sulaiman
sulaiman
About
- Username
- sulaiman
- Joined
- Visits
- 5,047
- Last Active
Comments
-
When i started the game, gen times were kept in check by old ruin. It wasn´t good against experienced players, but new ruin isn´t either.
Since the change of ruin, the pace of the game heavily increased. Games used to be double as long as now. Sure, part of it was due to my own inexperience and the resulting play style, but to me the game seemed more relaxed back then, and not the sweatfest it is now.
-
Yes, i did, but i know that you need video evidence, which i got.
-
@Reinami said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2314501#Comment_2314501
Correct, but now i can't know when i cross the line from strategy into bannable.
Like, is 10 seconds fine? What about 60 seconds to wait out DS? What if i'm doing it to wait for someone to die on hook? Maybe i hooked 1 guy, and the other guy is body blocked. So the guy has to wait the 2 minutes for the other guy on the hook to die. Is that bannable? What if i'm plague, and i just body blocked 2-3 survivors in a corner, but i'm in corrupted purge. So now i want to wait out my corrupt purge to puke on each survivor individually and then 1 tap them each. You need to define the terms or you start risking punishing people who aren't actually doing it to be jerks.
But this is not about the killer bodyblocking. What stategic value has trapping a teammate in a room exactly?
-
There is no need to give an exact meassurement outside trying to break exactly that and be unsportsmanlike but within the rules.
-
Well, i was bodyblocked when i repaired the gen, and held there till i coulnt make it out. Is that long enough?
-
Yeah, they nerfed sthe stealth aspect in every map rework so far. Fog should be a thing again, but then, people use strechted res, brighting filters and such anyway to not to have play fair.
-
The worst thing about this map for me is: They finally got colorblind filters, and i got myself a good setting, and this map is so different from the rest that i again cant see any auras on this map. And since i can´t change filters during a match, i just use the penalty-free disconnect i enjoy at the moment.
-
I play solo only, and i had very good matches with other solo survivors vs skilled killers. In a good balanced game, i dont even care about winning.
I hope matchmaking will give me such matches, but i fear they might be like the last test showed me: one killer, 2 player with higher skill, 2 player with lower skill, and most end in a 2k2e.
-
@ill_Boston_lli said:
The fact the recently Every survivor I've been matched with even though I save them multiple times has left me on my first hook at the end of a match. Killer isn't camping or anything and they just dart out of the gate. So If I am in your game and we are survivor together don't get hooked because I am leaving you up there. As I cannot take the chance of risking a hook state for someone who is just going to leave me up there.
Thats the reason i stopped doing it. Help to save someone from an swf (i was the random one), get hooked because i tanked a hit for him, and they dont even try to get my. I was just the odd one to be sacrificed. I might come to your aid if i am not at risk doing so, but i am not going to die in your stead. (however, there are games where you have good teammates before the end, people that take over chases if you are injured, and stuff like that. Those who have already shown to be teamplayers deserve my help even if i die trying.)
-
I dislike just running in circles. Looping is no solution, it is as boring as just running straight.
Also, its not like more killer were viable against good survivors if they just can be looped. There is a reason there is a rise in killers that rebalance the looping issue.
-
Personal survivor goal: Surviving is a win.
Team survivor goal: 3 people get out the gate, even if i have to sacrifice myself for it, is a win. 2 Escape through gates are a draw. Taking the hatch is a loss (unless gens are done anyway)
Killer: 3 people out of the exit gates is a loss, 3k is a win, 2k2e is a draw.
-
@KayTwoAyy said:
I'm sure the survivors on the hook are really glad keys are in the game.
I'm playing immersed pig, and have 3 hooks total. How could you possibly live with yourself, pulling that ######### with 2 gens left?
I had a game once with a 3-swf. I found a key, then the killer found me, and i run them for 4 gens. Then i got downed, hooked, and the 3 swf came to the hook, teabagged me till i was dead, took the key and got out.
Afterwards they told me it was because i was useless and didnt work on gens.
However, as a solo survivor, there are so much dcs and hook suicides, that i like to have a key as a backup. Oh, and tunneling too.
