UndeddJester
UndeddJester
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@Langweilig said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3849115#Comment_3849115
First of all you can make this more complicated than it really is.
- /3./4. It is an extremely niche scenario to happen. If you bring this perk for the sol purpose to counter screams you waste a perk slot and gamble for some value, that you won’t get in 90% of your matches. Basically you waste a perk slot for something, that will most likely never happen, which is already a big enough downside.
- I think introducing hardened was unnecessary, but their effects differentiate enough, so they don’t need any more changes (for now). If you want the other effects of calm spirit you take it and if you want aura reading you take hardened.
If we assume Thrill stays the same, calm spirit should get its penalty removed as fast as possible.
Is it fair that 1 of the killers 4 very valuable perk slots is rendered completely pointless by a hard counter perk
If only one person brings anti scream perks, the scream perks doesn’t affect only one person. All others can still be affected by screams, so it isn’t rendered pointless.
If Calm Spirit/Hardened can so easily counter my scream perks, why bother taking them?
It is such an extremely niche scenario, that the killer brings scream perks and the survivor anti screams perks. You take scream perks if you want something less counterable and aura perks if you don’t care whether or not survivors bring distortion.
The last time someone used Calm spirit, was before the nerf to Ultimate weapon and I always respected survivors, who wasted a perk slot just to counter this perk.
Oh... as I was writing this post I just realised I completely forgot that Hardened reveals the killers aura for 5 seconds... I had to delete everything... 🤣🤣🤣
My bad... that changes a lot of my perspective… Calm Spirit is always useful cause no birbs is in every map... Hardened is more rewarding vs. Screams, but is dependent upon them for value (Scene Partner?). I think thats fine. Carry on that man xD
In any case, to reassert, would still like both of these perks to stop falling yelps. That would be a nice niche buff to both of them, and fits both Jake and Lara being outdoor survivalist and the damned Tomb Raider.
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Long boots 🤘
Debatable between Meg and Feng ala Sprint Burst and Lithe.
Objectively I'd say Sprint Burst is the more versatile and universally useful perk on any map, but is trickier to use and isn't as on demand as Lithe.
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They said in their own post that their maths was probably wrong and didn't understand where 46s came from, but would like to know. All you had to do was explain the actual calculation.
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I disagree, because an important part of the killers skillset is tracking hook stages. It'd be the equivalent of a killer having a perk that can break an already repaired generator but using it doesn't update the survivors on their HUD until they find that gen again.
I had a game where I was playing more for fun, and even with the notifications I missed it, I must have got pallet stunned or something as it happened, but I caught the Taurie who used it and hooked her, not realising she was on death hook.
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I've been thinking... doesn't reducing the bleedout timer in any way make slugging more viable?
We're in an era where some killers are trying to justify hard slugging... and wouldn't bleeding out faster make it more viable?
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It's still a solid suggestion. It's still a challenge perk, so this change would be fine.
Also fix Badham basement please. Boil Over, No Mither shouldn't work the way it does here.
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@Hex_Ignored said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3848971#Comment_3848971
Hardened could also use a buff. Both perks are just bad.
@Langweilig said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3848971#Comment_3848971
We can just removed the penalty for calm spirit and the conditions for hardened. I wouldn’t worry about buffing one perk only so another bad perk doesn’t get outclassed.
Sure... but if neither have a penalty then they are the exact same perk. So what do we do to differentiate them?
I'm playing Devil's Advocate here because this problem is more complex and requires a better answer.
1 - To suggest "remove the penalty from Calm Spirit" is only a half suggestion, because you make all other survivor scream blocking perks obsolete, the same way Distortion made all other perks that combat aura reading obsolete. How can any other scream perk exist when this perk exists?
2 - Also consider if neither have a requirement/trade off, the secondary effect is what is gonna split them. Not disturbing crows in a fairly benign effect, so what effect are you gonna give Hardened that isn't gonna make it just a straight up better version Calm Spirit that is behind a paywall?
3 - This is also not really considering the fact that screams are the weaker version of aura reading... so why are we so determined to make scream perks be perfectly countered with no investment or effort from the survivor? Is it fair that 1 of the killers 4 very valuable perk slots is rendered completely pointless by a hard counter perk, when the effect of that perk isn't even that strong for the killer? If Calm Spirit/Hardened can so easily counter my scream perks, why bother taking them? What is the point of a scream perk? Just take aura reading cause it's better anyway.
4 - Also is this gonna assume that Thrill of the Hunt is or isn't nerfed? Cause if Thrill of the Hunt is nerfed again, then screams are one of the few ways for the killer to protect Hex Totems, and most scream perks are either weak or have been gutted.
That's the reason Calm Spirit has its penalty, it's otherwise a perfect counter to Hex builds as one of the few defences the killer had were screams. From a game design perspective, the penalty does make sense. So how does this penalty-less version for Calm Spirit fit nto the Hex balance discussion?
I'm not rubbishing the idea, but there are a lot of questions that come off this "simple change".
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@Boons123 said:
Option 1 - Get Down Mr President!
I didn't understand the first part, can you explain?
In my opinion this Hex should not apply the effect to itself + reveal its aura This Hex is within 10 meters of the survivor, because you literally cannot tell which Hex belongs to which perks if there is more than one Hex totem.
Yeah, option 1 was the slow doesn't apply to itself. It doesn't need an aura, the fact you get no red bar is the giveaway that it's Thrill of the Hunt.
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@SoGo said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3848971#Comment_3848971
Actually, i had an idea about Hardened…
What if repeating the process needed to activate it made it so every time the killer reads your aura, it gets changed into a location reveal?
So like it powers up for every pair you complete?
Actually quite on brand for Tomb Raider opening chests and breaking bones... 🤔
My initial concern is rats players throwing games but doing non-stop totems and chests... but the work involved might be a good discouragement. Interesting idea 🤔
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@Langweilig said:
I don’t understand why they haven’t removed this penalty.
@Hex_Ignored said:
The perk doesn't need a downside to at all.
@SoGo said:
Or remove it altogether.
And if perk tiers are an issue, the bird disturb chances can be made variable.
Problem with removing the Penalty, what do we do with Hardened?
Of course Thrill of the Hunt is now brutal on this perk, but if it flat stops all screams with no downside or trade off, there is no room for any other survivor scream perk to exist.
On a side note, I have felt for a while that a nice buff to both Hardened and Calm Spirit is to remove falling yelps.
Obviously that is part of Balanced Landing, but this would be a situationally decent buff for both perks.
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Pretty much agree, Houndmaster is growing on me, but after playimg a few games as and against her, a few things would be nice to fix: -
- Snapping on generators and gates should be easier. Often pointing at a gen is "good enough" for whatever you wanna do, but having to meander your aim around to get it to latch on is a constant pain.
