Moundshroud
Moundshroud
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@mintchapstick said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1609836#Comment_1609836
No you don't. You have 120 seconds until the guy on the hook dies and the killer finds someone new to stand in front of. You have to use the time the person is being camped to do gens and leave, not run around the map looking for totems.
It depends, i.e. is Gen-Rushing your only goal? Face campers aren't giving up very many points. Just Gens and getting out the door doesn't earn you much in the way of emblems. Do you see my point? If all you care about is rushing out the door, sure, go for it. I don't think this is a good long term strategy because the META is bigger than what new Survivors face. It also depends on Rank, do you care about it? You need a variety of achievements each game to earn more different types of emblems. Totems earn a different type of Emblem than Generators. They are easy and quick. Long term, it is a good habit to get into. But you can take my advice or ignore it. I won't be offended. I've been where new Survivors are at so my suggestions are based on where I am now.
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@Red_Beard said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1610073#Comment_1610073
I'm not upset at all but with all of your passive aggressive comments in this reply I would say you are getting a little tilted. I have never once at anytime said I was upset about being face camped, didn't know what the pros and cons were to a killer that face camps or was inexperienced against face campers. These are all things you are assuming and trying to insult me with. Let me recap for you.
Some one said a face camper with NOED guaranteed 2 kills. You said NOED is irrelevant to the conversation because the face camper would need to leave the hook to use it. They replied the face camper gets one kill on the camp and another using NOED in end game. You said NOED is still irrelevant because a camping killer gives you time to "ALL THE TIME IN THE WORLD to cleanse the totems". I replied that is bad advice, don't cleanse, do gens. You replied back talking about RUIN. I called you out for talking about an irrelevant perk after you told someone a perk was irrelevant. You double down and include another irrelevant perk "Hex Undying". I told you again the best strategy against a face camping killer is doing gens.
Let me ask you a direct question. Let's say I am an inexperienced survivor running with 3 other inexperienced survivors and I came to the forum to ask what I should do against a face camper. What would be your response?
Well, as I said before, the other three should earn as many points as they can, completing different objectives Generators and Totems. They earn two different emblems and thus they will earn more points. The person on the hook should milk it for as much time as possible. Don't sac out early. Sometimes you eat the bear and sometime he eats you. You were the unlucky loser on the Price is Right. Hopefully he gets bored of camping and gives someone else a chance to get you. Normally, face campers that start the behavior aren't going anywhere though. They are losers. It is a sick sad word sometimes. Most Killers, who want to get better, grow out of it.
I do apologize if I sounded snarky or passive aggressive to you. I'm pretty direct. As you advance, it will be VERY important to do Bones. I give that advice now. Use extra time bad Killers give you to do Generators AND Bones. You will profit in the long run, and the short run. You will earn more points and Pips, and be ready for when things CHANGE and suddenly you are facing Perks you aren't running into yet.
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@Red_Beard said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1609916#Comment_1609916
So you are trying to derail the conversation about face camping by talking about perks that may be relevant in a non face camping scenario?
The only picture I should be looking at here is about being a survivor against a face camping killer and giving the best advice I can for inexperienced survivors who come across one, because that is what the thread is about. The answer isn't "Do Bones". That is dumb to do. Forget about bones and do the gens. Once gens are done, get a door opened and leave.
I'm beginning to believe you are a face camping killer intentionally trying to convince survivors that they should waste time and look for and cleanse totems so that you have more time to look for and face camp the rest.
And in regards to your advice to do nothing but Generators, again... this is a narrow view which isn't upheld by experience as you advance. Remember there are other Emblems you are trying to earn. Earning Pips and improving in Rank (if that is important to you) becomes harder and harder as you advance. Just doing one thing does not profit you.
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@Rivyn said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1609231#Comment_1609231
Really? I don't have a problem seeing him coming. He's waving that stick around broadcasting his location, after all.
I've missed him a few times with medium to high terrain. He is so fast he can go behind it move closer and then launch and he moves so quickly that by the time you hear the heartbeat he is already on top of you. That is the most effective use I've seen so far.
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@Red_Beard said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1609916#Comment_1609916
So you are trying to derail the conversation about face camping by talking about perks that may be relevant in a non face camping scenario?
The only picture I should be looking at here is about being a survivor against a face camping killer and giving the best advice I can for inexperienced survivors who come across one, because that is what the thread is about. The answer isn't "Do Bones". That is dumb to do. Forget about bones and do the gens. Once gens are done, get a door opened and leave.
