Kilmeran
Kilmeran
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@UlvenDagoth Well, I have money and I won't be. Like with any Battlepass out there on the market, I'll first see if I can play enough to progress through it far enough for free. If I do, then I'll buy it to unlock the paid rewards.
In two years of Battlepasses across most my games, that has happened exactly one time so far.
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@FishFry247 From what I saw, it is to a degree. As you progress, you choose your Challenges along a web, which kind of sets your path. So, you could have a slightly different path than your teammates to a degree.
The issue seemed to arise that the Challenges are just glorified or harder dailies. Such as get three Flashlight saves, Get 5 safe unhooks, Kill a Survivor through the Entity at End Game Collapse, Heal a Downed Survivor to Healthy X-times (that one I might be remembering slightly wrong), et cetera.
Since they are the progression model for the Archives/Rift, I already saw a lot of games focusing on Challenges, even to the point of farming their random teammates, instead of actually playing the game normally.
Hey, it might be good for Killers as Gens certainly won't be rushed. But over time, I think it is going to hurt the Solo survivor experience even more.
I also wonder what this will do to Ranks. I can see people de-pipping in matches as they worry so much about Challenges as opposed to playing a rounded game for the emblems.
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@Kerbert @FishFry247 I'm also waiting to see how the Challenges play out in Live over time, especially for Solo survivors.
I was watching some streamers today on PTR and saw some things that made me step back. One streamer had a challenge for flashlight saves. I watched them stealth follow a killer until someone was downed and picked up so they could go for the save.
I watched another hide around the map waiting for fellow survivors to be hooked, so they could get some of their 5 Safe Hook Saves completed before someone else could run in for the save.
What I saw was a lot of worrying about the Challenges and less about doing Gens and playing the game normally. Especially now since, unlike the old Dailies that were just some extra BP, these Challenges are directly tied into the Archive/Rift core progression model.
I think it's going to be rough for Solo survivors, since a SWF can better layer and coordinate getting Challenges done between them. I already saw enough "farming" of one's fellow survivors today to have concern over the Solo survivor, random teammates, grinding Challenges problems.
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I'm waiting to see how that pans out. How many real hours it takes to complete. How many folks do it. I know BHVR claimed 70-80 hours to complete, but I'm positive that doesn't account for queue times and other factors.
Can it pay for itself? Absolutely. Will it for most people? I've been around enough battlepasses over the past few years to know enough to maintain a wait and see stance.
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@DevourOfSalt said:
The amount of ass kissing comments here just ignore them lol
but yh battle pass should never be in game if this was free to play absolutely fine but since its not its unacceptable. And just plan greedy oh dont buy alot will say but its not the point battle passes should not be in a paid game period doesn't matter if i buy it or not
@DevourOfSalt @ProfessorDunwich I would expect them to continue to find new ways to monetize DbD now that they are firmly in financial bed with Netease:
GUANGZHOU, China, July 15, 2019 /PRNewswire/ -- NetEase Games, the online games division of NetEase, Inc. (NASDAQ: NTES), one of China's leading internet and...It is what it is. More and more game developers are getting into bed with Chinese investment, either through Tencent buying a portion of them out, or Netease doing so. And it keeps resulting in the same end game: microtransactions and monetization to double, triple, or quadruple dip into your wallet.
You either accept it, or try to find a game developer that isn't in bed with them . . . yet.
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@nos4a2 said:
The king put up a YouTube video stating that it starts on the 10th and runs through the 1st. No starting it on the 22nd is not ample time to do the grind that is expected .
@nos4a2 Okay, and The King doesn't work for BHVR and has now been proven wrong by BHVR.
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/93854/ clearly states October 22- November 1st. Per BHVR.
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@Carpemortum It's more than just a cash grab.
I noticed something about the challenges on their Archives/Rift page. The Mastery Challenges will require specific Perks to complete. Those Perks will be available in the Shrine the week the Mastery Challenge releases.
