Alcuin
Alcuin
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@Stabby_Widdershins said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3307331#Comment_3307331
You can't really ban people for violating the 'spirit of the rule' because that line will be different for everyone screaming for bans because they assume the Killer's intent was to make them angry.
It doesn't have to be about bans but it can lead to an increasingly toxic gameplay environment. Griefing/bullying can be obvious, though, and it was in this case. I mentioned to another forum member watching a streamer player in a 4-man SWF on Badham and using Head On against the Killer at the two-story house/garage. That's bullying and I understand that it can be both sides.
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@Batusalen said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3307322#Comment_3307322
Why else would you play a competitive multiplayer game? To compete and try to win, simple as that. Again, you are doing a false correlation between two games that has nothing to do with each other in any way.
And I don't know what you understand by "meta" and griefing, but using perks that aren't the ones that allow to play the most efficient and competitive way possible (hence, the most used perks) or just having a synergy that can be frustrating to play against are either of those things. And dude, TTS is an hex, you can literally turn it off.
There are multiple METAs against Solos. That's what I'm saying regarding the perks used. In this case, a specific load out built around Knockout and Third Seals against Solos is a META. Especially with Wraith. Watch Pro Vengeance on Youtube if you don't believe it; he goes on 50-game win streaks with nearly all the M1 Killers in this game. His builds are very specific, maybe niche, and always strong. As far as totems being able to be cleansed, the map was Pale Rose and it has pretty well-hidden totems at times.
As far as competition, it takes fair play, sportsmanship, and competitive balance. For both you and the opponent. It's not fun when these things are not taken seriously.
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@Mandy said:
Can say for certain, nobody is going to be banned for any perks that they use!
Deerstalker, sloppy, third seal and knock-out, that's a build for a specific playstyle, and a legit one at that! Yes it might very well be stronger against solo survivors, it's also a good slowdown for SWF - as it gets players off gens to get up their team mates.
Players are free to choose what perks they wish and to play the style of game that they wish to play as long as it's within the game rules and this is not something that will be bannable not now or in the future.
It might not violate the letter of the law, but the spirit of it? In addition to the perks, the Killer had no intention of picking us up and was anonymous in the process.
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@Batusalen said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3307120#Comment_3307120
The complain don't exist there for the simple reason of Fortnite not being an asymmetrical game, meaning all players have the sames tools to win and objectives to complete, and you have literally a mode where every player is a solo. Not only that, but you are comparing DbD to a game that doesn't even have perk loadouts (to be fair technically now it has, but they are randomly given through the match and the impact of those "perks" are not comparable to the ones in DbD). So, I don't get what point you are trying to make, much less taking in count the context behind my answer to you.
Either way, you are not only complaining about an specific no-meta perk loadout that I have yet to see in game, but claiming that anybody that uses it should be ban without even give reasons of why it is such a problem. No, just no.
The comment was about multiplayer games and I gave an example where bullying/griefing is not possible and to succeed takes skill alone. Sportsmanship and skill in a nutshell. Why else would you play a multiplayer game? You can grief and bully in DBD, though. That's the problem. And it doesn't even take skill.
As far as META vs solo queue, there are a lot of ways to skin that cat. Knockout and Third Seal is a META build against Solos if you want to win and grief in the process.
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@Batusalen said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3307082#Comment_3307082
I think you just gave yourself the solution to your problem.
I play Fortnite as well and the complaint I have here doesn't exist there. It doesn't have anything equivalent to bully squads or slugging against Solos (with the benefit/crutch of perks) because skill can still allow you a way out and the only way to overwhelm an opponent is with said skill. DBD is not like that. Perks and depending on whether or not Survivors are on comms makes the difference.
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@VikingDragonXii said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3307089#Comment_3307089
So let's use your "logic" here.....Then Survivors should be banned too for using Head-On to bully the Killer or all bully Squads and players who make the Killer into their plaything should be banned as well......
You just want to punish players for playing the game just because the Killer had a build you didn't like isn't proof that they were deliberately playing to ruin YOUR "fun"
I've seen streamers play SWF and use the garage/2-story house at Badham to head-on the Killer. If the behavior continues in the match I think it says something. The same thing with the Wraith I went against. He was slugging and griefing. You shouldn't be able deliberately ruin the experience of others in the game. Both examples do that.