I'm beginning to believe you are a face camping killer intentionally trying to convince survivors that they should waste time and look for and cleanse totems so that you have more time to look for and face camp the rest.
No, I'm not trying to derail anything. Should I get you a doll so you can show us where the bad Killer touched you? :) Face Camping isn't going anywhere. The conversation is simple, i.e. get used to it. Weather it. It gets less frequent as you play against better Killers. Those who camp lose points the closer they are to the hook, lose points as they aren't earning other emblems, and lose other kills as so many other people get their objectives and more will escape. Face Camping is a problem that takes care of itself.
I apologize if my direct, no bs, manner upsets you but those are the facts. Face Camping, normal camping, tunneling, slugging, and the Mori are basic Killer choices and none of them are going away. You will be relieved to know that Face Camping goes away pretty quickly as you advance, and so does Noed.
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@Peace said:
No terrorradius on killers.
15 FPS on console
Seriously every update just ######### this game over. Its unplayable at the moment.
I'm sorry things seem rough for you. I haven't experienced any of the issued you list. I've found the update to be excellent.
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@Red_Beard said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1609870#Comment_1609870
"more often than not, how quickly you can do Generators is based on the Totems you cleanse." Is there a perk I'm missing that let's you complete gens faster if cleanse a totem? Are you referring to Ruin? Ruin really isn't a problem against a face camper because it only regresses the gen if you aren't doing the gen. So if the killer is face camping, he isn't chasing you off the gen causing it to regress.
I like how the whole deal with you about NOED was it was irrelevant to the conversation for you to then talk about another perk that is irrelevant to the conversation.
You waste a lot of time searching for and cleansing totems. Every second you waste time not completing gens against a face camper is another second gained to him to down some one else and face camp them.
You can trust Moundshroud there and believe I'm giving you bad advice, but don't because I'm not.
It is irrelevant. NOED has nothing to do with camping, except that Camping Killers give the other Survivors MORE time to do Generators (and potentially Totems). I'm pointing out they are apples and oranges as a topic. In regards to Hexes, Ruin is the MOST COMMON Perk you are going to come across as you advance which can be defeated by doing Bones. Undying is now in the mix, and it is ALSO a Hex which protects things like Ruin. Do you follow? Noed is a Perk that newbie Killers take. I haven't used it in forever. It isn't a good return on my investment. Playing with Noed is playing a Perk DOWN for most of the game. And just because you suddenly get Insta-Down doesn't mean you will be in a position to profit from it.
Noed is beloved by newbie Killers, but fades pretty quickly. It will become even MORE unpopular as Undying starts making the rounds. Undying will make it so everyone will kill any Dull Totem they find. If there are no dull totems at the end of the game, there will be no Noed. You need to learn to look at the BIG PICTURE, but that only comes with time.
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@Red_Beard said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1609836#Comment_1609836
That's bad advice. If you are cleansing totems, you aren't doing gens. Don't cleanse totems, do gens and get out. If they have NOED, it will most likely be a 2 kill anyway if you waste time to cleanse totems to avoid it.
You think so huh? :) I never told them do Totems before Gens. I say DO BONES. Totems are also a game objective, and more often than not, how quickly you can do Generators is based on the Totems you cleanse. You can trust Red_Beard there and believe I'm giving you bad advice, or you can take it with a grain of salt that if you are facing a camper and have lots of time, do Bones along with your Generators. You get points for every Totem you cleans (they are quick and easy). And you might have the added benefit of shutting down Ruin, Noed, and any number of any other High Risk vs High Yield Killer Perks.
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@ad19970 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1609719#Comment_1609719
A killer camps one survivor until they are dead. The argument of why hook camping is not good is that the killer will most likely only get 1 kill. If the killer is running NOED, he is almost guaranteed to get at least 2 kills, one during the match by camping, and 1 during end game.
Even more so now with Undying in the mix as well.
Again, this logic doesn't track. Why would a camper be MORE likely to get extra kills out of Noed? :) If a person is a camper you have ALL THE TIME IN THE WORLD to cleanse those Totems. Remember, Noed only triggers at the end of the game, once all the generators are up. The Killer gains insta-down, sure, but you know it might happen. The Killer has no idea what Gate you are going to run to, and if they camped the entire Team is there to make saves and take actions.
People gripe about Noed for no good reason. You do know there are Killers that start and play the whole match with Insta-Down right? It isn't that big a deal. Noed is not the Killer's friend. It takes up a Perk slot, it may never activate if the bones are done or the gates never open, and just because you get insta-down doesn't mean you will catch anyone.
