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@gibblywibblywoo said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2165032#Comment_2165032
I think that's peoples main gripe with her design. She lives or dies based on what perks are in play. At least for average players. A decent spirit can still win against IW users without Stridor but you have to be good at listening out for footsteps, and knowing when to stop the phase early to catch a double back.
"but you have to be good at listening out for footsteps, and knowing when to stop the phase early to catch a double back."
Good survivors will not be giving you footsteps and early double back is not reliable, it's still guessing. Those ending scratch marks could have got in multiple directions.
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If the survivors are actually using Iron Will and you're not using Stridor she's barely even B tier. People like to mock and call Stridor a crutch and it just shows how little they actually play it from both sides. If the survivors are actually silent because you're not running Stridor it is literally you just guessing every time.
As long as Iron Will exists in the meta, you need Stridor, just equip it. You can win games against complete potatoes even at rank 1 without it, but if the survivors are even the slightest bit competent you're gonna get dunked.
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@PureDoctorMain said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2164227#Comment_2164227
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2164654#Comment_2164654
I'm sorry I am a bit confused is OP giving you two crap because the twins are hard. Can one of you explain to me whats happening. Because it seems he is giving you crap for no reason.
Literally all that happened was I said Twins did require a lot of skill and explained why. Then he decided to mock and insult because he disagreed. That's pretty much it.
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@Babawizwiz said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2161700#Comment_2161700
Did i touch a nerve by simply calling you a potato? You have a lot more hours so you should be able to tell the difference between an easy killer and one that requires skill. Kinda funny how a player with at least 1k hours claimed that "victor needs muscle memory'.
And now you're gonna attempt to belittle? It's quite possible to have a normal conversation without trying to insult the other person.
I think you need a few more hours and experience into the game.
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They really just want no one to play this killer, that's how it feels. They were already the lowest played killer and now they've made them even less fun to play. They're just killing all skill cap and creativity available to them.
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Man it feels just so bad. It doesn't fix any of their issues while simultaneously making them less fun to play...when they're already the least played killer in the game...
Eating a DS on every hit is such a terrible idea.
Not to mention the slew of nerfs they didn't even bother to put in the patch notes because they don't even realize how much of a nerf they are. So much for creative use of Charlotte. As if she wasn't already near useless enough, we found some little use for her in blocking escape routes, gens, or totems and now even that's gone.
It feels like they really just don't want anyone at all playing the Twins.
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@Moxie said:
Hey! I am currently still in mourning and am in the "grr im so angrey" stage:
ADDITIONAL STEALTH NERFS TO TWINS NOT MENTIONED IN ANY PATCH NOTES:
-No longer have collision. Remember how you could block door ways with Charlotte? No longer! This was deemed too "creative" by the Devs, so that has been taken away. You can now glide through Charlotte like a specter or something
-Back to Back view. Remember a couple patches ago, when you latched on to a Survivor you switched back to Charlotte right away. That's gone. Now we are back to Victor View after he latches on, adding another 1.5 secs to Charlottes "awaken" time.
Still testing all Add-ons and bugs. I will update this when I discover more.
Wow. For not even mentioning all that in those notes it's quite insulting. That stuff is more than QoL changes.
They're really trying hard to kill the only 3 people that actually play The Twins.
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@Devil_hit11 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2162419#Comment_2162419
are you saying that 90 second lucky break wouldn't need med-kit to get multiple uses out of it?
Its not that it is niche, it is that old lucky break was ineffective perk with irrelevant effect. The no scratch marks is relevant effect in new one, though sadly it might not get used much now. It's ok, most chapter add very little perk wise anyhow, so we're used to it by now. Sort of miss old days where we were excited for new perks/changes. Now a days, its more like "cool zanshin tactic is better" or cool "Any mean Nessacary is better" neither of which I really see get used unless its tome challenge.
"are you saying that 90 second lucky break wouldn't need med-kit to get multiple uses out of it?"
No I am not.
