Predated
Predated
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@Luciferr_2nd said:
This is such a silly thing but i just need to say this because im going to lose sleep over it otherwise lmao.
Loads of people are referencing the new killer as "The Pinhead", just look at some YouTubers titles.
But that's just, wrong.
It's either "The Cenobite" (his dbd name) or "Pinhead" (his name).
That's like calling Pyramid Head: "The Pyramid Head".
There we go, rant over thank you for reading have a nice day :)
to be fair, you could also read it as THE Pinhead. As in "Pinhead has joined, yes, THE Pinhead"
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@Verconissp said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2435136#Comment_2435136
100% wrong. If I was in chase for 2-3 gens and no one came to save me, I would be getting 8k-10k points, especially if the killer ends up going for me before
Cause you'd be on a gen at the start of the game while he's chasing others around first?
It's rng weather or not he'll find you first. and even if he doesn't and You're LAST to get said chased.
You still get maybe. 1-2 gens done in that manner. + maybe acouple unhooks. leaving you with 15-18k points.
Because Americans are taught that any system that benefits society as a whole, will in reality only benefit the demon lazy leeches who somehow found a loophole to be getting governmental support.
Again.. what does that making me American have to DO with anything else. You're 1st off. assuming i'm American..
And 2nd off. I'm Technically Canadian with a mix of Irish / Scottish / German / Spanish / French
...Don't assume someone is American.. #########..
"Again.. what does that making me American have to DO with anything else. You're 1st off. assuming i'm American..
And 2nd off. I'm Technically Canadian with a mix of Irish / Scottish / German / Spanish / French
...Don't assume someone is American.. [BAD WORD].."
- I literally explained why it matters "Americans are taught that any system that benefits society as a whole, will in reality only benefit the demon lazy leeches". That has literally been your argument prior to this
- I literally said I was gonna start assuming you to be American because you were acting like something that would overall be more beneficial to be an act of heresy. How often do you really see a survivor consistently urban evading? I've rarely seen it the past year. Sure, there have been times where it was more common than other times, but I'd say about 2-3% of my games would hold such a player, where in 5-10% of my games I would be tunneled hardcore. The biggest reason that percentage is higher, is because I encounter them more often and those games tend to last less than 4 minutes.
"Cause you'd be on a gen at the start of the game while he's chasing others around first?
It's rng weather or not he'll find you first. and even if he doesn't and You're LAST to get said chased.
You still get maybe. 1-2 gens done in that manner. + maybe acouple unhooks. leaving you with 15-18k points."
I also took it into consideration that I did a gen prior to the chase, which is why the upper limit was 10k. So, still wrong. You only get 1250 points from doing a solo gen, maybe about 2k points if you finish it with another survivor. And assuming 1-2 gens done with a couple of unhooks, you would still get 15-18k points, if not slightly more. The amount of BP you are personally getting depends on how much you've done+how much your team has done if you were in a position where you literally couldnt do anything else. Meaning if you're on a gen when your teammate saves someone, both you and your teammate gets some points. If you're slugged on the ground or on the hook while your teammates did gens, you'd get some points too. And yeah, if you are self-caring in the corner, getting some survival points, you would get some points from people who are doing gens at that moment, just as they would gain some survival points from you patching yourself up. Because believe it or not, self-care can be used quite efficiently.
That means if you're urban evading to a hook, taking almost twice as long as running to the hook, you would get a lot less BP too.
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@DerpyPlayz said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2435161#Comment_2435161
Duh, the concern is because I didn't ask you anything? I am confused why you are saying this to me?
So? This is a thread, you're replying on a forum, it doesnt matter who you asked, you joined a thread and people can reply to your thread.
If you dont want people replying to your comment, then dont be commenting on a forum.
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@Orion said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2435158#Comment_2435158
Time is the true test of what it means to be iconic. If it lasts for all of 15 minutes and is then forgotten (seriously, I can't even remember any of the so-called "instant classics" to list as examples; that's how forgettable they are), it's just an advertisement tactic.
I mean, before their announcements/people theorizing about new killers, I didnt really know about Bubba, nor about PH or Nemesis. They were only really classics if you or someone you knew played that game. Pinhead I did hear about, but not really iconic either. Myers, Jason, Freddy and Ghostface would be examples of truly iconic, as you would knew them even if you've never seen the movies.
I do remember someone name dropping Pyramid Head once, that's it. Yet a lot of people, most of who played Silent Hill, would call me crazy to even call Pyramid Head "forgettable".
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@Devil_hit11 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2435140#Comment_2435140
It doesn't matter what timer is. just thought of implementing a mechanic that victor "times out" is stupid. tricky movement does work vs victor. Camping does not work at high-level. camping is what weaker killer players do because they cannot win the game and its mostly used for securing one kill through problems with hooking system.
Only tunneling and slugging are effective strategies vs good players. Twins are unfun currently because their nerf to victor ruined victor's ability to get momentum from slugging at high-level.
I love playing against victor in a chase. Twins is pretty uncommon killer to face though. too many exploit/issues.
Camping works when you can put Charlotte in stasis when slighlty walking up the stairs in the basement. Tricky movement doesnt work if the killer sees it as a hit and the server considers the total latency as small enough to be considered a hit, even if you fully dodged victor. And I still stand by the fact that if you need more than 60 seconds to down multiple survivors with Victor, you're simply not in a situation where you should be using Victor to down all survivors.
I do have to make you realize though, that this would mean that Victor's changes would essentially be reverted.
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@Devil_hit11 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2435108#Comment_2435108
you just named what would possibly be perhaps 2 worst design tiles for killer where best outcome of these tiles for killer is an early pallet drop and at worst case, an entire game lost. Having series of these loops connected to each and the killer going for this chase is an instant loss vs efficient gen team. If by counter-playing bubba, its suppose to be that killer never hits get an opportunity to get hits, than these tiles right on mark. Its like perfect excuse to just play nurse at this point.
I think at most filler pallets, bubba is unlikely to be able to get hits on them with his chainsaw and most of the time, he has to break pallets using his chainsaw. Its just that, unlike other killers where their pallet break is so slow, bubba is probably only killer where you can physically run out of pallets as survivor. with other killers, there is practically no repercussions to just dropping a bunch of strong pallets when your team is doing objective. in any case, Pallet still eat bubba's time and if you can understand his charge system, you can use it against him to pressure him to go through pallets to get stuns during his chainsaw or make him afraid of going through pallets where he falls short on chainsaw duration to down you.
T-L wall is good tile vs bubba. If he wants to get instant downs, he has to make reads with his chainsaw and single bad read wastes all of 3 his tokens. For that reason, M1 at T-L loops for bubba is common. Forcing bubba to M1 you on loops cuts down his time efficiency and even though it doesn't auto win you the game like some of those other loops, it gives you the opportunity to prologue chase.
chase-wise, Bubba is definitely good standard for killer. he stomp bad players and has potential to beat good players as he can capitalize on looping mistakes rapidly. It is exactly what killer should be put at. they should have opportunity to beat better players and worse players shouldn't have much of a chance to win until they improve at the game.
"No, they actually dont excel at camping."
Its funny you to mention that because one of my games as survivor during MMR was... that I got chased for 4 generators and than got facecamped by Myers that had EV3 at 99%. My team finished all 5 generators. do you wanna know what happened? He downed entire team and I never got unhooked. so I cannot say I agree with your statement. Instant down are very powerful in deadzones and facecamping with them is pretty omnipotent strategy. To be fair, that team was pretty stupid to even think they were going save me, but I understand where this gameplay choice comes from. it comes from the not very well designed emblem system on survivor side where them escaping would yield them depiping even though escaping was so obviously the best play in that situation.
As you say, borrow time does not solve facecamping, even in the case of billy, he will still be able to hook trade down until at least one survivor dies. As i said, Its not problem with killer themselves, It is problem with hook system. If they used pyramid head's cage system where the hooks teleport if a killer facecamp, than this would be a lot less of a problem.
"you just named what would possibly be perhaps 2 worst design tiles for killer where best outcome of these tiles for killer is an early pallet drop and at worst case, an entire game lost."
If you lose the game because of a single jungle gym, you deserved the loss.
"Having series of these loops connected to each and the killer going for this chase is an instant loss vs efficient gen team."
Except that vs a Bubba, not really. Bubba creates a scenario where survivors HAVE to drop the pallet, or go down. Let alone that Bubba gets rid of that pallet faster than most killers too. Efficient gen teams are rare. It's the same reason why Nurse's addons havent been addressed. Because a genuinely good nurse, is rare. Balancing around the 0.1% without screwing over 99.9% of the community is very difficult. Which is why I am stating they slightly overbuffed Bubba.
"If by counter-playing bubba, its suppose to be that killer never hits get an opportunity to get hits, than these tiles right on mark."
Oppertunity to get hits are plenty, oppertunity to get insta-downs should be less frequent. Right now, in 90% of the cases, if you can m1 as bubba, you can m2 aswell. No addons taken in consideration. That's a problem considering 99.999% of this game is about the public matches.
"I think at most filler pallets, bubba is unlikely to be able to get hits on them with his chainsaw and most of the time, he has to break pallets using his chainsaw."
A good Bubba can quite easily down a survivor with 2 charges around filler pallets, then hook them and have all his charges back. The only time a Bubba has a hard time with filler pallets, is if survivors are so danm optimal at pathing AND have dedicated servers in their favor. If a Bubba cannot down a survivor on filler pallets where a Pig can injure someone with a dash, the Bubba is the one making a mistake.
"My team finished all 5 generators. do you wanna know what happened? He downed entire team and I never got unhooked. so I cannot say I agree with your statement. Instant down are very powerful in deadzones and facecamping with them is pretty omnipotent strategy. To be fair, that team was pretty stupid to even think they were going save me, but I understand where this gameplay choice comes from."
You kinda answered your own question later on. Yeah, if it's in the basement, it's extremely hard to get a safe unhook. But that is a combination of the basement AND the instadown. If it's any generic hook though? It's quite easy to get an unhook off with a hooktrade. If multiple survivors get downed, it's on them. With a Bubba? Doesnt matter what you do, doesnt matter where it is, you're not gonna be able to save your teammate without giving the killer more kills.
And no, the hook system is fine. Hook trading is fine. Turning all hooks(including the basement hook) into a cage system would quite heavily ######### over the killer's pressure. A killer needs to be able to camp and survivors need to be able to hook trade(especially if a survivor needs to die if the killer wants to stand a chance during the EGC). I'd personally make killers unable to use their M2 while within 16 meters of a hooked survivor. Meaning a Spirit would be forced out of her phase while within the range. Bubba and Billy wont be able to rev. Myers wont be able to stalk(but if he DOES have t3 prior to hooking the survivor, yknow, he earned it).
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@Snowbawlzzz said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2434893#Comment_2434893
You think the 4 parallel walls is the absolute strongest loop a survivor can use?
You're going by camping ability as your killer quality metric?
I don't even know how to respond to someone with such delusional takes
jungle gym isnt 4 parallel walls. Jungle gym is by definition 2 L-walls and 1 T-wall with 1 window and a pallet, with the 4th wall basically splitting 1 of the L walls in 2 if the window isnt there.
4 Parallel walls depends quite heavily on the map. On some maps, it's strong due to solid walls, on other maps, it's quite weak due to breaking up most walls.
And yeah, not a single killer in the game should be able to get a freebie by standing still. It's why people hate spirit so much too.
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@KerJuice said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2417692#Comment_2417692
Do what I do- put my character in the basement, then come here and browse, go on Twitter, get a drink, or bathroom break. Don’t let them stress you out. That’s what they want.
I mean, I've been playing this game since 2016, yknow, when survivors could literally keep the game going for 2 hours after they opened the gate. It's just a waste of time that stacks up. If it happened with a tournament squad, I would expect it as tournament squads dont go in publics unless they want to try out something. If it happens with 4 solo's who have no clue where their teammates are, fine, they remain untill they know their teammates are safe, meaning I'd only have to force people out at 1 exit gate as the others would know their teammates are safe. Those kind of games happen once, maybe twice, per week.