Camping and Noed are TWO DIFFERENT subjects and do not relate to one another at all. Please quit trying to imply that they do. If anything, a camping Killer gives you LESS excuse to whine about Totems because you had more time to deal with them.
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@Nicholas said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1609581#Comment_1609581
Yes I know, that's exactly what I said. I was just pointing out that unfortunately the victim could be more individualistic. And I understand why, because it can be frustrating especially at the start of the match where you got nothing accomplished.
This is true but unavoidable. Sometimes you eat the bear, and sometimes he eats you. Face campers are more common in the Newbie Ranks. That Player doesn't know yet that they are giving away the game to get a single kill. Or they are hoping the rest of the team will commit suicide because they had that happen once.
As you progress those Killers become fewer and further apart. It is a rough patch we all go through. It shall pass.
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@ad19970 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1608822#Comment_1608822
Unless he is Running noed. Or the team is a solo team.
The biggest problem with hook Camping is that its too effective against solo teams, especially when the killer is Running noed.
Noed is irrelevant to this conversation. It only triggers after all the generators are powered, and if that has happened the camping aspect is a non-issue. The Killer has to leave the camped person to use the NOED and thus is no longer camping. Do you see what I mean? Do not mix apples and oranges in this discussion.
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@sonia_delos said:
Actually I agree with some of these comments. Should be a perk or something. Like plunder’s instinct. Tells you where the chests are. How about one for totems.
I think the addition of some sort of Clergy Survivor who has a Perk called say, "Crusade" who can see Totems lit up just like the Plunder's Instinct, that would be worthwhile, certainly.
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My advice is going to sound crazy, but it works for me. Play Spooky Myers. Pick a good map for him if you have the option, but he will work on big ones too. The Wall Hack allows you to avoid wasting time searching, and put pressure where it needs to be. If it is a big map, find your three Gen early and make sure you protect it. Choose things like Haunted Ground and perhaps even Dragon Touch to get some Insta-Down availability. I've found the Red Rank folks don't fight Spooky all that much and it kind of throws them off just a hint. That with the new Perks available, you can slow down the Gen-Rush a LOT. Undying allows you to see their Auras too even when not Stalking.
Like I said, it sounds crazy but it has worked for me surprisingly well. The best maps for Spooky Myers (in order of potency) are:
Meat Plant
Hawkins
Lerys
Any Swamp
Haddonfield
Cold Wind (all but Rotten Fields)
McMillian, etc.
*Basically the weaker the map the more you lean into the 3-Gen. But Spooky can fight on a LOT of maps without issue, or even with advantage. The weaker ones can be tactically cut by smart choices.
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@IIITweedleIII said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1609378#Comment_1609378
So far. In my experience. Noone, except my own validity, because the incentives using Inner Strength to heal up, are doing bones. Granted 9 hrs of gameplay to this point, I've not come across many using NOED. Because like I said, these totem plays are situational.
Ok, let me put it this way... I'm a Killer Main right now. I play Michael Myers exclusively until I feel I've become competent. I assure you that people do Bones against me (or they lose). My standard list was:
Hex: Ruin
Hex: Thrill of the Hunt
Play With Your Food
Sloppy Butcher
*Now I will be swapping either PWYF or Sloppy Butcher for Undying. I assure you that not a game goes by where I don't start losing my Totems (Dull or otherwise). With Undying in the mix, Dull Totems MUST be purged if you want to get rid of that Ruin. If you give me more time, i.e. don't go after the Ruin, I will wreck you. I can't speak to your experiences, but as a Killer I know my Survivors are doing those Bones.
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The Perk is FINE. Seriously. There should be a rule, nobody should be calling for a Nerf or a Buff when new Perks, Killers, Survivors (what have you) come out for at least a MONTH of play. So please, how about we wait till Oct. 8th before we loose our damn minds.
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@IIITweedleIII said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1609335#Comment_1609335
That's the point. 80% of the time. Noone does dull totems. Hardly do hex totems unless its Ruin because of the moment it's noticable when doing gens. Most ignore Lullaby. Totem cleansing is situational. Unless there's a clear incentive to do bones. Most don't bother. Granted those are the ignorant.
But it isn't a good point. They will do the non-dull Totem, i.e. Undying so it WON'T be there at the end. :) Everyone is going to be doing MORE Bones now so Noed is going to take a severe hit.
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@kcwolf1975 said:
Wait till people start pairing it with hex: undying.....
