burt0r
burt0r
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@cannonballB said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2578646#Comment_2578646
Exactly! If someone is going to tunnel, they're going to tunnel. No amount of side information is going to change their tactic. I remember when they added the hook count. Their rationale makes literally no sense at all, and you'd think they'd want to put in more tools to help counter tunneling instead of less.
But the devs don't play their own game so.....
Yeah that's also the only reason I killed anybody in the last six months, forgetting who is already hooked twice. So i sometimes am "forced" by my playstyle of 8hooks with 0kills to stop at 6 or seven hooks because I forgot.
And to your last sentence, yeah, just yetserday, somebody posted the video with instablinds again, it's hilarious 😂. Especially with the background knowledge that that dev said flashlights where okay shortly prior to that.
Sadly that's the only recorded video i know of a dev getting so roasted by stuff the proclaimed "balanced".
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@JohnWeak said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2578609#Comment_2578609
If you play survivor as well, you know that most of them are total potatoes.
I have faced a survivor as a killer, he was arrogant and toxic as ######### but what he doesn't know is that i have been matched with him as a survivor may times before that too and my friend & I are dodging him as he is a total noob preshotting all pallets.
He has no skill at all but the game assists so much survivors with 20 pallets, 3 windows and Meta perks that even full garbage low skill piece of sh*t survivors like him are able to feel pros and become arrogant.
I have seen so many noobie survivors thinking they are awesome players just because they hold a killer for 3 gens using 5 pallets. If there were only 8 pallets on the map, wasting 5 pallets so fast would be detrimental for the rest of the team. Fact is there are 20 pallets and some infinite combinations (pallets + windows).
If we want the game to be balanced with a huge Maps/survivor nerf, we need to loose as we would normally do if we don't tunnel.
Well you may be right with the skill of some survivor and I already said above that i play like op suggested for more than 2 years.
But at the same time i only play a few times a month since I get tired of survivor thinking they are hot stuff after I intentionally let them go.
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@cannonballB said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2578552#Comment_2578552
If they didn't hide who's been hooked from the killer, I could easily avoid tunneling. But I'm with you - sometimes I tunnel accidentally.
As if killer didn't already have to juggle attention between 4 survivor, the progress on 7 gens, pallets/walls/hooks, and their 5 totems.
And the argument that it would make tunneling easier if the killer knew the number of hooks on each survivor is ridiculous since a true tunneler doesn't need any indicator.
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@MissKitty95 said:
Have they removed her ability to see scratch marks during phase? Or did I read it incorrectly because I thought they removed that ?
Only with the new boon totem shadowstep.
But why should they completely remove seeing scratchmarks during phase fromher? That would leave her with blood or sound with the latter being nearly completely negated by iw?
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The biggest problem with the here promoted playstyle is the need to have an incredibly thick skin since survivor will inevitably become arrogant and toxic if they notice the killer being "weak" (intentional or not).
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If your goal is totem protection it is the only option remaining.
I proposed a toth+undying+hg+whatever hex build to block all totems from easy cleansing.
So any attempt to boon a totem is prolonged and even normal cleansing is 21 seconds.
The only misconception i had proposing this build was the change to undying in having aura reveal for dulls not hexes.
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@Nemmy_Wemmy said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2578456#Comment_2578456
What killers do you usually play? I also mostly play for stacks and BP now. Well been in a break for a few weeks but yeah. I'ma BP addict.
It's like any game, if it gave you a way to earn double XP, there's no way I wouldn't do it.
That's the thing, if you only aim for the 4 stacks and then 8/"as many hooks as you can get" without tryharding, then all killer become viable.
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@ShinobuSK said:
I mean I already do that for a while, no need to sweat if MMR is a worthless invisible number anyway.
All I care about is BP so 4 BBQ stacks and some good chases are my win conditions.
Same, this has been my playstyle for the last 2,5 years. No use in tryharding when all it gets you is more stress.
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If it's the last survivor after some DC then i will help them finding hatch.
But if it's the first survivor that DCs then i will keep playing normal while taking down my pressure a notch or two aka a chill game. Farming is most often boring and too often survivor become increeeeedibly slow once they know that they get an escape for free.
