Devil_hit11
Devil_hit11
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@Sava18 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3623032#Comment_3623032
A lot of the loops on nostromo are just plain m1 killer sided.
It's not a skill issue when the short side of some loops is like a second worth of walking for the killer while the long side is 3-5 seconds of running.
As far as I can tell only the jungle gyms hold any real safety on that map.
sure, if your talking about filler pallets located outside main building. there is 1 filler pallet on side of the god pallet in main room which is very unsafe. 2 pallets on right side assuming the orientation of being main hall and 1 pallet on far left side somewhat behind main building. these 4 pallets require you to stun the killer.
The rest of pallets are decent. The space shuttle located on south part of the map has unsafe pallet but... if you run in a specific way, you can run behind space shuttle and path around table inside to get back to the pallet. All other pallets either contain a strong window as jungle gym with weak pallet or both a strong window+pallet.
The map is fairely big meaning killer is not that good at 3 gen/applying gen pressure and one of unique aspect of this map is that stealth is somewhat viable on this map. It is not that easy to find survivor on this map. I don't think the map is that bad for survivor but there is no free waste time loops. you have to earn your time-waste on the map. most of the other maps do not require you to earn time-waste, the map design somewhat gives you free time waste.
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@MikaelaWantsYourBoon said:
So you are just asking free kill after all.
DS and OTR are activating for long time. So there is really killer can not do so much. But BT is not like that. You can count and hit. You can bodyblock. You can go after other injured survivor etc.
But game should never reward killer with free kill.
I still think DS and OTR should work in end game because you already get free escapes vs m1 killers by doing hit cooldown into BT -> bodyblock to exit gate.
What OTR and DS were accomplishing is allowing survivor to get 4 man out vs characters like bubba, trickster, huntress, infinity ev3 myer's, aka strong camping killers.
It is technically still possible to escape camping killer now on reliable basis but it is only possible with For the people+Buckle up. This makes you wonder. If FTP+Buckle is the best perks in end game, why did DS/OTR get nerfed in end game when that combo exists for end games? It seems one of dev went back on that DS/OTR change and brag back an even better combo for getting end game escapes. that is only anti-tunnel buff i'd like to see if they ever buff those two perks.
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@xEa said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3623032#Comment_3623032
If this is the way people think this game should work, i know why some killer get mad.
No, it should not be around 50/50s at all, it should be around interactive gameplay.
Sidenote: A 50/50 only becomes a 50/50 when the survivor plays it perfectly. If the survivor does a mistake, he looses automatically. It is only 50% for the survivor if the killer a) missplays plus b) the killer gets lucky.
i see survivor playing tile perfectly as default skill. If survivor plays a tile 100% perfectly and there is no 50/50 then where is interactive gameplay for the killer? At that point, is there any looping skill at all if you cannot get hit if you play x way?
@[Deleted User] said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3623032#Comment_3623032
You don't have to 50/50 anything on Nostromo though. Everything is typically compact enough that you can get to the next pallet without playing the tile.
Chain multiple loops is an advanced skill in looping. Because of that, this is why survivor think this this map is killer sided because loopers at high-medium to lower level do not see anything other than loop they are currently at. They only see loops as individual pallet itself. That is an example of why a lot of people think that hawkin is killer sided, you know, unsafe pallets. It is same thing for Nostromo Wreckage. Individually, the pallet suck but if you use your logic in to form clever paths, you might find more value in pallet resources then originally perceived.
Haddonfield for example is polar opposite of a map requiring brain-power to loop. Most the houses are straight up bloodlust 3 infinity loops. there isn't any secret to dominating killer. A good 70% of the cast can purely lose from pre-running and running window infinity loops vs good team. That's average level for survivor to do well on a map is infinity loops like haddonfield or a map filled with god pallets everywhere such as... badham preschool or Gideon's meat packing plant. Anything more then vault a window 3 times going in a circle or dropping a pallet in which killer is forced to break is too difficult for survivor. Loop too weak.
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the game is suppose to be about 50/50's. if something isn't 50/50 than it is 100-0 for survivor. most of the maps follow the 100-0 rule with god pallets and safe loops everywhere rather then 50/50 pallets. As a result, survivor looping take a lot less skill in practice despite being one of the most pivotal elements of dbd. Nostromo Wreckage requires survivor competency to loop the killer.
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@Dwight_Fairfield said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3622971#Comment_3622971
There's no stalk management with tombstone. You basically want to drain every survivor you lay eyes on. With piece there is management.
i consider tombstone piece and Judith tombstone as nearly same add-on. both of them benefit from 99% EV2 so i think both require stalk management.
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@Dwight_Fairfield said:
Legion and Wraith should be below Mikey in my opinion.
Mikey's power is simple but you need to know how to optimise it since he has a cap on it. Good Mikeys know when to stalk rather than chase, they know to 99 their tier 3, and the optimal times to pop it.
I see many Mikeys pop tier 3 prematurely when a survivor is guaranteed to make it to a safe window or pallet. They end up wasting it.
You also have to try to not max out stalk on all survivors for as long as possible. Save some on each one so you can always pop your 99'ed tier 3.
i don't think i have ever ran out of stalk playing regular Michael Myer's so I somewhat agree with him being easiest killer to master/play. his stalk management only comes into with tombstone and i do not think it is much of a skill-ceiling.
@TheArbiter said:
I understand every choice in the "God Help Me" tier except for Pinhead. Why is he so high? Is there tech im unaware of, because to me outside of knowing when and how to use his chains and beelining for the box once you have spawns memorized I don't think his ceiling gets much higher
he has difficult skillshot to land and a 4vs1 element to activate his game-delay. He is unrewarding to play because his anti-loop doesn't work but his actual mechanical skill-ceiling is there.
My top 5 killer in skill-cieling would be Wesker #1, Nurse #2, Blight #3, Pinhead #4, Twins #5.
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@woundcowboy said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3622205#Comment_3622205
The solution is to remove clutter and broken tiles. Deathslinger is also one of many examples of a botched killer change. All of the weaknesses we talked about existed back when DS could insta scope and had a small terror radius. He was never a great killer. The nerfs made it even harder for DS to engage in a meaningful chase since he can’t sneak up anymore and the increased aiming time puts control of the chase in the survivors’ hands. He is a perfect example of the game being balanced around bad survivor play.
I agree completely. I did not rate him even before his nerfs as powerful killer but he was admittedly a fun killer to play. Now I just find him unfun to play for exact reasons you describe. pre-running and ADS change putting all control into survivor's hands.
