Atrushan88
Atrushan88
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They die. At least I would assume. If the RBT is activated you're not supposed to be able to leave except via the hatch.
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Camping is predominately a lower rank strat because newbies don't know that it's bad to camp and it works in low ranks because low rank survivors also don't know how to deal with camping. I feel like one thing BHVR could do to lower the amount of campers would be to simply put something about it in the tutorial to encourage them to look for other survivors after hooking one, and mentioning there's an emblem penalty for camping. They could also put something in there for survivors to tell them if the killer is camping that focusing on doing generators might be the better option.
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I also underestimate how important it is to hug walls. I also can never find pallets when I'm not near a T wall or a the cow thing, or certain recognizeable spots, and I never memorize them. I'm not great at chases, I prefer hiding.
As for faking window vaults, I think they pretty much removed that because now killers know you can't fast vault without making a huge L so you might as well not even try. I haven't seen any killers swing at windows anymore.
As killer, when someone's annoying me to no end I have face camped, and their SWF friends flock to the hook and get them off anyways. It annoys me to no end. It's usually when they're trying their hardest to lure me away from one of my hexes and then there are 3 others behind me waiting to jump on it, tbagging me at every pallet, being as optimal as possible(knowing it's a rank 1 survivor with much lower ranked friends), and then making my blood boil while I eat their DS. I also still fall for DS sometimes.
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@Locker_Monster I've never continued running while gen tapping. You can cancel the animation pretty fast, but the stop definitely happens and it takes a second to start running again.
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The question is...will this be able to be used with Self-Care? I'm sure stealthy Claudettes behind trees will want to know with this + Iron Will.
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I don't think they'd rework GhostFace, he's already in a pretty good spot imo. Would probably still play him.
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I don't see a problem with gen tapping. Gen regression can actually help quite a bit on a killer if only one person is working on that gen and everyone else is far away on another gen, and honestly, if you were to be forced to stop for longer, the survival percent(which I heard last was already well below 50%) would be even lower. I'm not sure there's a need to be nerfing survivors right now. Also, from my experience, when you do tap a gen, your character still stops and doesn't begin running immediately, and it takes a second after stopping for your run to start back up. I'd wager that it'd already slow you down to at least 1-2 seconds with just that alone.
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Self Care wouldn't even make sense as a healer role perk. It's a selfish perk, not a perk to heal others. This is not a good idea though. Killers are not limited in perks, survivors should not be either. Unless you want to limit Nurse to only antiheal perks and Doctor to tracking perks, etc.
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I disagree with this because by doing this you'd severely limit people's builds. The reason killers are going to be ranked differently is because they all play differently, have better/worse maps, playstyles, etc. This is so that someone who plays Freddy to rank 1 isn't a rank 1 Nurse despite being ######### with Nurse and playing against rank 1 survivors and depipping constantly when playing her because they're not technically rank 1 with her.
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People say OoO destroys Ghostface but I've gotten 4ks against OoO users. It's fun slugging an OoO user in a SWF and then going after their friends while keeping them slugged, because it's basically a built in deerstalker from any distance. That said, I wouldn't mind OoO to get one nerf, and that would be to only work when the killer and survivor are both looking at each other, as it's description led me to believe this was the case originally.
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Suiciding and DCing is actually very different. It takes a long ass time to be sacrificed. If the killer knows where the hatch is it's pretty much a free 4k. That's why people DC. If they'd open the hatch the moment someone gets sacrificed, people wouldn't DC for hatches.
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@DaS_only That's an alright idea. Personally I don't think that NEEDS to be added but surely the people complaining about DS wouldn't mind then.
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@Jimsalabim I mean the entire series is pretty childish. It's about kids and none of it is really horror. It has some gory/gross moments and some jump scares but that's literally it. It's a drama.
@Okapi I did watch Nightmare on Elm Street, and it's not straight up comedy. It's VERY MUCH horror first, and it does way more than just jump scares and gore. In fact most old horror movies didn't even do much gore. They had blood, but that was about it. Also Freddy isn't really THAT much of a joker. He likes to make witty comments but he's far more of a pervert than a joker. Also in case you didn't know, this Freddy is based on wannabe Freddy who wasn't really either in terms of his acting, despite what his character was portrayed as. The movies didn't get straight up ridiculously non-horror until Freddy vs Jason, and I don't count that movie. If you want to talk about someone who's a joker, you should have talked about Chucky. Then again, the first movie, again, was nothing like that.
