snozer
snozer
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@PigMainClaudette said:
I've asked before because 90% of the time I get chainsawed is in an area where there is no counterplay. Especially with Insta-saw or Drift King builds.
It might be because I faced way more who simply relied on the saw, rather than any actual skill. It's like I said in my own thread about this subject. Hillbilly and Leatherface, as in 2/19 killers, have an easy instant down mechanic that requires basically no skill to use. Leatherface has broken hitboxes on terrain, especially compared to how he can hit a survivor, but that's a different topic.
Hillbilly does have nice mobility and map pressure, and there are some instances where I can accept a saw. But as a whole, too many Hillbillies I face rely too heavily on the saw and start it in areas that any other killer would be thankful for a basic hit.
If he is able to chainsaw you around a loop, that is on you for being greedy.
If he catches you out of position, YOU made the mistake and for once YOU are punished for it.
He has zero ability to land a chainsaw from a distance unless you are a potato.
Tired of survivors wanting to sleep during the game and have zero threats...
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@PistolTimb said:
Bhvr will likely change Billy's (Leatherface's as well) addons at some point to make them more consistent with other killer addons. He has no iridescent addons and not enough purples if my numbers are right. Billy's base kit is balanced and shouldn't be changed, but nurse base kit was balanced as well and they changed it for some reason. Hopefully whatever they do with him doesn't reduce his power while simultaneously giving him more build variety with addons.
Nurse got less build variety, not more.
Charge reduction addons or nothing.
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Tru3 has a vid somewhere showing how broken toolboxes are.. a single commodious toolbox with socket and prove thy self got a gen from 0-100 in 25 seconds and it has enough charge to do 3 gens like that...
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@Hellbughunter said:
The problem i see with the archives is the comunity.
When the devs make the challanges short there to short, when they make them take longer there to long, you can't have gens cause that incurages gen rushing, you can't have unhooks cause that incurages bt hook farming, you can't have pallet while being chased because that incurages throwing the game by throwing all pallets instantly when chased, you can't just be chased cause then nobody would do the objectiv and would just try to get the killers atention, you can't have blinding because that incurages toxicness, but it also can't be something to specivic to not get done in a match.
But what else could you do? The real problems with the archives is a comunity that can't let these challanges happen naturally instead having to force them threw as fast as possible.
Why shouldn't we encourage gen rushing?
Are the devs scared to show the true balance in this game?
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Simple answer is none.
All killers are being dragged down to wraith and trapper level,
But hey, a chart combining all platforms with zero context and released during an event, shows that all killers are OvErpeRf0RmINg
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@Mister_Holdout said:
DS is one perk lol.
Can i have a perk that randomly downs each survivor once during the game?
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@FriendlyGuy said:
And that's why keys need a major nerf. If you three genned yourself, you shouldn't get an escape without some effort.
3 gen can happen from the literal start of the game. The killer just needs to ignore all chases and slowly clear the area around the gens they are protecting and it is no different to having 5 gens left or just the 3 that they are protecting.
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If you want solo on the same level as swf then this needs to happen
All these perks at base level
bond, empathy, OoO, kindred, dark sense,Alert, Premonition, spine chill, Windows of opportunity.
Add this to base survivor:
Traps and totems light up for all survivors when seen or touched.
Remove or make a new perk or re-balance as they will be useless:
Knockout, All hex perks,
Add quick chat bubbles with phrases like
"i am being chased"
"i am not being chased"
"help me"
"shack"
"harvester"
"basement"
"i have found"
etc.
If solo survivors are to be the same strength as swf, then all of this must be done to compare.
None of this will happen as killers will be destroyed, and bhvr knows it. It is already in the game
"but it doesn't happen every game so deal with it"
"not everyone plays like this so deal with it"
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@immortalls96 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/866095#Comment_866095
While the changes to spirit were well handled so far as I can tell there are also many people who have stated reasons why the nurse base kit change was not necessary or wanted..yet they are met with silence..it kind of feels like THOSE are not being taken seriously...
