Blueberry
Blueberry
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It’s currently way too easy to pip on both sides but it’s significantly easier on survivor. It needs to be made much harder.
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It’s also currently filtering the names of quite a few maps.
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@Devil_hit11 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2144384#Comment_2144384
you don't get it. if your at 1 stack and you use chainsaw on first charge, you lose your 5% boost. It consumes a token on chainsaw release and if your telling me that your charge 2-3 tokens with pwyf than using it, well you could lose all 3 tokens in a single rev.
I am just trying understand your leatherface logic for using this perk.
The point of the 5% tokens isn't for chainsaw speed, it's for positioning right before starting the chainsaw. IE to catch them out of position and just generally map pressure for that matter.
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@Devil_hit11 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2144158#Comment_2144158
You do realize that each token consumed removes a pwyf stack. Like suppose you have 3 tokens, if you use his chainsaw, it will go 2-1-0 in single chainsaw sprint. If your at PWYF stack 1 and you activate chainsaw, you will be at base speed. Unless your using his iri add-on(Carburetor tuning guide) to convert his chainsaw into 1 sprint, Nemesis+PWYF is not worth it. leatherface's iri add-on are terrible. they reduce your base movement speed in his chainsaw and remove control over when your chainsaw ends.
I have seen bubba run this as survivor and I do not understand logic, can you enlighten me?
Yes but you're rarely getting over 1 stack anyway as that's consecutively getting you downs before they just sit there stacking.
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There's definitely some kind of bugging going on. I haven't opened a single chest in the past few days at least that wasn't a key. Almost every single match has had a key in it where no one brought one from lobby as well.
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It's not daylight, it's daybreak. The sun still needs to be higher up for it to be daylight.
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@TicTac said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2144158#Comment_2144158
Dont you lose your PWYF-stacks with new Bubba to quickly? Or are you using always only one charge?
No it's per chainsaw use. I'm very rarely ever using m1 either. You'll get lots of stacks through Nemesis and not respecting pallets as well.
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Curving around objects is all just practice and knowing the object hit boxes. It comes with time.
As for builds I run Nemesis, PWYF, Bamboozle, and Pop. I tell you this build is scary to see as a survivor against a Bubba. You end chases so fast. This build makes it so you never respect any pallet. If they greed it you get a free down with a chainsaw in the back and if they throw it you just break the pallet, get your free PWYF stack, and drop chase.
Now I don't run a tracking perk as I find it unnecessary as I can generally gauge survivor location simply through experience but I understand most people will want to run BBQ, Discordance, or whatever your tracking perk preference is. If I was dropping one I'd take the Bamboozle off. Bamboozle is one of those perks that is unnecessary in most matches, but the rare time you run against those sweat squads that actually know how to loop it will feel essential. I don't mind giving up a situational perk slot on most matches to have it on the matches where I really need it.
Most people don't realize how much Bubba was buffed in his rework and they vastly underestimate how fast and how far his chainsaw goes now. You can make near 2+ times around a loop depending on the which loop it is. You can also start your sprint quite a distance away from a survivor and catch up to them before it's ended.
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@MadLordJack said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2143772#Comment_2143772
I don't think Twins are particularly good agasint decent teams. I'd be a whole lot more comfortable taking Legion or Trapper, because against good teams you may as well not use your power at all except as a little locator/camping totem.
Well typically you can down them before they get to a locker. If they don't try and loop at all and just run straight into the locker then you get a quick hook. If you leave one of them at the hook while you pressure the map then you're guaranteed to catch them away from a locker going for the save. There's just so many times they are not conveniently near a locker.
I'm not saying you're gonna win vs those good teams, just that I think they can pull out much more than I feel like you're giving them credit for.
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@MadLordJack said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2143765#Comment_2143765
I honestly go against those teams (especially lockers) a lot, somehow even more than as Oni, the other killer that tactic (lockers) destroys whose been around for a lot longer and whose counterplay should be more common.
Don't get me wrong, I understand basing a killers strength off the average trial, but the stick together/lockers teams is ever fifth or so trial for me.
