Nerf pop but not DS or UB, aight fam.
Why would you even think to do this? Like stop the "oh it's not final and it's just a sneak peek towards the mid chapter", no.
Why would you even think of nerfing pop without thinking of nerfing DS or UB.
It's pretty stupid to call the devs survivor biased, but when they do stuff like this it's hard to call them not.
This needs to be balanced out from both sides, pyramid is getting nerfed, his lose lose scenarios is what made him good, we'll have to see how he turns out though. Other survivor perks are getting buffed (thankfully none of them look busted) and now pop is getting nerfed with nothing to the survivor meta being nerfed along side it.
Pop is still going to be pretty good and usable, but just why did they need to nerf it in the first place? AND why not nerf DS UB in the mean time if we're touching meta perks?
Comments
Survivor perks are in the game for a reason and some of the good ones That allow someone to actually be able to PLAY the game exist as a one time use. If you think they need to be nerfed that would destroy survivors entirely. They need better perks!
Pop can be used 10 times maybe 11
Ds only once and you only have two changes to use it
Pop: a perk that cuts 25% off a gen
DS: a 1-time use perk that can only be used after being unhooked and then it is gone
these are not the same, stop baiting for the OPPRESSED, VAUNTED KILLER MAINS, nobody should have issues with risk being added to the game
You misspelt 60 seconds of immunity.
Anyway, it should be even, why is pop getting nerfed before DS UB? They're both meta. Just because they can't be compared doesn't mean DS doesn't deserve a nerf (which it absolutely does).
Just got tunneled off hook by a wraith. A change to make it solely anti tunnel is a nerf. You are removing the anti momentum feature.
That's what we want, we want the anti momentum part of it gone but the anti tunnel to stay.
The anti momentum is pretty BS.
Its immunity if you hit the get downed and picked up in that time and hit the skill check AND have UB to go with it, its not complete immunity without it
If something being meta means it should be nerfed, lets nerf BBQ, Nurses, Iron Will, Corrupt, hell why not nerf Self Care since the devs say its used alot
Stop with the whataboutism, 1 thing being nerfed does not mean something else has to be nerfed as well
You are missing my point by miles.
DS UB deserves a nerf because it's too powerful, NOT because it's meta. I never said we need to nerf meta perks.
And also, when the devs nerf a perk that isn't even a problem on one side, and there's DS UB not even being touched on the other side, it's not me with whataboutism, it's me pointing out either a clear mistake or complete bias.
An important aspect people are forgetting to consider when comparing the two perks is that it's not about how many times they can be used.
How much time does each perk buy the players using it?
Pop regresses a gen instantly 25% of its total progression which I understand to be 25% of the progression survivors have made on the gen.
At the very most when a gen is almost complete a gen can be popped regressing it by 20 seconds.
If a gen is 50% complete then pop will regress it by 10 seconds.
If a survivor uses DS once, depending on the skill of the survivor the chase can last much longer than it would take survivors to recover the lost progress of a popped gen.
This is where the disparity lies and should be considered when talking about these two perks in comparison.
I know I'm pretty late to the party, but Pop didn't need a Nerf. If Pop does go down to 45, I would like to see DS go down to 45 as well.
You can’t draw comparisons between two completely different perks. Nice try tho
Yes I can. At the top level of play Pop is used to extend the lifespan of the game, in order to get more time to gain a foothold. DS, on the other hand, is used as a means to put the killer into lose/lose situations, waisting his time as your allies gain an advantage.
Yes I brought up that tunnel to show it happens alot. You cant say it's a change when it's a downright nerf to remove anti momentum.
But the ,,anti momentum" feature is too strong. It can cost the killer the whole game especially if they abuse it and everone uses it. Even if only 2 people are using it.
You say it is ,,required" because you got tunneled but then proceed saying it shouldnt be only anti tunnel.