Nothing will be done to nurse because killers don't matter, and survivors stopped complaining (sign that the killer is weak)
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just make it so struggle is automatic with no imput from the survivor, Easy solution
But nah, we are talking about survivors and bhvr here, they will do some stupid and convoluted system to "fix" the problem
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@anarchy753 said:
She's fine with me. I'm a pretty casual Nurse player and still managed to whip out a 4k on blood lodge with brown add ons, including her flannel just to see how it worked.
It was good fun.
At this point it's just people protesting that they DARED touch their overpowered win-stick.
So i guess wraith is fine and leatherface to? i get a random 4k on them as well.
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Head on requires reaching a locker.
Decisive punishes a killer for survivors stupidity(running into the killer by accident after being unhooked), or can be used as a weapon, because you are essentially untouchable for 1 minute, and can do whatever you want (unhook in killers face with bt) (body block for a friend)
It needs to deactivate if the killer hooks someone else, they are not tunneling if this happens.
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@Peanits said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/852656#Comment_852656
I don't know if we'd be able to go into details like add-ons, perks, items, offerings on each killer. That would be a ton of data to try to squeeze into a graph (each of the 17 killers have ~20 offerings alone). We'd probably stay away from survivor usage as well since they're purely cosmetic. Perk usage across the board might be nice, though.
Add-ons are important tho. The way you guys currently balance killers is centered around taking specific add-ons or being a walk in the park for survivors if they don't.
Most of the complaints around nurse were because of add-ons and you nerfed her because of the "lack of fun" that these add-ons caused.
Even now survivors still say the nerf was justified and start talking about her old add-ons, forgetting you butchered her base kit too.
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easy to do, but to lazy? or are they scared that it will show the true balance in this game?
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All they need to do is buff solo survivors and balance around that.
Remove bond empathy etc and just give that to solo players at base level. swf don't need these perks so it doesn't matter if they are removed from the game.
Another suggestion that they really need to do is a quick chat system with basic lines like "killer is chasing me" etc.
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Where are people getting this idea that nurse is still the strongest killer in the game?
To determine this bs statement, you need to actually play against a nurse to begin with. From what i have seen playing survivor the past 2 resets, NOBODY PLAYS HER.
I have had a total of 2 games against nurse since her nerf and we destroyed her as solo survivors.
she is to slow and has no map pressure. They will never change her, because they made addons that interact with the base kit nerf, and probably can't be bothered to do anything else because survivors have stopped complaining.
SURVIVORS HAVE STOPPED COMPLAINING. This alone proves that she has been destroyed.
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@supersonic853 said:
Decided to take a break with legion and came back and realized just how behind legion is when it comes to other killers, other killers have their own way of dealing with survivors. The 2 chainsaw users every killer except legion can use noed michael has tier 3 oni has his thing. Legion...just kinda lacks any down potential because all his power really does is smack you and thats it i go to get the other survivor and the other surviors mended or healed by that point. And the other killers that dont have down potential have other things that make them good. Freddy puts people into the dream realm every 30 seconds which depending on the addon can be really good And can tp to gens. Trapper catches survivors in his traps then kinda just walks up to them and smacks them or has the addon. Huntress can snipe you and hag has her traps. Not to mention ff itself is kinda a joke like i miss or the power runs out im stunned for 4 seconds...are you serious on top of the already having to wait every 20 seconds for the power. I wasnt really that active when he was reworked so can someone let me know what they were trying to go for with him? Also any suggestions is appreciated on how to play him better hes definitely confusing.
They wanted to delete him from the game without having to give a refund, so they just made him useless.
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@Th3Nightmare said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/856028#Comment_856028
gen rush? I think there are many complaints about the gen rush but 0 news about that :D
It only applies to the side that buys the most cosmetics.