He is only ranged killer to not have lullaby, so on technical level, he can still use M&A to reduce his tr to 24 which was his old TR. this does not allow you to m1 sneak up on people but you can still fire in most cases. Considering that you are having games where you get 5-6 shots entire game, it might be worth considering. In my opinion though, you'll lose to strong survivors regardless for what you select on him. over-balanced killer.
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@woundcowboy said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3621726#Comment_3621726
Playing any killer except blight/nurse against competent survivors is hell and not fun. I’ll use one of my mains, deathslinger as an example.
The match loads in and, depending on spawns, I’m probably losing a gen slightly before or after my first down. That alone can hurt my chances if it was part of a 3 gen (which encourages boring killer gameplay) and puts pressure on killer within the first two minutes. Then, when I’m approaching a gen/survivors, they can use DS’s terror radius to pre run and completely deny any chance of a shot. If it’s an indoor map or a map with high walls or clutter (most maps btw) then I’m lucky to have the opportunity to make 5-6 shots in a match.
This illustrates the problem with most killers. It’s not like the survivors dodged shots or juked the killer: they straight up denied any chance of skill expression just by existing. High level killers have almost no agency and depend on survivors playing poorly.
In my opinion, current deathslinger is a terrible killer for all reasons you listed. What you described in your paragraph is precisely my thoughts on dbd on the global problem with most killers at high-level.
those two problems can summarized in two categories
1) Comeback factor/Chase efficacy: Survivor Gen pressure.
2) Pre-running
I do not want elaborate much more then what you talk about but the speed that survivor do generator at when killer is successful at the chase is oppressive at high-level for killer. It is like you barely notice any game-delay as killer despite all your chases ending as quickly as they could have. there is just simply no game-delay in killer base-kit and being forced to use game-delay perks, most of which are weaker is stifling killer perk variety and creativity. The other problem as you talk about is pre-running where your chases are not long but strength of pre-shift w away from generators before the chase means that your chases are in fact long because it took too long to get into the chase. If the entire is yoyoing generators effectively, there is no good chases that is time efficient for the killer to take. As you describe, you lose passively for survivors existing. Deathslinger being 4.4 makes him very vulnerable to such a strategy. I agree with your opinion that these two aspects for high-level killer are not fun.
knowing what the problem is half the challenge but coming up with a good solution is more difficult.
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@UndeddJester said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3622064#Comment_3622064
I'd be more OK with a Forfeit at 15 minutes, if someone is just trying to stall and hold someone hostage.
However yeah, I'm with you, games are over so fast, forfeit doesn't make sense.
i think real reason why was forfeit was never implemented in dbd is to prevent a concept called lobby shopping. the idea is many people would go into a game. see if they're winning. if they're losing. forfeit. go next until they get a game where they're winning/having fun.
the dev for most part don't want that. survivors killing themselves on hook is form of lobby shopping.
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@Reinami said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3621685#Comment_3621685
I'm asking you that because its simple.
First of all, i personally think she does need to be reworked, but the game has a ton of other problems to deal with first. But to answer your question on why i asked you that, let me pose you with another question.
Would it be better for the devs to balance the game around:
1) Top tier players
2) Average players
Based on your post talking about solo queue and "average survivor" and so on. I am assuming that you think the game should be balanced around average players. I personally disagree with this, i think you balance the game around the top level players, because top level players are going to be the best at exposing issues in your game, making it more important to balance the game around them as well as using them to find the flaws in your game faster than you or the "average" player would. There are other nuances there as well but in general that is what i believe.
And the reality is, at the highest levels of play, only nurse and blight are viable and every other killer falls apart to a SWF team. Even nurse often falls apart if she doesn't play perfectly. Here is an example match that is a bit old at this point, but still showcases exactly what i'm talking about:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dtENJZ_z0zw&t=1s
Now, on to the "average" player. If you think you should balance the game around average players, why does nurse need a nerf/rework? Every single time that BHVR has released data on kill rates, the most recent one being over a year ago at this point:
https://us.v-cdn.net/6030815/uploads/4I6BVOD57OX8/image.png
Keep in mind when looking at this, the devs shoot for a 60% kill rate, you can argue against that if you want, but that is what they balance for and is part of a different discussion.
So anyway, looking at this data, it is clear that when looking at "the average" player, nurse is by far the lowest kill rate killer in the game. And this has been pretty much true since she has existed and almost every single time they release data. I think there have been a handful of times where someone dipped below her, but in general she is always in the bottom 3.
So, again i tell you. If you balance the game around the "average" player, then you MUST also take that to its logical conclusion and ending point. And that logical conclusion leads you down a single path. Nurse not only should not be nerfed, but that she actually needs MASSIVE buffs, because she is so far and away below every other killer in the game.
The game should be balanced around top-play. the more concerning part about blight and nurse is the 700 winstreaks and 1500 winstreaks on blight. that at least shows that blight and nurse over perform in matchmaking environment. The only question is whether this is because those character are over-tuned or because typical soloq under performs. I am more likely to lean on latter portion because strong players can escape nurse/blight however it is not crazy to perhaps think that these characters might be a tiny bit too effective in the hands of competent killer player. that is my impression on @MikaelaWantsYourBoon post.
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@woundcowboy said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3619697#Comment_3619697
And that’s an issue with the playerbase, not game balance. A mediocre player should get stomped by an experienced player 10/10 times.
they do. momo's blight streak that is 1500 wins is living proof that a mediocre player will get stomped 10/10 times by experienced player. The result is 100% win-rate.
He has that streak because most pubs are bad players. The fact is, experienced players shouldn’t have to put up with awful high level gameplay because people refuse to learn. Like if you are that lazy, go play a mobile game.
you have to change wording from most pub to all pub are bad players because every single pub lost. Explain what is "awful high level play" for experienced players.
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I just wish they buffed This is not happening a little bit so I could stay on H6 and not lose it. Hyperfocus is pretty good if you stay on H6 the entire game but it is a tiny bit too hard. the perk don't need need a buff.
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@Reinami said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3621356#Comment_3621356
So why does nurse need a nerf then?
you shouldn't be asking me that question with an opening sentence as following:
As a nurse main she needs a complete and total rework because her power is fundamentally OP.
@woundcowboy said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3621068#Comment_3621068
Yup that’s exactly what they’re saying. These same people then turn around and say that SWF is fine because good players are rare. The survivor bias in this community is undeniable.
The vast majority of killer that gravitate towards do not need to play nurse to win the vast majority of matchmaking games. Nurse in terms of regular matchmaking is crutch killer to get free-w's. Some people also say same for blight. I am not sure how i feel about blight being crutch killer in that category. Maybe if you consider running C33 or a running double speed/alchemist ring speed with moon-rushing. maybe.
nurse had many changes over the dbd lifespan. So far none of the changes have yet to turn nurse into unviable killer. Safe to assume that nurse is unlikely to ever be irrelevant.
