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@PistolTimb said:
That's why I like make your choice. It's a good timer.
Lol, maybe I should start using Make Your Choice as my fourth perk purely as a DS timer with occasional one-shot benefits.
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So your new idea is "saving DS until last hook gives you either a free health state or a full seconds of being unable to be hooked once you are downed no matter what".
Sorry, but no. At this point, that is basically making it so you either all but force DS to proc or force the killer to play horrendously suboptimally to play around it (because not knowing who has DS means that if you don't want to proc it, you have to leave someone on death hook slugged for 60 seconds every time you see the Obsession icon, barring you using Obsession perks/add-ons yourself). A slightly more difficult Skill Check is not close to a fair trade off to that.
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The sweet satisfying sound of a Reverse Bear Trap snapping.
Also, Clown's HUEHUEHUEHUEHUE
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@Aven_Fallen said:
There are a few things I would like to have for PIg. In general I think that she is underrated, she has good Slowdown-Potential with the Traps, once you have like one or two Traps on peoples head, when you are in a chase, the game is basically hold at this point.
However, a few things I would like to change:
Her Ambush:
I dont think that her Ambush is good as it is. It can be useful on some Loops, but thats it. Most of the time I use the Ambush just to get some BPs, in areas where the Survivor would have gotten an M1-Hit anyway. You are better off by just chasing someone with 115% Movement Speed, than trying for some Dash-Mindgames at Loops, most of the time.
Her Traps:
Her Traps are fine from the way they are designed. They also dont need to be active during EGC, they should not work that way and this is fine. However, to spice up her Traps, you MAYBE can think about the key not being in the first Box, which would result in people searching at least two Boxes. But thats a MAYBE.
However, I think her Add Ons can get some love:
Amandas Letter-->Change from pink to purple. No other changes. I think Amandas Letter is quite good as it is, but not as a pink Add On. Because you will most likely also have to use a Map Offering, because otherwise it might be wasted. Nobody wants to use Amandas Letter on Rotten Fields. for example.
Amandas Secret-->
- Gain a notification when a Survivor removes a Reverse Bear Trap.
- Auras
- of Survivors removing a Reverse Bear Trap are revealed to The Pig for 6 seconds.
- Disables The Pig's ability to see the Auras of Jigsaw Boxes.
This is what it does. And it is one of the worst, if not THE worst Add On of her. I dont see any way why I should use that. What I would like to see:
Increase rarity from purple to pink.
Effect: The Key is ALWAYS in the last Box. Also the Timer should be increased so that it will not be too deadly, it should waste a lot of time, but not be something that would basically result in death nearly all of the time, which can happen with Extra Boxes or Tampered Timer/Crate of Gears.
(Also an Idea that came to my mind, that in NO Box is a key. The Trap will not kill the Survivor in this case, but will fall off when the Timer runs out. This would be really cool with the rigged way of Amandas games, and also a tracking tool, however, when people realize that the Traps will not be deadly, they will not search Boxes, negating the Slowdown completely for tracking, which is not really that useful I would say)
Then I have some Add Ons I would like to see:
Stronger Version of Combat Straps-->A yellow and MAYBE green Version which is basically Combat Straps, but better.
Add On which removes her Roar-->Maybe yellow. Something that helps when the Pig actually ambushs someone.
Stronger version of Last Will-->Two extra Traps.
Those are the Add Ons I think can be reworked to my suggestions:
- Utility Blades-->Survivors caught in a Reverse Bear Trap suffer from the Haemorrhage
- Status Effect.
The most useless Status effect, no need to have it on Pigs Bear Traps as an own Add On. Either tie it to the Mangled Add On, or make it baseline (I mean, that person has a Trap attached to his Jaw, they will be bleeding).
- Razor Wires-->Moderately increases Jigsaw Box Skill Check
- Trigger odds.
More Skill Checks? Cool, less time to get rid of a Trap! Awesome! Does only help vs new players, experienced players will not have a big problem with that, it will benefit them.
- Interlocking Razor-->Tremendously increases the Regression penalty of failed Skill Checks on Jigsaw Boxes.
I mean, can be nice in combination with Razor Wires, and if people start to panic, they will miss Skill Checks. But again, this is something that punishes bad Survivors more than good Survivors.
So the stronger Combat Strap Add-On can either replace Razor Wires or Utility Blades.
The roar Add-On, also Razor Wires or Utility Blades.
And the two extra Traps can replace the Interlocking Razor.
Another aspect. Cuteness:
How dare you?! Pig is cute enough, and now boop that snoot!