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@Zoldyar said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/850144#Comment_850144
I don't know if the link I sent you is the same as the one it is now. But if it is then the video just proves that the nurse is capable of catching up to any surivior regardless of how far they are. So the point of a surivior simply running in a straight line isn't valid. A surivior can run in a straight line against any killer and still make a far enough distance to make it to another loop.
She is unfun, but she isn't weak and her counter play isn't running in a straight line.
The surivior would have already been in a far enough distance to where the nurse would have to used alot of blinks. Just like every other killer trying to catch up to a surivior in a chase. For example, each blink the nurse has can cover 13.33 m/s, but the trapper moves at 4.5m/s. Obviosuly including the fatigue and e.t.c she would still be going around the same speed rate as the trapper when using no add on. So once again, she would still be moving faster than a surivior with her blink.
Now find a video that ads walls and rocks/trees between you and the survivor and see if 4 blinks will reach them, TLDR it won't as nurse now has a tendency to short blink rather than go through the wall or rock that they should have.
The very fact that you need 4+ blinks to catch up to a survivor who is running in a straight line destroys all arguments you can come up with, as that is TIME WASTED that should not have been wasted on something so simple. This is the problem, her nerf has obliterated her map control. She can't defend anything because she is so damn slow now, and large maps make the issue even worse.
She can't chase. She can't defend, She can't patrol gens.
The nurse is dead.
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@oxygen said:
Things on both sides tend to get nerfed when there's massive complaints about it.
Nurse has always had people criticizing her, Spirit has had it for a while. DS always had controversy around it and got nerfed, MoM had overwhelming controversy around it (for good reason) and got nerfed. Balanced Landing hasn't had nearly as much complaints directed at it in comparison and that also got nerfed.
It happens, but it's not an automatic thing. If stuff just got nerfed if complaints reached a certain point, don't you think camping and tunneling would've been made mechanically impossible to do ages ago? Same for SWF. The devs don't just go "if complaints are greater than this arbitrary number, nerf it"
camping:
Borrowed time, hook swivel, tweaked decisive strike (stronger than last iteration)
Decisive strike:
They tweaked it to a perk that is highly abusable. we went from everyone can jump off, to the obsession can jump off the killer and the others need to wiggle a little,
and now we are back to everyone can jump off and are a god for 1 minute who can force undeserved saves and abuse the killer with no fear
They didn't nerf decisive strike, and they have been bending to survivors cries about camping and tunneling.
An overwhelming amount of people said to just nerf nurses addons, they ignored everything and destroyed her base kit to the point that even the best addons can't even get you to that level.
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@steezo_de said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/846898#Comment_846898
Fragile Wheeze/Dark Cincture or any combination of that and Ataxic or CBT is where it's at and gave me very good results-- I won almost all of the games I played last night and tonight. I did get a 0k and that was because I brought myself to Lery's and used Anxious Gasp and Bad Man Keepsake, then went all-in with the slugs because I wanted to gamble against a guaranteed 2k. Range add-ons seemed good as well.
The biggest issue I had was with some dedicated server BS and a couple times when I couldn't use my 2nd blink. Not sure what that was about. At least the warping is gone.
I won't argue with someone that says she's not as fun as before, but she's still feels like the best killer to me.
This is the problem tho
Being FORCED to use a green and yellow addon every single game just to have a chance against basic survivors.
Balancing killers around addons that they will not have every game, and making them an easy pushover without the best specific addons, is wrong.
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@immortalls96 said:
Made a whole post explaining how not only does she feel clunky and like survivors are getting a handout in chase , the devs also failed to achieve the goals they claimed to us to be their intention..diversify nurses play styles? Great..if you dont run at least 1 cd addon good survivors will bury you..oh and they nerfed them hard before release ,/ you know, just in case you could feel ok enough with 1..Didnt want to hurt nurses play rate? Shes not only even harder than before but they slammed a heavy limit on her power with this change..you know they overdid it when using two addons cant even get you base nurse
Survivors memed about 1 blink nurse, BHVR took it seriously.