- Tapping power again while Snug is off searching to cancel. In conjunction with the above, having a return command would be nice. I've had him run by survivors on route to a gen and reveal them, and I want him back to start grabbing people. Instead I have to wait for him to arrive, bark a few seconds, and wait for him to come back k before I have a power again...
- Switching command with secondary power. Less useful Chase to Search, but the movement buff could help with holdW. Being able to swap preemptively while Snug is doing his thing in either state would be nice.
- Remove his scent ring from Survivor view. I'm not sure why survivors can see Snugs scent radius... it makes it much easier to see him coming and prerun from the effect, and kinda ruins the illusion of his threat. It's not like he can injure them, and the passive effect of houndsense doesn't help without landing an m1, so making detecting survivors easier should be a big boon of her power.
- Greater scent range when Snug arrives and is barking, plus have him stay put while detecting a survivor. Similary Houndmaster can't see through Snug when he is searching, often when you turn up survivors have hidden. I started running NTH cause it was so common for survivors that I knew were there to have vanished in the time I took to arrive. Portia doesn't have the lethality to be afforded time to look around. In conjunction with the cancel ability, having Snug stay to attention with a larger scent ring would make it so you can detect people leaving and get into pursuit easier/stop hiding.
- Have Snug deep wound injured survivors when they stun him. With the combined effect of Snug getting stunned as easy as he does by camping under a pallet, and also getting completely messed up by pallet drops after the chase command is sent, it would at least be nice if a survivor is injured already to get deep wound on stunning Snug with a pallet. Won't come into play much, but as least If you are forced to leave th at survivor for whatever reason, at least the deep wound makes it not be a total loss.
- A passive detection around Snug while he is following Portia. This would be a nice change. Even if it's a Whsipers like growling to alert you someone is nearby within 20m. This would make her non gen search ability a lot more useful.
She is a lot of fun to play, I like her a lot more than I did, but these small QoL changes and minor buffs to her kit would make her feel a lot better.
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@Langweilig said:
I don´t like either of the suggestions. It also got counterplay already, just cleanse the dull totems. The killer won´t protect them.
I only hope they give it something in return when it gets nerfed. 12% per totem would be fine or what I hope for as secondary effect if they return it back to 10%:
- Reduces the healing, repairing and sabataging speed by 3% for each remaining Totem.
It's not really counterplay when you have to take longer than half a generator to cleanse a dull totem before you can even start attempting to remove the actual threat my guy.
It's been long known that doing totems for points is a throw... and that's at a mere 14s. Making it a mandatory 47s? That's busted. Imagine if you play a game of survivor where you spend 45 seconds doing literally nothing, and that isn't even including search time. I would call that a throw, and expect to lose as survivor in that scenario, wouldn't you?
That is the value of Hex perks, when sufficiently strong they grind the game to a halt as survivors look for them, and forces survivors to take risks removing them while the killer defends them, and that's the key, defend them... TotH makes it so monumentally easy to defend them even Demogorgon was nerfed so he couldn't do it with add-ons… only for it basically be made also doable for any map mobile killer.
All hex perks have been balanced with the idea of having to find and cleanse them in 14s. As I said, if raw slowdown on cleanse time is needed for Hexes to be viable, we should be looking at the base cleanse number, not make 1 perk grant more than triple the time it takes to cleanse a Totem.
12% might be OK, but it's still a boring change, taking it to 35s to cleanse a Totem. Thats better cause at least Counterforce would actually do somethi vs. that, but it's not very interesting.
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Yeah No Mither is not the way. You're too juicy a target and too dependant on which killer you're up against.
I found that running Invocation: Weaving Spiders was the best approach, and the important part is, don't use it immediately. I mean you can if you feel confident, but I found doing a gen and then going for Weaving after you'd taken chase one time and been injured was more beneficial. Not only is it more useful to the team, but you can actually assess how the gamenis going before you use it (and see if perks like BBQ and Chilli are in play).
You basically forgo getting healed hook, and run straight to basement, which means you've taken chase, you've used a full set of hits, you don't cost your team the time to heal you, and you've contributed plenty of value via gen times.
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The scripting of her lines and voice acting is awesome. Portia keeps coming out with odd little lines that make me think "huh... that's clever".
She's kinda growing on me as a killer, and I do have a lot of fun with her... her Chase power is weirdly satisfying to land... like a Trapper trap, it has a "Hah! Gotcha!" feeling about it, especially when he leaps a window and catches a survivor.
I also like running along scent lines, feels awesome, and it's clever that the path gets mapped out regardless of Snug, so even if he gets stuck I can still use the ability to zoom around the map.
One thing I would like is being able to swap between Search and Chase mode at any time, particularly when Snug is off searching… the number of times I want him on Chase for when he comes back from Search and I'm having to wait first and inevitably fumble my modes is infuriating.
The only other thing that I would probably want is something to help her out vs. Snug getting stunned. If a survivor is injured, it'd be nice if they got Deep Wound or Haemorrhage after being bitten by Snug, just so her power still has some threat, even if it's pallet hell.
I also want her torso bulking out a bit too. The legendary skin with the poodle looks awesome, because she has those big shoulder pads and pads on her arms to make her torso and arms look thicker. Even though it's an optical Illusion, this version of her looks a lot more imposing and bad ass. If her torso and arms were a little thicker at base, she'd be perfect IMO.
Also I want a sea curse skin on her at some point. A true horror of the deep type deal 😏
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Myers blood mask is the GOAT
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@CrimsonVoid said:
This issue happened a few months ago, the workaround is to go to the options and toggle anonymous mode on and off and back out. This will force the game to save, noticiable by the spinning red entity claws on the screen.
Beat me to it!
Yes anyone wanting to save their selections/loadouts, toggle/change any option in the menus.
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@TheSubstitute said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3847689#Comment_3847689
My stated position on the perk has been it's useless in solo. I'm just restating that as it's unrealistic for anyone to expect that every forum poster keeps track of every other forum poster so I of course didn't expect you to know that I said that but that's my position. I'm not arguing it can't be used in a coordinated 4 person SWF; my argument has been that it's a badly designed perk as it's useless for all but a tiny portion of the player base (and the ones it benefits are the group that least needs any help).
Well fair point, though to play Devil's Advocate it's quite tricky to make a perk like this be useful in soloQ and not abusable by SWF.
The goal was to make a perk that allowed transfer of hook states. This at base is EXTREMELY strong, like Old Borrowed Time level strong. So how do you do it?
Well now you have basically 2 options: -
- You allow the full strength and potential of the hook trade ability and give it a huge downside/risk so that regardless of SoloQ or SWF the killer can really punish them hard (this is what BHVR opted for). Sadly this means SoloQ tends to get punished much harder than SWF.