The kind of game im talking about happens quite often to the point of obnoxiousness. It's why I've requested the gate to be a bit more dangerous as to give survivors a reason to leave as soon as a killer is close. Like, the exit gate being temporarily blocked for survivors who are not in chase when the killer enters the gate. That means if you're hanging around for the sake of hanging, you'd be in danger and have to run to the other gate instead. But untill something happens around the gate, people just gotta leave when they think their teammates are safe.
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@DerpyPlayz said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2427774#Comment_2427774
Why are you tagging me.
because I was replying to you, everything I said was in reply to you.
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@Orion said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2427518#Comment_2427518
Have you noticed how the vast majority of these so-called "instant classics" are quickly forgotten? They have their 15 minutes of fame and then die off. Sure, even a broken clock is right twice a day, but you can't call something a classic until enough time has passed. That's the real mark of a classic: that it survives the test of time.
Oh yeah, the longer they exist, the more iconic they might be. But that is more in grades of being iconic. There are plenty of historical moments that were iconic that died out. Heck, if it wasnt for the horror reboots, it was going to be quite likely that Freddy would no longer be an iconic killer. Which would mean that Myers and Jason are more iconic than Freddy was.
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@Orion said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2427728#Comment_2427728
No character was shown in any of the images. That's called "pareidolia".
So this is pareidolia?
its a bit more blocky since I zoomed in, and the ears are more purple because of messing with levels, but that doesnt appear on the normal map, there is not a single DBD character that has that on top of their head.
I could agree with you that the sky image is pareidolia, but even the sky differs from what is inside the map itself, so it's reasonable that people came to that conclusion as well.
This is why I say that even though hellraiser is the next chapter, they did aquire a license to use FNaF characters too. At least, for promotional material.
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@IamFran said:
I'm so glad it's not FNAF, only due that crowd of FNAF fanboys being a pain in the forums.
How is that going to be different from the forums now. We already have entitled killers, entitled survivors, resident evil fanboys, silent hill fanboys, players who arent entitled but severely misguided on what the game is designed to be, players who act like DBD is a single player game.
The FNAF fanbase isnt really that much worse.
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@Devil_hit11 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2427553#Comment_2427553
you guys have no idea for how unfun your ideas are for killer. these are such bad takes for killer.
Having tricky movement to dodge victor pounce is how your suppose counter victor.
please learn to actually use skill to defeat killers rather rely on automated timer mechanics to auto win the game for you. its remarkable for how much the game babies survivors.
I mainly play killer, and it would be fine.
There is not enough tricky movement to compensate for dedicated servers. Giving Charlotte a timer in which she can use Victor, removes any boring camping mechanics, while still giving her enough time for momentum to down every survivor. 60 seconds is a long time. If you use Victor for more than 60 seconds to down every single survivor, you should be the one learning to actually get skilled at killer.
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@Verconissp said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2424603#Comment_2424603
What does being American have to do with not wanting to give my teammate the most amount of points?
You're not understanding the simplest point i'm LITERALLY giving you,
Take this for instance, Say you led a killer.. for bout 2-3 gens. Normal chase..
But you noticed that A: Gens aren't flying that quickly.
B: Your one teammate is urban evading around the map hunting dull totems slowly. and hiding whenever he / she hears a terror radius..
C: Soon as said person gets into a chase. They don't look behind him and starts wasting pallets with 0 mindgame for no reason,
D: Oop. you just hit second cause teammates didn't come unhook you. now yer death hook and decide not to play...
Now if we had YOUR idea of putting everyone at the same amount of bp. you would get maybe...12k depending if they even touched a gen.
whereas. you coulda had 15-18k solo for points.. Do you now understand how flawed your system still is,
Meaning that your worst teammates can do jack and still not even give you ANY bp in that whole trial,
Because Americans are taught that any system that benefits society as a whole, will in reality only benefit the demon lazy leeches who somehow found a loophole to be getting governmental support.
The benefits to a shared survivor pool will benefit survivors overall more, while maybe only giving leeches a minor benefit.
"You're not understanding the simplest point i'm LITERALLY giving you" And I am going to point out why YOU'RE not understanding it all.
100% wrong. If I was in chase for 2-3 gens and no one came to save me, I would be getting 8k-10k points, especially if the killer ends up going for me before I even get to do anything else. If I was in chase for 2-3 gens with MY system(its not a 2-3 gen chase if they didnt pop, yknow), same scenario, I would be getting 11-13k BP.
And if my teammates didnt do #########? Well, all the generator points would still be mine.
Who said the BP has to be the same for everyone? Not me. Shared bloodpoint pool doesnt mean equal bloodpoints.
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@Devil_hit11 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2424591#Comment_2424591
haha this post is funny. what your asking to change about him is how bubba used to before he got reworked. He actually used to have only 1 charge and he used to move slower in his chainsaw. In fact his chainsaw was so slow and had so little duration that you needed to use a perk to increase his movement speed to be effective.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-S4XMd8nKkE
He was one of the worst killers in the game. Otz shows a good old glimpse of what old bubba used to play like. It was really bad.
"On 99% of the vast majority of maps, there is no counterplay against a Bubba's instadown as he can catch up with you either before you finish the vaulting animation, use his second charge to catch up and if that fails, access his third charge to basically guarantee the down. I've never even needed to use a 3rd charge on Bubba to get an instadown on the vast majority of loops"
The vast majority of survivor players are pretty bad but against good players, the charges system is very integral for bubba to down better players and integral to part to counter-playing his chainsaw. I have went on extremely long chases vs bubba. his chainsaw has counter-play. you just need to get better at using tile sets against him. he can be looped.
Much of the playerbase needs to stop asking for negative killer changes and instead should get better at playing vs bubba so they can defeat him. I do agree that facecamping aspect of bubba is not very good but at the same time, I do not think that facecamping with any killer is particularly healthy towards gameplay. I am pretty sure that all killers that have reliable instant down e.g infinity ev3 myers, billy etc. excel at camping. Its problem with hook system and not anything to do with killers themselves. Pyramid head cage system offers a possible solution to that problem.
Yes, I know, I've been playing this game long before you have. And no, I am not asking anything of the like. I am asking for 1 of those things. I am asking him to be slightly slower OR have 1 less charge(note, I didnt say give him 1 charge, I said remove 1 charge, he has 3 charges).
I have played Old Bubba, the fact that he could instadown people off hook was quite a problem as he could still catch up with a survivor that had BT triggered while being unhooked. Let alone that Bubba was guaranteed to have at least 2 stacks of PWYF too. I know why Old Bubba was weak, dont try to lecture me here. As for one of the worst? He always remained above Myers, Clown, Demo and Trapper. Arguably Wraith and Ghostface too. Being the 8th worst killer in the game, with a roster of only 19 killers makes him not one of the worst. He was bad, yeah, but one of the worst? Nah. His power was the absolute worst when it came to using it to damage survivors, but considering all killers were essentially m1 killers against high tier survivors anyway? Bubba was mid-tier. That is how much the game has evolved since 2019 by simply reworking the maps. Current Myers performs better than old Bubba. Even if he used to perform worse.
"The vast majority of survivor players are pretty bad but against good players"
False, the vast majority of survivor players SEEM bad due to:
- lack of communications
- lack of usable tiles(the maps before their reworks had too many, haddonfield seems much worse because all maps have gotten better overall)
- lack of communications
This is why I said 99% of the area's on maps do not offer proper counterplay against Bubba. Rather than putting it on the players.
"you just need to get better at using tile sets against him."
There is only 2 potential tiles you can use against a very good Bubba: 1. Killer shack. 2. Jungle Gyms. At best, there are 3 tiles like this on a single map. 4 if you count non-reworked maps. You cannot expect survivors to reach those tiles because 1: bubba outspeeds a survivor who uses sprintburst because he has 3 charges. 2. That's it, I literally do not need to say anything else. There is no way you can expect a survivor to go to a killer shack or jungle gym to loop him properly. It's why so many survivors rather use W. But if the Bubba realizes they are W gaming, he will start cutting them off instead, and then downing them there. There are some main buildings or indoor maps that are quite effective against a good Bubba, but that's only 25% of maps. Meaning there is a 75% chance you wont be getting a map you can properly use against a Bubba, unless you're a full SWF with good comms. Anything less, and Bubba is an issue right now.
"I am pretty sure that all killers that have reliable instant down e.g infinity ev3 myers, billy etc. excel at camping."
No, they actually dont excel at camping. You can get around a Billy and Myers by using an Endurance state, Bubba bypasses any endurance state. If you try to unhook a survivor against a Billy or T3 Myers, you're quite likely to either swap hookstates(and thus buying more time) or even be able to unhook+dead hard, causing them to hit the survivor you saved with BT and then both survivors leaving the hook. Against a Bubba? No chance.
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@Devil_hit11 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2424543#Comment_2424543
There are places where taking hits can be good thing. like in cases with body blocking or places where alternative option is worse, like purposely taking m1 hits against instant downs like billy/bubba for speed boosts, but most of the time, they're mistakes and they're basic way killers get downs/hooks. No player is really flawless but everyone sure tries to play the best they can be at the game.
""Vigo's Journal gives blight undetectable in blighted rush." You DONT have undetectability during a rush, that's a drawback. Seriously, you having a terror radius is a drawback."
Remember your comment early about distressing, you just answered your own question regarding why distressing is a bad perk. Making your terror radius bigger in most cases is really bad for killer. The point I am trying to make is that blight add-on improve the killer and add to his base-kit. Trickster add-on add for what should already be base-kit inherently.
Blight wasn't designed to be stealth killer so saying that this "removes" drawbacks is just very strange. further comments on Alchemist ring is that those situations require context. Blight has very low cooldown on his blight rush, he does not need alchemist ring to capitalize on those situations you describe. I do not really use alchemist ring and I have climbed to rank 1 by playing blight only on a rank reset, so to say you need it means that it is big crutch for you. his other add-on are just as solid as Alchemist ring.
"5 hatchets is not enough for Huntress to take down 4 health states assuming the survivor is not a complete potato. Let alone that Huntress does not have an ability that allows her to throw an unlimited amount of hatchets at an increased speed for quite some time. Nor does Huntress have any addons that reload her hatchets."
5 hatchets is a lot of ammo. She doesn't need to throw unlimited amount of hatchets, one hatchet is enough for full health state. In places that trickster downs survivors out of position, huntress is also equally good in those positions.
"Old Freddy was F-Tier based on the meta and map design that existed back then. Loops were much more powerful, gen regression perks werent that good in high tier and overall map tiles that were strong spawned quite close."
That is not true. Gen slowdown perks were in fact more powerful than before. Remember old hex:ruin and Pop goes weasel synergy with hex:ruin? Jungle gyms haven't changed and many of popular tilesets remain same. The only aspect of maps that has changed is some of strong unfair windows being removed or reworked into breakable walls. Strong tiles still spawn close, especially on older maps, think of suffocation pit or coal tower. Freddy was bad because current mindset back in the day was that the problem with killers was their chase, back than, people believed that killers all needed to be on level of nurse in term of chase and freddy wasn't very good at the chase. Instead he was good at stealth and stealth was not properly used/utilized correctly back than. He probably wouldn't be amazing in today's standard but at least he would be more unique compare current freddy that is not very powerful after his series of negative changes.
"No, they were not, Huntress basekit takes 4 seconds per throw, 3.5 if survivors are close enough that hatchet speed doesnt matter a bit. Trickster can literally deal 1 health state per 1.7 seconds with Main Event. Sure, it has to be quite optimal positioning, but that's not exaggeration in the slightest way."
