I don't like the idea of dead by daylight
-Cut insults to kick-start discussion.-
Dead By Daylight should be made much harder, no more aim dressing, no more second chance perks, you want to survive? Work together or die alone. Do you want to kill them all? Train your aim, learn set-ups, and speak up if the power role doesn't feel powerful.
The Killer Power role is a joke, with exceptions. If facing a killer by yourself is not daunting. something is wrong. In a proper asymmetrical game, the power role should be powerful, you should be wary of being near, knowing that getting seen a bad, and getting caught dangerous. It isn't, not to myself or any other truly experienced survivors.
I mean, I run Mettle of Mither, and can still escape without a Survive With Friend squad. That should tell you something is up.
Edit January 12, 2020: I've realized that, Dead by Daylight is not meant to be a challenging game, at least not on the survivor side. The killer side is a whole different can of worms, beyond frustrating unless you play specific killers, Nurse is the only killer the feels like you are the killer, something to be avoided and feared. Very high skill-celling.
Huntress and Deathsligner feel good too, having a range feels good. Huntress more so IMO.
Regardless, the devs should remove match-made ranking altogether, as with how casually balanced this game is, true match-making will never work. Unless.
Anyone, this discussion has given me some kind of answer, not one I wanted, but I asked. I'll leave this thing going, and may bump it, but I'm no longer going to justify my feelings on the survivor gameplay in Dead By Daylight.
Comments
I legit wanted to have a discussion with you. The out-of-no where personal attacks threw me off and so I don't really want to continue to bicker. Maybe I did misunderstand you, but either way I don't appreciate being attacked and for that I'm just going to end this discussion after this.
I appreciate the apology. The only reason I stated my last comment is because of the way you jumped into diverting the overall debate to just aiming at me for my profile picture and accusing me a riding BHVR's rooster (didn't want to risk getting flagged for using the other word). Also, I would never insult someone and call them a "baby killer", don't know where you got that from probably likely from me telling a Killer to try a different side or to get better OR my topic about "helping a baby killer (myself) with builds" in which case it wasn't used as an insult. That term is used negatively so I can see why you think I was being insulting. Either way, I hope you get better and improve.
Take care.
Thank you <3 D;
You're the honestly the best person ever v_v
To improve the Survivor expierence for new players, they have to "balance" it around potato level (which is okay, cause DBD is supposed to be a casual game IMO). Problem is, that it makes the top tier genrusher groups of Survivors even more powerful. On the other hand, as a killer, I feel like I face "bad" or mediocre survivor teams way more often, than a few months/years ago. So it makes playing killer feel easier, but kinda blurrs the statistics, cause a coordinated Survivor team would probably still steamroll me.
Oh ok
Everyone has been saying to give survivors a secondary objective. People don't realize that having a secondary objective contributes to the game's fun since holding M1 on a gen is simply boring. I agree that increasing gen speed isn't the way to balance the game since it would just make the game boring. Then, everyone just started using ruin undying, which gives survivors an optional secondary objective that, when completed, increases your chance of surviving. But no, guess survivors like to simply hold M1 on a gen for an entire game and escape without doing much.
Not necessarily. Let's create an imaginary situation. Let's say that gens now take 3x longer to be completed but there are much more good mindgameable loops on the maps. Every survivor would have to learn how to loop effectively, since relying on only one teammate wouldn't be viable and also wasting the killer time would be essential so the other survivors can do gens. In this hypothetical world, once per game every survivor would be required to at least be chased by the killer once. Doing gens doesn't require any skill at all, and in this situation, what would be the requirement to escape would be looping which means that you are changing the required skill of the survivor role to be focused on something that actually require skills.
Just to be clear, I am not saying to gens to take 3x longer. This is simply an example to argue that is possible to make survivors rely more on skill without nerfing the overall role.
Kindred new open handed after care bond empathy alert all the perks that can help you work with your team
If only there wasn't a select set of perks that didn't stand out so much compared to every thing else
Not to mention rank is really gonna mean nothing now it's your reward for how long you can sit on a gen or how much bs your willing to put up with
Round and round we go. Same bellyaching that has been going on for years. Take a cue from Cote and go play something else if you mad.
Being a dismissive jerk doesn't make my points less valid.
Believe it or not but I used the kindred+OH combo and I've been left until struggle for more than once
This. Killer mains don't play solo q and it shows.
Uh... Survivor IS hard for someone like me.
I only play killer because the few times I try to play survivor I am just too jumpy to do ANYTHING properly.
All I'm good for is distracting the killer until I finally die.
That's the bad thing about the post that started all this - they grouped every kind of survivor together but I've had PLENTY of fun games where I use an ebony Mori to keep track of hook progress; and I let everyone go if it's a fair and fun game.
But if you troll me I'll just Uno Reverse Card your butt.
You're just not there yet, believe me, play enough and you can solo carry your survivor teammates, both in gen progress and in killer distraction.