- You stack a huge number of conditions on it similar to DS, so the perks impact is massively neutered and very situational. E.g. each player can only have a hook stage traded either way a single time. (2 possible total per survivor team).
The latter would be complained about just as much since it would massively nerf the potential of the perk, and for SoloQ again, likely would not really stop insistent tunneling... so BHVR went the former route.
I am a believer that a sufficiently skilled set of soloQ players can play like a SWF.
I know that SoloQ has a disadvantage, and that is a byproduct of the facts that information in DBD is very valuable, but players who exploit all the knowledge available to them can effectively play like SWF. Most people don't, but they can.
So to my mind, you can't make a perk with power such as this a foolproof perk that any goomba can use freely, cause then you get the Borrowed Time/Decisive Strike/Mettle of Man situations.
How you reign perks like this in is difficult, but they absolutely must be reigned in.
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@TheSubstitute said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3847683#Comment_3847683
That's a good suggestion for SWF but I play solo nearly exclusively due to my schedule. Both perks are great if people know to let you marinate on hook but solo can't communicate or coordinate that.
Unfortunately no perk can combat Survivor stupid... to do that you'd have to have the most broken unbalanced stain of a perk ever... xD
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@TheSubstitute said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3846569#Comment_3846569
I did run Vigil. It made no difference. Non-tunnelling Killers aren't hanging out by the hook and tunnelling Killers are proxy camping so they're at the hook before the unhooker can get away. STB is a weak perk.
Take Reassurance and Camaraderie with it. Punish campers uber hard.
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Counterforce considerations 🤔🤔🤔
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Houndmaster can use Search ability as a speed boost for map traversal as well as a decent detection tool. I'm pretty sure someone better than me could effectively use it to get speed boosts on loops.
Her Chase ability is decent if you are good at aiming it, and I've snuck some nice hits/zones for survivors running to pallets, and I've also found that if you know youre not gonna get a lunge at pallet, you can still throw Snug at the survivor to get them to spend it stunning him instead of you.
She's not especially strong, she's not gonna rival the upper Echelons of the tier lists; she's effectively an m1 killer with a decent movement hinder ability that is an alright anti loop/zoning tool, some map traversal and some detection. I'd probably tenatively put her in the same line as Clown thus far. Has some good tools, but also some glaring weaknesses.
Maybe if Snug had a small amount of invulnerability frames immediately after biting or something so he's more consistent at those really tight hits under pallet... or even if he just stunned the survivor for 0.5s after jitting a survivor so they can't immediately start running again after cracking a pallet on his head... but I've not played enough games yet to get a proper feel.
What I will say is she's surprisingly fun... I thought this killer was gonna be a pain for controller, but it's surprisingly decent on console. Haven't had much in the way of Snug glitches though myself, which helps.
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Erm... just use clean break at gate, it's not hard...
Unhooking broken is a bit harder but you could take numerous perks to achieve this. Deliverance, For the People, Moment of Glory, Clean Break and the Invocation Perks can all be used to achieve this.
Though it's free any time you face Plague or Legion with pin. Woudl also have been doable with Skull Merchant too, but y'know, we railroaded her xD
If people are taking No Mither, that's just doing it the hard way... can't blame an achievement when players are being silly 😅
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@SuspiciousBrownie said:
I’ve been playing a lot of survivor ever since this perk dropped an I have to say it has single handedly won us so many games. Even when killers have one gen left and are desperately trying to get one kill to try and bring the game back it doesn’t matter.
People may not realize it but I’m calling it now this is the new meta pick. If you want to win you WILL bring this perk. Forcing a killer to spread hooks in this tunnel meta is just so strong. I won 9 out of 13 matches today 3-4 person outs
Thus far this is my experience as well.
I even had a couple of teammates trying to SoH against non Tombstone Myers (seriously Survivors what the hell is wrong with you?).
And even the extra time it took take out the SoH players was quite noticable...
Not gonna call it one way or another yet until the new patch drop dust has settled and we can really see what's going on, but I believe the threat of this perk can't be ignored.
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Surprisingly better on console than I expected. Credit where Credit is due, this power works a lot better than I though it would.
I still not great with it, but far more accessible than I thought it would be
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On top of this, I thought the salt circle was supposed to burn up after an invocation was used, so you couldn't use it twice?
I might be pulling that out of my backside but I was sure that was a thing... which makes this even less logical.
Has to be a bug... Can't be intentional... Right? 🥺
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Inevitable yes... but does anyone feel like this "buff" still leaves Distressing woefully under par? A bigger TR is actually a detriment, so you're relying on perk synergy to get value...
It gives TR at just over 41m... for a 32m TR... we get to be Wesker? Like what does it synergise with?
- Doctor Static Blast
- Legion Feral Frenzy (no real benefit)
- Wesker (for the funnies)
- Unnerving (trash perk)
- Overwhelming Presense (extremely niche that distressing doesn't do enough for)
- Coulrophobia (situational)
- Septic Touch (trash perk)
- Infectious Fright (decent, but very niche for distressing... MAAAAAYBE Pig value)
- Starstruck (decent, but niche with distressing, maybe decent on Wraith)
- Dissolution (unnecessary with distressing)
Like maybe at 50% (48m) I can start seeing it getting value as a pseudo stealth, cause survivors hear your TR often and become apathetic to it... and at that range it's making some of the perks above actually kinda decent... Starstruck might even be pretty gnarly...
But at 30% I can't see it 😒
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The comeback mechanic was way too simple to be considered a proper comeback mechanic.
I made a thread discussing it here... and how a comeback mechanic SHOULD work...
@UndeddJester said:
As we all know, 2v8 has a comeback mechanic built into it, where: -
- Whenever a generator is completed, all survivors suffer a 5% repair speed penalty.
- Whenever a survivor is hooked, all survivors gain a 2.5% repair speed bonus.
Thinking about this system, I believe it is far too simple, but as I thought more about it, I went down a bit of a rabbit hole trying to decide what exactly a comeback mechanic means for a game like DBD.
What is a comeback mechanic?
Just so we define our terms, a comeback mechanic is a mechanic where one side is given bonuses in some form in the event that one side starts performing too well and begins to snowball/dominate the game. They provide a means of giving players a chance to "get back into" the game, and at its simplest provides a means of keeping players invested in playing.
It is highly contextual to the games they are in, and the effects are unique for each game. They can be controversial (especially if implemented poorly) since at their core they effectively provide rewards for losing the game. However at the same time, depending on the game, they also provide their own elements of tactics and balance that can smooth out a lot of pain points, particularly regarding combating metas and rush down strategies.
Typically, well implemented comeback mechanics add a different layer of strategy, where a player winning early is still compounding their advantage, but is also incurring a risk along with it, where if they then get outplayed or make a catastrophic mistake despite their advantage, their opponent is greatly rewarded and effectively levels the playing field again.