Main event is ultimate ability and let me tell you, for an ultimate ability, its really bad, Like you can loop a rock and trickster will never be able to catch up for how slow he is in throwing mode regardless what his fire rate is. In general, better players will not give trickster the optimal positioning to utilize it.
I would like you to show me a clip of a survivor getting downed in 1.7 seconds. I tried my best efforts to find one in this video that got those add-on weakened(bugged).
https://youtu.be/KsHzccP2Xdg?t=230
At 3:50, The fastest that trickster could down is 6 seconds with Jeff at badham preschool and this video is full of bad plays. its everything i talked about like.... animation locking yourself into free downs and moving in predictable pattern that makes aiming knives easy.
I have no clue where you concluded 1.7 second for full down from healthy to injured. it is certainly is not organic in normal gameplay.
"II agree, so is Huntress though."
Its what I was talking about in my previous post, Those loops are not as crippling to her as they are with trickster. It is because she less line of sight time to do full health states of damage. The little cracks that knives can go through often are not too meaningful for trickster. His blades simply do not do that much damage for it to matter. they matter for deathslinger though as he can use those cracks to get injuries for faster chases. I think she is just overall better at all tile sets in general. Trickster can be equal in some places to her, but he is not better in any places. Just worse in many places.
"but most of the time, they're mistakes and they're basic way killers get downs/hooks."
Still wrong. I could be looping perfectly, making a fake that could extend the chase by 10 seconds or get downed. If you're in a 1v1 in this game, it's really just a matter of time when you get downed. Mistakes makes downs more common, but the fastest way I've downed some survivors was by them never making mistakes, instead never having access to anything they could use.
Survivor mistakes rely more around generators than chase. The 1v1 chase in this game is 100% killer sided, the 1v4 defense is 100% survivor sided. Taking hits isnt a mistake. Vaulting the wrong window could be a mistake that accidentally extends a chase for significantly longer because the killer wouldnt think you'd ever make such a mistake. The mistake relies more in how efficient survivors can be during your chase. If all 3 survivors are cleansing totems and opening chests while there is 1 generator remaining, you're dead on hook and have adrenaline, that is the mistake. Survivors make mistakes as a team, not as a single unit. Some hits can happen because of mistakes, or poor decisions, but that's not exactly a punishing mistake. Hits are supposed to happen. Heck, if you were going to compare killers based on how often they can hit a survivor in a tournament, a lot of them will be slightly below Spirit and Nurse. Healing is why taking hits isnt a mistake. The mistake a survivor makes, is shortening the time to his first kill, which doesnt neccesarily need to be a hit.
Tanking hits, tanking hookstates, healing people who are closest to being dead on hook, are all part of lengthening the time it takes for a killer to get his first kill. After the killer gets his first kill, that is when hits start becoming mistakes. But if you have 0 hooks, and your teammate is dead on hook, even if that teammate sucks in chase, he wasnt the one making a mistake. You refusing to tank a hookstate is.
"Remember your comment early about distressing, you just answered your own question regarding why distressing is a bad perk. Making your terror radius bigger in most cases is really bad for killer."
Which isnt what I said tho. I said: "Distressing is quite good in combination with infectious, especially with ranged killers if you decide to run Infectious. Trickster already has a very soft TR, players dont realize they are inside the TR. Since Trickster's Main Event works best with as many known survivor locations that are close, IF makes sense, since you can down people outside of chase with Trickster, Distressing compliments the perk." Which you shortened to "distressing is quite good" when the context was "quite good in combination with infectious". You ignored 90% of my explanation to just be like "he gave a very specific situation and build where distressing can be good at, but that doesnt matter, he called distressing good, which is heresy". Distressing can work wonders on specific builds. Distressing is a supportive perk, not a solo perk. I can create builds that actually rely on having a bigger terror radius, and Distressing is MUCH better than M&A because Distressing increases the TR based on a percentage instead of a flat number. Use the full context. I never said Distressing was a good perk on it's own. I clearly stated Distressing is good *IN COMBINATION*
"Blight wasn't designed to be stealth killer so saying that this "removes" drawbacks is just very strange."
Still a drawback. And if Blight wasnt meant to be a stealth killer, then why do people run Tinkerer on him over Discordance? People use Blight as a stealth killer consistently. Sure, it gives info on the gen, but that's not it's most important asset. The Undetectable status effect is what makes Tinkerer so powerful on Blight.
"further comments on Alchemist ring is that those situations require context. Blight has very low cooldown on his blight rush, he does not need alchemist ring to capitalize on those situations you describe."
Wrong though, you dont gain stacks while rushing, it will take too long to get more than 2 extra stacks to reach those scenario's. Heck, let me tell you how wrong you are:
- Ruin is still up and Tinkerer goes off. 5 stacks prevents that gen from being finished. You cannot reach the opposite side of the map quickly with just 3 stacks. Meaning you would have to wait at least 2 more seconds to get your 4th token before you start rushing there, assuming you'd only need 4. You are going to be unable to reach that generator unless you already had 4 or 5 tokens remaining. Anything less, and that gen is gone.
- You still have Pop and Tinkerer just popped Same reason as above. You cannot simply be fast enough to hit/down a survivor after at least 2 rushes and still reach it.
- Tinkerer just Popped Just point 1 and 2 without gen regression reasons.
- You see another injured survivor. Again, you needed at least 2 rushes to down your survivor, at best you'll have 4 if you only used 2.
- You see someone visibly work on a generator and want to spook them off before hooking, if you hit them with a rush too, you can rush back before anyone picks them up. You literally cannot do this without alchemist ring.
I am assuming you didnt read the context again, because the context was clearly off a situation where Alchemist Ring works, which is AFTER hitting a survivor with a Lethal Rush. Meaning you first use his M2 to hit or down a survivor and THEN those scenario's occur. None of Blight's addons allow him to do so.
"5 hatchets is a lot of ammo. She doesn't need to throw unlimited amount of hatchets, one hatchet is enough for full health state."
You dont read, so I'll copy paste: "assuming the survivor is not a complete potato". One hatchet = one health state if it hits. Just like six blades = one health state if they hit. 44 ammo is a lot of ammo if 6 blades is enough for 1 health state. That isnt even mentioning Trickter doesnt need Main Event to be played similar(if not better) than huntress.
"That is not true. Gen slowdown perks were in fact more powerful than before. Remember old hex:ruin and Pop goes weasel synergy with hex:ruin?"
More powerful, but when did I say powerful? Gen regression wasnt that good in high tier. Old Hex Ruin was ######### at high tier, because survivors never missed great skill checks. Sure, great skill checks didnt progress the gen, making them go a tiny bit slower, but the main strength about Ruin in public lobbies was that not all survivors are going to be high tier. Pop remained useless at high tier, because by the time you got someone on the hook, they would finish 3 gens. Why? MAP DESIGN.
"Jungle gyms haven't changed and many of popular tilesets remain same."
They havent change in terms of design, but there are less, they spawn much less close to each other. When is the last time you have seen 2 jungle gyms have windows facing each other? Or a jungle gym have it's window facing a killershack? That's right, before the maps got reworked.
Suffocation pit has 1 area where ALL the loops are and it's not even that strong, there is a jungle gym on each end, which is just 2. There used to be 3. And remember pre-rework suffocation pit? Where there were looping tiles next to the mainbuilding too? Coal Tower even has 1 less jungle gym and more space between loops. That's not even talking about the thickness of the trees being decreased. You used to be able to hide with 3 survivors behind 1 tree with ease, you can now barely fit 1 if you're not carrying an item.
And again, wrong, Myers was literally THE stealth killer. The biggest issue literally was map tiles. Let me create the scenario of your average chase back then: 1. find a survivor. 2. injure them before they enter the loop unless they use sprintburst. 3. try to get them to drop as many pallets as possible. 4. bait out their exhaustion perk or hope sprintburst didnt get recovered and down them.
Freddy had 2 more steps to that: 1. find a survivor. 2. start pulling them into the dreamworld. 3. hope they reach dreamworld before they reach a loop or hope they are close to hitting dreamworld when you have an oppertunity to m1 them(not even including the fact that you couldnt grab survivors who werent asleep, they did address that later, I believe, but I quit playing this game before that happened). then the "normal" step 2-4 were performed. With the extra downside that Sprintburst would have recovered most likely. The nerf to exhaustion perks and the changes to maps is what makes old freddy viable today.
And no, pre-rework freddy wasnt exactly healthy either. Mainly because 1. there was no way to distinguish between a real and a fake pallet unless you were the one who dropped the pallets. 2. he was capable of slowing survivors in way that clown couldnt. 3. on top of that, he could teleport across the map. Freddy NEEDED to be slowed when placing traps. Every single other character placing traps is either locked in animation or is at least slowed down. I agree that they kinda gutted his trap count, which was unneccesary, as now he doesnt really have access to placing down traps for information anymore, just anti-loop. But other than that? His slowdown was needed.
"Main event is ultimate ability and let me tell you, for an ultimate ability, its really bad, Like you can loop a rock and trickster will never be able to catch up for how slow he is in throwing mode regardless what his fire rate is. In general, better players will not give trickster the optimal positioning to utilize it."
- Main Event is literally the only ultimate ability in this game.
- You're not supposed to use it at loops
- better players dont see when Trickster is able to use it, meaning they cannot get to optimal positioning while he has it. They just see him activate it and hope there is something they can use against it.
Yes, on paper, main event sounds bad as there is a plethora of reasons you can think against it, but in practicality? There are millions of oppertunities where main event heavily benefits Trickster. The fact that he can use it with 0 knives left often makes up for the fact that he needs to reload to get more knives. You can enter a chase with only 4 knives, knowing you need to hit 3, slowly build up the lacaration and force a survivor to leave a loop, then use main event to down them before they can reach the next. With Main Event, you can down someone before they finished vaulting.
"I have no clue where you concluded 1.7 second for full down from healthy to injured. it is certainly is not organic in normal gameplay."
Again *R E A D* I clearly said "1 health state per 1.7 seconds" I didnt say "downed in 1.7 seconds". That means the hitrate of Trickster is 1 knive every 0.28 seconds. The throwrate of Trickster without main event is less than 0.2(Consecutive Projectiles Decay time: 0.2 seconds. This refers to the time in-between Throw inputs after which the Game will not consider the throws consecutive anymore. This means that his standard throwrate MUST be 1 knive every 0.2 seconds, or less, for the game to not consider it consecutive throws for the multiplier he recieves at 4 and 8 thrown knives). Considering Main Event is 1.667x faster than the standard throwrate, that means it's either 1.667 knives every 0.2 seconds, or 1 knive every 0.08 seconds. I'll go with the first option, since that's in your favor, meaning he will throw a knive every 0.12 seconds. Meaning you only need to hit a bit more than 40% of your knives in main event to down someone in 1.7 seconds. Yeah, you could down someone within the same time, by hitting 85% of your knives, but a survivor would pretty much need to run into a wall after their first hit. But that doesnt include the scenario where there is more than 1 survivor.
Maths. That is where I concluded the 1.7 second per health state(not 2 health states, just 1) while in Main Event, and I was assuming average games.
"I think she is just overall better at all tile sets in general. Trickster can be equal in some places to her, but he is not better in any places. Just worse in many places."
I mean, you think she is. She feels like she is. And I will fully agree that Huntress will feel better than Trickster. But that doesnt make her better.
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@IronKnight55 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2424548#Comment_2424548
This is a game we are talking about. How hard is it to open the gates and force survivors out? You guys seriously need to stop crying about this non issue. 🤦♂️
Yes, and if it happens in 1000 games, we're talking about 2000 minutes, aka 33 hours of time where you just wait. Let alone that survivors might not even be in the same gate. Forcing survivors out of 1 gate(aka, hitting them twice if you dont have an instadown), takes about 5 seconds each. Assuming I am at the gate with all of them there, sure, that's just 20 seconds extra to the match.