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@[Deleted User] said:
I'm guessing by your replies to everyone you're just frustrated and just wanted to vent. No, I don't agree using a perk combo should be ban worth. Though you do state "I can count on two hands how many times I've gone against this build." SO at least you'll probably not see it again anytime soon.
It's not venting.
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@Stabby_Widdershins said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3307089#Comment_3307089
So now you're assuming the Killer's intention, and claiming they should be banned if whatever you assume about them is bad? 😂
All your OP said was that he used [x] perks, and that that is worthy of a ban. Because apparently you being angry means they should not be allowed to play?
Again, Have fun with that. Don't be surprised when no one gets banned for making you angry.
I give people more credit for their actions than you; that's all the difference is. It's not about perks.
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@VikingDragonXii said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3307078#Comment_3307078
He was anonymous mode because probably was a streamer and didn't want to get stream bombed by sore losers. BHVR did that mode for a reason.
Really Sloppy isn't that bad of a perk...and Deer Stalker....really your complaining about that perk?
lol
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@Stabby_Widdershins said:
You think using perks you don't like is 'worthy of a ban'?
Have fun with that.
Playing the game as if the other side is your mule is worthy of a ban. It's not about perks, it's about intention.
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@RaSavage42 said:
Well... take it for what it is
BTW... So Eruption, Overcharge and Call Of Brine is bad for solo
And now Knockout and TTS...
It seems that Killers are not supposed to even try (wait.... can't even do that)
So what are Killers supposed to do???
I'm not dumb. He was playing Wraith to get an easy first hit. He also had Deerstalker and Sloppy (everything for me, nothing for you). It's not hard to play Killer like this, especially against Solos.
To add, he was anonymous (no characters in his name). There's a reason for it.
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The Killer equivalent is camping the hooked Survivor during endgame. Killer also sees the auras of the exit gates. That's enough opportunity for one kill like hatch is enough opportunity for one escape.
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@[Deleted User] said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3303056#Comment_3303056
Sorry to hear about your bad experience. That's my #1 criticism with matchmaking. And it's kind of industry-wide right now. So many devs have gone to this constant engagement model of matchmaking that almost completely disregards match quality. They'd rather have someone be stomped and embarrassed than have two people wait in queue for 3 minutes. It's not a good long-term strategy for game health IMO.
It was just something I wasn't ready for. I've played a handful of matches over the last few weeks and my first match back is against a streamer with more than a thousand viewers at the time. He's really good, though, and plays creatively.
As far as the queue times, I too would rather wait a few minutes for a evenly-matched trial than just have fast lobbies. I play Fortnite, too, and they added bots to find quick matches but it's not the same game anymore.
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@[Deleted User] said:
I feel you. The game is in a really bad spot right now. This is the least amount of time I've played as of late in the past 4 years. Awful meta and awful matchmaking.
About the matchmaking, I've been watching Hens today while prepping for Christmas. I decided to play a match of Survivor because it's insanely cold in the kitchen. Got destroyed by the Killer. Turns out it was Hens and the chat was making note of how poorly I played. In my defense, I am Ash III Survivor right now and my controller has really bad drift which gets worse with the cold.
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You've been burned out on DBD for years but you've never played Huntress until this past week and your only Survivor that gets BP is Leon?
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I've never played as him so I can't say much about that but he talks trash throughout the match. That might be part of the reason.
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@trapped_by_daylight said:
I’ll start with a few:
Iron Maiden on Huntress and Trickster (every blue moon I play him): It’s in all of my builds and after playing a huntress match without and seeing how slow the animation is, I refuse to take it off.
Hex: Blood Favor on Plague: I usually try to get a survivor fully infected at the start of the match, so it’s always fun for them to see them get broken, rush to a pallet and freak out when they realize what’s going on. I use Blood Favor on a lot of m1 killers but I get the most value on Plague.