-
@justbecause said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2306538#Comment_2306538
https://us.v-cdn.net/6030815/uploads/EYS3ACV2MC0V/img-20210624-221839.jpg
So much about killer being impossible when I as rank 11 killer all of these with bunch of meta perks
Metaperks doesnt make for a decent player. And ranking up as survivor is incredible easy, so red ranks are not an indicator that a player has skill. The absense of red rank indicates more likly that the player has none.
But as solo survivor, even in red ranks its still a gamble to get a decent team.
-
@Troman said:
I read this foolish argument from killer mains again and again on this forum. They try to justify the broken solo vs Killer balance, which is in favor of killers now. Their logic is childish, they are afraid of DEVs boffung soloQ and that they will have less 4k games, so they say it's not a matter of balance, survivors are just bad blah blah.
By that logic all solo players are bad, killers are mediocre and all SWF players are just god-like. So, why do you complain about SWF then? You are just bad, SWF players are just much more skilled. And as soon as a solo survivor starts playing SWF, he suddenly becomes god-like. That simple. Nice perverted logic right?
I remember the days when it was vice-versa, escape rate in soloQ was around 60-70%. After all nerfs, it is around 30% now, so it seems killers were just bad those days and suddenly became smart and all solo survivors became bad.
Killer logic, or the lack of hereof, is so hilarious sometimes.
I am a solo survivor, and i agree that most survivors are just bad.
I really belive that this game is not as much won by the killer as it is lost by survivors.
The quality of my matches on avarage gets way better once i hit red ranks after a reset, and i did have games with other solos where we beat really good killers. But there still a lot of potatoes in red ranks, and even one can ruin your match.
but i propose you see for yourself, and its actually quite easy to do that.
In every build you run for a time, use some kind of survivor information perk, be it kindred, bound, or whatever (although these are the best i think). Then take notice what your teammates do during the game.
I had games with 2 surviors in the basement pointing at each other for the whole time to take a gen from 0-100%, because they both wanted the basement chest.
The very last game i had there was a survivor that left the gen as soon as he heard the terror radius of the killer, even if he was in a chase some way of (and you could see it).
We all know the memes about locker dwaight and corner claudette, and while i encounter them way less than the meme suggests, they are there.
People running behind the killer with a flashlight half the game but not being able to make that flashlight save are not that uncommon.
And really, when i keep stats about my matches as solo survivor, i have an own category for gen allergics, because having 1-3 teammates that don´t touch gens (because that is boring) but hookfarm instead are common enough that its a category alongside dc´s and hook suicides.
It might depend on the region i play in (here in europe, with a lot of russians who are not always....teamplayers), but its still real.
-
@vvumper said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2307394#Comment_2307394
The gist is the same though. This game is a 1v4 and balance can't be thought of like a 5v5 or 1v1 game.
If Killer is too weak, then match making gets broken, too
Survivor has to be just slightly stronger, but not so much that no one plays killer. And that is a hard thing to balance
Every time the balance problem with swf comes up, a lot of people claim that its not about the advantage they have, just about playing with friends. If thats true, simply playing killer isn´t an option for them, and thus your theory would be false, seeing that at least 50% of games have some kind of swf in it. Also, SWF survivor is stronger than killer, and solo survivor can be if you get a decent team. Lets see what happens when matchmaking finally comes out.
-
Well, the map reworks did nerf the stealth aspect of the game. Autohaven, there is no way to juke the killer on a lof of tiles anymore because there is nothing where you could have gone except that one spot. The game has long loops with pallets, but a lot of the spaces are more open, see-through stairs and such, less possibility to hide.
So the maps didnt really change in side of survivors or killers, but they changed in favor of chases (which a lot of people claim is the only enjoyable thing in the game) but nerf stealth for both survivors and stealth killers.
-
Thats the reason a lot of killers that ignore part of the chase-mechanic are hated by survivors. They just take a lot of that power away from them.
-
@meatisadelicacy said:
I never cared that people DC'ed. I never card that people killed themselves on the first hook. I play less now since I might have to sit in a bad girl time out. If a game bans me from playing, I just don't play it. Especially one as unstable as this game is.
And thats a good thing. I rather play with someone that plays the game to the end instead of someone that dcs because the backround of the map doesn not match their choise of outfit.
