Warlock_2020
Warlock_2020
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@Peanits said:
It's definitely something that we have considered (and still do). We've experimented with different objectives and goals in the past through events. In terms of a radically different mode that plays completely differently, that can be tricky because it would split the playerbase and increase matchmaking times, and it would also require two modes to be balanced simultaneously.
If you ever have ideas for a gamemode you'd like to see, feel free to post them in the wishlist subforum. We'd be happy to take a look.
What about random matches/modes? YOu que up, you don't know which mode you are going into until you hit lobby. If you don't like it, leave, but if you stay in random, you get 25% bp bonus for all actions.
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@Peanits said:
The perk was changed because in the right hands, it was far too powerful and incredibly frustrating to play against. The goal with the changes was to keep the powerful effect of the perk while allowing the killer to have some counterplay against it. This was done by adding a prerequisite to the perk where it only becomes active after being unhooked. With that change, the perk can no longer activate in the early game and prevents the momentum of the entire match from being shifted wildly against the killer.
More details can be found here: https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/48381/
It's important to note that any perks, add-ons, offerings, killers, etc. can be tweaked at any point if it's deemed necessary.
Though I don't disagree with the change to DS, I think this explanation is at the core of the problem in DbD. "...in the right hands, it was far too powerful and frustrating.." This game is not competitive. It is casual, no matter how hard you want it to be otherwise. It is not balanced enough to be a competitive game.
So, to nerf perks/abilities based on the top 5% of players is a bad way to balance things. There are a ton of perks that fit Peanits description. NOED, in the hands of a toxic camper/tunneler rewards him for his actions. Insta-heals can cause a lot of frustration in the hands of a coordinated SWF. BBQ & Chili gives Nurse/Billy unfair advantage in speed-hooking (is that a hook rush?!). Adrenaline, the list can go on and on. Is that the new measuring bar?
We need to stop trying to balance by survivor/killer and start looking to balance by rank/skill levels.
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It's ok. I relate it to BT. If the killer is surprised by it, then you can really capitalize on it. If it is a ranged or one shot killer, there are negatives. Like, don't heal vs billy/Shape/LF after MoM triggers. It won't save you if you get one shot from healthy state.
It is useful, not game breaking. As Trapper, I usually try to plant half the field with traps, so by the time I'm knee deep in the chases, they are hitting traps, so MoM is not much of an impact.
Honestly, I think MoM is more an anti-tunnel perk. I'm sure it works well for that. Add BT to it and you can really counter tunneling.
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I hated playing with streamers before. Now they made it worse. Wth is wrong with this company? Do they ever think of ramifications related to their actions? The last thing we needed was to encourage more sweaty gameplay.
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Not sure what the whining is about. Played killer all night last night, even had a full group of Ash. Saw little difference from the norm. 7 matches, 25 kills. One match where 2 got away, one where 1 got away. Flip Flop never came into play. MoM was like having BT active. I just anticipate it. Don't over chase, and keep pressure on my side of the field. Ran Trapper for 5 matches, Pig for 2.
Still playing killer today. Do I get a T-shirt for keeping my will to play?
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@Maximus7 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/398192#Comment_398192
If gen rushing wasn't a thing, then games wouldn't be ending after two-three chases. Not sure what kind of survivors you've been getting, but godspeed, I guess
You keep using the term "gen rush". Wth are survivors supposed to be doing? Should they line up and take turns being chased and hooked before touching a gen? Should they run around the map once before starting one? They have one job, do gens. It is not an intentional activity to rush the gens. They want to survive they better hit gens and get them done. That is the only thing they have.
Problem is, too many killers try to pressure the whole field, but can't pick 3 to 5 gens and keep them under pressure. Don't get pulled off in a useless direction in a chase. You slow the game down this way.
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It is way too short when running enduring. I've only been hit with it once and dropped them again within 6 seconds of use. 3 of those seconds was the supposed "stun".
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Once, intentionally. The obsession was super immersive and I needed Remember Me stacks. Noticed an injured survivor all but trying to bait me less than 10 seconds after they were unhooked. They clicked their flashlight, so I figured I could use a new obsession. Downed them, DS, downed them within seconds and continued to down them over the next 3 to 5 minutes till I had 6 stacks. Then started hooking her. She kept coming back.