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@PickCollins said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/845961#Comment_845961
A killer should not only be fun if you have the right addons.
This is the problem, they made addons specifically around the nerf to force you to use addons.
They will never change her because it requires making new addons, and thus more time spent doing something they should be doing, instead of making cosmetics and thinking of rift challenges.
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@DevourOfSalt said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/841753#Comment_841753
I feel same way im trying keep a post about nurse high so maybe a dev could respond gives us some peace of mind if she had chance to get basekit change back or is she a lost cause.
Its all i want is a response. A simple yes we might change it back or a no so i can stop torturing myself try play her. I love nurse but the way she is, is pretty bad and not enjoyable to play.
The survivors wanted the nerf and survivors LIKE the nerf. this is all that matters to the devs as survivors are the cash cows, or as the industry calls them "whales" and they just disconnect against anything they hate until it is removed or nerfed.
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@Fibijean said:
I'm not a Nurse main. I'm not even a killer main. I've barely played her. But it sounds like the rework changed her kit pretty significantly. Is it possible that part of the reason she seems so weak currently is because people who have gotten used to how she plays, who have developed that inbuilt muscle memory or second nature or whatever you want to call it, are naturally having trouble adjusting to a new playstyle with her?
Yes, she's weaker, but maybe she's not as weak as she seems. Perhaps she can become a solid high tier, if not top tier, killer again simply by giving her some time to get used to.
She has a physical limit to her ability..
Her map pressure (ability to patrol ) is a fraction of what it use to be making large maps an automatic loss
The best addons do not even bring her back to old base nurse level.
Survivors can see where she is going to blink to and counter move her every time
dedicated servers are messing with her lunge and movement.
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@kate_best_girl said:
Lemme just say, as someone who plays on ALL systems except switch, its gotten better you just dont notice. Things like Nurse going to 15 FPS when blinking happens so little if at all anymore, Clown can throw bottles without extreme lag at first now, doctor no longer lags as well. The changes are big yet minor and also subtle.
It got worse on pc, i was able to get a solid 144 fps at 1440p on low detail, now i struggle for 120-130 fps
They are making things worse.
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@GrootDude said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/841686#Comment_841686
Because those go away mid-game. Unless you want Medkits, toolboxes and maps to last all game? Also, these items can be temporarily removed with a perk.
but the damage they inflict is equal or currently greater then what a killers addons can do. a commodious toolbox with addons is 2x 50 second generators solo. One survivor with that essentially removes a generator from the game.
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@xllxENIGMAxllx said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/841548#Comment_841548
Such a powerful killer that everyone make it weaker than she is. I mean sure she's weaker than before but at right hand you are still as strong as before. Add-ons are here to be used and old nurse no one were using them. Sure except omega blink and thousand blink combo but overall all good nurse weren't using any. How is that normal no one should play against the best players and win with base kit.
However i'm not happy with base kit change but could have been way worse. Sensitivity and framerate and why nurse is so unplayable. As a nurse main on PS4 i still 4k with her at red ranks just not against the best teams because my skill is not that high.
Why the double standard?
Why should survivors be viable without being forced to use toolboxes or medkits?
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It is a good life lesson to people who spent cash on something they shouldn't have. Perhaps they will learn from their stupidity and never do it again.
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Let me guess, you paid for your cosmetics, and you are salty and want everyone else to pay as well?
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You didn't even earn them, they were randomly given out by streamers to people...
You got to PAX to see the games and meet the people, not for a skin.
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We already know tome 4 is impossible, so why does it matter?
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@Endstille said:
Well counterplay to nurse has been reduced to run in a straight line away from it.
Honestly, I read this a couple of times on the forums, so I did have to test it. Yesterday I went into Custom Game with a friend, we picked thompson's house for a test run.
