Gandor
Gandor
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@mizark3 said:
I would only go with the 3rd, at a rate of 1/5 round down. So with our current 38 available maps Killers could ban 7.
Personally I would also have map offerings be changed with this as well.
First off, all map offerings are rolled into 1 offering. When you pick the map offering you get a sub menu to pick the specific map. This also helps with inventory bloat.
With 7 bans there are 31 maps to be 'rolled' from. Survivor map offerings add 3 extra 'rolls' for a specific map. Killer map offerings add the 31-38 rolls (depending on number of bans used) for the map they want. This way they can avoid banning certain maps to raise their odds of a map being rolled against offerings.
In a circumstance where a survivor brings an offering for a map that is banned, they still add 3 'rolls' to the map pool subtracted by 1 for the ban, for a total of 2 rolls out of the new total, 33 if all 7 bans are used, and only 1 map offering being made.
Finally, the Sacrificial Ward is buffed to prevent the maps being offered from showing up, instead of only preventing the bonus chance. This still can be negated by 4 identical map offerings, but those would lock in the realm now instead of the map.
One positive aspect of this is if some maps are universally banned at a disproportionate rate, then BHVR can see which maps are the problem children and might need altering in some way.
One neutral aspect of this is Kill rates will likely go up, resulting in some form of Survivor compensatory buff later down the line. Since BHVR wants 60% kill rates we can expect Survivor's would get something to counterbalance this. Hence why this is in Neutral.
Another neutral aspect is neither side can as easily force maps. Since both sides can do this, both for good and for ill, I place this here in the middle. I thoroughly enjoy Lery's Scratched Mirror Myers matches as both sides, but despise Midwich matches against Nurse.
A negative aspect is Killers won't learn how to play on their bad maps as much, so they will be all the more annoyed when a map offering rolls the map. This can also lead to Survivors having a worse experience as the Killer could be aggravated enough to play in a manner the Survivor's don't enjoy, in an attempt to 'equalize' the suffering.
Oh there is nothing more that killer can do to make the experience worse. People like the one who created this thread https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/352131/there-should-be-an-option-to-play-vs-solo-survivors-only-as-a-killer are rather common. There will not be anything more they can do. There is already way too many blights that send you to mcmillan with C33 and alchemist ring. Also I still can't fathom why making the game balance for 3 out of 5 wins for killer a good idea. I find it inherently unfair. But it explains all the new tiles and everything that has been happening lately with the game
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@BabyShrimp said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3244694#Comment_3244694
Sounds good. Face camping Bubba is iconic. Realistically, tea baggers shouldn't complain about tunneling/camping, after all, It's all fair game. Face camping Bubba is only good for the memes tho, as I said in the original post the best counter is doing gens. The best build for camping Bubba (imo) is noed, insidious, agitation, and iron grasp bc it's very hard to get out of the basement, you'll have no terror radius, and 9/10 if things go bad you can fall back on noed for at least a 1k. If you play basement Bubba you should hide out of sight, sometimes that's in the basement, other times it's guarding the entrance.
Swap insidious for deadlock and you'll see the change. Insidious does not really help. Especially on Bubba, because everyone expects it. And you would also be surprised that no - it's not usually 1K, but 2K instead (with the exception if survivors are able to run you for minutes until first down happens. Then it can be 0K - but each down is kill). This version has very real chance of getting 3K or 4K if survivors screw up in any way - btw this is also the reason why it's so much complained about. It's super boring, unfair and all around bad sportsmanship
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@SundayRaid said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3244422#Comment_3244422
You reply like you're a killer, but it's obvious by all your posts you're a survivor as everything you write is just defending their behavior. So I'm not sure why you would feel qualified to say it happens 5% of the time. It's just not logical. Because unless you're playing with a coordinated group you can't speak about what the rest of the groups are always doing. SOMEONE is rushing the freaking hook. If you are playing with a coordinated group of friends, then you're experience is with them and not with the larger playerbase.
You think that players only rush hooks 5% of the time....but there is a "HigH cHanCE" killers will camp and tunnel? Come on man. Give me a break.
Anyway, you're wrong. 95% of the time. Not 5%. Nuff said.
If you are part of game, you see what happens to you or to person near you (especially because HUD exists). I play solo and swf. I obviously don't count swf as they know better then to farm me (yes, even with basekit BT, what you are saying is farming survivor). And yes it still happens in my solo games... But it's like 1 in 20 games. So 5%. And maybe it happens more in a game that I am in, but it would mean a few things - a, I am preocupied to watch the hud (so probably in chase - meaning it's save to unhook as obviously I will not loop next to hooked person) b, it does not happen immediatelly - meaning killer is camper. In this case there is no helping it anyway. Like it would still make sense to use most of camping time on gens, but... Nobody plays perfect.
But maybe you are in a different skill group and these things happen to you. It's just that they don't happen to me often. Certainly not 99.999%. it's not even close
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@SundayRaid said:
Camping and tunneling is NON ISSUE if other players immediately rush the hook. Which is what happens 99.999% of the time.
For a killer to not be accused of camping/tunneling they would have to actively ignore and give a free pass to the players literally rushing to the hook often before the first survivor is even placed on it.
I see that happen about 5% of times. It does happen, but very rarely. Usually survivors in my games get unhook any time between 20-50 sec after being on hook. Insta unhook does NOT happens 99.999%. What happens in every other game is, that killer camps. Meaning he will stay in proximity of hook until 1 of 2 things happen. A, survivor gets unhooked - there is high chance killer will now decide to tunnel. Not always. Some killers only camp. Some only tunnel. But those that camp will probably also tunel. B, survivor dies on hook.
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@JustWhimsical said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3244290#Comment_3244290
That's the problem, isn't it? Unfun playstyles aren't likely to ever go away for either side, and it's way too hard to balance niche perks in a way that they are suitable for both sides, not too strong and not too weak. It often causes mediocre perks to release, like boon: a dark theory that very much was released so weak due to fears it would be abused if they made it stronger.
There are tons of perks out there that are just better to use in an SWF, like head-on as a prime example which is why you often see teams of all using head-on because even though it's a bad perk, normally, when they can force flashlight saves it becomes a very fun and useful tool to use against killers, but often creates miserable matches for the said killer.
I wish there were a way to make it a healthy balance, but ever since the boil-over incident, I don't see how they can balance it, as there are always going to be cases where unfun playstyles come out. Now I would say boil-over still is a bad perk, it will never be a good perk unless they were able to give it a buff, but the buff has to be something that won't make it as bad when facing bully squads.