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@Reinami said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3621031#Comment_3621031
So its ok for these survivors to basically completely win every single game "because its rare"?
i do not think survivors in average soloq win all the time. survivor don't try hard enough to win every single game. The average strong swf probably wins huge % of the time, like 80% of the time. Could they win 100% of the time? Yes, Hens showcases that you can make a swf strong enough to win 200 games in a row but those are uncommon as in non-existent. Most of the reason why you can win with such high % with survivor is weak killers. BVHR refuses to buff killers in a significant way to go against strong survivor players. most of their killer are balanced around average weak survivor player. on top of that, there is still some soloq vs swf disparities issues. So until BVHR resolves that, they unlikely to buff killers because killer win % being too high. Killer do not need nurse. they have nurse and blight until bvhr re-balances the rest of the game. unfortunately, they seldom change anything so status quo stays.
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@UndeddJester said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3621096#Comment_3621096
Correct me if I'm wrong, but from what I've read, the popularity of old Self Care meant the common counter to Freddy was spamming skill checks to escape the dream was his main counter?
He couldn't yoink people into the dream world and disrupt their ability to repair because they could wake each other up, and whoever he went for could self care out of the dream after throwing a pallet.
Though admittedly I would assume something else would be needed in his kit. Hard to assess having never actually played in this era I will admit 😁
yes. at the time, there was 2 schools of playing freddy. otz briefly talks about that. The first school was that the way to play freddy was to run two cat block that reduced the dream transition time and play as m1 killer. freddy's mechanic was that you couldn't m1 survivors. you had to put them in dream world and dream transition was very long. Like 6 seconds. it was like having borrow time on every survivor. with add-on, they reduced dream transition time. In the end game, you would get free escapes because freddy atrocious at defending hooks. The dream transition gave survivor's free pre-running potencial because even if they were out of position, survivor would make it to the pallet as a result of freddy being unable to hit the survivor. He almost had 0 chase potencial. The only add-on that improved your chase was Red Paint Brush because it reduced your TR from 24 -> 8 meaning you would have some periodic wall-hacks at loops but the add-on also reduced your m/s from 115%->110%.
If you watch otz video, otz talks about freddy's strength. freddy's strength were that he had unlimited wall-hacks across the map and he had 24 meter TR(16 meter) with M&A. The problem is that using his wall-hack at base-kit was really bad because survivor could go to generator or use self-care and wake up easily. This add-on otz uses reads as following. it considerably decreases chances to get skill-check. The green add-on above it does same thing but it moderately decreases chance to get skill-checks. survivor's found these add-on to be frustrating because when you stacked them, survivor spend 20 seconds self-caring and get no skill-check. Freddy could read your aura across the map, see that you were self-caring then show up and hit you. The same thing would happen with gens. you'd spend time working on a gen from 0->50% with that -50% action penalty and still get no skill-check. When you do get skill-check, you regress gen which produces loud noise notification for the killer. So freddy show up to your gen, put you back to sleep and so on. Otz mention in the video that if survivor group-up, Freddy could see the survivor who was waking up and by the time you wake up, he would show up and put both of you back to sleep. Survivors hated this gameplay, it had no name, but eventually gave it a name, it was called "forever freddy" because it stalled the game.
people who didn't take advantage of add-on and his strength whined that freddy sucked. Killers who did use add-on massively stalled the game and survivor found that frustrating. So they reworked him into what he is today. Unfortunately, survivor still found him annoying even after rework because he had two add-on's. Swing chains and Jump rope. These add-on reduced your action for repairing and healing labelled as "Forever Freddy" add-on's. Survivors found these to be annoying, so they nuked this add-on to orbit by completely making them useless and they also took the time to nerf freddy's base-kit by reducing his max snare count from 8->5 and making it that when you charge a snare, you move at 100%.
Since then, freddy has not received any changes. My guess is that he has design related to -action speed but dev don't want killer to use it so freddy just stays the same. receiving no changes. These days, I don't think killer care about that -action speed. people like @GeneralV just want freddy to be fun to play. Being stealth killer with unlimited wall-hack is fun. Current freddy kit is boring. He has nothing unique that stand out even if BVHR did buff him. His old design was superior because he had different unique gameplay that no other killer had to this date. otz showcases some matches with old freddy power.
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@Pulsar said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3621087#Comment_3621087
All of the above.
He's pretty earth-y colored, I'd say. Definitely his size.
Just general visibility. It doesn't feel like I'm getting outplayed half the time, it just feels like old Spirit "where the ######### is she" energy.
i hate how this is something that doesn't work vs top-tier loopers and only works vs worse players. the really good loopers use check spots and vantage spots while worse looper's just run into you as the killer.
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Unlimited wall-hack while moving at 115%. that was his most defining feature that no other killer had. Still no killer to this day has that.
His other defining feature is -50% repair/healing/exit gate penalty which rework on improving through add-on but got gutted. so he has no identity.
@UndeddJester said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3620432#Comment_3620432
We've danced before, and I remember this suggestion.
Have to admit, the TP is pretty cool. I like the blood rushing out of the generators... and part of me I likes the idea of anyone regardless of asleep or awake seeing it as a mind screw when using the add-on 😁
The immobilise for survivors while yoinking into the dream looks like it fixes a lot. I think your iteration of the idea works fine, especially as it gives him some nice traversal.
I'd personally like the new sleep and old sleep mechanics combined. What I'd want for Freddy is to capture the ambiguity of when you're between awake and asleep... in short:
- Survivors have 90 charges of microsleep and don't see their progress.
- Charges at 1 c/s (90s) and 2 c/s doing conspicuous actions (45s).
- Freddy channels a survivor at 10 c/s (9s)
- Once the sleep meter is filled the survivor can see Freddy intermittently (like the current Dream transition)
- Micro-sleeping Survivors get pulled into the Dream World by making loud noise notifications or when Freddy channels. Wake up from skillchecks removed.
- Can only be woken up when in the dream world either by teammate wake up action from someone not in the dreamworld, or via the clocks (though I'd use hot plates, steam vents or whatever and have survivors scream).
I was looking at dropping his gen slow down to 30% with this change, as Freddy can take a lot of the newer gen slow perks as well, and escaping the dream is harder.
freddy wasn't good even with -50% penalty and old pop/old ruin probably outclasses all current game-delay options.
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haha no. overwhelming presence is special perk for that.
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@Grigerbest said:
Title.
Personally I don't understand this thing. Survivors obviously can hear and see the TR when killer is near them or approaching. Why are they also can see killer's aura through perks? Makes no sence.
Suggestion: Rework all survivors perks that shows killers auras. Make it so they can see only their teammates auras.