@Mikeadatrix As for Evil Dead, I haven't watched it. Ash is a survivor however, not a killer, which if the Evil Dead series has no horror in it, at least only has a survivor who is not meant to be a horror icon, and even then, all horror movies do have non-horror scenes, however if there is not more horror than there is comedy or drama, and while there can be both drama/comedy and horror, there has to be an abundance of horror for it to be considered horror. Stranger Things does not have horror. It has emotional heartfelt scenes tied to it's deaths, and a few jumpscares. The only death that was remotely shown as a horror scene was Barb, and it lasted a few seconds. Bob wasn't shown as a horror scene, but an emotional heartwrenching scene. It didn't invoke fear, it invoked sadness. If I could watch it as a child without closing my eyes or hiding behind a couch, it's not horror, and I could most definitely do that with Stranger Things. I have friends who even watch Stranger Things with their kids and they don't feel an ounce of fear. And as you said for Ash, his lore indicates he wasn't intended to be there.
I don't hate Stranger Things, I just know it doesn't fit with this game. Outfits would be welcome, but I'd prefer to not have it be a chapter when there are other iconic characters who still need to be added that actually do fit in the realm of horror.
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No one confirmed it is a chapter. This show isn't horror related. It's a drama with some things taken from horror genres(jumpscares/gross things). I'm personally hoping it's just cosmetics. That'd allow people to have their Stranger Things hype without making the game more childish. I mean come on they sang the Neverending Story in the last season for Christ sakes, that's not horror.
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@Raven014 Not abandoned, repurposed. Mori would be something the killer could do after 2 hooks and a down. New offering would be to give the survivors/killers a new way to play the game while also granting the killer a pretty big advantage without ending the game abruptly and survivors barely getting points.
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@Raven014 Did you even read my idea? It feels like you barely read any of it with the arguments you're coming up with... Though thank you for reminding me of addons. Perhaps they should be disabled with these new offerings. I'm not sure...
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Not everyone will riot. A lot of people realize that Stranger Things is not really horror. It's more drama than anything and it doesn't really fit with Dead By Daylight at all. Liking the show and realizing it doesn't fit in with DBD's horror thematic are two different things. Yeah, Stranger Things has jump scares and gore, but that doesn't make it horror. Give me Chucky(Forgot I have to say OG Chucky, since there's a wannabe Chucky out now), Jason, Pinhead, or Candyman, not Stranger Things.
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@Raven014 Well, 10 Jigsaw Boxes on The Game map with the Pig chasing you wouldn't be so easy. Remember, the killer no longer has to gen patrol with these offerings. They only have to look for survivors in those situations(In fact I may need to rethink the amount of boxes and maybe even keep them the normal quantity). It's still a strong offering, it removes gens from play and gives the survivors another requirement for survival, and could even change those conditions to be an every man for himself style of play(For example, the Trapper with 4 hatches and 4 keys. After the hatch is used it could disappear). Also if you don't use moris that way, it doesn't mean that most others don't. It's not that your group is being lumped in with others. It's that your group is so small it's practically nonexistent against others who use an ebony. Also, if you use an ebony on the last hook, this change would be absolutely nothing to you, since you'd already be doing that, and the new offering would be a bonus.
@Karl_Childers Again, killers will likely only use moris for dailies, except maybe the first few days after this change and for a cool animation every now and then(assuming it happened). I wouldn't consider it massive unless all killers specifically ONLY morid their victims, but they get less points for moris, and since you're practically already dead anyways, what would be the point other than visual effects? Also, in case you didn't know, you can force the killer to pick you up via lockers. I don't see this being as massive a nerf as you think it is.
