NerfDHalready
NerfDHalready
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@Spare_Them_Mori_Me said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3618225#Comment_3618225
Source for that 5%? Ridiculous lol. Its much closer to 7.5% :P
FTP would have no real combos if it didn't proc as a heal. Is it good enough on its own? Probably.
Buckle up, on the other hand, is pretty useless without some luck. With something like FTp, it turns it into a shotgun BAM of a powerplay. Takes a good bit of time and situational awareness to pull off. But no reason to bring that up, yeah?
Tunneling was brought into the mix due to it being the biggest issue survivor side.
So, killer can powerplay out the gate. Survivors have a powerplay that requires things to go just right.
I dunno, but lets keep this going.
do we need a source? i'd say any number between 1 and 99 and it would be more reasonable than saying 100%, which is what you are claiming.
the only perk combo with ftp is wglf so it wouldn't lose much. i'd actually like it's not nerfed and niche future combos aren't already dead but ftp buckle up needs to go.
buckle up is bad on its own? no. that's an anti slug perk and doing its job very well. it's not (shouldn't be) an anti-down perk that can downright undo someone going down ENTIRELY. what the hell is an anti-down perk and how does that sound reasonable, anyway?
i agree with tunneling but that has nothing to do with the combo. they are irrelevant and should be handled independently. that's pretty much like saying survivors should have anything until they can completely prevent a killer from tunneling and there is no limit to that. hey buff boil over so it lets survivors wiggle in 1 second, because killers are tunneling! like huh?
the combo doesn't need things to go right. killer either leaves their injured target for a healthy one (assuming they are aware of the person hovering) or suck it up. it's that simple and free.
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@appleas said:
No idea why a discussion about Buckle up + FTP gets sidetracked into tunneling.
This combo is dead hard in another form. Instead of the chased Survivor pressing E, someone else does it for them.
While it means that two people are off gens (Chased Survivor and FTP Survivor), it also extends the time taken to get that first hook which also affects the time taken to get that second hook and so on.
Either the amount of uses FTP gets has to be limited (One use after unhooking someone or being unhooked) or the Broken Status effect duration has to be increased.
Alternatively the endurance effect duration from Buckle up could be reduced but I guess people would cry foul if it went through
some people claim (yes multiple) and defend this combo as an anti tunnel thing therefore justified so we are trying to explain how no more than 5% of uses of the perk is to actually prevent a tunnel. idk why either, they are very irrelevant topics.
i really would like that they won't kill ftp's combo potential with other perks (only wglf currently, which is earned and fair imo) but they can make it so ftp isn't counted as a heal for perk purposes. can't think of a more reasonable solution other than nerfing buckle up, but i also think buckle up isn't problematic by itself, so.
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@LordGlint said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3618166#Comment_3618166
I honestly WISH they do something crazy. Turn off the survivor hitbox until they do conspicuous action. You'd have survivors complain they can't take hits for their unhooker. They'd call it a DS nerf.
will be off topic but my go to tunnelling solution would be something just as crazy, 20 seconds of complete invisibility and silence with no collision. oh and that definitely has a potential to be called a survivor/basekit bt nerf, i know dbd community well enough.
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@LordGlint said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3618158#Comment_3618158
Nothing short of godmode will make it impossible to tunnel, which was my point. The idea that as long as the killer has free agency to down his opponents, you should get any amount of OP stuff to do everything better and claim it as "countering tunneling" is asinine.
i wanted to partake in the discussion but you already are saying anything and everything needed to be said, so i'm showing my support and appreciation o7
also i couldn't handle that argument without coming out as (actually, being legit) condescending so extra props to you. cheating is also fine because of tunneling yeah.
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because she is your everyday swf clown, unfortunately. she preys on survivor mistakes, and that's not all that abundant on high levels and comms destroy her just like trapper.
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unless survivors are unable to use ftp on people not unhooked within the last 1 minute, this combo has nothing to do with tunnelling. hey let's bring back og ds where people can use it on their very first down. b-but it helps with tunnelling! let's bring locker saves while we are at it as well, people can use it to combat tunnelling, right? mft as well, a tunnel target should run faster.
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@BlightedDolphin said:
Tap the attack button rather than lunge when they spin and the auto aim will hit them for you. Lunging can make the attack end earlier than intended.
assuming this is in response to my comment, it doesn't happen when people spin but rather when they "wiggle". rarely happens though.