Hex: Plaything on Bubba and Pig: Jumpscare Bubba is always so much fun, and I always run it in a build for him. I barely use Pig’s crouch because it’s so easy to avoid and makes you slower, so I run Plaything to waste more of the survivor’s time on top of the RBT’s + maybe scare some people along the way. On both I sometimes use Thrill of the Hunt to make cleansing Plaything take even longer.
Zanshin Tactics on Spirit. It helps me devise a path in phase. I don't think Spirit has ever been as easy to play as people say.
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@MrMori said:
I run it every match, I like it a lot. Something really cool is that with the unhook speed, you can actually unhook a player and then DH if the killer tried to trade. I've gotten some awesome saves and gotten out myself thanks to that.
Also free BP.
I've just started running it. First match, I was able to unhook a Feng against a STBFL Wraith; I died in the process but Feng escaped. Next match, I unhooked an Ace with We'll Make It, too, about 20-30 meters away from the Doctor in chase with a Nea. I tried getting Ace away from the hook, but he wanted to be healed on the spot. It was a super fast heal.
The map-wide Bond also keeps you in the match if you're on death hook. You know when it's safe to stay in the trial and you don't have to be waiting at the exit gate doing nothing. It's a nice perk.
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The perk can work against you if you're relying on the aura reading of the Killer. If the Killer is still within the bubble, he/she might be coming your way while you wait to see if the aura appears. The bubble gives them stealth even when your perk is supposed to counter that. They're getting the jump on you while you are waiting for your perk to function. There are plenty of Killers with anti-loop and mobility that they don't need their aura obscured by the bubble notification. There's more than enough already working against Solo Survivors.
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@Seraphor said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3292036#Comment_3292036
Kindred has always done that as far as I can remember.
The problem now is that Kindred doesn't show the killers aura at all.
That is the new bug this topic is about.
You used to be able to see the Killer aura within the bubble. Now, the bubble obscures the aura.
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@Seraphor said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3291799#Comment_3291799
That's not a bug with Kindred, that's just how bubbles obscure all auras.
When Hawkins was still around, there was a bug with Bitter Murmur where the bubble blocked the auras of Survivors upon the completion of a gen. The perk became and felt worthless for a short period of time but was quickly fixed. This "this perk is worthless" feeling is the same with present Kindred, but it's been around since April or May. Kindred is THEE Solo Survivor perk and for it to be not how it should be is not good. It needs to show the Killer's aura within 0-16 meters of the hook.
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@Crowman said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3291977#Comment_3291977
There's no perk in the game that prevents camping and tunneling. Perks at their very best make those tactics a bit less rewarding, but they don't prevent the killer from doing so.
Reassurance, OTR, and DS existing don't make tunneling and camping invalid mechanics. They are just tools to deal with valid mechanics that devs are aware about. The perks wouldn't exist if the devs didn't allow killers to camp and tunnel survivors. They would simply make camping and tunneling impossible.
Camping and tunneling shows down the game. The Wraith that sits at the hook is not clever, he just wants it easy and is making the game unfun. More than perks are needed. Make it so Killers have to throw the game in order to tunnel and camp. 3 Mettle of Mans or 90 sec. Borrowed Time. Camping and Tunneling is boring at this point. Make the counter just as boring.
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@jesterkind said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3291876#Comment_3291876
I'm not talking about consideration of the other side, though?
I'm talking about consideration of your side. The survivors. Your three teammates who you just put in a much worse position by putting them in a 3v1 super early in the match. That is why you shouldn't ragequit whenever you see a killer tunnelling, because there are three other players who aren't being annoying to you that you are putting at a huge disadvantage by leaving.
It's not a "ragequit" if Blight is coming after you after being unhooked with Compound 33 and ignoring the unhooker. It's broken. I know it. Blight knows it. The chat of the Blight I was going against knows it. I am able to realize that "This is BS" in the moment. It's a cumulation/convergence of imbalanced things. If I can recognize it in the heat of the moment, it's really, really broken. Nowhere near a "ragequit".
It's sending a message. They get it or they don't. You want an easy match, I will make it easier than you want it. That's all you can do a solo in DBD.
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@Crowman said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3291873#Comment_3291873
Everyone should finish out the match regardless of the role you are playing. People queue up to play a game and the least you can do is respect other's people time and play the game from start to finish.