Anyway, I think this would finetune the Pig a little bit. I dont think that she needs major Buffs, she is 100% underrated. But making her Ambush a little bit more worth it and finetuning her Add Ons will help her.
"They also dont need to be active during EGC, they should not work that way and this is fine."
I was on board until here. :P
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@Warlock_2020 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/947925#Comment_947925
That's a nice try, but suicide on hook has never been bannable, nor should it be. The "struggle" is an option, or it would not require you to tap the button.
Never has there been a ban for hook suicide, nor will there be.
What do you mean "nice try?" I'm not making things up or twisting words or anything, and I'm certainly not making up claims without being more than willing to back them up. Again, I can pull up a screencap explicitly that the things I stated are reportable offenses. Would you like me to show you?
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I got, like, six Reverse Bear Trap kills in one session today. That was pretty cool.
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Had someone try something like this on me earlier. Did not go well for them.
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@BagelLord said:
I have been seriously wondering this for a while, I understand it technically is a way for all survivors to escape without gates, but that's only when all gens are finished either way. The way it works is for 1 survivor to get hatch spawned is that everyone else is dead, and every other amount of survivors require 1+however many are left alive to even spawn in the first place. I frequently see keys being held on an even level with moris, and I simply don't understand why.
The problem in my eyes isn't that it lets everyone escape when all the gens are done. The problem is that it lets multiple people escape before all the gens are done.
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@Warlock_2020 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/947880#Comment_947880
In order for that to work, you have to rescue someone first, which means half the team would not have the chance to do so. Not that I care what they ran, there was still validity in their reasons for doing it.
@LetsPlayTogether if you are that concerned about having a quote, go dig through @Peanits past posts. I remember there being several conversations on this in the past, but am not about to spend significant time digging up a quote to assuage your concerns. This is a message board, not a journalism site. Do your own homework.
I can quote the actual game itself that both killing yourself on purpose and rage quitting are reportable offenses. Would you like me to post the screencap?
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@Boss said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/947837#Comment_947837
Sounds too risky.
Disagree.
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@Boss said:
Since everyone is always allowed to try to escape the hook in the first phase, and since struggling can be interrupted by things such as real-life situations, they can't really ban for it.
Which is why i'm now fully for an automatic struggle in phase 2, so that they at least can't skip a minute.
Sure they can. Just make the threshold high enough that "IRL interruption" isn't really a plausible excuse.
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@rch614 said:
Yes they can and will use suicide to dodge bans.
No, they can't realistically punish suicides. And they shouldn't.
If a survivor doesn't want to play, they will DC/suicide/run at the killer/afk or what have you. Behavior can't put a stop to it all, just hard DC'ing and AFKing.
They can punish and they should. Obviously not in the same manner as the recently-tested DC penalty system, but people who are shown to excessively suicide on first hook should be punished.
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@avilmask said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/947699#Comment_947699
Right, let's balance offerings around perks, and as a consequence offering might be denied an use of it. Slippery slope that BHVR gets dangerously close to recently with concept of new perks.
That's part of why they are part of the bloodpoint offerings and not their own separate perks. So that worst-case scenario, they still function as bloodpoint offering perks. They still do something.
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@avilmask said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/947174#Comment_947174
Change "has been hooked twice" to "is/are on their final hook" and we're fine. Also why Tenager and not Shrike? Sacrifice category would make more sense.
1) I deliberately put it as "has been hooked twice" to make it so a player with DS won't lose their chance to use it either because the Killer camped them some amount or because nother Survivors simply didn't bother to rescue that Survivor in time to not reach 2nd stage on a single hook.
2) My idea would apply to all the Killer Bloodpoint offerings (except Hollow Shell, Survivor Pudding, and Bloody Party Streamers). The Uncommon ones would let you kill one Survivor, and the Rare ones would let you kill all Survivors. I only used Tenager as an example.
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@Cixon said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/947285#Comment_947285
Honestly the only way I can see this buff of DS being broken is if a 4 man SWF group outplayed the killer on a end-game and stunning him to let all their buddies to escape which I mean...is kinda the killers fault for not out playing the survivor.
Force the survivors of their DS or something. You can always attempt to slug players in hopes of downing all 4 before their last hooks. There's many ways killers can combat this, you're just pressuring the fact that there will be a 4 man somewhere 'abusing' this buff.
So you're talking about slugging a 4-man SWF team to play around DS, which plays right into Unbreakable. You're talking about just letting DS proc anyways when the ENTIRE point of changing it was to give the Killers some way to play around it. You're only making your DS idea look even more problematic.