It will gradually help solo q with more needed info.
Against killers they already have a TR, it is more than enough info about distance between them and a killer.
wall-hack perks help you in the chase. this complaint is random. TR for the most part doesn't help you in the chase unless the loop is really big house like a haddonfield house loop and your on other side of it.
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@Reinami said:
You are correct. As a nurse main she needs a complete and total rework because her power is fundamentally OP.
The problem though? She is the only killer viable against top teams like Ayrun/Hens etc. Until THAT problem is addressed, you need nurse to exist in her current state, because if she doesn't, you'll create a snowball effect that will kill the game.
Right now, survivors like that pretty much only go against nurse (and maybe a stacked blight). But since most killers are not viable at this level you have this problem. Lets say that every player starts at 1k MMR, and these top players are 2.5k MMR, really bad players are 500 MMR and the average player is at 1500 MMR.
You probably have a sprinkling of people at various MMRs, but at that top 2.5k bracket? There are 0 clowns, 0 legions, 0 nemesis etc. It is all nurse and blight. What happens if you nerf nurse and blight (they are about to do that soon with blight)? Now those killers are not viable at that MMR anymore, so those killers MMR goes down. Well now those 2.5k survivors have nobody to play against, so the game opens up the matchmaking pool more so they get shorter queue times. Then they start going against killers who can't handle those types of teams, so they continue to dominate and INCREASE their MMR, making the matchmaking need to work harder and harder to find them matches.
Then as this goes on, more and more killers start playing against teams like this (many of them former nurse/blight top tier mmr players). This results in other survivors who CAN'T handle that type of play to suddenly see harder matches. You'll start seeing them start to go DOWN in MMR and have harder and harder matches. Then what happens?
Well now those top tier killers are playing against those top tier survivors mostly again, and the cycle continues, slowly pushing the MMR of those survivors UP while the killers MMR gets pushed DOWN. This results in MMR basically being non-existent again and the average survivor can't handle this level of play so they start to get frustrated and start quitting the game.
Then you start seeing a mass exodus of players as MMR is failing, not matching people up properly anymore, top tier survivor teams steamroll every killer they see, forcing those killers to play scummier, so when they go against average players the average players suffer. And the top tier killers start playing against average players, making the average player suffer even more. So every game for the average survivor player is awful and miserable. And slowly but surely the game starts dying.
For the health of the game right now, nurse needs to exist to prevent this from happening. Until they fix survivors at a high level so these top tier survivors don't win almost every match, then we can go about finally fixing the nurse.
i don't think you understand that very top mmr that wins all the time is like very small number. it is like 200 survivors players and like 50 killer players. I also would not be surprised if most that is like duo swf, 3 man and 4 man swf. I do not agree on that snowball effect. at worst, killer role might be under-powered as a whole vs strong teams but nothing more.
I think they can nerf nurse by nerfing her blink movement speed so instead of being fast near instant teleporting killer, she would be a slow teleportation killer but I suspect that nurse would be something like current billy where rewards for playing character wouldn't be worth effort in winning with the character. Like I could easily see a nurse where TP is 33% slower to what it currently is where nurse tp's are barely faster then blight's rush.
Another possible nerf that they could do is Spirit type change. Currently, with Nurse's blinks, you do not get info for where nurse blinks. This forces survivor to predict nurse's blink location using mindgames instead of reacting to nurse's blink location. So another possible change is to give nurse a blink indicator after releasing a blink. This would reduce nurse's mindgame potencial and allow survivors to more easily outplay blink.
nurse is possible nerf. it is just bvhr has no interesting in nerfing nurse.
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@ChaosWam said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3620933#Comment_3620933
Good idea, but actually no. My go-to build is Adaptive/Brown Noise with Surge/Game Afoot/Dark Devotion/Furtive Chase. Really fun to me because I can constantly confuse survivors with TR. I am debating swapping Brown Noise for something though.
weird build. my build with stealth merchant is monitor&abuse, bbq, sloppy butcher and stbfl with adaptive lightning. I have tried running the build with Gearhead to try get information on gens so you can place a drone before going to gen but it just ended up being that bbq gave me more direct info then Gearhead... the perk designed to show aura on people on gens. I wonder if they'll ever buff Gearhead to show yellow gens again.
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@ChaosWam said:
I play SM as a stealth killer, she pairs extremely well with perks for it. I also played her the same before her changes, and I will say her new kit is much better for the game than it was prior. I find her 3 gen potential better than most M1 killers, but only because drones are intimidating to most players still. I would tend to agree she may need some kinda auditory sound while effected by the drone's stealth but that depends on how it would effect chases I suppose. I'm no balance expert with her.
When I play survivor, I have enough knowledge of the game plan to just do gens under the drones so the SM doesn't suspect much until she comes back around and harass her 3 gen setups until my teammates get a clue, or do the other gens. Doesn't always work, but I've gotten more wins than losses doing it.
I'm still not a fan of her lore by any stretch, but her gameplay is fun for how I use her.
Question, do you use Monitor&Abuse with Adaptive Lightning yellow add-on that increases undetectable by 1.8 seconds?
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@Sava18 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3618104#Comment_3618104
Bro I'm already not running gen regression and no add-ons, cut me a break here.
For real though, any human killer player running an A tier killer, maybe even a B tier killer or higher would just run through most teams.
Most survivors players are just not cut out for that. Even a 5% regression would be too much imo. With the way I play I would get full value out of this mechanic every game.
sure because your opponent is playing worse then you in the chase. If your winning all the isolated chases in short amount of time, Should you really be losing gens? that currently how it is vs A-tier and S-tier survivor teams. You'll finish chases as fast as possible but they'll finish the gens while your opponent does bare minimum looping.
All the regression would do is reward the killer for choosing to spread hooks instead of inherently punishing the killer for doing extra chases. the killer would still likely go negative in time for extra chases but they'd be less negative on time meaning there is more viability in winning when not tunneling.
In a way you do but instead of frustration for one player it's frustration for everyone. In league you can hard carry if you do well enough on your own, but if hook states were shared in dbd you the killer would just hard tunnel the two weakest survivors until win without ever chasing you.
the killer still needs to down you that single time. You just wouldn't the extra second chances. The thing is, If a killer is perfectly tunnelling, you won't get those extra chances anyway because you'll get 1 hooked. If a killer chases survivor A -> Survivor B and repeats this process 3 times, Survivor C or survivor D will get 1 hooked because what can you realistically do vs a killer in a 2vs1 when killer hooks one of you. The killer can camp and they're guaranteed a 3k in like 99% of cases.
the 9 hook suggestion is just giving killer the worst possible outcome every single time on tunneling while 6 hook suggestion is removing the 3vs1 "early" benefits of tunneling.