Although I think slugging and tunneling is a bit tricky as sometimes it is fine to use, like when all the survivors go out of their way to fall into your hands, and sometimes a survivor just is unlucky getting caught repairing a generator after a hook or 1-2 gens left which I feel is very much fine to tunnel in as you need a survivor out asap then typically there is a bit of nuance to it. Though tunneling at the start of the game is boring and slugging all survivors all the time without hooking anyone is dreadfully boring, and both should be removed.
I don't mind tunneling so long as killer gives opportunity to reset. I mean technically it's still tunneling, but that's OK for me personally
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@JustWhimsical said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3241869#Comment_3241869
Just because you win in the end doesn't make it fun. I wish there were a give-up button after a certain amount of time, like rainbow six's surrender as a bad example of how it might work or whatever, lol because I instead play normally than play in a match where people are using gimmick builds to troll you like a trapper or any killers who can't do much against it. Is there a point in winning if it wasn't fun for you, that's why we play games, isn't it? To have fun.
Exactly. And yet camping and tunneling is "valid tactics". Remove both. Even tho it would be harder to distinguish between bully squad and legit plays
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@YOURFRIEND said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3243746#Comment_3243746
What exactly does that legion combo do, precisely? If you predrop it does nothing. It does nothing vs. strong windows. It's a dumb meme.
You predrop he destroys the pallet with iri button. You stun, you charge her power+spirit fury and gain little by enduring. Map contains almost no window loops. I ask you what CAN you do as survivor? Try it out and then talk.
@YOURFRIEND said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3243768#Comment_3243768
You're winning as a mediocre huntress cuz you don't play her and your MMR is rock bottom, you little weirdo. You're making sweeping statements and generalizations with only your personal anecdotes to back them up.
Because high MMR killers don't hit survivors when they are animation stunned?
@Unam said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3243768#Comment_3243768
So, you are basically saying:
You rarely play killer, you dont even own every killer, nor are you really good on playing killer.
Which means you are not playing against good survivors due to lack of playtime on killerside.
Yet, you still have the AUDACITY, to label killers as easy you havent even played yourself?
Maybe, just MAYBE, consider the fact you are not as good as a survivor as you think, which may be due to the fact you rarely play killer and therefore dont know their weaknesses...
You are the prime example of a surv main, crying for killer nerfs bcs he simply doesnt know or understand #########!
Dont talk about balance if you never stood on the other side of the scale!
It makes you look like a total idiot.
Case closed!
Maybe I play against good killer? Maybe as a matter of fact I am almost repeating what large killer mains (in this case Otz) said? Maybe you are blinded and biased? Case closed.
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@Unam said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3243746#Comment_3243746
Please!
Play Slinger, Huntress, Trapper, Onryo etc against any decent SWF and then post the video.
According to your post it should be easy peasy.
Im very excited for your Trapper Match!
I am mostly survivor main so I can say who destroys on those maps and who doesn't, but sure enough.
Very good slinger can hit thru pallet and go around them - it does not work on all of them, so I said 50%. Yet average or bad slinger will struggle (and I have maybe 2hrs on the killer).
As huntress - even if I am mediocre huntress at best. Just today I had 4k. Reason being, that dropping pallet next to huntress is 50/50 (and I would actually say it's like 70/30 for huntress if she can hit without getting pallet). If you really want bad map for huntress that contain a lot of pallets, check out RPD. You will see the difference immediately.
Trapper depends more on how good survivors are in noticing and if you find a team that actually follows him to untrap all his traps - but again, the map contains quite a few bottlenecks that usually contain god pallet - if you are able to trap them (and those traps stay), then you should get relatively easy game. But I will give you the fact, that I overshot and the match is not insanely easy.
For onryo - I don't have her, so I can't say from my personal plays. However I faced lethality onryo on the map before (so yes - this requires her iri addon, otherwise when played "normally", she will struggle). She can teleport almost constantly and with the map being so damn small, you will very soon find yourself in need of a tape. But you will get it only once or twice. After that, you get killed. Without ever being hooked.
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@xEmoGirlxAlexisx said:
Fix the Map Designs 90% of the Maps are Survivor Sided Maps like the Game where u Need to break 30 Palets before the First hit shouldnt be in the Game
Well the game is not survivor sided. Take nemesis or nurse and you will understand. Or take legion with iri button and julie's mixtape + endurance + spirit fury and you will just loose. Same with wraith with brutal strength and 2 shadow dance addons for very probable loose. Or take huntress, trapper, or any other killer that can disable your loops (this includes a bit skilled slinger - who can ignore 50% of all pallets on this map) for insanely hard match. Or take mori-build onryo and prepare for your certain hard attack.
Then again, take (non-palet) freddy or oni for very easy game.
You would be surprised how often will the game screw you over as survivor. There's always problem with finding totems and generators on this map compared to most of other maps. It's very hard against some killers, because this map has very few loops without pallets (with windows).
Even some big killer mains changed their idea and consider this map killer sided. Together with midwitch, saloon, shelter woods and many other maps.
BTW maps in general can't be so bad, because otherwise survivors will not get 41% escape rate on avarage and 39% in high MMR.
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Actually exactly this happened to me last game. After 1 successful sabo play (regular play trying to just rescue teammate. No tbags, nothing. I went immediatelly after dropping survivor far away to not get downed) - I got downed and huntress refused to go anywhere from the hook - just facecamp and hit me on a hook.
What I am trying to say - both sides have their toxic behavior. It would make sense to remove both of them whenever possible.
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@LapisInfernalis said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3243194#Comment_3243194
Even then you slowly die. It just takes longer than 4min.
But this behavior suggests that maybe you did something wrong in their eyes (maybe hiding too much?). Or they wanted to farm and you didn't understand?
What they did is not OK, but tbh your situation is so rare it never happened to me in over 5.4k hrs.
well it happened to me with much less hours. The main reason is if killer wants to deny hatch at all costs and other survivor want to wait out you dying at all costs. Sure the game progresses, but it can take above 30mins (killer decides to do this from very first moment, not slugging you) if you actively try to make it as short as possible. Not a fan. Not a fun for me.
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@Barbarossa2020 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3243625#Comment_3243625
Again im specifying when survs have no reason to remain in the trial and they do it just to bad mouth.
It's just toxic behaviour. There's no reason for it, or a reason why the developers condone it. Again the standard we walk past is the standard we accept. They wil remove Masks because they were used in a racist way, but accept t bagging as fine.
Sure thing. If all 4 are at the exit gates and tbagging, they are doing it just to make killer mad. No argument there. Same as killer hitting someone at hook if next closest survivor is more then 10m away - there is 0 chance he missed something. It's purely to BM.
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I am for Scourge hook idea, or changing cooldowns.
Meaning for changing cooldown - cancel time limit for hemorrhage (so until healthy) and increase exhaustion to 1 minute.
Lifting injured condition on it's own sounds like too much. The perk would make killer snowball too much with little counter play (at least it being scourge provides some counter/condition to activate).