@Damarus Yeah, you would only be able to mori the person who's on their last hook stage. And again, I highly doubt killers who 2 hooked a person would mori them on third hook. If they caught that person twice, it's likely they couldn't do much against a third hook. The killer would know this as well, and that would mean more points if they decided NOT to mori them and instead bring them to a hook. In a SWF it'd be possible they might try to do something against the killer to keep that person alive, but it probably wouldn't do much good unless the gates were powered. and if he knew it was an SWF that'd mean they're super altruistic and he could just keep slugging them, luring the others out and no one would be on gens.
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I made a solution to ebonies, or moris in general if you want to have a look and leave some suggestions/add to it.
@Atrushan88 said:
I have a new offering in mind to replace Moris, that would be new and fun for both killers and survivors imo. A lot of survivors are wanting a secondary objective, so I figured, why not make an offering that allowed the killer to force survivors to play THEIR game, rather than the Entity's? This would give them a new secondary(well actually primary since gens wouldn't be in this new offering at all) objective as well as allow the killers to have a unique offering that isn't something that makes them basically win. Basically, Moris should go in their base kit after 2 hooks+1 down. They can choose to mori the survivor or hook them.
Also, the new offering: Killer's Wish
The killer is given permission by the entity to force survivors to survive their own hand crafted trial. Each killer has their own original trial that survivors must overcome to survive. The offering always chooses one of the killer's specific maps.
The Trapper: There are four keys to four hatches hidden around the map placed inside bear traps. You have to disable the bear trap to get the key by succeeding several difficult skill checks. If you fail a skill check, you are immediately trapped in the bear trap. All traps are pre-set(meaning the Trapper does not have to set them up, unless he wants to move them around) and the Trapper cannot move the traps with keys(this is just my idea, there could be other objectives I suppose).
The Pig: Every survivor starts with an active RBT on their head and must play Amanda's game to escape. There are 10 jigsaw boxes, one has the key to their specific RBT. Placing an RBT on a survivor's head if they manage to escape one will activate the RBT immediately again. RBTs have an extended timer to make up for the extra jigsaw boxes.
I just thought of these two in general, if anyone wants to add any more killer trials, or has any other suggestions or something, feel free to chime in.
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@Damarus You're already pretty much dead if you're on your death hook, so I see no reason why mori being base kit for the killer would be a problem. They would normally just hook you most likely anyways since it's more points, unless they wanted to see the animation, or they had a daily for it. There might be the very rare event they think you have DS and they're close to the exit gates. The offering about the killer specific trials was the "fun for both sides" thing. Moris being on death hook doesn't seem overpowered at all imo though.
@AzdrubaelVect Not sure I agree with end game being the trigger. I think it'd be fine if on death hook you could be killed by hand. The killer already pretty much won in that scenario anyways, outside of specific situations that are extremely rare(since if you were on death hook and downed you pretty much already were dead).
@Raptorrotas Basically the killer can kill any survivor by hand once they're on death hook and downed. They don't HAVE to, as they'll get more points by hooking you, but they're given the option. As for the Trapper idea, the hatches are closed(meaning you have to find them with your eyes). You're given a key to the hatch if you do them, and the keys are not anything you can find by aura reading, and there are traps all across the map, some with and some without keys. With 4 keys on traps on somewhere like the Macmillan Estate with Trapper not having to set traps, or patrol generators, I think it'll be fine, but I could be wrong. If you have any other ideas feel free to add them. It's hard for me to think of all the killer specific trials honestly. I just think that would be a better offering than a Mori that would favor the killer while also not make it where they're downright winning no matter what and every survivor would have a chance to get points even if they did lose.
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I made a post about a secondary(or new primary) objective with a balance change to Moris. If you want to look at it.
@Atrushan88 said:
I have a new offering in mind to replace Moris, that would be new and fun for both killers and survivors imo. A lot of survivors are wanting a secondary objective, so I figured, why not make an offering that allowed the killer to force survivors to play THEIR game, rather than the Entity's? This would give them a new secondary(well actually primary since gens wouldn't be in this new offering at all) objective as well as allow the killers to have a unique offering that isn't something that makes them basically win. Basically, Moris should go in their base kit after 2 hooks+1 down. They can choose to mori the survivor or hook them.
Also, the new offering: Killer's Wish
The killer is given permission by the entity to force survivors to survive their own hand crafted trial. Each killer has their own original trial that survivors must overcome to survive. The offering always chooses one of the killer's specific maps.