For Vets, that's a non-issue. For new players, or players who didn't grind all the Perks yet, it's a subtle way to force those folks to spend their shards in the Shrine on Perks, instead of saving them for cosmetics here and there. It's a disguised way to push that segment of the player base into buying even more auric cells for cosmetics, since they were probably buying some anyway since 9,000 cells for a cosmetics isn't a fast earn for them.
But now, to complete some Mastery Challenges, they'll have to dump those shards into the shrine.
Remember, I was debating making DbD my main game due to Overwatch burn-out, but was waiting for the Archives/Rift into to see the practices involved.
Nope. It'll remain a side game . . . a very, very side game now.
To be honest, some of what I have learned today is actually leaning me toward a permanent uninstall and no longer giving another dime to BHVR. Just like I don't touch EA games anymore.
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@Blackadder I wouldn't know. I stopped playing Apex right after the first Battlepass came out, I just remember that you could earn the cost of it back throughout the pass if you leveled the entire thing. It was the argument people made over there as well. So, I was pointing out to him that BHVR isn't the first to do that.
Personally, I play DbD as a side game, so have zero interest in buying their Rift. I won't be playing enough.
I also didn't care for the fact that some Mastery Challenges will require specific Perks, according to their PTB release descriptions of it. Oh, but those Perks will go into the Shrine for the week the challenges release.
I see that as no issue for Vets who have everything unlocked. But for newer players, it's a disguised way to get them to spend their Shards on Perks for the challenges, instead of saving them for cosmetics. Which is a subtle nudge to pushing new players to buying Auric cells for cosmetics, since instead, if they want to advance their little Mastery Challenges then they need to get those Perks off the shrine.
I also doubt I will be doing most of the Archive. I like to play Survivor with my kid when he wants to play, so need to be careful not to advance my Rank since our little two man SWF under the MM changes would preclude us playing together. He's not going to be able to play against mid or high rank Killers. So, I don't play Survivor anymore except on the odd times he wants to mess around with Dad.
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@starkiller1286 said:
That is an interssting way to do it. Cant say i heard of a battle pass you buy and it slowly refunds itself once you hit max.
@starkiller1286 Apex Legends did just that. At least the Battlepasses did back when I played it.
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@Carpemortum said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/744952#Comment_744952
I'm not going to.
My point isnt that I want it for free. My point is that they're greedy little shits acting like they're doing us a favor by giving us "cool new #########" when cosmetics already cost $10 a pop.
They're turning into a lower class Blizzard.
@Carpemortum At least Blizzard games work properly and aren't the same bugs for years on end.
If anything, BHVR is coming off as a poor man's EA.
And I'm with you. I've spent a decent penny on DbD. I have disposable income. I'm the type of player that doesn't mind spending on games. Hell, I own all the statues for Overwatch, and just pre-ordered the Mei statue.
I'm not giving them a dime for the Rift.
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They can deter DCs, but what they can't stop is being dying on first hook. And while I've seen Killers state they prefer that since they still get points, it's the Survivor teams that are going to continue to suffer.
When someone doesn't find a match fun, they will find a way to leave it. DC's are not required to screw the experience for three other Survivor players.
And if enough Survivors in a match do it for whatever reason (SWF maybe) it also screws the Killer out of BP and maybe even Pips. Remember, the system does not reward fast sacrifices anymore.
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@SteelDragon They've already shown they will delay them. I don't see where your worry is coming from. BHVR has delayed them and showed they want to get them right.
Yes, they are going to be tested in the Live game as part of that process. In any video game, a minority of players use the Public Test Servers. It's a regular complaint throughout the industry from development teams. BHVR needs as much player feedback and as many players on the Dedicated Servers as possible to get accurate data. Which means we're going to continue to see Live Tests throughout the process now.
Blame your fellow gamers who don't want to use the PTB.
