TAG
TAG
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@InnCognito said:
wow. i rarely see them.
I saw them even with the DC penalty. I can only imagine how bad it is without it.
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@Steel_Eyed said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1453539#Comment_1453539
If this is a non-EGC scenario, this is killer advantaged due to the slowdown implications. Multiple injuries. Objectives not being progressed. If it is an EGC scenario, then the killer probably played a very poor trial.
Is it? Because now I have zero hook pressure while everyone I'm not chasing is free to work on gens.
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@Steel_Eyed said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1453281#Comment_1453281
This doesn’t acknowledge the downward spiral that the decision to camp hooks creates. Killers camp when they feel they cannot compete in stopping gens or winning chases and encouraged to stay by a two health state grab. Rather then defend generators and look for chases, they stay and wait. Thrilling gameplay. ‘Doing gens’ doesn’t encourage the killer to stop camping. It reinforces their thought that all they have is a hook camp.
Again. Killer can still punish bad hook saves (even though they’re forcing all hook saves to be bad). Removing grabs doesn’t stop trades. They just don’t get an instadown.
Maybe you’re a killer whose abilities are beyond this style of strategy but many aren’t and need bad habits removed by removing bad mechanics.
Other teammates stop trades that wouldn't be necessary if you just grab them.
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That man is probably a zombie who has Dead Hard equipped. Notice how you don't get to see what he looks like from the waist down.
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@Steel_Eyed said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1453217#Comment_1453217
Why can’t killers get two health state grabs at windows then? It’s the same logic but applied two different ways.
The two health state grab is not a ‘punishment’ for an opportune killer. It is an incentive to face camp especially when they feel the game is lost when it isn’t necessarily. Were you pro M2 hostage Cannibal? Survivors trying to save were just ‘punished’ then too, right?
The killer will still likely get a down, even in the same face camp scenario. But they don’t get two downs without earning it.
Looking through the responses to this thread I think there are too many bad habits in the killer community. Encouraged by the gameplay mechanics, encouraged by the community. I might not have convinced yall yet (or ever) but I hope y’all keep it in mind while playing matches for the next few days.
Why can’t killers get two health state grabs at windows then? It’s the same logic but applied two different ways.
Because there's no reason to punish someone for vaulting. There is a reason to punish someone making a bad save. It's like being able to grab a Survivor who won't get off a gen. Punish.
The two health state grab is not a ‘punishment’ for an opportune killer.
Yes, it is.
Were you pro M2 hostage Cannibal? Survivors trying to save were just ‘punished’ then too, right?
I am not pro camping. I am pro punishing bad saves.
Looking through the responses to this thread I think there are too many bad habits in the killer community. Encouraged by the gameplay mechanics, encouraged by the community. I might not have convinced yall yet (or ever) but I hope y’all keep it in mind while playing matches for the next few days.
This thread has convinced me to start making as many hook grabs as possible. :)
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@Steel_Eyed said:
Okay, keep all grabs. But make it work like window grabs. Window grabs can only be made when the survivor is in injured state.
Also I can pull my killer credentials for anyone if they want.
I think getting an instadown at hooks encourages stand offs rather than action. Action is what makes the game fun for both sides. Chases; not standoffs.
How would that be any different from just removing grabs completely, then? If they're rushing the hook while injured, you just down them anyways, no harm no foul. The point is to be able to punish them while they are making a bad save while at full health.
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How 'bout we just balance individual perks that are problematic?
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Honestly, I have soured on hex totems almost completely because if it gets found right at the start, ain't nothing I can really do to stop being down a perk.
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@Steel_Eyed said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1452132#Comment_1452132
If the hook is forever unsafe, then what? I believe part of the reason they made changes to Hillbilly and Leatherface was to de-incentivize camping. This is in the same theme they're already pushing.
Add grabs to healing to compensate. Death pays for life, y'know?
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1452139#Comment_1452139
NOED does this. I'm pro-NOED as is.
If the hook is forever unsafe, then what?
Then do gens.
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I enjoy Tru3 and acknowledge that he is rather skilled, but I also acknowledge that there are a looot of times where it seems like games that go badly are on him not playing it well as opposed to unwillable 4-man coordinated SWF etc. etc.
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IMO it just comes up short of being a passable perk.
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@DeadByMittens said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1435708#Comment_1435708
Dude no, the key is determined for each trap before the trail starts. The devs even talked about it on a live stream. The only thing RNG about her traps is; which box is going to have the key for trap 1,2,3 and 4 before the game starts.
I know which stream you are taking about, and I am reasonably sure that the box is chosen when you put a trap on. Each box has a number associated with it, and when you put a Trap on someone, one of those numbers is randomly chosen for the Trap. Only the box whose number matches the one assigned to the Trap will successfully open it.