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@Iron_Cutlass said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3620458#Comment_3620458
From my matches, all it does it just making tunneling way too easy. The Survivor who is unhooked is bound to go down eventually since being unhooked does not remove infection and 8% Hindered in inevitable as a result.
I just think it makes him a bit too strong in that regard. He already has a good chase power, having an 8% Hindered effect on top of it seems a bit excessive.
punishes skilled-loopers for looping too long. I get hit by his 8% hindered almost every single game because wesker has trouble downing me. the issue is that wesker's chase power is too weak at base-kit. in my opinion, they should turbo buff his dashes to be less reliant on hug-teching to be relevant and make infection a little bit worse.
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@ChaosWam said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3620102#Comment_3620102
Yes, but when she's currently in chase with someone else for longer than 20 seconds and survivors don't bother to cleanse their 4-5 stacks when an active TV is right behind them? I hate slug condemned spam as the next guy, refuse to do it myself, but when I never went past 5 stacks myself while everyone else turns a blind eye to safe TVs it's concerning.
My main point being after this recent Trickster rework, I hope BHVR doesn't go nuclear on her and make her more useless than pre-change Sadako.
it depends what goal they have. they might turbo buff her passive phasing where she is suddenly a better chase killer but make her curse not as effective.
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@pizzavessel15 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3619706#Comment_3619706
no it wouldnt. odds are the survivor coming to save will have an emp so its perfectly fine if they remove that. not to mention itll also take longer for a few seconds to track and teleport to them so i think itll be a good change. its just like oni tbh. it just disables his power for hooking which hardcore encourages slugging
I don't think slugging killer are inherently bad design. it means your suppose win differently and play them differently to get bleed outs but.... that is not viable in current iteration of the game so why design powers with that gameplay in mind? I tend to shy away from playing killer slugging-type killers because i don't feel like my gameplay is rewarding. The only one that i ever bother to play with ring drawing because it felt somewhat rewarding.
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@ReikoMori said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3619319#Comment_3619319
Picking perks is about give and take. You want more info then run info perks and accept that you'll give up a boost somewhere else. Not using the perks don't make you automatically lose, plenty of folks don't run info perks and do well. If you need or want the extra info, but still decide not to expend a perk slot on then that is reckless player choice. The game isn't designed around real time information passing that you get from coordinated voice chat. It can make the game much harder for killers and much easier for survivors. That said it doesn't mean SWF should have a -3 perk slots as a drawback. You can't balance the use of systems not in the game, but here is the real kicker; You as a survivor are NOT PLAYING AGAINST SWFs. The difference in gameplay experiences between SWFs and Solo Q players has very little bearing on the problems that affect someone playing solo.
SWFs and Solos are playing with the exact same balance against the exact same killers and the only real difference is solo players are more likely to play like teamwork is optional. To drive this home even further SWFs and solo players are even playing in the exact matches with each other as teammates with the results largely being the exact same as usual. DBD is a team game and that means it requires survivors to work as a team, but what is preventing that team work from happening isn't a lack of information. It's a lack of player cohesion and bad decision making which aren't things that can be fixed by the devs shoveling mechanics at you.
The game already gives you a ton of information to the point you can literally know what every player is doing at any given moment. You can see every major piece of information necessary at a glance. If that plus perks(that people refuse to use) hasn't improved teamwork then why do you think another mechanical intervention will curb 'free for all' survival habits?
you are heavily missing the point in your opening sentences. why should soloq be giving up perk slots for boosters when swf can pick all best boosters and have all information base-kit. that is what that reddit AMA post is about.
The game isn't designed around real time information passing that you get from coordinated voice chat. It can make the game much harder for killers and much easier for survivors. That said it doesn't mean SWF should have a -3 perk slots as a drawback.
your agreeing that real time information is providing an advantage here but your disagreeing for SWF having less perk slots due this said advantage. After that, your asking soloq to use perk slot on information to have less perk slots available for perk they want to use. In other words, it is fine for soloq to have -1, -2 or -3 perk slots but not fine for SWF. Irony.
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@Chiky said:
i can only think of 2 perks that can get benefited with that...
i can think of 7 perks off-the top my head. Hangman Trick, A Nurse's Calling, Darkness Revealed, Nowhere To Hide, Hex:Undying, I'm all ears, Awakened Awareness. Maybe there is one more but i can't think of any others.
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@Xernoton said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3618072#Comment_3618072
Please no. Not another perk that is extremely broken on release and needs 3 nerfs until it's finally in an ok spot (CoH could maybe use some small extra to help solos but it's otherwise fine).
Good perks, I'm all for but let's not repeat the CoH journey.
i suspect that there will be another strong exhaustion/looping perk because of MFT being destroyed/gutted into obscurity.
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@MikaelaWantsYourBoon said:
- No. Singularity is very strong killer and when you master him, survivors are outing of EMPs pretty fast.
- Yes, this is kinda annoying.
- No. Same reason of number 1 and it's not hard to reset cameras.
- Yes, he deserves some QoL changes and that's one of them.
- Soma add-on should be base-kit and this will fix issue here. There is reason why this add-on is used so much.
- I don't know if this is necessary.
Rework Idea 1: No. EMPs are just fine as they are, no change needed.
Rework Idea 2: Hell no, Singularity does not need any help from AI.
would it be overpowered if singlurarity kept the infection upon hooking a survivor? I dislike how the killer self-weakens his power for hooking. Like I get that you can slug and keep people infected on the floor but the slugging aspect to keep your overclock duration high enough to anti-loop is not very fun. I feel like singlurarity would be a way better killer if bleed-out slugging was more rewarding or if singlurarity was not losing his infection. i don't get why dev design slugging killer with a game design that strictly encourages hooking.
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@Akumakaji said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3618790#Comment_3618790
For real, the drive by of Reassurance is so close that you could just take the hit and unhook unsafe anyway. I think you should at least have been able to use be perk on someone in the basement by loitering a bit around the area, then we wouldn't have needed this whole, convoluted Anti-Facecamp thing.
I still think that the nerf to Reassurance was done for the wrong reason and handled absolutely horrendous, ie "oh some one in a million survivor could keep someone hostage on the hook, so let's make the perk borderline useless by only giving it a single use per person per hook".
Instead they should have gone by a token system: Reassurance got 3 tokens and you could use them up any way you deem fit, maximum 3 per hook stage. This way one single Reassurance user could waste a lot of time of the killer without keeping anyone hostage and with a hard limit. And even two people could take the perk and apply it to both hook stages.
And the easiest fix of them all would have been to just allow a survivor on the hook to overwrite Reassurance with a double tap or something.
i think people use reassurance incorrectly as a perk. to me, reassurance is something like sabotage where you want to run to the hook as the killer hooks someone so you immediately press reassurance and extend hooks from 60 second -> 90 seconds.
