thesuicidefox
thesuicidefox
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Church is okay. The only thing I would change would be to remove the god window above church basement but only when basement spawns at the church. Ward needs to be fixed though. That map is awful. Really all that needs to be done is they need to shrink the map. It's just way too big. Maybe also adjust the windows of the observatory in the main building (best to add a breakable wall somewhere there). But yea the size of the map is a huge problem.
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@danielmaster87 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1855127#Comment_1855127
Flawed logic. If they're solos, they won't know you have Rancor until they become it, so they're not gonna be deterred by something they don't know you have. If they're SWF they'll make sure you never even see the obsession after 5 gens are done.
If it's a SWF then they definitely won't want to DS you so as long as you have some way to track survivors and find the obsession they won't want to do it. So win win. Either they purposely avoid DS'ing you or you kill them.
And for solos it's a nice little surprise. Makes them regret having DS'd you.
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Rancor is better.
Survivors will hesitate to DS you as the gens finish. They don't want to get mori'd.
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I thought this thread was gonna be something like...
"You're making me git gud. You wouldn't like me when I git gud."
Cue Hulk rage out.
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@FFirebrandd said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1852434#Comment_1852434
"Where no amount of experience can make up for how much value you get from Dead Hard or DS or BT etc."
Again... I'm saying Tapp should move from D to C. Why do you keep comparing his perks with perks that are far higher up than where I think he should be?
Can you make a solid case for why Aftercare is better than Detective's Hunch? Can you make a solid case for why Deliverance is better than Tenacity? If you can't, then maybe you need to reevaluate.
Aftercare gives you information about another player which you can't predict or control like you can tiles/objects. I can know where every totem spawn is and where gens are so as not 3 gen. I don't know what this Dwight is going to do if he gets chased to the main building while I'm on a gen. If I have Aftercare on him I can see what he does so I can avoid the killer, or maybe protect him if needed. He also sees me and can decide to run away from my gen so that I can finish it.
Aftercare also shares information with other survivors. They get a lead on what you are doing, which helps them. So it's like a perk that helps 2 people. Breakdown has a physical effect on the game by taking out a hook for 2 minutes. That can alter what a killer does. If you get tunneled but then he uses 2 hooks in a corner he might not be able to hook you again so he slugs. The best value you get from Detective's is that you optimize your ability to destroy totems, which has diminishing returns based on how well you know the game.
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@FFirebrandd said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1852167#Comment_1852167
Maps can run out, both from your inventory and total usage time during the match. Also maps generally require that you pass within 8m of objects before it starts tracking them. For all of those reasons, maps cannot replace Detective's Hunch. Also one could argue that Medkit + Hunch is better than Map + Inner Strength or Self Care. As for just knowing where all the totems are... That's simply not practical for most of the player base.
Tenacity can absolutely be useful without comboing. I have had it save me several hook states and has even gotten me the hatch or an open exit gate on its own. It isn't as strong as unbreakable because it can't handle multislugging but it can absolutely save you when you get slugged, and it can do it multiple times. Even if it doesn't outright save you, if the killer takes 5 seconds longer to find you after you get downed it's still decent.
Now I'll admit that because its an anti slug perk, it is inherently less reliable than those perks you mentioned. However all of those perks you mentioned are currently in your B rank. I'm not trying to get you to move Tapp to B... Just from D to C. Tenacity vs Deliverance is a far closer comparison... And Tapp's other 2 perks are debatably better or at least on the same level as pebble and autodidact.
"Maps can run out, both from your inventory and total usage time during the match. Also maps generally require that you pass within 8m of objects before it starts tracking them. For all of those reasons, maps cannot replace Detective's Hunch."
If your map runs out and you didn't find all the totems, like WHAT THE FUDGE were you doing with it then? That's literally the point of a map, to find totems. You shouldn't be even coming close to running out if you are using it for this purpose. Not to mention you shouldn't even be using it until you ran the map at least once. The game tells you when something gets tracked via Bloodpoints so run in a circle around the map then light it up. Do some totems, then only use it to track down the last few by waiting for more BP prompts. Again you should never be running out.
This besides the fact that, like I said, Detective's is barely worth running if you know how tiles/objects spawn. The entire purpose of the perk is negated by just lots of experience. Where no amount of experience can make up for how much value you get from Dead Hard or DS or BT etc.
And by your own argument, the aura from Detective's only last 10 seconds. If you are in a chase you don't exactly have the luxury to look around when a gen pops so you can miss stuff. And you only get 5 procs, that's 50 seconds, and since gens tend to go in pairs or triplets thats means you lose a lot of time. If you were the first one chased you lost 30 seconds of aura reading.
Tenacity just isn't that great though. Majority of kills pick you up right away, and if the killer is slugging multiple people well they could very likely have something like BBQ to find you, so you're not going to hide that well from them. A good killer will still find you. I'll admit I've lost some people using Tenacity, but then when I catch them again I make sure they don't get away.