So yeah you will not be able to catch up to a survivor, no matter if you blink once or twice you can simply outrun the nurse. Should you not get a hit by the end, you would have to do the whole thing again. How is this considered balanced or fun @Peanits ?
So for testing purposes we took the wall right next to the house which is basicly a big straight line without any LoS blockers, without something blocking the way of the survivor or the nurse. I had no idea it was actually this bad.
How to catch up? Use an ultra rare oof.
It is fun for the survivor, the whales of dbd, and that is all that matters.
You need to remember that they are balancing around "fun" (disconnects) and will nerf anything that has a low "fun" (high disconect) ratio.
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@Peanits said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/818226#Comment_818226
Coincidentally, she also happens to average three kills per game if not higher (with the target being two kills two escape). Fun is definitely a factor, but not the only thing that's considered. A game is meant to be fun though, advocating for not making the game fun is a hard sell.
If the game is balanced around 2 kills and 2 survive, then why did i just kill 3 survivors (3 hooks each) with the last survivor on death hook, and still black pip?
I did nothing but chase- hit- kick gens all game and still did not earn a pip with 3 dead!@!#
your pip system is broken and needs a gigantic revamp if you want us to believe that the game is balanced around 2 die 2 survive, when the game its self is literally telling us that it is not.
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@Peanits said:
To say that nobody asked for changes is objectively untrue. It doesn't take much searching to find a whole trove of videos, threads, and comments about The Spirit. I think you're missing the point of the argument, it's very rarely about how powerful she is, it's about not being fun to play against. You cannot tell someone that they're having fun when they're not, that's not up to you to decide.
If you want to argue that a video game shouldn't be fun to play, I'm not sure what to say at that point.
this is the second time you have essentially admitted to balancing around disconnects ("fun")
So are you condoning killers to instantly disconnect from haddonfield and swf groups until you change that? i mean they are not "fun" either.
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@TruEternity said:
I feel the only real loss was her control on larger maps, which is fine. She has potential to end chases very quickly due to avoiding what other killers have to be aware of. I feel she’s on par with Huntress now, still good, just struggles a bit on larger maps.
I will say though, half her new add ons are terrible, and I really don’t know why they exist. Like why do I want more bp for blinking through someone? Or lose the ability to blink and become man with a machete, just why?
and the other half just make up for base kit nerf so.. still disgustingly terrible. None of her addons are actually good.
What we really need is to increase repair time to make toolboxes mandatory, then we need to make it so survivor items and addons are single use only. Survivors should require addons to beat top tier killers, just to be fair and balanced.
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They killed allot of things, many rooftop jumps or ramp jumps have had invisible walls placed on them so you can't leap off them and catch survivors with billy or demo. Got to keep survivors as the power roll i guess....the cash shop demands it.
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rank?
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@Aven_Fallen said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/821330#Comment_821330
Will be my last post, because it is too dumb for me to argue here:
If you really take 5x80 seconds aka 400 seconds aka almost 7 minutes to Catch one Survivor with two others on Exhaustion after using Head On, you are just bad and Head On is no problem.
Once again: Its a gimmicky Perk and nowhere near as strong as the Metaperks.
Just like OoO is a gimmick, but swf sure can abuse that perk.
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@Irisora said:
Omg so i tried her just today and they trashed her so bad. Right now every other killer is better than her in my opinion. Ill add to this that i played her most of my 1500h hours in the game so im not new to her.
Im playing in rank 1-2:
I tried several new addons combinations and her base kit and... god those addons... are SO bad. How could it be possible to worse her addons even more? Im surprised they could manage to do that...
The only way i could play/"enjoy her"(not really) and not get 4 escapes or just 1 kill was using "spasmodic breath" wich gives you 4.6 speed after a hit with blink and chase like a normal killer wich compared to the old nurse this sucks.