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@Mr_K said:
No and aim assist only screws you when near objects. Survivors spinning is taking advantage of killer piss poor FoV. If a survivor spins you thats a skill issue. Try not lunging an taping M1 instead, turn with the survivor, or wait out the spin then hit them.
sometimes auto aim makes me short swing for some reason.
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@GannTM said:
*Laughs in sniping Artist*
also meanwhile me shooting crows as soon as they come off cd in chases. it carries zoning to a whole next level.
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what is she even doing, trying to teach you to slug for 4k in your next matches? i got a headache watching and hearing this.
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idk how those easiest fixes for objectively broken **** take AGES. we had to endure mft for 5 months, we'll have uw for more than 4 months and ftp bu isn't even on the roadmap. just funny.
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um, no. peep oni, blight and wesker. even saying huntress, nemesis and demo wouldn't be a stretch.
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it's undeniably atrocious and op with ftp and hopefully gets the hammer soon, but unlike many people, i honestly think it by itself is fine. though, it's basically an infusion of wglf and mft so it completely powercrept both perks, that's the only issue with it. either those perks or bu needs attention to solve this issue, independently from the disgusting combo.
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@Xernoton said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3616963#Comment_3616963
Why would that be a problem? They waste a perk slot and then don't use their power when they should, which wastes a lot of time because M2 attacks can get hits much easier than M1s.
Are you going to tell me, that a killer nerfing themself is too oppressive?
doesn't an m2 killer getting save value mean they basically become an m1 killer, and why is that an issue? since when m1 killers are an issue? i don't understand this argument please someone enlighten me.
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it's the second strongest survivor map after garden of trash. it has countless pallets on very strong loops, whopping 4 buildings for some unknown reason so you can run onis blights and billy's there and do outside gens in safety against stealthy killers so it's no-killer-sided. awful maps still favor certain killers while screwing over others (like garden is still better than rpd or lery's for singu/huntress etc while it's vice versa for stealth killers), but badham is dogwater for the whole roster for this reason.
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@UndeddJester said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3616855#Comment_3616855
It's... one of those things where I understand from a gameplay point of view that Basement is pretty abusable and can create very 1 sided scenarios that allow the killer to play really nasty and be borderline uncounterably unfair.
However... in the same breathe it is a classic trope of horror... and it does carry the fear that it should... and the core idea I think is really cool, and something that definitely should be in the game... I personally would have done it differently, but I think BHVRs iteration does fit the bill of a dangerous and scary place... if that makes sense?
If it were me, I'd try and improve basement for counter play and more potential scares. In case you were interested:
If it were me... (and this is kinda riffing off my head), if I take the current version of basement I'd make it have something like a connecting narrow corridor to a second entrance with an auto locking doorway that the killer can use freely, but survivors have to unlock (lockpick style, but similar timing to an exit gate).
This second entrance can be opened by survivors but this has an noise alert upon opening, and a time limit that it stays opened for... say 30 seconds? The path would take say 12 seconds to traverse, have no pallets or any slow down. Once locked, the door cannot be opened for 2 minutes. So if the killer guesses you, and moves to intercept, or any other delay on unhooking, and you might get trapped in basement.
Would offer an alternative and hopefully nail baiting escape attempts before the basement door locks and leaves you trapped in with the killer.
https://us.v-cdn.net/6030815/uploads/SA4SY4F6FXEZ/sketch-1703634713815.png
^ Something like this ^
That would be how I would do it, and this would be the route I'd go instead of basement removal... obviously this is too much a map overhaul to suggest, but I like the idea.
i fully agree it contributes a lot to game's atmosphere and theme, and that's the only sensible reasoning behind it's existence because it's awfully unbalanced. 2 entrances to it and hills would be my solution too, it would solve a bunch of its problems like body blocking the stairs, especially as twins or trapper and killers expecting rescuers to come from one way and camping it.
about the spoiler, it would actually lead to lots of clutch moments, but basekit bt would need to last a lot longer for basement rescuees if they'll need to traverse that long of a path. or going into that hallway could prolong the effect. i'd also change the door logic in favor of survivors and not make that path too narrow.
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@OwlWithMustache said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3617037#Comment_3617037
I'm not criticizing the list, I'm saying that your entire argument doesn't even exist, that's how bad it is. Clearly you wanted people to share their opinions, kinda seems like you're getting defensive rather than discussing now that you realize your thread didn't turn into the circlejerk you wanted
not every discussion here has to be the most valuable balance argument devs should take into account, chill. even if they wanted to hear others' opinions about said killers, what about it?