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So Plague should be the only one in S tier since she has 2 meta perks and a third perk that's decently above average. Bubba would be mid A for BBQ and Franklins (BBQ is a meta perk but not actually that amazing at high ranks). Swap Pig and GF. Surveillance is meta, and MYC is a good perk on most killers. Thrilling Tremors is not actually that good, IDK why people love this perk, if they are doing the gen they do the gen. You might know where to go but they will finish the gen, and you can cuck yourself if you run Pop. Furtive/Ears are not good enough to make up for it, his perks are meh at best. Top of C tier prolly. Twins and Wraith I'd argue for C tier. Coupe is actually a nice perk and Oppression goes well with Pop and Surveillance. Shadowborn is a great perk, basically makes it damn near impossible to evade the killer's vision or do cheeky moves, or just ######### hide in plain sight. Bloodhound is a good tracking perk, albeit a bit obsolete in today's meta.
The rest looks good though.
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Definitely not Claudette.
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It's because sounds suck hot dirty unwashed diarrhea ass in this game. You have to learn how to track without sounds and learn to predict movements. Once you do that then you can start to rely on sounds just for confirmation.
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@tt_ivi_99 said:
Jake deserves A tier way more than Claudette, Iron Will is just too good.
@Kaiju said:
How is Iron Will in B? I don't find Bond that useful since comms. Well maybe Prove thyself
I agree Iron Will is very good but Sabo and Calm Spirit are not. You have to consider them as well. And I love Calm Spirit but it's just not a great perk at the end of the day. It fills a niche and is good if you play a certain way but otherwise it's not going to be very useful. Sabo can be useful but it's so situational really, and you kind of need another perk to maximize it's impact (eg. Breakout).
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@FFirebrandd said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1852033#Comment_1852033
Did you miss that I said Tapp should be in C?
I honestly would say that Detective's Hunch and Tenacity are about on the level... if not better than Aftercare Breakdown and Distortion. Similar story to his and Cheryl's perks honestly. They both have 1 perk that's... kinda meh but can be nice (Stake Out/Blood Pact), 1 perk that can counter the current killer meta of Ruin+Undying (Detective's/Repressed), and 1 anti slugging perk that kinda needs comboing to work really well (Tenacity/Soul Guard).
Honestly I could make a similar comparison between Tapp and Adam's perks too. Probably Felix's as well.
I like Detective's Hunch, but the problem with it is that it can be replaced by a map, or by just understanding how objects/tiles spawn. Like yes, it's great to be able to see the totems and run right to them but it's not entirely necessary to get them all. I know where every totem spawn is on almost any map, if I really want I can just run the map once or twice and get them all, or just check for them as I move from gen to gen. Not to mention that if the killer doesn't have a totem it's kind of pointless. And on the off-chance they have NOED, well if I just make a mental note of totems, maybe doing the ones that would be hard to get or find otherwise, NOED is almost a non-issue. Maybe 1 person gets hit but that's all the killer is gonna get against a survivor like me. So while it's a nice perk, it's just completely unnecessary at the end of the day. It's more of a QOL buff than anything else.
And Tenacity is not good by itself. Not like Inner Strength, Lithe, Balanced, or Iron Will. It's the perk you pair with another perk to actually get value.
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Rather than outright nerf the effect I think it would be better to just add some kind of drawback. Maybe it makes you lose your power faster or maybe slows you down. Something that's a trade off, because I imagine if you make it just a lesser value it would just become a really bad add-on.
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@Katie_met said:
Honestly I'd put Cheryl at S tier. Repressed Alliance is fantastic since ruin is so common. Sould Guard is incredible if you have adrenaline and get up in the killer's face or if you play unbreakable. It's also good anti-slug because with ruin+undying being so common then you're guaranteed to be cursed by a hex totem most of the time so you don't have to suffer with being slugged because it has unlimited usage. Blood pact is the weaker one of the perks but still has a lot of potential both in solo queue and in a swf. It's good in a swf because you can stay near your friend to get the haste, and it's good in solo queue because it shows you where someone is so you can see if they're in a chase and if you're in a chase then you can avoid that survivor if they're on a generator.
@FFirebrandd said:
I think Tapp deserves to be in C at least. Yes, Stake Out is kind of underwhelming. Detective's Hunch is just info but it is all the info, which is particularly useful against Ruin/Undying. However, I think you are severely underrating Tenacity. Some of it is that its pretty infrequent people play around it, but if they don't play around it, it can be just as brutal to the killer as Unbreakable but it isn't limited to just 1 use. I fairly frequently run Tenacity without UB or SG and it still pays off handsomely. Not always of course, it is still an anti slugging perk and you don't always get slugged but it works fantastic for what it is.
@Ghost_Face_Main said:
How is Jeff not low A or at the very least top B tier? I've never had more valuable use out of any teachables (not Distortion) than his, especially Aftercare.
You guys don't seem to understand how a tier list works.
A tier list is a relative ranking of some thing. That means that any particular thing on the list is ranked in comparison to every other thing. So while THING A might be a good thing, if it's not objectively more impactful than THING B then it will be lower on the tier list. This does not mean thing A is bad, just that compared to thing B (and everything above it) it's not as impactful on the game.