-
@DuskMascato said:
So since DBD fixes everything besides their bugs that kick people out out and make them lose points I’m now a rank 9, I was a 4. I’m getting killers who either camp or tunnel. Is this the new strategy for people who suck? You get no points for camping and tunneling so why do it, it’s not fun for either.
No, its the old strategy for people who sucks, but it got a rise after the ds-change.
-
I just tell you how i handle it. As a survivor, i dont like farm games, i want the game over as fast as possible. I will try to play the game, and if my teammates give up, i hope to get the hatch. Farming makes me go afk, because its a waste of my time.
If i play killer, i try to decide: If the player dcéd because he was downed, tough luck. Your teammate left you after being outplayed, not my fault, blame him.
If it was a "real" dc, or at least i think (happening at the very start after loading in, or someone dcs that is in a safe spot while someone else is in a chase) then i will keep playing the game (without camping and tunneling), but i will make sure to never hook someone more than twice. After that, its the slug. If i get all 3 people down, at the same time, ready to hook, i just let them go and go afk so they can finish gens and go out.
The game is a lot more relaxed that way ^^.
-
@terminus345 said:
It's so funny to me how defensive a lot of people get in this forum when it's anything related to a killer being unfun. Everyone comes to the thread with tips on how to outplay by holding W or saying how weak he is stopping gens. Like cmon man, nobody cares about that, OP is not complaining that Nemesis is overpowered, OP is complaining that it is UNFUN being chased (yes, the main reason people play this game, the killer-survivor interaction) by this killer. Do not come in this thread, mention his 3-hit down first chase with each survivor, and think you're making a solid argument because you can extend a chase by just holding W. NOBODY LIKES JUST HOLDING W AND RUNNING STRAIGHT!
The 0.35 windup time on his whip is many times faster than Huntress or Pyramid head and boils down his playstyle into a situation where you just lose as a survivor and have zero input in the chase. You hug the loop until he gets close enough to raise his whip, you either drop the pallet and you get hit through it, or you don't drop it and he cancels and M1's you. This brainless chase repeats for windows as well, you can try to fake the window and get m1'd by him, or you can vault it and get whipped. But hey you can also pre-drop the pallet early before you get whipped, and have him zone you around the dropped loop (unless its a god pallet) until he can break the pallet instantly from any side he wants.
This is all that OP wanted to say, that it's just plain unfun. I've played many many matches against him, tried many tactics on loops, played against super sweaty tournament-practicing nemesis players and babies alike, and if they learned to abuse this playstyle it just becomes inevitable that you hold shift-W and don't try to loop anything and hope you run him away from any gens, or get to a super safe pallet you can pre-drop.
Ok, but chases are not the only killer-survivor interaction, and not all players play the game as a chase-simulator. For me, the stealth part is much more thrilling than just a simple chase where i run in circles and camp every palett. But i never saw a statistic on what people like about the game, so if you have one, i would like to see it.
That a vocal part of this forum prefer it, i know. But thats all data i have on the subject so far.
-
Also, i stoped playing today because i couldn´t get a single game that were played out, most of the time the first one to go down dcs, or killer dcs the moment he cant start or end a chase within 30 seconds.
I hope the people who want dc-penalties gone take notice.
-
@Jokersmile said:
There is so much to do as killer the match is intense from start to finish. When i play survivor its the same thing over and over not being chased work on a gen not unhooking work on a gen you can do totems if you want but always be doing gens
I think you must be doing it wrong (just like myself).
I play solo survivor, and i can tell you a lot of survivors are not doing gens at all....
-
@van9684 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/260253/dear-devs-stop-listening-to-otz
I agree. You won’t find honest discussion on here sadly. This is killer main central and they’ll gang up on you to say it’s your fault, your bad at the game, and statistics aren’t real. It’s every post but you’re right. Basing a game on the skill of a red rank dude who plays 8 hours a day is not healthy for the regular play base and it shows. Survivor sucks to play. It’s basically a kill simulator for killers now to get easy 4K games each round.
Statistics are real, but a lot of people dont know how to read and interpret them. Seen it many times on this very forum.
-
As a solo survivor main, i think noed is fine. It doing anything depends on the survivors doing nothing (except gens, and the occasional unhook).