Why would you care about this? They don't work well together. Noed doesn't appear on the board until the end of the game, lighting up a Dull Totem. Undying being in play just assures that people are doing Bones, all of them. The only way Undying makes a difference to Noed is IF both it and TWO dull Totems are still going at the end of the game (unlikely if people know what they are doing).
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It is his built in disadvantage and advantage at the same time. He is harder to see coming as he can use terrain, but his POV (particularly on some maps like Swamps) sucks. He has to make up for it with speed, which he can do.
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@Haselden said:
This perk combined with ruin or Devour hope literally is breaking games. They're to many hex totems to worry about now with undying, it should only reveal people near totems not buff other perks.
No, it doesn't. The Hex does exactly what it needs to do. It exists so people take Totems seriously. There are only five Totems and four Survivors. That means "dull" Totems will always be equal (and usually fewer) in number than the Survivors themselves. With that in mind, Survivors should simply take the time to cleanse any dull Totem they come across. That is what will Nerf the Hex.
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You score more points that way as a Gatekeeper, so just roll with it. You can't blame them for not wanting to lay down and die. :) They are probably new players and can't think of anything else.
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I think this was the most common suggestion for that Perk during the play test too, at least so it seemed to me. I suspect they want to see how it plays. It wouldn't shock me if the Hex part of it went away in the next Patch.
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I once had a Killer down me, drop me in front of the gate and proceeded to open it himself. He then let me crawl almost all the way out, the implication he was letting me go. Then he picked me up and took me to a hook. I was the last Survivor, so it wasn't bait for anyone else. It was just being a jerk. Likewise, I recently had a Killer (I was the last Survivor again) down me and then proceed to watch me bleed out instead of hooking me so he could Tea-Bag me for the entire time. Again, there was no game purpose for this; he was just a jerk. Well he or she was jerk. Who knows. This kind of behavior really shows the very worst of humanity, bad sportsmanship, and so on. They aren't even rats; they are fleas on rats. Fortunately, they are the exception, not the rule. Pretending to let someone get the Hatch is kind of the same bait and switch, a weird sort of cruelty that has no game purpose but really makes you wonder about the person on the other end.
When I give the Hatch, or a Gate, I carry the Survivor directly to the point of exit and drop them there so there can be no doubt.
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@Pipefish said:
A totem counter would nerf NOED since it'd incentivize cleansing which would make less games were NOED pops up. 😬
I'm a Killer and I disagree. The point of NOED is to force people to do Bones, not the fleeting, highly subjective Insta-Down during end game. That was always the point of NOED, to try an nudge Survivors to treat Totems the same as they do Generators. That buys the Killer more time to hunt them down before losing them out the gate. If anything, a Counter would mean you get MORE value out of the NOED.
If they clean them all, GREAT.... you gained a fair amount of time that they were not on Generators. If they missed even ONE you still get your NOED. I just think you are thinking about the Perk backwards, i.e. its true purpose.
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I just kill anyone with a Key early. It is my goal to make sure THAT specific Survivor is sac'd out before the Hatch spawns, and the Key is on the ground somewhere. If I happen to have a Mori, I use it and make sure I kill them somewhere that Key won't be picked up by anyone else. :) Brutal I know, but a Killer has to do what a Killer has to do.
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@lazerlight said:
I really don't understand Killer mains lmao.
They're always like "DO BONES LOL"
But at the same time don't want there to be a totem counter. It's like... do you WANT Survivors to do bones, or not??? This is why the whole "Do Bones" argument doesn't sit right with me.
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This scenario is a perfect example of why NOED should be changed.
The ones that are most affected are the ones that do most of the work during a trial or succeed at distracting the killer most of the game. (Lets call them the MVP) The MVP has no chance of doing totems since the Killer won't leave them alone, and then when all gens are done, they get downed and camped and die on first hook.
But it's not the Killer's fault for running a cheap perk, it's the other survivor's fault for not using the time that the MVP is giving them, to consciously run around the map, taking time away from gens in order to make sure all 5 totems are gone.
What is the MVP supposed to do?? GIVE THEMSELVES to the Killer so that they have a chance of searching for totems before endgame?? I don't think so!
I saw an idea of having 5 lit candles in the basement and each fire represents a totem being untouched. This would be a cool addition for a counter.
