radiantHero23
radiantHero23
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- radiantHero23
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@GeneralV said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3692205#Comment_3692205
Unfortunately it seems none of the modifiers will be permanent, at least for now, but I know I would love 2v8 while it lasted!
Just imagine the possibilities, my friend.
Freddy & Piggy team up.
🔥🐽🔥
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@Atsuka_Anarchy said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3691970#Comment_3691970
Oooh nice! I want! 🤩 I’m doing pretty piggly wiggly lately, so far so good.
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3692094#Comment_3692094
Platinum??? 😮
I can share some pictures when it arrives.
Otherwise I'm on my second playthrough of Elden ring in ng+. Everything fine with the exception of one swordswoman.
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Alive and well. Recently ordered a custom Piggy charm plush with a detachable mask.
These are all the Piggy news from my part.
💎🐽💎
How are you doing?
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@Deathstroke said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3691026#Comment_3691026
Xbox count entity sacrifises, escapes, playtime and bp earnings stats so those stats I like to see increased as long time goal. I know not many cares but I love stats so there is that. It's same thing as some grind to get P100 characters to me. I aim for 10K sacrifise total and 1 billion bp earned.
Thanks for clarifying. Keep it up.
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@GeneralV said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3690791#Comment_3690791
Everything this flawless map had:
https://us.v-cdn.net/6030815/uploads/H17AGMQP0SI8/image.png
In all seriousness, though: the older a tile is, the more potential it has for mindgames.
For the most part, I agree.
Some main buildings and old coldwind jungly gyms are the exception, but main buildings arent really tiles.
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@baharuto48 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/409396/the-state-of-shift-w-in-dead-by-daylight
Do you think people just run away because they don't know how to loop? Maybe there's like a new player base that's coming in and they're just trying to experience this game in a way that makes sense to them. Maybe there's like a bunch of people that have under a thousand hours instead of everybody who brags about having 10,000 in the game and "I know all about looping and pathing."
I normally check hours if people in my games play like they are a lot better or worse than what I usually expect. The people holding shift w are all 1k hours or higher. Most people are around my playtime at around 3k hours.
Whats your experience?
I could be wrong.
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It feels awful.
As killer I try a variety of different builds right now.
When playing survivor, I use flash bang, we'll make it, second wind and wicked.
Survivor experience:
Killer is running corrupt, pain res and pop. Almost no exception.
My teammates all run adren, Windows, sprint burst, lithe or otr.
Killer experience:
Perk variety of survivors is similar to what I experience as survivor with my teammates.
I had a pyramid head with 4 Slowdowns losing on Haddonfield. They wherent too happy, but I tried to reason with them that his perk where not helping him much.
When they calmed down, I explained how lethal instead of corrupt and I'm Al ears instead of no where to hide would do wonders for his learning curve.
We then had a nice discussion about stealth and skill check builds and called it a day.
Summary:
Perk variety seems really bad right now. Many people use the perks they use because it's their comport zone, published by popular content creators. We should all use different kind of builds. Slowdown as killer is mostly required in some form. Just not 3 or 4 of them.
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@Deathstroke said:
It's bugged got first normal Oni and then I played it and I was huge Oni so it's real. My only complain is that kills are not counted as sacrifise. It would be much better if they were sacrifised to entity instead. When they're kills I just feel I don't achieve anything in long term (need my sacrifise total to increase). You don't earn enough bp as well.
Sacrifises to increase what?
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How does one get the badge?
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@Shirtless_Myers said:
Survivors should spawn on hooks to make the game more fair to killers.
Based.
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@Reinami said:
Because if you are flashlight saving, you aren't being tunneled.
I see nothing speaking against it.
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It's Freddy...
Let's hope he's gonna receive help soon. Hopefully the next rework will be less flawed than the last one.
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@GeneralV said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3686151#Comment_3686151
The maps are also a factor.
In the past most tiles in the game had potential for mindgames. There was no real reason to just drop the pallet immediately and keep running, this would be seem as a waste of resources.
But now, most things are unsafe. The game basically encourages survivors to hold W and pre-drop everything.
So onoe solution would be to make tiles be mindgameable for survivors again?
What kind of tiles are these?
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@Aven_Fallen said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3690594#Comment_3690594
Yeah, would be a shame if an Anti-Tunnel Perk would have any impact on Nurse. In the end, she could have always NOT tunneled…
That is very true.
