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@chieftaco said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/664829#Comment_664829
i believe you also are ignoring very clear and valid points that demonstrate there is already a nerf to camping: it's called being a skilled survivor and breaking the camp.
nerfing camping even further would just remove the need for skill on the survivor's part allowing anyone to play the game without skill.. please look into getting skills..
What? My point is it's too effective against less experienced players. I get that camping isn't a good strategy. I just don't want camping to drive away less experienced players. It's not fun, and nerfing it will probably discourage more people to doing so.
Also, how does it remove the skill needed to play survivor? It only removes the skill to counter camping some more, which isn't hard anyways, it's just that less experienced players don't know how to, and solo survivors can't tell each other that the killer is camping. But why would that be a problem, if countering camping took less skill? Standing in front of a hooked survivor and watching them bleed out takes absolutely 0 skill.
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@Maelstrom10 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/664932#Comment_664932
I think he means basekit hillbilly level - ie being strong in the right hands, yet completely counter able both through perks and smart play. Hillbilly with certain add-ons can become a beast though not one i would say needs to be nerfed. Just very strong.
Yeah I got that. But adding a second objective in addition would be way too much then.
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@Predator3174PL said:
bringing all killers to Hillbilly level, no infinities, mindgameable loops, another objective, smaller maps, Haddonfield deleted
All of those at once? Or just one of them? All killers at hillbilly level and a second objective will kill this game faster than you can blink.
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@Maelstrom10 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/664848#Comment_664848
Thana already stacks to 16% which stacks with other debuffs like sloppy butcher, dying light, coulrophobia etc. Not against thana being buffed and it does encourage good play, but I can see why they aren't keen on it.
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/664855#Comment_664855
Doctor used to be my main, hope they don't change him to much but otherwise buff his default kit and make him less annoying. Clown is slowly becoming a fav though despite how low tier he is, love his anti loop ability.
Really hoping for a haddonfield rework next, atleast cutting down the fences and making some of the bushes both leapoverable from roofs, and some of the roofs blocked off from being leaped off of.
Clown just needs some kind of map pressure ability. Or his chase potential needs to be made a bit stronger.
I do hope they buff Doctor in the right way. I don't know for sure, but I feel like Doctor is very good at low ranks because he can find survivors so easily. So maybe a buff to his chase potential, and maybe his map pressure, and a small nerf to his detection.
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@immortalls96 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/664850#Comment_664850
I've already told you my thought process on the matter..and I didnt say anything about you..just the ones making outlandish suggestions like near invulnerability for the unhooker, entity blockers on the killer, etc
Ok that's fine. I do know there are some outlandish suggestions here on the forums, that's true. I'm sorry then.
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Yes, buffs for the weaker killers is something I really hope to see. Doctor and Clown are two of my favorite killers in this game, but they seem just a bit weak at the moment.
I'm also looking forward to the map reworks, and I wish camping got nerfed.
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@immortalls96 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/664819#Comment_664819
Well you gotta remember there are still millers whom read these posts..and the sheer volume of them is alarming..I'm not saying it's an illuminati tin foil hat kinda scenario however it lights up the selfish nature of many of these survivor players posting these threads..it shows that theres an alarming amount of survivors whom only wish the killers to be nothing more than playthings and that they are the important ones..its sad honestly
Wanting a nerf to camping doesn't mean we want killers to be nothing but playthings. I'm a killer main myself, I just think camping is unhealthy for the game. And we are not being selfish, lol. But we are allowed to voice our opinion about this game.
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@[Deleted User] said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/663826#Comment_663826
I know they aren't just reworking maps because of totems. I never said that.
What I did say is that we shouldn't have to wait for all maps to be remade to have proper totem spawns. They've been crap for 2 years already, and they're reworking only, what, two maps this year, with springwood being one of them? How many maps are in the game again? Hexes are supposed to be broken for how many years before they're fixed?
No. Take a good patch cycle to look at all of the problematic spawns, make some rules for their spawns, add a few new good ones to replace the crap ones that were removed, and voila. This doesn't take a ton of resources to do. I've worked with Unreal Engine before. It's not hard.
True, it would probably be nice to not have to wait for the reworks. I mean not every totem spawn should be really hidden, but they should at least get rid of the totem spawns that are very easy to find.
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Nope. This is a forum, we are allowed to voice our concerns for this game. Maybe it isn't a reason why killer queue times are longer than survivor queue times, but I personally believe that nerfing camping would probably balance out queue times again, at least a bit.