But the cold reality is that not every member of the DbD playerbase is going to benefit from Dedicated Servers. Hell, there are Overwatch players, on Blizzard's top-of-the-line servers and Netcode, that suffer lag and other issues. It al depends on location, personal internet, and other factors.
But the same was true of P2P as well. Not every player benefitted from the original set-up, either.
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@SteelDragon said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/739491#Comment_739491
well don't forget like I said they got a lot of other stuff to do, work on the next chapter, the upcoming mid chapter update, the map reworks (which are more needed than dedicated servers tbh) balance changes. the archive event. skins. the Halloween event. etc. so it is not a all hands on deck for working on the dedicated servers
@SteelDragon All of which should be immaterial. You do realize that doing network and server coding is a different beast from programming perks and killer powers, or doing map design?
Unless their team is a majority Jack of All Trades but Masters of None somehow, the folks dealing with the Netcoding are very unlikely to be the general game programmers.
I actually have folks in my family with Masters Degrees in that field. Three people, as a matter of fact. And not a one of them could program game code to any professional degree.
But they can handle your server and networking coding just fine.
And yes, the issues being faced would be normal. The difference is that pretty much any other game studio would have built their game and the servers from the start to use Dedicated Servers. The issues would have been discovered and handled during closed Alpha, closed Beta, and then the final tweaks in Open Beta via massive player testing and load testing.
BHVR is doing this to a live Game-As-Service three-plus years after the fact. So, it's going to be messy as hell.
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@SteelDragon I'll reserve judgement on that until they announce they are launching them. They technically have until December 21st (the last day of Fall) to do so and make their new schedule, and a lot can happen with the Netcode in two-and-a-half months.
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@SteelDragon To be fair, this was one live test. Now they tweaking again. I'm fairly confident there will be additional Live tests throughout October.
So, the original server launch delay is still in effect. And they said Fall 2019, which gives them until late December.
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@SteelDragon Agreed. As I stated, while my experience was smooth all around, there was enough negative feedback that it is obvious their Netcode still needs some serious work.
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@UlvenDagoth I agree with you. The weekday DbD Steamcharts count last week was where it normally hovers. The weekend daily count has been over 30k most of the day yesterday and today.
I would wager that the SWF matchmaking changes haven't actually made too many people leave. At least not on PC.
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@Lithuanian It's not about firing people, it's about shifting resources. The team that designs the killer and survivor appearances would still do work on store cosmetics.
The team that codes the Perks, the killer powers, et cetera are coders, they can be shifted to finding the bugs in the code causing issues.
Obviously, for the amount of bugs in the game and the slow pace of fixing them, they need more coders on bug-squashing.
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Gotcha. Then I would say yes, report them. Such things are not allowed in the game by BHVR, be it in lobby chat or after-match chat. It also helps to send a screenshot of it in the report, if possible.
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@FairP1ayer said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/738387#Comment_738387
I hear the Euro servers were amazing, and the American ones were awful, so perhaps some of the server locations just need some optimizations.
@FairP1ayer Depends on the player. I live in Maryland, United States, one State away from the east coast data center. I have extremely fast internet. I had zero issue with the dedicated Server.
But yes, from the general feedback, their Netcode needs a lot more work before these servers are ready for prime-time.
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Is there some context you'd like to explain for wanting to report in the lobby?
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Eh. Never mind. I'm wasting my time saying the same crap over and over again.
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@GuyNamedPubert Well, if all you worry about is the main objective, then don't complain about NOED. Cleanse totems, and the killer won't be able to use NOED. The counter for it is right there in the game, on each and every map. You're choosing to ignore it, and then complaining about.
And Not_Queen stated months ago when Freddy was reworked that NOED is not getting changed. Cleanse totems. It has a counter.
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@FiftyCalReaper Yes, I found his portals to be cumbersome. They do not fit my play style. I don't need 100 hours and YouTube videos to determine that. I also do not like his Shred. Again, I don't need significant time to determine whether or not I like it.