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@Barbarossa2020 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3243558#Comment_3243558
So we can add Bubba's masks then right?
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3243561#Comment_3243561
If you're all at the exit gate what time is that buying? apart from just being annoying or insulting?
3 survivors at 1 exit gate. 4th being injured. What can the 4th do? If he has means to heal himself, he can try to do that (time consuming). If he has not, then he can try to run to the other one and open this second gate (also time consuming). If 3 survivors at exit gate just leave, there's a good chance 4th one will not make it. If they stay at the exit line, wait to be pushed out (or ignored so they can heal themselves and take hits for the last one), they will buy 2.7s for each hit this takes. This gives quite some time to last survivor to also be able to escape.
Sure it's common that some survivors are just being mean and they don't need it because everyone is at the exit gate (still this does not need to be just to BM killer - maybe they want some extra free chase points for both BP and emblem. E.g. I remember I have lost a whole pip for not doing this). I am not advocating for tbagging at exit gates. Makes no sense if killer played fair. Sure many people do this. But it does not take away the example I already provided.
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@Laluzi said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3243533#Comment_3243533
There's nothing wrong with pips, and the monthly rewards are awesome - it's just that depipping from a bad match is a fairly pointless and unhelpful mechanic at this point when ranks measure playtime now (instead of skill, as they used to be the basis of the matchmaking system.) It's really annoying to hit 4 out of 5 pips and then get dragged back to zero between your teammates ragequitting, getting tunneled, and players playing in a way that makes pipping impossible.
Or you face one of instakill meyers and you know you will not get any altruism so in a best case - and you really need to work for this, you will not depip.
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It's funny that one of the main proposed counters to mori is going to the locker and be hooked. And yet when you do that, you are screwed the second someone unhooks you if meyers is close. Yes please remove this for duration of endurance
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@BabyShrimp said:
These are just my ideas and they could suck, honestly. I'd like to hear what you guys think in the comments, and your suggestions.
For body blocking I was thinking that survivors with crows could have no collision, at least not for other survivors. If a teammate tries to trap you, you can walk through them eventually.
As for slugging, this isn't honestly toxic unless it's done out of spite. Most sluggers leave people slugged to snowball, or they genuinely can't find the slugs. I think that if after some time of being slugged maybe base kit Deer Stalker could show the slug's aura so the killer can find them, and I think that would fix most of the slugging. If you really wanted to make it so that slugging out of genuine spite didn't happen then after the survivors aura has been shown for long enough, and the rest of the team is dead, or slugged, then perhaps they could be provided with base kit unbreakable. Another thing is I do think soul guard could use a buff, so if that were more common that could also play a role.
As for Leatherface, keep Bubba the way he is. He is perfectly memeable and iconic, ESPECIALLY after the prestige rework I mean can you imagine going against a face camping/basement Bubba who is a high prestige or even prestige 100? That's freaking hilarious and I love it. I think if he can't use his chainsaw close to the hook people will just be rewarded for staying near the hook with the killer which is obviously a bad move. It's also unfair as there would be safe spots all over the map, and if there wasn't that wouldn't fix the problem because Bubba would just face camp slightly further away than usual. It's not like camping isn't easily countered, more on camping further down.
When it comes to survivors unhooking themselves there are only a few situations where this should ever be attempted.
*Everyone is slugged/hooked
*The last person is in chase
*There is Deliverance
*You're trying to give away hatch, or signal the killer is camping and to just leave.
*Everyone is too far away, and you'll hit second stage anyways.
With so many completely valid, yet less common situations it can be hard to decide when unhooking one's self should be an option, but what we have right now just isn't working. Every other game, or depending on the day more games than not someone rage quits on hook. I'd argue it's more helpful to take away the unhook yourself option than to leave it there even for the situations you sometimes find yourself in. Here's my idea, take away the option to unhook yourself unless you have Deliverance, or there's one person standing. I'm not gonna bring slippery meat into the conversation bc it should obviously be removed, or reworked.
To fix some issues with camping, as I said camping should be an option, it's a real strategy even if it's a meme, but the camped survivor shouldn't be punished. The best way to counter camping is to simply do gens, and with reassurance it's even more easy to counter, so survivors who spend enough time on hook shouldn't be punished, especially since the game can tell the killer's proximity to the hook. Really, it's not their fault if they're being camped, and if it's a 1 hit down killer it's not the team's fault for not trading hooks, and even if it is in some cases it's still not the hooked person's fault specifically. My suggestion is if a survivor stays on hook for as long as possible, or as long as they can, their grade progress should be paused (or if they did enough during the game they should make progress). This also fixes part of the issue of the team not going for save simply bc they made bad plays, now the hooked person did everything right and it's their team who now has a 3V1. If the killer is camping (hook proximity) the camped survivor should be awarded with BP for occupying the killer's time.
I think we could appreciate a spectator mode after every game where you can view it from other player's perspective. This would really help people who think they may have gone against a cheater but aren't sure, or see if someone was working with the killer, or at least see things from the killer's POV bc I've had games with cheaters where I didn't even know they were cheating bc I was off doing gens but I was told after by the killer they were 100% cheating. I and many others have had games against cheaters and their team didn't even know. I've also had lots of issues with the last survivor working with the killer to sandbag me, I think maybe this would discourage that.
So again, what do you guys think? Do you have better suggestions? Please share your thoughts and ideas in the comments! :D
I like bodyblocking (if this thing is very rare - you basically screw your team over just by DC. Nothing more is required) and even deerstalker/unbreakable stuff.
For Bubba - sorry but I find it boring as hell. You can't really even stop watching a game and play youtube, because somebody might rescue you and you need to run immediatelly. Also you need to hit skillchecks in 2nd stage. And yet there are very strong odds that you are trying for nothing. Facecamp bubba begs you to go afk or suicide. It's only on you to resist the temptation. Very boring and very unfun. Also the solution to your deadzones. If you are in chase, depletion of your charges should not happen. Voala, there are no real deadzones now. You either camp so you are not in chase (or you are in a chase so it's screw up on survivor's side), or you do camp and your charges should go down after some time (say after 10 seconds). Also if this works in 16m radius and bubba waits just outside it, then you HAVE a chance to unhook that survivor as opposed to current situation.
For unhooks - sure thing. But it's another survivor nerf because you take away legitimate use cases (even if they are a bit more rare). So compensation buff should happen somewhere.