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@Locker_Monster said:
I love that everyone claims 'Camping will chase away new Survivors' & offer solutions that would chase away new Killers...But these same people never mention that part. 🤔
It's almost like they don't really care about balance or the health of the game. They just want to skew the power dynamic more towards Survivor & get something they can abuse.
I don't know what to tell you anymore. If you just want to ignore our points on why we actally want to nerf camping, then do so. But it really can't be too hard to understand that that is not our point.
I doubt it would chase many killers away, they can still play the game, unlike the survivor being camped.
And how often are we supposed to tell you we want a nerf to camping that can't be abused?
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@Locker_Monster said:
'Camping was abused...Let's let people do that again!'
Hard pass.
I love that everyone claims 'Camping will chase away new Survivors' & offer solutions that would chase away new Killers...But these same people never mention that part. 🤔
It's almost like they don't really care about balance or the health of the game. They just want to skew the power dynamic more towards Survivor & get something they can abuse.
Once again, there are ways to implement a punishment without survivors abusing it. Bringing up that on instance where the devs tried a punishment won't prove anything at all.
I'm pretty sure that camping drives away more survivors than having camping being nerfed will drive killers away. Getting camped pretty much makes it so you can't play the game anymore until the end of the match. Killer's can still play the game normally, and if they are led into that direction of not camping, they might get better at the game.
Killer queue times are far longer than survivor queue times right now, we shouldn't just ignore that.
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@The_Bogeyman said:
Punish campers by gen rushing their sorry asses.
But many people don't know that, or realise to late that a killer is campig. If the killer has Ruin and NOED, it'll be so much harder as well.
We need to think about less experienced players as well, and how to maybe get more people playing survivors again, since killer queue times are much longer than that of survivors, and nerfing camping is probably the best way to do this, since it doesn't nerf skilled killers.
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@Acromio said:
PSA: When one of their teammates is getting camped, the other survivors have a very simple counter they more often than not refuse to utilize: focusing on the remaing generators. This counter produces a 75% win-rate for them, which in any normal game would be considered insanely overpowered and in need of a sledgehammer-nerf.
I bet that pretty much everybody on these forums knows that. That's simply missing the point. It's not about balance, it's about design. And how less experienced survivors don't know how to punish camping effectively. If the killer has Ruin and NOED as well, that just makes things much harder on them. It's just awfully unfun to get camped, and the devs should at least try and reduce the number of camping killers by making it less effective, even against less experienced players.
Those people want to enjoy the game as well, and will just leave the game if they aren't having fun. And this game is in dire need of more survivor players, as killer queue times prove.
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The devs did say they want to rework the game's maps. So I hope these maps as well will improve in the future.
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Oh no. Why is Doctor so low? He's one of my favorite killers in the game. Even if he is quite weak.
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@Mert_MK said:
I agree with you OP.
Me and a friend went against a facecamping LF the other day. Lucky for him, he downed my friend rather early and facecamped. Ruin was up at that time but nobody wanted to waste time looking for it while he was being facecamped so we tried doing gens. Finished around 3. He downs the next person and facecamps them too (she tried to kobe for some reason but still struggled). We finish the last gens, he actually left her but there was no way we could have saved her because of time. Turns out he had NOED too. Me and the other random died because of it. Because you can totally do all totems and gens with ruin up in that time. Fun game.
Exactly. Ruin and NOED make camping so much more effective, it's not good. People will of course argue that that's Leatherface's biggest strength, but honestly that just means he needs buffs elsewhere, not that we keep such an unfun strategy to verse the way it is now.
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Fully agree. We should at least try it to see if it can get abused. I mean it's already implemented for the chaser emblem.
You would have to add the conditions that if a killer is in a chase, or if the exit gates are powered, those penalties also don't apply anymore. But I fully agree that we should try this on the ptb.
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@se05239 said:
Even if the devs made it so that hooked survivors literally couldn't die if the killer was camping, some would still camp. Its a mentality.
I mean maybe you are right. It would be extreme though. I'd just hope it would cause less killer players to camp and more to try and get better at the game, when camping is doing very little for them. So survivors would have to deal with camping less often. It would be the best the devs could do for the game's health.
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@HatCreature said:
You can't fairly nerf camping at all UNLESS you get rid of the hooks.
No Hooks, No Camping.