I'm not saying they're strong based on average trials as I don't think that's legitimate criteria as well.
All I'm saying is that out of most the killer roster which doesn't make it into the "viable" against "good" teams category, The Twins is at least near the top of that non-viable list. Which to me at least doesn't earn them a "weak" tag since if we're gonna call them weak then that means 90% of the entire killer roster we can call weak by those standards.
They'll lose vs good survivors as most the killers would as well, but they'll do a better job than most the roster.
I guess I'm more just pointing out that they're quite underrated and better than most people think. I'd put them a very solid A tier.
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@MadLordJack said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2143759#Comment_2143759
Gone against teams that stick together and/or use lockers? Can't snowball if they literally deny you Victor.
I have. That's extremely rare though.
If you want to say she's not "strong" when we're referencing against good survivors then sure I can agree with that. However we're not talking about strong, he said she's "weak".
Even against "good" survivors The Twins is still probably in the top 15% of killers at least. So while not strong per say, still better than most the roster in comparison.
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@dadadadadada said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2143753#Comment_2143753
Yeah if she was strong people would play her but shes weak the survivor can counter her with so many thing its kinda sad.
What she need is buff instead they are nerfing her next patch i hope you are ready because i think most of the player who will play her will camp the dev nerf her just for that
I mean I'm on a 9 hour 4k win streak with her at rank 1, with most of those even being at 5 gens. She can't be that weak.
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@dadadadadada said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/245757/why-arent-the-twins-more-popular
They are weak you pass the majority of the match on viktor you have no perk you are on charlotte you have perk but no power.
1 The time it get after each hit hurt them and they will get nerf next patch this wont help at all.
2 again it take too much time for charlotte to wake up not only that after a down you still need to walk half the map this take time too and during all this the other survivor can still do gen or he can pick himself up with UB or a teamate.
3 like some people already said she strong in a camping scenario killer and survivor dont like that play style a lot
You think current Twins are weak?
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@Yords said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2143726#Comment_2143726
Excuse my oversimplification, I am tired and probably gonna get sleep in a minute. Not really thinking all that much honestly lol.
I didn't mean the POTD, I meant the spamming of the cages. Cages are powerful not only because they can prevent BT or DS, but they are incredibly efficient at saving time. Normally, you shouldn't spam cages willy nilly because the survivor on cage will get saved quickly, robbing you of pressure, and cleanse torment off of one survivor. However, a good pyramid head with this addon will consistently hit shots and have survivors tormented most of the game.
Since the counterplay to pyramid head is holding W, you would literally be running around the map, downing people with POTD, and then sending them to the opposite side of the map. This is another issue since you wouldn't ever have to use rites of judgement to inflict torment on survivors.
Tunneling or camping cages is similar to bubba basement camping with insidious though, you literally cannot do anything to save the person being sacrificed and I can definitely see this being another very unfun tactic that people do.
I'd actually near call the cages neutral on time. At face value they are "supposed" to save you time until you realize the extra time you wasted to get people Tormented in the first place basically negates what you saved. Realistically against good survivors you aren't getting that many people Tormented in a match. It's so few that you only generally end up using the cage at a time someone was just unhooked to avoid a potential DS for the most part. The cage is also giving up any hook pressure. I'm not saying the cages are bad necessarily, just simply that how good they are is generally way over exaggerated. Would it really matter if there were a lot more survivors Tormented all game? I don't think it would be that big of a deal and would actually give PH more chances to use his cages strategically rather than just here and there to avoid a DS.
"Since the counterplay to pyramid head is holding W, you would literally be running around the map, downing people with POTD, and then sending them to the opposite side of the map. This is another issue since you wouldn't ever have to use rites of judgement to inflict torment on survivors."
I think this is making it sound way easier than it is in reality. I still think you'd use rite of judgement a lot as his PotD is quite avoidable.
"Tunneling or camping cages is similar to bubba basement camping with insidious though, you literally cannot do anything to save the person being sacrificed and I can definitely see this being another very unfun tactic that people do."