For camping - saving my emblems means nothing to me. All I see is that I am prevented to play the game. I can understand it to a degree when it makes sense - like killer leaving the hook and no survivor going for rescue in this time window and then go secure the stage for last 10 seconds. This is 100% valid and I have no beef with this. I can even understand camping in 3gen and endgame camping does not exist in my eyes. It's still boring to be camped, but I understand the legitimate use. What I don't understand are killers that feel the need to camp AND tunnel at 5 gens - which is quite common these days. It spoils the game. It pads killer wins and many killers feel they HAVE TO do that, because they never learned to chase because of such camping/tunneling and now they face survivors with much more skill then they have.
Spectator mode would be really nice, but as far as I know it's not possible. Design decisions of the game prevent this. This feature (specifically to be able to replay your own games - which is technically the same thing you want) was proposed many times before and the answer was that it would be way too hard to do now.
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@Barbarossa2020 said:
Everyone has different ideas of what's toxic.
I dont have an issue with tunneling or camping, as it has it needs, but 70% of survs think standing around in the exit gate being flogs is fine.
So for me i'd start by banning people who think that's fine, and those survs who rage d/c ban them as well.
sure. You play killer. Standing in a single spot waiting for your 4k without any effort sure is not toxic to you. Yet helping other teammates by buying them time in exit gate is 100% toxic. So much hypocrisy.
@Barbarossa2020 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3243500#Comment_3243500
But is us as consumers who define what should be in a ToS. The standard you walk past is the standard you accept.
We don't tolerate racism in dbd as it causes issues, but we tolerate bullying.
sure. Let's define facecamp bubba or any other insta-killer as ToS. You don't play the game. You prevent other players to play the game. Sounds toxic to me ;)
@SundayRaid said:
I think it's useful to separate "toxic behavior" and "toxic tactics".
Tactics = a killer tunneling and survivors coordinated body blocking.
Behavior = teabagging at the gates, flashlight clickspam, etc.
The toxic tactics are a product of poor game design and probably can't be fixed without dramatic redesigning of the game. It's possible, but it would involve coding that the devs either can't or won't do. For example, it would be rather simple conceptually to check whether or not the person being struck by a killer is A) between the killer and a different wounded player AND B) within X distance of both the killer and wounded player AND THEN in that case make the damage count for 2 hits and an instant down. Something like this would solve body blocking because instead of just "getting in the way" which is stupid you would have to actually sacrifice yourself (which is more logical, and would make it rare and strategic). Nobody has to agree with this. It will never happen anyway. It's just an example of the kind of balance/thinking that it would take to actually improve "Toxic tactics".
TOXIC BEHAVIOR imho is made 1000% worse because it only goes one direction. There is no way for a killer to teabag or "answer back" when someone is bullying them. Anyone with any real life experience knows that when a bully is left free to act without push back, they don't get bored, they push further and further. Individually it increases and collectively it increases. Meanwhile, the target of the behavior just takes ever increasing abuse.
Why can't killers crouch? If you're crouching you're not chasing. So how would that be unbalanced? It's almost as if this toxic us-vs-them (as people, not characters) was desired by the devs in the way they made the game.
Few people would suggest a company ban people for teabagging, and anyone with gaming experience would know that people rarely get banned for anything in games no matter what the rules are....But this is the only game I've ever played where my opponent has a full range of EXPRESSIVE tools to communicate with me and I have none whatsoever to communicate back. And that is a big part of the overall toxicity.
Oh you are so mistaken. Head nodding and hitting on the hook are evergreen classics in toxic behavior. There are more specific stuff that depends on killer (like some killers actually can t-bag, bubba can M2 you on a hook etc), but the point is - both sides can and ARE toxic towards each other.
About your "toxic tactics" - what is toxic in trying to help fellow survivor that is being "toxic tactics" tunneled to death by trying to take hit for him? First of it's killer who decided to abuse easy/cheap stuff and all that the other survivors can do is to get injured/downed just to prolong his misfortune. It sounds way more that toxic tactics are mainly things that killer can do. Sure you can take 4 BNP's and genrush the hack out of killer, but how often do we see this and how often do we see (face)camp/tunnel? I can tell you that 4 BNP's is very rare. For tunnel it's more then 50% of games. Camping (if we include proxy) is even more.
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@not_requested49 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/352159/delete-the-artist
Lol survivors complain about ANY killer
Of all killers, the artist? Like, what next are you going to say Freddy is OP with his snares?
I don't support OP. There are more problematic things in game then artist. But targeting her is not actually so wild. She is in top 5 killers (#1 nurse, #2 blight, #345 wesker spirit and artist). She is not comparable with Freddy. I mean she is so different and has such a difference in power, that having them both in 1 sentence is weird on it's own.
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that's going to kill scratchmirror. And some other funky builds
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@Peanits said:
Others have beat me to it already, but simply increasing movement speed would have a significant effect on loops. Pallets that are safe suddenly become unsafe and pallets that are already unsafe become more or less worthless. You'd have to make quite a few changes elsewhere for that to work.
But as to whether or not it would make chases feel more intense, it's hard to say since that's highly subjective. Probably the most tense moments for me are when you're running for a window and the Killer's closing in on you, and you're not quite sure if you'll make it in time. In that case, faster move speeds would shorten the time that I'm thinking, "Do I make it?", so it might even be less intense.
You would probably have that feeling sooner (from larger distance).
I think overall effect would be survivor nerf - loops will be harder, reaction times worse, desynch hits worse, the only thing that might work for survivors is better chance to dodge ability (e.g. flying hatchets)/dodge hits (360) - provided they will not get compensation speed buff/slightly bigger hitbox. There will be also better chance to make it to another loop, but as every loop would become worse, I think this would not be sufficient compensation.
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@Alen_Starkly said:
That would ruin a lot of things:
1) perks like Off the Record, Distortion, Lucky Break, Bite the Bullet
2) potential for flashlight/flashbang saves, since the killer would know someone else was nearby
Imo killers already have good tracking abilities. Gens being number 1, survivors are often found at gens. Then there are BBQ, Lethal Pursuer, Nurses Calling, Tinkerer... Not to mention visually being able to see if crows in certain areas have been disturbed (are they sitting still, flying away, or flying back).
As for the scenario when there are 2 survivors left and they just keep hiding, I'd suggest a special mechanic be added to the game, where killer instinct would trigger until the survivor gets in the chase with the killer.
or spawn hatch at last 2 survivors if there are 2+ gens left to complete. But allow at most 1 survivor to get out
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People like OP should be banned from soloQ. Also SWF should get a warning that sweaty tryharding camping tunneling killer is in their lobby so that they can prepare their BNP's with syringes. Killers already have 61% in highest matchmaking elo (5% of best players). Facing such a sweaty tryhard should give a warning so that survivors actually get a chance to play the game for a change.
If we even accept such an unfair "strategies", there should be indication of it so that proper countermeasures can be taken. 39% escape rate is already low and considering all the recent silent nerfs survivors get all the time, this would be at least something to offset it.