Did not see the immersed Claudette till she was trying to open a gate. Fun 4k.
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Big bad SWF is the real killer? Seriously, that is pathetic. Most SWFs suck at this game. It is cute when you get the ones who try to be toxic and elite with their flashlights and sabo boxes, but they suck and do it all wrong.
The big bad hit squad is rare outside of red ranks. In red ranks, I expect every group of survivors to be that good....or they should be.
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I don't need NOED. So few games get to the end game unless I'm running end game builds.
Gen rush is not a thing. Gens are what survivors have to do. If gen rush is real, then hook rush is too, especially for Billy and Nurse. Get better at pressuring the gens. Don't chase one survivor too long. Herd them by focusing on gens they have started, then changing it up. Don't be predictable.
NOED never works in my groups. 600 BP per pop, I hit totems when I play survivor. Can't tell you the last time NOED actually popped. Wasted perk slot.
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@Gamzello my comment was not directed at anyone. Obviously people with anxiety issues will stress at any aspect of this game. My Aunt has anxiety issues. She stresses at cooking on the grill due to concerns over an open flame. I'm sure DbD would flip her out.
I don't think that should be the bar we measure the roles by though. If you don't have anxiety and you are stressed over playing killer/survivor then you are taking this game too seriously. Stop and laugh now and then.
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Zero stress on either side. Its a game. I am not stressing over it.
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@thesuicidefox Pretty sure the Halloween event proved me right. All ranks were affected because even red ranks lost rank quickly as they were more focused on milking puss than doing gens.
Secondary objectives are the way to go. Tweak from there.
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Teleporting killers is not the answer, neither is limiting repair speeds. That may work in red ranks a bit, but would devastate every other bracket.
Want to slow down gens? Give survivors something else worth doing. Secondary objectives that award BP, increase survivability, assist with end game, etc.
I mentioned a long time ago having various interactive things around the map like:
1. Mud pit- survivor spends 10 seconds covering themself with mud and gain 60 seconds of immunity to aura sight abilities the killer may have. Pit respawns after 180 seconds or so.
2. Murderous tools- survivors search toolboxes hidden around the map for an object used in horrible crime of passion. The Entity awards extra bloodpoint to any survivor who repairs a generator with one of these tools.
3. Entity's Chosen- In the first 90 seconds of the match, a dark rune will appear on the map. The first survivor to absorb the rune is given the Entity's blessing. That survivor repairs generators with a 10 percent debuff to their speed, but is able to locate exits and the hatch from anywhere on the map. Furthermore, if they are the last remaining survivor, they are able to open the gates as if all the generators were repaired. It takes 16 seconds to absorb the rune.
4. Oil Barrels- Survivors can cover themselves in oil in order to greatly increase their chances of getting off hooks, or escaping the killer's grasp by wiggling twice as fast. The blessing has a curse though. The survivor struggles to hold tools and slows down their gen repair speed. Oil stays on a survivor for 180 seconds at a time.
Etc, etc.
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@Maximus7 said:
Please let this happen. Also block off the exit gates so they can't crawl out.
No. This is the killer's fault for losing track of their prey when slugging. Survivors should not be punished because you slugged and messed up. If I drop two survivors in the exit gates, one will likely get away, but so be it.
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You are more likely to be hard camped/tunneled as a survivor than you are to face a 4-man hit squad as killer. Granted, the odds increase at red ranks, but it is still not the norm. Watch any red rank streamer and you will see several teams who try to be a hit squad, but few good enough to be competitive with it.
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Head on rarely works. Flat out worst perk right now. Exhaustion for no reason.
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Rank 8-10 almost instant to 2 minutes. Been nice to get low ping survivors again too.
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Ranking system is more to blame. Survivors are ranking up much more slowly than killers. The new system truly puts the survivor pip in the hands of killers and team mates.
Getting camped/tunneled = no pip
Killer is camping/tunneling other = no pip due to no no chase. (Camp and tunnel is worse than ever now. They know you need that chase emblem and altruistic actions to pip, so you will feed them kills)
Survivor DC's in the beginning, likely not popping unless you have great survivors or potato killer
3-man laod game, see above.