None of Jeff, Cheryl, or Tapps perks are as impactful as the perks for characters above them. Would you say Jeff's perks, despite being pretty good, are as good or better than perks in tier A? Better or as good as stuff like Dead Hard, Self Care, Prove Thyself? If so then you could say it's tier A but I doubt anyone would say Aftercare or Breakdown are as valuable as Dead Hard and Self Care. Same with Cheryl. You don't see Repressed Alliance being as impactful as BT or DS. Not even close. Soul Guard you could make an argument for, but at the same time it's reliant on other actual meta perks like UB or DS to get real value. On it's own Soul Guard is not a very good perk, at least not on the same level as UB or DS.
It might hurt to see your character low, or see a character whose perks you love to use low, but you have to remember it's all relative. Just because a character has F tier perks doesn't mean those perks are COMPLETELY useless, just that literally every other perk is better.
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@GodDamn_Angela said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1849948#Comment_1849948
Built to last is good if you use a high charge item. And Desperate Measures does what it needs to do and does it mostly well.
Visionary is the only perk I would consider garbage.
@thesuicidefox I don't see how Inner Strength is worse than Self Care (unless you take a medkit and botany) but Nancy's other two perks are just straight worse than Claudette's so I agree with this placement.
You have to pay money for Inner Strength and you can only use it a max of 5 times. You also need to spend time doing the totem, so it's not an 8 second heal it's actually 24 seconds. You also need a locker, which makes you completely immobile while you heal. With Self Care you can relocate very quickly and easily if you need to and continue the heal. IS is all or nothing.
@Marigoria said:
How is felix c tier? his perks are all garbage
Visonary is actually very good for gen rushing and preventing a 3 gen. It's like a better version of Deja Vu. Desperate Measures is a strong healing perk. Built To Last is very good for toolboxes. Basically all his perks are good enough to just throw on a build, they just don't qualify as meta because they aren't so strong they single handedly win games.
@[Deleted User] said:
Obviously David is A tier because of No Mither right?........right?
Right.
@gatsby said:
The only Survivor tier list that matters is one that ranks Survivors on how loud they are to the Killer. Because that can actually give you an advantage in game.
Because otherwise Survivors are basically just skins since you can unlock any teachables you want on them
I said it's based on teachables. If you had to play with just a characters 3 teachables, who would be the best, and/or what survivor should you level first for their perks to make a build and/or how much of an impact do their perks have on the game.
Like Ace is quiet, but his perks are all complete ass. Ace In The Hole is the only one of value and even then it's not even that decent.
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@TotemsCleanser said:
I feel that Soul Guard and For The People deserve a bit more recognition, hence I would move both Cheryl and Zarina one tier up. Cheryl also has Repressed Alliance, which is kinda useful to counter gen regression, and Zarina has Red Herring, which is niche but can make the killer waste a ton of precious time checking a gen that no one is at, so I feel these girls can do with going up one tier.
Jeff on C is... questionable to say the least, I enjoy running Distortion from time to time because of the amount of info it gives you, but that's pretty much it.
And Tapp deserves more love, because Tenacity can be GREAT if the killer is trying to slug (which happens somewhat often), and Detective's Hunch gives you a ton of info that is very much appreciated in the current R+UD meta. Stake Out is honestly not very good if you're good at hitting great skill checks, but I feel it /is/ kinda underrated because it can help you to genrush even faster, lmao. Specially if the killer is getting looped close-ish to where you are repairing.
I do appreciate that you put Dwight in tier A, though. My underrated boy deserves more love, and so do his perks.
Jeff is as high as he is because Aftercare is a very good aura perk. Also Breakdown when used as a group is actually super effective at denying the killer pressure. I had a game recently when 2 or 3 had it, and there came a point where I had no hooks in an area and I was forced to slug at a bad time. Distortion is probably his worst perk honestly.
The thing with Soul Guard is you need to be running UB to get the most value out of it. On it's own it's not really a great perk. Repressed Alliance is solid but the problem there is you need to work on a gen for 60 seconds, so if you get chased a lot there is no value. It's almost like Deliverance in a way.
Tapp I thought about putting higher, but his perks are all utility. You don't run Tenacity by itself you bring UB/SG. Detective's Hunch is his best perk and while very useful you can get the same results with a map, or even just basic knowledge of how objects spawn. And while this is sort of true with Self Care, SC has infinite use compared to a medkit and frees you to carry a toolbox or something else. Being able to heal yourself is ALWAYS valuable. Being able to see stuff you could find just by knowing the game well is not always as valuable. Also Claud has Empathy and BK which are both really good perks, and the fact she is a starting character while Tapp/Cheryl are only available with real money has an impact too. You'll notice that aside from Laurie and Nancy the top 3 tiers are all base game characters (at least for SE like we have on Xbox/PS). So while in absolute terms Cheryl might have better perks the fact you can have to buy her makes it harder to say it's actually that good. When you don't have to spend money on the game and still have a fully meta build that's why most of the base characters are where they are.