The Trapper: There are four keys to four hatches hidden around the map placed inside bear traps. You have to disable the bear trap to get the key by succeeding several difficult skill checks. If you fail a skill check, you are immediately trapped in the bear trap. All traps are pre-set(meaning the Trapper does not have to set them up, unless he wants to move them around) and the Trapper cannot move the traps with keys(this is just my idea, there could be other objectives I suppose).
The Pig: Every survivor starts with an active RBT on their head and must play Amanda's game to escape. There are 10 jigsaw boxes, one has the key to their specific RBT. Placing an RBT on a survivor's head if they manage to escape one will activate the RBT immediately again. RBTs have an extended timer to make up for the extra jigsaw boxes.
I just thought of these two in general, if anyone wants to add any more killer trials, or has any other suggestions or something, feel free to chime in.
the idea is basically to make moris something the killer has the option to do after 2 hooks and a down, but they obviously still get more points for hooks. Then remove all the mori offerings with a replacement that would be a fun new objective.
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@Raven014 Arriving at the same time is pretty much wrong 95% wrong in my experience. When I play survivor I appear in a lobby at the same time as all other players almost EVERY time, but I'm not in a SWF. When I notice survivors with the same cosmetics, it depends. If there are 3 default outfits, most likely they're just leveling those characters and playing the same as I do, leveling the character they play as, etc. Namewise etc, sure. Either way, this new offering to replace moris would do a fine job of dealing with SWF in general anyways, as they'd be having to deal with ther own things that SWF really wouldn't be a part of in helping, other than unhooking/healing. You can't help someone with dismantling traps, taking off RBTs, etc. For example, with the Pig's trial, having 4 RBTs on your head(and activated) at the start basically means you're on a timer. You can't do all that SWF stuff while you have an active RBT.
It'd be more engaging for both sides without the whole "K I'm gonna hook you, wait for you to be unhooked, and then come back and kill you instantly, meaning you barely get to play" style of gameplay.
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@Marcus Except that's not the survivor that existed causing this effect. The locker existing negated BBQ. If the survivor existing negated BBQ, they'd be able to do a gen as normal while it went off. This is a more comparable scenario. As for people going in stealth not to specifically negate alert, maybe not, but maybe they will. Why? Because it takes literally no time to go into stealth to kick a gen. As I said, you can practically do in one animation.
@LordGlint It has far more use in the gen kicking scenario. You can know all those other things with more useful solo perks like Bond and Empathy imo.
@avilmask Aura reading affects Wraith about as much as it affects Trapper. As for the others, how does aura reading make Myers or Ghostface's stalking, or Pig's RBTs harder? Also how does it ROB them of their stealth? They show up for 5 seconds max outside of OoO, which again, is a double edged sword.
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@My_Farewell It would negate 4 flashlight saves which likely would not have happened anyways due to you being hooked 2 times prior, and it also wouldn't negate DS since if you've been hooked twice, the killer likely already knows you have DS and would have slugged you. The chances are slim that you would have survived anyways if you had been hooked twice and downed a third time. Also, I doubt killers would go for moris quite as often because they get less points. It may see a bit of play early on but later on they'd likely see less and probably only come up when a killer has a daily.
@Raven014 You don't 100% know if someone's in a SWF most of the time. Ebony Moris are overpowered, the fact that you need to use them to demolish SWF is proof of that, and needs to be changed imo.
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@avilmask Every stealth killer outside of Wraith has something besides stealth(and he at least gets a speed boost when coming out). 0 TR is generally a bonus ability. And being seen by the killer is a drawback. It comes quite in handy for the killer when you can see them from any distance. Heck, if they have OoO you can even slug them and use it as a form of deerstalker.
But again, my point: This is gonna be like healing. People are gonna stop running them and go back to another top tier perk to take their place. No point running a perk that will barely do you any good. And then you guys are gonna complain because they're doing that, when all of their mediocre options keep getting nerfed.
