hastarkis
hastarkis
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@j4p_was_here said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/meet-your-maker/discussion/comment/3576608#Comment_3576608
Actually...permanent jump up and down is the key... never stop moving. If you got hit mid air you still die sometimes
But to be honest, just give up if the whole base is like that without safe spots.
I built one of those as well , only 1 player finished it until i added some safe points.
Oh, so there's a way. Good to know. I dodge bases without safespots but it's good to know a way around for other bases. Thank you!
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Just met such outpost in dangerous area. 45 cubes (according to boost) and nothing else, they stuck vertically so floor is always a lava. I don't know what am I supposed to do to pass it. I tried to shield but apparently shield doesn't save you from acid already dropped on a floor. I can't grapple efficiently bc there are turns everywhere and also walls are covered with acid too.
I'm not good at speed hardware and such so I'm confused, it's annoying but also looks impassable for me. Does anybody know, is it possible to win this set up and how? Feel dumb abandoning those but can't find a solution by my own :/
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So you want survivors not be able to switch from p2 Dwight into p26 Nea. And that solves what problem exactly? They still have all their perks, items and still are in swf. They won't switch into high prestige character but that doesn't change anything except you don't know they have p26 nea in their pool.
MMR is shared among all survs. P2 Dwight or p26 Nea, this person would be matchmaked into your lobby anyway.
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@MadMoeZel said:
addendum, why not just suggest making tombs be unbreakable by traps and guards so that only the raider can control when they drop their resources? that way you only lose your resources in operator error.
That's a good suggestion.
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@Amaroq64 said:
It seems like people on this forum are only here to bombard the developers with their ungratefulness until the devs get demoralized and quit.
This game is amazing. The only things wrong with it are:
- Lazy builders putting a room of death with a ton of bs piled into it.
- The raiders drying up 1-2 hours after you activate your map.
And you can at least do something about the former.
The only thing I'd ask from the new DLC is, if you're gonna give us the new trap/guard/suit/weapon for free, at least charge me an increment of 5. My synthite is going to be an increment of 5 minus 1 forever now, lol, and I'm gonna be OCD about it every time I look at it.
Loool, yeah, increment of five would be better xD but lazy builders now have to be more creative bc new shield suit and new weapon own them. Also with new rank point system I don't mind dying that much.
BTW you can farm some maps until debuff makes your incomes 1 point of resources and fix your numbers! I don't say it's ok now if you can fix it, it's just a way to help OCD :)
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They have same problem in DBD now. I know those games technically have separate dev groups but might be sort of global issue.
So maybe it will be fixed along with dbd. idk, but
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@Seraphor said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/Meet-Your-Maker/discussion/comment/3442800#Comment_3442800
I think it's fairly clear they panicked at the falling player count and decided to throw buckets of prestige points and synthite at players to keep them playing.
Unfortunately, the opposite happened.
Well, yes, but those prestige points are from prev bases, I haven't built anything new since prestige requirements were changed, just retired all the rest, saw 2-4 raids max per prestige and that's it. So even back then I had enormous amount of prestige points (70%+ were from accolades!) with no use (player xp they give? great). Then what's the point in building smth to get a lot of accolades?
And, like, yeah. Now it's worse. I like raiding and still raid, but
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@noggieB said:
I was getting about 6 raids per prestige before the patch, 0 raids until the bug was fixed, and now back to 6 raids.
That seems about right, because it takes me around 6 raids to gather the synthite for another prestige. (Combined with the other sources of synthite such as tributes etc.)
The new synthite drops might be slightly too high, but they are closer to what I would like than the old drop rate.
(Although the old drop rate would have been fine, if we could use accolates to help pay for prestiges. That would encourage builders to make fun, artistic and ingenious outposts, instead of just going for kills.)
Yeah, accolades give nothing valuable outside of prestige points. I have lot of p10 bases with 2-3-and even 40 thousands of extra prestige points. What for? I can have nothing extra (on less creative outposts) with exactly same result. It would be great to be able to pay additional points to save synth or convert all extra points into resources.
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There is creative geometry setup when bomb ejector has triangle thing under it to divide bombs into two groups. First one drops right on top of the raider and second one is going slightly back with a slope shaped vent: so raiders with "running to where you came from" instinct still get bombs on their head and can't avoid explosion.
But you have to make high ceiling (2-3 blocks), cover "activation" drop with eagle eye holocube (because of high ceiling) and mask "back drop vent" with normal holocube (so this back drop gap with trap itself don't be spotted too early before even active). If well hidden/placed it works pretty good, even on its own. Probably can catch speed runners too with some geometry alternations and trap combos.
Chaos bombs are the best.
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As a general vibe to target, I'd say anything bronze ranks
I must add that's pointless because every season everybody becomes bronze ranks and have to climb again. Deep in the core that's a battlepass for rewards, not a rating system.
Of course experienced people climb faster but - still - they have to climb. And while they are climbing they are "bronze", "silver" and so on which will affect this system in a very wrong way at the start of every new season (at the very least).
Also, it is possible (and pretty much intended) to just grind your way into masters if you play enough. And, in addition, it is possible to be great raider with bronze rank (social raids don't give rank points). How can you take them into account along with skilled masters and inexperienced "bronze" players and make it accurate? It's an actual meaningless mess.
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@LordRaidenCR said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/Meet-Your-Maker/discussion/comment/3428802#Comment_3428802
So, how do you block Outposts?
You press "view player's profile" key (P for PC) on post-raid screen or in replay station and get 3 options: view profile (if you both on steam), report and block. Blocking prevents you from getting maps of this player and prevents this player from getting your maps in their pool.