"Its not that it is niche, it is that old lucky break was ineffective perk with irrelevant effect. The no scratch marks is relevant effect in new one, though sadly it might not get used much now. It's ok, most chapter add very little perk wise anyhow, so we're used to it by now. Sort of miss old days where we were excited for new perks/changes. Now a days, its more like "cool zanshin tactic is better" or cool "Any mean Nessacary is better" neither of which I really see get used unless its tome challenge."
I don't think the effect is that irrelevant. Great? No. Niche? Yeah
I agree with your other points.
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@Devil_hit11 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2162211#Comment_2162211
it already had niche uses with med-kit. 180 seconds is a lot of time. You could even make an arguement that the perk is in fact worse than it was before its changed if you were only using it to hide blood marks. I don't think people equip boil over to have 1/20 game chance to escape the killer shoulders just like you won't equip lucky break to have a.... 4/30(?) in seeing it do something. some indoor maps it does not even work on. like elementary school, killers generally always have vision on you.
"it already had niche uses with med-kit. 180 seconds is a lot of time."
Way too niche. Requires medkit of perk use to play around it.
"You could even make an arguement that the perk is in fact worse than it was before its changed if you were only using it to hide blood marks."
My argument wasn't about how good or bad the new Lucky Break is, simply that I would have preferred the other change which would've made it better for people interested in hiding blood.
"I don't think people equip boil over to have 1/20 game chance to escape the killer shoulders just like you won't equip lucky break to have a.... 4/30(?) in seeing it do something."
That's not an accurate comparison. Apples and oranges.
Not saying hiding blood is crazy strong or anything, you're just undervaluing it.
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Very dissapointed in the Twins gutting.
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@deckyr said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2162116#Comment_2162116
yes, you counter victor by grouping.
that's why the nerf doesn't change anything. in any cases where the survivors are good, victor will get kicked. and any cases where the survivors are bad, then you just win because they're bad so it doesn't matter.
No, the difference in distance you can cover with 3-5 seconds is massive. 3 requires some better reaction timing and positioning, 5 is so forgiving you can be bad with slow reaction and positioning and still get the kick. Not to mention simply the fact of stacking an extra 2 seconds of wasted time on Victor all game adds up to a lot.
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@Devil_hit11 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2161995#Comment_2161995
Not really, following scratch marks is an essential skill to playing killer. No blood marks is only hard counter to Wraith's perk "BloodHound", Hemorrhage status effect most often applied from the perk sloppy butcher or Spirit's father glasses add-on. Hemorrhage is most useless status effect in the game that nobody cares about and BloodHound is another one of those garbage killer perks that only get used by new players for tracking injured survivors that have trouble following scratch marks.
The only way i can see the effect being good is if you have iron will in an indoor map like lery where blood is really easy to see and you walk around corners which makes very little sense in the middle of a chase most of the time.
In the end, Iron will is mostly used on loops that have wall blockers and what it does is it makes killer have huge risks for attempting to do red glow mindgames on outer parts of the loop as they may leave the loop, gain a lot of distance and hold W against you without having to use precious pallet resources from their juke, so even if you can track scratch-marks/blood, it is often too late. Worth the perk slot? Maybe, but I'd say slightly overrated. Its definately good in its magical moments. It often conditions killers to "brute force" loops with bloodlust because they're afraid that they could lose you.
"Not really, following scratch marks is an essential skill to playing killer."
This has nothing to do with what I said.
"No blood marks is only hard counter to Wraith's perk "BloodHound", Hemorrhage status effect most often applied from the perk sloppy butcher or Spirit's father glasses add-on. Hemorrhage is most useless status effect in the game that nobody cares about and BloodHound is another one of those garbage killer perks that only get used by new players for tracking injured survivors that have trouble following scratch marks."
It has more use past all this. I'm not calling the perk meta, I'm simply saying it would be good enough to be considered for people that like stealth builds.
"The only way i can see the effect being good is if you have iron will in an indoor map like lery where blood is really easy to see and you walk around corners which makes very little sense in the middle of a chase most of the time."