To explore a couple of genres for games that have comeback mechanics:
MOBAs (team vs. team)
A game like League of Legends for example has multiple comeback mechanics, such as killing spare bounties and objectives bounties.
TLDR - This works in this games context because the focus of LoL is more the objectives and your role in the team, more than your specific ability to win your lane (due to the huge roster). If you're getting ahead, you should in turn be pressing your advantage to help push your team ahead, but that itself comes with the risk you yourself are also a target as well as said objectives, so once you're ahead, you can't just throw yourself at the enemey team and kill as many as you can for free while your team takes the map objectives.
For those who are unfamiliar who want a longer explanation, LoL is all about destroying the enemies base. To do this you farm/kill creeps, monsters and other players to gain experience for levelling up and gold to buy items. The faster you level up and buy items, the stronger you become relative to your opponents.
When a player gets a killing spree, they also get a bounty that increases the longer the killing spree goes. If an opposing player kills the player with a killing spree, they did so at a great disadvantage and can effectively score between roughly 1.3x to 3.3x the gold they would normally get for a kill. A player getting killed repeatedly will also get a losing spree, which will also reduce that players value similary down to 0.33x the normal value.
The idea is that if you've managed to win your lane and get substantially ahead, you are in an advantageous position, and should be pressing that advantage to secure objectives and help your teammates win their lanes to put your team ahead... but if you fail to make use of that advantage, or you get outplayed, your opponents can get their own player fed.
This makes sense in League because the roster is so large with so many hard counters, that a player snowballing a lane is normal, so the comeback mechanic smoothes out the natural snowball that occurs when a player starts to lose, and still forces League goal as 5vs5 teamwork based game.
Fighting Games (1vs.1)
Games like Street Fughter 4 or Marvel vs. Capcom 3 have comeback mechanics in the form of Ultras (a single high damage move) or X factor (a 1 time damage, speed and recovery boost that last longer the fewer characters you have alive).
TLDR - These mechanics work because the pace of these games can quickly result in a heavy deficit for one player, and it's not uncommon to see the fight grind to a halt while a player protects their life lead. These comeback mechanics ensure that both players are still fighting to the end, and actively trying to knock each other out, and the comebacks themselves still require the losing player to outplayed their opponent to use them, they are not "free win" buttons.
For a more full explanation: A game like Street Fighter 4 has comeback mechanics in the form of Ultras, which are a super powerful move that builds up as you take damage with enough damage to totally swing a round.
Marvel vs. Capcom 3 has X factor, which is a 1 time per round boost to damage, speed and recovery that lasts longer based on how many of your fighters are still alive when you trigger it. With all 3 characters alive, it last only a few seconds, maybe allowing a single high damage combo to quickly try and knock out a character, with only 1, it is has a much longer duration, that can turn your lone charactervwothoit assists into a bulldozer that chews through your opponents team.
The comeback mechanic makes sense here, because the pace of these games means a few unfortunate 50/50 exchanges can result in the better player falling significant behind and then getting "lamed out" using keep away and run tactics, non-stop blocking, and running out the clock (having more health when the timer expires is a win).
While people can still do this in these games, the comeback mechanic is a new threat to take into consider. It still requires the losing player to win an exchange (which is harder to do because while on low HP a mistake easily results in a round loss, especially on a time limit), but playing overly cautious and falling for a grab or a mix up can lead into being punished extremely hard and even the game back out (or lose it outright)... this keeps both players engaged the whole fight, and taking opportunities when presented to try and close out the round.
It's also worth noting though in both cases the formerly winning player will now also get their ultra/factor boost as well, but now like before they still have to win the exchange to use them.
So what does a comeback mechanic mean for an asym?
The traits that make up a good comeback mechanic are: -
- It only comes into play when one side is being heavily dominated, and otherwise has a minimal or non-existent effect.
- It doesn't remove the winning sides advantage (which effectively punishes them for winning), it instead creates a "risk" that the winning player has to be wary of.
- It still requires skillful play from the losing team to exploit that incurred risk, rewarding them for good play and not giving up.
With this in mind, while I'm not full.blown negative Nancy on the 2vs8 catchup mechanic, I believe it does fail on all 3 of these points.
That said, it seems to me that coming up with a fair and balanced method of employing a comeback mechanic in DBD is quite hard.... I don't really want to make a suggestion, because this thread is more about what the comeback mechanic should achieve more than making an actual suggestion but to give an idea off the top of my head:
The comeback mechanic should track the amount of meaningful Generator Progress made by survivors and, I dunno a Pressure system of some kind for killers. The difference between these 2 defines whether the comeback mechanisms for either side trigger.
I'm gonna gut feel numbers without doing much maths or really balancing it, but hopefully you get the idea.
Generator Progress is something like a % of the total gen progress done, maybe weight gen each gen at 1, and the progress on each generator so has a value multiplier at boundaries for 0%, 25%, 50%, 75% and 100%, valued at 0x, 1x , 2x , 3x, 5x respectively.
Killer pressure is more complex, Killer pressure has points weighted based on survivor states. Something like 0.5 points for injured survivors, 1 point for currently hooked survivors, 1 points for downed survivors scaling to 2 over the course of a minute, 1.5 point for survivors on 1 hook stage, 4 points for each survivor on 2 hook stages, 7 for each dead survivor.
If I eyeball it, say the comeback mechanic would trigger when say one side is 15 points ahead of the other.
Off top of my head, for survivors getting the comeback mechanic results in getting a Distortion token passively every 120/60/30s based on their 0, 1, 2 hook stages, and a Bardic Inspiration 1/2/3% bonus on skillchecks based on comeback scaling, with an addtional 10% chance of getting skillchecks. This rewards playing smart and staying hidden, but also encourages jumping on generators and risking being found.
For killer getting a comeback mechanic results in getting a 10/20/30% faster pick up speed and passive movement haste increase out of chase of 10/15/20% for 30s after hooking a survivor based on the comeback scaling. They also gain a 10/20/30% Pop Goes The Weasel with a 10/20/30% faster gen kick speed after hooking a survivor, based on 2/1/0 hook stages on that survivor. This rewards identifying the gens needing to be protected (and helps m1 killers), not being hindered in kicking them (tempered by the anti- gen mechanic), and rewarded with a fast turnover after committing and downing survivors (especially not yet hooked survivors) and getting back into the fray.
That's obviously a rough version I came up with in about 30 minutes, but you get the kinda things I'm angling at.
Survivors comeback should involve being rewarded for playing smart, keeping their vulnerable teammates hidden and drawing killer attention.
Killers comeback should involve being rewarded for holding your important assets and converting chases successfully.
The current system doesn't encourage these things. I'm not really putting my system as a concrete suggestion (I eyeballed everything), but I hope it might inspire others to come up with their own systems!