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@Orion there are 3 other survivors not likely running aura reading(and if they're running OoO you can tell). Are you saying your stealth is immediately broken because ONE survivor out of 4 knows where you are? Also, again, as I've said. If they can see you, you can see them. OoO is a perk that has as much negative impact on the survivor as it does the killer. It's a double edged sword. If they can see you on the other side of a wall, you can also see them. If killers can automatically negate a perk's effects just for existing, survivors should have similar treatment. This is like BBQ or Nurse's Calling not finding immersed Claudettes.
@LordGlint Generally when I use Alert most is when they kick gens. They come to my gen, I hide, they kick the gen, and I can see which direction they're going so that I can go in the way they won't see me. Why would I need alert when they're breaking pallets outside of knowing they're in a chase?
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@LordGlint Except since Pigs and other "stealth" killers will know this, they will obviously use said abilities to counter those perks. Gonna kick a gen? Crouch then kick it. It doesn't take that long to crouch and you can pretty much crouch and kick the gen almost at the same time, and OoO will STILL be useless against any of these killers because it will be giving your location away for free while their location is hidden from you. Who would want a perk that would give your location away without giving you anything in return?
Oh and GhostFace will counter Alert pretty much 100% of the time unless he's hit someone or been knocked out of stealth. And usually in those situations he's in a chase anyways.
The perks already aren't amazing perks. They're somewhat useful, but not top tier perks or anything. This will push them down and people will pretty much run all the top tier perks all the time unless they're going with off meta builds(which probably still won't include aura reading).
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@avilmask A killer's power isn't countered with a single perk. OoO has the same effect for the killer as it does the OoO user, and there are 3 others who you can go after if you're Ghost Face or Pig. When your terror radius is reduced to 0, that means you can see them from ANYWHERE as well(meaning you don't have to actually look for them once you get in range). Alert only shows you if the killer kicks something, or breaks something, and those are the only two DECENT aura reading perks a survivor has.
I also never said that OoO couldn't be changed(I personally believe it should only work when both the killer and survivor are looking at each other, as that's what I originally thought it did due to it's description), but the fact that all aura reading is rendered useless against these killers will just make survivors run more perks that benefit them directly rather than aura reading, and you guys are gonna hate that.
Compare this change to removing BBQ's effect any time you want just for existing, or Nurse's, or anything else.
@LordGlint that was my thought exactly as well and I definitely disagree this should be the case.
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@Marcus those aren't against specific survivors. I meant for example, a perk that doesn't work against Jake Park or David King. The perks you are mentioned are counter play, not things out of your control(I mean they are out of your control but they are also affected by that by having to play differently to counter those perks). None of them actually help survivors and hurt you. Outside of maybe Discordance if none of them have Prove Thyself.
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@Bravo0413 16. That means 1 in 4 and 2 of those are mid/high tier and used pretty much whenever Spirit/Nurse/Billy/Hag aren't. Why would I run any aura reading perk with a chance to make the killer see me without me seeing them too? That is a literal perk that will HELP the killer and HURT the survivor in those situations. GF is in stealth whenever he can be. It happens quite often and GF is never running up on survivors while his terror radius is out unless by accident. There used to be only 2 killers with this power and even then I was disappointed I brought Alert when I couldn't tell where they were. Name a killer perk that can just not work against a survivor. There isn't one unless it's a hex and it has to be dismantled by a survivor. Think about it. Survivors stopped healing when they nerfed self care. Now that they're nerfing aura reading they won't use that either. Aura reading was already not great for survivors. Now it can be straight up detrimental.
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@Bravo0413 there'd be no point to the test because no one would bring aura reading. If they add it, they add it, but I'm telling you that you guys are gonna start getting mad when you start seeing all the meta perks EVERY game instead of every other game because another group of not even meta survivor perks are getting nerfs.
Next they'll nerf Quick and Quiet and Dance With Me. Then another viable but not meta build will go out the window and we'll see an even larger amount complaining about DS and Adrenaline because no one's running surprise off meta loadouts anymore.
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Exposed actually does make sense. Other games use that as a form of "armor pierce". However I did at first think it meant it was aura reading because I was thinking of the other meaning of exposed. Vulnerable doesn't really translate well either honestly though. If you were new you'd be like "Vulnerable to what?. Exposed definitely sounds better as well. Broken honestly sounds the best but that's already a status effect. If it were me I would change Broken to Cursed and Exposed to Broken. It'd make a little more sense with Plague as well being cursed over being broken.