Killers are forced to put Survivors into a ''time out'' and they can be saved from that. Now Killers will defend this time out zone if they have to or if they want to. The problem isn't camping though, the problem if you've been reading are the hooks.
Deathgarden, the original Deathgarden had the same thing but instead of hooks they had a bubble where Runners were held in and could be rescued. They scrapped idea because they learned from DBD's mistake, MISTAKE. Instead they solved this problem of camping by letting Scavengers RESPAWN.
Let Killers KILL SURVIVORS and let the Survivors be held for a certain time inside limbo and then spat back out by The Entity somewhere completely random. No hooks, no camping, problem solved by something completely simple, the only problem is a complete rework of Altruism and hook based perks.
Also :( R.I.P Basement <3 I will miss thou in the deepest trench of my cavernous heart.
To be fair, yeah. The whole idea about having to hook survivors had a serious design flaw that the devs didn't think of at the beginning. I personally can't blame them for that though. I still think that nerfing camping could very much improve the game's health.
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@immortalls96 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/663829#Comment_663829
I'm on ps4..but regardless it only makes sense considering the circimstances..as a survivor I can barely get a killer on my level anymore..its always way too low..hence with putting two and two together I have concluded my cues are slow because its trying to keep you near your rank but..its not possible because not enough killers are high ranking meaning we are currently in a shortage..
I heard it was the other way around on the PS4. I don't think we should ignore killer queue times being longer on PC though. It's possible there are other reasons why people don't want to play killer on console. One thing that would come up is bad framerate and not being able to increase the aim sensitivity more. Those I'd say are seperate issues though.
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@RoKrueger said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/663460#Comment_663460
So your point is that survivors can't be bothered to learn how to counter campers. You stated yourself: It is not very effective at higher ranks.
Sure make them have to learn how to counter camping. Like people would rather want to learn how to counter camping instead of just leaving the game. It's not like they want to play games just to have fun.
Like, I really want this game to grow. But new players who get camped a lot will just leave the game. If anything, after the new chapter, we are just left with more killer players. And I don't really enjoy a lobby simulator personally. And you can't blame people for leaving this game if they often play against a camping killer.
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@Warlock_2020 said:
Nothing will be done about camping, ever. It was a horrible grief system left open in the game's design. It is PART of the toxic style of play that keeps this game from really hitting big and having huge player numbers. I've seen so many new players leave due to either camping/tunneling killers who are purposely deranked and torture new players, or groups of survivors who derank just to mess with new killers.
It is a toxic system that the developers don't have the balls to do anything about, and it will forever be an albatross on the neck of the game.
Pretty much sums it up. What a shame really. It hurts the game so much.
And nerfing camping isn't nerfing killers, it's just nerfing a strategy that is awful to play against.
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@immortalls96 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/663662#Comment_663662
The stats say ots caused by too few killers not survivors, and my survivor cues reaffirm this belief for me..plus you forget..survivors are about to receive the biggest buff they've ever recieved in the future..what do you think life will be like for killer when it happens? You know it..I know it..I will not simply believe unless I'm shown , after all..we may be about to see nurse kneecapped..we still dont know..
What platform are you playing on? Because most posts regarding lobby queue times seem to be about killer queue times taking to long, and for me that is also the case. I can find a game with survivor always very fast, but as killer often it takes definitely longer to find a lobby.
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@[Deleted User] said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/663626#Comment_663626
Or, or, or, get this...
They can just have hexes not spawn near survivors, next to generators, hooks, or out in the open.
An entire map rework shouldn't be needed for totem spawns. Besides, the above BS still happens even in springwood. Found two hexes literally 20 feet from each other in the Springwood school basement once; which both by the way were within 30 feet of the generator.
And I must emphasize on feet, not meters.
They aren't just working on map reworks because of totems. The main focus is to improve looping and make it more fair, having more mindgameable loops, and to get rid of the ridiculously safe window loops on certain maps. But while they are at it, they also plan on improving totem placements. Maybe also decreasing the size of the huge maps, which means Hex: Ruin will become easier to not take.
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I bet some bosses from Bloodborne would work. Father Gascoigne or Orphan of Kos come to mind.