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I'm ok with lower maximum but it does nothing bc I have nothing to cut in my case. I have only one (two max) outposts already. And, probably, will be able to add third (mastered) one.
And I doubt it does anything at all. It forces people with 3-4-5 active outposts to stop and loose their raids for more raids on other one/two outposts, right, smth could be saved here. But those people were raiding a lot to keep their 5 outposts active and now they don't. So spherical builder in vacuum gets several raids from lowered maximum but also looses in raids because other (more active) builders don't raid as much. I can't see it solving anything, tbh.
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That's exactly what it does. The patrolling path is blocked by the cube preventing guards from passing through it until it is triggered to dissappear. There is no word about making it actually solid, the guards just see it as an obstruction when patrol or chase.
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@MythicMikeneto said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/Meet-Your-Maker/discussion/comment/3425423#Comment_3425423
But you do get synth for raiding.
Every 9 outpost you get a +125 synth/parts
Every 5 advisor levels you get +250 synth/parts
Trap, guard kills, and even tombs are random to give synth. Popping a tomb and seejng all traps is a super sad moment.
Just wish that upon those tomb hunter/leavers lol.
Every properly ended raid gives you this, correct. And MadMoeZel doesn't get this but get much much more for tomb hunting. That's what I meant. Normal raiding is less profitable than tomb hunting. Or maybe not less but also not enough to choose it.
Like, you say that traps and guards give you synth but do they with all corrosive ammo traps? I get my ammo back easily but all my loot is buried under acid and I get nothing. I legitimately remember outposts where all my synth was from tombs (smth like 20-30) and that's it despite several deaths and destroyed traps. Yes, I got genmat to get level reward later but I bet I'd got same genmat and spent less time if I abandoned this one after tombs and finished another outpost with no pits rather than this one.
That's sad too but apparently I, as a builder, need to think this through and avoid some fair trap builds just because raiders don't feel rewarded enough for beating them.
Every five properly raided outposts give me 250 synth from leveling. Tomb hunting gives more in less time. But boring af :/
@MadMoeZel my game is also in ssd and my loading time isn't much better than hdd :/ well, with this setup... Meh. Just meh.
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@MadMoeZel said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/Meet-Your-Maker/discussion/comment/3425650#Comment_3425650
Master 1 means nothing with no rank penalties. with 0 setback, literally anyone can climb. there is no longer a skill requirement for master 1 as there is no way to go backwards.
yeah, i'm gonna spend my time stockpiling a crap ton of low effort resources while i'm able to profit off this poor decision. because it's again, profitable. i can now farm synthite at a rate of over 3000 an hour doing this. so i'm gonna hit the currency cap.
you know what, yeah. i'm fine with this. builders no longer have to raid, they can just farm tombs and leave for no penalty. they made it so i don't have to raid anymore i can focus on my building. wonderful!
HEY BUILDERS, you don't actually have to beat bases anymore to build, just take tombs on the big maps and quit any that are blocked since there is no rank penalty, leave after getting tombs, don't do outpost. saves time, better profit per hour, less frustration, and you can go back to focusing on what you actually wanted to do. POWER TO THE BUILDERS!!!! BUILDER TO MASTER!!!
Less frustration, yeah. And then all your bases will be raided like that, too. But I got you. I saw your comments about master and numbers go brrrr but your argument about no negatives makes sense. I guess, there still can be only one 1st master but it's understandble if you aren't interested anymore.
And, I guess, you just really like to exploit system's weaknesses for max profit :) You'd be a good game balance tester. At least bug with corrosives was fun and challenging for you (and you think it's healthy for the game) but are you really going to use this method even though it's boring af and hurts other builders? If yes then why? For numbers? For devs attention? It's just your favorite playstyle? Is this healthy?
Like, for instance, don't you think it's more profitable to actually get genmat and get additional synth from levels? In my experience you farm more parts than synth from tombs anyway, it's ridiculous and doesn't worth a time of loading. If I'd try to farm synth i'd find an easy outposts with tons of traps and no corrosive floors and clear it as many times as possible before debuffs. Isn't it more profitable to clear one base 10-15 times than jump into 10-15 bases with tombs rng? Especially when it's pretty hard to find big normal maps, pretty all of them are small or medium.
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@Nahasno said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/Meet-Your-Maker/discussion/comment/3425656#Comment_3425656
Oh... this is a very misleading post. Since i read a lot here in the forum i know that you are not a pure raider on the contrary you seem to like building as much as raiding. So it's very sarcastic and ironic - i get you but some will not understand it the way it is intended.
Because if they really do follow that advice they shoot them selfs in the foot because there are no pure raiders in this game at least not long time, because well there are no incentives to hold them in game after they maxed out their equipment there would be only cosmetics for them.
That's one of the big problems of this game, that many don't get that they can't do only the one thing (build only) without hurting the experience of anybody else that plays the game as intended.
The problem is there are pure raiders. It's possible to be pure raider. Your argument about "nothing is here to keep them busy after max out equipment" is kinda true but it's... personal? Not objective? Like it's a matter of preferences whether you like to raid bases with nothing to unlock or not. But it's possible. They can raid and do nothing else if they like.
And it's logical for players that if you can be pure raider you should also be able to be a pure builder too, but you can't, and this time it's not about preferences, it's about game economy. It's missleading in the core, deep in souls of main builders it feels unfair and unrewarding. People love symmetry, people don't think through, they try, get friction and become sad even if it's for a matter of game life.