Assuming I am not there, that means I would have to walk to the gate they opened, meaning if I dont have vision on the gate I might first be at the wrong gate, THEN spend 5 seconds for each survivor, THEN not all of them might be there with the others being in the other gate, forcing me to go back to hit them all out, adding another 5 seconds for each survivor there. Walking between gates can take anywhere from 10 to 25 seconds. So if I am "lucky", I am at the right gate, all survivors there, 20 seconds later they are out. Fine. If I am "unlucky", that's 10 seconds just walking to the first gate, another 25 to walk to the other gate, hitting 2 survivors out for another 10 seconds, seeing no one else is near, me walking to the other gate, 1 person there, so 30 seconds just to force 1 person out, THEN walking back again for another 30 seconds just to force the last person out. That's nearly the entire lenght of the EGC, with all survivors safe and sound in the exit gate, just waiting, meaning I could have been AFK, and it would just be as effective.
So obviously "forcing survivors out" isnt really the solution
Stop
Wasting
Time
By
Waiting
In
The
Gate
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@Snowbawlzzz said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2424591#Comment_2424591
You can stop pretending that your speed limiter proposal is a "common request". It's not. Bubba is an extremely loopable killer. A simple 4-wall jungle gym is enough to keep you safe from a chainsaw if you hug corners and are decent at breaking LOS. This is something I learned by playing against Bubba, which you claim is too rare to be done. Current day Bubba is the gold-standard for a strong killer that doesn't take away survivor agency.
It was though, not currently, read my comments, the proposal WAS for the bubba rework, not currently, P R E - R E W O R K Bubba.
And no, Bubba isnt the gold standard. No killer that is capable of guaranteeing kills on hook by camping with his basekit is even close to being called a gold standard killer. Doctor, Demo, Oni and Blight(excluding some of his addons) are much better deserving of the name gold standard killers. Killers where small mistakes end up in an earlier hit, not an instadown.
Also "A simple 4-wall jungle gym is enough to keep you safe from a chainsaw if you hug corners and are decent at breaking LOS." is simply asenine, as this is supposed to be the absolute strongest loop a survivor can use, with only 2 of these spawning on each map. Yeah, you'd be fine IF Bubba never m1's, IF you're able to even reach it before Bubba closes the gap AND IF your teammates are actually aware you're being chased.
I wouldnt mind Bubba's balancing, if the map spawns 3-4(depending on mapsize and genspread) jungle gyms while facing him, which is not the case. Bubba is not fine because maps are not. IF we keep the current maps, Bubba shouldnt be able to instadown from at least his first charge(heck, im even pretty certain Bubba shouldnt be able to rev within 8 or 16 meters of a hooked survivor at this point).
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@DerpyPlayz said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2426889#Comment_2426889
Cool, thanks. Why do you prefer this? And why D/C over AFKing and bleeding out? At least that way your account will be OK.I see it as a insult to injury, like the killer after winning is like "Pfft, you are too pathetic for me to even kill because I feel bad for you, take this escape you noob, as that is the only time you are even going to escape you [BAD WORD] [BAD WORD] [BAD WORD]".
Of course, I realize most killers are just tryina be nice, just doesn't feel that way. Since I personally only let the weak links in easy games go, or the advanced players go during a game in which it was easy.
I mean, thing is, you're the last survivor in the trial, the 1v1 in this game is heavily killer sided. I dont ever get the view how it could feel like the killer thinks you're too pathetic to kill. It tends to be quicker to just leave you slugged and bleed you out while the EGC timer goes down so they can go AFK while you die. They are literally in a position where the only chance you escape, is if you happen to reach the hatch faster than the killer does. Which, if the killer knows where the hatch is, is impossible and otherwise is heavy RNG. Meaning your chances of survival are extremely luck based at that point. Would you rather have a escape based on pure luck, or a killer admitting defeat?
I'd personally see it more as "if your teammates were better, you would probably have escaped, I admit my defeat".
I dont ever give the escape to a weak link, because if the weak link hasnt died by that point, they must have been hiding all game, or I've been purposely not killing them so I could get more hooks before finally killing the first person. The only time a weak link escapes through hatch, is if that weak link has been my favourite survivor that match.
Why would I ever give a terrible player the hatch, unless they've made the game awesome in an unexpected way?
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@Lenox said:
I have almost 500 hours in this game. I've never heard this before until today. Usually I'm thanked post-game for giving the last survivor the hatch. Or at least there's cool banter.
Today, the person sat in front of the hatch and didn't take it. I thought they AFK'd. But they didn't. In post-game chat, they called me a jerk and said giving the hatch was BM. What?
I was a Hag with Iron Grasp, Sloppy Butcher, Hex: Thrill of the Hunt, and Hex: Devour Hope. Nothing crazy, setup-wise.
The reason I have heard from people:
"I do not want a pity win".
It's the kind of people that consider a death a loss, and an escape a win, regardless of the outcome of the match as a whole. They are also the kind of people who hardcore tunnel and camp, because killing any survivor means you won against that survivor(even though the 1v1 in this game is clearly killer sided, that's like 4 tournament survivors all escaping from a low tier killer who got 9 hooks and being like "we won" even though they would have lost the match if it were a tournament).
They simply cannot be reasoned with. Personally, I'd just go AFK and let them bleed out if they refuse to escape. If they dont want the hatch after I have given it to them, they gotta earn their defeat.
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@Frontdoor6 said:
Isn't its the Devs thing to give teasers that throw us off? Remember Silent Hill chapter teasers? Everything was looking like Candyman
Yeah, but candyman himself never appeared in the teasers. Here, we have Springtrap in multiple images, in official promotion material for a company that does not own a license for FNaF. That's not exactly legal to do unless with permission.
Unless they do. And it would be kinda weird for the devs to just obtain a license to use a character in promotional materials(it would just cost money with little to no benefit)
I'm not saying chapter 21 isnt hellraiser, just that chapter 22 or 23 might be fnaf.
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@OnryosTapeRentals said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2426238#Comment_2426238
I second this.
ALL of the evidence points to Hellraiser. There's literally no doubt about it.
I don't mean to sound rude but everyone still saying it's FNaF is just intentionally adding up 2 and 2 to get 5 because they prefer that explanation.
To be fair, it would be true Scott Cawthon fashion to be promoting around a specific thing while leaving easter eggs of something else, that are red herrings for the true thing.
Heck, I wouldnt even be surprised if both licences were aquired and to be released right after each other. Every single post has had something hinting at Hellraiser or FNaF. Hellraiser is quite more likely since some devs wanted him to join the club in chapter 21, but I do like to point out, that you cannot really start placing easter eggs of licensed material as promotional material, without having access to the license to use it. Seeing as Springtrap has been made quite visible on the background, that means they have at the very least had access to using the character like that.
So either way, it's just Hellraiser for chapter 21 with the devs having the license to use Springtrap in promotional material as just a red herring, or Hellraiser for chapter 21 with Springtrap being on the horizon too. And people are like "yeah, but they made us think Candyman too", the thing is, when was any actual candyman imagery used? In this case, we have 3 cases of Springtrap actively being in the background, that's very different as to "hinting" at another killer.
So I agree, the next chapter is confirmed to be Hellraiser, but I'd also say that "FNaF confirmed" is a fair statement to make aswell, just not for chapter 21, but perhaps 22. It wouldnt be the first time 3 licensed killers are released in a row.
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@Tricksters_Wife said:
I had a game recently where I was stuck in the loading for probably around 10-15 minutes — no joke. It got to the point where I friended as many people as I could on the other side to talk to them because I didn't know if we were all stuck or not. Come to find out that one of them told me they crashed their game on purpose because they didn't want to play on my map offering. One of the other survivors dced as well after we finally got back to the lobby, probably because they didn't know what was going on either.
I disconnected while loading in a game a couple of days ago because my power went out because of a storm outside so I felt really bad that everyone probably went through the same problem I did 😖
That normally shouldnt happen though, worst case scenario, the game should stop loading and kick everyone out once the person who crashed the game on purpose has reconnected to DBD.
That's more a problem with a glitch with the loading screen than the person crashing.
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@Lord_Tony said:
when MMR was on killers were getting steam rolled by survivors.
now that SBMM is on are killers still getting steam rolled by survivors?
should swf and comms instantly raise their SBMM level?
Neither were survivor sided. MMR was fine, it just meant the game decided you were winning quite often and started putting you against optimal SWF's. Same for SBMM.
It's more the fact that solo queue is so god danm awful, that MMR seems to me survivor sided. You might be winning against 4 extremely high tier solo survivors purely because their team didnt have the proper synergy. Thus the game decided you must be capable of facing 4 high tier survivors who teamed up.
It's the gap between solo survivor and killers that makes MMR or SBMM quite uneffective.
In fact, it's so severe that those people who want to add a debuff on survivors when they play SWF, dont realize killers need a much bigger debuff if they face solo survivors.
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@gnehehe said:
A killer, that desperately relies on dedicated maps with low walls or massive dead zones, is indeed very nicely designed!
I mean, the only maps that do not have low walls or massive deadzones are quite literally just Coal Tower, Rancid Abattoir and Haddonfield.
That's just 3 maps, one of which will very likely recieve a rework soon anyway, making it only 2 maps. So yeah.
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@CornHub said:
https://us.v-cdn.net/6030815/uploads/SAK4XNDH1TOJ/1436589375788.jpg
Now you know good & well he's still trash, especially on console.
To be fair, Nurse and Blight are also quite trash on console compared to other killers. Doesnt mean they are actually trash.
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@Edilibs said:
Its one thing to lose but its another to know WHY your losing. First off i want to say that this new mmr system is absolutely horrible! So i can can see my progress at the cue screen but BHVR seems to be going in the direction of removing rank all together and this is a mistake.
The people that say rank doesnt matter really don't understand games with ranking systems and this goes into a variety of genres. On average green, yellow and dark yellow (Rank 20's) are pretty bad and this can be for a number of reasons but the bottom line is that they don't really know the game and or are bad at it. Now i have no information post match so i can asses why i lose a game if i lose one or even when i win. When i win i want to know why and see ranks, stats etc and the same for when i lose. This new system is so bad along with the fps drops on console its really turning me away from this game which i really liked and still do but things are getting ridiculous with these changes...
Why does BHVR think ranks dont matter? Have they been listening to top streamers that may have said this? Please revert the match making back to the way it was, i dont care if me at red ranks get paired up with a rank 9 i'd still rather know that the person is rank 9 so i can assess my win or loss. Now i just dont' know anything...Now things are just a mystery and i have no answers and can only see perks. I'd much rather have the old MMR system (which i wasnt a fan of) than this crap because at least i know why things have happened the way they did! I would usually play at least 2 hours of DBD in a day but just shook my head after 45 min and turned it off because of this (mentioned above) reason. Its really becoming less and less fun....
In fighting games and other genres of games theres you can see points/ranks because you need to have info on a player. If BHVR really think that pairing a red rank up with a green or yellow rank doesnt matter then they really dont know games or the people that play them im sad to say. Why oh why would they get rid of rank displays!!!!?
WHYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYY!!!!!!!!???????????????
Btw i play killer at rank 1 and survivor at rank 3 so just throwing that out there.
All ranks are, is an indication that those players know how to earn pips and know how to not consistently lose pips. That's literally all they need.
You can become rank 1 on either side, within 2 weeks of having installed the game.
That means, you just need 40 hours(assuming you play 2-3 hours a day on average) at most, to reach rank 1. So how do ranks matter? Sure, a green rank is more likely to be bad than good, yet, if that green rank outperforms the purple ranks, does that mean the purple ranks are worse? Does it mean the green rank was a red rank with a derank bug? Does it mean they simply dont know how to pip in the game?
Best case scenario, rank indicates that more skillful players play at red rank than at green ranks. That's it.