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@[Deleted User] said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1849782#Comment_1849782
i still think nancy deserves A tier, because inner strength is much better than selfcare. it gets the job done when you need a quick heal and resume generators like nothing happened. and repressed alliance counters the killer's meta, so i consider it meta as well. being able to save potentially 60 seconds of regression while you go for unhook, heal, something like that, is very good
You have to remember tier lists are relative rankings. So while IS may be a good perk, it's not going to be better than Adren, UB, DS, BT, Self Care, Dead Hard, Prove Thyself...
By putting it in S/A tier you are saying it is as good or better than all the perks in S/A tier.
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@[Deleted User] said:
seems good, although i would move nancy and cheryl to A tier because of repressed alliance and inner strength. those two perks are extremely underrated: repressed alliance counters ruin undying meta, and inner strength, it is good because it cuts your healing time to 8 seconds, and when combined with decisive strike it's overpowered. i would move adam to S tier because deliverance is capable of so many things, and when combined with decisive strike you can make yourself a free escape when hatch or gates are open.
S/A tier is reserved for survivors with meta perks. I wouldn't consider either Inner Strength or Repressed Alliance meta. Soul Guard is meta but only when paired with Unbreakable. Also DS/UB is much stronger than DS/IS or DS/HO. You could make an entire build around DS and lockers with the 3 perks but you could do equally as well with only DS.
Also I was going to put David in S tier but No Mither, and also WGLF is not exactly meta it's just a really good perk. He's mostly there because of Dead Hard. Just like Laurie is mostly there because of DS (also OOO is very very good).
S tier is for the best of the best. Deliverance is not the best of the best. Definitely meta, but the fact you lose it if you are caught first (or when everyone else is dead) knocks it down a few steps. Autodidact is a decent perk, but not good enough to make up for Deliverance's shortcomings.
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@[Deleted User] said:
What's the purpose of Furtive Chase? You won't be hooking your obsession if you mori with Rancor.
If you hook them and they are not dead then anyone that saves them is basically dead. And since you are Ghostface you can avoid BT if you play it right, so you get 2 kills. It also makes them scared to DS you late game or stun you with a pallet.
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@Aneurysm said:
I've ran this on spirit and doc but you don't need bitter murmur, MYC or dead man's switch both work well as a 4th
I use Bitter Murmur to just focus down the obsession when the game ends. Usually between FC and Nem I am chasing the obsession when the last gen goes but sometimes I'm not and I just wanna get my scrapbook photos done.
But DMS sounds like fun too.
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The devs said they were going to nerf Undying IIRC.
IMO it should just have a cooldown on the aura reading. That's really what makes it so powerful. If you nerf that the combo isn't as bad because it will be like any other totem build, a risk.
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@Huge_Bush said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1847326#Comment_1847326
Imagine being so entitled that you demand the developers to give you an easy win against a killer. And no, hiding next to a gate and waiting for the killer to leave doesn't require skill.
Trappers traps have counters, it's is your choice whether or not you want to prepare for them. If they're such a detriment to your gaming experience, you should run Resilience, Wake Up and Spine Chill to give you faster opening speed.
Not every match against every killer should play out the same. Your team failed to loop Trapper long enough to do gens. You failed to find the hatch. You failed to bring in a key. You failed to run Plunderers for an increased chance to get a key. You failed to prep the gate before Trapper had time to trap them. You are not entitled to have your escape made easier and have yet another chance to escape.
You also have an offering that can cause the hatch to spawn at the main building or at the shack. When last person is hooked, you can prepare yourself to be near it.
Yes. Saying "Buff Trapper just remove this one stupid thing" is being entitled and asking for an easy win LOL. Wow. Those are some massive hoops to jump through to come to that conclusion.
How do you prepare for alerting the killer to which door you are at and not being able to do ANY progress, not even touching the switch, without alerting him first? Please do tell.
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@Huge_Bush said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1847283#Comment_1847283
No, he can delay you from opening the gate, but he can't "stop" you unless he is actually there. You can still disarm the trap and work on the gate. The Twins, well at least the sister, I dunno about victor, can't stand in front of the lever because they will completely prevent you from touching the lever, with no chance to mind game them.
Yes he can stop you. You disarm and start the door. He comes over and resets the trap. Now he knows you are there and there is no way to do the door again without alerting him. You'd have to waste time going to the other door where it just happens again. There is no situation where you can get the gate open.
Twins cannot stand directly in front of the gate to stop you from doing the gate. They have to switch back and forth and Victor can be kicked forcing them to reset. There is a small chance to get the gate open with that. But against Trapper there is literally 0 chance because you can't touch a gate at all if he keeps resetting the trap which all Trappers do before chasing.
Imagine defending something that is so outdated newer killers can't even do it.
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@Huge_Bush said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1847215#Comment_1847215
You can't compare the Trappers power to the Twins power, they are fundamentally different. All the twins have to do is run Whispers and they will have the same effect as Trappers traps. You park the sister at one exit gate while victor is at the other, now the player is notified which gate you're at.
How different is what Trapper can do versus what Spirit, Nurse, and Hillbilly can do? If they run Whispers, they will get the same effect. All they have to do is use their abilities to zip between the two doors and watch for Whispers and bam, you have no chance to escape.