I think reactive use of reassurance is bad/weak play because you trade gen efficiency(actual counter to camping killers) for 30 second on a hook. Proactive use of reassurance is much stronger but issue behind it is that proactive using reassurance gives killer free-tracking because your giving killer two choices.
choice 1 camp hook for 90 seconds, that is 33% increase in time commitment to camping relative to 60 second camping
choice 2: Chase survivor that activated reassurance
In many ways, the perk does counter-camping but it doesn't counter camping the way survivor want to counter camping. Lot of survivor want to rush gens and unhook survivor at 59 second marker and reassurance is not good for that particular type of gameplay.
@Emoba said:
Removing the gen repair buff single-handedly killed the perk.
the repair bonus had 35 second duration with low number of 6%. you need buff the perk to give you like 30% repair bonus for 35 seconds for someone to consider using that perk. with 30% bonus for 30 second, you would save 10.5 seconds on a gen as opposed 6% that saves a whooping 2.1 seconds...
@BlightedDolphin said:
Saw someone use one of the Teamwork perks earlier and had no idea what it did.
Still don’t know what any of them do.
one of them gives haste... indicated by haste icon and other gives no scratch marks.
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that is somewhat normal. survivor has incredible steep skill-floor. In my first 50 hours of play, i remember dying 95% of my games. I do not remember how many game i played but let say i played 100 games in first 10 hours of dbd of survivor. I probably died in 95/100 games. in most games with mmr, you typical starting MMR is usually higher then expected average value of new player so it does take time for MMR to adjust. I don't think there is anything that can be done to soften skill-floor on beginner survivor without imposing rules like, you can only play on garden of joy, badham and autohaven(restricted realms) for 100 games or you can only play vs trapper xyz killers. those type of stuff divide queues and hurt matchmaking but who knows, maybe new player queue might increase player retention.
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@D0NN1ED4RK0 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3619205#Comment_3619205
I can assure you not everyone who was using this perk was in a SWF if they fully knew what they were doing
and also the reply has nothing to do with Ultimate weapon it’s just a reminder that a perk doesn’t need high pickrates in order to be overpowered
OoO was the strongest tool as it always gave you info on the killers whereabouts yet it had downsides and always had low pickrates but in the end it still needed and deserved its nerf
most perk on killer that are overpowered tend to be overpowered universally on every killer. UW has been out for awhile and it is not having outstanding use-rate.
OoO was over-tuned perk for SWF but ineffective for average soloq. perks like that for killer tend to be perks that synergize with killer power but are not universally useful on all other killers. An example of that was Starstruck Nurse. the perk exist in vacuum where they strong in their 1 specific synergy but end up as outliers in all other cases.
UW is not falling in OoO category or over-dominate I see it on every killer every game category. the perk is a generic tracking perk with good gameplay value.
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@ReikoMori said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3617259#Comment_3617259
This is the exact issue though.
The game wasn't designed to handle that level of constant real time information generation and passing in real time that SWFs have freely. Under normal circumstances to have that there is supposed to be a trade off of at least one perk slot because you aren't supposed to just have a ton of information without being worse off at another aspect.
Nothing the devs can give survivors is going to fill that kind of gap. HUD changes plus perk changes are literally the best they have to offer without just giving you in-game voice comms and as much as it sucks to be told that the problem isn't a lack of tools but lack of player skill it's true. The vast majority of players in this game aren't actually particularly good and aren't actually even aware of how much information is available to them. New and low level players do not understand the HUD most of the time and higher level players actively ignore it until something bad happens.
Pair that with the fact that players in solo Q often treat the game as 1v1v1v1v1 rather than a 4v1 and you have an experience that is going to be overall less enjoyable than playing with your actual friends or at least a coordinated team. So yes, at this point it is the players' fault because no amount of mechanical intervention is going to make up for having weak players, selfish players, inattentive players, or people refusing to use the tools they have access to over something else they are already using. Like folks constantly ask for versions of Kindred to be basekit, but absolutely despise even considering that they should just run the perk. Even when perks are changed to directly address fundamental game flaws like the buff to Deja Vu people actively refuse to use it when it can help them in the short term. You can't out design reckless player choice.
you realize that telling the player to use kindred is forcing the player to always play with 3 perk slots. perks are suppose to be optional bonuses. not mandatory choices where not using a perk makes you automatically lose. That is hardly reckless player choice. Saying the game is not designed around constant real time information means that SWF should have -3 perk slots as drawback. dbd is meant to be played as team-game on survivor side but soloq is playing the game as free for all survival.
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@UndeddJester said:
The simple reason is, if you don't have a scaled effect the gens pop:
- 90 secs for 1 survivor (90s currently)
- 45 seconds for 2 survivors (53s currently)
- 22.5 seconds for 3 survivors (43s currently)
- 11.25 seconds for 4 survivors (41s currently)
As you can imagine, survivors would just wander around as a group and just mass repair gens, and scatter whenever the killer comes to the gen. Whoever the killer follows, the other 3 go back and only need 22.5 seconds to repair each generator. If he guards that gen, they just congregate elsewhere and can rush a gen in a few seconds.
If you assume each gen is a 20s walk apart, you can see how the killer can't really stop the survivors. Even just putting someone on hook can take about 15 seconds.
90/1 = 90
90/2 = 45
90/3 = 30
90/4 = 22.5
where are you getting 11.25 seconds? you would need 4 engineer toolboxes with 4 survivors to get 11.25 seconds because 90/8 = 11.25.
There is inherent advantage in dbd for looping when 2 people group-up on gens. that advantage is that you won't run into teammates that work on generators. it means person who get chased has bigger map to shift-w and runaway.
For example, if you have 3 people on 3 separate that spread out, you are occupying 60% of the map where the person that is getting chased cannot loop else killer interrupt gen progress.
with 2 people on 1 gen and 1 person on another gen, you occupy only 25% of the map yet your total gen efficiency is not a lot worse. Looping 40% of the map is a lot harder then looping 75% of the map. with 75% of the map, you have wider selection of pallets to choose from. With 40% of the map, your pallet selection is limited. You are often forced to choose weaker pallets.
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@Chocolate_Cosmos said:
I don't think Chucky needs much any buffs or nerfs honestly.
Only buff I would do is reduce the cooldown for the power by maybe 2 seconds. That's it. He don't need nerf either.
chucky needs better map presence. his cooldown really hurts his map presence at the moment. no ability to get chain-hits. I wish Chucky had Blight's Alchemist ring.