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@Karl_Childers said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/663663#Comment_663663
It also didn’t involve the Chaser emblem penalty though, so it was a garbage and invalid test. I’m also going to take a stab and say you are someone who thinks survivors need another objective, which if that’s the case I say git gud since thats a camping buff. So if you support camping as a strat, don’t complain about gens, simple as that. Otherwise it’s hypocritical
Yeah, they pretty much have the solution already implemented for the chaser emblem. It punishes you as long as you aren't in the chase or while any other survivor is within that certain radius. They just need to implement an actual gameplay punishment with those restrictions and the devs are fine. Boy I hope the devs will surprise us with one of their patches and have a proper nerf to camping that can't be abused, people will be able to see for themselves on the ptb then.
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@Locker_Monster said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/663670#Comment_663670
Rofl. Sure, buddy. 'if you disagree with me, you must abuse the mechanic.'
It's not like we might be smart enough to realize, based on past experience and logic, that the idea is bad. Heaven forbid we disagree and have logic and history on our side. No, that would mean you're wrong. And you can't be wrong, so we must probably want to abuse the mechanic. 🙄
How about this?
Most people who want to change camping are just salty they got camped and want to remove whatever prevents them from winning.
Or this?
Most people who want a punishment for camping just want a mechanic they can abuse so they get free unhooks.
(Oh wait; this one ACTUALLY HAPPENED. Well don't that just beat all! It almost like I have logic on my side and..you're....wrong! 😧)
Both are not true. People want camping to be nerfed because it is the exact opposite of fun to be camped. Are you really expecting survivors to just keep playing the game no matter how often they get camped? People play games to have fun, getting camped is the exact freaking opposite.
You are just bringing repeatedly bringing up that one time where a nerf to camping was tried, and it didn't work out. But it's not the only way to nerf camping. There are easily enough ways to try and nerf camping, not just that one way that was tested in the ptb. I even gave suggestions on how to prevent survivors being able to abuse the nerf to camping I suggested.
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@Mtom912 said:
Tbh most people who defend camping are probably campers, since if someone doesn’t camp then they wouldn’t care if it got changed, as they wouldn’t be affected.
That's what baffles me, honestly. They all say they don't camp, and I would believe them, because they do seem to be part of the experienced community. But why would you be against a change that would improve the game's health and design? I mean they are allowed to have their opinion, I just feel this will really hurt the game in the future. With killers being granted buffs many times now, plus the upcoming map reworks which I really, really welcome, survivors however might get fed up that their number 1 issue continues to be ignored. We'll see, I think the map reworks that are coming are absolutely needed, especially to help the weaker killers. But without anything for survivors, I just fear killer queue times will inrease even more. Let's hope not though.
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@Locker_Monster said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/663642#Comment_663642
You're ignoring the most important part:
The Devs tried hook-camping punishments. Survivors abused the mechanic!
That's right; the same Survivors screaming for hook punishments showed they can't be trusted. They showed that they would abuse any mechanic put in to give themselves a free unhooking.
It was tried. It sucked. Accept hook camping as a bad, legit strat. Nothing else will work. It would either be unfair for Killers, OP for Survivors, or abused again.
But that was because of the design. The Bleed Out times paused whenever a killer was within a certain radius of the hooked survivor. Survivors abused that by just hanging out at the hook the entire time, being chased by the killer, which meant the Bleed Out times didn't go down. By having only slow down the Bleed Out times, and making it so the penalty disappears as soon as the killer is in a chase or if a survivor is within that radius would make it unabusable by survivors.
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@immortalls96 said:
Ok..so..this will take some explaining as to the core issue here , camping while lame has its place , the egc for example..it would be rendered meaningless , and looking at the big picture let's face it..the devs are already viewed by the majority to favor the survivor side , and to be fair they've shown little evidence to refute this..killers grabs have been bugged for months..nothing..yet the bugs for dh were resolved very quickly, it feels that survivor priorities are favored..the devs constantly talk about whether something is fun for survivors..but never talk the same about the killer having fun..ds..got nerfed? Too weak..buffed it again, THEN nerfed enduring to remove all killer resistance to perk stuns , thano? A bad perk that's been begged for buffing for months..instead they made it worse..killer fun<survivor fun..now where am I going with this ? Well..now your suggesting that because as survivor we hate it killers should be punished for something that's not always the scummy play , and be told they arnt allowed yet survivors have no real rules to how they play..there are no penalties for any play style for survivor except farming team mates which only hurts other survivors...in fact scummy playstyles for survivors are very often rewarded , body blocking , sabo, hatch camping , etc..looks rather one sided doesnt it, I could list examples all day.. It would cause newer killers to feel undervalued and I very much think cause a mass killer exodus..why do you think high rank survivors are getting bottom rank killers ? Theres not enough high rankers... small things like this make a world of difference in this game
I mean that's why I said these penalties should not apply once the exit gates are ope. Of course the killer is forced to camp then.