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@xEa said:
Recently i had an interesting conversation with a former DBD streamer (Demogorgon main, Survivor main) and we had a long talk why he left the game. It basically came down to the following statement, and i realised it is completly true:
"Since Blight release in September 2020, so over 3 years ago, the killer design became worse and worse, with almost no exception."
Lets take a look at the roster:
Twins: Nobody plays the twins, and almost everybody hates them. The gameplay revolves around slugging and camping, usually something a killer wont enjoy, neither do survivors. Desperatly needs a rework.
Trickster: Extremly hated and not played much either. An extremly one-dimensional little counterplay chase killer. Not much thought into this one. The rework made him not better, for neither side.
Nemsis: Not loved either. For many a boring loose/loose killer. Very uninspired power. His wip is still buged in many ways (for example crouch tech).
Pinhead: Probably more in the okay category, they added some stuff that makes this killer a little bit interesting. Overall still a strange fella, that has little chance against strong groups but easy wins versus solo players.
Artist: Arguably one of the dumbest killers ever released. The beginning of the "leave the loop or get hit" killers. Very bad design overall. And also not many who enjoy this killer.
Onryo: The pub stomper. Cool license but overall a power weaker players can not handle well. Not bad for me personally but i can see why people dont like her. Overall an interesting concept, but wasted potential.
Dredge: Poor Dredge. Sounds so good on paper, but this killer plays.. how do i say this.. clumsy? Not to bad tho, but it could have been so much better. At leasted they nailed the "spooky" aspect.
Wesker: The radiant star and the only really great killer BHVR designed in over 3 years. Sure, not everybody loves him, but in terms of chase, he is the by far most interesting and most fair killer to play against since a long time. And he is super fun to play, easy to learn, hard to master. Everything i could wish for good killer design.
The Knight: L o L.
Skull Merchant: DC DC DC DC. Rework made a terrible designed killer even worse. How is this even possible?
Singularity: Overall interesting and fine. Cool design, but so much effort for the little you get back as killer. Yet, another survivor defense killer. I dont hate him, not at all, but still most downs feel way to RNG based and cheap.
Alien: Loose/loose killer. Nobody wants that really.
Chucky: Great potential, but so far we are miles away from a great killer. Most dont like Chucky because he is in most situations unfair. Many killer complain they dont like the power CD. Understandable somewhat.
Most killers i named have one thing in common: Little to no chase interaction. Looping/Unique pathing is often not possible and it is more effective to just brainless drop the pallet, run away and hope Capitno RNG is in your favour.
I want to see good killer design and less failed experiements. I beg for more killers that fullfill the golden standard. Powerful, but fair. In case you wonder: Billy, Blight, Wesker, Demogorgon, Huntress and Bubba are great examples. They are strong, potentially stronger then most unfun killers and still loved. Why cant we have more of them instead gettign flooded with crap?
The opposite of this golden standard are the recent ones i named: Artist, Knight, Alien, Skull Merchant for example. Stop pumping out more and more of those and find your way back to the roots. I beg you.
agree except nemesis, crouching is fine even if it's considered a feature, decent balanced counterplay. his sound bug needs a fix though where he silently pulls out his power. in my personal experience and perception, artist and knight are also fine-ish. i used to hate knight, but not anymore. you can't counter if he hits the patrol, you gotta dodge the patrol and if he is going for m2 taps, that's free hold forward. artist is... you can't go for edge map loops where she can zone you out. different playstyles for different killers apply to them, yes that's generally hold w but it still depends on how they play and use their power. similar to another controversial topic, if you are facing an oni that can flick, you can adjust your playstyle. i chased that ash in the helicopter area in rpd and missed my flicks like 5 times because he took it wide, for example (yes that's a major skill issue on my part but my point still stands).
also sorry but no way billy and bubba should be considered the "golden standard" for killer design, especially billy. i like facing those killers... because they are so easy to play against.
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@egg_ said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3617044#Comment_3617044
I really don't want to say this but how am I supposed to take seriously a totally unbiased opinion from trickster profile picture user
what you mean, that's the most objective take i've seen for a while. 🧢
they are right about the memento blades though it's almost a must-run add on. it was buffed as a band-aid fix and didn't get reverted back after his basekit throw rate buff for some reason.
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@ACleverName4Me said:
Personally the snow on killer made me very disoriented. I liked it as surviors but as killer because it is first person triggered a lot of headaches for me. The snowskulls felt kind of weird to throw like the arch was wrong.