You're forgetting that the Trapper has to take time away from chasing you and your teammates in order to collect the traps and to walk to the gates and trap the levers. You also have the option to ignore the hatch and wait by a gate the moment your last teammate gets downed. You then work on the gate as long as you safely can and sneak away before Trapper traps it. You also have perks to help you progress the opening faster. There are ways around it, it may be difficult, but it can still be done.
Because Trapper can physically stop you from doing the exit gate. It's not hard to understand. Twins can't physically stand in front of the gate to block it. They were explicitly DENIED that ability. Demo portals cannot be put by the gates either. Yet we have a killer that can do it and do it WAY more effectively than either of these killers.
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@ChiTenshi said:
Killers that can place traps shouldn’t be able to place them in front of the exit gate switch.
Trapper, Freddy and Hag (Rusty Shackles) should be able to place them all around the exit gates and so on, but not create an almost impossible situation of escaping if you’re the last Survivor.
As someone that plays a lot of Freddy (and a decent amount of Hag) yes I agree 100%. There needs to be a minimum distance. Demo and Twins already have it, why not these other killers?
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@Huge_Bush said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1847038#Comment_1847038
Survivor is a team role with the option of playing selfishly. As a result, your teammates performance will affect you. You playing well doesn't entitle you to an escape. You just get a chance to escape, which diminishes the more terribly your teammates perform.
The game is filled with dumb mechanics, but Trapper trapping the gates isn't one of them. Lots of things aren't fair, such as the hatch mechanic. Killer can play perfectly and still only 3k due to the survivor getting lucky and finding the hatch first. Heck, the killer can play decently and still lose 3 survivors due to a key.
Both sides have ways to cheat the other out of a victory, if you have a problem with one, then you should have a problem with the other.
Trapper trapping gates is a non-issue. It adds variety to a very stagnant game.
"The game is filled with dumb mechanics, but Trapper trapping the gates isn't one of them."
Um... yes it is actually. Why is Trapper allowed to do this while Twins are not (especially when it's stronger for him)? No one has explained this yet.
Hence why I asked for him to be BUFFED and then this removed because it's a stupid outdated feature.
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@Huge_Bush said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1846939#Comment_1846939
I would say if you're the last survivor and the Trapper played well, while also finding the hatch first, then Trapper has earned his 4k if he thought to trap the doors ahead of time while applying enough pressure to kill 3 people.
Trapping the doors are a non issue.
By earned his 4k you mean got a 3k and was just handed the 4th because of dumb mechanics? Because that's what this is. What if you had 3 bad survivors, you're saying no matter how good you are you should die because they all died? Literally no chance to escape. Yea sounds totally fair.
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@Metalhead said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1846969#Comment_1846969
It's like people don't realize you can disarm a trap, get 20% or so gate progress, hide out while trapper investigates until your buddy disarms the other gate trap and he leaves letting you go repeat the process.
If Twins can't block an exit gate why should Trapper? He is literally the only character that can physically block the gate. You haven't given a good reason for him to keep this yet.
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@Metalhead said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1846941#Comment_1846941
Killer knows you're in the area, he just stands in front of the gate switch, blocking you off until whispers stops or a crow alerts him as you run for the other gate. Killer doesn't need a crow to tell him when you're at a gate, only to tell him which one you are moving towards, he can just body block or patrol the switch until you are found or move on and alert him again.
Leave the trapper be, he's in bad enough shape as is. Start checking gates early on for traps if you know you are playing against one.
You can make progress on the gates if they do that. If you don't just walk to the other gate and force him away from the door you can work on it before he KNOWS you are working on it. It can be done. But doing it against a Trapper is literally impossible.
"Leave the trapper be, he's in bad enough shape as is."
Again the Wobbles defense is bull ######### and that's what this is.
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@lagosta said:
Hear me out:
1-Equip Iridescent stone+ Fastening Tools.
2-Get 4 stacks of Remember Me.
3-Trap both gates.
4-Profit.
Any survivor that disarms the trap will take 36 seconds to open the door. The trap will reset in 30 seconds. :D
Yea and this kind of stuff makes it extra stupid. You could even have Bloody Coil to make it so that now the survivor is injured and easier to track.
It's just dumb. Like why can he do this? Because he is F tier? That's honestly no excuse for this kind of BS. It's the Wobbles defense and that is just another kind of bull ######### right there.
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@OniWantsYourMacaroni said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/216557/whenever-trapper-gets-a-rework-please
Twins can do it to 2 exit gates though.
Just park victor near one of the gates and controll the other one with charlotte.Either see a survivor as charlotte or wait for the killer instinct from victor
No they can't. They are explicitly denied the ability to physically block the gate. Yes you can have one stand guard. If it's Victor he can get kicked and you have to reset, giving the survivor a chance to get to the other gate. If it's Charlotte well you'd have to constantly switch back to her to see. The fact they can't physically block you is the key distinction here.
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@Metalhead said:
Any killer can detect you hiding at and attempting to open a gate if they so choose. Stridor, Whispers, Spies, etc. there are many perks a killer can use to sniff you out that you rarely would think to counter at all that are far more effective than a trap.
I main trapper and he is a thinking man's killer. It seems like you ran across one who was thinking ahead and you lost. No reason to nerf him
Yes but they can't actually stop you from opening the door while also tracking you.
