hastarkis
hastarkis
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- hastarkis
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You didn't hooked them once. Other two players left. You lost this game. I understand your salt but if we imagine your suggestion will be implemented then... then this person just opens gates and leaves. Like, they leave ANYWAY either they can be hooked and self-unhook themselves with endurance or they just doesn't try to save teammate and leave right away because deliverance won't give endurance. You can't get them killed, no matter what, your solution changes nothing but band-aid your frustration.
Also your "Like I said it's a rare occurrence but I had that kill" sounds like "it's a rare occurrence but I had that escape and killer just used get out of jail free card and blocked gates with bloodwarden, how is it fair, it was a tough game". You don't have escape until escape animation and you don't have kill until death animation either.
This person used perkslot, activated perk and SAVED it till the EGC (being zero hooks), that last part isn't easy, you know. That definitely wasn't a free card. 4% would be a free card there. Probably. Still if you didn't manage to hook this person at least once through the whole game then the problem is matchmaking (or your bad luck) and not how the perk works.
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@Waldbeere said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3261320#Comment_3261320
Sure, if there is an idea to make this builds playable on every map, that would be great. And if then finally every map would be balanced the only reason to use an offering would be for fun. This would be the best scenario. I think it's not easy and keep the variety of such builds and make them work on every map 🤔. But hey, maybe some designers have ideas 💪.
Let's hope!!! ❤️❤️❤️
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@Gandor said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3261320#Comment_3261320
meyers can't be buffed until tombstone piece is updated. When they fix this (and OK this one is up for debate) and fix also the other (iri) tombstone, then meyers should be on very high priority list of killers that need buff.
Just to make clear: I didn't mention word "buff" here. Also I told about changes for those specific addons of him with wall hack. They definitely can change those without fixing pieces since those addons can't be used with insta-kills. And can keep wallhack functionality.
As for insta-kills, in my opinion you can't change those two addons without changing everything else. He needs rework. Like completely. No buffs can compensate limitation in using his power, the only limited power in killers roster. Like, yeah, it makes him unique, but I'm sure they can make him unique in other way. If they have contract requirement to make him mori people, they can use Executor mechanic: after some stalking (and two hooks) you can instakill. Or smth like that. I definitely want them to change limitation of stalking, and after that they have to change all addons, especially mori ones. They proved their creativity, and Michael deserves love <3 of course, that's my point of view. Maybe they can just fix insta-kills and buff him. It will work for me either (along with couple new outfits, hahah).
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@Waldbeere said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3261223#Comment_3261223
By assuming every map is balanced I just want you to ignore the balancing aspect. I just want to support playstyles. Because I think the chances should be fair. If there is an issue on a map because of balancing that should be fixed in the map and not be provided by different chances in the offerings. That's the wrong direction. That's was what i meant with "assume ever map is balanced". Maybe this wasn't accurate enough. If there are too many loops on a map you would also fix the map and remove loops and not decrease the survivors running speed. That was the idea 🙂.
You know the people dc for everything, if it makes sense or not 😌. I had someone in my team who dced after he realized the killer was a plague although she hadn't injured anyone. It's just "I don't want to play again this killer. I don't care about the others, bye".
I like the aspect that some killers can have different playstyles based in their addons. For me it's more exciting.
I hope the Shape's SM build will stay. It's so much fun to play against 🙂.
Oh, got it. Then my last point still should be valid. I told more about structure and size.
And yeah, I know people dc for everything, still if it's 10th midwich with nurse starstruck I pretty can puke my frustration out and just insta DC to close the game and don't return untill next update. And I have DCd intentionally like two times only out of my 2k experience. I just can imagine how frustrating could it be, even for me. Of course, maybe, I won't DC, I just will close the game after 9th nurse without even trying to play 10th game. Result is kinda same.
You said yourself "If there are too many loops on a map you would also fix the map and remove loops and not decrease the survivors running speed", so if there's builds that strong rely on maps maybe we should change builds or maps and not decrease survivors' offerings value to band-aid the problem. Wouldn't it be better to be able to play SM Myers comfortably on most random maps and bring Halloween event offering instead of Lerys? Different playstyles still can be different even after you address the problem. Anyway, even if we have different points on how to fix this we have at least one thing in common: I like SM Myers too xD
I like all Myers, he's my main :) I want some love for him from bhvr :ccc at least graphic.
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@Mandy said:
Thank you @hastarkis for explaining this so clearly <3
@Adaez said:
Thanks for the clear explanation as well.
No problem <3
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@Waldbeere said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3261104#Comment_3261104
"Yeah, so survivors bring maps to win and killers bring maps to use builds (and not to win). "
And I also did not say that. Please do not add words I haven't said. I respect that you do not agree. But you still talked about map balance a lot. This topic has nothing to do with balancing.
I play for fun and that does not mean necessary for a 4k as killer, which might be your definition of ia win, if I would guess?!
But you can try to play a scratched mirror myers on a wide open map and where everyone can see you before you can. I bet that's a lot of fun for everyone without bloodlust and nearly no lunge attack. And this is not a meme build. A BK Meyers would be a meme and that is not longer possible.
Your suggestion is here because you assume every map is balanced. It's your words. That's why I talk about balancing map. You suggestion should be implemented after all maps are balanced. But if maps are balanced why we even need smth like your suggestion?
Right. Again. I don't put words in your mouth just continue your logic. I'll try to explain.
As I understand, you are trying to say that those map-specific builds have disadvantages on every maps and work NORMAL on only one map. So it's kinda fair to let them get normal gameplay on that one map just like everyone else has on every map.
But that's not true. Some of those builds - maybe. But we also have other builds that work normal on all maps and have HUGE advantage on some specific maps. And that's the reason why those killers want to bring those specific maps.