I'm a Killer "main" as I play Killer slightly more than Survivor, and I think having a display of how many Totems are left is fine. I've never heard a single Killer have a problem with it. We want you to work Bones too. Half the time we take Hexes to slow down the Gen-Rush. There is nothing wrong with Noed. Let me repeat, there is nothing wrong with Noed. There are already Killers that start the match with the power of Insta-down all game long. There are other Killers that power up to it or have Add-ons which provide it. Noed, at least, doesn't kick in until a specific time so there is no unfortunate surprise.
I rarely put Noed in my list of Perks, but not because I have a problem with it. I just can't squeeze it in. Slowing the Gen-Rush with Ruin and such is more important to me.
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@ToxicMyers said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1606470#Comment_1606470
I still disagree since I get skeleton keys like its candy on Halloween(if you know you know). But I'm getting ivories more than ebonies at this point.
I don't disagree with you at all about the weird availability of Keys versus the Mori. Heck, I seem to find Rare keys every game when I search chests (I have the Perk which makes me a good looter). But I don't know if that is an issue with the keys or Mori themselves, or simply the Bloodweb and the chests.
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There are three levels of Mori... no reason not to have a key type that only lets one person out... and one that would allow 2. But all in all, I don't really have a problem with either the Keys or Mori as they are now. I'd rather there be NO CHANGE to either than some idiotic Nerf to either of them which makes the irrelevant.
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@LowSpecGamersMatter said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1606204#Comment_1606204
Thank you!!! THIS is going to help me soooo so so much in my next Solo Q match. Damn, what a genius u are. How could I not came up with that?? Just get better team mates 4head!!!!!
<laughs> If counter-play was being sought (it wasn't) this would have been the right answer. I know it isn't what most people want to hear; Totems are high risk, high yield Perks. There are five of them on the map and most of them spawn in plain sight (sadly) so it doesn't take too much to find them. It doesn't take too long to cleanse them (assuming no Hex: Thrill of the Hunt). That means if each Survivor cleansed one Totem they happen across, it becomes a non-issue. Granted, I know as a Solo person you have little control over the quality of the Survivors you get, but they DO get better. We have ALL been there.
We have all been there when Kindred reveals the rest of the team crouching around and doing nothing productive while we die on the hook. We have all been there, when we personally have cleansed two Totems, and Noed still goes off. We have all been there when another Survivor leads the Killer right on top of us while we are doing a Gen (Kindred was up so he could see us and we could see him). Sadly, it is just one of those things. I expect the Hex: Undying and such will get the point across real fast to everyone that they MUST treat Bones with the same priority as they do Generators.
All that being said, he just wanted a visual display of how many Totems are left. Sounds like a great idea, or at least as part of a Perk. HOWEVER, it is a double-edged sword. Many Survivors (particularly those of lower quality) will see a lot of Totems left and not bother, thinking it won't affect their game. They will only get motivated if they see a LOW number on it and know their efforts will matter.
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@GoshJosh said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1606204#Comment_1606204
I can't tell if you're trying to be prickish or not, but he said totem counter.
Not at all, I took him too literally. I thought he was meaning a counter as in counter- play. If he means a counter showing the number of Totems left, sounds like a great idea. If it isn't in general, it should certainly be part of one of the many information Perks.
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@skarsguts said:
To be clear: I'm not here to talk about any NOED nerfs or changes.
Just had a Blight chase me through five generators, and I get screwed over by NOED at the end. In this game he was running Hex: Undying with Ruin and NOED (I forget the fourth perk).
I was able to cleanse one lit totem before I started to get chased (was Ruin but because of Undying it transferred.)
In this scenario, I really think a totem counter could have brought more incentive to my teammates to cleanse totems during the game - and of course it helps keep track of how many totems remain on the map. They cleansed a lit totem while I was being face-camped to death but it wasn't NOED.
I'm the type of survivor that cleanses every totem I see, so this is really irritating as a solo. On top of it all, I de-pipped, which in itself is not fair considering Blight was all over me the entire game. Red ranks BTW.
There is a counter already, i.e. your whole team takes Totems seriously and does Bones.
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@OmegaXII said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1605838#Comment_1605838
If she wants to win the game, then go and do gens, i won't be able to stop her anyway. Don't just stay around me and spamming flashlights when i'm chasing someone else.
Also, her teammates doesn't look like total potatoes either. So i can almost guarantee she just want to make fun of the killer.
I have been ignoring these survivors for 2 years..
Fair enough. You were there; I was not. I know that the line between trying to fulfill a role for the team and simply aggravate someone is not a simple one. It is just something you "know" is happening when it happens. That is why I asked for clarification. I don't mind the clickers too much, particularly if I'm chasing someone else. It tells me I've tied up two Survivors with one chase. I'd rather know where they are than not, so them doing the silly is kind of helpful and doesn't get under my skin.