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i think they shouldn't nerf ultimate weapon because they'll kill perk. the perk doesn't play the game for you. you still have to down the survivor and it might be one of the most overrated killer perks. you can still escape and there is no reason to rq. The first two updates in road map look promising but that 3rd one on Ultimate weapon/Decisive strike buff looks empty. it would be more interesting if they buffed under-performing perks instead nerfing good perks that provide value in the match for killer. I hope they re-consider 3rd update into something more interesting.
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The problem is needing slowdown perks to compete. slowdown perks should be an optional choice, not a mandatory selection to play the game.
@Xernoton said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3618615#Comment_3618615
Isn't that what most use anyway? Deadlock / Surge, Corrupt, Pain Res and Pop?
At this point, what are the the devs even supposed to do? Information is a no-no (community says it's too much already), chase perks are either pretty terrible or very unfun to go against, slowdown has the danger of being used in combination and anti healing perks are again either terrible or very unfun to go against.
I agree with your sentiment. BVHR is too concerned with survivor having fun vs perks to make diverse perks for killer to use.
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@MikaelaWantsYourBoon said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3618681#Comment_3618681
That's why i am keep asking they need to buff DS. Tunnelling is so free atm and it's braindeadly easy. OTR is supposed to help but it just meh level perk.
Buffing DS will be good nerf to tunnelling and then maybe we can see different strategies again.
no, you'll still see same strategy. the only difference is now you'll get punished for doing same strategy. this incentives killer to play stronger killers in the chase because they can take DS, re-down quickly and ignore the perk. The killer who get punished by obvious shift-w don't get played anymore or get played less.
It is like saying, "Hit & Run is so free right now, we should re-buff circle of healing so hit & run becomes less viable", That will stop those killers from spreading pressure! that your logic towards tunneling. that logic stops wraith from playing hit & run and encourages wraith to put on 1vs1 add-on like shadow dance. Alternately, you see less people play wraith. that is my analogy to your DS tunneling statement.
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@MikaelaWantsYourBoon said:
Not really.
Corrupt is maybe good for killers like Myers, Trapper, Hag, Singularity etc but there is better options for most of killers. Some killers need to build their powers, so corrupt is here to help them.
But there is no reason to use it on most killers.
a lot of people run corrupt for purposes of tunneling and camping. it is not situational perk because every killer benefits from having multiple gens in early stages of the game to A) proxy camp or B) lose gens on purpose to tunnel 1 person out. If you at 1-2 gens and you begin tunneling, you'll lose but if your at 3-4 gens and you begin tunneling, then you can afford to lose 1-3 gens to remove someone from the game. Corrupt delay's early gens to get return on investment in mid-game.
that is my opinion to why perk is so popular. It is sister perk, Deadlock can further cement the above strategy. I don't know. I really dislike the whole gen-blocking meta. I think CI tunneling strategy are band-aid problem with killer no game-delay in their base-kit. Because killer passively lose generator for leaving 4 survivors alive, All killer are just playing for tunnels. The only perk you see that is not gen-blocking that does anything is Pain res but that perk is simply not strong enough on its own.
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@LordGlint said:
Sidenote... this is a good example I stumbled across.
https://youtu.be/vIrnB4c20oE?si=Haf0KuxHO3o4hZJu
First use was about 1:20. 2 survivors cranking out a gen, 1 being injured against a Wraith. This would typically be a risky play, but... it's not anymore because of the combo. It's just an anti-down at this point. The irony that the killer is called a tunneler after the survivors keep erasing downs on OTHER survivors just makes it ironic to the topic.
at 2:41, Wraith hits the BT and tunnel's off Mikela off-hook. She goes down at 3:54. the teammate uses FTP+Buckle up and bring her back to injured state. that is an example of it being anti-tunnel perk. Laurie gave Mikela a indirect form of decisive strike.
1:20 is example of bodyblock usage of FTP+Buckle up. you can use it as form of informal bodyblocking.
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@Liozio said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3616054#Comment_3616054
First point here isn't true, your throw rate would increase if you threw within a certain time period but it used to also increase the recoil from each blade. You could avoid this entirely by throwing within specific intervals I cannot remember off the top of my head (I want to say it was every 0.2 seconds or so but I'm not 100% on that.)
tap-firing like that would decrease your m/s and increase recoil. in practice, the character is not suppose tap-fire or burst-fire. your only doing that in loops because your throwing m/s is low. Letting go of your throwing mode made you lose throwing-rate bonus so in practice, you never got to rapid-fire with him due to LOS blockers.
In every single clip I've watched of new trickster, I have been able to pinpoint the exact moment 6 blades would lose a health state. I've watched survivors make it to an entirely new tile because of the 8 hit requirement.
It is not fair to compare old main event to new in this way due to the massive difference in frequency, especially since you had to hit 30/44 of your ammo count (almost 69% of your ammo give or take) for one main event rather than getting it in every single chase. The PTB for the rework proved this at its core was a terrible idea, but BHVR doubled down on it and reduced the requirement by two blades when the requirement should never have been so low in the first place.
ME occurring in every chase is intentional. the reason why his base-throwing mode is not main event throwing mode is balance. his base-throwing mode is worse other ranged killers due to time to injure(TTI) being worse but his main event is best throwing mode in the game because it has approximately the same time TTI as other ranged killers with added bonus that trickster does not need to re-wind up his weapon.
The intention of Main Event was to make it a reward for extremely high accuracy, and now it just rewards you for the bare minimum. I can miss 36 knives in a row but as long as I just backrev you and hit 8, I get what is basically a free down despite missing literally 81.81% of my ammo capacity.
Back-reving a survivor with knives defeats purpose of a ranged killer. The whole point of being ranged killer is to attack from outside your m1 range. @Coffeecrashing already talks about accuracy. he is not suppose to be accurate killer with 100% accuracy. Your inherent suppose to miss with him.
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@Liozio said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3618318#Comment_3618318
To say Trickster's ammo economy is better is just demonstrably false. If we view this purely in terms of health state, 44/6 is a larger number than 44/8 (7.33333333 and 5.5 respectively)
you need 12 knives to down in old trickster from healthy to dying. in this one, you need to hit 8 knives to down from injury to dying[IF] you use main event correctly because main event allows you to spend 8 knives for other health-state. 8 is lower number then 12. This is not accounting that a lot of the time, survivor may eventually grouped for trickster to use ME to get mutiple health-states leading to way more ammo efficiency. your only worse if survivor is already injured.
@Liozio said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3616005#Comment_3616005
I've watched OP play trickster, they know what they're talking about.
The changes are objectively a nerf because the ammo econ and "dps" is factually worse and Main Event being available so often is not good design.
it is a nerf if all you do is only use regular throwing mode and nothing else. it is a buff if you use throwing mode to get to main event and you use main event at the correct time. you should explain what about main event is not good design. it is meant to be temporary power-up that makes him better then other ranged killers.