Also LOL at using Stridor or Spies to track someone opening a gate. You have Whispers, which can be dodged albeit it's very difficult. But if done right you can avoid it and get a gate open. Try doing that after disarming a trap.
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@HR_Helios said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1846927#Comment_1846927
There's no issue with being able to set a trap. It should only really result in one kill. If there's two or more survivors one person on each gate results in split pressure where the trapper can only secure one kill at most. Chances are if youre in a situation where that's an issue you've lost anyway. He should not get a kill with 4 people left. If he does it's the survivors error.
And when you are the last survivor?
He basically gets a guaranteed 4k'd if he closes hatch and puts a trap at each gate. Like dude. Twins were explicitly denied the ability to block an exit gate and they can only actually block one. Trapper can block both, so what if you can disarm it he knows you are there, he just resets it and looks for you. Either he finds you or you die to EGC.
It's dumb. And it's also super effective with 2 survivors. All he needs to do is slug if the other trap goes off.
Tell me one reason why he should be allowed to completely block the switch.
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Blindness is actually very nice for slugging. Duration needs a buff but that's about it.
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Yea that would be a bit much.
I honestly think Beast Of Prey could be made better with 2 simple changes. First, it decreases the time to get Bloodlust by 3 seconds each tier (so 12/24/36 instead of 15/30/45) which would make it the "Bloodlust perk". Second would be that the Undetectable lasts up to say 4/5/6 seconds after a chase ends so that you could use it to get a speed boost then change targets effectively. After that I'd just remove the Bloodpoints thing, no one cares.
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Killing Claudettes. I'm already pretty good at it but I'd like to be even better.
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On Tuesday's I main an AFK Insidious/Lightborn Ghostface.
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@GoodBoyKaru said:
Dying Light at max 8 stack with all 4 survivors alive, leading to a 24% (8*3) action speed decrease.
Thanatophobia at max 4 stacks, leading to a 20% action speed decrease.
Freddy's Swing Chains at max 4 stacks, leading to an 8% (2*4) action speed decrease
Freddy's Jump Rope, leading to a 4% action speed decrease.
To get the total interaction speed, take the number of needed charges (80 charges) divided by the charges inputted per second (c/s).
According to this thread from Orion:
Debuffs stack multiplicatively. This means to calculate the total debuff from all of them, we need to multiply them together. Therefore we do:
(1-0.24)*(1-0.2)*(1-0.08)*(1-0.04). This gives us a total of 0.792723456c/s.
EDIT: I DID THIS ON MY PHONE THERE'S A TYPO. THIS IS THE CORRECT ANSWER:
0.5817344
So, to figure out how long it takes, we divide 80 charges by 0.5817344 charges per second to give us a grand total of 137.51980285161 seconds.
Wrong picture above due to faulty numbers.
For the record, Thanatophobia alone at max stacks is 100 seconds on a gen.
IN MY DEFENCE IT'S 1:40AM AND I HAVE A SPLITTING HEADACHE I SHOULDN'T BE DOING MATHS.
Always check your work lads.
Your calculations are wrong. I can see you put 1.024 and 0.008 instead of 1-0.24 and 0.08 respectively.
@freddymybae said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1843086#Comment_1843086
Noice will try this once
TBH it is overkill. You get equally valid results using just Thana and Outdoor Rope (2% debuff) and combining it with Pop or Ruin. The problem is Dying Light. The obsession is unaffected AND they get a altruism buff. Also if you kill them you lose the perk, and smart teams will force you to chase the obsession. You also can't eat a single DS because now you can't kill that survivor. One last note, to get the max value out of Dying Light you basically need to kill 2 survivors and have 2 hooks on the third non-obsession. At this point the game would be over anyway so the repair debuff is almost moot.
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Play Freddy and use this build:
- Dying Light: 0.03 * 8 stacks = 0.24 (max you can get where a survivor is still affected)
- Thanatophobia: 0.05 * 4 stacks = 0.2
- Jump Rope: 0.04
- Swing Chains: 0.02 * 4 stacks = 0.08
Here is the math for 1 survivor that is not the obsession (and no repair speed buffs):
80/((1-0.24)*(1-0.2)*(1-0.04)*(1-0.08)) = 148.97 seconds
Roughly 2 and a half minutes.
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My only problem with the Rift is how some challenges are just obscenely stupid to get. You have to either throw a game or farm them at high ranks.
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It is actually one of my favorite perks. I found it pretty useful on Nurse and Huntress to snipe people in corn. I also like it on GF. Sadly it's just outclassed by other tracking perks. Spirit is really the only killer that can make more use of it because of how it synergizes with her power.
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@Selliato said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1839487#Comment_1839487
Account created on this site can be used with steam, stadia and , "in the near future ©" Switch to share progression/friends and unlocked survivors/killers/cosmetics.
I mean until it's on all platforms and doesn't require you to pre-emptively make an account with BHVR there is no actual cross progression in the game.
When I can buy the game on PC and transfer all my content from my Xbox we'll talk.
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There is no cross progression in DBD. You must mean cross play. They are two entirely different things.