DBD is a game that can be rigged. I know when I'm going against a SWF and when I'm going against Solos. If you want to rig the game against Solos, I'll make it easy for you.
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@jesterkind said:
It doesn't really matter what the killer's doing, DCing screws over your teammates. As you say, there are five people in a match, not just you and the killer.
Anti-tunnel could stand to be stronger, and Blight could stand to be weaker. Those statements are true at the same time that you DCing was a scummy move can be true, because you are not the only survivor in the trial.
Certain killers want a 4K and as easy as possible. If you want to tunnel, I will make it even easier. The streamer was talking about how he won every match over the course of five hours. Solo Survivors do not escape every trial over a 5-hour period. Who's not taking into consideration the experience of the other side?
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@Crowman said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3291853#Comment_3291853
The killer isn't an NPC either. In fact, you are upset that the killer isn't an NPC programmed to not tunnel.
It's Solo Survivor that has to "finish out the match" under all circumstances, not Killer. I play both. I can ruin the fun of the other four as Killer but I have no control over the match as a Solo Survivor.
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@Volcz said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3291744#Comment_3291744
..This is odd coming from the person who left a match b/c of how a killer played. Lacking self awareness, I suppose.
Now you D/c'd and left your teammates in an even worse situation than before just b/c of the way a killer played. If you play like that in mind, play a story-driven game or a single player game.
& yes its totally a ragequit when this is your reason. You can't handle or control their gameplay so you resort to a little temper tantrum by D/cing. Just play it out, there are plenty of matches that start out rocky but turn around as the match goes on. For both sides.
I added the information about Blight's strength and the strength of Compound 33 to make clear that it's not some emotional thing. I DC'd to send a message. His chat got it. The Killer said he doesn't play by the "Rulebook" anymore.
I'm a person, not an NPC. Tunneling says you're an NPC.
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@Crowman said:
D/cing because you were getting tunneled by the killer isn't making the message you think it's making.
Frankly, you just need to accept killers are not bound to play in a way you want them to.
There are five people playing the match. If you play without that in mind, play a story-driven game or a single player game.
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It's been like that since May, or even April. The forums say it's a bug but it's been 7-8 months. It seems like it's by design. When the suggestion comes up about how to buff Solo Survivor, Kindred without showing the Killer's aura always comes up. We already have that.
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@Aaronseuk said:
What is it with people playing so terribly with this new (I think awful designed killer) killer!?
I have NEVER seen so much camping or tunnelling in this game, it’s pathetic.
and continuously dropping guardians around hook is really not in the spirit of the game.
PLEASE, if you play knight as killer, play with some integrity. It’s making my friends and I not want to play anymore.
They might be trying to figure out how his Guards path/work if they're using the power around the hook. That's what I did when playing him and still let the Survivors go at the end. Whenever I used his power at a loop, the Survivor is gone and I can't figure out the direction they went because the new map looks like an endgame collapse and it's disorienting going back to the Knight's POV after placing down a Guard.
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Scroll wheel is extremely broken on her.
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@foodie said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3261930#Comment_3261930
You can do this with any button, not specifically the scroll wheel.
There is also no way of you knowing what the hag you faced was using as their teleportation bind unless you can see the hag screen, which you can't and regardless, any key will guarantee quick teleports. I repeat any key bind.
Just because a hag is able to teleport quickly doesn't mean they're using the scroll wheel, which you think is OP, but no one else does. Even if they are using the scroll wheel, it's allowed.
If you're not happy about how your controller works or your console, it doesn't mean the entire community of PC players or the killer- Hag has to be nerfed. Her power is neither OP nor uncounterable. In fact, she is the killer with the most counters to their power.
If you want to change something on your end, you can add a mouse and keyboard to your console. There are loads of resources about that, so do your research. This is pretty much a you problem.
And I think you received enough replies on the situation and more than enough tips on how to face hag or how to find information about that, so perhaps learn how to face the killer instead of begging for its demise.
What people do, not what people say. You are using scroll wheel in your Hag video.
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@StibbityStabbity said:
So, how would you fix it?