Also, i think it is an option for an endgame perk. Noed with blood warden, remember me and others should be a thing. I mean, the killer played most of the game without perks in that scenario, on the chance to be op in the end and crush all hopes. Why not?
-
@LylakLavender said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2303793#Comment_2303793
It's not bait. I really honestly believed killers were OP. Since my son plays killer he told me to try out killer myself so I could see why he was always getting angry. So I took his advice. Nothing wrong with me wanting to try and get some perspective from the opposing side. Why do people feel the need to go off on anyone who tries something different.
Its always a good thing to get some perspective of the other side.
I am also a survivor main, but have played killer as well, but stopped after the mori change, because there was no way for me to handle swf anymore.
Sums it up nicley.
However, after 5k hours in the game, i finally come to the conclusion that killers actually can be op and oppressive. I am not the best of killers, but i got about 10-15 4ks in a row with the doctor, his calm-addons, the extended-tr-perk, and starstruck on "The game" (had so many map offerings). There was next to nothing the survivors could do, and i have no idea what i would have done. So for the first time i believe killer can be op (under certain circumstances)
-
Well, how would you estimate your kill rate? Since dev means a balanced game is about 50% kills and 50% escapes, keys become unfair if they drop you below that rate. if your kill rate is higher than 50%, you are carried by matchmaking anyway.
-
@smart212 said:
I think with all new reworked map, breakable walls really not helpful to killer, somehow this RNG breakable walls only be a burden to killer when we want to chase survivor. Indeed in chasing period, breakable walls only be a blocker and destroy tempo of killer ryhtm in chasing survivor
the breakable walls on the game make the map one whole deathtrap. I played several games with map offerings on the game, and got a 4k every game. there is noowhere to hide anymore, and with the breakable walls, nowhere to run.
-
I think it is already fixed. The killer does it all: Chasing, downing, hooking, damaging stuff, and thus he get points.
In a lot of my games, i get more points than the killer. But i do gens, unhook and heal, cleanse totems (i know, only very few people can do that, hence the many noed-threads), hidding next to the killer as well as being chased. Finally, escaping, and you have most likly more points than the killer. But you dont get that by only unhooking, or only chases, or only gens. And this is what a lot of survivors do.
-
@Tsulan said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2291980#Comment_2291980
At this point the offerings should be used after a match. So people can decide if its worth using BPS or a Cake or something instead of using one and feel like its wasted.
I really wouldn´t mind using BPS after a good match. So everyone can benefit from it.
So, if i see the killer is to fast, when do i use my hook offering to affect the game? Or if i dont like the map and would rather use a map offering? Or should we be able to use 2 offerings per game?
-
@Sluzzy said:
Why can killers gets a boatload of bloodpoints for playing like a douche but survivors can only get points if killers play in a nice and friendly manner? What is the point of survivors having options such as party streamers when it directly causes the killer to deny them? Every time there is more than one party streamer it is a large neon sign to the killer to slug everyone, camp, tunnel, etc. Just finished a match where the killer saw these offerings and he put on his mad angry cap and he actually got 26K and survivors about 5K-10K each. This is wrong. Bloodpoints should re-evaluated. Perhaps bloodpoints should be removed from the killer when they play in such a way so it promotes gameplay.
They dont. I have tons of games where i have more bloodpoints than the killer. But its not enough to just hide and doing those gens as fast as possible, you have to play a little more of the game.
-
As a solo survivor main: Bones are not that hard to do, and not even hard to find, even without perks. There are 2 maps where they can really hurt you if they got a good totem placement, but mostly, its no problem. Survivors just dont want to invest time to do them, even if you see them just running in circles in the basement and pointing at each other instead.
-
@gammatsunami said:
I just played pig for the first time. I got 1 kill, they got down to 1 gen left to go, all 3 just left via hatch.
All red rank, they brought the key and all got more bloodpoints than me.
How the ######### has it not been changed yet, when moris have been made useless.
Make it so theres an animation to leave the hatch, or only 1 can go
really? Your issues are the key, when you should never have faced red ranks with a new killer anyway? Yeah, keys are the issue, not matchmaking.