There wouldn't be THAT much friction (I think) if it wouldn't be possible to be a pure raider too. If raiders have to build (at least anything) to continue raids then it's ok that builders have to raid to continue building.
Or with better synth economy: pure raiders can raid just several brutals casually and be satisfyed (and even unlock smth new if there is smth to unlock) but builders liretally must raid a lot because otherwise they stop being builders (their bases can't be active). And it's not even guaranteed they'll be able to unlock anything after that grind, people have to choose between several unlocks and one prestige.
So back to your "that many don't get that they can't do only the one thing (building)". If devs want people to accept it's impossible to be pure builders, devs need to make it more rewarding. So people could feel justifyed and fair that they have to do that much work to keep their bases active. But then you get 4 raids per 24h cycle and 35 synth. And 1,5 levels of advisors, ofc. Completely ok reward for someone who unlocked everything already. I guess, I must raid another 15 raids to restart this cycle (and do that couple times bc I have more than one outpost) because that's deffinetely smth that can incentives to hold me in game after I maxed out my equipment.
Am I missing smth here? Because that's my experience and I stopped to build new things for now, beeing even partially builder isn't worth my time, I just raid and that's it.
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@MadMoeZel said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/Meet-Your-Maker/discussion/comment/3425263#Comment_3425263
they removed the penalty for leaving, i'm literally going into maps, breaking tombs and leaving, no exposed tombs, i leave. either way, builder gets nothing and i get loot. ez win. you block the tomb with holo cube, put it in your base? good for you, don't care, moving on. that is what the game is going to become for everyone and i'm getting a head start and profiting off this idiotic setup. you should do the same.
Master the 1st is awaiting along with all opportunities to learn new things and you are going to spend your time loading, jumping around bedrocks and loading again. Interesting.
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Technically it is already implemented. You need to raid several outposts (five-seven if lucky) to get several raids on one of yours (to earn enough synth to prestige and activate, and then you get special matchmaking boost untill first raids). It forces builders to raid (to earn synth) while pure raiders can raid as much as they want sitting on a huge mountain of resources they don't really spend.
And you want to add another "currency" to earn for builders, which pure raiders will stack up in a corner with no use. Just why.
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@MythicMikeneto said:
So for me, at top out, I will make an assessment of effort required to win versus the gain.
If I have spent 10 active minutes and 3 deaths and havent even caught site of the gen mat (and die again) I am likely gonna bounce.
Not all outpost are built for players like me, so I leave my two accolades and be on my way.
As a builder, unless you are going go build your outpost with a solution in mind for all player types, some are going to 'tap out' on your build (sometimes even without trying).
The blocking holo cubes over tombs are likely to get you (stupidly) blocked, because of the high levels of raider 'entitlement' to tombs (though I find the idea of post gen mat access to tombs to be a great idea overall).
How is a raider coming in, not being able to access tombs, then leaving and a raider coming in, looting tombs, then leaving: any different? They gain and you dont?
Being spiteful about raiders who dont want to raid your build sounds kinda toxic.
In my opinion, Builders need to build to the interest of the raiders. They will always hold the keys to a build's success story.
If you build a killbox ans the raider deosnt want. speend run high adrenaline experience, they are gonnaa leave.
If you build an stroll through easy base, speed runner pro are gonna blaze through, 0 death, and not leave commends.
If you build a time sink maze, soem are gonna leave after 15 mintues of boredom and leave no accolades for wasting their time.
The point is, you cant please them all.
We need more raiders of all different types, period.
I think these 'builder only' players or dragging down the game by soaking up raids and not giving any back.
The number of raiders need to be equal to or greater than the number of builders. The solution is not punishing the dud raiders (effevtively punishing all raiders), but instead actively encouraging everyone to raid more.
Cheesy meta and spiteful oupost builds arent gonna do that. Be better than that.
>>How is a raider coming in, not being able to access tombs, then leaving and a raider coming in, looting tombs, then leaving: any different? They gain and you dont?
Difference is if they see/understand tombs were built into outpost they can try to get them OR they can even pass those outposts in the first place if it's pretty obvious from preview. As far as I understand, those people are trying to search for outposts high in the air or with visible tomb arrows on outside walls/bedrocks.
Yes, of course, you can't please all types of raiders but all those raiders who don't match with your base spend your matchmaking time. We don't know if deathless abandoning somehow affects matchmaking but could be that it doesn't affect it at all. So, like, you have some minimal visibility before you loose matchmaking boost. You only can get that many raids during that time. If all those raids go in, loot tombs and go out without even trying... that's frustrating af? It's not bad to try to suck them into your base with their greed. If they want tombs so bad they can try to find them inside and maybe even have fun playing. If they leave just because there's no free tombs outside then, well, I guess, not all outposts are built for players like those.
>>The number of raiders need to be equal to or greater than the number of builders. The solution is not punishing the dud raiders (effevtively punishing all raiders), but instead actively encouraging everyone to raid more.
To raid more. That's extremely correct. As for now "going in, looting tombs and going out" could be more profitable (due to awful RNG and corrosive floors which both can give you zero synth) and more desirable (due to time effectivness) than actual raiding. IMO, people should get synth for raiding not for tomb hunting :/
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@momolepro48 said:
Bug or not its good for creativity and diversité in outposts
But it's not?
More options - more creativity, true. But if you have hundreds of options and only one THIS effective there's no creativity anymore. If you don't place corrosives to cover every possible trap you effectively loose possibilities to kill raiders. Hence, there are tons setups that could be considered as creative (without corrosives) but end up like "oh that second wave strat again".