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yes please
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@VaporLion said:
ok wow thx for letting me know that i have to loop the killer. i didnt know that.
but jokes asside, you cannot win certain 3 gen situations especially with insta down killers. if the killer isnt stupid he doenst overcommit. and as long he doesnt overcommit he doesnt lose. as long as the survivors dont overcommit on gens, they dont get hit. so yea good luck escaping this never ending cycle without ever missing an overcharge skillcheck i would love to see you face a good killer so you can agree with me :)
Believe me. I do. I actually play SWF (and am learning from) 9K hour survivor main. But not all my games are with him in SWF team and I do win against this also in solo and against insta down killers. I mean of course you will not win them all and that's OK. But to say sometimes it's not possible is... Overstatement. So long as other survivors know what to do - if they are clueless, then I agree that there is nothing you can do - but that's matchmaking/player problem
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@VaporLion said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3242483#Comment_3242483
i disagree with you there. you cannot win certain 3 gen situations. if the killer uses degression perks and walks back and forth he gains more slowdown than you get gen progression. if you want at least some progression which is initself such a time wayst for both sitdes, you have to overcommit which will then allow the killer to down or hit you. and this even more of a problem in solo q because without comms you dont know what the killer is doing.
in the game i just had at some point i just surrendered and walked into the killer because ive had enough of this. its a prison of constant degress, just not fun gameplay.
As I stated. It's hard. Especially on soloQ. But again. If everyone knows what to do (and there are at minimum 3 survivors alive, but 4 is preferable), you don't need to be in SWF to play around it. You need people split up on all 3 generators. Once the killer comes, you run (or rather loop) away from 3gen letting other 2-3 survivors work on other generators. Killer has option to go for you and let 3gen progress, or turn around to go back to 3gen - which lets you in worse case heal and go to gen, in best case directly hop on a generator.
I played a lot of games. This works always (ofcourse if you are bad looper and go down within 10s, it will not work). There might be 1 little exception to this with wesker if all sprays run out, but there's a good chance you will break that 3gen before this happens.
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@VaporLion said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3241585#Comment_3241585
yea youre right about the maths. but why dont you like the idea if you think that prove is overrated?
im sick of 3 gens and i think its too much work for the devs to rework maps with balanced gen layouts which is why i think this would be an easy solution.
you literally cant win in some situations. in fact i just had a game in lerys memorial where a myers just facecamped a claude near a 3 gen and won on the spot. if i experience this type of stuff it just makes me sick of this game.
Because you always can win. Even in 3gen situations it's possible - but I agree everyone needs to know what to do (which is kind of hard in soloQ). Also you should take care to not create 3gen in a first place. I mean - killer can camp his 3gen from the start of the game, but that also means he is giving you 3-4 gens for free - so you could potentially have enough time to teamwork into deleting his 3gen instead (this is currently still possible even if it's hard. I mean it will be possible until they make an additional buff to regression perks). The teamwork is about doing all 3 gens at once and once the killer comes, you immediately loop away from the 3gen to maximize the time for everyone else. This will take long, but survivors should slowly win if they can hit overcharge skill check.
About proof. As it happens there's a streamer that has almost identical opinion to mine. So I will post link instead:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a5ZDB3v5h8UAlso there is 1 additional strong counter to 3gen you can use. If you are so afraid of 3gen, take toolbox with brand new part. But when loading into match, find an obscure place and leave that toolbox there (so no franklins can take it away from you and your teammates will not steal it). Once you identify 3gen, you can take this toolbox and break it rather quickly. Alternatively take dejavu and work on marked gens first
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@IlliterateGenocide said:
Breaking a three-gen/Making one not happen in the first place is a survivor skill
That can be completely denied by killers. I have already had games where killer camped 3gen from beginning (from 5 gens) to end. Thanks to some strong 3gens and killer regression perks it's already possible. If you can't reliably hit OC (and yes some players can't), it's winner's tactics. Only if you are able to hit them reliably you chip away slowly at those gens to actually fully do them
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@not_requested49 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3241436#Comment_3241436
I'm saying the joke went over your head, you missed it pretty badly there
But is it? Have you seen new loops? LT-s look like god loops in comparison.
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@Barbarossa2020 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3241179#Comment_3241179
You can go on the dbd discord and find more friends and do your "stupid" stuff together.
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3241323#Comment_3241323
It's a 1 v 4 thats the advantage hence why killers have to be buffed, to deal with it, but once it becomes 1 v 3 1 v 2 and 1 v 1 then killers have the advantage.
No. Killers have advantage by ability and speed and stronger perks. Survivors have advantage in numbers. Overall killers have advantage which is mathematically 59% in general and 61% for 5% of best players towards killers. And every killer has more kills then escapes - even the weakest one. We have official stats for that.
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@Viktor1853 said:
Camping dont need a nerf just do gens is not that hard
Does not work. We have 90s gens and 60s hook stages. As was proven survivors can't make it under these conditions. And reassurence is still risky, does not work that well in solo and is behind paywall. On the contrary camping requires nothing (even if deadlock helps a lot), is very easy, inflates killer's kill rates, is boring and very rewarding.
Nerf is very much needed for all these reasons
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@JustWhimsical said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3241562#Comment_3241562
That doesn't mean we should make lose-lose situations more easily accessible. I mean, yes, they are niche perks. Still, once they become easier to use and more accessible perk investment, it creates situations like the boil-over buff where there will be dedicated survivor teams aiming to create the most unfun gimmick builds to face, not even trying to win, just trying to be as annoying as possible lol. The only reason that people don't use those perks is that it's way easier and better off using other niche perks to create those situations. I see more head-on 4 flashlight locker animation locking SWFs than teams using that kind of build. Could you imagine if most survivor teams used those bully builds, it would be so unfun playing lower-tier killers; I'm just glad that most of the time when I'm facing them, I am playing killers who cancel out those situations like pyramid head at least to some degree.
And yet, those games usually end up in 4k. They don't do gens. They loose a lot. It's tactics that won't get you anywhere
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@VaporLion said:
so currently prove thyself gives 15% for each survivor. if it starts at 5% and you would get 5% for each completed gen, that would be 25% for the last gen.
currently genspeed with prove thyself and 2 survivors working on it is roughly 185%
the last gen with that idea of prove thyself and 2 survivors working on it would be roughly 195%.
with that you would even out with the current speed of prove thyself on the 3rd gen and get 5% more on the 4th and 10% on the 5th.
could also start with 0% where you would even out on the 4th one and get 5% more on the last one
The math works differently here. 1, proof gives those 15% to everyone so that would correct it to 200% 2, it actually takes different base value (the lowered one from penalty by multiple people) so your final efficiency for 2 people is 195.5% with current proof.