Yeah, SM Myers can't perform well on wide map, but he can perform ok on Midwich and The Game but a lot of Myers with wallhack tier 1 bring Lerys. And not only lerys, they also bring perks! I just can't agree that all of that is JUST because of build. This game has a goal and every player is trying to achieve it one way or another (otherwise their build should be called meme build, and if they just goof around with no intention to kill they don't really need this specific map). But ok, let's say Myers is one of those "legit" killes whose builds can be bad everywhere except couple maps.
But Impossible skill check Doctor or Starstruck Nurse can perform pretty well on every map but they are significantly stronger on small maps where survivors literally can't avoid key perks. WH Wraith pretty can get value on every map, even huge ones, still small indoor maps with walls or 2 floors give him much more value. RPD with no-boxes-before-gen and everyone-start-with-boxes for pig. Pig definitely get value on every map but RPD put survivors in a huge disadvantage. Now that can be easy "countered" by random offering (not completely countered, only this external value, also you still have pretty valid chances to win your map), that's why it's rare. And you want to make it guaranteed. Can you guess how first minute DC ratio will change? :D
You are trying to defend SM Myers and I bet that after implementation of your suggestion EVERY nurse will be starstruck-awareness-midwich. And wesker definitely can find strong build for his 40m TR. And there will be much more of them because now it's risky so they don't bother to use offerings most of the times or loose them by offering battles but with 50%+ EVERY game - sheeeesh that will be a must have to make games easier. And this won't be fun for survivors.
And - again - after that, all survivors will start to use reject-any-map offering. And all this will be for nothing. Maybe it's better to buff map-specific builds that are too weak rather then buff strong ones? Or rework Shape completely, after all.
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@Waldbeere said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3261031#Comment_3261031
Hi thanks for the reponse, I assumed this reaction 🙂.
My suggestion is not for game balancing ☝️. That's a total different thing in my opinion. A mechanic like this must be independent from balancing, otherwise you could overhaul it after every balance patch. So lets assume the maps are balanced.
I play survivor 90% time. So it's not the view from a killer player. And the only exception for balance landing is Shelter Woods. I used Balance Landing a lot and you will find a usage everywhere. And you can sabotage on every map. Of course it's easier on maps where the killer can't see you. But you don't really won't compare a less effective sabotage with a complete build destroyed build 😲. A survivor's build is by far not so independent on a map. I think you can't compare a full build that's ruined vs 4 players where maybe are 2 perks have less usage.
Don't forget you play 4 vs 1. If your build is not perfect there are still 3 other people. For a killer the game can be nearly over at the beginning.
And final, how often does a killer really use a map offering? 🙂 It's already total rare and 90% time it's used for a specific build. There are so many groups outside there. At least a pair of 2 people. Even 2 people can throw the same offering and most of the time they will win. Additionally 4 players have 4 times more offerings then a killer. There is nothing balanced about this, if you compare this equal.
I think the direction of your comment is more that you are afraid that the killers kill tate will increase. But again, balancing is a total differnt thing. Assume the maps are balanced as are prerequisite 🙂.
>>Assume the maps are balanced as are prerequisite 🙂.
How it it even possible? Like, ok, let's assume maps are generally balanced. Then either you don't need specific map to make your build work OR by choosing specific map you get some sort of advantage.
Then, either this advantage isn't that big (then it's not a big deal if your offering doesn't win) OR the advantage is so huge you really want that specific map. In that second case how could map be balanced if some specific build gives you huge advantage on it? Like let's get wallhack wraith. Doesn't matter how balanced maps are in general, every map with LOTS of walls will give Wraith huge advantage. And ability to use this advantage every game can be balanced by only one way: by making all maps with similar number of walls and positions. Then there's no point in specific offerings.
Doc with impossible skill checks relays on small maps with several floors. Then if 1,2,3,4 maps are small and 2 floors and 5,6,7,8 maps are big and wide those maps clearly aren't balanced in between.
Same with every other map-specific build. If you assume maps are perfectly balanced then there's no map-specific build. And if there ARE map-specific builds then you don't have to get value out of it every single time, it's even more unbalanced.
As for "And final, how often does a killer really use a map offering?". It is rare (not really but ok) because there's nothing to "abuse". If killers know they will win offering battle in most cases (and your suggestion makes it so) then they will use that. Just like now they use camping and tunneling. And just like now sabo swf make sure their map win.
@Waldbeere said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3261077#Comment_3261077
I did not say that ☝️. I said that the killers most of the time throw a map offering because of a specific build.
The survivors throw it pretty often for the win rate and not for the build. There may be some exceptions, but how often does a survivor throw a map because he/she want a better usage of bond? 🤔 Now you will say "Hey in the past the survivors used Balance Landing on Haddonfield'. But there is a difference between "I want a indoor map. I don't care which one, but without my build is unplayable." and "I want Haddonfield, because with Balance Landing I can't loose, because the killer can't catch me.". The last one is more an abuse of balance issue. And even , if you get the wrong map as a survivor the impact is much smaller. I assume you will confirm that.
Most of the time it's all about big maps, strong loops and good spawns. And that's absoloutly ok 🙂. They're are allowed to do this. But it's sad that one offering of a survivor has the same weight like the killer's one where the impact is.much bigger.
A sabotage squat can still throw 4 offerings. That shouldn't be a problem.
And as I answered the person before. Don't forget this is an edge case where the killer and the survivor throw a map offering at the same time. That's pretty rare 🙂.
Yeah, so survivors bring maps to win and killers bring maps to use builds (and not to win). If I bring balance landing (for archive or anything) I definitely will bring any map that have more than one drop places like the Game or Saloon. If I use detective hunch or Distortion I will bring 2 floor map to get tokens out of terror easier. If I use boons, maybe I will bring 2floor map either. If I use boil over I will bring map to make sure I can use it everywhere and don't have to abuse one spot in main building like idiot (or don't use it at all). If I have lucky break and bite the bullet I'll make sure I'll bring non open map to make killer loose me easily.