Exactly and there are many indoor maps these days.
"In the end, Iron will is mostly used on loops that have wall blockers and what it does is it makes killer have huge risks for attempting to do red glow mindgames on outer parts of the loop as they may leave the loop, gain a lot of distance and hold W against you without having to use precious pallet resources from their juke, so even if you can track scratch-marks/blood, it is often too late. Worth the perk slot? Maybe, but I'd say slightly overrated. Its definately good in its magical moments. It often conditions killers to "brute force" loops with bloodlust because they're afraid that they could lose you."
I never said it was amazing/meta/better than Iron Will. I feel like you're comparing it to meta perks. I'm simply saying it would have some niche uses, not that it's gonna break into the meta.
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@deckyr said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2162008#Comment_2162008
i'd like to take this opportunity to point out that "the killer is strong" and "noone knows how to play against the killer" are seperate things.
realistically, after you down a survivor on victor, one of two things is going to happen: victor gets kicked, or you switch back to charlotte to pick up the downed survivor (and then victor gets kicked).
victor is regularly open to getting kicked for way more than 5 seconds in the case he downs someone as it is. what does 2 extra seconds on a process that takes up to 30 seconds actually going to impact? be honest with yourself.
"realistically, after you down a survivor on victor, one of two things is going to happen: victor gets kicked, or you switch back to charlotte to pick up the downed survivor (and then victor gets kicked)."
The more likely option that you didn't mention is continuing to look for other players with Victor for more slugs.
"victor is regularly open to getting kicked for way more than 5 seconds in the case he downs someone as it is. what does 2 extra seconds on a process that takes up to 30 seconds actually going to impact? be honest with yourself."
Because you're playing him wrong. 2 seconds is a lot. You counter Victor by grouping and those 2 extra seconds makes the window for another player to kick him massive. Even at 3 seconds it was already extremely forgiving. Downing each survivor one at a time and then walking over to pick them up is non viable, aka not how you play The Twins.
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What are you talking about.
2 seconds extra on successful lunges is a huge nerf.
The minuscule movement after lunge "buff" is near irrelevant and all the other changes were were only addons changes...ultra rare addons at that.
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@Devil_hit11 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2161519#Comment_2161519
Don't think so, following scratch marks is super easy. they needed both effects for it for to impact gameplay. they just chicken out because for some reason, they think meta perk =bad when meta perk just means it will get used unlike majority of the perks in the game that go unused due to little no to effect on gameplay.
as I said in previous discussions with you. the perks either have impact on gameplay or not have no impact on gameplay and it effects whether you see the perk or not. nerfed lucky break can probably get used one time on first chase but I do not think its worth the perk slot. I think I'd rather use Spine+Resilience over it. Chances are, if you lose the killer even a little bit, iron will already did its job in giving you distance.
The whole point of the no blood isn't for sprinting, IE there won't be scratch marks with it. I do think they got overly scared as you mentioned but I do think you're undervaluing no blood permanently.
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Get rid of the Twins nerf and I'd mostly agree.
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Buff? Her changes look more like nerfs than buffs to me.
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@Babawizwiz said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2161170#Comment_2161170
oh yeah there's so much muscle memory needed to get good with victor, jeez man are u a potato
Are we really gonna name call because you disagree? I have a lot more hours into the game than most people
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@TruffleTurtle said:
I just played a match. The speed is like if u hit a pounce and slowly were moving and yes u can still be kicked. I don't really like this change and kinda make them feel sluggish. Wish they just did missed pounces
So yup our worst fears. The movement is basically irrelevant and The Twins got trashed.
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@QwQw said:
I wouldn't get your hopes up. I imagine what they mean by "move" is Victor will be able to slowly shuffle around like Charlotte does when shes waking up, not actually having full movement speed.
Oh god, if that's actually what they mean then it's irrelevant and The Twins just got trashed after all.
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@SunderMun said:
It's a joke, honestly. If they're too scared to make a useless perk viable, they shouldn't bother changing it at all.