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As someone that runs Spine Chill all the time, I'd be okay if it were disabled when you have the Oblivious effect, however I'd only be okay with that if Dream World didn't inflict Oblivious by default (put it on an add-on like Pill Bottle or Z Block). Otherwise I think it's fine. If you know a survivor has it (which is the hardest thing about the perk) then you can mess with them by moonwalking a lot.
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@Devil_hit11 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1837745#Comment_1837745
Its good that you made up your own definition for S-tier but that is just not how the world works. Its like me making up word saying that happy means sad but at the end of the day, anyone that read word "Happy" will read it as joy. Its just how the world works.
As I stated in
my previous post, I think highest tier in DBD is A-tier and it goes down to B,C,D but what does that even mean in respect to DBD? Can a D-tier killer win vs good teams? The answer is probably not. What about C-tier? Probably not. B-tier? closer than everything below it but probably not, at least not in reliable sense. at this point it becomes a list of how hard killers lose rather how good at they are at winning. In the end, you need to be able to win(hook) 5-6 times within 5 minutes of DBD game and you need reliable tools to outplay your opponent at every turn. Its not like other games where every character in a fighting game can beat another character, but other weaker character have worse tools or numbers. In DBD, its more true/false question in regards to whether your tools are effective or not in allotted time frame.Moral of the story, I think tier-lists in DBD are publicity stunts and perception skews for what people believe is effective and often their tier-list is what works for them. my 2 cents on it. So I would them take them with grain of salt.
That's not how a tier list works. I've made actual tier list before, discussed how they should be made ad nauseum. I'm not making up anything I have actual experience drafting official (semi-official) tier lists.
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I have a lot of builds. My main Spirit build is BBQ, Pop, Corrupt, and either Sloppy or Stridor depending on how ######### sounds are that day. For Freddy I do currently do BBQ, Pop, Discordance, and Remember Me, and also a Sheep Block to counter OOO. Literally all I feel I need on Freddy is BBQ, Pop, and Sheep Block. After that I just kind of use whatever.
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@Cable2486 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1837019#Comment_1837019
Says the one who's killer list looks like a 5 year old made it. Keys are broken. The Mori still required work to use, in either form. This thread isn't a complaint, it's an observation.
LOL maybe you're just reading it like a 5 year old.
And yes, this is basically a complaint thread. You were mad about mori's, then you decided to play even more like a bad killer to make up for it.
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@Devil_hit11 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1837083#Comment_1837083
Look up what S-tier stands for. here's quick link and I'll read the description based off this website: https://tiermaker.com/blog/news/15/s-tier-meaning-what-does-s-tier-stand-for.
"The S ranking in a tier list is typically regarded as standing for "superb" or "super" and is considered the highest ranking on a tier list template. Under S tier, the tier labels use a traditional A - D grading scale. Tier list labels can be customized and at times a row for "SS" will be placed above S tier.
A fighting game character, fast food restaurant or any other thing ranked S in a tier list would be considered the very best, OP, elite or whatever other adjective you want to give it.
There doesn't appear to be a definitive origin story for using S as the top placements in tier lists or definition of what it actually stands for. Here are some of the top definitions and meanings for the acclaimed tier list placement."
The origin of the term is what Japanese used to describe as "Perfect score". No killer in DBD is 10/10 score. Anything that has perfect score in video games is overpowered beyond belief and game-breaking. Most kllers in DBD are at best 6/10 (above average), 5/10 or 4/10(Average/below average) or at worst, 1-3/10(really situational to weak). A killer in dbd to have perfect score would have to have perfect anti-looping potential with little to no counter-play, Instant global mobility, Undetectable, Global aura-reading, Instant down, Instant mori. 90% of survivor base would just rage disconnect if a killer was that strong.
No S tier is reserved for the top characters. Dude, I was on the Smash Backroom, THE ORIGINAL Smash Backroom. We made the first like 8 tier lists for Melee, and they haven't changed much in the 10 years I left. That was literally 50% of our job, the other 50% being to make the community guidelines/rulesets. We discussed just how tier lists are formed for pages and pages and pages on the forum, this not including the discussion of the actual tier list itself. I know all about how to make a tier list, I've done it many times.
Whoever the best character is gets placed in S tier. The next best, third best, sometimes also gets placed there if they are of comparable strength to the top (and is usually dependent on how many characters are on the list). That's all it is. S does not mean perfect, it means the best. You will never see a tier list without an S tier even if the character in S tier is actually not that good COMPARED TO THE REST OF THE CAST they are the best. SS is generally the tier reserved for broken or "perfect" characters, but those are actually insanely rare.
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@Devil_hit11 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1836434#Comment_1836434
Nurse has bad maps. Lery's and Hawkins are not good maps for Nurse as there is a lot of LOS blockers. Rotten field and Old Yamoka estate could been argued has "difficult maps" but that does not mean that Nurse is bad because few maps are harder than others. you can argue that you can just "blink" better on these maps and usurp the difficulty and dominate the map but the reality is that if survivor team is good and has tricky movement+fast generators, Its going to be a rough game, high probability to lose, yet many people still say she is the best killer, even put her at S-tier. I do not like tiers because S-tier almost implies that the killer is a 10/10 and that the killer is broken/unbeatable which is definitely not the case. Also, you can't say that Wraith Purple Windstorm+All-seeing blood or Ghostface on Hawkins is a bad on these maps, Its just that... majority of the maps are bad for them, so people do not really consider the odd ball maps for where they're good or bad, they look at the majority.