Also I don't like your idea. Proof is a means to delete time penalty for cooping. Many people don't realize that cooping poses also inherent risk of multiple survivors being in 1 spot (and 2 survivors can't both e.g. fast vault single window). This is also the reason why I think proof is highly overrated and that it already does not work well if you don't have last 1 or 2 gens.
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I do. Whenever incentives are not on survivor AND I am not playing with my friends, I will play killer. Meaning I play mostly survivor
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@burt0r said:
Uff, the combination of flip-flop, power struggle and the proposed basekit unbreakable would make survivor already unhookable at a pallet just by having a second survivor distracting/disturbing the killer for less than 10 seconds.
Yes. That is intended. And yet you rarely see those perks. Maybe it's because it's such a huge perk investment that does not really pay out
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@Gwinty said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3237534#Comment_3237534
Your evidence is quit selective and strongly depends on the time frame.
I just looked through all of the patch notes once more to get a better picture here. Killers and survivor had almost the same number of changes. We can now argue back and forth about how useful or helpful change xy was and will come to no end. On some we can agree with ease that they should be reversed (Decisive Strike back to 5 seconds, no problem).
I for one welcome the change to Dead Hard. That perk was stupid and Dead Hard for distance was so easy that even I was able to use it. Right now the perk got stronger once you learn how to handle it (speed boost) and weaker when you just spam it. I guess we need to agree to disagree on this point. I was also always more of a Sprint Burst player because the extra distance was always more useful for me.
Some of the things you say however are clearly bugs. Like the change of spawning no pallets is an issue with the game counting wrong. This is not intended and should be fixed soon (I hope).
The map reworks of the strongest survivor maps shows a bit of bias in my opinion. RPD is still very survivor sided. It has many safe pallets and strong windows, the exit gates are very far from each other and many hiding spots for survivors exist. The only thing ruining this for survivors is the chance to spawn 2 generators in the main room (an atrocity that should just be deleted).
Haddonfield is still a very strong map when you know how to use the buildings. The windows here are very good and the tall bushes allow for hiding. Some loops can be used without a pallet for a long time. The weak point of the map is a the middle where survivors are in the open, however with the ability to hide within a building or reach one even with the shorter speedboost I think Haddonfield is balanced right now. It has strong and weak points for both sides.
Midwich and Shelter Woods are killer sided. However you took effort not to mention Garden of Joy, Badham, Red Forest, Cowshed (THE reworked Cowshed) and Aery of Crows. Aery and Garden are especially relevant because they are some of the newer maps and they are quit survivor sided.
Garden of Joy offer many very strong windows and generous generators for survivors. The main building is very good and can be used almost to an infinite without even using the pallet. Exit gates are fare from each other and generators rarely create a three gen.
Aery of Crows offers a big and bright map where you can see the Killer from far away. The main building is strong and offers good windows on the bottom, a strong pallet on top and even a good window on top. There are plenty of safe loops and the generators are very spread out. This map also is quit survivor sided.
For me the evidence points towards the view that both sides get their cookies. Right now it would be the survivors time go get another one which is why I point towards survivor buffs aimed at SoloQ.
You are however painting this a bit to grime. I think a big part of the issue is communication which is where changes should be made. Many of my survivor games are not lost because of bad perks or bad maps but because of bad coordination (2 people running for Cenobites box etc.) or because survivors make stupid moves (grouping up against Legion, setting up Cycle of Healing against Plague etc.) or because they are just bad (letting me die on the first hook with Kindred + Open Handed against a Doctor that was clearly chasing on the other side of the map).
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3238734#Comment_3238734
Please elaborate, this short statement had little to no meaning for me like this.
What is your point?
You can take whole history of DBD. Looping got reduced a lot many times. No more infinites, no more vaulting single window, pallets work much worse then they used to, introduction of bloodlust, keys, fast vaults requirements (yes there was also mori system and stuff killers had - but survivors got nerfed way more).... I mean a lot of changes make sense. Survivor used to be easy mode and it was unfair to killers. But now devs decided it's good idea to aim for 60% (they got 61%) killrate also for 5% of best players (and games with DC are not counted - meaning if you play survivor now, odds are you will probably loose). So they WANT killers to win 3 out of 5 games instead of 1 out of 2.
For DH - I never really used the ping. I am from EU and Russians join some of my games - meaning the ping can be absolute bonkers sometimes and you just never know. Meaning you can't time DH right, because if you find the exact correct moment when to push the button - it will still not work sometimes - because killer's ping (and no - you will possibly not get even a warning about it with icon indicator. Sometimes killers have unstable ping - not necessarily bad one all the time).
As for the clear bugs - well this happens slowly on all maps. Just yesterday I went thru crows in front of the main. The map is supposed to be packed full of pallets between the small structures that are present. Unfortunatelly I went over 7 such double-structures. Found exactly 0 pallets. When the map came out I would be able to find 4 or 5 of them. And no - if they were used already, I would find debrys of them. All the maps are being slowly nerfed.
RPD too - there are no more really strong windows. The map used to have some (like library or east office) very strong loops where you could stay for a moment to waste killer's time. Those loops got opened so you can't use them any more the way that you used to. Nowadays you need to move thru map and use pallets or maybe use single window once to shorten the distance for you (meaning once pallet is broken, you have nothing - or better yet - it's nemesis or another anti-pallet killer and you just enjoy your misery). As for main 2 gens. Those are almost a rule - they almost (not always mind you) spawn there. You have also almost certain chance to get another gen really close by (first room to the east on upper floor - meaning the closest room once you go up the stairs, or the hallway next to this room, or library, or "waiting room") and if all this fails, it's still possible to check the guaranteed gen that's outside between main entrance and fire escape stairs (this one is little bit more tricky, but still not insanely hard). And you mentioned that gates are far from each other - well they are VERY easy to patrol. You need to move like 6 meters to see from one gate to another - so even this will not help you.
Haddonfield is clearly much worse for survivor then it used to. You also have guaranteed 3 gen with 1 gen at main (where there is basement), 1 gen right outside the main touching the corner of it and one last gen in the open, but not far from the gen on the corner of the main - so even if there indeed are insanely strong loops in 2 of the houses, the killer does not need to go there ever. You just accept that the map contain 5 gens instead of 7 and the map is suddenly very killer sided with very strong guaranteed 3gen.
Badham and red forest are old maps - there is no change there. Sure it's stronger survivor maps, but the tendency to remove strong things for survivors is clear. It will be nerfed with all the other maps when new unloopable tiles (hallo to a, few pillars, 1 trash window and 1 trash pallet b, 2 windows with short-ish walls facing each other at 90 degrees and nothing more to slow down killer - making LT look like a god loop) arrive also to these 2 realms.
With Garden I have to agree - something strong-ish for survivors. I give you that.