Once again: If you're saying "it might be broken if used cooperatively for a 4 man SWF group", you're saying it's okay to add stuff that might end up being broken. That is not okay. That is not, as you say, a perfect idea. That is a bad idea. Plain and simple.
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@Cixon said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/947167#Comment_947167
You're saying the buff would be broken only if used with SWF. Many survivor perks are broken with SWF.
- Adrenaline.
- Breakout.
- Borrowed Time.
- Saboteur.
And killers have counter perks to all of them including DS. That's why it's invalid.
Just because a set group of friends can play together and use it to their advantage to win doesn't make it broken.
Let me put it to you like this: If your counter-argument is "it's okay because there are already other things in the game that are broken with SWF," then you are basically arguing that it's okay to add potentially broken things because broken things already kinda exist in-game. That alone is enough to have this idea dismissed.
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@Jgold1376 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/947009#Comment_947009
I'm not sure I follow your train of thought. Please explain more
Examples:
Devout Tanager Wreath
Uncommon Offering
-Grants 75 % bonus Bloodpoints in the Brutality Category.
-Grants the ability to kill one Survivor who has been hooked by your hand twice during the next trial.
Ardent Tanager Wreath
Rare Offering
-Grants 100 % bonus Bloodpoints in the Brutality Category.
-Grants the ability to kill all Survivors who have been hooked by your hand twice during the next trial.
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@Cixon said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/946982#Comment_946982
Not even, killers can just tunnel survivors out of their DS easily. In addition to that, basement hooks are terrible for DS situations. (edit): ALSO, you can wait out the DS.
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/946947#Comment_946947
Just because it wouldn't work well for YOU with SWF doesn't mean it wont work well for you with individual survivors. You're just trying to reach at a point that isn't even valid.
What makes the point not valid?
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I think it could be fine if you make 2-hook Moris part of the Bloodpoint offerings. I personally think 2-hook Moris by themselves are not worth even a common offering.
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Currently (as in, before the Doctor re-work), I would personally say Doc. On paper, you could say Doc's is better because you can maybe time your Shock Therapy blasts just right to cut off someone from a window/pallet long enough to land a hit, but in practice, I think that is just painfully impractical. Once the Doctor's re-work comes in, though, I will probably flip my stance since the vault/pallet block Shock Therapy into M1 will become a fair bit more practical.
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I feel like this would make exhaustion perks that aren't Sprint Burst awful. Dead Hard especially would become flat-out unusable. As stated above, if you want to buff Mindbreaker, just buff Mindbreaker.
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@ALostPuppy said:
I....what...ok so I think you're saying that the undetectable status effect is a problem in a sense that it gives killers a free hit? Well in terms of Stealth killers that's all they're gonna get before they get taken round the entire map in an attempt to get the second hit. While I can agree to some extent that it's not really skillful as someone like GhostFace or Wraith to just run up to a gen and smack someone that's really all they're gonna get. You can almost always get to a loop or safe pallet after the first hit and every stealth killer can get looped to oblivion (no idea why a certain someone says wraith doesn't get looped but he definitely does)
OP is saying they don't like how you can't counter stealth killers with Object of Obsession anymore.
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@Cixon said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/946913#Comment_946913
Then find a way to combat it. Clutch a basement hook or run perks that allows you to down survivors more efficiently.
SWF isn't really balanced and never will be. The game allows you to invite your friends so killer mains just have to deal with it. Get better or play survivor is all I have to say to that lol.
If your response is "SWF isn't balanced," then to me that means that your idea that would be easily abused by such isn't a good idea.
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@Cixon said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/945906#Comment_945906
what difference would it make if you force the players out of their DS?
SWF is a acceptable play-style anyways lol.
You said "not everyone runs DS". What happens if a 4-man SWF team decides they're gonna all run DS together?
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Smelly Inner Soles and VHS Porn.
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Typical Killer/Survivor main bias. /s
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I'm actually pretty on board with this at a glance, assuming that this is the sort of thing that would bridge the gap enough that devs can finally start to balance Killers around SWF.
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@Cixon said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/944747#Comment_944747
Depends on what perks the killer is running. You also have to take it into the account of other survivors. Not everyone is gonna run DS.
Did you take into account a 4-man SWF that would run DS?
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@S_Panda said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/945741#Comment_945741
They do if the hatch is closed by the killer giving the pressure score event :P
Joking aside if the final survivor didn't get hooked at all during the match that means they did such a great job of avoiding any chases at all with the killer (ie not doing anything) or used a map's strong point every chase they got in so the killer just ignored them for the most part...
Maybe the Killer just couldn't catch them and eventually decided to save them for last. I've done it before.