I do not like the way he plays. Therefore, I am not going to get the mileage out of him that I would someone like Hag, whom I do enjoy. Or Myers or Pig, which I also enjoy.
Period. I don't care how it looks to you. Those are my feelings on him. I'm not interested in how viable or good he is, or how great his portals can be with more experience. I don't like how they play. I don't find him fun.
And whether or not it is fun is all I give a damn about when it comes to DbD. I play this game here and there only to run around as a Slasher horror killer. So, I will invest play time into characters I think are fun. Nothing more.
@anarchy753 Thank you. Someone gets it.
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@FiftyCalReaper That is where your argument has fallacy. If this was League, or even Overwatch where I have experience as my main game since Beta to the present day, I would agree with you. The characters there are much more complex, and when playing them in an environment of team vs team, and counters vs counters, there are a lot more moving parts to consider.
Two hours even on an Overwatch hero is nothing due to that. In two hours it is impossible to determine how the character fairs against their counters, how they synergize with various other cast members and in what combinations, what positioning is best for them, what maps are best for them, when best to use their Ultimates for greatest effect, and so forth.
Killers in DbD are nowhere near as complex, nor does a DbD match have nearly as many moving parts.
Now, I never stated how viable or nonviable he is, nor did I ever state anything about top tier. I don't climb to high ranks in DbD. I play it as a side game and don't play enough matches in a month. I stated that after two hours, I don't feel me spending the time on him is worth the payoff (to me) when I could instead place that time into Spirit or Hag, both of which I've played and see myself getting better mileage out of.
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@HP150 That's been my impression. I just bought him today and played him for over 2 hours. To be honest, his portals are cumbersome, Shred is easy to dodge, and although I got 2ks and 3ks with him, that was more on the Survivors not being the best rather than a testament to Demogorgon.
I can see where the learning curve is, but to be honest if I am going to put that time into someone I already don't normally play, it would be Spirit or Hag over him. I just don't see where the payoff is really worth the effort and time.
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@Blackowt_9120 Okay, that makes sense. I was about to comment about that crap being broken, otherwise. That would be like using Surge, and then being able to kick the same generator for PGTW.
By the way, bought Stranger Things tonight and tested Demogorgon out using only Surge. Now I am torn between TT and Surge.
Surge actually saved my ass tonight. They did the outlying gens, and then kept getting hit with Surge on everything they tried to do mid and late game because I kept downing people. Ended in a 3k with a hatch escape, my second match in. Map was Haddonfield.
But, not sure how that would play out on a wider map like Coldwind.
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@Attackfrog A fairly accurate explanation.
Also, let's not forget that his fans fell for the biggest scam in publishing history: Rushing into stores to buy a book, one chapter at a time.
I had friends that worked at Waldenbooks back then. We privately laughed at those people.
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@[Deleted User] said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/737578#Comment_737578
It’s good.
Pretty much gets right into things straight away, other than an expected lull in the first quarter of the story.
Or just wait for the James Wan film (The Conjuring, Saw)
@DudeDelicious I'm 47, so I remember the old 1979 miniseries for the book. Didn't know a new version was coming out.
Speaking of getting to things straight away, ever try to read Under the Dome? I'd like to beat King with his own book after attempting that one. Get. To. The. Damned. Point.
I made it about 200 pages in and returned it to the library.
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@BBQnDemogorgon Two things to remember when correlating the financial success of IT Part 2 with general reviews.
First, those who stated those things already paid their money into the studio revenue pool to see it.
Second, those who spent the time and money to go see Part 1 were going to see Part 2 regardless.
Movie-goers, in general, hate not completing a series. Look at Disney Star Wars. Solo was a disappointment for the studio, but even after the poor feedback regarding The Last Jedi, people will still go see Episode 9 to complete the trilogy. But in the case of a standalone like Solo, a lot skipped it in theaters.