I mean if they are sent to the opposite side of the entire map that's a lot of time to get a safe rescue before he could get over there. At least in this case he can't immediately camp you which is what would happen if you were on a hook and then he'd just camp you on the ground till your DS wore out.
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I personally find them quite fun and unique. So many survivors rarely see them so they just don't know their counter play very well.
I think I'm on like a 9 hour 4k win streak with them at rank 1 at the moment. Mind you probably 60% of those games are with 5 gens still up even. They're much better than people give them credit for.
That said, take this with a grain of salt. MM, rank system, and rank reset are a mess at the moment which is highly skewing kill rates artificially. I'm getting a ton of lower ranks thrown into my lobbies. Needless to say these are not true rank 1 games.
If that PTB nerf actually goes through though...they are dropping at least an entire tier not only in power but also fun. They're gonna kill the rare handful of people that actually play The Twins.
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@Yords said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2143710#Comment_2143710
Pyramid head players can memorize the locations, or just guess their general area. It is still too strong even without including the tunneling. With torment almost always being on survivors, you could spam your ability which seems weak at first since that is not what you do, but you would never have to worry about DS or BT and could easily get through hook stages incredibly fast.
I feel that's over simplifying it.
They can memorize the general spawn of the cages all they want but they're still on the opposite side of the map. If a killer wants to tunnel he's gonna tunnel, regardless of if it can prevent BT/DS or not.
Also no, I don't believe they would be spamming PotD, that's just ridiculous. That would be extremely time inefficient and just doesn't make sense to do.
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@Yords said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2143707#Comment_2143707
That would make him too strong. Imagine being tormented almost all game, it could make for some really unfun tunneling plays off of being rescued from a cage.
The cage puts you on the opposite side of the map though.
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@Yords said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2143658#Comment_2143658
I think that is too weak, or too strong if it inflicts survivors with torment when hitting them with the punishment of the dammed attack.
Well tbh PotD leaving trails and applying Torment on hit should've been in his base kit to me.
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Last Ultra Rare.
Punishment of the Damned leaves a trail of torment.
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None.
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These changes would make her complete garbage just so you know.
Honestly just up the distance she can put traps at the hook and remove the flashlights ability to remove her traps. That's it.
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Boil Over
Even the slightest nudge of a buff could take this perk from garbage to abusive. Very hard to touch.
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You don't nerf killers because they're boring. You rework them to not be boring, but still just as strong.
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They consider it scummy because it's checking their egos. It pseudo makes them feel like "I'm better than you enough that I'm confident I can down you again if you get up".
As you pointed out the hate for slugging is completely irrational. There are even a multitude of reasons why you should prefer being slugged.
Most that slugging hate stems from them not actually playing killer to any significant degree to understand why they slug. Most people that only play survivor think the killer just decides if he feels like slugging which couldn't be further from the truth. The killer typically only slugs when the survivors present the opportunity, IE playing bad.
Then they bring up how the scenario of slugging at 5 gens is bad. As we've gone over the killer didn't just randomly decide to slug at 5 gens, they played bad and handed him a slug opportunity. If the killer is actually able to pull off a 5 gen 4 man slug the survivors are completely outclassed and way worse than the killer or the survivors just played really, really bad. IE either scenario it is, it's because the survivors played worse than the killer, significantly. That scenario is never happening with survivors that are even remotely decent at the game.
Slugging is also basically required to even have a chance at winning if the group of survivors are actually good. There is literally not enough time to down and one hook each survivor one at a time and get 12 hooks.
This is a circumstance of people playing bad and being unwilling to take responsibility for it so they make excuses, or simply not playing both sides enough to understand the balance of the game.
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It's the same reason why you can't prevent yourself from playing against people you block.
You will essentially cause tons of dodging which will jack up queue times. People will start dodging just because they know it's a good player or because they play a killer they don't like. If they know that person mains a certain killer they'll bring certain perks to counter them like flashlights for hag for example.