Sadly it got drowned in the forums, but the highlight was that the 2vs8 comeback fails on 3 points.
The traits that make up a good comeback mechanic are: -
- It only comes into play when one side is being heavily dominated, and otherwise has a minimal or non-existent effect.
- It doesn't remove the winning sides advantage (which effectively punishes them for winning), it instead creates a "risk" that the winning player has to be wary of.
- It still requires skillful play from the losing team to exploit that incurred risk, rewarding them for good play and not giving up.
And 2v8s iteration doesn't really achieve any of them.
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Personally think the perk is gonna be plenty strong, just requires you to have to use your brain rather than being an unhook happy goof like most of SoloQ is.
We've all see those cracked survivors who are untouchable, that the killer drops chase repeatedly to not waste their time with them. Survivors who are actually good get real carry potential with this perk by forcing the killer to have to deal with them.
A build off top of my head for it:
- Shoulder the Burden
- Vigil
- Off the Record/Sprint Burst
- Camaraderie/Reassurance
Plenty of options to make the perk perfectly solid for absolutely thwarting a killers tunneling and camping plans. Just because a perk is not unga bunga foolproof to the point any idiot can slap in on any build and get value out of it, doesn't mean it's not still strong for players who use it at the right time.
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I wish they'd make the penalty Oblivious then buff the effects... there's so much more potential for Invocations if we don't limit it to broken...
Also Weaving Spiders should be changed to permanent exposed. That would be a cool buff, and benefits M1 killers over the generally stronger M2 killers. Sogo came up with a gem of a suggestion for that one.
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@bm33 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3844932#Comment_3844932
Imagine Deathslinger realing survivors off boxes? Or survivors needing to disarm bear traps before they can try removing their reverse bear trap? 😂
They don't count as being in chase when speared by Slingy.... you sir are a genius O🐽o
◀️🐻🪤
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Creating a bunch of burner accounts and spamming the same topic multiple times is not going to help your case, if anything that just harbours irritation and apathy over the issue and gives a much stronger reason to ignore you.
People have already started supporting this point in the first thread that was made, but that support will dwindle quickly if you keep being a pain doing this.
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@SoGo said:
She was a flop from the very beginning. Her reputation will never recover, and survivors will still DC against her out of pure pettiness just because they can and they won't forget the time she could force a server shutdown.
Also, most people (myself included) dislike her lore filled with fluff and her weird mask, which will always be the same.
Another chance to plug my lore rewrite? 🧐
j/k xD
On topic, the treatment of Skully by the survivor community was somewhat understandable, but also completely unreasonable. There were a genuine and long list of complaints to be made about Skull Merchant, but the asinine, childish and pathetic treatment of the character and her playerbase is simply not defencible. Not every Skull Merchant was a Chess Merchant contrary to what her detractors would have you believe.
Most players didn't even want to try and discuss how to improve her, to make the concept work, and shut down every discussion and idea with the same level of thought and quality of argumentation as your average youtube and facebook comment.
I respect Scott for example, but on SM he is insanely biased and refuses to concieve of a world where she can possibly exist. I can quote his as saying "After you've played the game a while, you get a feel for things that can and things that can't work, and SM can never work". Bullshit.
She absolutely could work if people got their head out their backside and really thought about it, but people didn't want to. The community had already decided, and so nothing could be done to improve the character. The last version of Skull Merchant still had problems, but she was absolutely fixable.
I look forward to her future rework, because I still like the idea of having a Ted Bundy/Patrick Bateman-like attractive psychopath killer with a surveillance system I have to sneak past Metal Gear Solid style. Her walk and everything is a part of that, and with a few improvements to her lore, is a character I actually like quite a lot.
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Even with those mondo buffs, Wraith gets utterly cooked by the Escapist class, very much like he gets cooked in 1vs4 is survivors take SB
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I mainly end up playing Escapist for some reason… it's the class I wanna play least because I don't run WoO or Exhaustion perks normally to keep my looping skills sharp, but my lobbies keep taking the others xD
As least I can help my team by running over to them and granting speed boosts… that's pretty fun… but WTH xD
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@Crowman said:
The system was designed to handle killers facecamping. It is not meant to punish killers pressuring hooks from a distance.
Is there anyone else that eagerly enters any thread they see with the words "Anti-Camp" in the title, and hunt for and like the first reply that says "anti-FACE-camp"?
It's becoming a little hobby/mini-game of mine xD
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@Vishlumbra said:
I am not sure, but it can be a reportable offense no?
It is not no. BHVR have no foolproof means of deriving player intent. After all how do you programmatically differentiate between: -
- Suiciding on hook to leave the match.
- Suiciding on hook to give hatch.
- Genuinely trying your luck to unhook yourself because your team are braindead.
- Being a noob that tries it cause they don't know better.
You could TRY and do it, I reckon I could probably build a system that would likely be right 99.5% of the time… But you can never be 100% sure you will only catch players who deliberately SoH to throw the game... and when it comes to banning players, almost perfect just isn't good enough.
There have been lots of suggestions to address it, and no one can agree on how to fix it.
If you remove the 4% you bring with it a slew of other problems (namely no Suicide for Hatch, and no last ditch attempt to escape when your useless soloQ teammates leaves you to rot on hook).
If you allow 3 attempts with no penalty, survivors always attempt to unhook themselves, cause there is no reason not to.
Allowing it to be reportable comes with issues of troll/ spite reports.
My suggestion was to allow 3 attempts with no loss of bar. 3 attempts will have the Entity pin you in place and no allow any further attempts, but for each attempt you lose 33.3% of your remaining sacrifice progress when you hit stage 2. This "pin" effect is disabled when only 2 survivors are left, and the Entity will simply accept your sacrifice at this point, since it is sated. (Though because of Slug for 4k and hatch, you could argue that disabling this is not necessary).
This means that at least a SoH player is stuck for 70s and their team doesn't have to immediately bolt to stop them leaving AND it's the killer's choice whether they kill them or not... and some killers leave SoH players slugged on the ground, so this system would be quite the deterrent for players trying to SoH to my mind.
However a lot of people reading my suggestion either disagree with it because they want their own system (though often it's one of the ones above with all the myriad of flaws therein), or they don't understand it correctly and think it's just as easy to leave on this system as it is now. I'm yet to hear a good reason against my system yet, some of the arguments seem to boil down to just not liking it tbh... but no real good argument why not... and other suggestions are met woth similar resistance.
As such the issue forever remains in limbo.
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@TheSableSimp said:
What if I told you that you literally just described the Vanity Mirror?
Small TR instead of Undetectable, can be seen by aura reading abilities. That's the Vanity Mirror.
What they should do is simply make him 4.4m/s with Scratched Mirror, and make his lunge 0.4.