I had a great Survivor taunt me once with the pointing animation. He was in the gateway (door already opened). Both gates were VERY close and he was trying to keep me there so his buddies at the other door (it wasn't open) could get out. I respected the move. What he didn't know was I had the Tombstone Piece and fully powered up. I crossed the distance in a heartbeat and as he turned to get knocked out and crawl into escape (he assumed he would be insta-downed bout out of my grab range), I picked him up and did the Myer's Mori for folks on the run.
He took it in good humor just as I took his taunts in good humor. I knew what he was trying to do (there was a reason) so I wasn't offended either.
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@OmegaXII said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1605483#Comment_1605483
Ok. At start, she run towards the center of the map, and try to gain attention probably because i'm undetectable. Probably a bad choice for her i guess, because if it's ghostface, she's doomed. Maybe she did this for to attract attention away from her teammates.
Obviously i left her, and then go for her starting position to catch other survivors.
Then, i got into T2, and try to chase the one who i stalked. Then mysteriously i lost her track at shack, where scratch marks ends for no reason. Not in the locker either. I'm not mad at this, as i even forgot who i stalked (a female survivor)
So i decide to pay the OoO user a visit, because she was doing gens at farthest location, and i have nowhere to go (no information perks are equipped). The moment i got near like 30 m away, she T-bags, and spamming flashlights.
Obviously i stalked and ignored her, and started to chase the other one who was with her. I forgot the details, but the general things she did was spamming flashlights at distance like 10 m away, trying to gain my attention.
The moment i tried to get close, she ran straight line for safe loops. T-bag at every pallet, spamming flashlights in between loops when she knows she'll make it.
Come on, i know i'm playing m1 killer, and got extremely small terror radius that you can abuse. Fine, abuse it, but can she not be a toxic little brat and try to annoy me? I have been dealing with so many OoO users before, and i don't really care about it if they don't try to actively seek to annoy killer. That's why at this point i decided that she needs to die.
At one point she did get unhooked, but you know what she did? Spamming even more flashlights, because she has BT, DS and UB. So i slugged her.
Then, for some reason, someone else came in and throw a pallet at that area. So i chase them off, and she uses UB to get up when i'm at the other side of pallet. More flashlight clicking, and i downed her in 10 secs.
Gens were done at this point, so i hooked her and camp. For some reason, i grabbed both survivors that tried to rescue her. Then she died, and i carry the rest to exit gate. No reason to kill them as they're not toxic
If i was truly toxic, i won't even carry the rest to exit gate when i can hook them.
Well, hrm. I'm stickler for good sportsmanship. Tea-bagging someone without a purpose, that is just rude. Clicking the light and doing her best to keep you chasing her, well that's just part of the game. I wouldn't take that personal. You are a Red Rank Killer so you don't need my advice on how to play. I got angry the other day because I was the last Survivor (all else dead or disconnected) and the Ghostface downed me and then proceeded to let me bleed out so he could force me to watch him tea-bag for five minutes. That is above and beyond and I would feel like punishing. Someone who has decided to be the bait, well, I'm not sure I would single that person out.
All that being said, camping, face camping, tunneling, slugging, and the Mori are all your call. They are valid tactics (although I tend to use them when I'm trying to win). I'm just saying, in my opinion, the Strode doesn't sound like she was doing anything I wouldn't do if I got that role.
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Agreed. He just has a steep learning curve because of his unique movement. He isn't weak, he just requires some effort. In two days everyone is going to say he is OP. Like Nurse, you have a narrow margin of error but when he is done right, he is very hard to counter.
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I'm just trying to keep an open mind, and I'm trying to assume there is something OTHER than her clicking the flashlight at you (and having OoO) that made you decided to "punish" her. The screenshot you put up shows you and them in the Red Ranks, so I just can't believe clicking at you is the extent of it. Please elaborate.
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@OmegaXII said:
https://us.v-cdn.net/6030815/uploads/6B000QPU3JPA/image.png
The one i facecamped is a laurie with OoO, and spamming flashlight. At that moment, i decide to punish this kind of behavior.
So, soon after i downed her, i proceed to facecamp her. Of course when she's in second stage, all gens are done, and they start to rush the hook. Eventually i manage to prevent the unhook, and then slugged 2 more survivors under the hook (Massive misplay by them btw).
Eventually i facecamp her to death, and then carried the rest to the gate :)
And i feel so satisfied to punish these toxic survivors!