Legit all they had to do was make it permanently remove all blood at tier 3 and it would be sorted, but instead they went with this questionable rework idea that led to it being overall even worse than before.
Iron will for blood, that’s all this perk needed I agree. They overcomplicated it.
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Very happy they added this change. This makes the increase pounce delay much less painful and gives Victor more counter play to the kick.
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@Babawizwiz said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2160943#Comment_2160943
Then explain to me what is so complex with Twins.
You have to learn how to micromanage going back and forth understanding when you should or should not swap. You also need to learn the muscle memory for victor such as know your distances for how far you need to be back to make it through windows or over pallets.
This is much more skill level than the the average killer requires.
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@Babawizwiz said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2156409#Comment_2156409
just because a killer can't do well against red ranks, doesn't mean that they're easy to use. Freddy and Twins over-reward players for doing simple things, sure these simple things won't apply to good survivors, but against a non red rank, it's an easy win
"just because a killer can't do well against red ranks, doesn't mean that they're easy to use."
I never said that. Also, all killers can do well in red ranks.
"Freddy and Twins over-reward players for doing simple things, sure these simple things won't apply to good survivors, but against a non red rank, it's an easy win"
The things Twins are doing is not "simple things". Also, winning at low ranks is pretty meaningless as then they're just losing because their bad. We don't balance around bad.
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At this point I just want the meta shaken up.
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I love Midwich on both sides.
Haddonfield I like aesthetically, it's just a nightmare in terms of balance.
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@ShamelessPigMain said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2158620#Comment_2158620
I was thinking more in the case that the killer is just that good, so you're down a perk slot that could have been DS or DH. It's a downside based off of potential.
You're running all 3 of those perks so you actually aren't losing much.
That's why you see stacked second chance perks as the meta. BT/Unbreakable/DS/DH
A couple swap outs for WGLF or Prove Thyself possibly.
Basically they're all running a perk to counter tunneling/slugging/camping IE all your win conditions.
If you're running all those second chance perks then there isn't really an opportunity cost because unless you or your team played bad that game should be won since the killer couldn't do any of those win conditions.
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@ShamelessPigMain said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2158458#Comment_2158458
So what you're saying is high risk, high reward?
It's actually not high risk because if the killer didn't slug you should have won the game anyway. You have to slug if you want to win against good survivors. There literally isn't time to one hook each survivor one at a time. If you lost without the killer doing any slugging either you or your team played bad.
IE it's a win/win scenario running it.
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@IronKnight55 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2158388#Comment_2158388
Hook camping is what I was talking about. I don't mind getting slugged (unless I'm just left to bleed out). I wouldn't mind going against Twins if they fixed the camping.
That's fair then. Most people complain about the slugging which seems irrational to me.
I just want her hook camping fixed and taking Victor hostage fixed. Then she'd be fine.
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The better question is why they don't reach out to the high hour/high rank community. Bar some small differences most of them agree on the state of the game and its issues generally speaking.
Listening to the community as a whole would be a bad thing though. The community on average doesn't understand the games balance very well.
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S tier absolutely. One of the best perks in the game.
You only win against good teams with some variation of tunneling, camping, or slugging. Unbreakables removes one of those.
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@IronKnight55 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2158338#Comment_2158338
I wouldn't mind if I never saw another Twins player... I hate going against them. Most of them play scummy as heck.
Well it's the only way they can really be played.
Their only really scummy thing though is the hook camping which does need fixing.
The slugging is totally fine and has tons of counters.
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Really hope that Twins nerf doesn't go through.
If they thought Twins players were non existent before..they are gonna be extinct after this nerf.
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@Johnny_XMan said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2158294#Comment_2158294
You honestly just don't get my points. That's ok though, you seem to have an excuse for every single thing someone says against tunneling.
I'll just agree to disagree with every one of those comments. I like to have healthy arguments when players aren't biased towards one side or the other. I never said I wanted circumstances to be ridiculously loose, I want them to be fair. Big difference.