Also, I feel like we are getting in a spot where people don't feel like survivors are favored. Pallet vaccuum removed, exhaustion nerf, healing nerf, pallet density nerf, Mettle of Man nerf, and so on. There have been many changes that favored killer. Survivors have gotten very little buffs in comparison. It definitely was needed, but saying the devs favor survivors just isn't true anymore. And then there are map reworks coming, which will just buff most killers in the game.
And all things you listed, are just ways for survivors to be able to gain an advantage and to win. It doesn't prevent you from playing as killer. Being camped pretty much means you can't play the game until the next match.
I think the posts that talk about long killer queue times speak for themselves. We need more survivor players, and getting rid of the probably most frustrating thing to deal with as survivor will most likely help.
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@Locker_Monster said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/663488#Comment_663488
The radius does not matter.
Survivors will, just like last time, figure out where it ends and camp there. This will force Killers to either get punished or give up a free unhooking because the game is FORCING it on them.
Again; a punishment was tried. Survivors found that magic area where the Killer was punished for camping while the Survivor was nearby to unhook their friend. It, like I said, forced the Killer to either be punished or walk away for a free unhooking.
And if you force that kind of non-choice on new Killer players, and old ones, Killers WILL leave. And it will be more of them than your hypothetical Survivors. No one would want to play a game that slaps them in the face when the other team abuses the mechanic.
But that doesn't make a difference. If a survivor camps just outside of the radius or is anywhere else outside of the radius, either a killer is just standing at the hook and camping or knows you are there, finds you and then you are in a chase. I mean there is not telltale for a killer if a survivors is near a hook or not, except maybe for Barbeque and Chili. Just camping outside of the radius isn't abusing the mechanic in any way.
I doubt that many killers will leave the game just because they can't camp anymore. Definitely not as much as survivors leaving the game because the game is no fun to them when they get camped. And I mean, the longer killer queue times are not hypothetical. Personally I wouldn't mind if they got shortened, by having more people play survivor again.
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Now that's a weird edit. Did anyone say that survivors need nerfs? Cause they certainly don't.
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@TheGorgon said:
It's complicated man. This isn't just "fixing" a universal game mechanic, no, many perks and killers such as Insidious, Leatherface, Ghostface and other things vouch and encourage the gameplay of camping. It would take an overhaul and it's not something that can be done overnight or over a month. Think about it like a topic and it's sub-topics.
You also can't "nerf" populous psychology in-game, you might be able to alter some or many peoples opinions, but it won't be a concrete and direct hit towards the issue. This will and will always be difficult to figure out and even then, don't expect it to go away completely.
You're right, it would probably take longer. But making camping less effective will surely make more killers want to try and get better at the game and win without camping like crazy.
Also, Insidious just needs a complete rework. It's both awful designed and a very bad perk.
And Leatherface is one of those low tier killers anyways that need some buffs. Ghost Face though I don't really feel like he excels at camping. No more than any other killer, since he can get revealed by the hooked survivor.
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@Pulsar said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/663471#Comment_663471
How about we nerf survivors gen speed whenever the killer's heartbeat can be heard. That is what you are proposing.
Uhm, what the hell are you on about? That is pretty much just admitting that camping is the most effective strategy in the game. Lol. Killers can get kills without camping, in fact it's more effective that way. But it's just awful design because the survivor getting camped can't even play the game. Survivors doing gens is the only way to power the exit gates, plus the killer is still able to play the game exactly like in all cases.
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@Gopher said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/663478#Comment_663478
I believe they can have the game refunded within a certain amount of hours if they are dissatisfied. And that is their right. If they are not having fun, get that refund.
But that's not the problem. I want the game to grow, not for people who play survivors refund the game. The killer lobby times can already be annoyingly long.
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@Locker_Monster said:
Here we go for the 5000000000th time.
Camping is a legit strat.
Camping defeats itself by being a BAD legit strat.
There used to be a punishment to camping: Survivors found out how to abuse it to screw over Killers.
Camping is part of the game.