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@PokemonGOPlayer said:
I have no clue on how you can't get a simple joke, you transformed my joke post into a bait post without my knowledge.
I don't get how you can take seriously a post that suggests the Metro Golden Mayers thing, the RBTs activating on Totems, complaining about the mask add-on for the love of God.
I am kind of a Pig main and I was just making a joke, a JOKE. I wanted to make you laugh, not angry. I had the most stupid suggestions that I could think of to make it funny but not blatantly trolly. Because that would kill the comedy in it in my opinion, just like a "/S" at the end.
I wrote it this moring in 15 minutes, victim of my own anxiety due to a medical appointment I had later. I needed some kind of distraction and I had the ideas for this kind of joke-post.
I'm sorry if I made you felt insulted or disrespected, it was meant to be a simple obvious joke, taking the piss on all the complaints there have been recently and on all the misuses of words like "to react" or "counterplay" I've read. Not a bait attempt.
It's not a Billy post, I couldn't care less about Billy, but you made me realize I should've added something like a cooldown on the Ambush Attack, something like "her throat gets too dry after an ambush so she needs to grab a water bottle in a locker" just to make it more obvious.
I'm especially sorry for the Scorpionz part because I think it was a bad decision to use his name in my joke. I don't know.
Have a nice day and, again, I'm sorry.
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@Dead_by_Gadfly said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1439024#Comment_1439024
So that they know you could kill them if you wanted to
I mean, you could accomplish the same thing by downing them and then bringing them to the Hatch. :P
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Nonzero chance you could report them for griefing/unsportsmanlike conduct. Can't report 'em for hostage holding, though.
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@Xyex said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1425898#Comment_1425898
The first two words in the description are "while cloaked" so how is that not according to the description?
My mistake. As it turns out, the description on the DBD gameapedia page is inaccurate.
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It's awkward because I'm pretty sure there are still maps where bloodlust is basically necessary, but the number of maps where bloodlust is OP is steadily rising. Hopefully we'll reach a point where Bloodlust is no longer necessary on the vast majority of maps.
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@Ihatelife said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1445390#Comment_1445390
But she will most likely getting buffed in some aspects of her power.
You don't necessarily know that. That's just speculation.
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@Ihatelife said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1445349#Comment_1445349
But it was confirmed that she will get addons changes
I told you back then 😉
I didn't say "changes."
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I'll trade Billy, Freddy, and Spirit for Pig buffs.
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What's a Stadia? Is that some kind of paperweight?
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It makes it easier to track injured Survivors, but it's such a minor benefit for its cost that it is not worth using except in the instance of Sloppy Butcher due to it also inflicting Mangled.
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I'm gonna give my opinion on each one individually:
Workshop Grease - Better than current but I still don't think it's worth using, personally
Shattered Syringe - I'd be careful with this one, as even a slight increase in ambush attack speed could end up being a breaking point as far as loops. I could very realistically be wrong, though.
Utility Blades - I don't think the problem with the current Rusty Attachments was the rarity. I just don't think this class of add-on (Survivors wearing RBTs suffer from ______ ) is a good overall because it runs counterintuitive to the goal of RBTs (stall)
Razor Wires - Still not good; DS skill checks are not that hard to hit. At most, you might miss the first one.
Face Mask - Why no change? It's a terrible add-on.
Slow-Release Toxin - This is not bad. I would probably just reduce the time on it a smidge, since Exhaustion doesn't go down unless the Survivor isn't running. Higher numbers means that it may as well be infinite Exhaustion.
Rusty Attachments - Similar to Utility Blades, this runs counterinuitive to the goal of RBTs, which is stalling. If you chase them, you're not stalling. If you don't chase them, the add-on isn't really doing anything.
Interlocking Razor - Again, why no change? It's also a terrible add-on, even with the changes to Workshop Grease and Razor Wires.
Amanda's Secret - I guess it's better than the current Amanda's Secret, but that's a super low bar to clear. Not sure if this is good enough for its rarity.
Rules Set No. 2 - I suppose? At the very least, it lights a fire under Survivors, which makes it better than the current RSN2.
Amanda's Letter - I think you could just remove the downsides of the current version.
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The only times I slug for the 4k is if the fourth person is already within eyesight when I down the third person.
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Hangman's Trick is reverted to its PTB iteration. :P
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There's a Nurse add-on that essentially does what you describe. Last I checked, it was meme-tier.
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Most multiplayer games worth their salt balance for high-level play. It does not mean "ignore the rest." It means "make sure the game isn't unbalanced when played by strong players."
