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Blueberry
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@NMCKE said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2173216#Comment_2173216
I was thinking after a survivor becomes fully infected, the green infection meter on the survivor becomes a red infection meter.
Once the survivor's red infection meter fills, which would take considerably longer than the time it takes to fill the green infection meter, it would cause the incapacitated status effect.
To compensate, plague wouldn't get a fountain for free and would probably need to do something with Corrupt Purge.
I like the idea. I honestly don't think that sounds so strong that you would need to touch anything about the free fountain or corrupt though. She'd probably even need more.
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@TicTac said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2173084#Comment_2173084
Pyramid is almost always a threat in a chase. But he needs too much time to down, travel the map etc. So i think there need to be more ways to slow down gens, but only so much that a chase over a minute still hurts the killer a lot. So while Pyramid right now would lose the match against good survivor they still need to outplay him in a chase and are not safe. How fun such a killer is and whether he has counterplay or not are other problems. And frankly speaking idk how some killer abilities can be fun for survivor and still viable. (Deathslinger, Pyramid etc)
I could say a chase should only last around 40sec to be viable. But its not so easy bc how good a chase was depends on what did you interrupt, where did you chase, how many ressources did the survivor use etc.
I mean if we're talking about adding new mechanics or features into the game that slow the gens down enough to where the A tier killers like PH can compete then sure that sounds fine.
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@MadLordJack said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2173124#Comment_2173124
It's not a stretch. I'm a Plague main. I know my girl and what she can do.
Agree to disagree I guess. I play a lot of Plague as well.
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@MadLordJack said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2173046#Comment_2173046
"time efficient" being the operative word there. Anything less than a genrushing tournament squad is fair game for a good Plague.
I think that's a stretch. The standard of how time efficient you need to be to win against Plague is much more lenient than most killers with how bad her time efficiency is. Her time efficiency is some of the worst in the game.
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@TicTac said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2173044#Comment_2173044
I think Pyramid would be closer to the amount of lethality then spirit.
PH loses vs good survivors. I also don't think most survivors find PH fun to play against either for similar reasons to why they hate DS.
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@TicTac said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2173006#Comment_2173006
https://youtu.be/br871ZPS5R8 at 54:25 you see Otzdarva with hag against agony. Agony is clearly a strong tournament team and Otzdarva chooses Franklins. They could only bring one flashlight but it shows that Franklin is not a useless perk in general.
Franklin's didn't get him much use there. He would have got way more value from choosing another perk.
Also, if we want to got that route.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GxLZDyasPtEWatch another match to see how useless his Franklins was. He got utterly destroyed.
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@MadLordJack said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2173034#Comment_2173034
The kind of survivors that wreck Plague are the kind of survivors that beat everyone but tournament killers, including casual Spirits and Nurses.
No, they just have to be semi decent and time efficient.
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@TicTac said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2172977#Comment_2172977
Long chases are for the majority of the community only possible if they are that safe that the killer needs to absolutely outplay the survivor. (Example: a hit at a shack with pallet.) That would mean loops which are so strong that the killer should focus on forcing the pallet drop. But then its only a ressource management simulator like its currently on some maps with only strong pallets. Or you let the loops like they are now, but then bad survivor would absolutely destroyed bc they would need to go on long chases bc they need more time for gens but they just cant do it.
I brought bloodlust up bc a killer who depends on it makes for a boring chase. He will lose the game, but they will not care. Camping shows that. So my idea with weaker pallets would make the game boring if bloodlust stays and before someone comes again and say my idea is stupid bc bloodlust, i will say it myself.
I want slower gens created with killer lethality. Not slower gens by default. What that means is that if a killer get hooks gen slows down. So it isnt a waste to hook a person midmatch for the first time instead of tunneling. But i still want a mechanic which slows gens down at the start, so the killer has a chance to build up pressure. So the killer should get more time if he does good and shouldnt have more time by default. And for the increased lethality its more like a buff for the weaker killer. The majority of pallets shouldnt be so strong that you need a power to ignore pallets to get survivor quick enough. I shouldnt be able to loop at shack then hold w to a short wall long wall and hold w back to shack while the myers in T3 can only break the pallets and follow me.
"I want slower gens created with killer lethality. Not slower gens by default. What that means is that if a killer get hooks gen slows down. So it isnt a waste to hook a person midmatch for the first time instead of tunneling. But i still want a mechanic which slows gens down at the start, so the killer has a chance to build up pressure. So the killer should get more time if he does good and shouldnt have more time by default. And for the increased lethality its more like a buff for the weaker killer. The majority of pallets shouldnt be so strong that you need a power to ignore pallets to get survivor quick enough. I shouldnt be able to loop at shack then hold w to a short wall long wall and hold w back to shack while the myers in T3 can only break the pallets and follow me."
Oh well you're talking about something completely different now. You're not talking about killer lethality your talking about an entirely new mechanic. Btw the lethality you're talking about is something akin to Spirit levels and the lethality she has is completely hated by lots of the community. You can say what they hate is the counter play component but then you lower lethality if you gave her more counter play than she already has.