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@R2k said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2578123#Comment_2578123
There's no way to buff solo by not making survivors busted.
For example if we take most popular opinion *Kindred Base kit* it already gives me 2 free slots to bring something powerful. I don't need Spine Chills and Kindred anymore if i can see all other survivors any time cause it allows me to track killer any time too.
If we make something like Detectives base kit it will destroy Hex users.
And there are many many ifs* that will harm killer even more unless u want to buff every single killer in a way so they can match this power but it will end up low to casual players quit cause they refuse to *git gud* and want to play *for fun*.
The thing is perks like kindred, bond, buckle up and so that give informations about either the killer or your fellow survivor are the ones that swf can already bypass with comms and that is the problematic advantage.
Swf can hypothetically have (iirc, outdated info) 10+ info perks roughly substituted with effective use of comms.
Now give those perks all as basekit to all survivor and the impact for soloQ will be exponentially greater than for swf.
Of course this will increase survivor potential as a whole and has to be compensated on the killer side.
But many people on this forum plead for this for years and I think it never happen to get all 3 sides on the same level.
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A totally wack setup:
1. Playing
2. some
3. thing
4. else
And it's a total blast!
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@BasementDweller said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2577684#Comment_2577684
hex perks werent disabled
Of course they weren't, killswitch didn't exist until this chapter. Also, killers couldn't choose where their hex would be (so there was a 1/5 chance the hex would spawn where the survivor couldn't cleanse the hex.)
Also another point, for a boon not to be accessible by the killer, it first has to be blessed by a survivor.
Meaning that totems are only untouchable for the killer. So hexes can still be cleansed but boons not snuffed aka a problem only for one side.
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@dspaceman20 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2576270#Comment_2576270
In my opinion its not worth blessing a hex totem. 24 seconds is way too long and you waste out on gen times.
But the blessing itself is only 10 additional seconds coupled with a cleansing action.
It's a win win for survivor.
They permanently destroy the hex AND get the additional benefits from SEVERAL perks at once (I imagine behaviour plans for more boon perks in the future if they don't get trashed in this storm)
But i accept that those are simply different opinions on the matter.
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@dugman said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2575028#Comment_2575028
Thanks for the tip, I didn't realize noise modifiers were changed.
Yeah they did it to counter spirit (the only killer really using stridor) but also nerfed her now and probably in the next patch when they add the dust getting kicked up by her during phasing.
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@Munqaxus said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2576171#Comment_2576171
They sound great to killers, while survivors are hardly even using them the 2nd day they are out.
Well why should they?
Boons are not equally viable as meta perks. Just slightly below them since for boons survivor have to actively do something. (Or at least one survivor so all 4 can reap potential benefits)
Even in the game screenshot you posted in another thread iirc they used 14 of 16 slots meta stuff, which doesn't need ANY extra investment.
@Munqaxus said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2575650#Comment_2575650
https://us.v-cdn.net/6030815/uploads/O0H50RS1FLJ0/image.png
3 Mikaela's in this match. Look how powerful the Boon totems are.
Too bad it doesn't show the screenshot itself and I won't copied that since it isn't mine.
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@Tr1nity said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2576140#Comment_2576140
Yes. When the survivor is bleeding out on the floor is the killer not supposed to have the advantage?
How could you think that. The survivor should at any point in a trial have a chance to magically fly over the gates and escape. /S
Sorry for exaggerating but we are dealing with sluzzy here and I don't think a similar less over the top formulated thing could really be coming from them.
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Was the title inspired by the 19 month old resurrected thread that got deleted by now?
Edit:
Too bad it got deleted a few minutes ago so i can't do a comparison if this is another word for word copy and invert post or not.
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@Munqaxus said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/288467/killer-hex-perks-are-useless-now
How did Boon Totems make Hex perks useless? Hasn't cleansing totems been in the game since it was created, lol.
Well survivor cleansed.totem.already before.and now they get another incentive with the investment of additional 10 seconds.
Double reward for less than double the investment sounds like a net positive for me. Additional to being able to apply multiple blessings in one go.