The challenges were basically okay and easy. No issue there.
The new snowmen...horrible. I miss those inflatable ones from second year. Those were the iconic ones and they should STAY. These new ones if need to be in the can need to pair up with the old ones. If there is a decoy make the inflatable one turn into the creepy one for a good scare.
Oh and for the rewards. I do not own the tools of torment chapter and due to this I should be forced to grab the cosmetics for those characters in order to finish the event rewards. I hate that my trinkets were wasted on things I do not own and will NEVER own.
oh snowball aim is very very weird yes. you look down just a little and you throw it 90 degrees lower. on killer i struggle way more to aim properly for some reason.
you don't lose or waste any trinkets, they are enough to afford everything in the collection. should be at least, when level 3 releases.
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more bloodpoints would be fine and event offerings are always nice. i like it doesn't affect gameplay all that much (except for stalky bois and probably singu and plague, idk how or if snowmen affect slipstreaming or green puke). overall nice cute event i like it, snowballs are fun.
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in end game it's still fine, but i get few incurable diseases after seeing multiple teammates crouching or running around a killer camping my hook. no ace/nea/feng/leon, the killer won't instantly get annoyed at you and stop camping the hook when you tbag them from 30 meters away, for half of the hook stage timer.
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i think they only need to disable it near hooks.
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@UndeddJester said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3616195#Comment_3616195
It's a double edged sword is the problem... because Trapper can always lockdown basement, even without that add on... he just is far more efficient at it with it. If self save is made worse he becomes even better at it...
Mind you... What I do love about Trapper is yes he is weak... but there is that horrible feeling shift when your teammate goes down and you think "excellent, we're making good time"... only to see the notification bubble appear under the floor... 😨😨😨
There are not many things that scare me, but that moment is always a "Oh.... Oh God No...." 🤣
It might be nice if Trapper gets a Pig like buff... where escaping traps tends to pool around the same time. I'd probably prefer 3 attempts with double the odds at 4 seconds an attempt, rather than 6 attempts at 16.6667 taking 1.8s. Would make traps more consistent.
you probably wouldn't agree when i say basement shouldn't exist, would you? he already needs to hang around basement if he turned it into a minefield no? otherwise survivors can just disarm and save for free so nerfed self rescue wouldn't make much of a difference in that case. i like your idea though, 4 seconds per attempt and only successful on either 2nd or 3rd attempt, never first.
i'm dreaded to play him and see people save themselves in my face while i was ALREADY CHASING THEM. nothing feels worse than that. you can't set "smart" surprise traps around the map either because they won't work, they will almost always save themselves before you arrive, so you have to just play him as an antiloop killer which is super boring. i hate seeing traps on every window and pallet in sight but that's what trapper needs to do.
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@UndeddJester said:
Killswitch I would have thought would simply be something like a property of the object like:
TextName: Nowhere To Hide AuraDuration: 5 AuraRange: 24 EventTrigger: killerGenKick() Enabled: false //here's your killswitch
To killswitch a perk for a particular killer, you'd need some way of binding those properties together, which starts to get ugly fast. You'd need some way of saying:
When Killer selects this character, and this perk is killswitched for that character, then disable this perk...
You don't want your killswitch to require you to inject this instruction in the code, it has to already exist so that when you modify the property to killswitch it, the game just picks ot up and carries on... and this is something you have to do for every item/perk/character/event in the game.
Branches (if statements) have big performance impacts on software. If you can avoid them, you should, and that's why there is so much money in (and companies are very guarded about their) branch predictions hardware. Even with it though, you don't want an "if" running on every event.
E.g. What if blast mine gets a bug that causes permanent blindness if the killer kicks a gen while undetectable? How do you bind this together for a selective killswitch? Do you have to run this question on every single interaction in the game, which could easily slow the game performance to a crawl?
The permutations of potential interactions are astronomical. Hope this gives some insight into why this is far more complex than you think.
thanks a lot. idk how coding works, but if this is the case it makes sense.
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here's mine
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unpopular opinion, but i don't think it should. most trappers would just drown one area in traps (basement or a 3-gen) before the match even starts. with spread-out traps he can't, which is a better design. BUT, what he actually needs is some very very heavy nerfs to self rescue from traps, so he can actually play around the entire map (or you know, can expand past 20 meters from his trapped area).
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there have been server issues, might be contrubuting to your experiences.
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immersion, i suppose. i'm against a voice chat, but there definitely can be more means of meaningful communication like pings or preset chats.