-
@coaltrain503 said:
Why do people think it’s funny for survivors to be toxic, but it killers? Why do people watch survivors acting toxic, or even act toxic themselves, and think it’s the funniest #########? But as soon as a killer starts being toxic, everyone gets all butthurt and hurls insults at them telling them how much of a toxic piece of ######### they are? Why is it funny one way, and not the other?
Well, i am part of the community, and i dont think any toxic behaviour is funny, its rude and disrespectful to your fellow gamers, no matter which side is toxic. So maybe the premise of your question is wrong?
-
@bibibib8 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2288768#Comment_2288768
Separating solo and swf is not a good idea honestly i dont know any killer who is massochist enough to go in the swf queue unless they are nurse main
And why not? The ability to balance the killers advantages and disadvantages vs swf is the whole point of the seperation, so you can have fair games vs swf that are not very much harder than vs solo. For killers it would be the choice between a fair game with a lower killer powerlevel or a fair game with a higher killer powerlevel, the higher powerlevel balancing the swf advantages. So why wouldn´t killer go against swf if they can get a fair match there?
-
@Vetrathene said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2288751#Comment_2288751
Cool, then what would you do? because your not given constructive criticism, just criticism.
Easy, i would make a working matchmaking, and then balance according to the data i gather then.
Also i would seperate swf from solo queue, because thats the biggest balancing issue in the game. By seperating them, you could balance them individually, making both modes fair.
But both is probably not going to happen.
-
@Vetrathene said:
Give all of them bloodlust immediatly upon getting a survivor in chase. That way patrolling and movement across the map is the same, but chases will be shorter and give the killer more time to pressure and play the game. It will make it so survivor is the bit harder it needs to be, and killer is the bit easier it needs to be. It also prevents forcing survivors to spend more boring time on gens, and gives a buff to stealth gameplay as well.
As i see it, it might make stealth more important, but how does it buff it? The map reworks just left areas without any hidding spot, how does ending chases faster buff that?
Also, ending chases faster gives the killer more time to wait out a camp, or makes tunneling more effective, if he decides to not pressure and play the game. How would you counteract that?
At best, its not well thought out.
-
But the game is based around the advantages and disadvantages of the killers. If you improve one of killers disadvantages, and thus making them better at finding hidden survivor, how would you compensate this disadvantage to survivors?
Also, just comparing this game to others doesnt help also. In other games, movement speed is mostly the same. Should survivors now move as fast as killers? I mean, its the same reasoning.
-
@assassin_princess said:
Is this the end of the road for me and Dead by Daylight? For years I backed DBD saying this is the game to watch. The POTENTIAL this game had...
Over the years I saw all my favourite streamers start leaving dbd... and today I understand why...
As a 50/50 survivor/killer main. This game does not give me any feeling of fun or excitement while playing as survivor. In the 4 days winning like what...5 games? Being tunneled from 1st hook to final. Being camped in basements. Killers getting a hit on me after I have fallen half a story after vaulting the 1st floor window.. Getting hit through pallets...
But ... wow. My nights usually ended with a "let's play one more to end on a good note" to just everyone deciding to call it the night to avoid getting upset about how killers are and can play these days...
Nemisis dropped 4 days ago. How could the game allow a trial to practically just be "running simulator?". Taking away survivors' only form of defense by being hit over a pallette? Then why is it even there?! If you are lucky enough to escape the pallette situation with a survivor perk that not everyone even runs then you get hit through the window. Able to use stealth to get away? Here, cough loud AF to make the killer turn straight around and down you! Able to get away? NO PROBLEM, here is a zombie, A ZOMBIE to down you!
Survivors can't do anything anymore to defend themselves from killers in the trial anymore. Like seriously then, just remove windows and pallettes all together cause they don't provide any sort of protection against the killer.
I still play killer and let a person escape through hatch almost every single game. As killer you don't have to worry you can catch them at any pallete, down them through any window... how is that fun?
Or now you don't even have to worry about certain survivors cause they will most likely get downed by a zombie.
Dead by Daylight. Don't just hear the cries... ACKNOWLEDGE THEM! How long will you go on knowing how much problems this game has. STOP adding unneccesary things like zombies and spend your time fixing the problems that are already there! We will take being able to play the game fairly much more than over 2 new survivors.