I agree with your other points about loops. Most the loops in the game are way too safe and not balanced 50/50 to where the better mind game wins. Most loops are essentially so safe that as you mentioned, in order to meet the time standards for winning you have to have a power that ignores them.
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@Johnny_XMan said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2172951#Comment_2172951
Something we can both agree on. 😂
I agree that broken status just seems kind of... there. So I would love to see another status added to broken, or like the more you stay broken you gain x/y/z status.
I would love to see her be able to at least like I said be able to collect CP from a distance. An animation like old Freddy's when he put survivors to sleep, but for Plague she would just pull and consume her Corrupt Purge.
Basically yeah.
Being fully infected/broken isn't enough of a downside. She's then just an m1 killer with no power, extremely tall, large TR, and super loopable. Even in solo queue we can have all the gens done before we even run out of pallets.
People don't realize how inefficient with time Plague is. They think her Corrupt purge is so amazingly strong which it is decent, but it's not hard to loop a corrupt purge plague. Especially since she is forced to respect every pallet. Also people just look at the time it takes to down survivors with corrupt, without factoring in the time you spent getting them infected in the first place and having to go pick it up. When you add in those time wasters her corrupt is actually extremely slow in downing.
Of course last she has no mobility or things really slowing down the game which gives her near zero map pressure.
Everything she can do there are other killers that do it significantly better.
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@TicTac said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2172955#Comment_2172955
I wont deny that a hag who is chasing is a weaker hag. But like with trapper against old object sometimes you need to change your tactic. If you have a part of the map trapped you can chase a survivor, trap every loop, so that he needs to leave and herd him to your traps.
Or you can stay close to your web and if one gets disarmed you chase the survivor into the next trap. It helps to change your trap placement or to set a backup trap at the same loop.
If the survivor are on tournament level and destroy your traps all at the same time you will lose, but that never happens. Even the sweaty russian rank 1 swf with object and every meta perk couldnt do it and they were really good survivor. They got all gens done and almost escaped but i never felt like a killer without a power. So i know that there are teams which will destroy you, but i never met them. Everytime i lose with hag its bc i messed up.
Franklin is not that bad against flashlights. I did see it even in a tournament on a hag. Trapping items can cost survivor a lot of time or they lose it.
"But like with trapper against old object sometimes you need to change your tactic. If you have a part of the map trapped you can chase a survivor, trap every loop, so that he needs to leave and herd him to your traps."
Well first Trapper is a bad example. You can actually chase somewhat with Trapper as he's a 115%, Hag is a 110%, not the same. You aren't gonna be herding with Hag like that unless the survivors are rank 15's or something.
"Or you can stay close to your web and if one gets disarmed you chase the survivor into the next trap. It helps to change your trap placement or to set a backup trap at the same loop."
That's not a chaser Hag, that's playing defensively in your web.
"If the survivor are on tournament level and destroy your traps all at the same time you will lose, but that never happens. Even the sweaty russian rank 1 swf with object and every meta perk couldnt do it and they were really good survivor. They got all gens done and almost escaped but i never felt like a killer without a power. So i know that there are teams which will destroy you, but i never met them. Everytime i lose with hag its bc i messed up."
Hag is a pub stomper. She destroys bad players more so than the average killer and the average survivor is pretty bad. She loses quite hard with actually good survivors.
"Franklin is not that bad against flashlights. I did see it even in a tournament on a hag. Trapping items can cost survivor a lot of time or they lose it."
Tournaments run by different rules and most the tournaments are literally just face camping each person to death on a hook. A lot of the tournaments have had really bad players as well. You should never be wasting a perk slot on Franklin's if your actual intention is winning. The scenario you're describing will work on the average survivor because as we've talking about, they're bad.
If you want to mainly reference average games which are against bad players then yeah that's fine, you can run whatever you want as nothing really matters if the survivors are bad. You can run zero perks, zero addons and still slaughter most average matches even at rank 1. My responses are if you are actually facing decent survivors that are at least as good as yourself.
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It's because deep down they know it does mean something, they're just lying to themselves.
We all know how messed up and flawed the ranking system and rank reset system is. It piles up lots of people to ranks they don't belong in.
That said, just because there's a lot of potatoes piled up at ranks they don't belong in doesn't change the fact that on average a rank 1 will play better than a rank 10 for example. So while rank doesn't mean a lot, it does mean something.
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@TicTac said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2147487#Comment_2147487
How long is a long chase for you? Imo long chases are boring. Chases are interesting if you need to outplay the killer every few seconds. Like on unsafer pallets where you need to fake a vault or you need to stun the killer to get away. But currently a bad killer can get a easy hit with bloodlust in this structures. Safe loops should be rare and you would need to think when to use them in a match. So i want to create slower matches with more killer lethality which slow gens down.
Another problem with long chases are that 3 survivor need to wait and hold m1. So while i have no problem with doing gens, i dont like matches right now where i need to do 3 gens (240sec). And personally i prefer matches which take 10-15min.