Crows map - I already mentioned pallet nerfs. What good does it do that you can see killer from distance, when there is nothing to loop him on? Main is not as strong as you mention it, because e.g. top window can be used 0 times if killer knows his stuff. He will just break it instead of chasing you when you go that way. If you use it, you will get hit (because killer will get sound Q when he runs at you to return) so there is 0 reason to use the window and hit you while you stagger. You can still go up there for the pallet - but with the tendency of removing pallets from the maps all the time, it's just a matter of time until you find yourself trapped by expecting to find one.
Cowshed - I know this one is supposed to be survivor sided, but I never found out why. The map is large - that's true. But it does not contain many structures. It's rather easy to give up on half the map and play on the other one only and still getting downs and wins. Maybe I don't know how to play it, but there is just too few things to use in here (I mean it's still better then midwitch of shelter woonds, but still).
I don't view your viewpoint, because I see and listen to what devs say. They want to have 60% killrate instead of making fair 50%. And they will nerf survivors so long until they are able to find something. Like as far as we know MMR is based for +10 if you win and -10 if you loose. So getting sustained 60% killrate means killer needs to be climbing ranks all the time. Meaning more noob killers need to be able to win against best survivors out there to sustain those 60%. And if you are able to watch hours of players, you will see the trend of 200hrs killers being able to win against 1000hrs survivor team already. There will be more nerfs (I am looking forward to new loop that will contain just window without any walls - making Z wall look OP) until people get fully fed up with this and start to leave the game. No multiplayer game should cater to one side only. That was true in the past (where survivors were OP and killers begged to have a fair game and Q times showed as much) and this is also true now.
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@Bran said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3241322#Comment_3241322
I also try and make sure other survivors get out when I can, but when the gates are open the priority is escaping and not sitting at the gate. I'll linger myself, but I will leave if I need to. If I decide to stay and get killed that's on me.
Sure enough. But there is no reason why it should become any easier for killers with mini blood warden as OP suggested.
I will also try to not die. As stated I play the game in a way to maximize number of survivors that escape - that includes me. This also means that if i know I can save 2 other in exchange for me dying - I will take it. Yet such an opportunity basically never happens. But what can happen - if I see good chance to try to get other survivor from a hook, I will also risk myself to do that. It's actually better and teammates who play only for themselves (they leave because they can) are usually reason why nobody escapes (because they will prioritize self healing instead of healing dead hook teammate, they will not take a hit for another survivor, etc). I think this is fine interaction and I see no reason why this should be looked at in a negative way and why such a behavior should get any nerfs (as opposed to get actual buffs)
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@Barbarossa2020 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3241228#Comment_3241228
That's not me i don't own Wesker, im from Oceania.
Even if you play the worst killer - which is trapper according to stats. You still win more often then you loose. It's just 6%, but for worst killer there is - you win 6% more often then you loose - even if you are in 5% of best players skill group. Killers have it easy because devs feel they should have an unfair advantage and win more often then loose
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@Bran said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3241215#Comment_3241215
Not robbing you of anything. I'm punishing you for not leaving. The reason is to make the survivors just leave. Their in the gate and can finish their objective: escape. If they linger and get caught or was too slow, they get got.
Sure, there is reason why you mights wanna stay, but seeing your objective is right there and free to collect, you staying puts you in that risky game and if you lose that's on you.
No. My objective is team game. Helping all my teammates and making sure that everyone (or rather as many as possible) leaves. Why is that a bad thing? I mean solo is nightmare because a lot of survivors think the same as you just said - they play for themselves so if they go down, they DC. If we want to make this a norm, then insanely HUGE buffs for survivor should become part of the game.
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@Arbmos1998 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3241292#Comment_3241292
How is Devour and Deliverance even remotely similar? Deliverance all you need is a safe unhook which is guaranteed with BT base kit you can just charge in and not worry if it's a bad save. Devour conditions Killer to play fair by not Camping, not necessarily Tunnel and it rewards Killers for Hooks and you need 3 to even get any benefit from it and it can be destroyed literally 5 seconds into the game. Before you say "Yeah will Deliverance can be taken out instantly, that's on you just don't get chased first.
1, dhope will always provide you with value. You can't spawn with direct sight on any totem so there will be always some travel time and cleansing takes 14s which at minimum can be considered as a slowdown. And yes it's a gamble. It can provide you at minimum 16s slowdown, or it can outright win you the game (especially in lery's where it's quite hard to find totem).
2, for deli to make sense you need to not be chased first (that's more on a killer/luck then on survivor - like you can hide, but then it's 3v1 because you don't progress generators which is bad tactics - and even hiding does not guarantee you will not be found). Then you need to be able to unhook safely (so killer will not find you when going for unhook) and your team must know to play around it (in soloQ you have no way to communicate to others that they can stay on a gen and you are safe). Also when you use it, you are broken so you are very promising target for being tunneled as there is no way to heal you. Also you would be surprised, but basekit BT does not fully guarantee you safe save. I mean you are very likely to have it, but it's not guaranteed (just one example that is not the only possibility - Award-winning Chilli + The Beast's Marks will allow you to hit unhooked survivor twice if he is not close to window or pallet).
3, it's the same considering your example - you gave an example how "unfair" it would be if killer had random chance to mori changed to 100% certainty by perk (that has some conditions). So I used the same reasoning - 4% unhook changed to 100% perk (that has some conditions).
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I understand OP's frustration about 3gens especially with 4 gen-kicking regression perks and playing around 3gen at the beginning of the game. Especially for less experienced players that can't hit OC skillcheck this can feel just awful, because killer is able to defend 3gen indefinitely. So I understand that one of a solution to this would be to not show gen auras to killer - meaning he can't protect something from the very beginning if he does not know where it is.
However this is not a good fix for the situation. Killers need to know about gen auras to actually patrol generators (most heathy gameplay killer can realistically do). If devs ever decide that this mechanics is unfair (personally I doubt they would - as this provides additional challenge that can be healthy for the game and more experienced players are able to eventually win - because killer can't perfectly protect all 3 gens indefinitely), then some other solution would be in place (e.g. make it so that minimal effective distance between gens is always at least X meters more then what we currently have or nerfing some strong regression perks for some other killer mechanics)
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@Arbmos1998 said:
I swear this is becoming a lot more common where if you have a snowball effect happening as Killer where the game is more in your favor the chances of Survivors being handheld increases to the point of it doesnt even seem like a rare 4% anymore which completely takes away that snowball momentum.