It's Nurse. She has the chase power to end chases in literally seconds.
If she decides to tunnel, she and she specifically should be punished accordingly.
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@Devil_hit11 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3690216#Comment_3690216
they're doing opposite. they're buffing DS stun so you can hold-w longer and more effectively. So when you take DS as Pig, you'll get shift-w'd more.
Well... Luckily Pig is one of the few killers that gets punished for tunneling and rewarded for spreading hooks.
No ds for me. I usually don't tunnel. Ds won't be much of a problem for me.
This does not mean, that a licensed perk is the solution to tunneling though.
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@Ayodam said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3690304#Comment_3690304
That’s the thing—any killer can tunnel a survivor out at any point in the game & pretty much walk away with at minimum a 2K. Tunneling is potent and widespread because it works regardless of all else.
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3690344#Comment_3690344
Regression perks can make tunneling easier by creating extra wiggle room, but they really aren’t necessary to win a game. If I tunnel someone out at 5 gens, I’m going to tunnel the next survivor out with however many gens remain (3-5). And once two are gone we know it’s basically a game of outlast for the remaining survivors. They’re not concerned with gens (nor should they be).
Well, I guess, ds will be there to fix your problem.
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@Ayodam said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3690307#Comment_3690307
It isn’t really something that needs fixing. Anything BHVR could do to affect it would just make the game worse for one side or the other. Best to just leave well enough alone.
That's the easy way out.
Similar could be said about tunneling.
I think problems that make the game less fun should be tackled.
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@Ayodam said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3690216#Comment_3690216
That’s true, you did say that it should be discouraged. However, the only ways to disincentivize a shift w playstyle are to either buff other strategies survivors have (my initial point that you have to give survivors some way to survive), or weaken it as a strategy… which would be a nerf.
Any Idea?
Making maps too strong punishes weaker killers more than stronger ones.
I genuinely dont know how to fix this.
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@Ayodam said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3690225#Comment_3690225
You don’t need regression perks to triumph over survivors (good, decent, or otherwise). Tunneling one survivor out ASAP is the strongest tool available to killers. The regression perk may buy more time to do that but I personally think it’s a negligible difference.
Your take heavily depends on the killer you play
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@Aven_Fallen said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3690083#Comment_3690083
Nope. If you just prolong the game long enough it does not matter if your chases are longer since more ressources are used up.
And thats what @Xernoton said? Its common knowledge, that DBD Killer without any gen perks against decent survivors is basicly saying: "Its up to you if I win or lose." Exception are some killers, that are problems on their own.
This discussion is only about two perks. Not about killer stacking four perks that basicly do the same thing.
There needs to be regression. Otherwise, some killers are just not viable. This is at least how I see it.
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@Ayodam said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3690082#Comment_3690082
Yup. You’re complaining about survivors running in a straight line because it disrupts your ability to play the game how you want. You asked if it’s fun for both sides; surviving is fun for survivors. You said the strategy negates looping, I pointed out maps are being reworked so that looping really isn’t as efficient as a shift w strategy (more dead zones, more weak tiles). The only way it becomes boring for killers, because regardless of where a survivor goes you’re still in chase, is because it prolongs surviving and that is not fun for killers. That’s the gist of it.
But I did not say to just straight up nerf it.
I suggested disencouraging it.
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@Aven_Fallen said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3690075#Comment_3690075
"Some other regression perks will need to be buffed, so that they can fill in the gaps."
Yeah, god forbid bad Killers cannot stack 4 Slowdowns to compensate for their lack of Skill.
That's exaggerating a bit, isn't it?
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@Ayodam said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3686817#Comment_3686817
Survivors running in a straight line isn’t an insurmountable strategy for any killer in this game. I believe the devs are working on QoL for killers based on killer feedback, which is great, but I also know the devs have to give survivors some way to survive their matches. Maps are smaller (favors killers), loops are weaker (favors killers), and several survivor play styles have been nerfed (healing, stealth—favors killers). They have to give survivors something. And pushing the envelope with more survivor nerfs—eliminating the hold w strat—doesn’t mean survivors play with yet another handicap. It means survivors stop playing altogether (a la Deathgarden).
Did I say I want that?
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@BritneyMitch said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/409396/the-state-of-shift-w-in-dead-by-daylight
Well they nerfed the pallets on a ton of maps and gutted dh. If there's not a safeish loop near a generator survivors are going to pre-run because otherwise its just giving a free injury. When DH was better I could greed and play a riskier loop because of DH. I still run DH though because its more fun imo.