"How long is a long chase for you?"
In order for you to have a chance at winning against good survivors chases need to be <20 seconds tops. Hit or pallet in that time and then you rotate pressure. Longer than that and you're losing the game. Even then, you can still lose through objective time even when you're at sub 20 seconds if they're really efficient.
"Imo long chases are boring. Chases are interesting if you need to outplay the killer every few seconds. Like on unsafer pallets where you need to fake a vault or you need to stun the killer to get away."
The average community disagrees with this. Most players enjoy long chases. Long being greater than 20 seconds.
"But currently a bad killer can get a easy hit with bloodlust in this structures."
Bringing this up is completely irrelevant. The time it takes to gain bloodlust is losing you the game, so if they are actually bloodlusting you for hits they're throwing the game away for it. Bloodlusting is not a viable strat. IE not worth mentioning.
"Safe loops should be rare and you would need to think when to use them in a match."
I agree, they're currently way too prevalent.
"So i want to create slower matches with more killer lethality which slow gens down."
You're wanting to double dip.
Our options are either increasing killer lethality to keep up with gen speeds or slowing the game down so they don't need to be as lethal to compete. You're wanting both?
"Another problem with long chases are that 3 survivor need to wait and hold m1. So while i have no problem with doing gens, i dont like matches right now where i need to do 3 gens (240sec). And personally i prefer matches which take 10-15min."
That's understandable. That's part of why I think the "slowing the game down" should be with extra objectives that make "doing gens" more interesting and fun than it currently is.
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@Maelstrom10 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2147474#Comment_2147474
great changes!
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2147487#Comment_2147487
the problem with that is that slowing down objective times, ultimately comes down to the arugement of slowing down gens. and 80's already feels slow enough with gen regression perks on the table. imo opinion, i think that once the hatch changes come through, that depending on the amount of survivors left alive, exit gates should have increased time to open (ie 4 survivors left alive, the exit gate is 40s instead of 20, with each survivor decreasing exit gate timers upon death. remember me would need to be rebalanced, but if done right, this could allow for extra pressuring of gate's as an additonal objective. - other things could factor into gate times depending on how long the match took as well. ie if the generators sped by incredibly fast (ie if the generators were powered in > 5 minutes, it takes longer to open, but not if the generators were "protected" ( < 5 minutes.) this would allow for killer's to emit pressure if they had a poor early game, whilst still allowing survivors the ability to speed through gens if not adequetly protected
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2147545#Comment_2147545
I can deffinately agree to removing the stalking limit. that seems rather silly having ghostface in the game now. atleast have it regenerate over time so that only individual survivors are dry at any one point. - making him 120% in t3 isn't a bad change, but i think they should rebalance t1 instead and make it more powerful with him being 110% speed personally or even 115% with the small lunge. it would allow him to be a permanent stealth ghostace, or he could choose to tier up upon finding a survivor in order to get some nasty tier 3 potential. (tier 1 either small lunge and big speed, or big speed and small lunge
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2147548#Comment_2147548
yes
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2147602#Comment_2147602
Imo plagues already in a good place, but if we did give her additional abilities as such, i'd prefer she *move to the fountain*, instead. would save on travel time, but still allow for strategic cleansing from survivors as counter play.
on legion - Absolutely. if anything i would prefer for the ability to be split in two with addons. basekit legion works as normal, but addons adjust him to be a more lethal killer and less of a slowdown, gaining his power slowly and being able to unleash it like oni to go slashing for downs temporarily. like freddy pallets only useful! also having his basekit be more fun for both sides and less just mending simulator.
Spirit - i'd prefer for her husk to no longer be left behind actually. if you see her dissapear you know she's phasing. not immediately having it dissapear though, after a second or two. would also allow for her to have a higher skill cap as you could hide your body behind a wall rather then at a pallet, and make a survivor guess on whether or not you've phased or if your waiting behind the wall.
Pig - i think she just need's less rng to her kit. box's shouldn't be so far on a variety of maps, and she needs to never have someone get them off on the first go. - also no aura reading before activate, and possibly no allowing of searching boxes until they activate.
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2147658#Comment_2147658
Yeah this is how i'd do it. that or make him even 115% speed in tier 1. there's no real reason stealth killers should have a detriment to their speed in stealth (ie pig or myers) if they already have detriments to their attacks (small lunge and charge for pig dash/exiting stealth for her.)
"the problem with that is that slowing down objective times, ultimately comes down to the arugement of slowing down gens. and 80's already feels slow enough with gen regression perks on the table. imo opinion, i think that once the hatch changes come through, that depending on the amount of survivors left alive, exit gates should have increased time to open (ie 4 survivors left alive, the exit gate is 40s instead of 20, with each survivor decreasing exit gate timers upon death. remember me would need to be rebalanced, but if done right, this could allow for extra pressuring of gate's as an additonal objective. - other things could factor into gate times depending on how long the match took as well. ie if the generators sped by incredibly fast (ie if the generators were powered in > 5 minutes, it takes longer to open, but not if the generators were "protected" ( < 5 minutes.) this would allow for killer's to emit pressure if they had a poor early game, whilst still allowing survivors the ability to speed through gens if not adequetly protected"
I don't this it necessarily comes down to increasing the 80 seconds of a gen per say. I was thinking more through extra objectives, an "early game collapse", smaller map sizes, etc. Things like that.