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Dear SWF survivors. I would like to tell you that I am just as important as your friend and when you let me get in stage 2 while all 3 of you are on one gen when you could have been spread out doing separate gens much faster, you're going to have one less survivor on gens or running the killer around very shortly. Also stop bringing your brown rank friends in matches with you, a red or purple ranked survivor. I'm tired of being matched with brown rank players who have that one red or purple ranked friend while the brown ranks do practically nothing but heal each other and do gens on the other side of the map while I go into struggle phase constantly on first hook, and sometimes die on one hook.
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@Bravo0413 K, so imagine GhostFace, Pig, Wraith, Spirit(assuming all 4 have this status effect) are the killer. Now OoO is a detriment to your entire team with no upside. because they know where you are, but you don't know where they are.
If it works against Spine Chill, now survivors will no longer be able to know Ghost Face is looking and if a GhostFace is hiding, it's a guaranteed chase cut in half. It doesn't take long to stalk while leaning. It's actually detrimental to even try breaking him out when he is leaning. This would make him so much stronger, again, if it works against Spine Chill, which it may not as it isn't "aura reading". Either way, there are several killers whose red stain is hidden, and are undetectable outside of aura reading or seeing them with your own eyes, and GhostFace for one is hard to spot quite often. Why would I run an aura reading perk when at LEAST 3(probably 4 since Spirit would probably have this exact status effect while phase walking as well) above decent killers have this potential to render your perks useless? If for example, I had DS/Adrenaline/Balanced Landing and Alert or something, I would potentially have a useless perk. Might as well go ahead and run Iron Will or Borrowed Time. Most aura reading for survivors are ######### The only good ones I can think of are Alert and OoO. With OoO having the potential to basically be detrimental to your survival, Alert would be the only good one and why bring a perk with potential uselessness over something more powerful? This is just weakening already bad perks.
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@immortalls96 again, I don't care about keys but they are nothing like a mori. Not even close, and no one hardly ever uses BNP. Also, there was even a picture showing 3 ebonies connected by a bloody party streamers on these very forums a month or two ago. I don't even use keys. Their situation requires either you to do your entire objective, or most or your objective. It's underwhelming. You can feel cheated if someone manages to do 3 or 4 gens and you kill everyone but one, but that's drastically different than having a snowball from the beginning of the game. Keys are a safety net in case you start losing, but a mori is a bazooka that helps you win from the start. Entirely different concepts. As for BNP, people often call BNP useless. But anyways, if you truly believe keys are as strong as a mori, you and 3 teammates bring a red key vs a killer with an ebony and tell me how they're so similar. Manage a 4 man escape through the hatch in that situation 5 times out of 10 at least. That would prove your point that keys are just as overpowered as moris.
Also I am not a main of anything. I play both pretty equally depending on who I am leveling(I play who I intend to use my BP on). I've suggested things for both killer and survivor, and it's a little ridiculous to me that you're saying only survivor mains want moris nerfed when I have seen many killers also want them nerfed and even TAG is a Pig main and he agreed right in this very thread disproving you. The only ones who don't want moris nerfed are the ones who want to use them for either easy games, just to be dicks, or for revenge. I think that enough explains that moris are overpowered. Just because something is overpowered and needs a nerf on one side does not mean something else needs nerfed on the other, and again, for a key to have a similar escape as an ebony gives kills, you would need to do 5 gens. That's your entire objective as a survivor. Moris make things easier, keys just give an alternate escape option after you've already done what you needed to do, and nerfing or removing keys would make that achievement more difficult/impossible to obtain and they can't change ps4 trophies. I have rarely ever seen anyone complain about keys as there are also multiple ways to deal with them. Moris actually don't have a counter.
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@oxygen That's actually not bad either, because some places have ######### window spots and the Game map has almost no windows, but then there are lots of flat areas with windows all over the place.
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So basically survivors are going to stop using aura perks, of which, they already rarely used, and more perks that give them another extreme benefit. Man you guys are gonna be so pissed soon.