Why do survivors mains hate Scratched Mirror? Because he only hits & runs. Well guess what? If he was faster he wouldn't have to.
"But 4.4 Scratched Mirror would be OP"
The mere existence of Vanity Mirror is proof that that's not true.
What if I told you that you literally just described the Vanity Mirror?
Well I did mention that as a potential problem when I said "There is of course a problem that it starts looking kinda similar to Vanity Mirror though..." 😅
The main difference would be his Undetectable would be something he could trigger, would be a bit like Pig with her Amanda's Letter add-on, but with no TR when not in stealth.
It's also why I added the optional aura read when his aura is revealed so Myrrs can easily identitlfy aura perks in play for survivors and react accordingly.
Why do survivors mains hate Scratched Mirror? Because he only hits & runs. Well guess what? If he was faster he wouldn't have to.
I think it's safe to stay he still would hit and run, he'd just be way better at it and even more obnoxious in Lery's, Hawkins and Midwich.
"But 4.4 Scratched Mirror would be OP"
The mere existence of Vanity Mirror is proof that that's not true.
I mean, its still Myers, he's never gonna be OP. I never said he was OP with Scratched Mirror, just annoying, and I wouldn't want to make him more annoying. 😅
Vanity Mirror is fun. I ran it with Jewellery Box, FttE, Lethal Pursuer, M&A with Deadlock for slowdown, and it's actually pretty decent. You can move pretty quick while looking at survivors through walls and catch people off guard with perfect mind games round corners at any high tiles. LP and M&A is there to ensure we can always find our target whenever we want and can approach from any LoS blocker for hits.
With this Scratched Mirror you can ditch M&A and LP because your aura range is much longer, and can look at taking something like Make Your Choice and Coup instead with FttE.
I think the counter aura read and the on demand Undetectable sets it apart enough from VM to at least be interesting, and that's the point of this thread 😅
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@SuspiciousBrownie said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3844934#Comment_3844934
I mean you’re right it definitely has its downsides but there is no doubt even with those downsides he is far and away much stronger and it’s not even close lol AND on top of that he moves at 92% when charging and 115% at base.
Billy’s “Hatchet” can also allow him to cross an entire map in 8 seconds flat along with instantly shredding pallets and instantly downing survivors removing half of an entire chase. With windows and long wall loops being his main weakness. Not to mention overdrive which completely messes with survivors timings and counter play mid chase. Definitely not apples to apples as you said but either Huntress should be faster when holding a hatchet or Billy should be slower when charging imo. Doesn’t make sense for her to be so slow honestly.
You also mentioned a heavily telegraphed attack if I remember right and she has one that is arguably even more telegraphed with her screaming every time she reacts a hatchet and another warning for full power that’s map wide.
I’m not really meaning to make this into a Huntress vs Billy type scenario but if you think about it then both existing how they do currently just doesn’t make much logical sense. If Huntress is considered perfectly balanced as most people I see on here say then Bill definitely needs nerfs for sure. He was at a 67% kill rate before they nerfed overdrive. And Huntress has been sitting at 55% for 6 months now.
Well, to be fair, I did think Billy getting Overdrive was a bit much personally... I would have preferred Billy go back to OG Billy and get his basekit buffs with the standardised turn fix he got.
However, I have to also admit, that outside of the balance aspects... Overdrive is very intense and fun... so I can definitely see why it was added. Without it, I feel like Billy is mostly fine, rewarding, but with a skill barrier he just can't quite break through to rival the biggest names in the game, and he sits pooling somewhere around B+, which is where I feel killers should roughly fall. I feel Huntress is about the same place, just a little higher… but with Overdrive Billy is getting up there... but I'm not sure exacty where.
My personal main annoyance with Billy now is Overdrive makes him inconsistent at tiles. I don't mind it so much as survivor really cause blue is scary, but it does annoy the stuff out of me playing Billy.
I actually don't really like playing him now because although he was harder on controller before, he is a character that requires practise, muscle memory and a good understanding of his strength and limitations, and that made him rewarding to try to learn. Overdrive makes that all inconsistent, and just makes learning all of that, especially the muscle memory, harder... to the point I don't see much point in trying to learn him.
Whenever overdrive comes up, which is often, I have to basically ignore whatever I learn. Overdrive is great if you've already learned Billy, but when learning Billy, it's just plain annoying how often I'll miss because of it, or land a hit where it wasn't really me aiming well, it was more luck or the survivors mind gaming themselves.
It's one of the main reasons I want an add-on to disable his Overdrive... However I'm aware of the fact I'm a minority in this regard 😅
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You can actually catch bots really easily a lot of the time, because the bots are consistent and highly predictable; they tend to lock in their actions quite early.
This means you can often easily chase them knowing they are going to vault at windows and pallets, allowing you to shift direction and land an easy hit nearly every time.
I think this is fine tbh, because thenbots are goid enough to help out, but against aomeone who knows what they'redoing, bots can't really carry a failing team. If the bots are made unpredictable and perform as good as or better than the average Survivor, that would start yo become rather frustrating.
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@Venjamin said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3844949#Comment_3844949
I will admit, I had zero issue with Billy when he had the overheat mechanic. It required Billy to actually make choices about when and how to use his power. Now, he doesn't have to. Since they got rid of overheat, I've had an issue with him, for the main reason of not ever requiring him to play the game outside of his power.
Overdrive doesn't change the math, for me. If they took it away, I would still think Billy is top tier, right next to Nurse. Any time you are able to use a power simultaneously for infinite mobility and instantly cutting a chase in half, you're going to win with it.
(Sorry, I'm not sure how to cut quotes inline here.)
The majority of my hours are on survivor, and I've watched Billy win match after match on the back of never m1ing. And, depending on the Billy, I can run them solidly around a lot of structures. That doesn't change the fact that eventually, he WILL get me. And he WILL get an insta-down. No survivor, no matter the skill, is 'untouchable.' And the pressure that Billy applies because immediately after that he can rocket across the map is immense.
Flicking for Billy is pretty substantial, but it's only to the left or right of his current position. Downward isn't an option, when I say "bring it down at an angle" I just mean that he can swing left or right from his 'stopping' point. He's not like Oni that can flick… kind of insanely. But he can 'miss' and still hit if he turns hard enough at the end of his swing. (Who, I might add, I have ZERO issue with facing, even if the Oni is a master of the flick bug.)
If BHVR came out and turned off Overdrive, I'd still hate Billy, because it costs him nothing to be immaculate. The player skill is required to hit a mechanical threshold, for sure, because if you just keep bumping into everything, that's… not an effective use. But the fact that even if you bump, you just do it again? There needs to be SOMETHING that makes Billy earn his power. Nurse should be the only one at Nurse tier, and again, Billy is kind of right there.