Longer gates is one of those options as you mentioned as well. I like the sliding scale gate time based on survivors alive. I also think we need gate regression when not being worked on as well.
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@TicTac said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2171894#Comment_2171894
I never dodge lobbies. I would probably bring franklins, but a hard game is more interesting. Against a flashlight you need to set up less and play more of a chaser hag.
Hard games are fun, unfair games are not. There's a difference.
Franklin's is a meme perk and a waste of a perk lot.
There is no such thing as "chaser" Hag, that's just simply playing Hag badly.
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- Can remotely collect her Corrupt Purges.
- Fully infected/broken players have the Oblivious status effect.
This would go along way. She needs help.
Her issues are terrible time efficiency, no map pressure, and survivors denying her power.
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S tier is the level of power where killers actually stand a fair chance of winning against equally good survivors. You balance from the top down if you want a fair game. Lots of people are picking A tier but A tier killers lose vs equally good survivors every time, they rely on the survivors to make mistakes if they want a chance at winning. That isn't a fair match.
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@TicTac said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2170969#Comment_2170969
It wouldnt really make her extremely weak. Only good survivor can spot hag traps consistently and with this change you could make the traps less visible. She would still be stronger then against 4 flashlights right now.
Stronger against bad survivors, worse against good survivors. That's the complete opposite of what we want.
You mention a game of 4 flashlights but that's kind of irrelevant as you'd be dodging that lobby as Hag anyway.
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Sickle on the end of a chain.
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@ChunWooHan said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2171247#Comment_2171247
so you steal my argument after that change it (edit) to trying to invalidate the argument of aimant ? that is what we are talking about main killers, instead of giving a good feed just you dont want they change it i guess and that is fine but dont try to hide the sun with your finger.
First, I can't even understand what you're saying from the broken grammar and sentence structure.
Second, I am not a killer main, I play both sides equally. Just because someone disagrees with you doesn't make them a killer main. Stop being tribal and provide counter arguments to points you disagree with, name calling is illogical.
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@Aimant said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2171247#Comment_2171247
Would you mind explain me how's that "I lied and misunderstood basically (as you expressed) the whole game"?
Perhaps we're talking about a completly different game then, because I'm here playing and talking about Dead by Daylight. Oh, maybe I posted on the wrong forum... Let me check.
Hmm... Nope, this is it.
How's that you're so locked up in your own perspective that you can't consider other ones? That mayble I'm right too?
"Would you mind explain me how's that "I lied and misunderstood basically (as you expressed) the whole game"?"
First don't put quotes around something I didn't say. A quote is a quote, not an interpretation.
"Perhaps we're talking about a completly different game then, because I'm here playing and talking about Dead by Daylight. Oh, maybe I posted on the wrong forum... Let me check.
Hmm... Nope, this is it."
Sarcastic insults won't move your conversation forward at all, but making points with critical thinking will.
"How's that you're so locked up in your own perspective that you can't consider other ones? That mayble I'm right too?"
I did consider your points, they were bad.
"I assume you're main killers, right? Because there's no way a main survivor or someone who plays both sides would agree that nonsense argument. Just to make it clear, I'm the second tipe of person who plays both sides, as survivor and killer."
Calling someone a killer main because you disagree with them is already starting a conversation by name calling and doesn't show an actual eagerness for a rational conversation. Just because someone disagrees with you doesn't make then a whatever main. They may simply have a better balanced perspective.
"The obvious reduction of pallets? The machine (harvester-tech) nerfed? The dead zones (which are "covered" with useless huge objects as boxes or hay blocks) around the map? There's no need to have 7000+ hours to understand such a simple situation that happened here: the rework of Coldwind map is absolutely a pro-killer one right now. If you want to accept it or not, is your choice. But you can't change the evident fact that it is."
The map is still quite survivor sided. There are still way more than enough pallets, the harvester "nerf" is a bit of a stretch as it also got buffed since you can fast vault it now, and yes there are some dead zones as many maps already have, you are expected to play around that factor. The rework is not a "pro-killer" change, it's a pro-balanced design change. It was busted for survivors before hence why SWF always sent you there. As I mentioned before, it's still survivor sided.
"I've been telling it from a time ago: The main (and worrying) problem of Dead by Daylight and its toxicity is lack of empathy. And the comments here are the living proof of that."
People disagreeing with you isn't lack of empathy. Calling it that is just showing your ego with the inability to understand you could be wrong and choosing to name call them instead.