But dh made the game too safe. Especially old dh.
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@Devil_hit11 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3686819#Comment_3686819
Sadako has no in-chase mobility, no ranged power or instant down. The same is true for Pig. Pig is not a ranged killer and does not have instant downs. She does have ranged dash which might count for in-chase mobility but the pig dash is still somewhat weak. It doesn't go far enough or fast enough.
That's what I said, didnt I?
Both are loopable. However, against both, survivors hold w the moment they can.
Also, Sadako has invisibility - Mindgames. It's not strong but it's there.
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@ChaosWam said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3689661#Comment_3689661
Probably the most sane take away from this entire argument. Regardless of whatever combination DS can be apart of to make it harder on killers trying to avoid tunneling, DS being a paid perk that rarely shows up in the shrine isn't the best perk to praise for a problem the entire game suffers from.
True.
There should either be a base mechanic on the survivor side that punishes tunneling and a mechanic on the killer side that discourages tunneling OR a basekit survivor perk that is as good as ds.
This just punishes people that have not paid BHVR for the game feeling more fun to them.
I personally prefer a basekit mechanic.
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Both sides deserve strong perks.
Pain Res and pop reward chases with regression.
If they needed to be nerfed, then don't make them stack with each other. Otherwise no further nerf would be fair.
Pop is mostly game healthy in my opinion.
Regression should be linked to game progression. Otherwise we get gen kick standoffs back.
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@Pulsar said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3689426#Comment_3689426
First off, chill with the us vs them.
Secondly, we will have those posts regardless. The mere fact that DS is getting buffed has already set people off.
Set off way too much.
I'd just like for people to see what dbd is. A game. Not something to start a war over.
Playing dbd for this long really changes perspectives.
My statement to ds being buffed:
Overall good.
Is this the solution we have waited for? No. Game health should not be locked behind a paid dlc perk.
This is a start. Nothing more, nothing less.
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@alpha5 said:
It is difficult to keep any sort of proficiency in looping when you are not allowed to do it and you do not play that much. From the 14 killers you listed you can loop maybe 5 normally if they let you or if you get help from your mates in Singularity's case.
Singularity without addons is perfectly loopable. The most he gets is a faster pallet break.
Pig is loopable. Sadako is as well. Both are getting shift w`d.
Its not just because of maps and certain killer powers.
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@Ayodam said:
Maps are smaller, loops are weaker, and most killers have an anti-loop ability (teleportation, dash, ranged attack, some sort of loop denial). There are a few maps where looping is better than just running in a straight line (Badham) but I think survivors are being conditioned to run in a straight line and that’s honestly the better strategy. Why gamble looping on Badham (GoJ has terrible loops outside of main) when you can hold forward on one of umpteen maps that has really bad loops? Holding forward doesn’t guarantee survival but it might be the difference between a 5 second chase and an 8 second chase. And within those three seconds a generator could be completed.
But do you think its good for the game in terms of fun for both sides?
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@ExcelSword said:
This mainly comes down to the fact that maps now have too many tiles grouped together, meaning that as soon as you try doing anything to mind game that requires the survivor to make a read or get hit, instead they can just abandon the tile rather than risk making a bad read.
Now this wouldn't be an issue ideally, because abandoning a loop is its own read, and a killer could bait a mind game expecting them to leave the loop, and theoretically would get a free hit. But loops and tiles are so close together that alot of times you can't even punish the survivor if you predict they will abandon the loop.
Doesn't help that windows of opportunity removes a lot of risk of them abandoning a loop for a tile that has no pallet or window. I'm not advocating for it to be nerfed, but it is a big reason why shift-w is so much more common now.
I see this every time I do a break mindgame as Onryo (faking animation to trick the survivor to leave the tile). People fall for it, but it doesnt matter because they safely get to the next pallet in no time.
I genuinely dont know how to fix this.
Maps are smaller = more tiles close together, but the killer can get into chases faster.
Maps are larger = less tiles close together, but the killer cant get into chases fast.
Its a "pick-your-poison" - situation.
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@Nun_So_Vile said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3686488#Comment_3686488
I've been high on the JMF + WG post-patch. It does help at tiles to an extent. Her Ambush still leaves a lot to be desired even with the add-ons.