Deny PC the ability to rebind keys? Set some keys as not bindable? Some people use the mousewheel for other binds because they don't want to slam on their spacebar. Put a timer on how fast Hag can react to something, which would artificially limit their response time?
I want to know how you intend to fix this issue without outright nerfing PC players or Hag specifically. Or, I guess you could just nerf Hag for being available for PC. Any nerf to Hag would effect them on console as well, though.
I don't know how to fix it but I do have experience playing pvp games where one side has free sh*t on their side. That's what scroll wheel Hag is.
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@foodie said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3261222#Comment_3261222
This is an issue with any game that goes from being PC available to cross-platform. There are always issues that the console players have. The devs can do their best to accommodate, but at the end of the day, it is a PC game and no change will ever be enough unless it's overpoweringly easy for one side.
Not to mention that you can connect a keyboard and mouse to your console, so I guess that would be the solution
As far as I know, mkb is not available on console. Even if it were, there would be significant input lag.You wouldn't get the free hit that scroll wheel Hags get.
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@Starrseed said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3261162#Comment_3261162
Well then we should stop supporting dbd on either PC or console cause they have vastly different inputs and i also heard Player complain that its unfair that it's easier to play hunter or nurse or Trickster on pc
I've played against Nurses and ranged Killers that I thought were mkb but were on controller or console. There is no such confusion when it involves a Hag player using scroll wheel. Nothing is as fluid and responsive as that.
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@Grigerbest said:
You can still avoid a hit against a scroll wheel. If you can't do it on controller, I see that only as a personal problem.
If you know where the traps are:
- Avoid them.
- Crouch.
- In a chase, avoid this loop.
If you don't know where the traps and you can't instantly go on a opposite direction... Nothing to do but get hit.
I'm not talking about playing against her on controller, I'm talking about playing her on controller versus playing her on mkb. She gets hits on mkb that controller players cannot get. That should not exist in a game with different inputs. When you do not have scroll wheel, you know when you go against it. It's that good.
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@HugTheHag said:
Hag has a billion counters, to the point where without being imbalanced or bad, she's so tedious to learn to play optimally that few bother to.
Fast teleport is fine.
I'm talking about scroll wheel. Only a portion of the player base has access to it and not all of them use it. It changes how she plays. That should not exist. You cannot counter a Hag using scroll wheel.
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@Bot_Salvo88 said:
If I could find more than 5 hags a year I would be shocked.
Not a lot of people play Hag, that's true. It doesn't matter, though. They shouldn't be able to play the game with a massive advantage compared to the rest of the player base not having access to/not using scroll wheel. This is not the only game I've played where scroll wheel changes the actual gameplay/nature of the game. You go up against enough and in different contexts, it becomes a joke how anti-fair it is.
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@Laluzi said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3246268#Comment_3246268
"It takes skill, so it doesn't matter that it doesn't have any counterplay" is the same tired rhetoric Nurses have used to justify her broken state since time immemorial. Unless you agree with that, try another argument.
And honestly, knowing the exact sweet spot to hit while jumping out of a locker isn't nearly as skilled as you're claiming it is. It's about as skilled as plugging numbers into an equation. You memorize how to do it and then it's rote. There's no variance. You start from the same spot every time.
It doesn't matter that it was rare and only used by bullies - if anything, that's more of a reason to remove it because it doesn't affect normal survivors, does it? It was still ######### gameplay that needed to go, same as Boil Over RPD Library or Boxblocker Pig. Removing these things improves the game even if you dislike that it wasn't a fix for a separate issue you cared about more.
I don't think this nerf has to do with getting rid of things without counterplay, I think it has to do with giving in to Killer demands/(less charitable) complaints. Maybe making it "more fun" if "fun" means greater likelihood of 4king.
There is a roadmap for changes to the game and Solo Survivor has to wait. Solo Survivor is the only gamemode that really needs changes/help, though. SWF wasn't affected much at all or not at all by the 6.1 update. Solo was massively affected, though. It was a direct Killer buff. Subsequent patches have been follow-up Killer buffs while Solo Survivor is on the 2023 roadmap. Solo should be the priority.
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@mischiefmanaged said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3246233#Comment_3246233
Maybe I'm just skeptical, but did you watch the video posted in the first post of the thread?