Saying ranks matter, is like whether the gender of the players matter. As if the gender of the person will indicate how much skill they have. Sure, there might be a trend that says one gender tends to outperform the others, but does that really matter when you're getting utterly destroyed by the gender that tends to perform less, but get heavily sandbagged by the gender that tends to outperform more? Ofcourse not
All that matters is, that regardless of the ranks you faced, you had players being objectively better or worse than you. All I personally care for, is whether or not someone got into my MMR because of SWF or because the game has unfairly put me with people who are higher/lower skilled than me because of SWF. That's the only case where I see survivor rank mattering, because more often than not, if there is 1 red rank survivor and 1 yellow rank survivor in a purple player match, there is a high likelihood of the outliers to be SWF.
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@Gplays2000 said:
Same Killers same survivors same…..always the same…..It‘s just boring at this point….The only thing that keeps me playing is the Rift Pass and that shouldn‘t rly be the only thing that keeps a player playing the game… I honestly don‘t know what they could do but High Rank Gameplay is just so boring and repetitive….Same Killers all the time (Spirit,Nurse,Blight) same perks….Ruin,Undying,Tinkerer and Corrupt….Just the same game every damn time and not even good teammates .-. What do you do that keeps you engaged in the game and is it just me who loses interest in this game? Let me know.
To be fair, I've been utterly refusing to run any public meta or tournament meta perks while playing survivor or killer unless I am utter dogshit at playing the killer(really, cant blame me for running NOED on Nurse when I fail my blinks 95% of the game, if you can avoid me 95% of the game because I never played Nurse even though you faced many Nurses, then your teammates had plenty of time to scour the map and cleanse NOED)
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@WeenieDog said:
It really is a double standard when people talk about survivors DCing because they don't like the killer, but axing the match because they don't like the map offering is A-OK.
To be fair, not liking a killer is entirely different, as killers are at best annoying but are otherwise just part of the experience. Where certain maps can literally make or break the game for certain killers.
Huntress seeing a Haddonfield or RPD offering means she gets a 1k if she facecamps the first person she downs close to the basement, if she wants to play "fair", she would have 0 chance on a 4k.
Where, if its a Bubba, even if you do not like him, most maps do offer counterplays and the most commonly used perks help counter him quite well. You're fully in control on how many survivors can make it out the exit. Even if the Bubba facecamps, a 4 man escape is possible, and a 3 man escape is practically guaranteed.
There is a difference between having a very high likelihood of getting any kills at all purely because of mapdesign not allowing you to use your abilities properly, and a killer you simply dont encounter often enough to learn to counterplay.
So really, how is it a double standard? One literally reduces your chances of winning by merely existing, the other is a matter of taste.
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@adam1233467 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2427554#Comment_2427554
What lerys desync?
There is a desync issues based on pallets in certain rooms, where the game puts you on the opposite side of the pallet where you're really not.
And yeah, using map offerings as a survivor is often indication of a sweaty team. If I play Huntress and I see an RPD offering, I am going to assume that the survivors have prepared for that map, and Huntress isnt really fun to play on RPD, especially if she's unprepared for that map.
Let alone that if a killer uses a map offering, only 1 survivor map offering is needed to cancel out that map. Let that sink in, that means if survivors bring 3 different map offerings, there is only a 1/4th chance of the offering bringing you to the map you as killer brought in. Considering survivors can bring up to 4 offerings, where a killer can only bring 1, it's kinda survivor sided to be choosing a map offering in the first place. As survivors dont really rely on maps, where some killer builds heavily rely on a specific map(as an example, T1 Myers heavily relies on an inside map due to lack of survivor vision, putting him on Autohaven quite literally makes him unplayable).
So yeah, I can list 100 reasons as to why a killer would close their game during a loading screen to avoid a DC penalty, but the 3 main reasons: 1, the game didnt start yet, 2, if they were to play that game, there was a very high likelihood of absolutely 0 fun on their side to be had and 3 map offerings are not balanced towards the available offering slots.
From the killer's perspective, it's like you were playing football/soccer with them, then broke their leg because you liked the aestethics of a broken leg and be like "why are you quitting?"
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@Mister_xD said:
Twins just need a straight up power rework, honestly.
while i definitely agree that Victor is too good the way he works right now, the nerf the Devs made was certainly the wrong path to take.
IMO Victor shouldnt be the one downing Survivors, the finishing blow should always be delivered by Charlotte - Victor should however support her drastically when he is attached to someone.
make it an actual big downside to have the gremlin attached to you, as with him you are extremely vulnerable to Charlotte.
but just running after Survivors at 150% mms until you touch their toes, just to then down them with that truck sized hitbox of Victor is very boring for the Survivor and - at least in my opinion - also not very exciting for the Killer.
I am actually of the opinion that Victor being able to down tons of people isnt the issue. I think having essentially unlimited time to control Victor is. For example take the following scenario:
it's a 2 v 1 situation, everyone knows where the hatch is. All survivors are injured. Charlotte can be parked on top of the slugged survivor, and you can control Victor for the remaining 3,5 minutes to scour the map for the last survivor, park Victor next to the hatch, pick up the survivor after nearly 4 full minutes and hook them as close to the hatch as you possibly can.
Another one being with all 4 survivors being injured and then Charlotte releasing Victor after a BBQ read to start mass slugging.
I dont think Victor being the one to down everyone is the issue, I think there should be a 40 second time limit on Victor before he decays(time decaying half as fast if he's standing idle, meaning you could spend 20 seconds controlling Victor and then have 20 seconds of him idling near the downed survivor, and giving you 10 seconds to latch on/down anyone that gets too close) and starts regrowing into Charlotte again. That also means that a survivor gets rewarded if they are able to dodge Victor for long enough.
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@SquidBad said:
I was playing Hag trying to get her adept on coldwind. I placed a trap in a specific spot in shack, foreseeing a chase leading there where I would need it later. Sure enough when I chase an injured person into the shack, they step on the trap. I teleport immediately, swing, and they pressed E to make the distance to shack pallet. I cannot think of any way they did anything to deserve getting that chase extended so much. No skill, no intelligent usage... The only thing they did was equip DH and press E. I strategically placed that trap there with the specific intent of using it, minutes ahead of time. It is so frustrating to make a good play and get ######### for it.
If you think DH is fine, please explain to me what this person actually did that was smart or skillful. It certainly wasn't pressing E. It looks to me like they just get free things by merit of having DH equipped.
Well, the survivor had Dead Hard, noticed you placed the trap, and prepared to use his resources to force the trap to trigger while timing it perfectly so he would get out unscathed. From his perspective, you just placed a trap in a location that every hag would place it, making you the person who "didnt do anything to deserve a hit" in that chase, making you the person who didnt deserve to shorten the chase so much just because you placed a trap that literally cannot be removed without a very specific item that very few people tend to bring.
The counter argument could easily be made that if you had waited 1 second before you would swing, you would have baited out the DH and gotten the down. Essentially, you were too greedy for a down while being fully aware the survivor could carry DH in that scenario. Let alone that you could have placed a second trap next to the killershack pallet and essentially guarantee a hit too.
There are cases where I would agree DH can be a bit too strong for what it does, just like I can think of cases where NOED is extremely unbalanced. But there are plenty of cases where it's fine. Like survivors having plenty of time to cleanse all the totems before finishing the final gen, or having a tiny bit of patience.
There are millions of cases in a chase where you hit a survivor, and there was absolutely nothing that survivor could have done to avoid that hit. Especially when it comes to a Hag. Seriously, the only counter a Hag has is flashlights. If there is no flashlight, good luck trying to unhook any teammates without heavily risking having both people on the hook.
Yeah, it sucks for the killer, but guess what? It's not a single player game. Both sides need to at least feel they could have done something, and in this scenario, you could have. Remove Dead Hard, and you remove not only people being able to extend a chase through a pallet, but you also screw over every single survivor that doesnt have dead hard as there is no reason for you to wait out a hit. That second of hesitation allows players without Dead Hard to spin you out.
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@Orion said:
Iconic killers, by definition, are not "modern". Age+Influence is the bare minimum for something to be "iconic".
To be fair, something can be iconic within a year or 2. Michael Myers and Jason Voorhees were pretty much iconic after their first appearance.
Pretty sure if DBD was made back then, Myers and Voorhees would be top of the list quite quickly, even though other iconic killers like Frankensteins Monster and Count Dracula werent even added.
I'd say The Nun is an iconic horror movie killer, purely because the way she originally appeared in the movies, it's really a shame they spend 95% of the movie just going for jumpscares.
Amnesia and FNaF would also fit those "instant classics" definition of iconic. They were fairly original concepts that massively broadened what we would define as a horror. Just like Myers, Jason, Freddy, Amanda, Ghostface, Nemesis and PH expanded on what was possible. I'd say influence is by far the one and only factor that makes something iconic. Age just gives it more time to amass a greater influence.
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@Altarf said:
Brutal Strength should be buffed, but most of the pallet breaks/bypasses do have conditions and downsides to them that normal breaking doesn't.
-Billy: 2.5 second charge time, possibility to glitch and bump into the pallet without breaking it, AND considerable Overheat buildup.
-Bubba: 2 second charge time and charge consumption.
-Nurse: Needs to be out of fatigue, have at least one Blink charge ready and needs to have the Blink charged enough to go through it, then suffer through fatigue.
-Demogorgon: No real downside, but takes roughly the same time as a normal pallet break.
-Legion: Vaulting requires Frenzy and cannot be used in any way to down people, and gives you fatigue after.
-Nemesis: Probably the best one, but requires Mutation Rate 2, so a couple successful chases need to have happened first.
-Oni: Requires Blood Fury and is slightly slower at breaking than his Chainsaw bretheren.
I wouldn't flat out call most of these other pallet breaks better than Brutal. Above all, they are all heavily telegraphed, which Brutal isn't - I've caught several survivors by mindgaming the break and breaking it as they're closest to the pallet and out of position, letting me get a hit. Brutal should get a buff to 25% or 30% in my opinion, though.
(Forgot Blight. His break requires you to use at minimum two rushes, though, then suffer through the cooldown and recharge time.)
To be fair, in most scenario's this tends to be the case:
Billy and Bubba: either an instadown, or the pallet and can be done from quite a long distance to compensate for the charge time.
Nurse: Always has at least 1 charge post fatique anyway unless using a specific addon, and she would need to suffer through fatique for that hit anyway. My point was more that unless the Nurse heavily relies on line of sight to predict survivor movements.
Demo: Kinda same case with Bubba and Billy, only if you start charging to break it up close, is it a downside. Increase distance and you can break the pallet much faster than walking to it.
Legion: Oh boy, you dont know about the forbidden legion tech, do you? It's not consistent, sure, but even in that scenario, you'd still force them to mend or be injured(if they were healthy). But yeah, he's arguably the worst on the list, but even in that case, it's so, so much better than Brutal Strength in almost every single way.
Nemesis: You can get quite quickly though, 2 zombies and 1 downed survivor and you'll have it. Let alone that it also allows you to move, which is another benefit that I did take in consideration.
Oni is indeed slower, probably the slowest on the list(excluding the time it needs to achieve feral frenzy), BUT Oni has the benefit of downing a survivor if they stand too close too(they would need to be on the same side tho).
Blight, kinda same as all other killers, where it's either a pallet or a damage state.
Yeah, if taken purely from the perspective that you destroy a single pallet when up close, it's at a similar cost, but considering the possibilities of how the pallet is destroyed/ignored, the downsides can often be ignored. Heck, killers being able to basekit destroy it at about 35-40% without destroying their momentum, and have a similar breaking speed with the downside(but still better, it's 20-25% speed, so worst case scenario, you're an Oni post stun and have the regular 20% bonus). I'd say Brutal Strength could easily be 40% without being game breaking at all. Especially considering the way the game works with buffs and debuffs.
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@Junylar said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2417767#Comment_2417767
How many lobbies do you dodge?
As survivor? Maybe about one every 8 hours, mainly if 3 of them are obviously a crossplay SWF. Otherwise none.