"Really easy to say "If you waste 8 pallets in 2 minutes, then you're such a bad player"... With the corresponding respect, THERE'RE 4 SURVIVORS playing the game, you can't be so selfish as main killer. If I play alone and some of the randoms throw pallets as there's no tomorrow, why would it be my fault? Is it really my fault that my teammates are as bad as a rotten potato?"
That is not selfish, that is understanding the balance of the game. It's a 1v4, not a 1v1. You are a team, not a solo. If the game was balanced around 1v1 how you are implying it would be busted. The game is balanced around your team doing things like that. It is your teams fault, not your fault. Selfish is ignoring the team aspect and wanting the game balanced around you.
"If your answer is "yes", then there's no discussion to keep going on. Hope you can change your mentality soon and realize it's not everybody's fault. Playing without friends has turned into something impossible right now, and it's a pity for those good players."
Impossible without friends? Really?
I play solo queue at rank 1 95% of the time and we 3-4 escape at least 75% of my matches. If you find it that impossible it is a you issue, not a balance issue.
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The devs had a stream a couple years ago where they went into detail about why something like this will never happen. It was mainly related to difficulty with the amount of issues it would cause and computer processing load.
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@ChunWooHan said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2171155#Comment_2171155
you should read aimant POV anyways there is nothing to say, im main survivor who play both sides, im not agree with this new update coldwind farm and your pov is far to be the reality finally, that is why i made this post how discussion and has been moved to suggestion right now maybe they can fix it to give us a good rework like mcmillan state, autohaven, asylum, etc. atm its a painful map for solo survivors +1
Aimants post I almost commented on. So much of that post is completely untrue and shows a misunderstanding of the game at a fundamental level.
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@beached said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2171174#Comment_2171174
I’m absolutely in favor of those changes. Using the twins ability to be in two places at once should come with unpredictability which helps you surprise survivor. I would take the twins being hard to pin down over a camp mechanic any day.
Yeah they approached her slugging as the issue (which has lots of counter play) instead of focusing on her real issue which is the camping.
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This is the change they actually needed.
Now revert the ridiculous nerf they did on Victor pounces and give Charlotte Undetectable while Victor is being held.
This would fix her two issues which are camping and taking Victor hostage.
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@ChunWooHan said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2171104#Comment_2171104
The order of the factors does not alter the product, 40m of kills vs 4m scaped, this is maths only even if its not exactly for suicides / dc (dc for me is already nerfed since you got a ban) / slug / camping / facecamping / tunnel / premades / etc. this only show the killer sided what im talking about and the point here is the other reworks are fine cuz they keep the same amount of pallets and dont touch the main buildings / structures / objects... coldwind is another story finally... pallet reduction + new structures... no essence...
The result is not all that matters, that is flawed thinking. We care about kills because we are using it to determine balance, ergo the kills that were made in relation to balance are all that matter.
The only time the end result is all that matters is when we are not drawing conclusions from those kills such as balance, of which you are.
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@ChunWooHan said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2171027#Comment_2171027
so that is why 40m of survivors has been killed vs 4m of survivors has been scaped... bhv post it on twitter just amazing, this dont contemplate the facecamping , sluging, camping, tunneling (this is lgeal im not against it) but you cant say its survivor sided maps xD cuz the win rate is high on killer more than survivors for statics of bhv.
You're looking too much into those stats, they are flawed for a multitude of reasons that are completely unrelated to balance. Dcs, killing themselves on hook, NOED, getting 1 hook all game and then they just swarm the hook trying to save that guy and it turns into a 4k, etc etc.
There are many, many things in the game that artificial skew the kill rate higher that are entirely unrelated to balance whatsoever. This is also why the devs specifically said not to make any interpretations about balance when looking at the stats.
If you think the game is killer sided you are in the extreme minority. The vast majority of the high rank/high hour community all agrees the game is survivor sided and quite significantly.
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@ChunWooHan said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2171011#Comment_2171011
so if coldwind is broken like you said... the others maps are heavens for survivors? that dont make me sense at the final like i said to the other guy mcmillan state still have the essence of his old map :) coldwind no.
About 60% the maps are survivor sided with varying degrees of that of course. Some heavily, some mildly, and some just slightly. 20% are balanced and 20% are killer sided. These are rough gauges of course.
Coldwind still feels like it has its essence to me.
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@ChunWooHan said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2170967#Comment_2170967
well firstly my english is not good at all its fine,
They are still there. You are forced to destroy the breakable walls to remove them.
R: so you gona tell me in the old infinite in rancid abattoir is not nerfed? you dont see the video right? killer can hit you across the full railling... ggs. even if there are walls its not a infinite anymore its like a building with a unique window... and only can do fast vault for one side.
There are plenty of pallets, the structures aren't really nerfed, there are still infinites, and you can actually fast vault the side window of harvester now (aka buff for good survivors). This isn't multiple nerfed things about the map, you're just misconstruing the changes.
R: maybe main killer? im speaking about the two sides cuz im rank 1 killer and survivor playing 3000 hours+ in experience too, this coldwind farm is far to be the same as the old one in pallet ubications and structures. (nerfed)
Yes Brutal Strength is mediocre, the math has been done on the time it's actually saving you.