Complaining about camping is like going to the Overwatch forums to complain about sniping. 'I think Snipers need to be nerfed. Sniping takes skill, but new players are going to get sniped nonstop & can't snipe back. So sniping will chase new players away.'
If you slow down the bleedout, guess what Survivors do?
They stay just far enough away to force the Killer to camp for 5 minutes & lose the game, or the Killer has to walk away & give up a free unhook. This is EXACTLY what happened with the old punishment; Survivors would stay just outside the Killer's TR, so the game thought 'he's camping for no reason!' & punished the Killer.
If you reveal the Killer's aura after <x> time, guess what?
Insidious is now useless. Remove the perk. Again; Survivors stay just far enough away to trigger the punishment, forcing the Killer to eat it or walk away.
People need to stop with the 'Nerf/Punish/Remove Camping' threads. They're either wrong on many levels, or want to remove it simply because they hate it and want everyone to conform to their rule book.
Punishments were tried. They were abused. Camping is how it is. Stop.
Have you read my post? I know it's a legit strategy. I know it can be bad when played properly by the survivors. But it's bad design. The fact that it can be still as effective as it can be right now. Why ignore low ranked players? Don't you want the game to grow?
As I said, the radius could just be increased for radius. Or also have the penalty not apply whenever the killer is in a chase. Something I forgot to add and will add.
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@Dragonredking said:
Increase the bleedout time on hook?
You think killer that camp give a ######### about how long the survivor is going to spend on hook?
They don't camp to win they don't care about winning in the first place.
You can make the bleedout timer infinite they still would be camping, you can show their aura they will still camp
THEY DON'T CARE
Punishing them won't work, rewarding them won't work either and it can't be prevented
The problem is it can be effective. Especially at low ranks. Or when using Hex: Ruin and NOED.So why would a low rank killer want to play any other way, since it takes very little skill to camp. Making it less effective will definitely make more killers try and not camp.
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@Gopher said:
I think that new survivors will also face new killers. I agree that it can ruin a game experience for people, but hopefully they give it a second chance and try again. New killers tend to be a little campy and tunnelly. It's a learning curve for them too. I think after a killer sees that he's getting little to no points, he will change his strategy up. But again, they may just like doing it to ruin peoples experiences. In that case, they deserve the little bit of points they get. It's a tough problem to address and many ideas have surfaced that would be great, but I think it will remain unchanged simply due to the fact that the killer is punished via points for the camp.
That's why I want the change. The notice it won't do much, so they try and get better at the game. That's the point. Pretty sure camping is very effective at low ranks, since survivors don't know how to counter it. And then probably leave the game. Sure, I'd hope that they give the game more chances as well. But it's likely they won't, and I can totally understand that.
Having killers derank because of camping just makes this worse at low ranks. If I was interested in survivor and would just be starting the game, I could very well see me regretting buying the game after one or two days.
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@Speshul_Kitten said:
You can’t nerf camping without forcing the player (Killer) to play a certain way. This action will drive away killers from the game.
To understand this you must understand the psychology of human behavior: It is human nature to hold onto something you think is yours i.e. the person on the hook. The main reason for camping is because the Killer feels they are losing a battle in which the only thing they own is the person on the hook. Therefore, asking the Killer to submit the hooked victim is like asking the Killer to give up something they feel belongs to them. It’s just not going to happen.
The reward must be substantial enough for the Killer to decide they will benefit more overall. Thus BBQ and Chili comes into play. The killer uses this as an opportunity to expand their overall gameplay output. However; this perk will only benefit the person on the hook if the killer feels like they might still have a chance to turn the tides.
The devs will not give greater rewards to a killer for not camping as this would cause imbalance in the rewards system. No reward is REASONABLY good enough to stop a killer from camping.
I mean I don't really know if you can apply the human nature to something like this. Like killers believing the hooked survivor is theirs? That seems weird and a little unhealthy for just playing a game. The point is, it's not good game design. It would be the best for the game to nerf camping. I mean, as long as another survivor is within that radius, the penalty should be removed anyways. So killers would just have to play smart when they want to defend a hook. It seems like a healthy change to me.
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@Poweas said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/663335#Comment_663335
Yeah it shows how ungrateful some people are. I mean DS is balanced as hell now.
It really is, I agree with that.