Her addons sucks. Im pretty sure they nerfed her blink lunge, its so short that is ridiculous, and not happy with that you have to wait for blink charges. Im on pc and this change is terrible so i can imagine literaly no one will play her on console.
And now no one will play her in pc either. Im not playing her anymore until they change this. And also not supporting this guys with the buy of new rift passes/skin. Im very dissapointed.
I watched the scott jund vid and his blinks and lunge are FAR longer then what i am getting in game right now.
Either his house is parked directly on the server or i don't know.. The post blink lunge is literally half of what is in the vod.
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no killer should require add-ons, just like survivors don't require add-ons to win -.-
If you want it to be fair we need to make gens take 3 minutes each to do so you NEED a toolbox to stand a chance. and that toolbox will only last one game no matter what.
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Bring it on, nerf them all, spirit, billy, freddy, wraith. make them all equally terrible so we can kill this game 2 years early.
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@prettyf said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/817047#Comment_817047
most people in dbd not reached theoretical skill cap of nurse but they, no, we all killed most rounds and we all knew it
so nurse "main" players, they never had chance to test how decently skilled before this nerf
because it didn't matter before, personally i did all killed like 90% after 5h practice of nurse
now i don't think that easy but still thinking better than spirit but, much harder than spirit
this is better than billy vs spirit, because billy is harder than spirit but weaker than spirit
so i think nurse became fair right now
remember this question
what killer viable without addons?
The answer is that ALL killers should be viable, without being forced to used single use items.
How about we make toolboxes, or survivor add-ons, single use too? and then gimp the ever living hell out of repair speed so you REQUIRE a toolbox to have a chance.
Seems fair to me
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You can literally run from one side of the map to the other in a straight line before the nurse can catch up... this is without the speed boost from being hit.
She is dead against competent survivors.
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Or they could make his vault fast and frenzy a decent speed again since his power can't kill a fly.... but nah... survivors wil go WAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA! I AM NOT BUYING COSMETTICS WAAAAAAAAAA......
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@Entity_Burger said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/804664#Comment_804664
Play a match. Watch youtubers play; every match is 3-5 minutes these days.
Now look at every nerfed Killer; every one had some form of map pressure or perks/addons that could slow down the game.
NOW look at every perk or addon of Killer Survivors whine about: Again; it's the ones that can slow gen repair speed, or apply map pressure. Nurse was just beat to death. Legion was turned into a complete trash joke. Yes, he had bugs that needed fixing, but it was not bug fixes that turned FF into a power that does nothing. Spirit is being looked at for having map pressure. Hillbilly will be 'looked at' soon..because he has map pressure.
Survivors also whine nonstop about the Freddy addons that slow down the game. They also whine about NoED because, of course, they want to do gens in 3 minutes, ignoring bones, and not be punished for it.
Survivors also claim genrushing is fine while Survivor-Rushing (Tunneling) is unfair. They outright believe that doing 5 gens in 3 minutes is fine, but a Killer going after a wounded Survivor needs a punishment.
The Survivor bias is insanely obvious. Doing gens fast is 'just gameplay'. Killing Survivors fast is 'unfair', 'unfun', 'cheap', 'needs a punishment', etc.
And every time the Devs completely slaughter a Killer to ensure this status quo, they are proving that they feel the same way.
Survivors are the cash cow of the game, and the devs are going to ride them as hard as they can before the ship sinks.
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@Guertena said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/811651#Comment_811651
it already does i guess. flashlight and pallet saves, get someone off a trap too i remember i saved someone from a trap and got a token i was like hell yeah
The problem is that these are all random chance situations that only show up once in a blue moon, there is no consistency. They are also still forcing you to compete with other survivors to get it.
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@[Deleted User] said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/101583/wglf-buff-needed
Umm, protection hits!
And there are a few ways to get them.
But adding flashlight saves to get tokens might be a nice touch
Or how about something that doesn't involve standing in the killers face and t bagging?
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Use her without addons to see her true power.