That's just a small portion of survivor builds you can have better use of on some specific maps. And now you decide that some map-specific builds for killers are more important that mine? And that I have to either play swf to beat the bet (and make killer's life miserable) or use rejection (with chance to not get map I needed)? How is it fair?
Then you say "But there is a difference between "I want a indoor map. I don't care which one, but without my build is unplayable." and "I want Haddonfield, because with Balance Landing I can't loose, because the killer can't catch me."
So...there's a difference between "I want open map, I don't care which one, but without it my build will be unplayable" and "I want Midwich because then my TR will cover every corner of it and once I land one hit on everyone I won't be able to loose because of thana and coulorophobia"
And here we are back to balancing. There SHOULDN'T be build that works super good on some specific maps (except meme ones). All builds should be playable and winnable (both for killers and survs) on pretty every map. The fact you can get so huge advantage on one map that you can't handle getting any other map is not an offerings' problem. Let's balance all maps and then you won't be so afraid to play on any of them with every build you want (and won't be so afraid to get some specific offering from survivors).
Untill then survivors will just use reject offering and deny all your priority.
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@Adaez said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3261020#Comment_3261020
So you mean,once you unlock a perk in the shrine,you can have it maxed out to level 3 on anyone?
Or do I have to buy it 3 times,so I can max it out on everyone?
First one. Once you bought it in shrine you are completely free to level this perk up on every other character through bloodweb, from tier 1 to tier 3, with no problems. Just like before.
But you also can level up perks on other characters by prestiging initial character or by buying 2d and 3d tiers in shrine. As alternative. You don't have to do that, it is an option in addition to basic (old) system.
So don't worry. If you have bloodwarden for all killers tier1 you both: 1) can level it up from tier 1 to tier 3 on every killer now; 2) will be able to do the same on every new killer.
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So, you say survivors bring maps because of winrate and killers bring map just for fun? Not because their build (aka perks and addons) work better (provide higher winrate) on those maps?
Also all solo just will be forced to use reject-any-map-offering offering. Like it's 90% win for killer with one survivor's map offering, either you play every game vs impossible heal skill check doc on midwich or you play vs impossible heal skill check doc anywhere else with at least some chance to get even map. Choice is obvious. Your 90% will mean everything in one case and mean nothing in other.
You can suggest to not stack same offerings (like 4 haddonfield offerings from swf will give same probability as 1 haddonfield so you still will be able to get lerys), but your suggestion is broken. Casino roulette gives more chanses to win a bet than your suggestion gives to both sides.
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Ah, i got where you find 4.
Your bloodwarden is tier two without Freddy being prestiged.
Let me clear it. There's some sophisticated system with prices and discounts.
If you don't have character: tier1 = 2k, tier2 = 4k, tier3 = 6k.
If you have character p1: tier1 = already own, tier2 = 2k, tier3 = 4k.
If you have character p2: tier1 and tier2 = already own, tier3 = 2k shards.
So if you don't have character it's better to buy three perks tier 1 (2+2+2=6k) and level perks up through bloodweb. It is exactly like it was before, nothing new beside tier1 is ready to equip.
If you do have character (or don't want to level up perks on EVERY other character) then it's better to buy character and p3 them to unlock perks for everyone. It's new option you can use. But also you can level perks via shards (huge amount of them tbh), it's also new option, and nobody force you to do so, you still have old system for you.
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@Adaez said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3261006#Comment_3261006
so you have to buy a perk 3 times now in the shrine,meaning you have to pay 12k shards isntead of 4?
Well, you don't have to, and why 4? Where did you get this number?
Anyway, you can:
1) buy dlc with money/shards and prestige character 3 times to get tier 3 of all perks for everyone.
2) buy one perk in shrine 3 times (12k shards) to get only one specific perk tier 3 for everyone
3) combine first two if you want. If you have character p1 then you can buy tier 2 of the perk for 2k shards, and then tier 3 for 4k. If you have character p2 then tier 3 will cost 2k shards only.
4) you can buy perk only once, for 2k shards (or prestige character only once to unlock all 3 perks), and then level perk(s) up in bloodwebs of your other characters just like before. The only difference from previous system is you already have tier 1 ready to equip for every character, you don't have to spend bps to find it.
So no, you don't have to pay more if you want it old way, you even save some bps actually.
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You bought first tier of those perks. Now in shrine of secrets you can buy also second and third tier to upgrade this perk for all characters at once (bypassing prestige requirement).
Only after this perk will be upgraded to tier three (no matter by shrine or prestige) you will see "already own" text and will be able to buy blood points instead.
Can you check which color of those perks do you have in the shrine? If you bought bloodwarden pre-patch (and all killers have it first tier), now it should be green in the shrine allowing you to buy second tier of it.
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@FinestFantasyVI said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3260070#Comment_3260070
Really? I had no clue those were bots, I ran into a few of those myself and I wondered was that a player that got somehow stuck. A bot didnt cross my mind
Well, your thoughts aren't wrong, sometimes people can stuck that way (once I got stuck in generator as Doctor, lol) but it's more obvious. Like they are in between textures or/and spinning in confusion or/and nod acknowledging your presence.
And bots just use m1 and m2 every %x% seconds. Also, bots are more common than stucking in smth first minute in game so... yeah. Bots.
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It's not bhvr's bots if you about that. Real players sometimes use bots too both for lowering mmr and for farm (rift fragments and bp). If they are completely afk - it's just afk players (sometimes with bot-scripts to restart search after the game but sometimes they watch YouTube and restart games manually every 15 minutes for example). You don't really need have bot to be afk.