It could be mod with coded logic, could be new special kind of trap with pros and cons, could be anything intended and balanced (i.e. good for certain setups only and bad for other situations) but not this bug with no downsides except the capacity. Using second wave cubes was always a good decision no matter what setup you use and idk how can it be good for diversity and creativity if objectively everyone should use it :/
They'll add new stuff to help with diversity and creativity, maybe they'll even use this bug as inspiration but we definitely don't need this thing as it was before patch.
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You should post it in bug report section since this behaviour isn't intended.
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Same people was like "I don't care about rank, I just need my synth; maybe I give the base a shot if it looks cool but I leave anyway after couple attempts" even before the update. You can find comments here on forums. I don't know why they think it's better, they spend time loading and searching for tombs to get smth like 20 synth in total and go next... Oh no, I know why, because synth drop is so low (and often get caught in corrosives) that searching for tombs and leaving sometimes are better than searching for tombs and completing the outpost. I recall raids I got ridiculous 30 points even though I destroyed everything (several times). And sometimes it's extremely hard to destroy things bc the outpost was designed to be speedrun.
Anyway, developing assist is good and all but you can leave your tombs unguarded inside your outposts too. Reward those who play the game and not those who want to farm. And, in general, don't bother with those raiders. They will be there anyway no matter what (along with people who overestimated themselves). Dbd has AFK killers farming rift fragments even though it is extremely unrewarding. But this "unrewarding" part isn't that unrewarding in mym.
Don't let them [be lazy with you] get tombs without entering the outpost (and make sure it can be understood from thumbnail), support new players by not using anything that can destroy tomb and kill raider at the same time (robbing their resources), and vocalise grind problem. Maybe devs will add good synth bonus for completed outpost, huh. I wish.
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@mirrormask said:
https://us.v-cdn.net/6030815/uploads/QDNM1GX9TVV3/initial-stuck.jpg
https://us.v-cdn.net/6030815/uploads/A0N4H1BMA5NY/path-continued.jpg
@MadMoeZel Sorry for the late reply - didn't catch your message. My PS4 is having issues with screenshots so I took some quick crappy photos with my phone. One of where the HRV breaks, and another of where the path picks back up later anyway and goes straight to the GenMat - I don't understand what's going on.
The system is kinda tricky and not super intuitive. The game doesn't know your intentions, it doesn't know which way you want HRV to take and therefore it can't show you a real problem.
Like, imagine fresh outpost with default layout. If I delete several blocks of the original path, the game try to calculate the shortest path and shows red point right where I broke it. Even if I try to make another way (invalid by mistake) the game still shows the original broken path: it can't possibly know I was trying to create a new one. This another way isn't valid and the game doesn't see it so I don't even know where I built it wrong.
Since the game doesn't know which way should be valid (but actually invalid), it shows the break of the latest valid path, it can't see all new ones you are trying to create but fail.
Check this out. Here's the normal path:
Then I try to rebuild it. But somehow my path is broken even I CLEARLY have a good way to genmat?..
I even try to force HRV in a right way but he doesn't want and goes into a wall? Everything is ok, I have EXACTLY same way but one block left?
What's wrong with it? Ahhh, here it is, I accidentaly put wrong shape, this block seems to make the path invalid.
And... yes, now it can see new path as valid.
See? The break was in completely wrong place but there are hundreds of invalid paths along with yours so the game uses the latest valid path as reference and that's it.
Your problem could be a bug, actually, sometimes the system just doesn't work and glitch itself. But in my experience (not only my building but also from people who complained about same thing) more often than not it's indeed invalid path. In my example the break in new path is close and easy to see but imagine building a new long creative path, the actual break can be ANYWHERE actually and really hard to notice. Especially with those shapes:
I can't recall all times I failed this way x)
So, general advice: try to check the WHOLE path, not only that "broken" part of it. Be careful, pedantic and picky. Check all weak spots: all ramps, all turnes, all conic shapes, check ceilings and walls. Those could look normal for you but can be actually impassable for HRV, it needs more than half of the block to move. Even though you think the path have to be valid here - check everything.
Maybe you even want to dig an alternative hole from genmat and put straight path outside of your actual building: with no ceiling, no ramps (or no roofed ones) and no creative shapes and turnes - to force a valid recalculation. I bet this new straight path will be ok (then it's not a bug for sure), and your problem is in some accidental ceiling/corner blocks you can't notice bc they seem normal and you are too focused around red points.
Hope, you'll figure it out!
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Not reached cap, at least? I've passed 101 recently but Hugo (https://youtu.be/kFNrIIiL_VQ) has level over 430.
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@TragicSolitude said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/Meet-Your-Maker/discussion/comment/3419493#Comment_3419493
According to this, anyone who signed up for the closed beta got the HRV decal:
https://twitter.com/MeetYourMaker/status/1595123537077235712
(I wouldn't know, I didn't buy the game on Steam. I have it where I have DbD, on PS4.)
That's correct.
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@Tsulan said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/Meet-Your-Maker/discussion/comment/3410151#Comment_3410151
I think there are no exclusive decals or props for people that played the beta.
There is exclusive decal for beta testers.
https://twitter.com/MeetYourMaker/status/1623811481992060928?s=20
But no props.
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@Nahasno said:
But why abandon the grave site - you can just build something else in it instead?
I don't think it the site itself that's the reason the outpost doesn't get raided.
If you refill the base you loose all prestige points you've got so far but requirements are still there. And if you managed to presrige the base at least several times and then failed... It is super hard to prestige in one cycle from zero, with no legacy points. Even if you create smth new it's possible you just won't be able to prestige it anymore due to lack of raids and/or deaths.