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that's why i never play stealthy and instantly rush to the most central/critical gen to start repairing. i'm very greedy when it comes to dropping pallets.
but with all fairness, most maps DO provide enough resources so someone can predrop and survivors won't run out before end game unless others are slacking on the gen-work. they need to not predrop every yellow and still go down in seconds, though.
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what is the struggle for? does this forum monetize interaction or what?
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@Reinami said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/400846/your-thoughts-on-garden-of-joys-changes
Somehow they heard people say: "You want that garden of joy window nerfed? No problem, we went ahead and changed the upstairs window"
When people were talking about the OTHER window.
which one? because it has 4 FOUR F-O-U-R god windows.
four.
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survivors. not many factors change that unless the killer is one of the top 3.
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requirement is too much.
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bully the killer into a dc.
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i think both statements and the violations are quite clear. the only "loophole" here is, hiding for hatch and no longer progressing the game is completely fine, selfish play is endorsed but it somehow becomes an issue when 2 people decide to do it.
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@ironligma said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3606485#Comment_3606485
It doesn't give two for mettle? I haven't been against slingers but his shot itself wouldn't count. Right?
pretty sure it does. used to give 2 stacks for wglf, might be fixed but unlikely.
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@TheSyndromeOfClowns said:
I don't think it makes sense either. Nemesis contamination should at least help the zombies in some way. Zombies could immediately sprint at maximum speed to a nearby infected survivor?
even just some movement speed and wristband effects for infecting people would suffice imo.
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toy sword, partial soma photo, partial haddie's calendar, a bit of duration for myers and legion, multiple add ons for trapper mainly slower self rescue slower disarm faster setting and even honing stone, discipline, engraving (at least yellow), giga-cicada, chili, iri brush, ambush charge speed for pig, range for pphead, map of the realm. long list, i'd add turret add ons for xeno buuut, it makes sense that luxury requires add on slots.
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i bought mikaela's headpiece from that collection with shards 2 weeks ago, i think? they announced they won't leave the store anymore also so it should be fine.
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he is fine as is imho but can use small improvements on zombie ai and some reward as you keep people infected, like wesker and singularity.
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@jesterkind said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3610432#Comment_3610432
You should consider swapping out one of those boons for Overzealous, it brings the whole thing together really nicely. The time spent setting up your chosen boon also gives you more generator repair, on top of the toolbox you brought in.
That's my answer to the OP's question, at least. Overzealous, paired with a boon and Detective's Hunch. Really nice build.
i really would and want to use boons but i every time i think of it i instantly get flashbacks to the times when coh was meta and even then people would cleanse dull totems. it was infuriating.
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zarinas used to be rare but i see them quite regularly too. agree with the rest.
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i don't look for them for more than 30 seconds. if they aren't where i downed them or anywhere near, they can bleed out in peace while i'm on my phone.
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i love autodidact and solidarity together on survivor.
on killer... i almost never use pain res, deadlock or corrupt idk if that counts lol. i like gearhead on some killers and love floods, which is an incredibly underrated perk for some reason.
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they aren't even subtle about it. i'm both baffled and not surprised at all at the same time by the amount of people jumped right into it too. and my comment gets deleted while this post deliberately created to reinforce "us vs them" mentality is here to stay. lmao.
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even against scratch mirror myers survivors are always on their toes, until a chase starts. it is what it is, they can't take away hud indicator for chases.
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1-2-3-4-5- nap merchant. absolute trash.
6- trapper
7- spirit
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@LordGlint said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3609006#Comment_3609006
I thought it ironic that they were complaining about a survivor getting hooked back to back while they were denying OTHER hooks.
their behavour was... i'd like to think they were just trolling. playing like that and blocking the killer with basekit bt then complaining about tunnelling is crazy to me
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@LordGlint said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3607027#Comment_3607027
I actually saw a YouTube vid yesterday that made me think of this post.
https://youtu.be/vIrnB4c20oE?si=u6Rbg49MSecBSfy5
At 1 minute into the vid, you see 2 survivors cranking out with 1 of em being injured against a Wraith. This would NORMALLY be a risky play, but FTP BU removed the risk. This didn't require wasted time on either survivors part.
what a video, showcases the biggest issues dbd currently has: ftp buckle up, bt body blocking with following ds (and this **** is getting buffed), spammability of boons and yes, tunnelling but it's justified after all this bs. if there was a map offering it would be perfect.
and the ftp plays offered so much counterplay here 🤡 definitely interactable, fun and balanced.