Good killer with potato survivor = no pip
Tried to do a survivor daily yesterday to rescue 3 hooks. Took 3 matches to get what resembles a game. First was a match where only 2 survivors loaded into game. Killer (Billy) had no mercy. Bye-bye party streamer. Second was two idiots chasing the killer with flashlights, but they could not use them nor loop. The third survivor moved from locker to locker. I got two gens down while he slugged them. Got them up a few times and they went back to killer. Hatch escape and no pip. Last was a good match. Got three rescues, 2 escaped, and got a pip finally.
Get used to long wait times with this system. Few survivors are going to get up there in ratio to killers. I pip almost every match on Trapper, there is no comparing the two anymore.
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Jen, no0b3, and puppers. Each have a different style, but all teach something worth while.
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I work a gen and hope others do too. If 3 gens pop suddenly, that might pull the azzhat away a little, especially if it was close. Then try to save them. Rushing in to save them rewards the azzhat camper and does nothing to help the camped.
If I'm on the hook, I want you to spread out and kill off 3 gens. Then maybe get me down. Screw this camping killer, get done and get out. I get satisfaction knowing he got crap for points and likely depips.
Honestly, most want you to try to save. It gives them more points, which is not their goal, and aggravates the survivors more. That is all they want. They are griefers, nothing more.
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@Blueberry said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/390299#Comment_390299
The current hatch mechanic forces killers to slug if we want a chance at a 4k, it isn't an option. We don't want to slug.
I 4k most if my matches, yet rarely have to slug. Slugging is not the only way. I find it pretty sweaty when the killer wants the 4k that bad. If you chased and pressured well, you got plenty of hooks and chase em lem.
If you have a DC or two, I can see slugging in order to avoid depip.
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@Coriander though I agree with you, I think there is one other part of the equation. Many survivors are so paranoid of being camped or tunneled they won't put themselves at risk. To me, if you're that concerned about it being camped or tunneled, stop playing. It is basically feeding the campers.
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Warlock is the call sign of a Cyberpunk character I played for years. Cyberpunk 2020, so Warlock_2020
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They tried this once already and it led to zero survival rate. I don't understand the crying about the hatch. It is the least troubling thing in game to me. I either get them before the jatch, or they get out. I never sit there staring at the opponent at the hatch. That is purely your own fault for being stubborn/feeling entitled to that kill or escape.
Fix the thousand other things and Freddy rework before you even think of the word hatch.
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@Condorloco_26 I think you are absolutely right about balancing by rank and have said so in the past. Unfortunately, many in thos forum did not like that idea. Heck, limit certain perks to certain ranks. That gives some benefit to ranking up. If I can't run NOED or Adrenaline until rank 9, that is good reason to want to get there. Or just limit the tier that can be used at each rank.
I'd say to add a stamina system for long chases, but that could increase tunneling.
Either way, more discussions like this are needed and not the usual us vs them.
Oh, and I've grown to like killer more than survivor. Won't switch back, but might play more if they upped BP. I am a glutton for punishment though, I main Trapper. I love the strategic side of placing traps where they are not expected.
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@Condorloco_26 If I may, it does not matter. I started as survivor, and due to some of the reasons listed by the OP (BP, DC's, constant camp/tunnel), I switched to killer. Been playing primarily killer for six months or longer, more than I ever played survivor. Any time I try to talk about the shortfalls/issues of survivors, the killer mains lose their mind on this forum. Killers on the forum don't care about making the game better, just making their games easier.
The problem has long been that this is a casual game, that wants to act like a competitive game. This cannot be a competitive game on the gaming circuit due to its core system. Since the rank in this game has no impact at all, just personal enjoyment for a few, that makes this more a casual game than anything else. When players jump into a casual game and face try-hard killers/survivors, it is frustrating.
Survivors, when organized and skilled, can run a map. Those groups are less than 1% of the survivor player-base. Killers who camp and tunnel can completely destroy the experience of others, they make up roughly 40% of all matches. That is why camping and tunneling are talked about so much. Add in the crap bp survivors get and DC's and it is getting worse and worse for them. I literally moan when my wife used to want to play because that meant I had to play survivor. Luckily, she quit the game after this past week of match making and constant tunneling with high ping killers from across the world.
In my opinion, tunneling/camping can't really be fixed. They can add in some defenses for survivors to get away from it, but it is sometimes an actual legit strategy, but most often used from the start of the game. The best way to mitigate the frustration is to figure out how to get more bp to survivors, especially those who are tunneled and camped out of the beginning of a match.