"'you seem to have an excuse for every single thing someone says against tunneling."
Because your rationals are bad.
"I'll just agree to disagree with every one of those comments. I like to have healthy arguments when players aren't biased towards one side or the other."
I have massive amounts of hours equally on both sides. Just because you disagree with me doesn't make my opinion biased, that's flawed reasoning. Your reasoning's aren't rational and because I'm poking holes in them now it's not a "healthy argument", that's just ridiculous.
You seem to be unable to believe there is even a remote chance whatsoever that you could possible be wrong. No, no, not a chance, he's just biased.
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@Johnny_XMan said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2158059#Comment_2158059
Doing gens as an action is not enough of a downside. Of course survivors can still do the objective, but if they want their teammate to remain alive, they will also try to help where/if they can. That is fundamental to the game as it is a team-based game and working on gens isn't the only way you have to survive.
As far as inconsistencies:
Inconsistency # 1: You cannot heal yourself but you can have others heal you and still keep DS. (doesn't make sense but ok)
Inconsistency #2: You can touch a gen for a split of a second and lose your DS, because somehow that gets the killer off your back. When in reality there is a reason why the devs added a 60 second timer. Because they felt that was fair. Not a 1 second deactivation that does nothing to progress the game.
Inconsistency #3: Doesn't work on both hook stages, even though people on here claiming "it only counts as tunneling if it is done right after an unhook".... *killer proceeds to tunnel at 1st and 2nd stage*.
You keep saying "you're not suppose to be immune to tunneling" but we haven't even began to scratch the surface to make such assumption. Even with the previous DS, you weren't immune because the killer could still down you.
Your views on tunneling are far from what encompasses tunneling. It isn't black/white as I and many others have explained many times. If you can understand how there are certain circumstances where the killer is forced to tunnel, then you should have enough understand where there are also circumstances where they didn't have to, and chose to anyway. I mean, as a 50/50 killer player I can at least admit that one.
A far more realistic and fair balance would have been for the timer to start depleting AS survivors are doing objectives, not immediately.
"Doing gens as an action is not enough of a downside. Of course survivors can still do the objective, but if they want their teammate to remain alive, they will also try to help where/if they can. That is fundamental to the game as it is a team-based game and working on gens isn't the only way you have to survive."
Losing the entire game is not enough of a downside? That's literally as bad as it can get.
"Inconsistency # 1: You cannot heal yourself but you can have others heal you and still keep DS. (doesn't make sense but ok)"
You're right, it should deactivate if you get healed as well. They were trying to be generous. If either of those actions are happening you aren't being tunneled.
"Inconsistency #2: You can touch a gen for a split of a second and lose your DS, because somehow that gets the killer off your back. When in reality there is a reason why the devs added a 60 second timer. Because they felt that was fair. Not a 1 second deactivation that does nothing to progress the game."
And they changed it later because they felt that is was not fair. That scenario you are presenting is not an issue with the perk, it's an issue with you making a bad decision. You should be making sure you are safe before touching the gen. The perk is to prevent you from getting tunneled off the hook, not from going down again in 60 seconds.
"Inconsistency #3: Doesn't work on both hook stages, even though people on here claiming "it only counts as tunneling if it is done right after an unhook".... *killer proceeds to tunnel at 1st and 2nd stage*."
Do you realize how many times I run into the same survivor after they happened to be the last one unhooked? It's purpose is to prevent tunneling off the hook, that's it.
"You keep saying "you're not suppose to be immune to tunneling" but we haven't even began to scratch the surface to make such assumption. Even with the previous DS, you weren't immune because the killer could still down you."
And then he gets picked up by a teammate, Unbreakable, Soul Guard etc. Downing them for 60 seconds was not a legit counter. You are immune for 60 seconds. You are the minority here. The vast majority of the community understood how overpowered this perk was.