Oh to do that is this symbol: >
Then hit space and then paste in the quote. 😉
I had zero issue with Billy when he had the overheat mechanic. It required Billy to actually make choices about when and how to use his power.
I think this is primarily where we're disagreeing, because as someone who did play Billy back then I can tell you, you flat ignored the overheat mechanic. It built up too slow to be meaningful, and was the main critique of the ability... it was so little in its impact on how you played, its inclusion was pointless, and when it did come up once in a blue moon as an issue, it was just unnecessarily annoying.
Original Hillbilly didn't have this, and he was the most popular killer for both sides in DBD for literally years. He got nerfed with Overheat because of one broken add-on/perk combination (old tinkerer was busted) that allowed him to basically instant rev his saw... the nerf didn't make sense and was just a weird change noone asked for... old BHVR back in the day was quite weird at times with this kinda stuff.
To get back to the point, the reason why Billy's didn’t use their chainsaw as much before his buff isn't because there is Overheat, it's because landing a hit required you position and time your curve carefully, and on certain tiles it was more risk than it was worth. That is still case now, but now... there is Overdrive.
The reason he always goes for Chainsaws now, is because there is no reason not to. If you go for a hard hit chainsaw and miss, who cares? You're still building Overdrive. You might get lucky and score the longshot hit, but even if you don't, you're still getting Overdrive... and once you get Overdrive, if you play it right, it's almost always a guaranteed hit.
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@Venjamin said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3844844#Comment_3844844
Into killer? A couple hundred. I do mostly follow the bonus, but I have a special place in my heart for Ghostie, Freddy and non-Thana Legion. Gotta stab, and sometimes you just wanna do the murdering regardless of the bonus.
True, I'm not suggesting I've mastered Billy, I'm suggesting the "mechanical difficulties" were pretty easy to overcome. Skilled survivors should make a killer's life more difficult. The problem, though, is that Billy doesn't really have those difficulties because his chases end in a down, not an injury, and he gets to apply pressure across the map with zerodowntime.
- Telegraphing isn't a huge deal. Part of that is mindgaming. If Billy wins the mindgame, he wins the chase. If he loses the mindgame, he gets to rev and go again.
- Maybe I'm confused here, but most people on Billy have an ample hit box. A strong flick does allow them to re-orient and bring the chainsaw down at an angle. I know I've been hit sideways or around obstacles that ostensibly should have avoided the hit or had him bump. I generally give this to a mix of ping and the weird survivor hitbox pill thing that gives Huntress "curving" hatchets.
- The time to charge isn't that slow, so I'm kind of confused by this assertion. Especially if the Billy is intentionally charging/letting go to bait when his sprint fires. He should have difficulties at some loops. The problem is he doesn't seem to. Therein is my primary complaint.
- Overdrive felt unwieldy the first few times I tried it, but it didn't take terribly long to course correct with it.
This is kinda my point though, Billy is simple enough to use mechanically, but it's not that simple to catch good survivors. You're probably looking at the region of 800 killer hours before you're likely to start consistently facing survivors that will really start making you work for hits, and the scariest part is, those survivors are still pretty meh.
You have to remember Billy has been mostly the same since his release (barring insta-saw nerfs and overheat/overdrive). Billy at base is basically the same as Billy always was ever since his release. His chainsaw "spammability" that people are suddenly complaining about now has been with the character since day 1... and the Overheat mechanic was so slow to build up it basically didn't matter 98% of the time. There is no argument you have here that is not also applicable to old Billy.
Quite simply, the thing that makes Billy strong now is Overdrive.
Telegraphing isn't a huge deal. Part of that is mindgaming. If Billy wins the mindgame, he wins the chase. If he loses the mindgame, he gets to rev and go again.
Yes but you're missing the point, a good survivor will easily be able to read you and dodge. I can't do this consistently well myself, but I'mnot bad, and I've seen survivors who can, and they can be downright untouchable by even the most solid of Billy players.
Maybe I'm confused here, but most people on Billy have an ample hit box. A strong flick does allow them to re-orient and bring the chainsaw down at an angle.
The scenarios you describe here are likely lag, cause in my experience Hillbilly can't flick and hit downwards, his hitbox is very tight and unforgiving, far more so than any other comparable killer which given how dangerous this ability is, makes sense.
The time to charge isn't that slow, so I'm kind of confused by this assertion. Especially if the Billy is intentionally charging/letting go to bait when his sprint fires. He should have difficulties at some loops.
My post above explains it clearer. The technique you're describing is feathering, and the longer he feathers, the longer he spends slower than the survivor. Billy has windows at structures where he can curve, and windows where he can't. If a survivor understands those windows, that feeds into the mind games, and used properly can make it very hard for Billy to hit.
Overdrive felt unwieldy the first few times I tried it, but it didn't take terribly long to course correct with it.
Overdrive is Billy's strongest ability, and when used right, let's him get hits in places he normally can't... this pushes Billy into the top tier he is.
Personally, I don't think Overdrive is necessary for Billy. When he got given it, I didn't complain, and still don't cause I like facing Billy... but it's this powers ability to always grant a instantdown if Hillbilly plays it perfectly that makes Hillbilly the top tier characters he is now.
I see the arguments against it, and see teh arguments for it... and personally I'm on the fence...
However I will fight against anyone saying Billy is OP for any other reason than Overdrive...because if that were true, Billy would have been overpowered with his old recovery add-ons, and he simply wasn't.
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@SuspiciousBrownie said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3844844#Comment_3844844
Is 92% when charging actually slow though? 8% slower than a survivor isn’t bad at all considering Huntress is 23% slower and is actually literally impossible to land a hatchet at certain loops. And Billy can also cure a lot of loops.
I agree with you that Huntress can't land hits at certain tiles, but thats true of Billy at base for the same reasons, its all about your effective window to land a hit.
If we treat Hillbilly's chainsaw as a hatchet, you have to remember: -
- A hatchet moves between 3 and 4 times faster than Billy does when you throw it (9.2m/s vs. 25m/s - 40m/s)
- You throw a hatchet AT a survivor in straight line as Huntress, ergo the shortest distance. Billy can't look at the survivor as he throws his "hatchet", he has to look along the side of the current tile, then turn into his hit. This means his "hatchet" also has to travel further.
- In addition you can aim your shot as Huntress and adjust your aim as long as you like until you finally release. Hillbilly's hatchet can't be aimed until it first clears the obstacles, and it can only be aimed for the first 0.75s of it launch. This means the places you can even throw and curve a "hatchet" are limited to near the edges of a tile, and the further away from that edge you start, the smaller that aim window is.
Imagine trying to aim every Huntress hatchet you throw where you're only allowed to aim during your wind up, and aftrr that your sensitivity turns to 0.1. I hope this illustrates why we're not comparing apples to apples here.