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@anarchy753 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/944205#Comment_944205
The fact that in a 4k, the final survivor gets LESS survival points than the other 3 is ridiculous.
There should just be a score event when they die like "last one standing: 1000 survival points."
I can agree with this. The final Survivor should get extra points for being the last one, especially if they weren't hooked until that point.
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What about Survivors who just suicide on first hook?
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@laurelstroodle said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/944455#Comment_944455
Some trolls survivor can abuse this tbh.
Better this: If a killer cancel the mori animation 5+ times they can't use their mori on that survivor.
Or once they start the mori animation they can't cancel it.
Second suggestion seems way easier and more sensible to implement.
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@AvisDeene said:
I didn't know this was a thing until today. Devs probably won't fix it until they come back from vacay. Just alt+tab to youtube or something until the killer gets bored, then report them.
This has always been a thing, sadly. Should have been patched out ages ago, but alas.
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"But wait, this is your first time being on the hook all game, the gate is open, you have Deliverance! Redemption is one button away...."
And then you use Deliverance! But the Killer was right there anyways. EXCEPT YOU HAVE DEAD HARD. Except the Killer was not a potato and saw it coming. DECISIVE STRIKE, BOIIIII. Then the Killer just waits out the timer. BUT THE HATCH IS RIGHT THERE. Which gets closed. ADRENALINE, MUDDAF-and the Killer just downs you again because they already know you have Dead Hard and just plays around it. So all you did was waste time.
I'm okay with giving the last Survivor full struggle points, but that's about it.
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Absolutely. Really sucks that it's not possible.
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@anarchy753 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/942488#Comment_942488
Yeah, not a fan of how streamlined that would make kobeing after gen 5 pops into adrenaline being a guaranteed escape. You got caught and that comes with penalties, and a change like this that delays any consequence to "if you get caught again" is just unhealthy and exploitable.
Not to mention Deliverance unhooks in the endgame, ew, no thanks.
1) Things would have to line up pretty well for that to happen. You'd need to not be hooked for four gens, then get hooked on the fourth gen, then self-unhook before the fifth gen pops and then have the fifth gen pop before you are downed again. I'd say if you are in a position to pull that off, your team is likely already pretty far ahead anyways such that the self-unhook probably would not have changed much.
2) Unless I am misinterpreting you, I don't understand how what you describe with Deliverance would be any different from how it currently is in the endgame. The only reason I changed Deliverance as such was so it would still function the same as it currently does.
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@Toybasher said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/940383#Comment_940383
Plague also has some benefits Tier 3 Myers doesn't have like noisy stinky survivors or synergy with Thanataphobia and Blood Echo.
You are not wrong, but my point was talking about how Plague can become Tier 3 Myers isn't really true.
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Here's the question: What is your friend doing to progress his objective? He is keeping the Survivors from ending the game in their favor, but how is he moving the game toward a close in his favor?
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Reverse Irihead :P
Iridescent Handle
-Unlimited Hatchets.
-Hit target suffers from the Deep Wound Status.
-Hatchets can't put Survivors into the Dying State.
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You got it backwards. I said I DIDN'T see scratch marks, which meant I didn't have to worry about someone nearby distracting me from my camping.
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Irihead is balanced on its own. Infantry Belt is balanced on its own. Together, they are not balanced IMO.
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If the devs wanted players to play as the old characters, they wouldn't have changed them in the first place.
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@Waffleyumboy said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/942488#Comment_942488
That would kill immersion and hype for me. How would someone that's been chased for centuries still yeet off hooks no problem?
With Deliverance, currently. I don't see how immersion factors into this.
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@Waffleyumboy said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/942459#Comment_942459
What should they be tied to? Big pp energy?
If it were up to me, I'd make it so:
-Self-unhooks always succeed, but it can only be attempted within the first 30-45 seconds of being first-hooked (so you don't self-unhook one second before reaching stage 2 anyways)
-Self-unhooks skip a hook state (so you will become sacrificed if you are hooked again) unless you use Deliverance
-You can't self-unhook once the Exit Gated are powered unless you use Deliverance
-Deliverance would be adjusted so that instead of giving you a guaranteed self-unhook (which would be base kit), it now lets you self-unhook without skipping a hook state and lets you self-unhook during the endgame (still leaving you broken).
-Slippery Meat would be re-worked completely because that perk can go to hell
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@TheRockstarKnight said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/942439#Comment_942439
While Trapper definitely needs a little love, what's wrong with Luck effecting Kobe chances?
I don't like the idea of self-unhooks being tied to chance.