"Your views on tunneling are far from what encompasses tunneling. It isn't black/white as I and many others have explained many times. If you can understand how there are certain circumstances where the killer is forced to tunnel, then you should have enough understand where there are also circumstances where they didn't have to, and chose to anyway. I mean, as a 50/50 killer player I can at least admit that one."
And these circumstances that the killer would choose to tunnel you DS is protecting you in its current state. You want the circumstances for DS activation to be so ridiculously loose that it would be abused and carrying games in high skill matches as it was before. I play 50/50 as well and what you want is not balanced at all.
"A far more realistic and fair balance would have been for the timer to start depleting AS survivors are doing objectives, not immediately."
That makes no sense whatsoever. You are not being tunneled while you are working away on a gen, that is ridiculous. If you are that worried you are getting tunneled then you shouldn't be touching a gen, you should be getting healed and in a safe place away from objectives.
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@Johnny_XMan said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2157668#Comment_2157668
You may not agree but they have a point, just as others do as well.
It is still an oppressive way to play with hardly any downside. There are so many inconsistencies in this perk’s design that I wouldn’t call it anti tunnel for those reasons alone. Let alone for the fact that you can still tunnel someone out of the game and now in an easier form than ever.
Even at two hook stage activations I wouldn’t call it anti-momentum. You are still tunneling after an unhook.
"It is still an oppressive way to play with hardly any downside."
That's simply not true. Your team should be pumping out gens in this time.
"There are so many inconsistencies in this perk’s design that I wouldn’t call it anti tunnel for those reasons alone."
Like what inconsistencies? It's quite consistent for an anti-tunnel.
"Let alone for the fact that you can still tunnel someone out of the game and now in an easier form than ever."
No, it isn't easier to tunnel than ever. All the circumstances that were removed were not tunneling circumstances. It's just as good for tunneling as it was before.
"Even at two hook stage activations I wouldn’t call it anti-momentum. You are still tunneling after an unhook."
As we've been over, it's anti-tunnel, not immune to tunnel. There are circumstances you are forced to tunnel as a killer and 2 activations would make this an immune to tunnel perk.
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@The_Krapper said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2157651#Comment_2157651
A tier ? That's a bit of a stretch, while I agree with the immunity being abused part I feel it's too situational to be ranked that high now , it's truly an anti tunnel perk at this moment in the game , on an off note it makes you wonder what they're about to come out with to compensate? I don't have a problem with the nerf but I'm expecting some pretty strong perks with a RE chapter coming
You're only way of winning in good vs good matches will require some variation of tunneling, camping, or slugging. DS single handedly eliminates one of those 3 options of winning. That is godly.
When it's a good team eating even one 5 sec DS stun will cost you at least 2 gens, aka the game.
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@Marigoria said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2157668#Comment_2157668
Not everyone plays in swf. It's time to start thinking more about solo Q
I'm not speaking directly of SWF. I'm speaking of good vs good. We balance from the top down.
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@Marigoria said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2157657#Comment_2157657
It should activate after both hook stages and it still wouldnt be overpowered. It just needs to actually be good at anti tunneling, which it isnt.
No, that would be too much. It doesn't need more. Even at one use it's already extremely strong. If one 5 sec stun from tunneling isn't costing him at least 2 gens your team is playing really bad.
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@Marigoria said:
Still doesn't really work for anti tunneling.
A killer can tunnel after 2 hook stages, and DS only has 1 use.
It's anti-tunnel, not immune to tunnel.
Immune to tunnel would be completely overpowered. There are times when the killer is required to tunnel.
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You don't see it used much now because most those people weren't actually being tunneled, they were abusing it as a 60sec immunity.
It still prevents tunneling just as well as it did before. Shows how much the change was a good one.
It's still at least an A tier if not S tier perk.
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-Map design is probably the number one issue.
-Balancing for low rank survivors instead of from the top down like most games. They also need to really stop looking at their flawed data so much for rationalizing their changes.
