, which may drag up numbers semi-artificially (as they don't reflect how easy it is to win chases with the killer.)
I definitely think nerfing an underused and overall underperforming killer because the very top level has high kill rates is a bizarre design choice. And their philosophy of 'nerf heavily used addons, buff unused ones' often fails to address why some addons are used and why others aren't. It's often less of a numbers game and more of a 'this effect is not helpful or plausible to activate, and this other effect is helpful throughout the match, so I want that one.'
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Eyrie kind of has the Coldwind defense - the map is super bright and brown, so hexes aren't as visible as they are on a dark map. That said, yeah, most of Eyrie's spawns are really out in the open. The only kind of good ones are the one tucked against the side of main building, the one that spawns in a nook of a jungle gym, and the one next to the painting on the upstairs balconies. Everything else is super accessible and easy to spot.
RCPD had clever totem spots, though (its only issue is that there aren't enough possible spots, so they're easy to memorize.) So did Saloon, Yamaoka, and Midwich, if you're looking at other recent maps.
Derpiest totem spawn maps are Autohaven, MacMillan, and Ormond, in my opinion.
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I prefer messing around with the TTVs to see their reactions. I go for stealthy plays, arrange a bunch of slugs in a pile, etc.
Tunneling them out for being TTVs is a bad take. Do it if they end up being the toxic kind of streamer, but for the most part, they're fledgeling content creators that are mostly just trying to have fun playing the game and entertain for a couple of friends. You're not making any sort of statement beyond "I'm a dick" by aggressively deleting the TTV with 5 viewers who is 'making money off of beating you.'
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Should be the 25th, yes. They typically come on Tuesdays, 3 weeks after the PTB launches.
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@Lat0 said:
They're really strong but not that broken, y'all exagerrating.
Medkits are more powerful and they don't even take slots
Medkits have limited uses for whoever's holding it. CoH has unlimited use for the entire team for a variable time cost (could be 14s, could be more if you place the totem badly or the killer is aggressive about snuffing - which is time you honestly get back if they choose to hunt totems, but still, it has to be blessed each time.)
Medkits are powerful, but if you offered me a ranger medkit with gel dressings or CoH, I'd take CoH. The self-heals are the same speed, the teammate heals are better, and there's no limit. I've played games where I healed up at least 7 times using a totem or two. If I'm in a war of attrition, a medkit's going to run out; CoH has my back down to the end of the line.
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@SilentShepherd said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2764105#Comment_2764105
No, I'm not. CoH is fine. Killers just whining instead of just stomping the boon out and tunneling the boon'er.
If just "tunnel out the perk holder" is your answer for how to deal with the perk, something is wrong with the perk, because that means there's no counterplay beyond "delete it." Old DS had more realistic counterplay than CoH.
Also, if more than one player has the perk, you're still screwed. I've had some nasty matches with 3-4 CoHs and I had no flexibility to do anything. And even if there's just one, you can't tell who the booner is until you catch them booning or do some process-of-elimination over the course of multiple lightnings. It's not October anymore; people who aren't Mikaela do have the perk.
We shouldn't be encouraging tunneling and any perk that inadvertently does already has something wrong with it. And snuffing realistically does nothing. Boon goes back up as soon as you leave the area or stop pressuring the perk holder, and the mega efficient heals resume. It's not worth it unless you stumble across the totem when you're not chasing someone (snuffing it mid-chase often lets the runner reach another loop, which loses you much more than the 3-second detour to snuff.)
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@Heartbound said:
I really think they should change that. Let the hooks stick in the survivor for the duration of the puzzle box channel, that'd be fine but right now it's pretty un-intuitive.
Oh! That box is yellow! I should go grab it and stop the chain hunt!
Okay let me solv- let me solve i- let me-
Pinhead: THE BOX
Oh okay.
At least when he do the came, it ends the chain hunt. The worst is fiddling with the box angrily for 25 seconds and then he shows up to smack it out of your hands personally and everything goes to pot.
As underpowered as Pinhead is, they really should fix that. Being unable to solve the box without your whole team hugging you in a triangle formation like some kind of magical girl ritual is deeply obnoxious.
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@TragicSolitude said:
This happens to me constantly on Swamp and Red Forest. The zombies don't have the sense god gave a Roomba.
My Roomba's old and gets caught for hours bumping back and forth on the seam between the hallway and the bathroom.
...Seems like they borrowed his AI for the zombies.
So no, not a hack, but a feature. You've just gotta put 'em down when they get stuck.
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@Pulsar said:
I thought it was an interesting video.
Of course, we have to assume that the guy is telling the truth.
Also, yeah, everyone knew the game being free on the EGS would be a disaster
Seriously. All the fun of burner accounts without any need to pay for them. Some people stacked up thousands of backups during the free week... jesus.
Also nice to hear more confirmaton about how people can get away with obvious hacks or outright baiting the report team for weeks before they get banned, if at all. The recent spike in cheaters and the lack of a functioning anticheat would be severely mitigated if the report system in this game actually worked at a pace that exceeded "particularly sleepy glacier", but here we are.
Very interesting interview. A little disturbing peering into just how flimsy the bulwark is (and of course screw the guy who's being interviewed for enabling all of this bs, as interesting as it is to peer onto the other side), but I think we all already knew that.
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I don't think Blindness can ever be balanced in its current state. Its best use is preventing you from seeing where downed or hooked teammates are. And that's got great utility... when the survivors aren't telling each other that info anyway.
Effective against solos, worthless against SWFs. You can't fix that without overhauling the effect entirely.
It's also generally a pretty bad status effect to apply in chase, because it's most useful on the survivors who aren't your current target (which is why Third Seal or Fearmonger are way better than 90% of killer blindness addons.) The survivor you're chasing couldn't care less about auras unless they're running Blood Amber.
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@dugman said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2763426#Comment_2763426
Relighting the Boons indefinitely isn't an issue for Boons in general. Shadowstep and Exponential for instance aren't powerful enough that having it be replacable after being disabled hasn't been a problem. Only Circle of Healing has been controversial, so the answer has been to tone that one down. This nerf is a step in that direction. I don't know if 75% will be enough or not, but either way tuning that healing speed parameter is the simplest direct way to balance this perk. They can set that number to anywhere from 0 to as high as they want for instance, and at 0% it does literally nothing so obviously there must be some range where the percentage is low enough that the perk isn't overpowered but still high enough that it's something survivor would want to use.
I don't agree that infinite relighting isn't a problem outside of CoH. It's also an issue with Shadowstep. Shadowstep is held back because on most maps, the effect ranges from meh to awful. Might catch me off guard on Autohaven or I might still see where you ran. On Ormond or Eyrie, good luck on it doing anything at all. So the perk is typically slept on when map offerings aren't involved.
On indoor maps, though?
In Midwich or RCPD, you can cover most of the map with two boons. That's two-floor coverage on a dark map with tons of doorways and turns and smudgy floor textures to make blood that much harder to see. No scratch marks. Toss in Iron Will and I genuinely cannot chase anyone, because they will effectively disappear as soon as I break a pallet or hit them. I end up with no choice but to go back and snuff the totem, and then they put it back in the same spot for maximum coverage and I'm back to square one. Rinse and repeat. Lery's or the Game, I can see blood, but an uninjured survivor can disappear the instant they leave my sight. Same with Badham main building or Coldwind corn.
With CoH, the location isn't as important - you just need to put it somewhere where the killer won't walk by it while patrolling. Shadowstep is more of a case where it relies on being lit somewhere with high walls, but when you have the right spot, the value you can get out of it is extreme and the killer again has to find out who's doing it and tunnel them out if they want to stop it.