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It's funny because currently the only two things luck affects atm are things that I personally believe should not be RNG/luck-based.
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@csandman1977 said:
I hate hex perks in general. I get high risk high reward, but outside of brown and yellow ranks it's all risk no reward.
Make the perks a little weaker and remove the hex part.
Ruin - remove great skill checks
Lullaby - game long 3rd level or no noise notification for 60 seconds after being unhooked. I prefer the first one
3rd seal - no aura when on hook
Haunted ground - Survivors are exposed when within a certain range of dull totem. Most of which will spawn near generators
Devour hope - (my favorite perk) 2 hooks - mangled on hit, 4 hooks - aura blind when injured, 6 hooks - oblivious when injured, 8 hooks, mori when on death hook (not set in stone just ideas)
Thrill of the hunt - remove scratch marks get 100% more blood points at and of game
I would just prefer weaker perks that last all game or at last more than 20 seconds
I am not sure I'd go with the specific ideas you suggested, but I am in favor of re-balancing all Hex perks in exchange for making them not tied to totems anymore.
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@[Deleted User] said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/941127#Comment_941127
Agree to disagree then.
I think it’s exactly as the devs intended, and as far as I’m concerned she’s the most cleverly well thought out killer to date (I didn’t feel this way in the beginning. It took a huge time investment to appreciate the nuances of Plague, and how cleverly her 3 teachables compliment her greatly.)
Taking a non cleansing group scenario into account, Plague is now free to focus on simply outplaying/outsmarting the survivors for the downs. Once the downs start occurring more frequently than the survivors are comfortable with, they cleanse. They always do, no matter how stubborn those survivors previously were.
I don't believe the devs intended for Plague to become a glorified M1 Killer. I don't believe the Survivors being perpetually exposed by choice makes the gameplay more interesting. I think it just takes away from the gameplay depth because the gameplay now is stuck in "Can I M1 someone one time" vs. "How long can I avoid being M1'd one time". I don't think Plague has "nuance" vs. Survivors who choose not to cleanse.
She's not Legion in terms of bad design, and I don't believe her issues are anywhere near unsolvable from a design standpoint, but I would put her pretty far down in terms of execution of concept.
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@[Deleted User] said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/941075#Comment_941075
Plague can track broken survivors at base, and Plague can use Infectious Fright much more effectively because it will be impossible for a revealed infected survivor that flees to even juke Plague pursuing them.
I am thoroughly unconvinced a Survivor hit by Infectious Fright would stand a better chance against T3 Myers than Plague while broken.
@[Deleted User] said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/941094#Comment_941094
But she hasn’t stopped using her power. It just becomes passive.
Survivors are choosing to give plague the power to insta down them (which does still give devious point gain), and the power to track them anywhere. That’s still a power, albeit a passive one. Fully infected survivors cannot hide from a Plague that knows what they’re doing, and chooses appropriate perks to still exploit that further if foregoing Infectious Fright and/or Dark Devotion.
That's exactly my point. I highly doubt the devs intended for the power to just become a completely passive ability that gives the Plague no additional interaction. The power just stops being something for the Plague to do and instead just becomes something that simply is.
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@[Deleted User] said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/940408#Comment_940408
I do agree that Corrupt Purge isn’t a free win.
A Plague needs to be smart about Corrupt Pool management, and there are only 2 optimal times to use them.
If a chase takes you within 16m to 8m, it is always worth Plagues time for the slight deviation to activate the pool and then resume the chase.
Second instance, is to actually take advantage of (bank on) getting the survivors to waste 60 seconds hiding. I.e. knowing survivors will probably hide, exploit that to resume/regain control of some gens.
However I disagree about your claim that her power is NOT working as intended. Her power is designed around there being an equal amount of pros and cons whether survivors do cleanse or do not cleanse. Ok, if survivors are stubborn and don’t cleanse the only further devious gain is when she manages to down broken survivors (no point infecting any objects if everyone is already sick), but I also stand by my view that a Plague going against survivors that aren’t cleansing simply isn’t playing her smart enough either. If all survivors are infected extremely early in the match, passively becoming broken well before mid game, and Plague manages to catch them out with insta downs in loads of pallet dead zones before the survivors make any significant progress on the remaining gens, they always give in and start cleansing at the pools at the outer edge of the map. Once the survivors are infected AGAIN she gains even more map control because the survivors remaining cleansing options are also near Plague and the gens she’s stubbornly guarding.
The thing is that I don't think the devs would ever intend for a Killer to stop using their power because it doesn't do anything. I don't think "Oh, my power has stopped doing anything, so I'm not going to use it anymore" would be considered a well-designed power.