So you either refill forever or make social. I'd prefer to delete. Also I'd prefer to get refund from p10 bases too. Like, sooner or later we'll have all 200 slots occupied by p10 outposts. You have to delete those to continue building and you get nothing from it. Yes, it's far away now but one day we'll be there.
50% price refund is fair. Anything better then zero would be ok tbh
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@Seraphor said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/Meet-Your-Maker/discussion/comment/3413012#Comment_3413012
But it makes sense if they try to show similar rank bases to similar rank raiders.
I don't think that makes any sense.
Your ability to raid is largely unrelated to your ability to build.
Maybe it would make sense if we had separate 'Raider' and 'Builder' ranks but...
Missed your comment, sorry. Your ability to raid is largely unrelated to your ability to build and yet somehow they use rank of builder to calculate your rank gaining/loosing after the outpost. Even though we all understand that pretty all those thousands of rank poins builder got from raids and not from building.
EDIT: it looks like official AMA but it's from another forum post, I've just heard this info too and pretty sure they've said it on one of their stream. Didn't want to copypaste but then I thought it might look confusing so I here's the disclaimer.
So, it seems, if you die in a good base of not so good raider (with low rank because every time they raid they loose points) you loose more points than you should. And vice versa. Maybe it would make sense if we had separate 'Raider' and 'Builder' ranks but... But.
Maybe I understood or heard smth wrong but at this point I won't be surprised if they use those ranks also to show you more "fair" outposts so you can gain right amount of points.
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Oh my god, it works! It is so... odd... Like why, what's wrong with coordinates here that all bolts come back...
Great job! I guess we can use this information while there's no patch xD
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@MadMoeZel said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/Meet-Your-Maker/discussion/373986/guy-dies-18-times-and-i-got-nothing
who cares about the resources, the comedy that he left the game and left it running is well worth the loss in my opinion (this is mostly a joke but oh my word that 7 hour replay is funny)
for serious though, i'm not sure how they determine which kills do and don't give resources sometimes. from what i've seen we get rewarded most for multiple short raids when it comes to dropped resources (genmat earned bonuses promote high kill counts) but i've also noticed that if i clear out multiple outposts with or without similar death counters that they do not give the same ammount of resources or even anything that indicates it is related to number of deaths. this leads me to believe there is some sort of RNG loot table for each death and sometimes, you just roll snake eyes.
for serious though, i'm not sure how they determine which kills do and don't give resources sometimes
In this situation it's a bug. The raider crashed session and the game didn't registered deaths. Neither in resources nor in prestige points.
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@Danimal said:
Thank you !
I should add that accolades also give you prestige points. Try to get them too, by decorating the appearance and avoiding cheese tactics. Boltshots with hunter mod and acid cubes work well on normal (for new players).
Also you can check time of raids in your replay station and activate your base several times for couple hours each aiming at most crowded hours (if you can determine those).
But I believe those bases are cursed x) Good luck with that.
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You get only one login bonus per day. If you get several notifications it's a bug, in reality you get several tribute bonuses (cells), not daily. So you don't miss anything, actually.
Tho, it's frustrating to not get rewards you think you were granted with. I believe they'll fix that in the next patch.
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@Tsulan said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/Meet-Your-Maker/discussion/comment/3413012#Comment_3413012
I don´t think rank plays a role in regard of what maps you find. For example, in yesterdays stream a dev said that new players are not limited on what kind of maps they can play on. That implys that rank has no effect on matchmaking.
So if dev didn't mean new players don't have any restriction preventing them from playing dangerous/brutal bases... there's no real explanation why my outposts don't get 4 raids every hour unlike MadMoeZel's outposts xD You've killed my hope :D
Well, I'm going to get master anyway so it doesn't really matter.
@TragicSolitude said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/Meet-Your-Maker/discussion/comment/3412686#Comment_3412686
From the years I've been playing DbD, what I've seen is that BHVR does a lot of things that might sound good in theory but ignore the reality of player psychology. For some reason they are really bad at understanding human psychology. To BHVR, the grind trumps fun, and the drive to compete trumps burnout. So what they've done here doesn't surprise me at all. Rather than encouraging raiding by making it more fun and rewarding, they instead punished builders by increasing the Synthite grind (and also by treating builders like an assembly line to just keep pumping out new content for their game). This is what BHVR does, they go negative instead of positive, they favor frustrating gameplay over rewarding gameplay.
I hope BHVR fixes this, I really do. I like MYM, but there are numerous mechanics in the game that work against the players and will actually discourage playing. The grind is one of them.
I thought "fixed that for you" would sound kinda rude and aggressive so I deleted that part x)
Ah, okay, I can see that. I've seen that phrase used so often it's like punctuation to me lol
I'm sad everything you've said makes sense for me now x) Let's hope they'll fix it somehow.
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@Tsulan said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/Meet-Your-Maker/discussion/comment/3412767#Comment_3412767
What does rank have to do with raids?
Gold 1
They have formula to separate maps and offer them to different people.
I don't know if it contains rank in any way but I guess they pretty could use it to calculate things which could lead to smaller map pool for higher (less flooded) ranks (and therefore higher chances for every map here to be raided). Of course it's only my guess. But it makes sense if they try to show similar rank bases to similar rank raiders.