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@NMCKE said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2138307#Comment_2138307
Then if it was balanced to where it wasn't necessary, then a good killer would be unstoppable if they did use such tactics? 🤔
Well ideally if we actually got to that point I'd assume we'd implement some feature at base to prevent them as well.
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All of them. The only ones I haven’t bought with shards are the licensed ones that you are unable to.
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@BananaBlooD95 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2139119#Comment_2139119
Old ruin was oppressive on new player as they would often miss their great skill check while experienced player wouldn't affected at all. Also it was a passive perk. Right now the killer has to apply pressure to get value out of ruin otherwise it does nothing.
I'm not referring to old Ruin. I'm referring to the previous Undying.
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@Devil_hit11 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2138307#Comment_2138307
They did balance it at one point. The survivors had this called a secondary objective and its name was Undying+Ruin. Survivors complained about it and so it got gutted.
Hopefully video showcases two very important points. The first is that deathslinger is nowhere near viable vs top-level, he has too many high pressure shot moments all of which if he misses are instant loss for him and his downs are simply too slow, just not enough reward for each shot. I've always wondered what would happen if hitting a harpoon shot would inflict 5% hindered effect instead of deep wound, Would it be more realistic for him to land every shot if his target was slightly slower to give him a chance to win. No clue really.
The other point is that game should showcases many moments for why you need drop the pallet when injured right away. There are many cases where you can shoot when a survivor drops a pallet during animation lock and hit you. Don't drop them when healthy as deathslinger can easily fire and break chain to injure you, in that sense, he's pseudo legion when your healthy. In the end, even with the chases being not as great as they could be, the survivor still triumphs which I have always said that survivors do not need to play perfectly to win. they can afford to 5-6 hooks states and still come out on top.
I suppose I'm in the minority but I thought Ruin/Undying's previous iteration was a much healthier meta as survivors actually had a secondary objective and it slowed the game to the duration it should've been at base without having to use perks. Everyone's now back to ignoring totems as they're irrelevant. As you mentioned survivors can afford to make a lot of mistakes and still win. Killer gets about 1 hard mistake and it costs him the game.
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When people imply that others are saying SWF is unbeatable that's quite a strawman. Whether they win or lose people like playing a fair game, simple as that. The game is not balanced around SWF, IE not a fair match.
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It's related to ping and desync, not really hit box. I experience this a lot on Plague as well as DS. It's quite infuriating.
That said, they aren't going to be able to realistically fix this with its actual cause. However they can fix it in a roundabout way.
Essentially do what they have on Huntresses hatchets where there's two circles of detection. One small one for detecting object collision and one larger one for survivor collision. This way they essentially bandaid fix the issue by increasing the detection radius of the vomit (the larger circles hit box size) without hindering its collision on objects (the smaller circle).
You're getting some extra collision size to compensate for the bad ping basically. Really wish they'd do this.
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She needs a lot. She's too time inefficient and her map pressure is so low.
Allow her to collect her Corrupt Fountain remotely.
Survivors fully infected/broken have the Oblivious status effect.
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@Phasmamain said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2138366#Comment_2138366
BT makes a lot of sense since having killers like Wraith or pig just being able to camp while undetectable was dumb.
Iri add ons are meant to change the killers playstyle for the worse mostly. Things like body blocker hag or tombstone Myers are good examples of iri’s imo. I’d rather they add a range requirement though
Freddy needed a small nerf to his sleep cycles and nothing more. Making it easier to stay awake would make worse Freddy’s have a bad time while better freddy’s who work around it do the same
Trickster is flawed no matter how much they change him. He’s annoying as hell to fight and is pretty much a low skill low tier huntress
The visual reworks aren’t about balance tbf it’s just visual for the most part
I think it’s because killer generally has a wider amount of viable perks because of how they have different powers
Wraith and Pig both have delays before their hits allowing for chances to save if done well. You also have DS available. How many times does this realistically happen anyway? I can't even remember the last time and I don't run BT. BT is almost always a god tier perk regardless of the situation or game and this is removing the tiny, tiny little scenario it's not. Regardless, I have less issues with it now always activating and more issues with the fact that they saw this as a priority but not it's abuse.