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@DbDCasual said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2576129#Comment_2576129
LOL I was literally right next to a hook. I was ready to end the game. Keep going though. You're on an incredible roll of being totally wrong. :)
And you made that clear in your og post where?
At this point it doesn't even matter how your trial was since you could add any circumstances to fit your narrative.
And yes he answered you any strategic point for letting the last survivor bleed out right here.
@BrokenSouI said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2576104#Comment_2576104
Because I know youkk wiggle off ? Because I can't make it to a hook ? Because I don't want to chase you again to down you ? You're not entitled to an escape. If the means of which I kill you is by bleed out. Then so be it
Survivor dropped with wiggle progress, no hook close by, survivor crawled to a hook dead zone and so on.
But at this point in the discussion i guess you are simply looking for confirmation that "killer are so toxic".
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Well i don't know either, never done it myself.
But maybe ask the multiple survivor butt dancing inside the exit gate for the whole duration of the egc and when/if the killer comes to push them out even dead hard to deny hit points.
Both sides do questionable stuff.
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Well they changed some hex perks for killer but they still remain hexes and those weren't worth running before and won't be now.
It always felt like 3/4 of the 5 totems spawned in the open/next to objectives/ survivor spawns or in obvious spots in characteristic structure like shack.
So no real point for celebration here.
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Agreed and already several times posted about.
And I think the argument that changing achievements on console is too hard also does not apply anymore after easily getting rid of ranks to change them for grades and I guess the "get to rank X" achievements simply work with grades now.
So changing the requirement for adept shouldn't even be in question as the achievement does not even specify those.
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There is probably nothing to be done because your friend themselves are responsible for the accessibility of their PC at home.
Also when such a tense relationship is known, then they should've either locked their PC behind a password or shut it down. Especially when leaving for several hours just thinking about the electricity bill.
I heard of similar cases in other games when a family member plays on their account and behaves toxic or uses cheats and the account is banned.
There is no way to proof the involvement of another person on the owners system and the responsibility of leaving it on and unsecured lies ultimately with the owner.
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@Nathan13 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2575380#Comment_2575380
ruin/undying/haunted/thrill actually sounds like a decent build. why not give it a try for a game or two?
I don't really play anymore and the last time I ran a full hex build on my hag (since I don't have much else on her) it took the survivor less than 2 minutes for all 4.
But i am also one of the so called "friendly/fair" killer player and only aim for my bbq hooks with 0 kills.
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@Nathan13 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2575355#Comment_2575355
this is probably not a good suggestion but you could run a full hex build. it takes 36 seconds to bless a hex totem with TOTH.
That's what I posted above, like i said 😅.
1. Thrill: for the time increase
2. Undying for the aura reading (as this is the only remaining form of direct totem protection with thrills noice notification gone)
3. Haunted grounds: to hex 2 totems at once
4. Some other hex perk but most probably ruin or noed
But like i already said, this build would only help in wasting time IN CASE one or multiple survivor have boon perks. Outside of that only the 4th perk or hg might be of any use.
Edit:
Nevermind my point about undying. I forgot that they changed the aura reading to be exclusive for dull totems. 😓
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@Nathan13 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2575341#Comment_2575341
TOTH has potential
Only if you make a build like i proposed above you, I think.
And that would be useless against anything but boons, without for example a specific 4th hex like ruin.
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If you wanted a pure anti boon perk build without any other benefits i guess toth+undying+haunted grounds+ a Fourth hex to block all totems could work. Thrill for the time increase plus aura reading from undying should help protecting totems and the other two are just there to make all totems into hexed ones for the additional 10 seconds to bless.
Again only to work against boons. So it is trash for anything else, like gens or even against anti totem itself.