Someone being hooked means Gen Efficiency is at 75% thus a Survivor teammate has to go and unhook them which leads to the Survivors being at 50% Gen Efficiency at most during that time. If a Survivor is able to unhook themselves that leads to 75% Gen Efficiency especially if a SwF group knows their teammate has the likes of Deliverance active this can completely take away a Killers momentum. It's not like the Killer can gain that momentum back either as even if they go for the person who unhooked themselves they can still have base kit Borrowed Time and Off the Record into a potential Decisive Strike, that's a lot of time wastage for something what shouldn't even be in the game.
Here's how the 4%/Unhook mechanic is so stupid, picture it from a Killer perspective. Imagine if Killer had a 4% base kit where there is a chance that on a random down the Killer is granted a Mori or when hooking a Survivor the Killer has a 4% chance that the next down they do will be a instadown and there is no tell tale from the Survivor perspective if that was going to happen. A random Mori would take away momentum for Survivors as it could even happen to a random person who hasn't even been hooked yet. Can you imagine the uproar if this sort of thing was put into the game? That's just how stupid the unhook mechanic is.
It's the same for if that basekit Unbreakable makes it to live. Currently if the Killer is slugging and no Survivor has Unbreakable a teammate must rush to go and pick them up, thus again 50% Gen Efficiency. With basekit Unbreakable the Survivors don't have to worry as they will just be able to pick themselves up so gens are at or should be at 75% Efficiency.
Your example lack 1 crucial part that IS part of unhook - the downside of trying it. You can implement your insta-mori mechanics and I would not oppose it. But it should have 4% chance to succeed and if you don't hit it (96% chance), then you get 5s stun instead of a hit (so survivor will stay healthy). Now these things are in line for each other - survivors also usually don't go for 4% if they are trying to win the game. Using this chance will usually get you killed (specific perks excluded - but if you are angry at deliverence, then I am angry at devour hope because again - that's kind of a same thing).
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@CosmicParagon said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3241227#Comment_3241227
That would be the case, except I quite honestly could not care the slightest if I'm playing against real people or not. I play DbD to be a murder monster man and slaughter people, whether the people are controlled by humans or bots holds absolutely no concern over me. Therefore, bot games are an objective gain for me.
sure go for it. If it will be fun for you, then you can play to your heart's content
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@Iron_Cutlass said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/351997/dragons-grip-discussion
I think Dragon's Grip should apply to a generator for 30//35/40 seconds. If a survivor touches the generator, they become Exposed for 35/40/45 seconds (effect applied like Make Your Choice, so it will have no cooldown in a sense) and scream. Multiple generators can be affected by Dragon's Grip at one time, and generators affected by it are outlined in yellow, if a survivor touches a generator affected by Dragon's Grip, all other generators with it applied have the effect removed (to prevent it from getting out of hand).
I don't like that. Expose time on a generator being 1 full minute makes sense, because if you play normally and don't camp a generator - it will take some time to find survivor that got exposed - especially because he will be trying to hide. Once you find him you will likely not be able to catch him in time DG is up. Contrary if you camp your 3 gen with 3 regression perks this would become a bit too strong, because you can stay in the middle of those 3 and wait for 1st person who touches any gen (where you have OC) - making for some really long and boring games.
No the perk is strong at what it does. It just needs to be rearmed immediately if it does not trigger exposed effect. It should trigger 2-6 times when played around the perk like this making it possibly better then haunted ground (and possibly worse if survivors play around it better).
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I agree that OP's suggestion does not sound really good. Slugging already poses a risk of other survivors helping and picking themselves up without any hook benefit for successfully getting survivor. I think the only problem with slugging is when it's tied with camping said slugged person. But - it takes 4 minutes so it's kind of a game throwing behavior (so it very rarely happens) and there are few counter plays already (even if they are unreliable/hard) - so this is not even big deal.
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@Barbarossa2020 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3241120#Comment_3241120
You can play with all your friends in KYF.
This game has been horribly skewed in balance because of swfs.
Take boil over fine, until some swfs decide to camp in police department with it.
Typical example of how swf behaviour causes perks and maps to be balanced because you "want to do dumb stuff" together.
61% in higher skill bracket 59% average. This does not include games where someone DC's. I have no idea why you complain. You clearly win more often then you loose. If you play wesker you win almost 2 out of 3 games by stats
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@CosmicParagon said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3241132#Comment_3241132
I'm gonna laugh when Survivor mains whine that their queues jumped to an hour long
How? Devs cater to everything killer mains think of for several years now. Incentives and Q times are clear indicator. 61% average killrate in best 5% MMR also being clear indicator. And the devs are happy with current state. If anything, you will see survivors slowly leaving the game, because there will not be any new survivors now. Because killer is OP in stronger MMR group. All the killers but nurse must absolutely slaughter all the beginners every single game. So if anything Q times will be slowly going for that 1 hour mark for killers ;) It will not get better. It will get worse for killers. Even considering it already is instant for survivors and 5+mins for killers (prime gaming time excluded)
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@GatorsRaid said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3240194#Comment_3240194
I wiggle off every single game with Boil Over and Flip Flop. The perk makes complete sense. Just that little difference is better than wiggling off and getting back up down instantly. Maybe the percentages need to be increased, but it would still be a good perk. I'm assuming you're a killer main which makes sense.
I play 90-95% survivor :D And I actually play saboteur.
You being able to wiggle free every game makes no sense to me. We are obviously in a different skill group, because most of my killers will absolutely ignore any benefit Boil Over can bring (occasionally they will not notice closer hook) - because all the benefits this perk gives can be easily played around to not exist and flip flop doing mostly nothing, because killers will still pick up rather soon after down (there are exceptions especially if I play in SWF where someone has flashlight, but this can't be every game)
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@Bran said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3240894#Comment_3240894
Not gonna lie. I don't care about any stats the devs throw out.
Its hardly a buff, more of a quality of life change.
you still provided 0 reasons. Your "QOL" is actually "make it easy for me". I provided legitimate use case when I really want to stay at the end of the gate and wait out until you force me to leave. Typically this happens when there are 3 out of 4 survivors (or generally all but 1) in a gate and the last one is injured and opening the other gate. If I leave then the killer will turn and go for the other gate and kill that last survivor. If I stay and get hit twice (get downed), I will buy enough time for the other survivor to be able to open gate and leave. And you want to rob us of this cooperation, because "QOL"
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@Bran said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3240198#Comment_3240198
All there doing is running back and forth until they are forced to leave, which is probably what the killer should do, so if they do get caught that is entirely on them.
Plus, with it happening with Wesker, it makes total sense for it be added with others.
Why? I see no reason to buff killers any more.
If it's to remove toxicity, then I agree. Do it. But for both sides.
If it's to buff killer, then hard no. We have new stats now and we know that it isn't just average MMR where killers get more kills (61%) then survivor escapes (39%). It's also pike that for top 5% of players. Even worst high mmr killer (trapper) has 56% killrate. So buff survivors instead