That is absolutely true. Hoowever, the stealth aspect has become a loot stronger. Amanda now crouches a lot faster by default. Combined with medical file, shes now 4.18 m/s (if I understood it correctly). Thats faster than a survivor is running. What this means is,:
- that you can actually traverse the map crouched without losing the game.
- that you can stealth at jungle gyms or other structures to lose your red stain and catch people off guard.
The medical file has undoubtably become one of her best addons. It offers a unique effect, that the Pig has been lacking ever since she got released. Good stealth.
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@UndeddJester said:
HI all!
In case you haven't seen it, I did an add-on review in a thread the other day, though that is just background for my actual point in case you're interested:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3685340#Comment_3685340
This spawned discussions regarding Combat Straps, and I quick mathed why Combat Straps is rarely worth it, that I thought might be useful knowledge to share, and is just interesting to know for Pig add-ons in general:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3686048#Comment_3686048
Although at one days time it was one of my favourite add-ons... I salute your noble sacrifice Combat Straps, you will be missed dearly, and fondly remembered 😥
Combat straps was one of my go-to addons. Now i still use it almost every game, but you are right. Its not really that good anymore.
Workshop grease it is.
The medical file truly is the winner of this update. Piggy go zoooooooooooooooom!
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@Krazzik said:
There are some killers that punish shift + W so you can always play those.
But what if i want to play Pig and Onryo?
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@HexHuntressThighs said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/409396/the-state-of-shift-w-in-dead-by-daylight
Kyto actually said he doesnt play DBD anymore because all survivors just hold W. And he has a DBD channel with 300,000 subs lol.
I love playing DBD but holding W is very boring. I like it when survivors are super confident and go for big plays. Sometimes they beat me and pop a Gen in my face and sometimes I beat them. Mindbreaker could help with the SB off gens problem.
I ran into a p400 lobby where they held W and it was azarovs with huge LOS zones. I just started slugging people out to gain pressure. I always had one person on the ground and I know they were bored out of their tree but hey, if they wanna bore me by W keying because they wanna win so bad. I’ll bore them by slugging to win. They gave up after 30 minutes of back and forth, they got to one gen left but it didn’t matter.
But isn't that the issue?
We counter boring stuff with boring stuff. The game should encourage survivors to make these big plays that might be risky but overall fun.
Same can be said for killer. It's often risky to go for many chases and not for a kill when possible. This however is mostly considered the fun way to play. Sadly, many people go for the simpler route and just tunnel one player out.
Dbd should encourage fun over efficiency. Optimally, the fun playstyles should become the most efficient playstyles.
Look at flashy safes for example. Is it efficient to go for a risky flashy safe? No. Almost never. The survivor going for one is not on a Gen, therefore delaying Gen progression for the team. It's fun though. That's why people still go for it.
Sadly, also the amount of people actually going for flashlights over toolboxes or med kits with very strong addons has drastically went down from my personal experience.
Conclusion: Dbd should encourage and support fun playstyles over boring ones and discourage boring gameplay.
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@jonifire said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3685950#Comment_3685950
GOJ is in my opinion no good map for looping since its rework. My games as killers there are incredibly easy and as survivor the opposite. The main building is strong, but no killer will follow you there and the outside part is trash.
The parking lot is very strong. There is a shack. Between both are filler tiles, a jungle gym and sometimes even mutiple strong tiles leading direcly into each other.
Personal experience is good and all, but the map is overall one of the worst killer maps in this game. The rework has barely changed anything.
Im glad your experience is better though.
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@Blueberry said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3685929#Comment_3685929
Yes you're correct, that is a very unfortunate side effect that I don't have a solution for. Just in general for "most" the game it would be better overall. Maybe those specific killers could get alternate improvements in other ways to compensate. Maybe most the LoS blockers are more "vision" and less actual like objects, so they could still theoretically make the hits, it would just be harder to see that far and maybe put more emphasis on aura perks for vision through them. Idk. Maybe you have some ideas?
I honestly dont think shift w has much of a solution in the current version of DBD. The best RIGHT NOW would propably be to change peoples mindsets. More looping, less shift w. This is hard because many people solely play to win and be the most effective possible. Comp doesnt help by promoting these playstyles.
Right now, the only win condition for survivor is escaping. This means wasting time of the killer for as long as possible. Time is wasted by:
- Looping tiles
- shift w
Sadly, running across the map without using any structure and going down in a corner wastes way too much time compared to looping well. This does not mean that looping wastes less time. A great looper wastes a lot more time than a survivor just running straight into a corner.