The skill seems to just be "know the locker flashlight timing consistently". Where was the coordination? When he chased one person, that person ran into a locker. If he switched to go for the person holding the flashlight, they got into a different locker.
If he forced them both into lockers and tried to pull one out, the survivor in the other locker had time to exit the locker and position themselves for the save.
What advanced coordination was needed that could only be done with all 4 team members and only in a highly skilled tournament level SWF?
What exactly was the counter play for the killer player? What could he have done differently beyond just never chase any survivor jumping into a locker near the main building.
I watched the video.
As far as the skill, it's timing the flashlight correctly and aiming it correctly. Survivor flashlight saves (locker or otherwise) take more skill than Huntress hatchets; I play on PS4, one is way more hard than the other. Flashlight saves are probably the most skillful thing a Survivor can do and they're being nerfed in different ways. At least, no more complaints about the skill it takes to play Survivor because skill is being taken out of it.
The coordination is that one goes in the locker and the other goes for the save based on the Killer's actions. They're a SWF; SWFs are coordinated. I'll use my experience again. If you go for flashlight saves as a Solo, you're probably throwing the match. There are better ways to enhance your likelihood of survival than following the Killer chasing the teammate
As far as counterplay, there isn't any as longer as the SWF is skillful with their saves. But this video does not depict the average match. Most Survivors are not saving each other in lockers and very, very rarely to Killers load into a match where Survivors are doing that. Get rid of the bubble that blocks the Killer's aura when running Kindred and nerf Eruption; that's the balance the game needs because Solo Survivor needs actual buffs. Not Killer, not SWF.
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@mischiefmanaged said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3246209#Comment_3246209
In the video posted it was two people. And on what level were they highly coordinated?
You have to be skilled and coordinated to pull off a locker save. Kindred no longer shows the Killer's aura as long as the bubble that appears upon hooking a Survivor persists. That is a balance problem, not locker saves.
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To pull this off you have to be part of a skillful and highly-coordinated SWF with the intent to trull/bully. That's the not experience of the vast majority of Survivors and only a small fraction of Killers face such a team and only a small fraction of the time. Eruption should have been nerfed instead. That affects the majority of the Survivor playerbase, which are Solo Survivors.
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Can you make your prestige levels private because how are players with several thousand hours playing with non-prestiged characters?
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@Omans said:
Thanks for the tips everyone already knows.
Thanks to your wonderful thread, the secret to Nurse's counterplay (that no one except you and other nurse mains who defend her on these forums knew about, despite Nurse being on the killer roster for 6 years now) has been discovered.
People will now realize they were wrong. It was not Nurse's broken mechanics that were bothering them, but the fact that after years and years of playing at high MMR, they just never learned to play against her.
I'm sure she will drop quite far in the tier lists thanks to this thread. She's probably below Clown now, even. And it's all thanks to you, player who probably hasn't even faced a good nurse.
Someone hasn't learned how to break line of sight.
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@almofan1001 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3238233#Comment_3238233
Plenty of highly skilled players make Nurse's life harder. And why would I take you as an example? I won't use some random from forums as a sample size LMFAO. My post is made based on playing as and against Nurse and watching a lot of other players play her.
Hilarious try at defusing my points though, lol!
Hey, tell me whether sweaty Nurses should be able to run Starstruck against solo queue. lol. Solo is already bad enough, but you still go against one-shot Nurses.
Nurse gets one hook and, as long as one player is out in the open, Nurse procs Starstruck, downs the Survivor in the open, and the game is over. Second counterplay. Hey, PC Nurses have a much more forgiving lunge than console Nurses. lol. There is your second example of "Nurse counterplay".
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@almofan1001 said:
The popular conception amongst the community is that Nurse has "no counterplay". It's as if picking Nurse is guaranteed 4K and a win (already disproven by statistics both at the top MMR and all MMRs)
It's also humorous considering Nurse has quite a lot of counterplay tools, but Survivor players are lazy, refuse to adapt and give up without even trying. You can't just brainlessly run 3 times around Killer Shack, drop a God Pallet and give your team free 2 gens. Nah ah, this killer has different gameplay elements to it, so you also have to play unconventionally.