My thoughts: Why remove the ability of perks? This literally will just make people ignore aura reading perks altogether. Ghostface already has buggy revealing, and he's quite good. I love playing him, don't have much problems with using him, etc. This will just make him god tier if Spine Chill also doesn't work on him. Are survivors going to get more perks where the killer can't use aura reading? These changes remove stealth gameplay from survivors as well, as they won't know when to hide.
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This perk idea is terrible. "K I just hit a survivor so now I'm basically cloaked Wraith with the ability to attack and can down them even faster". This doesn't punish no heal meta, it buffs the killer for getting a hit, when he already gets a big advantage from the one hit.
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@DoomOrb I've heard specifically that the slows DO stack, unless that changed. Also what LawrenceGordon was saying was that if you trap every entrance, you know when they enter the area of that specific gen. I assume they do this to a close to complete gen.
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@immortalls96 Except you completely ignore Decisive Strike with a mori, so camping just outside the hook is encouraged and the second "hook state" isn't really something that's accomplished by normal means. That's why I say it removes 2. It completely ignores a hook, because you bypass the carrying to the hook(eliminating the occasional escape from the killer's grasp while carrying you). Normally you would either be slugged or picked up, with a chance of escape, but once downed, you're done for. Key modifications aren't that powerful and you can't use a key multiple times unless you have an addon that allows you to use it again after opening the hatch, or dying with it, and those aren't super common either. Also they can't be modified if they are gotten from a chest, and upon using one, it's destroyed, so I'm not sure how they can be farmed in abundance unless you escape without going through the hatch. A key is in no way more powerful than a mori, as again, it requires you to do MUCH MORE of your objective as a survivor than a mori does, and their conditions are completely different, as I said. A key requires you as a survivor to do your entire objective if you want 4 to escape. An ebony mori on the other hand requires you to do 1/4th your objective for a 4k(12 hooks normally, 4 hooks and 4 downs with an ebony). Again, the only comparable thing to a mori would be if survivors had an offering that allowed 4 people to escape via the hatch after one generator, or one and a quarter generators, two at most if you want to count downing them.
Moris also are not as rare as people say. I've gotten several just leveling characters from 1-40, and some people have had 3 on the same bloodweb right next together(and they were ebonies). Also the rate they are used also backs up my statement. Even while in yellow ranks I saw ebonies commonly on killers who were not fully leveled.
They are too powerful, not fun to play against(proven by how you constantly see people DC against them), and unfair(there is no survivor alternative, as I said, keys are completely different). They should only be made as visual effects and nothing more, unless a survivor offering is made in the same vein(and really I'd rather not go that route). TAG's idea is probably a really good implementation of how moris should work.
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@immortalls96 Um...how is a key similar of benefit to a mori? A purple or red key both require all 5 gens to be done for all 4 to escape. A red mori pretty much automatically gives the killer a win and depips for everybody, and a green mori greatly enhances a killer's chances to win. For a key, you still need to do every objective, unless people die, in which case you still need to do as many gens -1 for every death. Survivors are rewarded for using keys because they still did their entire objective.
This is why I said before you think moris are balanced, to imagine an offering where survivors only had to do one gen, and the hatch spawned, because as of right now the hatch only spawns when all 5 gens are done, unless the killer is winning. The key doesn't automatically give survivors an advantage. It gives them a chance of escape when things are going badly.
A mori automatically puts the game in the killer's advantage regardless of the situation, and no, moris are not rare. I've seen several, even going so far as multiple in a row. In a normal game, a killer with an ebony mori will automatically have 8 hook states removed, if he kills everyone, which is very likely if he slugs the next to last survivor, and a killer will automatically be trying to use that mori ASAP, meaning ignoring everyone else except the person who was just unhooked.
Survivors with a key need: 5 generators, and 3 other people to listen to them when looking for the hatch for a 4 escape. These are not the same mechanics, and I would argue a key is NOTHING like a mori. That said, how else would one use the hatch if keys were removed? How would one get the 4 people escape through the hatch achievement? And the EGC isn't a guaranteed kill for survivors, and if they have a key it's likely one of the only ways to get out if the killer got a 3k and closed the hatch because of how the doors are positioned. I'm not against the removal of keys(although I can't imagine how it would work with that achievement, and honestly keys don't seem that powerful to me), but I find them pretty lackluster as a killer with Franklin's can remove the key from the survivor, and again, they still need to do 5 gens unless people die.