R: there is something called imagination and builds.
I can't tell what you're trying to say here with the jumbled grammar and sentence structure.
R: like i said in the other line... that is only a point of view and i dont share it.
"so you gona tell me in the old infinite in rancid abattoir is not nerfed? you dont see the video right? killer can hit you across the full railling... ggs. even if there are walls its not a infinite anymore its like a building with a unique window... and only can do fast vault for one side."
I watched the video. In general, the infinites are more plentiful. It costs the killer a lot having all those breakable walls he has to waste time on or lose chases. I definitely wouldn't straight up call the infinites nerfed per say. We do need all infinites removed though, and not from wasting time on a breakable wall.
"maybe main killer? im speaking about the two sides cuz im rank 1 killer and survivor playing 3000 hours+ in experience too, this coldwind farm is far to be the same as the old one in pallet ubications and structures. (nerfed)"
I have played both sides at rank 1 for 7,300+ hours. It has plenty of pallets and I'd even say the map is still quite survivor sided.
"there is something called imagination and builds."
I never said there wasn't. It's just not very strong.
The Coldwind maps needed to be brought down in power level, they were ridiculous.
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@Ketrab2703 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2154558#Comment_2154558
When playing as Hag recently I thought that would be a good idea to remove ability to remove traps with flashlights BUT give survivors "basekit" counter (i used word basekit because i lack better word). It could be a small 2-4 seconds animation of survivor trampling the trap (the triangle symbol). It would be move away from items/perks countering killers, it would just a base feature of The Hag.
A feature like that in her base kit would make her extremely weak.
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@ChunWooHan said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2170884#Comment_2170884
the infinites are nerfed lol just look that: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pSAbddZYtmU&ab_channel=Cru5h , about the 8 pallets in 2 min im talking the point of view of me playing how killer :) and when im solo queue randoms wasted it so fast so what strong are you talking about? if there isnt pallets + nerfed structures + nerfed infinites + removed harvester tech + windows nerfed on rancid abattoir + infinite nerfed (you can hit now across the railing.... this is not strong anymore :) im talking just based on the rework like mcmillan state!, brutal strength is mediocre? damn boy there isnt perks mediocres at the final in this game everyone can use what they want and its legal.
"the infinites are nerfed lol just look that: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pSAbddZYtmU&ab_channel=Cru5h ,"
They are still there. You are forced to destroy the breakable walls to remove them.
"about the 8 pallets in 2 min im talking the point of view of me playing how killer :) and when im solo queue randoms wasted it so fast so what strong are you talking about?"
You don't call loops or pallets weak because you have teammates that play bad, that doesn't make sense.
"if there isnt pallets + nerfed structures + nerfed infinites + removed harvester tech + windows nerfed on rancid abattoir + infinite nerfed (you can hit now across the railing.... this is not strong anymore"
There are plenty of pallets, the structures aren't really nerfed, there are still infinites, and you can actually fast vault the side window of harvester now (aka buff for good survivors). This isn't multiple nerfed things about the map, you're just misconstruing the changes.
"brutal strength is mediocre? "
Yes Brutal Strength is mediocre, the math has been done on the time it's actually saving you.
"damn boy there isnt perks mediocres at the final in this game everyone can use what they want and its legal.""
I can't tell what you're trying to say here with the jumbled grammar and sentence structure.
The corn maps are still extremely strong and were busted maps before the rework. There's a reason all the SWF groups sent you here if they didn't have a Haddonfield offering. They needed significant toning down.
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Man I really hope it is a "vampire" killer that would be awesome. The video seems to very clearly point to that as what it is so if it's not that's very blatant misdirection. I don't know how else that video could be interpreted.
"The Impaler"
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@ChunWooHan said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2170598#Comment_2170598
im rank 1 actually both sides, you can delete these 8 pallets in 2 minutes (im speaking without perks to do it... if we add the brutal strenght... or bubba with bamboozle) gg game, there is not good loops anymore since they nerfed every main building + techs + structures (like tree of cows) + dead zones 1 pallet every 10 metters rip just not fun + reduction of pallets just its not fair at all. :)
If you're giving up 8 pallets in 2min you're flat out playing badly. Brutal Strength is mediocre, I hope they waste a perk slot on that. The main building is way stronger. The killer is forced to break multiple breakable walls just to remove the 3 infinites that are there before you break them. The jungle gyms are still there and nearly just as strong.
A lot of this you've said is just hyperbole.
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Has nothing to do with hit boxes. The issue is ping and desync. Yes they have been bad for quite a long time.
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@Mooks said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2168418#Comment_2168418
yeah, that’s alright but.. this forced diversity does not happen in Dead by Daylight?
i agree forced diversity and inclusiveness is wrong and shouldn’t be in any media without context etc. But in DbD and especially with the devs we know they do it in a great way and because they actually want to do it.
there is no reason to assume they do it for the wrong reasons. We got a Kpop star that is Korean even though they already had ticked of the Korean department with Jake. We got Yui and Oni even though we already had Spirit as a ‚token’ Japanese character. They are not going after a checklist and creating token characters is what I am trying to say, they are creating the Chars they want to create and the storys the want to tell.