@MadMoeZel said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/Meet-Your-Maker/discussion/comment/3412767#Comment_3412767
i'm not sure how much rank influences it, but i heard rumor that rank does affect if you see a player's map but never found confirmation one way or the other. also, are you turning your maps off during the dead hours? i use steam charts to disable my maps when the player count is under 500
edit their dead time is from about 8pm to 4AM PST (GMT-8) i turned my map on about 2 hours ago (posted at 6:08 AM GMT-8)
I don't have time through a day to manage my maps this way :c I buy 9k maps only and keep them active 24 hours. Like I activate them at 3 am (GMT+3), go to sleep, to work, come back into game at 10-12pm, check everything, raid and later (at 3am) I prestige and reactivate. But I don't get any spikes like you described. My raids seem random, without any time consistency. One raid here, one raid there, that's it. Not like all four in ohe hour. That's why I stopped. All my maps are on hold now except one.
Well, I guess, if you can activate your outposts at right time for 2 hours, get value and turn the maps off till next time it's better than one long run. Sad.
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@MadMoeZel said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/Meet-Your-Maker/discussion/comment/3412703#Comment_3412703
30 deaths an hour, 4 attempts per hour is my low average, sometimes its up as high as 8. i run exclusively normal until a map is p5, then i move them to brutal because every other dungeon is a champion run in brutal. this maximizes my raid frequency.
Oh you are master. I guess matchmaking works here...
I'm silver 4, almost gold, hadn't enough time to get higher. And I get 4-5 attempts PER PRESTIGE. At max. Even champions don't get too many raids. And I know everything that can influence raiders' decision to try the base so I'm pretty sure mine aren't bad in that way. It's either tons of maps in pool or I'm extremely unlucky. Your rank is the only possible answer for me :/ I guess I'm going to grind master rank as fast as possible and try again with same outposts, they aren't active for now anyway, I' ll keep them and will activate later as master. Not clear experiment but it is something.
@Tsulan said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/Meet-Your-Maker/discussion/comment/3412635#Comment_3412635
That is nowhere near what i get from my bases. Kill rate of 5 gets me like 30-50 synth on several raids. But 30 raids per Hour? How? I get maybe 3 raids per hour and am happy about it...
And what's your rank? Are you master or lower?
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@TragicSolitude said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/Meet-Your-Maker/discussion/comment/3412180#Comment_3412180
I'm not arguing with that. I was specifically answering the question "If we aren't supposed to have enough resources for that many bases (bc we have raid issues) then why do we have 5 slots in the first place?" BHVR wants players to attempt to keep more bases than they can reasonably handle activated so that they grind grind grind grind grind as Raider. They seem to be very afraid that players will not raid more than is required of them.
BHVR has this mistaken belief that the grind is what keeps players playing. They put more focus on that than on fun. They do not seem to understand burnout. They don't realize DbD survives in spite of the grind, not because of it.
I too hate the Synthite grind and I made a thread complaining about how solid cubes keep eating my Synthite drops so I get even less than I should be. I hope BHVR adjusts the game's economy.
https://forums.bhvr.com/Meet-Your-Maker/discussion/comment/3412324#Comment_3412324
See above: "BHVR has this mistaken belief that the grind is what keeps players playing. They put more focus on that than on fun. They do not seem to understand burnout." And in MYM's case, BHVR seems to be very afraid that players will not raid any more than is required of them.
I do hope they fix the economy. The Synthite grind is awful. I hate walking away from a raid with 90+ parts and 5 (or less) Synthite. It happens way too often.
Also, if you're going to alter my quote (which is fine), you should have bolded the changed part and said after "fixed that for you." I thought I'd messed up in my reply to you.
Oh, sorry for that, I should've bolded that indeed. And I thought "fixed that for you" would sound kinda rude and aggressive so I deleted that part x)
And, yeah, I understand why they gave us five slots but I don't understand WHY.
Of course, it's for grind, I just can't imagine who and why decided it that way. We were part of the alpha, we didn't have that synth grind at all (at least, I didn't feel that way), I was able to maintain 5 bases and they lived much longer. And I got (and did) MORE raids there than now. Probably, there are good reasons why now it is worse than it was during alpha but I don't see them. I don't know how shorter uptime can be good if lead into low raids and fast builders' burnout.
Prestiges were free, ok, should be fixed to make us grind more, I get it. But they didn't add some price to that, they made it THAT expensive and also they added parts into tombs. Like, everything seemed to be ok and in need of small tweaks, but they just dropped a big ass nuke on synth economy instead of little fixes with a hummer. 🤷♀️ I could pay 200 synth per base and grind 1k synth every other day to maintain 5 bases which can survive 10-20 days and feel both grindy and rewarded. But their solution? Now I don't build at all because I feel it pointless and not profitable. Or build some fast and not super artistic ######### I don't even like just to make it active.
I get they want us grind, but... Well, I guess my question was rhetorical.
@MadMoeZel said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/Meet-Your-Maker/discussion/comment/3411684#Comment_3411684
i'm still not 100 on all my advisors, i run 5 bases daily, all my maps but one are 4500 base capacity. i have 16000 synthite, every guard and trap fully unlocked including addons. i do not hunt treats.
edit - the only thing i CAN spend synthite on is bases now, so it just accumulates. when you're unlocking it goes fast and is hard to keep. but if you know what traps and guards you want, you can easily stick to a single base format without unlocking everything for a while and grind synthite out easily by keeping your bases active and productive. i go in and collect my kills on my outposts at about 20-30 deaths, i come out with about 100-200 synthite each time i do this from raider death. i do it probably once every 2-3 hours on each map. so about 150synthie an hour passively per dungeon if i had to guess conservatively. my presteige costs 1000 synthite, which on average the dungeon will earn me in 10-12 hours. and it has a genmat pool of 9000 meaning it's on for 24 hours. i also run these bases in overdrive, doubling the genmat they collect from kills. these kills also generate exp for me and each level up gives me a chunk of synthite, sometimes i log in from sleep and i've gained 3 level up rewards.