@Rydog Pretty sure you still get them, just not as many because you're not hooking them as much as you normally would need to.
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I mentioned this myself and got no response from the devs, even though a lot of people mentioned having similar issues.
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As killer, I don't really have a preference outside of hating the swamp.
As survivor Lery's is my favorite map. It feels the most fair. You get the middle gen done and your chances of a win are increased pretty well. Getting that gen isn't always easy though. When the exit gates are opened they are always on opposite ends of the map, so if you got screwed by crappy teammates you actually have a chance to get out. Of course a Doctor or Scratched Mirror Myers or Nurse can be pretty difficult but I'd rather that than most other things on other maps.
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@TAG Honestly that's a pretty unique and nice idea.
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I think a big problem is they don't WANT balance. The community doesn't seem to want that either, honestly. When you propose an idea that becomes more fair for both sides, you generally get one side or the other coming at you angrily. The devs probably don't care about balance because if they were to actually make the game balanced, one side or the other would go crazy. People use the cheapest tactics they can to get under your skin and make the game unfun as well, so it's really hard to enjoy sometimes when you have a string of games with a camping killer, or a red rank with 3 brown ranks while you're in green or purple ranks. And let's be honest, a lot of things(mainly addons and certain offerings) would have to go for the game to be balanced.
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It's not possible to get a hit when you teleport straight to a trap and sometimes they're usually to a pallet by the time you get close enough to hit them. Hag is already a 110% killer, I see no reason to slow her down more when she's already about surprise hits. She's one of the only actually scary killers in the game as well due to being all about jumpscares(unless with certain addons). There'd be no point in being scared of her if you're at a loop by the time she spawns.
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David is my main, technically, although while leveling up a character I tend to play them after I get them some decent perks to start off with, even if they're not fully tier 3. Right now I'm leveling Laurie so I'm playing her. Dwight would be my second main survivor.
As for killers, Ghostface pretty much. I haven't played much killer since ranked reset though. Hag used to be my main until Ghostface came out though. Freddy and Pig are alright too. I would play Spirit as well if I had her. The only DLCs I have are Halloween, Nightmare on Elm Street, and Saw. I'd play Myers but I haven't leveled him up much yet. I really wanna try a build on Myers, but I don't have a Fragrant Tuft of Hair or Judith's Journal. The build is Fragrant Tuft of Hair+Judith's Journal + Furtive Chase. Basically increase my stalking by a bunch to counteract Fragrant Tuft of Hair and get EW3 a lot faster than normal by stalking my obsession, which can change any time my obsession is unhooked.
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@Crazewtboy It's not even me on the hook usually. It's someone else, but they keep throwing themselves at the hook like their lives depend on it instead of doing gens, then I get one gen done, maybe 2, and everyone's dead and he has BBQ obviously so unless I'm near a locker, I'm screwed too.
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@Crazewtboy I didn't see Trapper very much at all. I see Myers occasionally across all ranks, same with Legion, and Spirit, and Huntress. My most seen killers are probably Legion, Ghostface, Pig, Myers, and now in high green low purple I'm seeing a lot of camping Leatherfaces, and my teammates tend to not do gens. Fun games ><
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@Mikeadatrix It's far more like drama. 90% of it is drama, 5% of it makes me want to throw up(like those big blobs of crap moving, I was eating and that made me physically ill), and the other 5% is action with a slice of jumpscares. People die, but not in horrific ways, outside of maybe Barb(who you don't even see die) and Joyce's boyfriend who is eaten alive and even his death scene was shown more as a somber moment than a scary one. I guess you could call it horror by today's standards, since very few movies actually are good horror movies anymore. And they keep rebooting stuff and completely scrapping the original stories(Chucky isn't even human, there's no voodoo, and the entire point of his vendetta is gone, for example. What the hell is the point of remaking Child's Play if there's no Damballa chant?).