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@dugman said:
Just thinking out loud, one possibility if you're running into survivors who always use Boon: Shadow Step to hide auras is intentionally don't use any perks or add-ons that rely on auras. So no Nurse's Calling, BBQ and Chili, Thrilling Tremors, etc. Obviously there are a lot of popular perks that use auras, but there are also good perks that don't so maybe try using those instead. For example, just looking at "tracking perks":
- Whispers is decent at the start of the match for getting to the right area and doesn't use auras at all. It's also good once you've knocked out a survivor or two to track down the last couple who might be trying to hide or go for the hatch
- Lethal Pursuer can give you a similar benefit to Whispers at the very start of the match, and it only triggers well before any Boons are played (Whispers is less accurate but potentially works the entire match so it's a trade-off)
- Stridor isn't bad for tracking nearby survivors by sound, and is a counter to Iron Will which is also popular
- Spies from the Shadows is interesting because the noise indicators for the birds aren't auras, so depending on whether or not you like that perk it's unaffected by that Boon
- Surprisingly Bloodhound is another interesting possibility since the highlighted blood trail isn't an aura either. It's possibly a reasonable alternative to Nurse's Calling if you're looking for an aura-less way to track injured survivors
Of course I'm just looking at tracking perks here since the whole point of auras is tracking survivors. Obviously perks that do gen regression or that directly help injure survivors or put conditions on them all still work normally too.
Finally another thing to try against Boon users is Hex: Haunted Grounds. Since the Boon players will intentionally be looking for totems to use, they'll very likely cleanse your Haunted Grounds early in the match and get you a free down or two or maybe even three if you're lucky. You could even pair it with Hex: Undying, and every time you snuff out a boon it just becomes another potential dull totem that a new Haunted Grounds or other hex could hop too. (Just be aware that aura Hexes won't work as well. Retribution for example will still make them Oblivious for instance but you won't see their aura when they cleanse a hex.)
I don't know if anyone told you already but one info in your post is outdated.
Sound perks interaction was overhauled and iron will now trump's any noice increase, so stridor is completely countered by iron will and not the other way.
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@R2k said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2574790#Comment_2574790
Gmt +2/+3 Starting from 22:00 my que times as killer are almost instant. Before it survivors times are almost instant.
Thanks for the clarification but i didn't mean it as critique to you or anybody in this thread directly but as an overall problem reoccurring with every queue time thread.
My first self made thread 2 years ago was the question if it would be beneficial to integrate those stats into a forum members visible profile/unser the comment like on other forums but it never got much attention.
The topic was maybe not controversial enough. 😜
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@Tremors said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2574381#Comment_2574381
You hate Plague because she's...good?
As a killer i hate plague because the vomit hit detection is still inconsistent as hell.
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@Shaped said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2574790#Comment_2574790
Not new lol but I honestly never had it this long before. I couldn't find a game at all.
Yeah my comment was more meant as general feeling exhaustion to have to mention this in EVERY last queue time discussion because often people argue with each other uselessly because one of the mentioned factors is already completely different and makes a comparison of experience mute.
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@R2k said:
During night killer que is instant. During day survivor lobby is instant.
That's why I hate that most of the time either the op or commentator don't give complete info that are crucial for a queue time discussion, like time of day, region and either platform or X-Play on/off.
And this day night swap has been like that for years but there are always new people wondering about their queue times.
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@adirgeforthedead said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2568959#Comment_2568959
This is the question we should be asking ourselves. I understand BHVR didn't really have much of an option if they wanted the license to include Pinhead in Dead By Daylight so I believe the fault is majorly at Park Avenue Entertainment for putting that as one of the clauses. We don't know the exact details of how it happened, but as a community I think we should think twice about getting the Hellraiser Chapter at the very least.
"Bhvr didn't really have much of an option"
Well of course they had. Showing some spine over profit greed and turn down the hell raiser chapter.
Despite the lack of content i would guess that the majority of the community would've understood IF properly explained.
Or they could've changed the goal of the chapter to quality improvements once they got wind of the NFT condition by the license holder.
No one but their own greed made them do this.
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@FrenziedRoach said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2566742#Comment_2566742
Absolutely!
I'm of the opinion you should play how you want. Long as you aren't outright performing exploits expressively forbidden by the devs or outright hacking, all is fair.
A healthy outlook on gaming.
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@FrenziedRoach said:
I don't think this is the right game for you.