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@DudeDelicious I need to give Salem's Lot a shot. People who tend to agree with me about King always point to that book as an exception.
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@Fibijean Ah, yeah, that. I've experienced that. I am in the post-game screens, I get the disconnect notification, then flicker back to the post game screens but chat is no longer working.
I basically assumed the same thing. The server disconnected that segment due to inactivity.
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@Weck I hate that damned swamp. 😂
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@DrVeloxcity Hmmm, didn't realize that about I'm All Ears.
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@bomb1720 I bought the DLC tonight.
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@Weck Except the swamp. Past two nights, a majority of my matches have been on the effing swamp. Often times three to four times in a row.
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@TheHoodedOne Strangely, The Mist was the only Stephen King book that didn't cure my insomnia.
The man can create good stories and characters, but damn his writing style and pacing puts me to sleep.
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Stephen King did not inspire The Mist.
The Mist was a film, and then television series, that adapted a novella by Stephen King.
He didn't inspire it, he created and wrote the novella they are licensed on.
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@Supernaut Depends. Is the game still running? Are you still in queue or able to queue? If so, then it's probably just a bug in the code triggering and sending out a false message.
If no to the above, then the server dumped you. Which I wouldn't find to be unexpected right now since they are merely testing Dedicated Servers and the Netcode clearly needs some work.
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@altruistic Hell, welcome to any online game that requires any sort of real team coordination.
I'll take my 3 or 4 stack team over a team of five other randoms in Overwatch any day of the week. Even when 1 or 2 players in that stack aren't all that great at their roles.
Voice comms or not, friends who play a game together are going to develop a sense of everyone's job and expectations, be it DbD, Overwatch, a MOBA, or squads in a B.R. It's something that randoms just will not have. Most of the time in random teams, there is an innate sense of not being able to trust your teammates, so a lone-wolf, my ass before yours, comes into play.
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@Blackowt_9120 Interesting. So, we can still kick a gen that the Entity has blocked via Thrilling Tremors?
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@Supernaut That's probably because when the match ends, you're usually jumping server segments from the match portion back to the lobby portion, so you're being disconnected from the one.
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@SpacingLlamas I think the issue with Deathgarden is that Hunter really does require aim ability (unless you played the latest Hunter, which really was broken at its launch), especially when going against Scavengers who know what they're doing. And let's face it, many people that play DbD and went to DG probably weren't steady shooter players.
I play Overwatch, and have since 2016. Although I main Tank and Support, I can also very effectively play Soldier 76, Hanzo, Widowmaker, and Ashe. So, I can aim. Hunter wasn't that difficult for me when I tried DG during a free period. Tracking a Scavenger was no more difficult for me than tracking a Genji.
Unfortunately, before that weekend was over, I was already growing bored with the matches. I'm not sure what they're missing, but they somehow felt less engaging than matches in DbD. And this is from someone who plays DbD has a side game and doesn't think its game play is that in-depth, and becomes repetitive quickly.
As a result, I did not purchase the game.
Looking back, I think it might be yet another behavior game that suffers from poor map design. In Deathgarden you have scavengers and hunters with hyper-mobility, high jumping, and wall-climbing. and yet maps that are designed as though the characters move around like in DbD.
Deathgarden is a game that would benefit much more from urban-style environments, even if apocalyptic cities, with nooks and crannies, more elevations, and structures to truly chase through. Maps where when to use the hyper-mobility and when not to do so requires more thought. Maps where drones weren't so damned map covering, and I say that as someone that played mostly Hunter that weekend.
One thing I have learned is that BHVR is very bad at balancing map design with their own game play design.
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@SpacingLlamas I'm going to be honest here, the coding in general in Deathgarden is far better than here in DbD.
The issue is that the game, itself, is utterly failing to keep people engaged.
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@SpacingLlamas Exactly!