Pop is overpowered because you can't get rid of it unlike Hex:Ruin, It is extremely strong on high mobility killers such as Billy, I'm not even gonna get started on Freddy with his teleportation ability, Spirit, Legion, and Blight. If you have a 3-gen going on, the survivors are pretty much #########. You're going to be fine. The perks still going to be meta, it's still gonna be the same old boring perk with literally just a 15 second difference. Is that enough for you ?
I think that pop should be 60 and ds last infinite if a survivor gets tunneled straight off the hook
I kind of agree with the long timer point but my god does their reasoning not make any sense when compared with unbreakable and DS. absolutely insane.
Blimey, what is all that whining about? Pop timer reduced from 60s to 45s, what is the big deal? It's still way enough to get to the farthest gen and pop it (which btw. is a very stupid way of playing with pop, but whatever). There used to be a time when Pop Tier 1 only had a 30s timer, and it still was a good perk then. Seems like no of you complainers remembers this.
I'm complaining that pop got nerfed and DS, UB didn't. The pop nerf isn't that bad, but it boggles my mind that they would nerf pop before DS, UB.
So what if DS/ UB were not changed? Why do the two have to be changed before others may be adjusted? That's just us-vs-them mentality again. Yes these two can be really problematic together, more than pop. But please take a closer look at the listed perk chances: They are nearly all just number tweaks and sometimes slight condition changes! Nothing was changed fundamentally. But thats exactly what DS would need, imo, a mere number tweak does not really change anything about the problematic combo with UB.
DS UB deserve to be changed because they're the most unbalanced perks in the game currently.
Doesn't take much to reduce the DS timer to 45 seconds. Then UB becomes naturally weaker. It kinda partially fixes the problem.
EDIT: In fact yea, DS does need a new mechanic to it, I still find it absurd tho that it's been out for so long and nothing has happened.
Ds needs a time nerf, 45 sec. DS at high ranks is just a “act like a dumba$$” perk.
Or ill go chase someone else and hook them, then random run into the survivor unhooked recently who never healed and went to a gen and they still have ds lol
Ds was nerfed twice because it made it almost impossible to get a hook it was the equivalent of sabbo squad with breakout. But you didnt need teamates ds is fine now by its self but not with unbreakable they just paradoxed themselvs with how the killer can pop a gen after downing someone but a surivor can get a gen 70% and then ds see the issue
I don't think the problem is the Nerf itself. It's just there isn't a red rank killer alive who hasn't had to put up with how utterly one-sided and broken perks like Decisive Strike and Dead Hard( I personally think Unbreakable is fine the way it is). And when Nerf season comes around, does it hit some of these perks that can make the game near unplayable for killers? Nope, you Nerf one of the few perks that can help them keep up. Rather it's unfair or not is up for debate, but it's definitely frustrating.
That what I say it piss me off.
Yea that what I said and now it gave me a reason to stop playing it.
Even with the nerf, pop probably will still be alright but why? Was there anyone genuinely arguing that it was unbalanced aside
from a few threads here and there. It rewarded the killer for doing his objective, still required some thought from the killer as to which gen to use it on and the regress is not that insane and you can't stack it. Even if we gave pop an unlimited timer until you used it on a gen, It wouldn't make the perk broken by an stretch. Again 60 seconds to 45 second to use it is barely anything but I just don't understand the devs line of thinking.This is just going to make more new players hop on the ruin+undying+tinkerer train regardless if pop is still meta because the former is already easier and stronger.
Thana buff might be really good. Current max penalty is 16% so if they bump it up from there it might see alot of use and people already combined it with sloppy already so the fact it doesn't affect healing doesn't matter.
that's called balance
Very true that why people don't wanna play killers.
The big deal is DS didn't get nerf
True
This is why I won't be back for months.
I'll repeat what I said back with the ruin nerf: Just because they touched DS before, does not mean it should never be looked at/touched again.
Lmao, I love the logic of the thanta nerf.
"It's lose-lose" when the survivors SHOULD be punished for the killer performing well and the entire team taking damage at the same time.
Nerf sloppy butcher too. That's lose-lose. Actually, nerf anything that gives the killer an advantage. It's lose-lose. How am I supposed to counter perks like bloodhound and predator? They are lose-lose for the survivor.