Why would dodging lobbies even matter here? Or if you were talking about me being a Bubba main? I got that statistic from rank 1 Bubba mains. As a killer, I only really dodge lobbies during the loading screen if I see people switch to a key and 3 toolboxes last second while they use a map offering for Ormond, Haddonfield or RPD and I am not in the mood/dont have the build to play super sweaty. It's quite easy to just use ctrl+alt+del and close DBD forcefully if that happens, dont get a penalty either, because the match never started in the first place.
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@Verconissp said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2417418#Comment_2417418
Im not rewarding my useless teammates that sit in a corner doing jack and #########.
Seriously. do you wanna reward the people that actively Throw on your team?
Cause lemme tell you the amount of times i get sandbagged and trolled while soloq.
Oh, I am fully aware. But do you know what pisses me off more than that? Them being able to get 18k BP because they farmed me, got chase points because they were seen by the killer for a second, while I only gain 6k.
The other option with my system would see me having something closer to 16k BP, while they would get about 19k-21k.
Seriously, at this point I am wondering if you are an American, because the logic behind it fits the American propaganda that access to free healthcare is bad, when it's globally proven to be better to have free healthcare. The only time privatized healthcare is better, is when you're part of the 1%. And I call it propaganda, because you truly rather see yourself massively suffer financially than seeing someone else benefit slightly better financially.
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@Devil_hit11 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2417912#Comment_2417912
"And again, base-kit speed limiter on bubba makes sense, he sweeps multiple times anyway. You could easily compensate by increasing his movementspeed OR add another charge OR increase the speed of regaining charges to compensate."
Nothing compensates losing instant down. Instant down is time efficiency. I play a lot of bubba, he's like my 3rd most played killer. I also play survivor at rank 1. Bubba would be a joke to face without instant down.
"95% of the killers that are being picked are not bubba, meaning you simply will not have enough time to learn to play against a bubba specifically, as there is quite a significant chance you wont encounter a bubba for literal weeks.
Dont act as if Bubba is a very common killer to face."
Not a good excuse. learn to play survivor.
"I've been playing this game for a very long time, buffing old bubba by giving him speedlimiter as basekit while giving current values has been a very common request"
common requests by rank 20 survivors. Its funny because sometimes you get strange matchmaking with like green rank survivors, sometimes you get messages like bubba instant down is unfair messages. Its very comical to think that red rank bubba should be losing to green rank survivors.
He is not overbuffed, it is learn to play issue. He is proper challenge to beat if the other player is good at using his ability.
"Nothing compensates losing instant down."
Except that it DOES compensate as it would remove the ability for Bubba to guarantee a free kill in the most boring and toxic way possible, multiple kills if you try to save your teammate. Let alone that increased speed and more sweeps would allow Bubba to hit people where he normally wouldnt be able to and overall have shorter chases. Overall shorter chases=better time efficiency.
"Not a good excuse. learn to play survivor."
'I barely encounter high tier SWF's, so I lose consistently to them, I cant possibly learn to counter their strategies if I only play against them for 4 minutes once a month as the strategies used by other survivors are very different, leaving to little to no time to adapt' "Just git gud".
Not how it works. You NEED practice against a killer to counter that specific killer. Learning to play survivor has nothing to do with a hag being able to teleport to you. Learning to play survivor has nothing to do with a Nurse being able to phase through walls. NOTHING you learn as a survivor against the average killer will teach you how to play against a Bubba. So yes, it is an excuse.
"common requests by rank 20 survivors." Nope, Bubba mains, rank 1 survivors, rank 1 killers all requested to highly amplify his pre-rework ability at the cost of losing the instadown. It would remove the incentive to facecamp on hook, while also allowing Bubba to far more easily hit a survivor twice. You can consistently run Speedlimiter on Bubba and have a 70% killrate.
"Its funny because sometimes you get strange matchmaking with like green rank survivors, sometimes you get messages like bubba instant down is unfair messages. Its very comical to think that red rank bubba should be losing to green rank survivors."
Just that it's comical that a green rank Bubba should be getting 1 kill while facing red rank survivors. Yet, that happens quite easily.
"He is not overbuffed, it is learn to play issue. He is proper challenge to beat if the other player is good at using his ability."
Maps offer far too little counterplay against a Bubba. You can charge a chainsaw and instadown a survivor faster at pretty much any loop, than any other killer is capable of doing 1 health state. The only exceptions being Nurse and Spirit around pallets.
On 99% of the vast majority of maps, there is no counterplay against a Bubba's instadown as he can catch up with you either before you finish the vaulting animation, use his second charge to catch up and if that fails, access his third charge to basically guarantee the down. I've never even needed to use a 3rd charge on Bubba to get an instadown on the vast majority of loops. That is why I call him overbuffed. He either has 1 charge too many or too much speed to be carrying an instadown. Lowering those 2 makes him significantly weaker on T&L walls and against pallets, so that's not neccesarily the problem. The problem lies at his instadown at this point. Which is why I definitely prefer him having speedlimiter as a basekit, if it means increasing his movement speed. Heck, I'd even would argue that Bubba could have a build in Lo-Pro chains(the PTB one, where it's basically speedlimiter with the ability to run through pallets), which would make sense.
Hits in this game are inevitable, having an inevitable hit being an instadown that's basekit without any requirements is a bit ridiculous.
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@IronKnight55 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2417936#Comment_2417936
It doesn't matter. So what if they leave without taking a hit? Either push them out or wait until they leave. Don't complain if you don't want to force them to leave.
What kind of logic is that? "Dont complain about the neighbours having loud music at night to the police, either knock on their door and tell them to lower it, or wait untill they go to sleep, dont complain if you dont want to knock on their door every single day, so what if they have loud music?".
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@Devil_hit11 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2417562#Comment_2417562
"Yeah, the easiest shots to hit are animation locks, but that doesnt mean that you still shouldnt vault it. You can easily sacrifice 1 healthstate to massively increase a chase. I could go for 1 more loop and take a hit and then be unable to vault without another hit, or be unable to reach the next loop without risking a hit. Going for a vault could guarantee the killer a hit quicker, but it could increase the time before a hook quite significantly."
Sorry, getting hit is a mistake in this game. Getting hit is how you get put on hook. you have more chances for the other player to make mistake if you have tricky movement to follow. There isn't any tricky movement when it comes window vaulting. Its why a lot of ranged killers are actually notorious powerful in loops like T-L loop.
"you cant really nerf holding W without nerfing killers. Nerfing W just to compensate for ranged killers would also mean increasing generator speeds to compensate for killers like Nurses and Blights that run Tinkerer, Ruin, Undying and Pop."
Holding forward and maximizing loops is part of the game. Weakening that aspect wouldn't change anything for Blight or Nurse because their power effectively renders such strategies ineffective. This is why they're classed as near the top. The perks are universal to all killers and these perk tend to be used a lot as they are among the best perks in current iteration of the game.
"You rarely face optimal survivors, you're far more likely to face survivors that cannot be optimal due to a lack of communications."
What if you do? do you just accepting losing because the killer is ineffective?
"Once the average killrate reaches 55%, that's when you can start complaining about optimal survivors ruining games."
As shown by statistics for killrate for red rank killers, every killer is at very least 60% killrate. That is because you need to have at least 65% killrate with killer to even be at red rank for rank 1 killer. I am rank 1 killer every season and I have already probably climbed with many killers to rank 1. So by your logic, I already far surpassed your criteria. It takes like 2 days for me to go from rank 5 to rank 1 with killer while playing more than just one killer though like everyone, I do have my favorites.
"Blight without addons isnt really good enough to win against a decent team."
Do you even play blight at red ranks? Blight has one of strongest base-kits in the game. All kilers have some reliance on add-ons vs strong teams. I know many players say Alchemist ring is strong add-on and I do not disagree, it is good add-on however I would say it is somewhat overrated.
The reason why I think its overrated add-on has to do with the fact that in order for this add-on to be relevant, you need hit survivors that healthy as this add-on reset your blight tokens on successful hit. If the survivor is injured and you hit them, than your next motive as killer is to hook the survivor and the tokens will refresh as you hook them. So unless your slugging to blight, it is not that remarkable. The other aspect of this add-on that is not too impressive is that when you hit a survivor that is healthy, they gain sprint burst and you get fatique as blight which gives survivor a lot of distance. Blight is all about calculating angles and being unpredictable for when he will activate his blight charge. This add-on often makes you a very predictable blight player as you are incentivized to immediately activate the blight rush ability and this end up being really bad as distanced gained+fatique gives survivors plenty of distance to find rounded objects to hide behind. Not into too much detail, but thick rounded objects very bad for blight because blight does not rotate these objects very well compared to the survivor as he has to bump into objects to rotate them and paired with his restricted lunge and turning, it makes his power ineffective. I refer to this as dead angling blight's lethal rush.
There you go, here is small 101 lession for how to counter blight's ability.
"Addons are literally always a form of reducing drawbacks with that logic. You cannot bounce knives without addons, that is a drawback. You need to wait 10 seconds to have access to all your tokens without Alchemist Ring, that's a drawback."
Not necessarily. Many of them tend to unlock new abilities or improve statistics of a killer. Let look at blight add-on list compared to trickster add-on list
Blight add ons:
Blighted Crow and Blighted Rat increase blight's movement speed in his rush(Improves statistics). Vigo's Journal gives blight undetectable in blighted rush. Compound Twenty-One unlocks the ability for slams to give aura reading in 8 meter diameter. Compound 33 unlocks hindered effect on slams and allows slam to break pallets relatively quickly. These are all examples of unlocking good special abilities.
Does blight need these abilities to be successful? No. Do they make him better if he uses them? Of course.
Trickster:
Many of tricksters add-on feel like they are mandatory. 44 knives is not enough for trickster to take down 4 health states assuming the survivor is not complete potato at running into knives. Bloody Boa add-on barely enough knives to be passable to have passable 52 knifes. Trickster is very power reliant killer. Needing to reload at lockers is really damaging in term of time efficiency. Fizz Soda and Ji-Woons Autograph are only add-on that improve him statistically, but the faster throwing rate also makes you run out of knives faster and with 44 knives, that really is not good. Trick blade is gimmick, just shoot at the survivor. There is no extra reward for landing fancy shots compare to normal shots. The other add-on are like Ripper Brace(Why is Laceration decay even a thing), Waiting for you watch(Not sure why I would need a longer trash event) and other irrelevant effects.
They even manage to successfully weaken Cut through+Album(Exploding knives) from Trickster S-tier, Better than Nurse video. Hope it was worth views. Trickster is good example of.... very bad base-kit with really dumb add-on design.
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"You are literally saying Huntress, who needs 2 seconds to charge per hatchet, and then another 2 seconds of cooldown per hatchet, aka 4 seconds per damage state, is better at slugging with Infectious Fright than Trickster, who has access to an ability that gives him infinite ammo for the next 10 seconds, can get a damage state every 1.7 seconds at max throwrate, meaning he can down someone before their post-damage haste effect is gone?"
Now we can finally talk about good stuff. First of all, your claims are highly exaggerated. Going back to the top where you were talking about exploit hold-W vs slow killers. The reason why huntress is not affected as much as trickster is that she requires lower windows of opporunity to release hatchets to deal full health state of damage. If we're talking about fully charged hatchets, it takes like 2 seconds charge and perhaps somewhere between 1-2 seconds to aim. so on average, it takes like 4 seconds for huntress to take a shot which has realistic chances to eat full health state. Trickster has to raise his knives and than volley many knives, it takes 6 knives to injure and realistically speaking, as long as survivor is not predictable, you will throw a lot more than 6 knives. Let's say on average it takes 12-15 knives to injure. 12 knives is 50% accuracy. that is like.... 2.5 huntress hatchets/5. to round off, lets say it is 3. Throwing 12 knives is a lot longer than 1.6 seconds. its more like 10 seconds. 10 seconds is a lot of time in term of distance for survivor in a chase. as we said, no matter how good your aim is, you cannot shoot through walls. This is why trickster is not very good. He needs large windows of opportunity to injure survivors between loops and his tileset game is just not good at all.