If they hit air constantly and use their ability with no reason - that's bots. They farm bp, lowering mmr, and lowering chances to be reported (survivors can farm too and even pip hence they don't pissed off so much compared with afk insidious lightborn killers).
But still they are bots of real players after all.
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@Nirgendwohin said:
I'm not sure if i have seen one since the beginning of the halloween event.
I'm pretty sure you have. During the Halloween there were mystery pumpkins instead of mystery boxes and there were LOTS of them.
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@Laluzi said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3246525#Comment_3246525
Psst, your video's private.
I'm thinking that the infection might come from other sick survivors interacting with the rift, though. I don't think there's a physical object for Plague to puke on, and the lack of a score event indicates that, but there's definitely something you can interact with and that spreads sickness.
Oh, i was sure I clicked right option, it wasn't published for some reason.
Now it is available x)
As for infection, I don't know. Two other teammates died (and DCed) early and my infected friend was chased, he wasn't able to infect the portal. I don't know if timings are right to keep it infected so long to respawn twice before I touched it. But maybe you are right with this theory, tho
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@Laluzi said:
That actually works? You don't get a score event or an infection shader on them when playing Plague, and that's usually the feedback you get when something is infected - you can even infect the hatch, and it used to be you could infect breakable walls, too. I'm pretty sure you could infect the snowmen last year, but every other event item I've seen has been immune.
Could be a crafty way to use prayer tablet fragment, I suppose.
As you can see, yes. Either that or sickness now tranfers through space and time, huh
So yeah, tablet fragment could be very handy during the event, lol
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@Nirgendwohin said:
Yes I'm sure thats not just a visual. I got 66k as match result und only 132k with all bonus.
And seems to me you got everything x)
You know you can get only 40k for the game, right? And only game points from emblems get any multiplications from bonuses?
33k for the game, 33k for the haunted by daylight (it shows in final score - just like white glyph does - but other bonuses don't multiply it because it's bonus itself), 33k for blood hunt, 33k for queue. That ends in 132k.
You got 132k (game+haunted+blood hunt+queue) and it shows you 66k on score screen (game score+haunted). Seems legit, you know.
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My game skips adding "survivor queue" bonus visually (because, probably, showing all three bonuses is too long for it) but if I return back fast enough I can see the prompt.
And by numbers I get all bonuses. So it works for me. Are you sure it's not visual for you too?
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@sizzlingmario4 said:
Oh yeah, it definitely used to have an icon for the 15 seconds. Good catch.
I’d go ahead and submit a bug report.
Oh, ok. I'll do that then. Was afraid I missed anything from later patches.
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@ReverseVelocity said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3243102#Comment_3243102
idk I can read the tells for those things just fine without Spine Chill
Yeah, and I can repair gens just fine without Proof. Still, proof makes it easier in some cases. Just like Spine Chill does.
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@ReverseVelocity said:
The red indicator isn't based on the killer's distance, it's just the Terror Radius. It's a temporary thing until they add the feature in as an accessibility option.
If you're not in the terror radius (ie Oblivious/Undetectable or the killer just has a really small one), it'll only light up if the killer is within 36m of you, and will give you a speed boost if the killer has direct LOS. Spine Chill alone doesn't give you any detailed distance indication outside of what you can hear.
You can't see TR-addons or perks like agitation or dark devotion through walls. You can see it with Spine Chill tho.
And I'm pretty sure you can react on pixel-size-moves of red indicator faster than understand that killer is now one meter closer to you by how loud or quiet TR/heartbeat is (won me some gate standings for sure). Also you clearly can measure distance if you know how to compare 360 degrees and size of TR.
Maybe it's not THAT useful but you definitely get something outside of what you can hear.
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@MaTtRoSiTy said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3242592#Comment_3242592
And this is why I hate boons, team mates will have a 'screw everyone else on the team' attitude and will waste so much time doing these things over and over to the point they become a 5th killer perk.
What a cool mood to play the game. Then you should hate 70% of survivors' perks (and 90% of archives) and assume that every teammate is trying to kill you just by being in the same lobbie.
Bad and non-invested survivor will throw the game without any perk. And good survivor pretty can afford to farm some points while there's room for that in the trial.
TL;DR not a boon problem
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@MaTtRoSiTy said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3242577#Comment_3242577
One thing I cant understand... why do people boon a COH when the killer is Plague?
It's 1500 points. And another 1500 every time you reboon it in another place.
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True facts from GentlemanFridge. It's kinda gambling, or you have to force situations where killer steal energy from you first (by downing you) and then you steal it back (with blast mine or DS). If killer wasn't maxed out by this moment you'll get it.
Also challenges are bugged now. Maybe you do everything right but the game won't count progress until you re-select the challenge. Or idk what esle can fix this but re-selecting seems working.
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@elyampedup88 said:
I have tried to do the earn 50,000 bloodpoints and no matter what it shows no progression!
Do you try to get it as survivor? Was the same for me but then I switched to killer and got it.
Also re-selection of the archive sometimes works too. I finally made the game "see" my escapes.
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@BugReporterOnly said:
I have been kicking pumpkins left right and center and it isn't giving me any progress and I know I did it so it seems like the event tome is bugged. Also hatch escapes seem to be bugged for that one as escaping via the gate let me progress on it.
I escaped through gates either and didn't get any progress :c
And yeah, I was kicking pumkins too. I'm sure I got right pumkins for the challenge - the ones with haste. But pumpkin challenge registered one thing one game, refused to register second one in next game and finally registered last pumkin after I unselected challenge and selected it again. So now I re-select my challenges after every game just in case.
It's very inconsistent, my other friend get both escapes in his challenge without any problem.
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@hemlock said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3237051#Comment_3237051
That's not the case.
@https://www.twitch.tv/videos/1629450344?t=2h28m40s@
He just opened my profile as usual.
You are the killer, right? Your name wasn't hide here so you wasn't under anonymous mode here.