I wouldn't be surprised this is a SWF group based on how they coordinate, but oh well, only the laurie is toxic, so she dies.
I'm not sure I fully understand. You felt it was toxic for her to blast you with the flashlight a lot? Can you elaborate a bit? I don't want to jump conclusions, but I'm not sure what the problem is with a Strode using one of her Perks OoO and a flashlight?
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@Milo said:
So, I just had a match where the survivors weren't... the best. (tl:dr got a 4k)
And two of them (mostly one) were rather... rude because of that.
And said something about ground rules, mentioning that one of them is letting the last survivor go.
So I just have to know, do you know other ground rules :3?
Ignore that garbage. You don't have to let anyone go; that is entirely your call. The only rules (unofficial and brought to you by yours truly) should be (and are for me):
- Don't cheat using hacks or lag switches.
- Don't disconnect; if you start a game, finish it.
- Be humble in victory and gracious in defeat (don't gloat or give salt).
What happens in the game, stays in the game. Play as hard as you want to play. Use whatever Perks and style you want to use. If it is tactically wise in a specific situation, camp, tunnel, slug, or Mori. But before the game and after the game always be nice.
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@sad_killer_main said:
I've never done this in the past, but nowadays I'm starting to realize that sometimes, skipping a lobby that's potentially unhealthy, may save you some headaches.
I'd want to know what are your reasons for skipping them.
Me, for example, I never skip more than 1 lobby in a row, because I don't want to be waiting a long time until I play a game.
So some of my reasons are:
- 2 or more toolboxes/flashlights
- Steam profiles of clearly egocentric/cocky/disrespectful survivors
What are your reasons?
If a group of Survivors all join at the same time, wearing the same outfits and geared up for WWII, I know it is a SWF. Sometimes I'll skip it because I'm just not up to the aggravation. When they all wear the same Skins and outfits, it is almost always a Bully Team who aren't there to play but to see if they can make you mad. I've played through those games before; I have a pretty thick skin, but the are pretty tedious overall and I skip those.
I'm not a big fan of SWF not being in their own Que, with an additional Generator required to power the gates and/or a 5th Perk unlocked for the Killer to offset the SWF 5th Perk (Comms) which trumps all others. Thus, if I know it is a SWF, I'll skip it. Give me the tools to fight on even terms and I'll gladly take them on. Until then, depends on my mood.
All that being said, I NEVER disconnect from a game no matter how bad it is going or unfun. If I start the game, I finish it. I do, like any Survivor reserve the right to leave the Lobby. All in all, I'm more likely to leave the Lobby if I see a name on a Survivor that I've seen before and got a lot of Salt from them or I saw them using a Hack or a Lag Switch. They don't get my business.
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@ringwinning said:
I always cleanse the totems I see around the map whether they're hexed or not, but then I end up feeling bad because someone might have inner strength and they might've needed that totem for a heal. Personally I tend not to focus on heals during a match but that's just me, and I'm wondering if this is one of the reasons people still bring self care rather than IS when they're playing because I see SC a lot more. Thoughts?
Don't feel bad. Do those bones. Pretty soon Undying is going to be in circulation too... so no DULL Totem should be ignored. Get in the habit now.
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@Kilmeran said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1583919#Comment_1583919
Pretty much. I got first hook Mori'ed three out of six games yesterday. Know what I did? Moved on the next match.
Bravo. Short and to the point. You are my hero.
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@mintchapstick said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1599307#Comment_1599307
I've never seen a killer who so single-mindededly follows one person before--it was definitely his fault, but I can see that it's really killing you to imagine that a killer could be the problem.
So what? Dude; you had a bad game. It happens. It isn't a problem with the overall setup. You got one single-minded Killer and YOU got single-minded in return. There are FIVE Totems and FIVE Generators to be fixed on that map. Even without a single save, you could have avoided losing a Pip. You CHOSE invest in the same insanity as the Killer; accept your responsibility in this situation. It isn't something that happens often, particularly not at the Red Rank level. Let it go, move on. Get your Pips back in another game.
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@mintchapstick said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1599300#Comment_1599300
I'm already in red ranks, dude. He was a rank 2 killer.
Then you should KNOW all this already. :) I fight Red Rank Killers and Survivors every day. Only once in a Blue Moon do I see the situation you described. It would be lottery odds to get it in the Red Ranks. It is a non-problem. If YOU keep running into it, then the common denominator is YOU.