So, every your map generates 20-30 deaths per HOUR? How many raid attempts do you have then?
My 40 deaths in outpost (from different people, no drop nerfs) became 65-70 synth average (with boosts). How in univers can your 20-30 give you 150...
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@TragicSolitude said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/Meet-Your-Maker/discussion/comment/3412129#Comment_3412129
If we aren't supposed to have enough resources for that many bases (bc we have raid issues) then why do we have 5 slots in the first place? I just can't get it.
Two reasons.
One: There are five types of GenMat (five Advisors), so you can have five bases.
Two: You're not supposed to be able to only build. BHVR designed the game to force everyone to raid. You can just raid, or you can raid and build, but you can't just build. That's why the grind is the way it is. If there are too many Builders and not enough Raiders, no one's bases get raided and the game dies. The more bases a player has, the more they're forced to raid. Unless you want to make the game a full-time job, you're really not meant to keep five bases activated at all times.
Unless you want to make the game a full-time job, you're really not meant to keep two bases activated at all times.
That's how I feel it. And that's the problem I'm talking about.
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@Tsulan said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/Meet-Your-Maker/discussion/comment/3411889#Comment_3411889
- You could argue that each ressource has a limited usage. But Cells is not one of them. Since its used for unlocking everything and for boosts. Pre-release dev statement was, that players should be able to play one way or another. But the only way to sustain a base is to raid all the time. Playing only raider is possible, playing only builder is not.
- Drop rate of parts seems to be way higher than the drop rate of Synth. Even with boosts activated.
- Bases not getting raided at all might be a combination of people blocking other players, thus preventing the blocked players from raiding and the use of lava cubes. Since the second wave exploit is heavily used, people just see lava cubes in the map preview and dodge them.
Getting a decent kill ratio of lets say 5 is not enough to sustain a base. How much would be needed? 10? 20? 30?Now consider that people abandon raids where they die to often, to prevent their rank from dropping. Only to revisit the same map with 0 deaths.
The game seems to be designed to punish builders. As i just had a rank drop of 22 points, because a base only got 9 kills in 2 raids. Doesn´t sound fair to me.
Kill ratio won't work because after that amount of deaths you get only 1 point of resources from them. So your key to get resources is to get tons of raiders because you get WAY more resources from 30 raiders who died twice than from one raider who died 60 times.
But.
But my super popular base with 1000+ visits total and 2.0 kill ratio wasn't able to pay for itself :) one cycle contained around 100 visits with around 200 deaths. One cycle. No drop nerfs since nobody died more than 5 times per attempt. It wasn't enough, you know. I got 500 synth, maybe 600 at maximum max. It's not enough to prestige even 1p base, you need 625 there. 40 000 prestige points at p10, what for?
And now my bases get 10 raids per cycle max. 40 deaths if 4.0 ratio. 40 deaths versus 200. Of course it is not enough.
@Iron_Cutlass said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/Meet-Your-Maker/discussion/comment/3411684#Comment_3411684
- Cells have limited usage.
- Parts are not that hard to come by.
- They probably invested most of it in Brutal bases which are not good for farming Synthite.
The issue is not Synthite drop rates, the issue is that you do not know how to properly design a base with profits in mind. Again, this are not surface level.
And again, the game already needs more raider than makers, we already have issues were maps just never get raided enough, even after the matchmaking update.
I don't know how to properly design a base with profits in mind if 200 death of different people isn't enough for base to prestige itself (see above). My normal (and small) base with 4 kill ratio gave me 60 (!) points of synth on its latest cycle. How can you even talk about synth profit if you definitely can't earn from building more synth than you spend? What do I do wrong? What do I miss?
Or do you suggest to create normal small bases to spend less? It's a great option to save synth but that's not a solution for initial lack of it. If we aren't supposed to have enough resources for that many bases (bc we have raid issues) then why do we have 5 slots in the first place? I just can't get it.
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At least let us get all loot from our raids. I've met outposts where I got 10 synth from all three tombs in total plus pretty all loot from trap destruction went into acid cubes. Total? Less than 15 synth. With boost. How the hell can I earn 900 to prestige, then?
Sometimes I get sweet 200 synth per raid but:
1) it's a lucky base without corrosives under traps, I can't control that
2) plus it's a hard base where I die 4-5-6 times (so I loose rank points).
If I don't die or die only once I can't get 200+ synth, it's impossible, traps/guards don't drop that many. And I definitely don't want to die on purpose to restart easy outposts and spend 15 minutes farming.
I have 20k parts with 100+ storage of all hardwares. I can't remember any raid when I got more synth than parts :/
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@Tsulan said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/Meet-Your-Maker/discussion/comment/3410809#Comment_3410809
Outpost rank rewards are meager to say the least. Even with a decent kill ratio.
Honestly, i don´t even know why we even have ranks in the first place. It seems pointless.
True. To give away rewards at the end of season they can implement battle pass :/
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@Varzin said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/Meet-Your-Maker/discussion/comment/3410760#Comment_3410760
Wait, your bases impact your rank as well? Where do you see that? If that's the case that's entirely unfair, you can't control what happens in a base once it's built and available. Even a deathtrap might get plundered without effort if it happens to get a good enough raider in it.
When you log in, the game shows you results in genmat gained and sometimes also shows your rank gaining/loss. It's from your bases.