You definitely should check your anonymous settings to be sure you chose the right one which hide your name for others and not hide it for you only (I know it's obvious and you probably checked it but) and next time (if everything is correct but someone clearly can see your profile) put this into bug section as a report. It's really weird.
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@CoDismylife said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3237285#Comment_3237285
Better stop sharing it before bhvr takes it away from us.
I don't think thay can, tbh.
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Open steam overlay and look at "friend" square. There's "list of friends" and "list of players" options. Click on "list of players" option and choose "previous games" tub. Here're all steam players from prev game. If there are two and more steam anonymous players you have to guess who is who, but if there's only one - you'll find them easily by recognising familiar names and only one new. There will be profile links too.
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@Trey5169 said:
Just re-tested on PC with the intention of submitting a full bug report, cooperative actions seem to be working as intended now.
Any luck with the rest of these?
Escapes don't work either. And getting 50k bps work for killers only despite the challenge being for killers OR survivors.
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Even if you escape the game can say "no" and not count your progress. Enjoy.
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Came with screenshot. I escaped (through gates) and no progress at all.
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I'd like to see HOW MANY players are in 5% for each killer. Of course, Sadako CAN have such w/r for top 5%, but it should be like 10 golden Sadako players vs 1000 Blight players with the same result.
And I bet, all those 60% for Twins is from two (three max) dedicated mains. All others didn't make it to top 5% mmr lol
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@Laluzi said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3220491#Comment_3220491
Low effort? They turned her censor into a gumball machine. The only way they could possibly improve upon this is if they changed her vomit into a stream of skittles.
You got me with this lol. Now I want it to be real.
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If there's no "increase tracking range by N meters" phrase there's no increasing. So yeah, this addon is useless for iri map, and this person could take it by mistake instead of other green addon or whatever. My friend often use green map and once got same addons for iri map just by force of habit.
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@MrMori said:
I don't think that's necessary. I was disappointed when the incentives came back and were additive, but the bloodweb node cost reductions were massive, I think BP gains are fine now even with additive incentives.
Survs could use a buff though, much harder to get 30k+ BP on surv than killer. Still feels mediocre even with incentives.
They think I bring Prove Thyself and toolbox to genrush them, but I bring Prove to get max 10k at one category and I use gloves with 100500 useless brown toolboxes to get passive +500 incomes for random sabo in other... At least they could proportionally increase poins for repaired gens since you have to repair those longer now.
I know multiplied bonus was a bug (and I agree, it's kinda broken compared with other BP gaining mechanics) but it was very sweet bonus ngl
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Let's see on your suggestion from another angle.
You've been told about your counterplays in case of presence of base-kit BT. You have your base-kit ability to hook people far away from gates (math already is in your favour) and then bodyblock to reduce 10-seconds-distance even more and survivor can try to outplay your bodyblock. Also in case of Bubba you definitely can chainsaw them two times, you just have to bodyblock them right first. I've been there pre-patch with old BT, bubba can do that. If you didn't get them without BT (perk) it looks more like being outplayed (even with bad RNG) than holding a hand for me. Base-kit BT is the reason DS and OTR can be disabled safely, in a fair way for survivors. But okay, let's say base-kit BT is too much.
So, what is survivors' counterplay in case of absence of base-kit BT? If you say "they can bring the perk" then you also can bring Iron Grasp or Blood Warden and case closed. If you say "they can simply not be downed" then you simply can kill them earlier or, you know, choose a different hook. Counterplay - it is a way to deal with a situation, not a way to prevent it.
So we are dealing with unhook. You got your hook, no one can take your hook from you; but everything else (like second and third hook and sacrifice in general) haven't earned yet (by game rules, otherwise there wouldn't be a kobe potential and hook stages in the first place). So kobe happened, now it's next fresh situation to deal with and both sides should have a chance. What's your suggestion here without base-kit BT? Get everything else for free, or do you have anything more fair in mind?
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1) 3 swf committed to gens while I was facecamped by Doctor (looped him for two first gens and was the very first hook in the game). They didn't even try to exchange, repaired all three left gens (together with Proof) right by the time I died and then died too because of no way out and noed. At least I saw them unhooking each other, I was worried they don't know they can.
2) Two randoms in The Game map were repairing gen in bathroom while I was hooked right under them in the basement. My swf friend were chased on the other side of the map, and those two goofed around this gen constantly changing repairing spots while I was dying below them. My friend was able to break the chase and save me after I hit second stage.
3) Two shirtless Davids did nothing. They walked together, t-bagged in basement (saw them via Kindred), blocked me in the basement after I brought white glyph there, didn't repair. Killer didn't kill them because saw they do nothing, instead hooked them twice and let them be. They weren't trying to farm or give out positions of others and killer wasn't trying to farm either, it was just miserable and pointless game 2v3. Killer just killed two others (me and my friend) and proceed to farm points on Davids (or maybe even let them repair 4 gens and let them escape, I wasn't in the mood to spectate them so long). I don't know what were their intentions but... well.
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@JustAnotherNewbie said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3215583#Comment_3215583
Aww, I hope someone knows when. Maybe I can save my shards for those times.
Here I found their news about bug.
https://twitter.com/DeadByBHVR/status/1501935986397245444?t=QdmMl2ON6TfqrA__Z2vxYg&s=19It was around march 10, so right when (or right after) Sadako was released. Haven't found any news about announcing in-game discounts themselves, unfortunately, but as far as I remember skins have discounts both in shards and cells at the same time. It should be the same with characters sales too and character sales aren't rare. You can expect those near to huge events and new chapter releases, I think.
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@squirtinq said:
https://us.v-cdn.net/6030815/uploads/6I6Q8QGK6LLE/image.png
The grab isn't supposed to cause entity spikes, as this bugfix says.