Looping is a valid strategy that you can play around if you actually put some effort into it. If you aren't willing to put in that effort, that's fine. But getting mad at players for utilizing their toolkit is a waste of time.
Damn this exact post could be used for strategic camping or slugging and you wouldn't need to change a word except the first. Wow.
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@aylawell said:
The penalty exists for ppl that are trash and don't give a care about us that actually do care.. ######### man, watch some current videos dude.. picking me out like I'm the only one pfft.
Well you don't care for your potential teammates.
What you have done wrong to get punished is queueing for a team game well knowing that your system is prone to kick you out for a still unknown reason.
But you still insist to keep trying ruining a trial for 4 other people with every (even unintentional) DC.
Let me tell you a story, when I was still living with my parents I wanted to play in a fixed team in games like league of legends or rainbow six siege or going raiding with friends. But my parents would cut me off at random times for dinner or to help them with something so i never knew when I had to stop playing.
What do you think I did because I felt a shred of responsibility?
I DIDN'T play in groups. Sucked for me but that's how it works. Either you ignore being a potential burden for everyone else or respect the responsibility and step back.
Edit:
Also let me preemptively answer the potential question (even if you directly won't ask it):
"Why should I care for anonymous randoms on the internet?"
Well if not then why should anyone else care for your problems? Maybe break the cycle and a bigger and better person.
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@johangpx said:
No i have nothing to know i was rank1 and i know i am rank 1 i want to be rank 1 i like dbd light but i cannot understand you accept this new system. I do not see it as win win and nice i get 250000 bloodpoints. I stay on playing dbd. But i do not take the effort to do all the hard work for nothing, To bad most do not understand what i am saying and accept it as it is.
No most people here play the game because they have fun just playing it and the little red number in front of their name never meant anything to them.
They don't need some form of motivation, they play because playing itself is fun for them. And now they even get SOME BP when they play a lot as bonus.
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Well if I had to put on my tin-foil-hat i would guess that the queue times during peak hours have gotten so bad again that behaviour has widened the matchmaking parameters again and it will be the clown circus of mm. Now only being not verifiable thanks to hidden MMR.
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@IronKnight55 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2565682#Comment_2565682
Harsh? Seriously? You have to be joking.
Well he is still correct that generally penalizing won't stop the problematic playeds and completely blocking the option to secure a kill will only aggravate one side of the community. And I am talking about securing a kill in mid to late/end game.
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@kirvo said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2565714#Comment_2565714
I'll assume you didnt think before you typed that comment. Me saying that the person has eagle vision is nowhere near saying that is a skill but the odds of them noticing something as opposed to applying techniques and abilities with movements. seeing something is not a skill.
No what i am saying is that you on one hand argument something on the basis that you personally as killer seem to not need perks and when someone else does it is suddenly being dismissed and a not valid argument, also only simply based on your own experience.
And to the aspect of totems being hard to find, oh please, more than half either sit in the open or in viewing distance from gens or in obvious spots in main structures like killer shack.
And it is still a 4 vs 1 and if all survivor just adapted the mentality to do every totem they see (just like all survivor adapted looping as a form of chase) then any given survivor wouldve only need to do 1,25 totems in the great avarage but again the unreliability of teammates is the reason for empowerment of the individual of the group against the lone killer.
But independent of all arguments i am going to seize further commentating you after witnessing you using the word "bud" in any conversation.
@kirvo said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2565712#Comment_2565712
Okay, sure bud. Great argument.
And the use of any derogatory term like bud, bro, lad, kiddo or the like disqualifies a person in my book from any form of fruitful discussion.
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@kirvo said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2565691#Comment_2565691
Well not everyone is you and has eagle vision in the game and has the super ability to notice every single dull totem in every single one of their games and has the spare time to cleanse each and every single one of them. At least a quarter of my matches, IF i notice a dull totem, i will possibly cleanse in case they have Noed, then other times i dont, either not noticing them or in mid-chase.
Just trying to over-simplify your argument and then state that you're superior at the game is not a sound argument that i will accept based off of your basic logic.
Right back at you.