The anti momentum feature is only strong I'd you let it be strong. You have perks like bbq, or thrilling that reveal other survivors location. Why wont you leave the recently unhooked one alone.
Yes the anti tunnel feature of DS is required, but that does not mean its anti momentum feature shouldnt be there it's always been anti momentum and it still is. It was never designed to solely stop tunneling.
Since it gives the killer the power to have a chance vs genrushing.
If its anti tunnel then why does it have a skill check?
It was never solely anti tunnel and it still isnt. It has way to many effects to be solely anti tunnel. Also these same devs said in the patch notes using it outside of tunneling was smart.
First of all, grow up. Second of all, what is this supposed to imply? My guess is that your tired of seeing similar post, but instead of ignoring it, you have to make fun of an opinion for...honestly no gain for anyone.
Im displeased to say that reading your opinion makes me sick and activate my surv biased alarm.
Oh yea i should let them body block or let them work on a gen in front of me just because they have DS? Or they just jump in a locker just to ,,distract me in a smart way"?
If you justify these thinngs with ,,its just survivors who play OPtimAlLY" then ypu shouldnt complain about tunneling or camping because thats also just playing optimally.
And no its NOT required. I almosr never use it and still almost always escape.
Quite the gain for me. I mean, I just got a reply from you.
you could get more by posting it on reddit, if attention is what you want, i think you would like more than just one person.
the pop's change is tremendously unnecessary. another change nobody asked for. congratulations bhvr.
Nah, I'm good, I'm good, ta' for the offer.
Now, focus on the topic at hand without derailing from it. After all, this thread ain't about me, it's about...whatever it's about.
Honestly I always thought the 60 second buff was totally unnecessary in the first place. 30 seconds was always fine, and taught better limited map priority.
The buff to 60 seconds cultivated bad habits in the same way old Ruin did.
Excuse me as I go check what this nerf to Pop is so I can celebrate with my SWF Escape Squad.
No you down them and slug them if they arent in the locker. But it's still technically a smart move.
I dont complain about camping and tunneling all I'm saying is that if thats legit so is DS and unbreakable.
Alright all the killer has to do is test and see if you dont have DS if you dont they will happily tunnel you. I havent been running them either so it was a bit of an exaggeration. My question is, is there an obsession in your matches you are surviving because if so then it's still DS because of the psychological effect.
I do main killer, so I feel the salt a little bit on this one. That being said, I do think Pop was very overrepresented. You basically run Pop or you run Ruin for one of your perks. If you don't run one or the other, you're doing it wrong.
Part of the issue with Pop, too, is Survivors can't really play around it either.
Also, I'll just level with you - I don't think UB/DS is OP. You're basically investing two perks to possibly undo one single error, allowing yourself to recover from being downed 1 minute after you're hooked. Honestly, I just accept trades now or slug after first hook. Go for the guy doing the unhook, hook him. Hell, that way, if the two of them are running Borrowed Time/DS/UB... they effectively got no benefit.
When I play survivor, I would just rather run information perks, so I can avoid being put in a situation where you need those. I usually just facecamp gens and leave the heroics to the other 2 members of the team... because they always try, I feel.
Besides, let's just be clear, if you really want to counter UB/DS, you absolutely can. Just run Mori. lol. "Oh, you want me to pick you up after I hooked you once? Cute. *Murders you awfully.* DS This."
POP was not nerfed enough! All they did was change it so you couldn't cross the map, down someone, pop the gen, hook them, and then pop it again. Even slow Hag can walk across the map within 45 seconds with BBQ.
They still have NO COUNTER to the objective progress removal. NONE. They didn't address why it was used so much.
They may be looking at stats and killers are enjoying a 3K+ average killrate all using slowdown perks is why they did it but it wasn't enough. It would be stupid to nerf survivor perks especially those that counter unfun killer strategies. And can be completely countered, whereas many killer perks have no counters or hinder the survivor so much it loses the game.
Still no information about nerfing the overpowered killers or the broken ones. They are hardly survivor sided!