You're meant to have a balance of tap, burst and spraying, tapping when at tiles with LOS blockers but areas you can fire through, bursting at medium range and full auto spraying at point blank. BHVR's intention was to supposedly make him feel better to play, but the changes overall are objectively a nerf because 6 blades is WAY stronger than 8.
that is already the case. your tap-firing around loops that survivor hug corners on. your burst firing between gaps(3-4 knives between holes of the loop similar to slinger's harpoon gun) and your spray & praying out in the open.
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@Nazzzak said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3618218#Comment_3618218
I'll quit this game before I run Dark Theory 😭
i'd prefer boon:dark theory out of all boons. the extra speed might make you not get hit extending chases. I miss my mft+dark theory build, that build was hilarious.
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add pain res regression to base-kit for hooking survivors with more hook-states then survivors closer to death hook.
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@Spare_Them_Mori_Me said:
And killers can tunnel without much counterplay in SoloQ. Its just not there. So until that is fixed, deal with this. This combo is not worse than tunneling.
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3617810#Comment_3617810
This perk combo has bought extra chases and time plenty of times in a tunneling situation. So, no, I disagree with you. It is too strong, I agree fully. But removing it before this tunneling meta vanishes is just cruel and one sided.
FTP+Buckle up counters tunneling. in particular, it is super strong in end game when killer hook camp because you can unhook someone, let BT person bodyblock. if they go down and your healthy near them, you can FTP+Buckle up and extend BT. It reminds of Old pre-nerfed decisive strike where you pick someone up, they DS you and run through exit gate. if you don't pick them up they crawl out of the exit gate.
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Also also, this problem is even worse because Victor doesn't initiate an official chase, so survivors can vault pallets an unlimited number of times. It's absurd. I haven't played in weeks now because they refuse to fix this, and it's insane.
pre-drop pallets is main gameplay/counter-play to victor. he does move at 150% m/s for that reason. he has to be able to go around pallets and use pounce to create 50/50 gameplay.
I'd just say to reduce his charge time on pounce to 0.75 seconds and reduce toy sword add-on to a lower value such as 5%. I don't think they'll give you pallet vaulting with victor because it is too similar to chucky and both killer are suppose to be unique.
Can someone explain me the philosophy of punishing a killer for using well his power and hitting a survivor? Survivors can hold hostage Victor for a minute (feels like more) I think before Charlotte can recover it, so you are not only powerless in most scenarios, but also super far away with charlotte, so you keep wasting time going from Charlotte to where Victor was (yes, I know you can go somewhere else, but you get the point) All of this only keeps incentivating slugging which feels super boring, not only for survivors but for the killer as well.
big reason to why most shy away from twins. being m1 killer with 0 ability on hostage holding the ability makes twins very easy to do gens. there is too much dead weight time in the killer. This dead weight time forces killer to perform slugging play-style which is not viable against organized strong teams in 4vs1 due to unlimited manual pick up and 4 minute death timers.
@GocafemojoLIVE said:
I agree with a lot of your sentiments. I have played Twins exclusively since the day they released.
1.I personally think switching back from Charlotte feels fine. It feels bad at first but you do eventually get used to it. Maybe it discouraged new Twins players but I don't mind it. There is an add on to improve it slightly, but I never run it. I think they. Could buff that add on numbers. I think it's the yellow hood. I think they put that cool down though to discourage camping hooks/gens. I think camping would become really strong unless they gave survivors a mechanic to slow her down I.E. tie her shoelaces so she falls down like an old timey cartoon. Kind of like how you slow down dredge by locking lockers.
2. The Hotboxes are THE WORST!!! I noticed it the minute they broke them. It happened overnight. One day they were not al and great, and the next day they were trashed. It happened when they broke the Huntress aim, but they refuse to fix it. Literally every pallet is an unbreakable god pallet now. Attack on Titan walls is well said. It was NEVER like this before. Victor could jump pallets. It took a little skill especially, but it was rewarding and felt great. I don't think Victor needs a scamper ability. He just needs his hotboxes fixed. Before they broke, I could get a hit at literally every pallet in the game consistently with Victor except for the top of harvester.
Also also, this problem is even worse because Victor doesn't initiate an official chase, so survivors can vault pallets an unlimited number of times. It's absurd. I haven't played in weeks now because they refuse to fix this, and it's insane.
3. Letting survivors hold Victor is just to give survivors a chance. If they couldn't hold him then the Twins player would just play Victor only and they would be incredibly overpowering. The drawback for survivors holding is that if one is holding Victor, you're essentially playing a 1 V 3 which is a hefty price to pay. I have no problem with the way that is now. I do think you should be able to recall Victor after 30 seconds if you want though. Having him on the totally wrong side of the mapxos frustrating sometimes, but it's not that much a problem overall.
As far as your rework suggestions for, I like the idea of Charlotte teleporting to Victor after downing a survivor. That would definitely decrease slug meta.
Giving Charlotte haste after switching would encourage camping too much though, and again Victor doesn't need scamper. He literally just needs his hotboxes fixed the way they were a month ago.
My suggestions:
1- Give Victor chucky footsteps so Survivors feel like they have counterplay.
2- GIVE VICTOR HIS OWN COSMETICS! I want a Victor Top Hat.
3- Bring back frosty eyes sometime. I was traveling for the one week they have them out and missed the ONLY free cosmetic they ever released.
4- FIX VICTOR'S HITBOX NOW!
5- Do nothing else. They're a fine killer. They're fun to play, and fun to play against once you know what you're doing.
6- If you are going to something, maybe let Victor sacrifice himself to send a survivor to the nearest hook at the cost of a 1 minute cool down.
Letting survivors hold Victor is just to give survivors a chance. If they couldn't hold him then the Twins player would just play Victor only and they would be incredibly overpowering.
The whole reason to play twins is to play victor. If i want to play m1 killer, Just go play trapper.
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plays very defensive/relies on camping, cannot take initiative when winning , get bullied easily by swf from following you and disarming traps/setting off traps on purpose, 4.4 m/s.
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i think they rather buff killer aura reading perks with further radius then invent new perk. for example, if nurse calling radius is too low, buff nurse calling to 34 meters. furthermore, i think majority of them are unlimited range and they already have lethal pursuer that increases aura reading duration by +2 seconds.
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I kind of agree. blighted rat+yellow speed and C33 are the 3 add-on's to "remove". Adrenaline vial is strong, i think the numbers on that adre vial could be a bit worse. the other add-on provide a lot of value but i don't think they're imbalanced/unfair. they're more like strong utilities.