Unless you are an absolute tool, there should be no match where your items+addons+offering were worth more than the bp you spent in the match. Too often, that is the case for survivors because bp rewards are a joke. I can run 4-5 matches as killer in an hour and make somewhere between 300k-500k depending on offerings. That same hour might get me 20k to 200k as a survivor, depending on team members, killer type/skill, and whether I was lucky enough to get camped/tunneled more than once in that time. That is at the core of the problem.
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@Carpemortum said:
How about a perk that slows gen progression by X% while in a chase. Would promote stealthier options to the constant "look at me" looping and slow gens down.
Even if someone wanted to abuse it and never end a chase, gens would still get done.
It's also up to the killer to fully use the perk by finding survivors as quickly as possible.
Thoughts? Just kind of a basic idea.
Has potential.
As for current meta, that is hard to change without some serious gameplay changes. I don't really use many meta perks on survivor. I'm all about the BP, so anything giving extra BP is likely in my basic build.
As for killer, they are trying to...slow the game down jus a lil bit. So you see ruin and sloppy a lot, as well as aura sight perks that allow the killer to pressure the map in order to slow it down. Hard to break that meta without game changes.
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The new system had too many flaws. Though a few people saw improvement, the vast majority were seeing their game become almost unplayable. Out of 70+ lobbies I had less than 3 with ping below 300. Out of 20 survivor matches there was only one killer from the U.S. with ping below a hundred. The rest were from Eurasia with 300+ ping. 45 minutes of lobby jumping to get a 250-300 ping lobby was not worth it. Add in the fact you rarely got a killer, or team mates, of appropriate rank and the new emblem system and you were all but guaranteed a depip each match.
It was not much better as killer. Survivors from across the world blinking around with their high ping only to learn you just destroyed a group of rank 20's.
No, that match making was horrendous and needed tweaking. They made the right move here for the majority of their players.
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Forgot Chili, Bitter Murmur
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On killer side I'd like:
A perk to assist with slowing gens down other than Ruin. Ruin is over used
A perk to get a short burst of speed, similar to sprint burst, but only able to be used once or twice a match. This could really help with those long pallet loops (which you really should not follow - 30 seconds, pressure a gen).
A perk that protects hex totems for a short period, or maybe for x seconds after each hook, totems are immune to destruction.
On survivor:
I'd like to see more perks that give bonus bp, or maybe actions that do it so the bp perks are not "meta". The grind is real, and I find myself running WGLF and Prove Thyself in almost all matches, just for the bp. Would be nice to see that shaken up some.
A perk that lets the survivor phase through a solid object one time in a match. I know, sounds horrid, but it would only be useable once, and could end up harming the survivor more than helping them.
A perk that allows a survivor to rebuild a pallet that was destroyed. Seriously, take x seconds to assemble the pieces, but it breaks after hitting the killer, or in one hit (killer can break it 50% faster). Again, one time use.
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@darktrix said:
Well they messed up by doing two major things at once when they should of rolled one out at a time and apparently never thought out/correctly tested/or listened to anything reported during the PTB. They changed the requirements to pip with the emblem system and created a matchmaking system that disregards region and ranks. It also did what I said months ago that their matchmaking 'fix' would do - average out the wait times for killers to get a game between those who got instant lobbies and those that waited ungodly amounts of time. It looks like it averaged out to about 5 minutes.
Reverting back to the old matchmaking is worse now because many people have just shelved the game, like some people on this thread are talking about doing. That is if steam charts for the PC is any indication of the trend.
This has been my frustration with BHVR all along. They have a horrible quality control process that does think about potential unintended consequences. Just look at events, new perks, powers, or core changes for proof. When they rolled out Halloween event, several of us said there would be problems due to too many people playing killer, and survivors losing rank too fast due to farming nodes instead of gens. Within days they figured out there were too many killers. Same with new years.
These guys make changes and don't do a good job of playing devil's advocate about how those changes might impact the game.
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Had 4 matches last night as killer, rank 10, and waited less than 3 minutes for each. Best part was they were all from my region, so no blinking survivors. Ran 3 survivor matches and took less than a minute at rank 10. Again, green ping vs rank 8 US killer.