Idk why you think it's unfair specifically for builders, everything you say also true for raiders who don't know which base (easy spam brutal or clever death trap, high rank builder or not experienced one) they get and whether or not they bring right weapon to beat it first try (even with suit boost). That should be solved by math: good raider won't drop your rank THAT much exactly because the game do know they are good and unlikely to die in your outpost. But the math seems to be unfair (not the rank system itself). You lost 44 points, it's probably because you have pretty high rank and builder's rank was lower that yours. Game doesn't expect you to die even once in those outposts. The games doesn't expect us to die at all, I guess, lol, in a game about learning from deaths.
Especially if you don't know the numbers beforehand and can't control your behaviour based on this knowledge. I wouldn't even try an outpost I can't die once in without loosing my rank, what's fun in a base without kills? :/ you've leared from deaths, you've finished the outpost and got punished for that. Gross.
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@sizzlingmario4 said:
It loses a token and activates the first time a survivor is hooked on a scourge hook specifically. It doesn't necessarily have to be their first hook stage. If you put them on a normal hook the first time, you can still get Pain Res on their second hook, or you can even get it on the third one if you put them on normal hooks the first two times.
Oh, right. I think, I missunderstood that completely. Like, my brain completely missed the point that first hook can be normal hook, not scourge x) Thanks, now everything makes sense!
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@Dreamnomad said:
That trap was pretty clever, but you can actually see the hardened skin cubes through the regular corrosive cubes. I can see falling for it once but it's pretty dumb to keep falling for it. I don't have a problem with it existing so much as I just think the cost should be different. Instead of costing +5 I think it should be -5 and refund you 5 build points. A hardened skin cube costing a total of 10 points seems fair.
Yeah, that's why that was number 1.5 and not 2, huh :D
Anyway, you've asked for purposes and possible usages, here are 3,5 of them. Tbh, I'd be happy to use those cubes in my fake-path build for 10 points only (and probably even make the base normal thanks for that) but, I guess, all people who've been trapped with genmat this way won't agree with you xDD
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Nobody wants all-traps-behind-two-layers-of-corrosives meta. Those traps would be pretty much indestructible without shield weapon, and claws would be extremely hard to deal with. Not impossible but annoying, boring and not friendly to new and not so experienced players.
And those would be everywhere, just like second wave exploit is but worse because there's no reason not to do that if intended plus you have one free mod slot for splatters. With current system you at least have to be creative with angles and LOSs. And you want... what? Easy building mode with even more obnoxious killboxes protected from any observation? Do you really think that's healthy for the game?
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@Dreamnomad said:
Basically turns your plasma cube into a regular cube. For the life of me, I can't think of a practical purpose. You'll die if you stand on it for too long, but raiders are more likely to die falling into the cube instead of just being able to walk off it. Sometimes if you grapple onto it and hang on for a while you'll die but that is really inconsistent. Please someone make sense of this for me.
1) I used it in fake corrosive corridor. Like this one which HRV takes before 2d wave and then it becomes lava thing. If I make them normal blocks raiders could just grapple to them with no harm and make their way out safely, if I make them normal corrosives raiders could shield through them and cut the path. If I make strait corridor without those cubes I need too many capacity points to be sure they can't outrun 4 seconds of activation and, hence, can get over dangerous into brutal with no need. Hardened skin was super useful here. Raides have to switch their direction several times bc of those cubes so they can't jump over the pit, can't grapple and can't shield through.
1.5) You can bait chield users into normal corrosives with those.
https://youtu.be/UkB1O5MB4ic2) Maybe there aren't a lot of things in active bases for this mod but in social parkour (grapple/jump) challenges it would be perfect fit. You can graple to those but can't stay there for too long.
3) Also aesthetic, you know. When you want corrosives as a decoration but don't want people to go through.
>>I think I've only seen them once or twice and never died to them.
Claws don't kill you too. Not all traps must kill, some of them have a support function.
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@Amaroq64 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/Meet-Your-Maker/discussion/comment/3407177#Comment_3407177
Maybe my replays are bugged then, because it looks a lot of the time like they can just swing their sword the instant it would impact them and it breaks off.
I was killed in corrosives just because apparently I wasn't "looking at claw" enough to break it with my sword before reeling. Your replays are just glitchy.
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And now, I guess, it fixed itself? Or was fixed without patches? Or maybe it's an occasional bug.
It was like this:
It was holocube but no red marks. Now, after restart, I notice that everything is ok again. Not sure why.
UPD: it's back. Again, no mark :/ restart the game with no result. Weird.
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Red cells and synth are daily bonus and you get it only once per day. Darkyan is right, you got several tribute levels plus a glitched reward screen that showed you same reward several times. I've got this too, it's confusing as hell but luckily you don't loose anything here.
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Great point. I was super exited during closed test and was investing hours into hard bases to finally beat and complete them. It was fun. It was profitable for everyone.
Even though I don't care about place in rank table I do care about rewards in the end of season, plus it is just lame to be punished for completing a super hard outpost just because it took 50+ attempts for me :/ Now I don't feel challenged after couple unfortunate deaths, I feel frustration because I know even more are coming and I definitely will loose points here. And I try the base with that though in mind. Then I finally beat the base and get negative points for that. Whyyyyy
It's nice to raid social outposts freely, I miss that feeling in normal game.
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As for "fix the hole behind genmat" - I guess they can find it out from your replay. Sometimes those holes are intended to be there and reward exploration.
I always nod at good traps or if I definitely know what's coming. And I shake my camera at blocked tombs. Shake my head furiously if I'm mad at myself for stupid death haha. That's enough communication for me tbh xD
But I'd like to see smth like dark souls system with templates and special dictionary, tho. So it's hard to insult people but enough to leave a short message.