I'm not necessarily implying the devs per say, but the aforementioned thought process was the rational I was getting from OP's use of words.
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@Mooks said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2168388#Comment_2168388
I mean for most shows/games they are taking place somewhere specific and it actually makes sense that for example in Japan there are mostly Japanese people.
but for Dead by Daylight, it just makes sense to have people from all over the place, as they are getting brought from their world to the Entity’s realm.
also, diversity doesn’t hurt anyone. But it can make people feel acknowledged/included when they don’t feel that way generally.
"I mean for most shows/games they are taking place somewhere specific and it actually makes sense that for example in Japan there are mostly Japanese people.
but for Dead by Daylight, it just makes sense to have people from all over the place, as they are getting brought from their world to the Entity’s realm."
That makes sense. I guess my point is that it's not being brought up from a place of "this game is technically located everywhere" and instead it's brought up in the sense of forced diversity quotas which feels discriminatory. I wouldn't want to be judged by my nationality but by the content of my character.
"also, diversity doesn’t hurt anyone. But it can make people feel acknowledged/included when they don’t feel that way generally."
Well for example let's say you had a cool concept for a samurai killer but oh wait, inclusivity, so you we make the samurai whatever other ethnicity. You just took that other persons position and gave it to another for the sake of their nationality, aka discrimination. Obviously these aren't real people but this is more a comment to "diversity doesn't hurt anyone", it can. I find "acknowledged/included" a very weird concept. In my previous example of an asian game I don't feel excluded because it's just asian characters, it's an asian made game, that just makes sense to me and is expected, it's logical. Why do people need to feel "acknowledged"? It's a game lol.
In other words I like the idea of unique characters from all over the world that get brought in because they have unique and cool stories that need to be included. What I don't like is forced quotas that look to put characters in because they fill the check mark next to that nationality etc. So I agree with the end result, it's the thought process and means to getting there I take issue with.
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I get people wanting variety but I honestly find the entire concept of looking at people so intensely through their nationality very strange.
Like I don't go into some japanese anime game and think to myself, "you know what this game needs? More European people!" or whatever nationality you want to throw in there.
If it's an asian game I'm typically just expecting it to have asian characters, that isn't surprising to me nor would I call that an issue that needs resolving. That would be like taking issue with them being asian because you're not asian. See why it's weird to think that way?
I guess I just focus more on the individual as a person(not where they're from) which is why I find this concept weird. I like new and unique characters because they are in fact unique, not because they fill quotas.
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@Babawizwiz said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2167341#Comment_2167341
How do i know you're a bad player? You stating that victor requires a trained muscle memory and body blocking with charlotee requires skill, that's a big giveaway.
And that's you not having enough experience in the game to understand that.
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@Babawizwiz said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2164227#Comment_2164227
nono i think you're one of those players with high playtime but not much to back up for, the killer you main says a lot
And how do you know what I have to back it up? You know nothing about me at all.
Your also going to assume I main Twins simply because you see a profile pic of the Twins. That's literally been there for not even a week. They aren't my main at all, I just regularly change my profile pic to whatever killer I'm having more fun on recently.
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Nurse and Spirit, that's it. Even Spirit will be sweating for it.
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@Devil_hit11 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2165567#Comment_2165567
I think you were missing my point. what i meant was that spirit without stridor can consistently be juked wiith Iron will by skilled survivors making it a hard counter to her. The truly strong killers can can overcome their pitfalls(drawbacks), in her case the lack of vision to reap the rewards of 180 m/s-220 m/s phase walk. Stridor removes hard counter towards her and makes it a soft counter making her a powerful killer. survivors don't like this full access of control and power and therefore complain she is "too strong".
I don't think agree with your last statement. The odds are stacked against the survivor against a strong spirit player with strong add-ons which is how killers should be. Its why scottjund at one point requests anyone to 1vs1 the his spirit to see how long they could last in a chase. the result would be obvious that the chase wouldn't last very long. With most of the other killers, their chases can last very long depending the pallets/resources used because the fundamentals of looping and loop design hard counter them in a chase. With spirit, they do not. This is why its impressive to escape a strong spirit player with good add-ons as opposed to other killers that consistently get destroyed with minimal effort with their best add-ons(if they have any).
Moral of the story. use Stridor on Spirit, it makes her good.
"I think you were missing my point. what i meant was that spirit without stridor can consistently be juked wiith Iron will by skilled survivors making it a hard counter to her. The truly strong killers can can overcome their pitfalls(drawbacks), in her case the lack of vision to reap the rewards of 180 m/s-220 m/s phase walk. Stridor removes hard counter towards her and makes it a soft counter making her a powerful killer. survivors don't like this full access of control and power and therefore complain she is "too strong"."
I see what you're saying, I agree.