We can end it there :)
Near to exit gates. When he throws right into exit gates, it's still here.
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It is. I don't really use shards for that but I remember once event were prolonged because sale were bugged and people couldn't spend their shards. So there definitely are discounts in shards. Unfortunately, I don't know when.
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@Ryuhi said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3215275#Comment_3215275
No problem, I'm always happy to help people learn or understand more. I dabble in some very amateur game development myself so sometimes I find myself explaining things in ways that might not be as apparent without any of that knowledge, but I'm glad I was able to explain things well enough. At the end of the day I always prefer when people understand each other better instead of finding details to argue over, especially seeing how many things we agree on :)
Edit: for the record, I should mention that no two environments are the same, so there can be real reasons for them to be unable to implement one or any of my suggestions. I tried to keep my suggestion as universal as possible, but there could very well be restrictions within the engine or systems already in place that could affect whether they're possible or not. All to be taken with a small grain of salt since its not from one of their in house devs, of course.
True! :)
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@[Deleted User] said:
I've run into it a few times since Pig box logic was updated, and I can't imagine this was playtested at all. Do the devs genuinely thing it's ok for a player to die to pure, 100% RNG? There isn't enough time to search even 4 out of 5 boxes on some maps if you're interrupted at all, let alone 5 out 5.
It feels awful on the survivor end to hold the killer to 2 total hooks through 3 gens and then have the game completely fall apart because two survivors needed 4 searches on a large map with Crate of Gears/Tampered Timer. The killer did absolutely nothing skillful to make that happen. The game rolled some dice in the background and the add ons did the work. It's a PVP game.
One time we lost the game even without those addons. It was a random team and one teammate poped a gen while one was on hook (with a trap), one were injured (with a trap) and one were downed after bad unhook attempt (with a trap). And after that he finished and popped another one (so didn't get agro to get killer busy and let at least some of us an easier time getting rid of traps). I mean, yeah, it wasn't a good game for us to begin with but in the end of the day we could perform much better if he'd left those gens 99'd for a while.
My point is you have to play around Pig's power. The whole team have to play around and make right desicions. It's like Michael: one irresponsible feed-er and the whole team suddenly are screwed.
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@Ryuhi said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3215181#Comment_3215181
Of course. When someone attempts an unhook, it is supposed to be because they either have tools to make it more viable, or because it is their only chance and they want to risk it. Thats the reason it's only a 4% chance, and the devs added additional feedback to make sure you know that it is reducing your hook timer. There are extremely few times where constantly going for self unhooks is anything other than giving up, and further considerations can be written into the check for them (like if multiple people are hooked on first stage at the same time due to a group slug, for instance.) Conditional checks for those types of variables are only limited by the game's ability to track them, so it usually only takes a handful of lines of code to create those types of systems.
With the skill checks there is a little bit more to consider, but not much. You can check for people mashing the button in an attempt to make sure it auto-fails the moment it pops up, and you can check for zero activity at all. The combination of the two gives you a pretty clear window on whether the person is actually trying or not, and the proposed sample set of 2 should usually be enough to make that distinction while not creating false positives in players who simply miss their timing in the skill check. These can also be adjusted over time without telling the playerbase, So that workaround methods rage-quitters attempt would be very inconsistent. At the very least, having it be on the first few skillchecks creates a situation where people who try to fail them on purpose are required to attempt at least a few of them, which creates a trap that either catches the quitters specifically, or at the very least inconveniences them and makes it more difficult to abuse.
The reason why these considerations on both system are taken is to minimize the potential of false positives, as in situations where survivors may been attempting the mechanics properly. Its also why there is no direct punishment imposed: The only thing that would be lost would generally be BP involved in the struggle phase. With the unhook one, You can only have a few unhook attempts per phase one due to the hook timer itself, so if someone is waiting before attempting to unhook they should only end up with a few attempts regardless. Its basically there to prevent them from going straight for the self unhook immediately while not affecting someone who goes for a last second unhook before going to stage 2, for instance.
As for people slipping through the cracks and still being able to ragequit, that is true, but it forces them to be in the game longer and to be more interactive to do it. Those are both deterrents to the behavior of trying to quit early and ruin the game for others, but also gives the other survivors time to recognize that and work on gens to progress the game further and minimize their penalty for the missing survivor. The game's balance shifts with each survivor dead or incapacitated, and the killer can only be at one place at a time: If the person ragequitting makes the killer take longer to get them out, the survivors who lost their teammate can at least even the odds during that time. The comment about storing the data to flag them as attempting to ragequit can then be used to corroborate if the other survivors report them if they continue to disrupt the match. People will always be able to quit by disconnecting their internet/closing the application/etc, but they put a disconnect button in there for a reason: By disconnecting early from a match, you are agreeing to the terms involving your DC penalty, while people use ragequitting on hook to bypass that penalty entirely.
There are a lot of types of data that the game can be tracking, but isn't. It was originally designed in a "P2P" environment, where it would base all of its core foundation of logic on the "host" of the match, which would be the killer specifically. In that type of system, there was no centralized server to maintain consistency for all of the data in a match, so it was more understandable that many integrity checks were not possible in the middle of a match. When they switched over to dedicated servers, many of these types of systems became possible but not implemented. To their defense, it takes a LOT of work to rewrite everything to use the potential of the new structure, so I'm not surprised they have not rewritten everything to use these types of solutions. It does remain a viable way to address fixes going forward however, which is why I wish they would use it more when it can be used to fix situations like this. If nothing else, I absolutely hope that using similar systems to remove video recording ends up being part of their reporting system overhaul they're working on for the future.
Issues like camping/tunneling/genrushing/etc are all a bit more tricky situations to handle, because they have legitimate causes and affects for both sides. They are a product of circular logic, if gens are too fast than killers need be more efficient to keep up with them, which means that survivors need to be more efficient to keep up with killers being more efficient, and so on. Many of those types of issues would easily be resolved if there was less of a potential shift each time a survivor dies, which is why any overhauls regarding those elements would best be directed at that issue in their center.