It also doesnt waste any resources like pallets. This in addition with how easy it is to pull off (literally just holding a single key with the occasional window vault to get lithe going) makes shift w undeniably effective and popular.
I think a complete overhaul of the game would need to happen. The survivor win condition would need to be linked to looping well instead of wasting the killers time as much as possible to finish gens. This would be very hard though due to many killer designs.
As you can see, a very difficult problem. Similar to swf, this might not have a solution at all. Making maps smaller is a way to make it better, but not only does the problem not go away, many people also dislike the shrinking of maps.
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@supersonic853 said:
I rarely play killers that don't have map mobility for this reason. Especially after billys fix. Hes one of the best for handling this kinda gameplay depending on the map. Its just the main easiest way to get value as a survivor without worrying about being hit. People will always steer toward the lowest risk easiest way to win. The problem is i cant foresee a way of them fixing it with just the killer and survivor movement speeds the way they are.
I dont think it actually can be fixed. Maybe it could be discouraged in some way of form?
DBD is really great at promoting the easiest playstyles. Im honestly not suprised why so many people tunnel, camp, shift w or stealth with distortion.
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@Hexling said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3685936#Comment_3685936
I mean I guess its not that strong vs most killers if you kick the breakable door it doesn't take long to chase someone down. All it has is one pallet and one window next to the breakable wall, and yea outdoor maps usually have less pallets but they are now usually only on one side of the map literally leaving you no option but to hold w because there's only one t l on one side of the map and 3 gens. They also added a bunch of new tiles that are very weak about as weak as t and l's. The amount of there's a lot of different reasons hold w i for one like to loop but to each their own.
I think a LT- wall is actually a very skillful tile. If played really well by a survivor, it can waste a lot of time. However, many survivors i play against dont know how to play it well and fall for the first mindgame. Thats also why most survivor leave the LT whenever they have the chance.
Again, I play m1 mostly. This tile becomes a lot weaker against stronger chase killers.
Guess this goes together with your point, that most people just stick to their comfort zone and rarely try to improve.
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@jonifire said:
That‘s what happens when there is nothing left to do. All maps get made smaller, less pallets, less windows (most of them just not playable/unsafe) and all perks that supported something else got hard nerfed. People will adept to what is best and works the best.
But you can absolutely loop Sadako on Garden of Joy
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@Hexling said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3685930#Comment_3685930
The game has changed a lot in the last couple of months since October every patch almost has gotten maps completely reworked to suit killer better and for the most part its been pretty solid changes to make the maps easier for killer.
I have played the game. I was heavily involved in the last updates. I play all Ptb´s.
I know about map reworks and new maps.
I just played a lot less public, because i got fed up with some players and the game overall.
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@Hexling said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3685926#Comment_3685926
Well that's the worst part it depends on the rng but even on groaning store house there's unsafe loops. Also the main thing about looping is chaining a lot of the new McMillian maps only spawn in ive seen as little as 8 pallets for a whole match. Or one side having multiple pallets and the other side of the map having literally none.
Outdoor maps usually have less pallets than indoor maps. Groaning storehouse has one of the strongest main buildings in dbd, a truly awful size and gen placement and a lot of safe structures and tiles.
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@Pulsar said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3685878#Comment_3685878
All of those Killers have chase powers that put Survivors into a losing scenario in a loop, except Sadako.
Nightfall is an accessibility nightmare on Survivor.
Pig: heavily depends on loop and addons.
Legion: literally m1 killer if survivor is injured.
With Xeno, i absolutely agree.
My other points you just ignored. Wasnt it you, who once told me to answer all your arguments?
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@Hexling said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3685921#Comment_3685921
They also house some of the worst setups now. Just curious what is your killer to survivor ratio?
My ratio is 80% - 20% , Killer - survivor.
I play mostly Pig and Onryo.
As mentioned, I played a lot less in the last few months.
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@Blueberry said:
Definitely an issue I notice a lot. As you said some perks exacerbate this but it’s a core issue as well even without perks. Generally speaking this is why large maps are mad design as they encourage hold a game play. Shift w is significantly reduced on smaller maps as it forces interaction with the killer.
Against good survivors, especially on coms they know how strong this is. “Left me”, “he’s coming!” Every gen you walk towards before you even “start” a chase you lose 10+ seconds at least to catch up. That’s at least 30-40 seconds lost when multiplied to other survivors also gaining that time and you see why it’s so effective.