And for years BHVR resisted Dedicated Servers and stated it was not on the plate. Until they decided to port to the Switch, which requires Dedicated Servers. That changed their mind, and now they're scrambling since they obviously want to maintain a consistent build across all platforms. Particularly if they want to ever implement cross-play between all four platforms down the line, like many other games are now doing.
But this is potentially going to be a rough process. I would imagine a lot of 2020 is going to be dealing with Dedicated Server issues.
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@PeenutsButt3r Well, if they're using Amazon GameLit for servers, there won't be one in Russia. Looks like it's only Germany, Britain, and Ireland over there for data centers.
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Good question. In games with Dedicated Servers, that typically means a hamster probably just died of a heart attack. I would assume it to mean the same thing here: a server hiccup, just that BHVR didn't change the announcement text.
To be fair, I sometimes even get that in Overwatch, which has good servers and netcode, and my internet is still active and fine.
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Stabbing people as Michael Myers. The primary reason I bought the game in the first place.
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@Chewy102 said:
To give my personal example what how servers are compared to P2P after finally giving myself some time to play.
I attempt to be a good P2P host and often am. Survivors in my lobbies always had pings of 80-100ms with the oddball going up to 150 or so. If someone had 200+, Id dodge the lobby as that would make for poor gameplay. DbD doesn't work well when a ping gets over 200 so Id rather just not. But in 5 out of 6 games, my lobbies would have nothing but good pings so I thought I was a good host.
On dedicated servers, my ping is 140ms. Don't know what pings the Survivors are getting, but if Im getting 140ms where I live then ANYTHING they are getting is going to make our combined pings well over 200ms! By the time someone sees me coming, Im already landing the hit. That isn't fair and it is clear to see in gameplay with Survivors not reacting to anything or simply walking into me from weak sauce mind games.
I live in the middle of West Virginia, and according to the only server list I could find the nearest server to me is in upper Virginia. Not even a state away and Im getting a ping of 140ms. Going from 80ms games that most would call good/great connections to playing something I called unplayable. Crap to say the least and I feel bad for playing with such poor connections after going through the time/effort/money to make certain for that NOT to happen!
Dedicated servers are not worth the effort. Not unless you put a server in every state to keep to the same low ping standards we are used to from P2P. And that's just for the US! You have to have a LOT more than that for the rest of the world.
Is DbD playable. Yes.
Is it up to the standards are already had? Hell no.
@Chewy102 Okay, and I live in Baltimore County, Maryland. Slightly closer to the data center than you, but not close enough to make a difference. And my ping is 30-38. However, I also run expensive ass internet at my home, because I work from home and need it, which might make some difference.
But I have had no issues with the server test so far.
But your assessment of Dedicated Servers is off, otherwise games that require a lot more data back and forth, and faster processing time, such as Overwatch, would not use such servers. And they're dealing with a combination of 12 characters per match, all the hits and misses in real time back and forth, projectile versus hitscan, and so forth. Not just a combination of five characters.
The issue is that BHVR has a ton of work to do on their Netcode.
Vinc3ntvega lives in Eastern Shore, Maryland, which is the southern part of the state and near Virginia and that data center. Has anyone watched his Stream to see how his experience is with the Dedicated Servers?
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@SpacingLlamas In my experience, and bear in mind that when I worked in the game industry networking and servers were not my area by any stretch of the human imagination, you have a game coded for P2P, and are moving it into Dedicated Servers well into its commercial lifespan. On top of that, you're doing this in such a way that, unlike if you had the servers during a closed Alpha, closed Beta, and then Open Beta phases pre-launch, you have to deal with getting all the Netcode correct and damn near flawless under Live conditions.
My expectations were very tempered from the initial announcement. This is not a small undertaking. Most large studios don't do it this way. And BHVR hasn't exactly been known for their coding work on DbD so far. No offense to them, it just is what it is on that subject.
Can they pull it off? Sure, yes they can. But only time will tell.