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@Onyx_Blue said:
@TAG because this post is talking about the potential abusability of Cages. The other killer powers you compared it to have zero comparison to it since there is potential for solid and reliable outplay and counters to it. The outplay to a PH tunneling off Cage is being near enough to the Cage in order to rescue them before PH can begin to get close to the area. It's unreliable and soley depends on rng of where they spawn, and whether or not the PH decides not to play that way.
When it comes to basic hook mechanics, the killer knows to potentially expect perks and other 'outplays' that survivors can perform in that situation. Just seeing an Obsession in a match may make a killer waste time slugging off the tunnel, even if it's not used. PH has none of those issues when it comes to Cages (which isn't the issue with his power). The issue, as I have repeatedly stated is the potential for PH to tunnel and quickly eliminate a survivor with no consequence to doing so. He spends his time making it a 3v1; If he does so early in the match he has no right to lose that game, all on him to throw it. One more time, it's the POTENTIAL to abuse the mechanic that makes it require changing again. Just remove the notification of the rescue location. PH will still know 90% where the Cage is, and will still be able to freely tunnel off of it; but having to make him guess, will actually offer punishment and consequence to going for the tunnel. If he guesses wrong, he wasted free pressure on gens and other chases plus he gets nothing out of it.
And I am saying you can just do that on a hook. Maybe not every time due to BT and DS, but that is made up for by not having to travel across the map to actually do it.
Also, I made no comparisons to other Killer powers. Otherwise, I could have brought up stealth Killers being able to negate BT no problem.
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Hockey puck projectiles.
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@Onyx_Blue said:
@TAG and in the instance which my post is raising awareness to: the potential to get a free tunnel, 2nd hook/kill. You seem to always bring it back to "regular hooks are an issue too then", which is ridiculous to even compare them. Since, like I said, hook related perks are a non-issue with PH, given the right situation, he can get a free kill which a survivor cannot do anything about if he chooses to tunnel (given how strong his chase gameplay is). You may not see it now, but just wait until almost every PH plays that way. We saw it in the PTB with the aura available to him, and we still see it now, even when it's gone...on the simple basis of the rescue notification tips him off to the exact location in an area he most likely already knew they were most probably spawned to.
Why is it ridiculous to compare them? Because some people might have BT or DS? What if they don't?
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Only when everyone else is dead/out of the trial. At that point, meh.
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I thought this was intentionally removed? Or am I confusing it with something else?
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@[Deleted User] said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1439366#Comment_1439366
Makes sense. She did throw 2 kids out of a window and nearly impaled a third kid on a fence.
Did you see that chase scene at Trunchbull Estate? I dare anyone to convince me that this isn't the embodiment of Dead By Daylight.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=02YwCuCZeqc -
We should replace all the FNaF threads with Matilda threads.
#Trunchbull4DBD
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@[Deleted User] said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1439046#Comment_1439046
No. Strider only affects the killer hearing. It doesn’t make survivors ACTUALLY louder to the actual survivors.
It does, from what I recall. I remember being confused as to why my Iron Will wasn't working, only to see that the Killer had Stridor.
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I would also go with NOED and Adrenaline.
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If you want to show mercy, why are you closing the hatch?
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@Onyx_Blue said:
@TAG so you're just wrong then, really. How can a killer camp and tunnel off hook easier than a Cage (given the right situation)? The hook camper has to most likely contend with BT and DS. PH not only hasn't got to worry about those, but he has a power that hits multiple targets, meaning he can potentially down them both...how is that weaker than regular hook camping/tunneling?
Because I don't gotta walk across the map to get to the point that I need to camp. I'm already there. I'm not risking the caged Survivor being put in a place where a Survivor can quickly uncage them before I can make it.
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@Huff said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1438518#Comment_1438518
As I said before, it's not about the efficiency.
I disagree.
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@Onyx_Blue said:
@TAG at the expense of wasting their time by going after a DS user, or BT rescue...yeah, exactly the same, love.
I have no issue with PH Cages not functioning with perks, but the fact players know this and are allowed to play scummy off of it due to lack of punishment for doing so is, as I stated, abusable. There is no manipulating the words or worming in innacurate comparisons to deny that. PH with his cages has potential in its mechanics for abusability by the scummier players of the game. So, on that premise, it should be altered to make it so he has zero intel as to where exactly the Cage was or is. Sinple as that
I didn't say it was exactly the same. I said that what you're describing is something that can be done on a regular hook more easily.
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They can bring back The Smasher in the Pokemon chapter:
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@Onyx_Blue said:
@Raptorrotas @2ndBusiestmusicnerd @TAG @Skarkio
You think Caging someone and then rushing to that side of the map to be close enough to successfully tunnel when the person is rescued isn't a form of camping? Yes, yes it is.