But for now... R.I.P, DBD . What is the use a game that only caters to 50% of their audience and let the rest just be constantly dissapointed and upset by the end of the day?
The recent map reworks also were a big nerf on stealth gameplay for survivors.
-
@Ink_Eyes said:
Not really, the average SWF teams out there are mostly casual players who just want to play with their friends but most of them lack experience and skill, the only reason why teams like oracle are able to do this is not only because they are playing on a SWF team but also because we are talking about some of the best players out there, players who refine and polish their strategy to the maximum by playing lots of games, they practice their strategy hundreds of times, most top players have thousands of hours of play time under their belt, a regular and average SWF team will never be this efficient (most players don't even have a third of play time hours as a top tournament player, I have seen people who have played for a year and are still below 700 hours of play time while a top player probably plays 400 hours+ a month) so comparing them is not really a good argument, I'm not saying that a regular/average SWF team donesn't have any advantages at all but they will never be as efficient as top tournament players, saying that a SWF is always gonna be better than the killer is just not always gonna be the case.
Average SWF teams are casual players who play a few times a week, and most of them play with the intention of just laughing together while playing, not with the intention of getting better at the game nor polish their strategy or become efficient, this argument only works for top tournament players most of the times and no one else.
You say we should not compare those swf and players to regular ones, yet in every nerf spirit-thread they just talk about the top spirits with 2k $ headphones. The average spirit is never the point in those threads, and i really think we have to use the same metric for all aspects of the game, not just for one side, whichever metric we chose.
-
Well, yes, i have. But i was playing killer only 30% of my time anyway. And a key nerf havn´t happen yet, it might take 2 years and then they nerf them without further notice, and it would be just the same.
-
@Sophrosynes said:
Three games in a row when survivors have multiple keys. Why? Incompetence. Moris had a surprise nerf, thats fair I don't care, but what I am upset with is the blatant announcement of "keys are next hur durr". Survivors are using all of their keys. Its fine, we got Franklin's Demise.
Time passes and Resident Evil chapter is on the PTB. Wow, Nemesis, syringes, flashbangs, how cool. Can't wait for June 15. The time comes and console players suffer, the game crashes sometimes and they disabled the new map. Typical Behavior, nothing we can do. I play nemesis, and I see 3 key users. After promptly losing, I take a break. Watch a Scott Jund video, turns out Franklin's was nerfed. What?
I play a new game. 2 keys, I equip Franklin's. Still lost, why? Thanks to behaviors fantastic intuition, instead of fixing the code for syringes, they nerf Franklin's. Why? I just lost 3 games with keys, moris and Franklin's nerfed, my games are infested with keys.
Lost every single one because even if I tunnel, either they pick it up or another person has another key. Why are killers forced to deal with this? Why did moris get surprise nerfs yet announce key nerfs? Survivors bully killers and killers are forced to deal with it? Why do you think survivor queue times are long? How is this fair?
The mori nerf was announced the same way as the key nerf. I needed months to use up all my moris, and i simply used them every game...
Keys on itself are fine for me (but then, i am a survivor main anyway, but i still dont care if i play killer)
The franklins nerf, however, was really unneeded. It was a good way to handle keys, and is now gone for no reason.
If i bring a key as survivor, i dont switch it in last second, i always display it from the start. I think killers need the time and strategie to prepare, and if its worth to someone to bring one or two perks just for that, its their decission. Its just part of fairness, to me at least.
-
@Marik13 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2278783#Comment_2278783
Hey. You still haven't answered my question that I asked twice now. I've been trying to appeal to your survivor bias and prove that you're not a troll but every time I ask what you think of my changes you never answer. 🙃
Also in general, are we comparing the old state of moris vs the current state of keys? Or the current moris to current keys, because the two are not comparable at all... Old moris, yes those were nerfed and rightfully so. But current moris don't really serve a purpose outside of seeing a cool animation kill.
Current moris the killer needs to still get someone to death hook, so at that point whether by hook or mori, you're dead regardless. Hell, sometimes hooking is actually better than using a mori depending on the killer. Some killers have really long animations for their moris to where you'd be saving time just hooking them to kill them. So yeah I'm a little confused on where this comparison is coming from...