Ideally speaking, As long as survivor is in good positions to loop trickster, trickster chases are long. he should not be good at slugging if the survivor play well. Huntress slugging potential comes from her low recovery on m2->m1 and large ammo capacity to potentially get a lot of injures before needing to reload. She is also pretty good at keeping survivors on the floor. For example, if a survivor is at 95% recovery and an injured survivor comes to pick them up, she can throw hatchets to down one of the two survivors. Huntress and Deathslinger need very low windows of opportunity to get an injure and this makes them really good at loops. Trickster is poor at strong tilesets like jungle gym, thus has very poor chase game. as result he has poor 1vs1 game. When you have trouble downing individual survivors, your unlikely to ever be in positions where you can slug.
It is not about liking or dislike play-style. Trickster is just ineffective vs players that can play well survivor. there is not much else to say. I doubt he will really improve and he is probably going to stay as a joke as feedback that dev keep getting is "he is anti-fun" and so on. They take this feedback as "He is in good position/too strong" from casual/really bad survivors so he is not moving anywhere any time soon. He is going to be new F-tier similar to old freddy though in my opinion, significantly worse than him.
Bare in mind, I can 4k with trickster at red ranks but you need to be facing really clueless survivors to really be winning with him.
Hope my post tried to answer as many points as possible.
"Sorry, getting hit is a mistake in this game."
False, I could 100% make 0 mistakes and still be hit. Heck, I can make 0 mistakes all game, and still be hit multiple times. Getting hit isnt making a mistake. Getting hit is inevitable. The time you take the hit is where it's a mistake or not. I could hold W with 0 usable windows and pallets, and still be downed. The matter of fact is whether it took me 10 seconds to be downed, or 60 seconds. If me taking the hit EXTENDS the chase by another 40 seconds compared to the moment of me not taking the hit, how is taking the hit a mistake? Hits are inevitable. They are not mistakes.
"Holding......game."
You could have literally written nothing here as you read it wrong. What I mentioned is nerfing W for survivors, would mean buffing genspeeds for survivors too. Which I think would end up in a worse scenario. Sure, you would be able to end loops quicker with killers that are slower of have powers that arent really useful during loops, but since loops across the board would be shorter, generators would need to be faster. Gen slowdown perks would need to be compensated for that too. You would essentially just nerf the killers who dont allow you to chain loops anyway, rather than buff the killers who have issues with chaining loops.
"What if you do? do you just accepting losing because the killer is ineffective?"
Just as much as you simply have to accept a loss on a camping, tunneling killer when you play survivor. Yeah. You cant solve the problems on one side, without also finding a solution for problems on the other side. You're meant to have games where survivors are utterly destroying your ass, just as you're meant to have games where you are able to kill everyone before a single generator has even been partially fixed. You are meant to have games where you're getting genrushed like a #########, while also having games where you're getting tunneled like a #########. Untill solo survivors are buffed to match the average skill potential of SWF's, you cant really change these situations.
"That is because you need to have at least 65% killrate with killer to even be at red rank for rank 1 killer."
Not really though. You can kill only 1 survivor and remain rank 1. You can only kill 2 survivors every single match and reach rank 1 within 1 day after rank reset.
"Do you even play blight at red ranks?"
Yes, I do, and I specifically said decent teams. Just because individually survivors are good, doesnt mean they are a decent team. You cant go addonless against a decent team.
"your next motive as killer is to hook the survivor and the tokens will refresh as you hook them. So unless your slugging to blight, it is not that remarkable."
Other motives:
- Ruin is still up and Tinkerer goes off. 5 stacks prevents that gen from being finished.
- You still have Pop and Tinkerer just popped
- Tinkerer just Popped
- You see another injured survivor.
- You see someone visibly work on a generator and want to spook them off before hooking, if you hit them with a rush too, you can rush back before anyone picks them up.
It's a very powerful addon, it only fails when there is absolutely no oppertunity in using it. Let alone that it's incredibly powerful within a chase itself. Any addon that can shorten a chase significantly, cannot be called "overrated". Especially the fact that it refills ALL your stacks. I think the addon would be fine if it just refunded the tokens you have used to land that hit minus the one that caused you to land the hit.
"Blighted Crow and Blighted Rat increase blight's movement speed in his rush(Improves statistics)."
Since I was talking about drawbacks, let me be even clearer: you DONT increase speed with every rush, that's a drawback. These addons remove that drawback.
"Vigo's Journal gives blight undetectable in blighted rush." You DONT have undetectability during a rush, that's a drawback. Seriously, you having a terror radius is a drawback.
"44 knives is not enough for trickster to take down 4 health states assuming the survivor is not complete potato at running into knives."
5 hatchets is not enough for Huntress to take down 4 health states assuming the survivor is not a complete potato. Let alone that Huntress does not have an ability that allows her to throw an unlimited amount of hatchets at an increased speed for quite some time. Nor does Huntress have any addons that reload her hatchets.
"There is no extra reward for landing fancy shots compare to normal shots."
Except, that there is. It allows you to land shots that you normally wouldnt have hit. Even if one of those knives miss, it could still hit the survivor after the bounce. You effectively miss less, have a larger radius where you can land a knive and it still hits the survivor, let alone that since you hit more often where you would normally miss, you also have much less issues with lacaration decay.
"Why is Laceration decay even a thing" "Not sure why I would need a longer trash event" And this shows your pure lack of understanding of Tricksters powers.
If Laceration was not a thing, Trickster would be capable of downing survivors insanely fast, which is also why the 2 addons in the Trickster S-tier video were nerfed. Main Event being longer means you're being able to down people faster. Sure, this sucks if you're alone, which is why you can cancel the ability prematurely if needed, but if you have multiple survivors surrounding you, any added second to main event can be the difference between another down. Trickster is more powerful than many killers, in situations that are not that uncommon. The problem is, if those situations do not occur, Trickster isnt that good. Trickster is like a bazooka, aim at the right target, and you deal massive destruction to the opponent. Aim at the wrong target, and while you deal a lot of potential damage, your opponent wouldnt really be fazed by it. Where other killers are more like regular guns, where as long as you aim at your opponent, you would deal damage, even if you ended up missing a few times.
So ofcourse, if you try to use them in the same way, they wont have the same effect.
"First of all, your claims are highly exaggerated."
No, they were not, Huntress basekit takes 4 seconds per throw, 3.5 if survivors are close enough that hatchet speed doesnt matter a bit. Trickster can literally deal 1 health state per 1.7 seconds with Main Event. Sure, it has to be quite optimal positioning, but that's not exaggeration in the slightest way.
"If we're talking about fully charged hatchets, it takes like 2 seconds charge and perhaps somewhere between 1-2 seconds to aim. so on average, it takes like 4 seconds for huntress to take a shot which has realistic chances to eat full health state." I was also taking in consideration that you have a cooldown between hatchet throws, which is also 2 seconds. So if you were to throw 2 hatchets in quick succession, you need to wait 1.5 seconds before it can be thrown, 2.something seconds before it's fully charged. You can aim while charging, so I rounded the number to 2. THEN you have to wait 2 seconds before you can start charging your other hatchet. From that moment on, it's 4 seconds per health state as you cycle between 2 second cooldown and 2 second charge/aim time.
"Trickster has to raise his knives and than volley many knives, it takes 6 knives to injure and realistically speaking, as long as survivor is not predictable, you will throw a lot more than 6 knives." Once again having to point out that you're not really playing Trickster properly if you start throwing many, many knives whenever you see a survivor. Lacaration takes quite a bit of time before it starts to decay, you can easily pop one knife and continue a chase normally, rather than spamming knives as soon as you see a survivor and hope for the best. On average, you might be throwing about 7-8 knives per health state, especially since you can land 4-5 knives per fast vault. Sure, Huntress might have taken a state of damage there regardless, but here's the quick difference: Even though the survivor isnt fully injured, they have to leave that loop if they want to reach the next structure alive. They have to act like they did get injured, otherwise they will get injured in a position that they dont want to be injured at. Take the killer shack for example, if the pallet is already gone and you take 4 knives at the window, you cant stay at the killer shack, because Trickster would be able to damage you inside the shack while adding on some extra knives. So you're forced to go to the next structure ASAP, at which point, you'll still be injured as you run out in the open AND take a few knives on top of that, meaning that the next window vault, you're down. Just like you would be against a Huntress. On top of that, you have an ability that you can use to mass slug, which you can use near an unhook to essentially down 2 people REGARDLESS of BT, something Huntress is incapable off AND being able to chain that ability to anyone else who dares enter your region. There is quite a good reason why people tend to call Trickster a better Huntress. You could theoretically play him like Huntress and you would perform similar, but there are plays Trickster can make that Huntress is fully unable of pulling off.
Trickster is the Bubba of ranged killers.
"as we said, no matter how good your aim is, you cannot shoot through walls"
You cannot shoot through solid walls. Any shot a Deathslinger can make, a Trickster can too. That includes shots that are impossible for Huntress. Meaning, once again, that you can down survivors in positions a Huntress can only dare to dream off.
"As long as survivor is in good positions to loop trickster, trickster chases are long. he should not be good at slugging if the survivor play well."
Same could be said for Huntress though. Although I would prefer to say "as long as survivors are better at positioning than huntress/trickster, chases are long".
"For example, if a survivor is at 95% recovery and an injured survivor comes to pick them up, she can throw hatchets to down one of the two survivors."
One of the few examples where Huntress outshines Trickster: very long range. But even in that scenario, if Trickster sees them running towards that survivor and he has access to Main Event? Pretty much same results, at least downing the injured survivor, trading the slug for a slug. Unless the visual distance between survivors and line of sight breakers is very narrow.
"Huntress and Deathslinger need very low windows of opportunity to get an injure and this makes them really good at loops." Not really though, Deathslinger needs to be able to draw in the survivor within hitting range, otherwise he literally cannot down them, and Huntress needs either an animation or an otherwise guaranteed hit with her M1 to lower the bar for a hit. But Trickster can hit survivors that Huntress cant. Meaning an unsafe loop, a survivor can crouch and never be hit vs a Huntress. A Trickster, and you would need to fully break line of sight.
"Trickster is poor at strong tilesets like jungle gym"
I agree, so is Huntress though. But luckily for them, there are at most 3 on a map, and they dont spawn close to each other. Any other tileset, and Trickster outperforms quite heavily. The Clown trailer on Father Campbell? Huntress cant land a hit there after 5 loops, Trickster can get one before his 3rd loop. Mount Ormond? Trickster can shoot between the railings, Huntress cant(same for Dead Dawg Saloon). T&L walls is where I would say Trickster and Huntress differ the most, since, if a survivor takes damage while entering the tile, Huntress can deal with them quite quickly, where if a survivor takes 4-5 knives while entering the loop, Trickster will take a longer time. But on average? The only benefit on Huntress is that she's infinitely better at landing hits that are further away than 20 meters.
"They take this feedback as "He is in good position/too strong" from casual/really bad survivors so he is not moving anywhere any time soon."
Except that it's not casual or really bad survivors complaining about his powerset. It's the mere fact that survivors dont have any ways of communicating without the use of a 3rd party program. And even then, Trickster is much better at gaining hooks than Huntress is.
"He is going to be new F-tier similar to old freddy though in my opinion, significantly worse than him."
Old Freddy was F-Tier based on the meta and map design that existed back then. Loops were much more powerful, gen regression perks werent that good in high tier and overall map tiles that were strong spawned quite close. Put Old Freddy in today's game, with maybe a few tweaks to his addons, and he'd be more than fine. Information on where survivors were back in the day didnt really matter as much, since you needed more than just your M1 to quickly gain hooks. Nowadays? Information is powerful enough to play almost any killer as an m1 only killer, even at rank 1. I've played M1 only Doctor, no shocks, no blast, just M1, and I won against rank 1 survivors. I've played M1 only myers(which, to be fair, is just T1 myers but without aura reading) and won. Old Freddy in today's meta isnt S-Tier, but he's far from being F-tier.