As someone who plays both sides at red ranks i will say that both sides can be easy or challenging. However the reason why many killers feel their feed back is falling in deaf ears its because it is. For the past few months every single forum post was about nerfing spirit or undying because finding totems is too challenging and when you tell them about their options they say thats not counterplay. Theres even people saying to nerf BBQ which is imo the most balanced perk in the game. Its only been nerfs for killers the few patches and "buffs" that some killers got are laughable and completely useless in higher ranked games. While survivor perks get buffed not the best perks but still more buffed. The clown rework? Dumbest power ive seen since playing this game. You have people admitting that they "frequently" play together meaning with swf and comms of course you're gonna have an easier time playing survivor right? The thing about solo survivor is its always gonna be stressful same as killer but the more you play the easier it gets. Killers will always adapt its only survivors who want something forcefully changed than adapt to it in my opinion.
There aren't 4x more survivors than killers. There are 4x more players playing survivor at any given time than they are playing killer. Big difference.
You are so quick to blame survivors as the reason why Developers are making the game "Survivor-sided" (which isn't even true, and this is objectively demonstrable) but if you want to see who's the most vocal on these forums it's the killers. This forum is a haven for killers complaining left and right about everything. Just looking at the front page right now you can see the topics.
Why chase status lost in moment when you chasing survivor
“To make sure Tea-bagging still feels satisfying to our players”
I just don't care anymore at this point.
"We don't actively seek to tear down perks just because they are used a lot"
They've won.
That's taken from the front page right now. Not even half of it. Nothing but endless killer complaints. The most vocal people telling BHVR what to do are the killers by far. At least on this forum.
No, he is correct. If you make survivor harder killer does become easier. That is how it works.
Also your hypothetical situation actually exists right now in the sense that survivors do need looping skills to win. While it's certainly possible to get carried by one amazing teammate in this game, odds are that doesn't happen unless you're in a solid SWF. Survivor teams where 3 of the people can't loop lose pretty fast. And that's a lot more common than you seem to think. Right now, a survivor will get into a chase at least once with the killer in most games. It's exceedingly rare that one person carries the entire game for the other three survivors.
Making gens 3x longer doesn't change that.
Further, right now the game is going in the opposite direction you are proposing. The game used to have more leeway for survivors to win with stronger maps that are easier for them to win in. It's slowly been modified to the balance we have today where safe palettes are exceedingly scarce, god windows no longer exist and basically it's much fairer to the killer now compared to how it used to be. BHVR chose to rework the maps and adjust balance difficulty and make other things take longer instead of adjusting gen times. They are absolutely never going to adjust gen times.
Be honest, you don't want to play a challenging asymmetrical horror game the requires strategy, thinking and skill to win.
You want a cheap power fantasy, where you get to beat the good guys.
You want to be the villain, without the effort.
You want to win, without a chance to lose.
You want to bully the puny humans because you don't have the strength of character to fight the real ones.
You are so scared of failure, that should something challenge to take away the tools you use to cheaply steal victory, you scream about it.
You are not the main character, you are not the only person playing, you are not entitled to win, no one else is either.
Dead By Daylight should be made much harder, no more instadowns, no more easy ways of locating survivors, you want to get kills? Work smart or don’t kill. Do you want them all to survive? Train your stealth, learn how to loop, and speak up if the survivor role doesn't feel like it’s possible to survive.
The survivor role is a joke, with exceptions. If facing 4 survivors is not a challenge something is wrong. In a proper asymmetrical game, the survivor role should have a chance of surviving, you should be wary of wasting time, knowing that survivors could be doing gens and getting run about is dangerous. It isn't, not to myself or any other truly experienced killers.
I mean, I run no perks or add ons, and can still get 4 kills against these solo queue pests. That should tell you something is up.
"You want to win, without a chance to lose" Dosent that invalidate what you JUST said that the killer role should be a power role (which you can have your own opinion about) and that you should "ask the devs for a killer buff"
In my defense, that last one's about as big of a mockery of inordinately upset killers as I could put to words.
well it's simple when evryone quit cau'z of queue time, since the survivor queue time exploded i got only potatoes half of my match, killer or survivor alike
Which DbD you are playing? Playing survivor in a optimal SWF takes literally no skill. The only thing you have to do is hold M1 on a gen and hide whenever your friend with OoO says to do so, I know perfectly how it works. It is baffling the quantity of bad survivors who get to red ranks carried by SWF groups. I have already seen survivors who don't even try to loop and simply run in a straight line reaching rank 1 by simply being carried by friends. Survivor is completely braindead role in SWF and may also be in solo queue if you just play to escape. Making survivor harder doesn't necessarily mean to nerf survivor, but just guarantee that survivors would have to have a little bit of skill to get the escape.
I wanna feel like prey lol. I like feeling weak and scared its why I usually run stealth builds. Its also why I don't want killers like xenomorph or space stuff in cause I want an actual horror game. Bottom line is a lot of people share my opinion sorry we play the game I guess lol.