The other system was horrendous. Wait 5 to 10 minutes for survivor lobby just to get 600 ping. Took about 45 minutes and multiple lobbies to find a 250 ping and it turns out to be a rank 20 or rank 2. No pips due to lack of chase or being steam rolled by a rank 2 Billy.
Glad they changed it.
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@douggie123 said:
I just don't understand why killers should lose a kill just because survivors want to crouch in front of them. Another reason I feel the game is totally survivor sided
If you look at the perk, "We're Gonna Live Forever" on David King, it literally encourages taking a hit while the killer is carrying a survivor. You get a stack for it. Meant to be part of the game and optional strategy.
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No. It is a strategy. If survivors want to give the killer free hits, they are welcome to. Furthermore, just set the survivor down and finish them off.
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But it won't matter because rank has no meaning in match making.
If you're rank 20 killer, you're likely facing rank 2-4 survivors.
If you're in the U.S., you're likely facing a killer in China with 300+ ping and a 10 rank difference. (We really need more killers in the U.S. apparently)
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Add in the fact that every lobby is 300 ping now and the doors to the locker might not open until you are on the hook.
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@tgrab said:
Theres a skateboarding trick called the christ grab but it just looks like your t-posing in the air grabbing your board, and i also really like skateboarding.
I was such a skater punk back in the day. We are talking about when Tony Jawk was still learning to shave.
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Warlock was the call sign of a character I ran in Cyberpunk 2020.
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It quoted the wrong person, nm.
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lol If they are trying to, they are failing horribly.
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I'd say replace the reward in 3 with significant blood point reward for staying in a hopeless match.
Emblem changes would be fine if they did not change the match making and screw it up so bad. There was only one killer from the U.S. out of more than 60 lobbies? 250 ping in all but one. Lots of red rank killers in green and yellow matches. Unacceptable. How are these survivors supposed to get better when the lag is too high to play or a red rank is obliterating them? Ridiculously hard to pip like that.
It made me feel better about playing killer though. Gave survivors one more killer in the U.S. since it is apparently just me and one other guy.
Pretty good job so far......
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Legion is the only one I hate to play or face. Such a poorly designed killer in all aspects.
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Just had 3 gold and one bronze as survivor and zero pip. Played several matches and the bp gain was atrocious and I'm running PT and WGLF. DC's, 3-man starts, tunnels and camps. Went back to killer and made more BP in 2 matches than I did in 5 survivor matches. WTH is up with the survivor game now? Keep getting paired with rank 18 survivors with less than 150 hours.
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Don't worry, rank has never been more meaningless than it is now. You can be rank 15 and still play red rank killers, or vice versa. Your rank means little in matching, so don't worry about losing pips.
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@Wolf74 My bad, I did not spell it out for you. I'm referring to accepted viewpoints by the so-called killer mains on this forum. Anyone that steps outside of that stream of thought is instantly discredited as a killer. It is a sign of a very small mind set. You do that a lot.
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10 Matches last night and not one killer in the U.S. I had 250 plus ping all night. Had no idea the game lost all its U.S. killers. So, I switched to killer and figured out I was appa8the only person in the U.S. playing survivor as well because I could only get Russian, Japanese, Argentinian, Chinese, and German survivors who all had blink technology or something.
I played in peak hours East Coast Standard Time.
Please, I can tolerate all the stupid crap you devs never fix, but this match making has to go. It will drive a lot of people away.
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@Wolf74 said:
If a thread start with a title like that, you know the direction it will take...
Faulty logic. No person can claim to be a killer main and counter what the supposed mainstream thought should be. That is a very weak mindset to have.
The OP is absolutely correct. I had no enduring and was hit with ds next to a window. I lunged and got them on the other side. No way that should happen. (Damn Megs in identical outfits and both wounded. Thought I had the one who saved the other.)
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@AshleyWB this game has not had progress in some time, or minimal at best. Bugs that have been around for years go unaddressed. Reworks take years, still waiting on Freddy and ot took how long on DS?!
The more they introduce, the worse the bugs and gameplay get. That is not progress. Stop with the new material and address the known issues full force. Ditch this horrendous match making (could not get a single killer in the U.S last night and nothing but 250+ping in 10 matches) and fix the wonky engine updates that keep messing up frame rates.
Not what I would call progress from a group of experienced developers.
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@LCGaster thanks. Much appreciated