"Bare in mind, I can 4k with trickster at red ranks but you need to be facing really clueless survivors to really be winning with him."
I mean, I can 4k with any killer I suck at if I am facing clueless survivors. That doesnt mean those killers suck, it simply means I dont understand how to use the killer's power in my favor. Myers is by far the weakest killer at the moment.
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@IronKnight55 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2417692#Comment_2417692
And? Push them out. It doesn't matter.
Ah yes, spending up to 1,5 minutes just to reach the right gate, only for survivors to leave without taking any hits. Sure, doesnt matter if that happens 70% of the time.
It does matter, people should just ######### leave.
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@TwitchyMike said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2417234#Comment_2417234
Well that problem is it's not an M1 attack because it isn't considered a special attack. It literally doesn't count as an M1 attack and can't synergize with any M1 perks. Now that I know it's not a M1 attack I am satisfied with this discussion. Now it's just a matter of realizing different ways to play as her.
I suggest watching Scorpionz guide on Pig. He teaches you clever mechanics that you can use in beneficial ways that dont really require too much skill to replicate succesfully. You can ignore his bouncing mechanics he explains later in the video. Essentially, Pig has a few mechanics that you'll only realize when you play survivor against Pig. Knowing those mechanics will make her a lot easier to play as, without needing to be a high rank killer.
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@TwitchyMike said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2410547#Comment_2410547
Okay I can actually see that. I can use my ambush attack on the obsession and not lose stacks. Interesting... I think it should still apply the mangled or broken status effect. You bring up some good points. Ya maybe rework her traps.
Oh, you can add mangled on hats if need be, as a Pig you dont really want to leave a chase unless its absolutely horrendous to chase them, and there are 3 other survivors you can still apply sloppy butcher on(let alone that hitting them with sloppy and 8 stacks of STBFL makes hitting multiple survivors quite easy).
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@Devil_hit11 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2410522#Comment_2410522
what the heck. no. speed limiter is bubba is a meme. Bubba needs an instant-down for his time efficiency in chase. Every second for killer counts and needing 2 hits means that a survivor can tank hit, speed boost to the pallet and than bubba chainsaw has to break it. that extend chases by 30+ seconds. Billy with Lopro chains has speed limiter when he breaks a pallet and billy is so bad now in general.
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Bubba has counters. you need understand how much each chainsaw sweep goes with normal, yellow chili, purple chili and yellow+purple chili with regards to distance. Once you understand this, you can greed pallets to maximize bubba token cooldown. It will allow you to conserve pallets and it maximizes your chances of making bubba make a mistake at bumping into objects for pallet loops.
Windows are hard counter to bubba as his chainsaw cannot go through them, however 99% of bubba who are good will use bamboozle. Bamboozle is countered by chaining two window tilesets. You need to make predictions for when Bubba will vault windows so that you can understand when to move next tile. Really good bubba can estimate distances between loops and will sometimes chainsaw 10-14 meters away so that when they're on 3rd token, they instant down you from a far. The way to counter this is that Bubba moves faster when you are walking in straight line, but bubba lose distance if he has to curve jagged objects like curved rocks as survivor can hug curved objects better than bubba can. This has to do with bubba chainsaw hitbox being huge and survivor model hitbox being small. Watch out for bubba switching directions when loop tightly around an small object. You can make Bubba waste all of 3 of his tokens which gives lengthy cooldown if he does not hit you to move to next loops.
Lastly, if your in deadzone, it is possible to jump into a locker and jump out safely if Bubba tantrums into a locker. there are 3 timings to escaping a locker. charge 1, 2 and 3. It is better if you can jump into lockers from further away as you can eliminate charge 1 and only work on learning Charging 2 and Charge 3. Jane's Head-on perk can skip exact timing to jumping out.
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@Predated Your post is classic "Nerf killer post" so I can escape survivor post. With speed limiter, You wouldn't need to learn anything against playing Bubba and because 75% of playerbase survivor playerbase puts zero effort into learning to play against Bubba, He ends up having 75% kill rate. Its not that killers are unfair/too strong, its that survivor put no effort in learning to play against them and ask for silly "base-kit Speed-limiter leatherface change plz".
Except that a lot of people in higher ranks agree that speed limiter bubba isnt really that much of a meme. He can hit you twice before you can reach the next loop because of his speed boost. You can actually use his chainsaw to gain distance. People tend to forget that.
"Lastly, if your in deadzone, it is possible to jump into a locker and jump out safely if Bubba tantrums into a locker."
Deadzones dont have lockers, and you cant jump out safely if Bubba tantrums as he continuously sweeps and deals damage faster than the locker exit animation lasts. You can only jump out after his final sweep has finished and that jump has to be nearly frame perfect to not be a grab(desync is a thing).
And no, it's not classic nerf killers. They overbuffed Bubba slightly.
As for "learn to play against bubba", 95% of the killers that are being picked are not bubba, meaning you simply will not have enough time to learn to play against a bubba specifically, as there is quite a significant chance you wont encounter a bubba for literal weeks.
Dont act as if Bubba is a very common killer to face.
And again, base-kit speed limiter on bubba makes sense, he sweeps multiple times anyway. You could easily compensate by increasing his movementspeed OR add another charge OR increase the speed of regaining charges to compensate.
I've been playing this game for a very long time, buffing old bubba by giving him speedlimiter as basekit while giving current values has been a very common request, because being able to hit multiple survivors twice was so much better than barely being able to hit 1 survivor once unless you facecamped.
Seriously, why does bubba NEED an instadown for efficiency in chase? We have tons of killers that dont have an ability to get rid of a pallet in 1 second that are doing just fine. Bubba is better at what Pig can do. So as a counter argument of "With speed limiter, You wouldn't need to learn anything against playing Bubba" My argument would become: With speedlimiter, you would need to be able to mindgame a survivor into a certain position to reach them before they initiate a vault(as you can hit a survivor twice within 1 window vault animation and you'd be hitting a survivor on the pallet while also breaking the pallet rather than downing them and breaking the pallet).
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@Orion said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2410525#Comment_2410525
Forcing a player to depip used to be bannable when survivors did it to killers, but it's never been bannable as a killer to survivors.
That has never been bannable, period.
Stop filing false reports, you're just clogging up the system and making it worse.
Oh really? So the people banned in 2016-2017 for creating depip squads were all imagination? Yes, it used to be bannable as they considered it an exploit, even though none of the mechanics they used were considered exploits. But they didnt really have permabans for quite some time.
How could you call a window infinite an exploit when it's used to depip killers, but not when it's used for your own survival? The difference was the intent on depipping the opponent on purpose.
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@Junylar said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2410525#Comment_2410525
"Forcing a player to depip used to be bannable when survivors did it to killers"
Care to elaborate?
Well, waaaaaay back in 2016-2017, it was possible for survivors to do 5 gens while literally never being downed(and thus not being able to be mori'd). If there was no mori, 1 survivor would run Saboteur and destroy all the hooks permanently while others did gens.
Back in these days, safety pips didnt exist. So it was literally a scenario where it was impossible for the killer to gain a pip, and thus the term "depip squad" was created and gained some popularity. This led to a time where players were banned for playing purely to depip killers(the most infamous player being Ochido, he is pretty much the embodiment of toxicity when it comes to dead by daylight with the reasoning "if I can do it, I am going to do it, and I shouldnt be banned for it, because the devs allow me to do it", he was banned another time for abusing the infinite mending glitch on Legion and complained about it).
Yet they never banned killers who facecamped, even though they would literally force a survivor to depip. It's been my biggest issue I have had with the devs, and the biggest example I use whenever people say "the devs dont care about killers", as the majority of 2016-2018 was all about nerfing survivors. Killers didnt really start recieving game changing nerfs untill 2018. Killer nerfs untill then were always mechanics that were similar to broken survivor mechanics(aka, Mori's were changed with BNP, Iron Grasp+Agitaion were nerfed after DS and Sabo were (somewhat) nerfed).
DBD has had a long history, and people tend to forget that window blockers have been one of the biggest survivor nerfs added to the game.
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@Junylar said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2410522#Comment_2410522
He is not powerful. He is one of the weakest killers in the game. Just two SWF survivors with purple flashlights can make him miserable.
Bubba one of the weakest? Hah, sure. That's why rank 1 Bubba mains have a 80%+ kill rate. Bubba is easily high A tier.
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@woundcowboy said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2387023#Comment_2387023
The problem is, his 1v1 is still weak. Unless you happen to be out in the open or at a small loop, his power is almost worthless. There are far more strong structures and buildings than there are open areas and small loops.
Depends on the map, but yeah, his chase is weak. That's not where Trickster thrives though. Trickster thrives in using 1 down to slug multiple people and then hook everyone who he downed, reload and repeat. It's why I think Distressing and Infectious Fright are actually quite good on Trickster, especially with Death Throes and pretty much any other addon, as you'd essentially could chain multiple main events in a very short time.
His 1v1 is made stronger than it was, while it also made his mass slugging potential a lot more powerful.
Is he the most amazing killer of all? No, but if we're speaking objectively, I'd easily call him an upper-mid B-tier killer, if not low A-Tier.
As for maps, that is a more universal issue among all killers and even survivors. I mean, what are you going to do as a solo survivor against a Blight with Alchemist Ring Tinkerer, Ruin, Undying and Pop on Blood Lodge? It doesnt offer enough counterplay to make a 3 man escape possible unless its a bad Blight. Considering the dev's intention is to make a 4-man escape possible against all killers, just as likely as a 4k with 4-5 gens left it's a bit odd to have Blight performing so well on Blood Lodge. Maps need to be based on killer seeds, giving structures that can be used effectively for and against a specific killer, rather than giving the same resources to all killers equally.
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@Gnarly said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2393390#Comment_2393390
I didn't mind them being reworked, but they changed many of the faces drastically and made them worse.
ADJUSTED is terrible term to use because I never asked for a Feng, Kate, or David to be fixed. They were fine before. My reasons for purchasing cosemtics was because they looked good on the character BEFORE. Now they don't.
Give me the old face as an option even. David objectively is far worse, along with Kate. Not to mention they changed facial hair itself and not the cosemtics individually. That's my main issue.
THEY DIDN'T TOUCH THE COSMETICS, THEY CHANGED THINGS AROUND THEM THAT RUINED THEM.
My points still stand though. You're free to complain, but you're in no position to demand.
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@IronKnight55 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2393452#Comment_2393452
Because it doesn't matter? Push them out.
Because it DOES matter. If you are doing totems, you're still at risk of being downed before escaping. If you're just sticking in the exit gate, not planning on doing anything at all even if all your teammates have escaped, that is what matters.
I gladly accept survivors to stick around if they plan on doing totems, if they plan on healing up to go for a hatch escape. But that is not where this thread is about, it's about players who, fully healthy, wait on top of the line, even if you're across the entire map untill you walked all the way over to their gate, and that's often not even good enough, as they will wait untill you can physically touch them to leave.
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@fogdonkey said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2393436#Comment_2393436
It is good that you have plans.
I am a bit skeptical about the part of becoming famous to give motivation to the devs. There are already famous streamers in the community, and the devs don't really care about their opinions or suggestions.
But the thing is, right now, you have a single community trying to convince the devs to improve it, while having a lot of players that are like "its fine as it is". No current content creator really has a changing view when BP would be improved, other than praise. Having a content creator with a certain reward if it ever would be changed, would make it a monumental change, even though it's something very minor.
It's something the devs can use to brag about, it's something BHVR could use for their own benefit. That is the difference between the opinion of a famous streamer and having a community wide known moment. What benefit is there for BHVR PR if they listen to an opinion, other than just free PR for the streamer?