@kirvo said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2565669#Comment_2565669
Sure, if i only played survivor, but i also play killer just as much and never use perks because doesnt seem necessary as a killer imo and i'm confident enough in my skills to do well enough, whether the survivors are top tier or somewhat.
Not everyone is like you, a god given prodigy at playing killer, that they can play perkless at any given skill matchup.
First making one's own experience an argument and then simply shoving someone else off for doing the same. Smh
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@BlueMeansDeep said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2565417#Comment_2565417
And what’s wrong with that? It’s no matter than sprint burst or lithe, if anything it’s worse as they are way more reliable.
SB and lithe have to be used at the beginning of a chase and therefore can be baited out.
Dh for distance is most efficiently and most often used after being in chase for the first hit and then some to get close and then AFTER already investing so much time give an ADDITIONAL chase and the killer has the only the option to keep chasing since they already invested so much (without having any option to prevent it or interact) or drop the chase and let the 30-60 seconds previous chase be in vain (so at worst potentially up to 90-180 seconds of gen progress for nothing).
And before you say that sb and lithe give you way more distance, survivor tend to behave like sheep. They boost away but once I kick the gen and pretend to move away they tend to get back to the same gen and therefore waste the hole distance of their speed boost.
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@Ulquiorraindbd said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2565274#Comment_2565274
Yup. It's the worst designed perk in the game imo, with DH or new Blood Favor as a competitor.
In which way is devour hope a bad designed perk?
Do you mean from a survivor or killer pov and which aspect of it?
No judging, just interested and curious.
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Hatch in itself is already an additional chance with the only condition to be the last alive.
You could do absolutely nothing all game and still escape while hiding for the whole time.
And from your story i would guess that even without noed you would've been dead given the circumstances getting interrupted opening the gate.
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From your video i guess he blocked the interactive space from you.
As killer you have to slightly be on top of the hatch (like with one foot) and he stood in a way that you couldn't interact with it.
You can see that the prompt for the interaction is only flickering on and off when your camera is looking at an angle at the hatch.
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What killed him for me was the additional noise notification for survivor to dodge aka his nerve grinding annoying repetitive roar.
I can just barely tolerate Oni's enrage and have given up on playing demo screaming every 5 seconds.
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@Siberia said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2565231#Comment_2565231
No offense taken! I don’t have a lot of killer hours under my belt, and the only killer I DO play is Michael. Somehow I keep going against sweaty SWF teams that clearly know what they’re doing, when I’m only in bronze ranks rn 🧐
This isn’t meant to just be me complaining. I was genuinely confused if I was just really bad or if survivors are somehow godlike & make killers look like fools often. I guess when I think of playing a killer, I think of them being formidable; someone you don’t wanna mess with. But instead with DBD you get teabaggers and clickers and people who smash you in the face with pallets & encourage a chase because they don’t fear you 😂
Careful, since it seems you came back after a longer break but (bronze) GRADE have no longer anything to do with matchmaking.
Those visuals are just indicator how much someone has played between the thirteenth of each month for monthly bp rewards. (You also can not "derank" in grades since their progress is determined by the old pipping system but without depipping, only black pipping at worst)
The matchmaking is done now with a hidden MMR value.
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@Sonzaishinai said:
https://us.v-cdn.net/6030815/uploads/SEO6F7I9GT99/e6pjenyxsaewluc-png-large.png
- Body is 1 character too short.
Damn that's ugly.
And something like this just to have a higher chance at winning? Against anonymous people on the internet?
Yikes
But hey, i never understood the attractiveness of cheating outside of the own perception of ones online balls or whatever.
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Posts like this always make for good popcorn entertainment in the comments.
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Just like Sabo squads were popular, once people noticed how saboteur worked back in the day or killer noticed the efficiency of mass slugging (partially thanks to those Sabo squads) or the always hated camping or tunneling.
Given enough time and sample size, people will always find ways to maximize efficiency in every game. Even while completely breaking the base gameplay atmosphere (i don't have the concrete game in mind but something is scratching at the back of my head regarding this topic but i can't remember).
Another example would be in rainbow six siege the development of breaking most walls for line of sights instead of reinforcing bigger portions for protection.