Obviously there are exceptions that make it so he cannot camp and tunnel the Cage: eg insta-save due to it spawning near a teammate. But in general, the capability is there, therefore the abusabilty cannot be denied. In other words, remove the abusabilty because it will get stale very quickly.
He is an incredible killer: strong, fun and intimidating. Having that aspect spoils vsing him for a lot of people.
Again, you are describing stuff that can be done on a regular hook more easily.
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@Huff said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1437153#Comment_1437153
I do understand. I'm telling you, at least the ones that I play against, the Pigs will do that and still tunnel somebody off hook even if they get off. They down, helmet, hook, camp, and then tunnel them so they can't get their helmet off.
And that's a really bad and inefficient strategy. Again, they are better off just re-hooking them and camping the hook until they just die.
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@Onyx_Blue said:
This is the sort of response that makes people lose braincells. We all know how the Cages work, typically, they spawn as far from the down as possible, so a PH player doesn't need to know exactly where they are, since they have a rough guess. The fact you can combine that intel with a lack of punishment, is abusable and needs to go.
Bringing regular hook mechanics into it is just stupid since Cages clearly function differently, and should do in every aspect.
You're describing things just about any Killer can do on a regular hook, but without having to run across the map to do it.
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Probably Monstrous Shrine for Killer; No Mither for Survivor
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I mean...what do you propose devs do about regular hooks, then?
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@Onyx_Blue said:
@TAG it still has value, since a lot of hooks spawn near gens. I'm not saying it's a must use, new Demo meta, but it's an example of a perk that provides a refreshing change from the dull builds people do spam all the time on the fun killers.
The one time I tested it for a period of time to see how it fared post-PTB, I got exactly one instance of information from it.
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@Onyx_Blue said:
It's not a case of what you 'should' run, but the alternatives are really cool; stuff like: Unrelenting (for pallet break mindgames), Discordance (for free intel to aid in rotation pressure), Hangman's Trick (to reveal possible next targets post hook, especially ones that aren't revealed on BBQ if you use it), Whispers, Shadowborn/M&A, Enduring, Dead Man's Switch...stuff like this to boost Demo in an alternate way than just Chase, Hook, Pop, Chase, Hook, Pop etc.
You know Hangman's Trick was nerfed from that one PTB, right?
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@FlamingkittyUmad said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1432169#Comment_1432169
if a survivors runs straight for the hook, then yeah, but if you watch all sight lines and instantly abandon chase if you see someone going for the save while within TR, then you're camping which again, is fine if you have to.
I Feel like I should also mention proxy camping since a lot of people don't know what it is, which is just the killer using their power to go back to the hook. (Nurse blink back, using a power that moves faster to go back [Billy, Sprit, wraith, Freddy, Demo], surrounding the hook with bear/ hag traps/ etc..)
I mean, if you see someone hiding near a hook and waiting to make a save when you are about to leave the hook for whatever reason, when would it not be justified to shift gears and go after that person? The only real answer I can give is "if you seriously need to apply gen pressure lest you lose the game."
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@Tactless_Ninja said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1437176#Comment_1437176
First key guaranteed dud is just ludicrous. Imagine any other power with the same stipulation.
And if they make such a drastic changes as the ones I'd outlined, they'd need to readjust the timer regardless.
Having an active beartrap on your head at egc IS a death sentence. It guarantees you'll die if the Pig decides they want your bacon while you're trying to get your helmet off. Even moreso if multiple teammates also are all trapped. You're completely at the Pig's mercy because you happened to get NOED at the wrong time. Now they have multiple end game perks stacked all in their favor and with only minutes to react with barely any investment on the Pig's part. It's lazy.
I want it shifted to early game stalling. If it does make it all the way to the egc and they made no effort to work on their trap, they deserve to pop.
Imagine any other power with the same stipulation.
You're going to have to give an example or two.
And if they make such a drastic changes as the ones I'd outlined, they'd need to readjust the timer regardless.
Why? You'd simply be searching 2-6 boxes instead of 1-6. I don't see what making having to search two boxes minimum a death sentence, especially NOT compared to "all 4 boxes need to be interacted with in full."
Having an active beartrap on your head at egc IS a death sentence. It guarantees you'll die if the Pig decides they want your bacon while you're trying to get your helmet off. Even moreso if multiple teammates also are all trapped. You're completely at the Pig's mercy because you happened to get NOED at the wrong time. Now they have multiple end game perks stacked all in their favor and with only minutes to react with barely any investment on the Pig's part. It's lazy.
Does it? You just do the boxes while the Pig is trying to get a Trap on someone else. If the Pig is going after the Trapped person, the Pig is just buying the Trapped Survivor more time before Blood Warden expires, everyone leaves, and the Hatch opens for the Trapped Survivor to escape.