Here is the list of things you can do:
- Line of Sight break - easily done on most maps, force Nurse to guess which is always a disadvantage for Nurse.
- Judging Nurse Blink Distance - estimate how long the Nurse has been holding her blink to judge what distance she can cover, perform juke
- Indoor maps - self-explanatory
- Dead Hard - not very hard to use against Nurse, 3rd health state
- Use objects as your advantage - it's not the easiest thing for a Nurse to blink past objects, so use it to make it harder for her to get a good blink
- Be unpredictable with your pathing - if you use conventional pathing, that's on you - you're making it easy for the Nurse to perform good blinks
- Hold W (against non-range addons) - this destroys Nurse a lot, if she makes a mistake and you hold W, she at least has to blink 3-4 times to catch up to you. Doesn't work as well against Range addons.
- Use Stealth - should be a brainer, but somehow this is never emphasized. Nurse won't check every corner when she patrols gens and if she doesn't see you - you're likely safe. If you know she is coming, hide. You have more chance to survive than trying to "loop her"
There are more tricks you can do, but the point here is that there are many small things that you can do to make Nurse's life harder. It's not even hard, you just have to learn and get better.
Learn to adapt to the game - you cannot loop her like an M1 killer but that doesn't mean you cannot waste her time at all. She doesn't have "no counterplay", you're just making excuses because you refuse to adapt to a different killer playstyle. Bubba face camping is no counterplay, Nurse is not.
And no, "good Nurse will still destroy you" is not an argument. She will be very strong, but you can still force her to take 50/50s which any Nurse (good or bad) will despise. The 50/50s can even become 70/30s in your favour if you read the player right and be unpredictable.
And well, if you got destroyed by a good Nurse, you better give her +REP considering most of the community sucks at her and she's not a problem in the game (compared to things like SWF).
I think Nurse could be a fun Killer to go against -- not in her present state --, but "break line of sight" is always the first piece of advice as far as a counter. Don't let her run Starstruck, there's a counter.
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What's "mayonated" mean? Is it a slur against Whites?
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@cheryl_enjoyer said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3237885#Comment_3237885
Definitely more than that for me. I survive about 1 in 10 games solo, I die in 1 in 10 when I play with ONE of my friends. Not a 4 man, but one friend.
The 6.1 update definitely affected Solos more than SWF. Consistently, you can play well and still be part of 6 consecutive unwinnable matches. That was never the case playing Solo prior to the update. I doubt the "each subsequent member of a SWF adds a 3-5% greater likelihood of survival as compared to Solo" number after the update.
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I agree that he has too many things going for him. That's the case for all the new Killers and they all have high kill rates. Wesker has mobility, one-shot, built-in slowdown, etc. Sadako has stealth, teleportation, skips hook states. Artist has anti-loop, camping, omniscience, and mini-fridge hitboxes. The same thing has been happening with Killer perks. Original Pain Resonance was a combination of BBQ and Pop without having to have the gamesense of what gen to kick and having to travel there. Other new slowdown perks that take gens from 90% to 30% in no time at all also come with auras, notification, or whatever to provide knowledge. It's not the Survivors' 16 perks vs. the Killer's four; it's more like the Survivors' 13 versus the Killers nine or ten because, on the Killer side, there's also add-ons (and other perks) to negate Survivor perks. Killers have all these three-in-one resources (perks and powers).
There was some good and a vision with the META shake-up in trying to nerf the strength of certain perks and strategies, but combine the basekit buffs with perks like STBFL and Pain Res and it's no wonder kill rates are so high. It's like a shooter pvp game where shotguns no longer can one-shot but smgs have been buffed and only one side has access to them. At this point, the only thing in favor of Survivors is the majority of the maps.
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@dugman said:
I'm not convinced the baseline 45 second self pick up will be an issue. Unbreakable itself might need to have its 100% bonus turned down but otherwise for most games that 45 seconds isn't going to change much one way or another.
I didn't know the proposed change was 45 seconds; it doesn't sound like enough. Infectious Fright might activate after downing a Survivor so you go after the one that screams just to get a hit on them and, by the time you get back, the downed Survivor is already up. It should be a minute, at least.