Sure killers easier when compared to the days the entity wouldn't block windows. When their were far more pallets in the maps. Before bloodlust. Before DS and DH were introduced. I dont think you have a complete understanding of the game if you think playing killer at the top % is easy. I suggest hitting rank 1 with killer for a couple months and tell me its ez mode because it absolutely is not. It is far more complex and difficult than survivor so, dont pretend like it isnt. I prefer killer because it is the more difficult role and I enjoy it. I'm typically a rank 1 both sides and I can tell you without a doubt survivor is chill af compared to killer even solo I dont have much problem. I dont always escape but I will loop a killer for days, get altruism, and hit gens and still pip. It's not hard.
I'm right there with you, survivor is way too easy to play. With multiple safety nets even before perk combos and yet we still have survivors complaining it's too hard. Well I think it's supposed to be hard, it should be hard, hell it needs to be a lot harder.
How could you possibly know how many totems were done?
I write down how many totems I've done. But I also make note of totems that were done not by me. I can see other survivor working on totems or the remains of totems that I didn't do. And make note of it.
It's really not that hard if ur mission is to get rid of totems first. If I'm playing w competent players, I clear totems in the first 2-3 mins of the game.
What sucks are Nancy's who use inner strength. They have no totems to work with.
If anything, I'll go back and watch my game to see if I missed anything as I record my games. I have over a 1000 videos.
Sounds like a survivor talking about most killers.
The killer Power role isn't a joke. You are.
A very needed comment on this discussion, lots of thought put into it.
Killers are not supposed to be the power role. Because being the power role means you control the match and can win by default because you control it.
The game is way too ez for killers and it is already almost unbearable to play survivor anymore. I can't imagine being new to the game and trying to play it. The idea that killer should never lose and survivors should always be defenseless should end.
Nice to see that this post is still relevant. This is a good little essay.
the power role is meant to be an obstacle the REQUIREs the combined effort of the other team to beat, not a pushover that can be deemed on very easily
For an example of what a killer should be, see juggernaut in CoD, the tank for l4d2 PVP, and the hunters from deathguarden (after they were buffed.)
Imagine trying to power 5 generators if the killer was as powerful as the tank from L4D. That would be impossible. I think you are forgetting that in order to win, the killer has to be stalled long enough for the others to do gens. If he is able to always instantly down, then there is no way to get the objective done. Killers are too overpowered as it is because if you'll watch any random match, the majority of survivors never last a chase longer than a few seconds because of various reasons.
If the devs ever decide to make survivor more skillfully, it would show how truly skilled all those who only play survivor really are.
I think I got the point of OP. Survivors using everything that helps them win. Survivors that claim dbd is easy win. You always can make it harder. Play without communication. Play perkless. Or play with no mither only.
When you don't use overpowered things you may see that victory is harder. And even rank will seem like reflection of skill.
Same goes with killers.
Too bad that your idea of how the game should be is different to what the devs think the game should be. Don't get me wrong, your idea might be cool, it's just not Dead by Daylight. It's a different game altogether. You should probably look for one that suits your tastes.
Edit because I just realized lol: I feel that the one who does not like the idea of DBD is actually you. I don't think that the idea of DBD is what you described on your post. Lore-wise? Maybe. Gameplay-wise? It's just not it.
You know what? That's fair.
*Killers beats Survivor*
*Survivor complains about tunneling, slugging, camping, etc...anything the Killer did right to accomplish their primary goal (to kill), despite the Survivor failing their primary goal (stay hidden, win the chase)*
*Survivor states "I shouldn't HAVE to run DS to enjoy this game" because realistically what they want is to be able to run any desired perk/add-on loadout, and never have to worry about whatever Killer they're facing or the perks they're running, or the strategies they employ being able to beat their own*
*Cue the biggest eye roll anyone's seen as they drench the forums with their salty tears*
I don't think you comprehend how much of an easily jumpy person I am.
I get scared as killer when I simply find a survivor out of nowhere.
But it's fine now anyway, my Xbox died. :(
He’s not wrong. Killer IS the easiest it’s ever been.
Bud, how many games have you lost where a survivor immediately dced? I’d venture to guess zero. If it’s more than zero... Yikes. This killer is the power role. You can’t 1v1 the killer. You WILL be caught and hooked. It’s unavoidable if the killer is actually skilled at the game. In most cases if the game is made into a 3v1 before the third gen has popped the killer has won.
Dude killers need to be spoon fed easy 4ks or they think they went up against a 4man swf. DbD killers are the woooorst, generally. Some exceptions. But most just don't want to get better at the game. They just wanna M1 and BBQ to the next survivor.
"Dude survivors need to be fed essay 4escapes or they think they went up against a sweaty no-lifer. DbD survivors are the woooorst, generally. Some exceptions. But most just don't want to get better at the game. They just wanna M1 gens, DS after not being chased for 50 seconds, and bully the killer."
Hey! Look at that. A salty killer main with a sense of humour. 😂 How rare.
Hey! Look at that. A salty survivor main with a sense of humour. 😂 How rare.