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I have to ask, and this is not being elitist or 'git gud' or anything, but... how many hours have you actually put into killer, and how much have you played Billy?
The reason I ask is contrary to popular opinion, MMR does actually work quite well, particularly when you are in low-mid tiers of DBD (where the bulk of the player base is) and younfollow the bloodpoint bonuses. The skill of the survivors is important for Billy. I play on console, and even on old Billy I could still chainsaw people down to a decent degree while I was still relatively new to the killer and in lower MMR, and yes this is on crossplay.
After his buffs I got even better at it, but now I'm going up against halfway decent survivors, and even in his current buffed state, Billy is VERY hard, as you'd expect for console... but if you're saying you've genuinely mastered him in 3 games, I would still pit my 150+ games of Billy against that, and I would also pit the experience of all the Billy mains over 8 years that I've talked to over yours.
The fact you say he's so easy to learn leads me to think you haven't really played him vs. good survivors yet, because good survivors they make your life very hard if you dont play close to perfect, and landing hits on Billy is certainly not as easy as you describe.
I will grant you, Hillbilly is very strong, and one of the best killers in the game... but:
- His power is highly telegraphed to Survivors
- He cannot adjust or correct his aim or recover if he misses, which makes him highly predictable and easy to bait/juke.
- Without his Overdrive Billy can't realistically try to land hits at a large number of tiles, due to his slow lumbering speed while charging and the raw time it takes to actually fire up a charge.
- With Overdrive he can land those hits he normally couldn't... but it is so unwieldy the above problems are all amplified.
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@Boons123 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3844436#Comment_3844436
The essential difference between Leader and Better than New + my suggestion :
Leader affects the speed of sabotage the Hooks while Better than New affects the speed of Totem Blessing.Meaning, increasing sabotage the Hooks Speed is an effect that Leader can do while Better than New can't do the same effect, however increasing Totem's Blessing Speed is an effect that Better than New can do while Leader"can't do the same effect.
Also getting Leader effect is very easy but temporary while Better than New is a bit harder but the effect is permanent until they get hit.
I like that actually. Fair argument that man.
Approved. 🤘😁🤘
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@Boons123 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3844365#Comment_3844365
I like this, however when viewed from a distance you will find that leader has more and multiple benefits except for repairing generators and all it requires is for you to be within 8 meters of your ally and the effect lasts for 15 seconds after leaving the range of the effect.
This is why the usage rate of this perk is low because there is a better alternative.
How about combining your idea of increasing med kit efficiency by 75% only altruistic healing, with my suggestion written above.
Aye that did cross my mind. I was tempted to suggest BTN grants the same bonus' as Leader... only reason I didn't was I wasn't too sure if I was robbing Leader of its identity considering BTN buffs would be permanent until hooked.
I was also a little reluctant to add gen repair speed because repair speed is obviously a VERY valuable buff. We would like have to reign the numbers in significantly or add extra conditions.
However won't reject the idea, there is potential to make somwthing interesting here 🤔
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@Boons123 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3844342#Comment_3844342
What I understand is that you want to make this perk only work with med kit? or give your ally greater benefits if you heal your ally with a Med Kit?
Well neither really, I wanted the buffs regardless of whether you used a medkit or not, but I wanted it to have an additional passive effect of increasing medkit efficiency. I would also buff its numbers as well.
It's obviously faster to altruistically heal with a medkit than without, but noone does it because they would prefer to use the medkit to heal themselves... I think a perk that encourages use of medkits for altruistic healing would be pretty cool.
Combining this with Leader for example would make for a pretty nice combo whete you basically give your teammate a medkit.
My suggestion would be something like:
When using your Medkit for altruistic healing:
- increases your Medkit healing efficiency by 25/50/75%.
Completing a Healing action on another Survivor grants them the following benefits until they are next hooked:
- Increases their Action speeds for Blessing, Cleansing, Healing, Unlocking by 15/20/25%.
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Being heavily survivor sided is just as bad as being heavily killer sided, which old Haddonfield certainly was.
Somewhere between the two, where the windows in houses don't sit miles from all entrances making them near infinites for killers, but also don't have a broken wall literally 1m away from them making the use of them entirely pointless, would be a great improvement.
Also fix that ridiculously good 3 gen that can spawn around the Strode house, the one with the gen next to the porch near the window, the gen upstairs and the gen in the garden... if the killer knows about that 3 gen when it spawns… that thing is plain doofy to break.
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I feel like Better Than New should encourage altruistic healing with medkits, something like make altruistic medkit use really efficient with BTN. It makes sense since it's a reference to Rebecca healing Chris with a seemingly unlimited supply in the supplies room of RE1... that Chris wouldn't load his pockets with for some reason 😉
All the healing perks we have either don't really care about or need medkits, have penalties with medkits, or don't work with medkits... using medkits for altruistic healing would be a unique niche for the perk.
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I'm not too keen on Shattered Hope basekit, because that is an indirect buff to Pentimento, which is already quite the pub stomper perk, and buries boons even more than they currently are.
My suggestion for Shattered Hope was to keep it's current effect, but it give it an additional passive that powers up the killer in some fashion for each currently broken totem.
I discussed it in this thread here:
@UndeddJester said:
On top of it's base effect of allowing you to break boons, how about giving Shattered Hope a passive that empowers the killer the more totems that are broken?
Something along the lines of, for every currently broken totem the killer gets a bonus, such as: -
- +3% bonus gen regression on every gen kick.
- +8% bonus to vault, pallet break, wall break and pick up action speeds.
- A flat +5% haste for 20s after passing within 8m of any broken totem.
- Some other effect (insert your ideas)
- Some combination of these (with toned down numbers).
It gives an alternative means of protecting your hex totems by making the killer stronger when they get broken... so losing a totem early isn't quite such a immediate loss.
Note: Pentimento
I went the "currently broken totem" route instead of the tokens route to hinder the obvious pairing with Pentimento... only because I want to encourage interesting builds, not just have Pentimento be the staple perk you always run with it for obvious reasons. Obviously not having that perfect synergy means we have room to be a bit more generous with the numbers.
You can still run Pentimento ofc with it, the 30% isn't anything to sneeze at with the other empowered effects in play, but it has a sort of trade off that keeps builds interesting.
Thoughts?
If the effect its given for each broken totem is decent, it might make a nice alternative hex build perk, that tries to use hexes but has a contingency plan in case that fails.
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I have the official answer here:
@Peanits said:
There are currently no plans to reintroduce the achievements for the Stranger Things DLC. When the Chapter was originally removed, the achievements were repurposed as generic achievements to ensure they were still possible to earn without owning the content.
This was nearly a year ago, so I dunno if the stance has changed, but thats the latest info I'm aware of 😁