Also I know that I tend to type in run-on sentences that don't always translate well (especially with stuff like Deepl or google translate, so I again apologize for anything that seems off in translation.)
Oh, got it, ok. I can see this solution as "hard to explain to players" but it could work, yeah. Can agree with you, it really could work and make rage quitting harder without affecting most of the playerbase.
As for people slipping through the cracks and still being able to ragequit, that is true, but it forces them to be in the game longer and to be more interactive to do it.
Also true. I've already used the "they won't stop try to die" argument, but in your solution it's much better than punish everyone with removing all interactive things from being hooked.
If nothing else, I absolutely hope that using similar systems to remove video recording ends up being part of their reporting system overhaul they're working on for the future.
Looking forward for that sort of change too. You seem to understand such things. It's interesting to read, thanks.
They are a product of circular logic, if gens are too fast than killers need be more efficient to keep up with them, which means that survivors need to be more efficient to keep up with killers being more efficient, and so on. Many of those types of issues would easily be resolved if there was less of a potential shift each time a survivor dies, which is why any overhauls regarding those elements would best be directed at that issue in their center.
This and this again. That's why I say it's impossible to solve camping and tunneling by making killers stronger "to be confident enough that they are able to win without camping and tunneling". Untill they can get a massive advantage by early kill (and untill they can get those early kills), they won't stop doing so. And survivors won't stop genrush trying to make as many gens as possible before the first kill. Meh. Hope, devs have plan to change it.
Also I know that I tend to type in run-on sentences that don't always translate well (especially with stuff like Deepl or google translate, so I again apologize for anything that seems off in translation.)
That's totally ok. I'm in that werd point of learning where I struggle with things translator can't actually help with, so it's kind of normal situation for me and a good practice, actually. Like, I translated it pretty right, as far as I can see now, but somehow got the whole idea wrong. Even my first language couldn't fix my misunderstood here, I think. It's just I got you wrong. So no need to apologize and thanks for explainig your idea for me!
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You sound like that's the very last mori for you.
But it's not. Even after the update you'll get plenty of them, especially with new cheap bloodweb and all future events and bloodhunts. If you like to see mori, you'll see more mori if you use offerings now! And after the update you'll have more mori to get BP.
Also, remember, it's work in progress. They said they remove offerings. Now they change them. Maybe when the update will hit live servers they'll remove them again. We don't know. Use offerings now, just in case :)
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@Ryuhi said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3215127#Comment_3215127
If there's a language barrier that is in the way, I absolutely understand and apologize if any of it doesn't make sense. The overall idea is that there would be systems in place to prevent people from either spamming unhook attempts or purposely ignoring or mashing to automatically fail skill checks in the second. It is specifically designed in a way to not affect legitimate misses in the second phase, while not preventing flailing your arms or going for deliverance/legitimate self unhook attempts in the first one. The advantage of doing the skill checks vs purposely triggering the failsafe is that you do not lose any of the time that purposely missing two checks takes off of the hook timer. The data is also held so that if the person decides to take it out on their teammates by sandbagging them or disrupting the game further, people will be able to report them without needing to record the interaction (while also not leaving room for people to false report each other and abuse it.)
My priority is on how people ragequitting early on the hook both ruins the match for their teammates and the killer, but also how it corrupts BHVRs internal statistics tracking that they use to evaluate the state of the game regularly.
Theoretically sounds good, but practically I can't imagine how to separate legit self-unhooking and attempt to suicide on purpose out of frustration. You said smth about timings of attempts and I can't imagine how it's different for suicider and someone who objectively has no other hope but three self-unhook attempts. If you can explain your idea, it would be super cool.
And for second stage it's kinda same. I'm not sure you can tell the difference between two of me: first me is trying to kill myself by intentionaly hitting skillchecks righ after the success zone (don't know if it's different from ignoring but anyway) and second me who are too distracted by friends' jokes she hit skillchecks too late accidentally (and because of unlucky lags). From game's POV two of me act similar. Maybe it could be better to not remove skillchecks, only remove insta-death after second miss?.. Like, you still can miss skillchecks to speed up the process but two missed skillchecks can't kill you right away, you have misse two or three more. But in that case devs could did that in the "struggle update", and I wonder what thoughts were behind their desicion to keep it as it is.
Idea about keeping the data is amaising. I know that ticket isn't required for those reports (I assume, they ban if several players report you for same things even without video evidences) but this would be even better.
Anyway, it's still "you can't just remove suicide button" for me because in your solution nothing is "just" and "removed". And, technically, it still leaves a gap to sneak in for those who want to exit the match asap - they still can surrender to killer to be hooked three times early in the game (and make it in a legit unreportable way). Technically, it's still a way to die and go next pretty easy and without DC penalty (the main OP's concern). That's why I suggested to be consistent and remove mid-elimination at all. At least, it'd also remove camping and tunneling - three birds with one shot, you know :D
So yeah, I can see now how your solution could possibly limit rage quits, but I can't catch a technical idea behind it to secure legit plays.
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@Ryuhi said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3215040#Comment_3215040
I just had a solution 2 pages back that addressed suicides not corrupting developer data while also lessening their impact on the rest of the game, and doing so in a way that automated most of the process and even allowed for a sliding scale approach to punishment to account for false positives. It got 2 votes up and 0 replies.
You don't need to reinvent the wheel. You just need to put in the simple types of variable storage that should have been in the game since day 1.