I disagree about Iri addons, that is not their goal. Their goal is to give a different play style, not a worse play style.
Freddy already got curb stomped by good survivors. People could easily choose to wake up before through boxes or failing a skill check but simply chose not to because they'd rather greed the gens completely. His counter play was there, just no one used it. It was a matter of "his counter play is there but I just don't want to have to do anything different and I'd rather him be countered without me changing anything", essentially. If you want to argue his skill cap is low or he's boring to face I can get behind that, but his power level was not too high.
The reworks being primarily about visuals and not balance is what's bad. Most the maps need heavy balance reworks.
Survivor actually has a much wider variety of decent perks available. The entire reason why you see less perk variety on survivor is not because they don't have more good perks, it's because they have some perks that are just completely way too strong and on an entire other level of power to where the rest the perks simply look bad by comparison. The second chance perks in this game are way out of control and in an unhealthy state.
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@Phasmamain said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2138329#Comment_2138329
How so?
Demo changes are great
Huntress changes are minimal but with iri head gone I’m happy
Freddy nerf is minor and just makes him a bit less frustrating to fight
Perk changes are great besides lucky break but I’m glad they are trying to make more meta perks
Twins change is the only weird one
Demo changes are buffs yes which is nice, but not enough and the changes actually address none of their core issues at all. It shows they fundamentally don't understand what's wrong with Demo.
Huntress Iri head nerf is good, however it was made useless. You are weaker running that addon than not using it, that's bad design. I also don't agree with some of her other addon changes.
Freddy nerf was more minor than we expected yes, however even if it was minor he didn't need a nerf in the first place.
Trickster buffs while nice, still aren't enough or address his core issues.
Twins nerf is absolutely ridiculous.
I'm glad they can be a little heavier handed on the perk buffs with Lucky Break but possibly too far, we'll see. Honestly all it needed was its timer removed and it would be Iron Will for blood.
I know you disagree but BT getting a buff is just straight up mind boggling. It was literally already an S tier meta perk before. Yeah we can say it lost a few seconds on its timer, who cares, changes near nothing. Just the principle that they thought BT needed a buff just tells me we aren't even on the same page. BT needs its abuse removed, IE body blocking for people. It's anti-tunnel for the guy on the hook, not 3rd health state for a rescuer. It needs to give the rescued person zero collision instead of the Endurance status effect. This makes it an even more powerful anti-tunnel as it protects from multi hits such as a Bubba saw while also removes the abuse side of it. It would deactivate early if they touched an objective of course like DS to prevent the other side of abuse.
The new map look gorgeous but still not balanced well. We also have multiple required to break walls again if we don't want to run infinite's.
The rest the changes in the PTB I'm generally okay with. Would have really been nice to see a balanced amount of changes to perks on both sides however rather than nothing but survivor perks and 1 meaningless killer perk.
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A few good changes but mostly bad.
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At the high end it's quite significantly survivor sided. This isn't really a debated topic. It's pretty unanimously agreed upon by all the high hour and high rank community on both sides.
Killers tend to win more at low ranks because the survivors are bad and are more heavily punished, but we don't determine "balance" based on people playing bad.
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@D3spair said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2138283#Comment_2138283
Survivors needs to accept that such tactics are normal and stop complaining that "Camping should be Bannable", "Tunneling is a problem" etc. Everyone knows that it's unfun but it's the only way to win as Killer vs Good Survivor.
I'd prefer if they balanced the game better to where it wasn't necessary.
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Everyone with good experience in the game knows that if you want to win vs good survivors you have to do some variation of camping, tunneling, or slugging. Just how the games balanced. That's part of why all the meta perks are anti-camp/tunnel/slug.
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Both played very well, but both could have done much better if they brought different perks.
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Lol.
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I mean it makes sense, the addon is completely dead once PTB hits live. You won't be seeing them anymore then.