In my opinion, while moris needed to change, they overdid it, since yes, moris are basicly useless, outside of maybe avoiding a ds of flashlight save.
But before the nerf, whenever someone asked for one, the response was "but what about keys", and thus people though it might be an adequate compatision, which i hopefully showed why its not.
One problem with the mori change was never adressed though, the fact that some killers needed them to keep up with swf.
But then, in this regards, keys are a little similar, because between Dcs, suicides and tunneling killers, solo survivors need a reason to keep going when the first survivor is out due to one of that reasons, and to me, hatch and keys are that reason.
-
@MrPenguin said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2276407#Comment_2276407
What don't they understand exactly that leads to them being incomparable? They both ends games early and skip part of their sides objectives.
One lets you kill survivors since thats the killers objective, one lets you escape because thats the survivors objective, both end the objective prematurely.
What's this fundamental difference?
@Pulsar said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2276401#Comment_2276401
Both end the game prematurely and both are essentially uncounterable.
A mori has the power to shape the game, which is something a key cannot do.
An old mori could come into play very soon, usually due to tunneling someone of the hook. That turned a game, designed to be 4v1, into a 3v1 before it would normaly happen, often before more than one or maybe two gens were done, thus changing the game dynamic in favor of the killer. From the moment of its use, the mori itself determined the outcome of the game in most cases, turning a game into a 3 or 4kill that without it might not have been happening.
Now look at the 2 extreme cases of a key, a 1 and a 4 key escape.
For a 1 escape to happen, all other survivors have been dead already, so up to the point the key actually comes into play, it was a normal play, and afterwards, its just over.
the same is true for a 4 escape (outside of a few rare cases where killers have and endgame build around blood warden and such), the key only comes into play after a normal game, when all gens are done, and the game is close to its end anyway.
Unlike a mori, the key didnt change the games here in any way.
The only part where a key can change the game is a 2 and 3 people escape. But again, the key doesnt shape these games, because gens still need to be done, so even in those cases (at least 4 gens done and one player dead or at least 3 gens done and 2 survivors dead) the game is further progessed normaly than it would be when an old mori was involved. Also, keys dont have the power to turn a lost game into a win, they just allow you to escape while still losing.
Thats why i dont think they are comparable. Old mori would best be compared with old brand new part, where (at least so i have heard, i didnt play back then) you could basicly skip doing gens and derailing it the same way.
Also, we know keys only account for about 3% of escapes, but i would bet that old moris accounted for a higher kill rate than that.
So summit: Old moris shaped games early on by forcing it into a state it didnt belong to, while keys only do something in the end when most of the game is already done.
-
@MrPenguin said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2275226#Comment_2275226
Well no one was talking about camping, tunneling, or NoED until you decided to.
The response was fair to your "You don’t nerf one sides toxic mechanic without nerfing the other sides too", especially since we're talking about keys, and Keys and Mori's were/are seen as equivalent for their respective sides.
You know what isn't seen as having much of anything to do with keys by the vast majority? Tunneling, camping, and NoED.
Yes, they are seen as equivalent because a lot of people dont understand the fundamental difference between the two.
-
@Pulsar said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2275197#Comment_2275197
They already nerfed mori's!
But comparing keys to moris doesnt do justice to any of them, because they do completly different things, and thus have a very different impact on the game.
-
Only it is not camping, is it? Someone rushes in before you leave, you are in a chase, thats not camping at all.
-
I think the buff to lucky break was needed.
The revert-change to franklins, however, was not.
Dont get me wrong, i play solo survivor, and between suicided, dcs and tunneling killers i love my keys. But the killer gives up a perkslot for that, and i think it was just fine.
-
@Ruma said:
Tell me why. Why tf do you unhook me, the killer on your butt. You unhook me, instantly deadhard so the killer downs me again? Why even unhook me then? I see this stuff so many times, i am tired.
Only time i do this is because kindred shows i am the only one around and you are about to change hookstates anyway.
Sorry dude, i didnt know that ghostface/pig/wraith was just hidding there, but i can just let you die next time if you wish.
-
Plague and PHead dont oneshot healthy rescuers, though. Oni, you might be right, if he fullfills the condition (but to be fair, its completly in his own hands)