Honesly, I didn't get difference between your suggestion and OP's (maybe because of my English). Afai understand, on first stage you can self-unhook only early and that's exactly what suiciders need, or you can self-unhook only too late - and then you can't try it three times - it's a nerf for legit situations. Then, no matter whether you hit skillchecks or no, you can't change anything because if you don't hit skillcheck they just stop to appear - you sit on 2d phase and wait others to save you, you can't die and can't decide to stay alive. Then why try to hit skillchecks is the first place and how it's not more boring and not more agency-less than now?
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@Ayodam said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3213049#Comment_3213049
This topic is a wash, but I was curious about your response specifically. Survivors aren’t a team in DBD, but... if they were how would no ‘mid-game’ deaths look? Killers pressure matches by scoring early sacrifices. Survivors lose pressure in these situations. If survivors didn’t die in the early or mindgame it would stop killers from applying pressure, no..?
Sorry for the late reply.
Yes, it would stop killers from applying pressure. That's why you can't just remove mid-game deaths, you have to give killers other instruments to apply pressure in a different way. Build-in thanatophobia, build-in Artist's "block gens after all survivors were hooked once" (and maybe not for 30 seconds but until survivors do smth to unblock) and other different things to apply pressue in a fun and not boring way.
Maybe killer could be able gain hook- or time-tokens and light up hexes for those tokens. You can imagine plenty of features and plenty of new perks for that. Also we can then balance game around new conditions and make killers stronger. At the same time camping and tunnelling won't work because camp and tunneling is for eliminate someone to gain advantage and you can't get advantage by this now, you'll just loose. Genrushing won't be possible too if you add build-in balance features to prevent it (you can limit gen repairing speed; or make it more profitable for survs to group up on one gen; or make some gens be blocked by Entity and make Entity change blocked gens after completing one gen to make looking for survivors easier and make it impossible to complete two or three gens in a short time).
And you have to change the win conditions too, of course. You have to base it on hooks or time of the game, for example. It's Dead by Daylight after all, maybe survivors need to do smth before Daylight or they'll die? Idk.
So, yeah, it's kinda hard reconstruction the game needs to achieve that. That's my point: in my opinion, those problems (like suicides, camping, tunneling, genrushing and so on) are core things, you can't fix them without either huge re-make of all basics or making experience worse for one (or both) side. Unfortunately.
That's why devs are changing slugging by re-making the whole mori system and adding new features. You can't just remove smth. And you can't just remove suicide button either.
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@SuzuKR said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3213163#Comment_3213163
In games like Siege (5v5 FPS objective), if you die, you are eliminated for the entire round, and a headshot regardless of distance is instant death. This is a game where 800+ RPM guns are the typical.
In games like League, a late game death can put you out of commission for 60+ seconds in which there is literally nothing that can shorten that (outside of one of the recent champions’ abilities).
In games like chess, it will become absolutely unrecoverable past a certain point if you get outread enough times because you will continuously be corralled into decisions you have less and less power over.
Losing agency is a part of games.
It's a lot of text but I'm not sure how to explain my pov in a shorter way, sorry.
You are eliminated in dbd too - by killer. I'm not close with league but I googled that you can't be eliminated forever here, you are waiting to be back in-game (which doesn't affected by your teammates decision to return or not return you in the game, it's the timer and timer only), you can plan your next moves (those games have much more dynamics in them) and - again - you can't be eliminated forever, you are respawning again and again untill all players won't be eliminated at once (if understand correctly). It's more like new mori system, you can't do anything but waiting for "respawn" and pray your last standing teammate won't be downed before that. And that's why they added respawns in the first place! Being slugged with no choice had no agency for players. It was boring, more boring than intended. Now you can wait until timer pass and get up. Or not get up and crawl first. Or anything else. Interaction.
But with hooks you can't unhook yourself after timer will pass, no, you die insted, the game ends for you if your teammates won't save you. You have even less agency than in legends, if legends is zero then in dbd being on hook you are below zero with your system. That's my consern.
In games like Siege... I'm still not familiar. But that's either like death on hook (game ended, go next game; so you don't loose agency, you just loose the game) or like CS system when the whole point of the game is to eliminate gamers and you play several rounds to see who is more skilled. The whole game have rounds to play in. All gamers play one round, it ends, then you play another - together. No one loose agency temporaly here. It's more like SWF then, you are dead and you wait all your friends to end the game to go into next together. This match isn't really affected, you've already made everything you could and were ended this round. So you can't compare this round with hooks, honestly, hooks are personal states, rounds is for all.
And chess... dbd has this too in the normal gameplay. You slowly win or slowly loose. And there're no parts of the game where you suddenly have to skip your turns untill your teammate touch you. You stil can make turns. You even can make a suicidal ones. For the very last moment.
Like, yeah, I got your point with agency, you are correct about you can be in lack of it sometimes, I don't argue that. What I'm trying to say: those "lacks of agency" is kinda build in, desined around and compensated properly. They have proper limits.
Slugging (bad one, with no hooking without reasons) is a lack of agency for survivors and it is being addressed right now. Devs are trying to avoid it because it wasn't really intended to be so boring. And all your examples were intended. It's not like earlier in league you could run across the map as a ghost and do some stuff, but because of people who didn't do anything and screwed all team... now no one can do anything too, like now there's timer, sit and wait because some of you did bad. It was always been that way, it was intended, it was as boring as it was ment to be. And it has a guaranteed end, which returns you back in game (unless all others are dead too).
And your suggestion makes hooks more boring than it was. I would be ok if there was league system - afther one minute you're off the hook automatically so you just wait it out and you're good if all survivors are good too. I would be ok with Siege(?)/CS system - we have three rounds, I'm on hook waiting untill all others will be on hook too and then we start next round unhooked and healthy. Then yes, doing nothing would be kinda ok. But with current system?.. When there's no guarateed unhooking back into the game? When we alredy have a lot complaints about boring and routine stuff? I'm not sure.
If you think, it's ok - then ok, I asked your opinion, I get it :) Thanks.