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Playing against Spirit just weeds out the bad survivors. It's easier to blame the killer than it is to take responsibility for playing badly and learning what to do differently next time. She still has a higher skill cap than most the killer roster. She only gives the "appearance" of being easier because she's a noob stomper. She asks something more of survivors that most killers don't.
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Spirit, Blight, and Huntress would be my top 3.
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@Mandy said:
Data is used for sure, but it's not the only thing that's taken into account when changes are made.
If things other than data are used why can we not get answers as to what those other things are?
We are always told data isn't the only thing used yet never actually get answers as to what those other things are. All the recent killers nerfs we get seem to reference nothing but kill rates.
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Because you're playing a 1v4 in a game that's balanced around the 1v1.
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These days I play more Twins than anything. They're quite underrated by a lot of people.
That said, if that PTB nerf goes through they are nose diving in power level.
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Been saying this forever. When you actually look at the numbers Brutal Strength is quite bad and way overrated. Same can be said for Enduring to a lesser extent.
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DS and Hag.
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The second chance perks in the game are way out of control and need to be brought down. Zero skill, zero cost, zero downsides, all with game swinging effects.
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@Devil_hit11 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2128279#Comment_2128279
This is not how it works. when you weaken a survivor or killer perk, it does not create diversification, it just removes the perk from pool of perks that people would choose from. Take Undying+Ruin for example.
When Undying got nerfed, it didn't "shake" killer meta, it just made that perk not get used. so when you have roughly 4 choices for slowing the game down(Ruin,Pop,Sloppy,Corrupt), Undying become unconsidered
Its same for survivor perks. When Mettle of Man or for example balance landing got nerfed, the perk did not "shake" the survivor meta. It simply died out. The choice between using Dead Hard and using Balance Landing is not a question of which exhaust is better, it's other one is superior and other is pointless to run. Balance landing rarely gets used (In comparison to dead hard). Weakening MoM did not make other survivor perks get used more, It just made MoM never get used because it was over-nerfed to being complete worthless.
If you weaken all of the survivor perk or all of killer perks that are meta, you are effectively weakening that side as whole and will create a perk imbalance for one side.
At the end of the day, a perk either
A) impact play
B) has no effect on the game
so for example, new lucky break perk, its either a good perk or its not good perk. there's nothing in the middle when it comes to DBD. Its either want this effect in their build or do not want this effect in their build. Many of the perks that are bad are structurally bad. What they give is unwanted and even if this effect was tuned to be slightly bit impactful, Its not going change the meta because its simply not wanted. easy example of that is ruin vs devour hope, devour hope has a potentially strong effect, but your more likely to face Ruin than devour hope because Devour hope effect is not "wanted" as much as Ruin effect is. Instant downs are great and all, but slow down generator is more competitive strategy.
"This is not how it works. when you weaken a survivor or killer perk, it does not create diversification, it just removes the perk from pool of perks that people would choose from. Take Undying+Ruin for example."
That is how it works. Lowering certain perks brings other perks into the meta.
"If you weaken all of the survivor perk or all of killer perks that are meta, you are effectively weakening that side as whole and will create a perk imbalance for one side."
Because that side does effectively need weakening, that's part of the point. Survivors already have a perk imbalance that we're trying to correct here.
"At the end of the day, a perk either
A) impact play
B) has no effect on the game"
This is quite a superfluous statement. "perks do something or they don't" Kinda silly right?
"so for example, new lucky break perk, its either a good perk or its not good perk. there's nothing in the middle when it comes to DBD."
That's just not true. It's a sliding scale of power, not a yes or no.
"easy example of that is ruin vs devour hope, devour hope has a potentially strong effect, but your more likely to face Ruin than devour hope because Devour hope effect is not "wanted" as much as Ruin effect is."
That is not why you see Ruin instead of Devour. You see Ruin instead of Devour because the likely hood of you losing Devour before getting value out of it is very high. You'll at least get some value out of Ruin even if it is cleanses in 1 minute. People would much rather have Devours effect.