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@Gopher said:
I always say that if a killer is camping, do the gens. At most, the killer will get a 2k if everyone gen rushes a camping killer. In the end, the killer will get way less points by camping. I'm not sure they realize this, or maybe they don't care and are just looking for ruin someone's game experience. Others argue that it's a strategy and I agree, although it isn't the best strategy. When I play killer, I hook and immediately go after someone else. More points, more fun and less salt in the endgame chat, haha.
Yes, exactly. But new players won't know how to counter camping. They'll just get camped or face a camping killer, think this game sucks, and leave. Not really favorible prospects for the game.
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@brokedownpalace said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/663335#Comment_663335
Because they don't actually want a balanced perk. They may claim to or they may like to think they do, but in all sincerity they just never want to see the perk run again.
I'd rather not have one less meta perk. They really need to work on the weaker perks. More meta perks, not less is the right way to go.
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@immortalls96 said:
It's no issue till the ds user sits on a gen in front of you, or starts destroying all your hag traps , or sits in a locker for free God mode..the base idea is ok..but sadly it's now being abused
Just down and slugg the DS user then. The only problem is when they get in a locker. Still don't consider it that much of a problem though.
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@Poweas said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/663349#Comment_663349
I've mained both of them before. When they're mastered they're not a sweat. Nurse is easy anyway. Even without mastery of her I picked her up in 2 games.
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/663352#Comment_663352
Yeah I played her like a pro in my first as Hag. But me and you have had knowledge about these killers when first playing them thats why we find them easy. Most the community struggles when learning Hag or Nurse. But I find them like a slap on the wrist kind of effortless.
I doubt most will pick up on her so fast. I tried her often enough but I still suck so badly with her. But good for you.
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@immortalls96 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/663345#Comment_663345
Then teach them..we all suffered all this and we are still here..gutting the only good offering killers have wont change that...
Teach them? No, new people will try this game in hopes to enjoy it and have fun. Things like Mori and camping is not fun, at all. Also not sure what you are supposed to teach them about Mori's. Sure you can teach them how to counter camping, but that doesn't make getting camped any more fun. It's probably the game's biggest design flaw, since it pretty much makes the survivor being camped not be able to play the game. If new players get camped multiple times, they'll just think this game sucks and leave it, and I wouldn't blame them. We can't only think about the players that are good at the game.
Sure, we are still here. But I bet we'd be more if the devs improved on their design flaws that can make the game extremely unfun. I don't see a reason why we should ignore the longer killer queue times. Unless you enjoy them of course.
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@GrootDude said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/663349#Comment_663349
It honestly took me three games to pick up hag, she isn’t that hard to learn hag.
I mean with some practice you'll learn where to put her traps. I just feel she isn't so strong that it's easy to deal with survivors that really know what they are doing. She isn't the hardest either, though. But it seems like many don't really know how to play her effectively.
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@Poweas said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/663294#Comment_663294
If you're good with Hag or Billy, there's no challenge. Actually Billy might still have one cause hes loopable.
Really? Hag? She doesn't seem easy, not against survivors that know what they are doing. Heck, mastering Nurse isn't easy at all, but I do agree that it is to easy to win with her once you do master her. She is just so damn ridiculously powerful.
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@justarandy said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/663246#Comment_663246
The issue to that: why using mori offerings then? Would rather use bp or other offerings which are giving me an advantage. Moris usually take longer than just hooking + you won't get bbq aura reading and PGTW activated.
That's true, but the way they are now is ridiculous and I feel the suggested buffs would take unnecessarily lots of work. Maybe have Moris increase your bloodpoint gain by 25% for every survivor you Mori. But unless a hook is right next to you, Mori's are usually faster I believe. Plus you don't need to look out for flash light saves or pallet stuns.
I honestly just want them to go as fast as possible. Killer queue times from what I see are longer than survivor queue times. Stranger Things has the potential to have this game gain many new players, but things like Moris, and more importantly camping, will probably just drive away way too many players again.
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@Poweas said:
I swear old DS needs to come back to show the people who complain about the new one, just what we used to deal with :P
The change to DS was incredibly good, I am surprised some people are still not happy with the new version.
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@SnakeSound222 said:
Definitely. That's not tunneling and the Killer shouldn't be punished. Unfortunately, Survivors can't seem to accept a fair version of DS. It always has be a get out of jail free card so they can do whatever they want. It's really sad but not surprising.
But why does this perk need to be 100% anti tunneling and absolutely worthless in any other situation? It has counterplay, it seems more than fine honestly the way it is.
I think they should rather focus on useless perks to increase the variety of perks being used.