"I don't think agree with your last statement. The odds are stacked against the survivor against a strong spirit player with strong add-ons which is how killers should be. Its why scottjund at one point requests anyone to 1vs1 the his spirit to see how long they could last in a chase. the result would be obvious that the chase wouldn't last very long. With most of the other killers, their chases can last very long depending the pallets/resources used because the fundamentals of looping and loop design hard counter them in a chase. With spirit, they do not. This is why its impressive to escape a strong spirit player with good add-ons as opposed to other killers that consistently get destroyed with minimal effort with their best add-ons(if they have any)."
I disagree here about Spirit specifically. Spirit against a good group of survivors is nearly a fair a match, I'd even call it slightly in the survivors favor. That's even assuming no items so it could tilt in their favor even further. Scotts example isn't exactly a fair one. You can 1v1 decently fast with Spirit but good survivors will still generally come out on top simply through objective time disparities. We don't judge this game through a 1v1, we judge it through a 1v4. It's impressive to escape a strong Spirit because most survivor matches are against potatoes but that's not how we judge strength.
I agree about the issues with the other weaker killers though.
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@Unironicalygoth said:
@Blueberry this is factual I forgot about that one
On average you will get way more value from WGLF than even Unbreakable. WGLF is a default on all my survivor builds.
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You actually forgot the best one, WGLF.
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Some no, but for the most part they seem good.
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They all bring Break Down when it was bugged with 4 toolboxes, Unbreakables, WGLF, Soulguard.
Unfortunately for them I was on the Twins and wasn't planning to hook them anyway lol.
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@Devil_hit11 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2165047#Comment_2165047
Its almost like she gets counter-play. who woulda gussed? See, truly strong killers do not have hard counter-play. They just look at you and you die. That is what true power and control looks like. Its why survivors complain about her.
With other killers, Its like opposite, the good survivors look at you and you get looped from seemingly endless string of safe pallets and relatively safe window vaults. With spirit, they aren't so safe and you have to make reads using the resources. I'd say any form of Juking is probably highest skill-expression that a survivor has for DBD. It is why looping a spirit is so much more skillful than any of the others killers. Its winning when the odds are stacked against you. Its very impressive.
"Its almost like she gets counter-play. who woulda gussed?"
She already has tons of counter play if they understand how she works.
"See, truly strong killers do not have hard counter-play."
They do have hard counter play.
"They just look at you and you die. That is what true power and control looks like. Its why survivors complain about her."
They complain because they're bad and just make excuses instead of taking responsibility. There's lack of accountability.
"It is why looping a spirit is so much more skillful than any of the others killers."
I agree.
"Its winning when the odds are stacked against you. Its very impressive."
I don't think it's stacked against them. It does show a high skill level to know how to juke Spirit though.
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The buffs were so small I don't think it actually moved his tier at all.
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I've been saying that idea for a while. Hide the UI so you don't have a good gauge on the killers current map pressure. Current blindness is lackluster.
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@Bangarang said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2165075#Comment_2165075
It just always confuses me as I constantly see her being called ‘easy mode’ yet I struggled when I played as her. And I see killers like Clown being called weak and I got to rank 1 by using Clown, Deathslinger and Legion.
I wasn’t sure if I was doing something wrong by not being able to pick her up straight off the bat. I accidentally ended up on an old Otzdarva video last night and it was when Spirit first came out and he classed her as having a high skill cap. It’s just funny how that narrative has completely changed now lol.
I’ll stick at it. I don’t have an ego when it comes to games and I shouldn’t expect myself to be good at every killer. I’ll try her some more but she might just not be my cup of tea and that’s fine.
What causes the confusion is people misconstrue kill results for being easy. Spirit asks more skill of the survivor than average killers do. So kills can make it "feel" like she's easy but it's not that she's easy, it's that survivors in general are quite bad and they don't play against you correctly since they have to play against her completely differently than other killers.
You gotta remember that the average player in these forums is playing at low ranks where the survivors will play terrible such as giving Spirit footsteps to listen to or scratch marks to follow. Against actual "good" survivors you will not be getting this.
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It's not bait.
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@Bangarang said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2165032#Comment_2165032
I just had a miserable time playing as her but I think it’s because I only had 2 perks and neither of them were Stridor. I was against high ranks and they knew to walk when I was phasing and because I literally had zero audio cues as to which direction they went, I just kept losing them. So I do understand why so many people use Stridor. Especially when learning her.
I often hear survivors moving in the grass and breathing but it’s entirely dependent on the survivor and the map. I just kept getting maps that didn’t have a lot of grass and it was like playing against Houdini lol.
I picked some killers up really fast and I expected Spirit to be the same but I really struggled as her. I’ve even played as perkless Nurse and got a 4K at red ranks. I actually find her easier to use, is that crazy of me? 😂
Maybe I just need to unlock Stridor and try her again.
Ignore when people like to call Spirit easy. It's either being uninformed or simply disingenuous. It stems from people just hating Spirit. She requires more skill than most of the killer roster.