-Bad perk design. You've got some extremely unhealthy perks for the game and then the vast majority of the perk list that are just garbage. We aren't asking for the next S tier perk, but lots of these perks that get released are so completely terrible that they could literally have their numbers doubled, cooldown removed, and they would still be bad. There's fundamental misunderstanding of perks power levels and designs with whoever it is that's creating them.
-Bad priorities. They focus on things they are very unimportant as a priority while things that are extremely important can take years to change and no we're not talking about different teams here like cosmetic design and killer reworks. We're talking things like nerfing killers that aren't even remotely too strong instead of spending that time buffing some of the extremely weak and struggling killers.
-Objective times between the sides are not even on the same playing field when you look at the numbers. This however can tie back into bad map design which is part of what fuels these objective time imbalances so if maps were actually appropriately designed objective times wouldn't be as much of an issue. They could address this problem from multiple directions in other words.
-Map size. This could also go into map design but so many maps are just way too large even after their reworks.
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Blood Echo and Thana are both pretty bad even in their best case scenario, aka Plague.
Plague is very overrated in my opinion. Even B tier is generous to me.
This opinion is based on good survivors, not average rank 1 matches.
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@alex9er said:
I actually read all of the changes you suggested and i really like how you decreased the cooldown of perks like i'm all ears and trail of torment which have an absurd cooldown(in my opinion).The only one i disagree with is tenacity due to how easy it is for survivors to hide under grass and be barely visible.
Understandable. What if we stuck that on one of the weaker anti-slug perks that no one uses?
My thoughts as well on the cooldown issue. There are a ton of perks with cooldowns that either shouldn't even exist at all or at least need to be reduced tremendously.
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@Mooks said:
I guess an update with so many perk changes wouldn’t really be beneficial, it I definitely agree they should make more changes and experiment more, especially on PTB; maybe even different changes during one PTB to see the effects
I mean hypothetically if all these changes went through you would see a rainbow of perks in matches.
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@Phasmamain said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2156428#Comment_2156428
I’m more for nerfing iron will as a whole but yes. I don’t want perks to be sole counters to killers
This is assuming we give her some other changes to
If we're nerfing Iron Will then that sounds fine to me.
Aside from Spirit though I do actually like Iron Will as a perk a lot. I think it's one of the most balanced meta perks. However as you mentioned, they don't want perks directly countering killers so I guess it does need something done.
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@Phasmamain said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2156395#Comment_2156395
You’d probably have to change how spirits power works so it doesn’t get effected by stridor or predator
And she's not affected by Iron Will as well?
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Since when has anyone called Twins easy? That's a first for me.
I actually disagree a lot. She has heavy micromanaging skills with bouncing between the two characters and learning the muscle memory for Victor. There's much more than you see at face value.
You can see this play out in your matches as well. How many actually good Twins players do you run into? Very, very few for me. I win most my solo queue matches I get against Twins because most people can't get the hang of them or understand how they work.
If they're so easy why do most players of them even at rank 1 do pretty poorly?
I typically slaughter on Twins and 4k most my matches, but that is the polar opposite of what I see when I face against them.
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@Phasmamain said:
The thought of a predator stridor spirit scares me
This did cross my mind and I was a little worried.
It's a fun perk though and I'm not sure how we get around this. Ideas?
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@nursewannabe said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2154540#Comment_2154540
Agree to disagree, gen speeds are perfectly fine and gen regression perks make the game boring af imho
Also i thought about your spies from the shadows one. Honestly I'd keep it like this regarding the range, but 1) it'd spawn more crows if used and 2) crows have higher chance of getting alerted
Anyone with a decent amount of hours on both sides does not think gen speeds are currently fine. Gen slow down perks are literally required to even have a chance of winning against good survivors with how fast gens are. Agree to disagree though.
Your changes to Spies doesn't make any sense. Those changes make the perk still just as garbage as it is already because you're misunderstanding why the perk is fundamentally bad in the first place. It is giving you redundant information that you already should know. Your change furthers it giving you even more redundant information that you already know. Giving the killer a notification when a survivor disturbs a crow within 36m is near useless information.