I also do consider every add-on & tactic. For example, Otz made a tier-list many months ago where he said that Hag is 3rd best killer in the game. i am not sure why he said that but I think possible reason he said that was perhaps related to Mint rag and Rusty shackles add-on. Hag has 1 main strength and two severe weakness. Her strength is that when hag gets a hook, Hag has best hook momentum in the entire game. Killers call it hook momentum, Survivors will call it proxy camping or just camping. When hag gets a hook, your almost never going leave that hook without trading. SWF make short work of hag. All they need to do to beat hag is have one person get chased by hag who is 110% which is laughably easy and one person following them with a flashlight and disable each trap that is placed. Other two work on generators until the game is over. One of hag's weakness is her setup can be broken very easily and you can effectively ban hag from ever setting up and starve her to death. This is what strong SWF do to hags. Not every game is swf and this strategy requires a lot of coordination and is almost impossible in solo. Solo-queue has different method against hag. Almost everyone knows that hag excels at camping but also know she sucks at the chase. This means that Hag has worst gen pressure in the entire game. Hag cannot chase people off generators in most maps(again Hawkins,midwich elementary school, The game etc, are small+choke points) so what most people do vs hag is they let a player get chased, the player who get chased often gets zoned with traps and than gets hooked. The idea is that hag will setup a web around hooked person and instead of survivors saving the hooked person, you just let the person get 2 hooked until their death timer reaches 5-10 seconds and just do generators across the map that hag cannot pressure than hook trade at last second so that hooked person does not die(Borrow time really helps here).
Depending on how fast the first was hooked and what generator were complete, All hags will either successfully 3 gen and win or unsuccessfully 3 gen and lose, but vs good teams Solo or SWF, 3 generators are not effective when 4 players are alive. Survivors can heal way faster than a killer can deal damage and luckily base regression speed is very slow compare to 2-3 survivors simultaneously repairing gens. So 3 generator Freddy is pretty easy to beat because 3 gen hag is pretty common to answer your post. Long-story, short, this is why I think hag is overrated and is not as good as people claim her to be. Mint rag add-on allows you to teleport globally around the map but Hag is still 110% chasing killer and she relies in-front setup at loops to use Mint rag as Anti-looping tool(Please play trapper if your going to do this). People talk about how Spirit has no counter-play in her power due to no visual feedback, They should play against Rusty shackle Hag to talk about an add-on that gives ZERO feedback when you spring a trap. In short, Its really strong, easily Hag's best add-on, Definitely Iri head level of power for skilled hag but at the end of the day, Flashlights exist and your going need a good SWF to beat this add-on as it is really powerful. Its why I place hag as almost viable with a big ?.
Lastly, When making that tier-list I consider many games some player names that i recognized as I played vs them, for example I've played against Ralph(A well known Huntress main) 2-3 times and Ohtofu(Played against his Deathslinger & Huntress) and those games are hard. I remember facing really good Freddy on Gas heaven, rank 1 with the perks BBQ/POP/Nemesis/Dead man switch with slowdown add-on and he hooked like every person twice including me and on very last chase, I had really strong chase against him and I died on 3rd hook but everyone else escaped. The key to beating Freddy is winning early game before microsleep kicks in, than staying awake for the majority of the game leaving him to be an M1 killer with just a teleport. Haddonfield is a bad map for most M1 killers and you can easily keep Freddy as M1 killer even if generator take longer from failed skill-checks as his chases will be very long if played correctly. Also don't give him free first hits. He's not that amazing as you think he is but it is really easy for him to access either his anti-loop snares or his game slowdown. Personally, If I had to make a change on Freddy, I would remove his micro-sleep mechanic from his kit because I feel like it gives him unlawful rewards for existences. It would make him need to actually work for his power like Oni. Currently I think his rewards for being in dream world are not that good but they're always present so no matter how bad freddy plays it, he'll always get rewarded for his power. I think it would be better if he perhaps had his old aura-reading back in his kit that works within his TR which would make him a greater monster in the chase but he'd have to hit people first to get it to work so he would fall more in lines with Oni/Spirit where the power is strong when the killer player is good but worse when the player is ineffective at getting hits with Freddy.
I am sorry if the explanation is really long but it is as short as I could write while trying to be really concise to the point. I consider all add-on and perks(lmo, like 20 killer perks are viable). I just don't consider map offering because they're rare in bloodweb and I do not consider Mori's that skip hook states as that effect is too game-breaking. Hopefully the post answers all your claims and questions in your post.
S Tier is reserved for the very few characters that are clearly the best. Most tier lists only place 2-3 out of a roster of 20 in S tier. Sometimes just 1. It's not meant to say the character is 10/10 just that they are clearly the superior one.