Solution? Shrink maps to force interaction of who’s better. Also, increase LoS blockage. An issue many maps have is they can see you coming a mile away, that bad design. This is another reason I personally like indoor maps as the line of sight blockage can many times prevent knowing which way to hold w.
There’s not really counter play you can do yourself other than bring stealth perks to prevent their heads up. However, like I said earlier swf negates all this as well anyway and now you’re also going down the rabbit hole of inefficient perks.
As much as survivors hate it, this is also why killers 3 gen. It makes the survivors come to you more and reduces the hold w (as much as you can anyway). Most killers don’t have enough map mobility or pressure in their design and are forced into 3 gens.
This is a really good take.
However, less line of sight would drastically weaken killers like Huntress, dont you think?
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@Hexling said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3685921#Comment_3685921
They also house some of the worst setups now. Just curious what is your killer to survivor ratio?
Where is an awful set up on groaning storehouse?
I genuinely despise the original variation and the new one doesnt make it any better.
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@Hexling said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3685907#Comment_3685907
No point still stands its a decent strategy but learning how to loop is always better. Holding W only gets you so far but if you learn to loop effectively as a survivor you can hold a killer for minutes on end. Its also the same when playing killer and tunneling it doesn't work at high mmr because people get better at looping and wasting your time and if you never learned how to spread pressure you are going to lose. By high mmr I am not counting comp play since that's a whole different game you aren't even playing dbd anymore.
Regarding your edit:
These realms, despite being reworked, still house some of the strongest survivor maps in the game with some of the strongest set ups. Reworked or not, maps like groaning storehouse, ironworks, coal tower, gas heaven, blood lodge and others still offer very strong variations with extremely good set ups and main buildings.
This is reflected by the amount of map offerings used for these realms.
On top of this, the reworks have been there for a long time now.
There are only few maps that have not been reworked yet.
Swamp being one example.
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@Hexling said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3685907#Comment_3685907
No point still stands its a decent strategy but learning how to loop is always better. Holding W only gets you so far but if you learn to loop effectively as a survivor you can hold a killer for minutes on end. Its also the same when playing killer and tunneling it doesn't work at high mmr because people get better at looping and wasting your time and if you never learned how to spread pressure you are going to lose. By high mmr I am not counting comp play since that's a whole different game you aren't even playing dbd anymore.
Your first statement was:
@Hexling said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/409396/the-state-of-shift-w-in-dead-by-daylight
Its because a lot of the new maps have really unsafe loops and you can waste more time by holding w then by trying to play around a unsafe loop and going down even faster. Nostromo, Toba, Greenville, and a lot of the new map reworks are just have really bad gyms or bad rng so its usually just safer to shift w to a window or just forward especially with the design of killers now being anti loop most of the time. That on top of the game having a huge uptick in tunneling is also a problem.
Which is: new killers and maps promote shift w over looping. I do not disagree with this. Chucky, Xeno, Knight and Skull Merchant do encourage shift w over looping AND newer maps have weaker loops and structures.
Please tell me im wrong in case that I misinterpreted it.
However, as I pointed out, it is done on every map against every killer.
You agreed with this and said, that survivor players, just like killer players grow more accustom to simpler strategies when they realize that it works very well.
With this, you basicly said, that its mostly done becuase it works. Not specificly becuase of newer maps or killers. This is what i refered to and what I also said in my original post:
"I have the feeling, that the general playstyle of just holding w until the end of the map or a super safe tile, is not only done because of the killers power, but because it takes minimal effort with maximum results. This of course being exaggerated by perks like sprint burst, lithe and overcome."
Its simple and effective. Thats why people do it. Similar to tunneling, as you pointed out.
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@Hexling said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3685896#Comment_3685896
Yea well its the same problem as tunneling for killers once you get in the habit of doing it you never actually learn how to play the game well. Even though it can be a decent strategy there is always the option of while in chase to look for a gen being worked on and transfer the chase to the next survivor which usually builds more pressure.
But doesnt your point here negate your previous statement?
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@Lynxx said:
You know, survivors adapt to numerous unsafe loops, smaller maps, nerfs to perks, etc.
Press w is just all around effective with all the anti-looping killer powers they built into the game now.
But i said, its not just maps or killers.
I play Sadako on Groaning storehouse and people shift w all the time.