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@mintchapstick said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1599294#Comment_1599294
There was no one to rescue because they couldn't catch the one person they chased. No one to heal because he wouldn't break chase. Literally could only do gens & go. Read the thread.
I read the post, closely. And you should have worked those Generators and then moved on to Boldness. Most people are happy when they get a Potatoe Killer. Again, don't place your failures on other people. Bad Killers are the exception, not the rule. The better YOU get the fewer of them you will run into. So play more games, rank up more, and worry more about YOU and less about other people.
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@mintchapstick said:
When are they going to fix the fact that survivors get punished because they're playing against a killer that can't play? I just played a match where a Wraith spent the whole match chasing one person and refused to swap targets or interact with any other players even though I was running in his face--and I depipped. Why was I punished because the killer was bad?
You were not punished because he was bad. You were punished because YOU were bad. You wanted him to chase you. You spent JUST as much time in wasted effort as that Killer did. You could have been earning points by doing Generators, Bones, or perhaps the odd rescue. You could have earned points by staying near him in the right way. Don't blame other people for your failure. A bad Killer who doesn't know how to break off chases means you are free to make all the points you want.
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@BubbaMain64 said:
It's really about how you want to play. But saying it's necessary is a bit of an overstatement. The game isn't as unbalanced as you think since if you learn how to recognize your mistakes you'll realize "oh that was dumb of me". Punishing a bad unhook isn't necessarily tunneling in my eyes, since normally you'll gain a slug and at the least a health state on a survivor. Plus you shouldn't be able to just deny the killer pressure for free, so it's a bad idea not to do so. But outside of any situation of that there's really not a legitimate reason, unless you're somehow at 1 gen with all 4 survs on second hook and they aren't running DS for some reason. Making excuses isn't needed; if you want to tunnel then tunnel, but you will never improve.
This is simply not true. Camping, tunneling, slugging, and the Mori are just tools in a toolbox. All of them need to be understood and practiced to be integrated into an effective style. Good patrols, knowing how to chase and defeat loops, and even when to break off a chase are the primary tool that all Killer uses, but those others are just as important. Without fail, every match is going to have a moment when one of them would have been optimal. Sometimes these strategies might even be more important.
Killers get better with practice. No amount of watching videos, good advice, or game theory compares to time in the trenches. But it is not honest, nor nice to tell people NOT to use a tool. The best Killers use every tool in the box, and what makes them different is they know WHEN to use them.
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@Useless_Bean said:
If your excuse for tunneling is because of gen rush just put more pressure on the game. Chase them of gens, kick them (always), look around a general area of a gen because survivors are probably waiting until you leave. Also run perks like ruin, pop, the one that blocks gens at the start of the game or when picking up a survivor ( I don't know their names).
I think you'll find that even if you tunnel gens will get done because the rest of the team will realise and WILL rush gens to end the game as soon as possible to save the other survivor.
This might work against Potatoes, and if you have an extremely fast Killer or can teleport, but overall, against a SWF team, you are going to have to Tunnel and remove someone to make it 3v1 as quickly as possible. If it isn't a SWF or Gen-Rush crazy group, you have the time to hook normally and earn maximum points. As I said earlier, every tactic depends on the individual match.
But the advice about Ruin, Pop, and Corrupt Intervention is solid.
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Like all tactics and strategies, Tunneling depends on the specific match and conditions you face. Sometimes it is absolutely necessary. Sometimes it works to your detriment. Other people in this thread have already gone over lots of the different situations that might merit it. I want to bring up something different.
Right now DS (Decisive Strike) is used by a large number of Survivors. It is annoying but true. I would rather get rid of it early game than late when it is particularly galling and effective. Thus, I will usually tunnel the first person I hook right away to get them to use it. Early game I tunnel a LOT more than I do mid to late, because I'm trying to get them to waste the 2nd Chance Perks.
You have the most power and control over the game when it is early, when you are still running them off Gens and getting a feel for the group. You are learning if they are altruistic or not. You are getting an idea of how focused they are on the Generators or if they are also working Bones. As long as you are NOT getting stuck in too long a chase, tunnel, down, take the DS and get it out of the way. And if you are surprised and there is no DS, you are one hook closer to fighting a 3v1.
I know this sounds horrible. The Perk was created to try and discourage tunneling. In my case, it encourages it. I want to decide when that DS stun happens, not the Survivors. And I have found it is always better when I decide what part of the match it happens.
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@Lagoni said:
I find the 4k challenge impossible to complete. Every game i enter, people DC, and escape through hatch. I'm at a point where i just bring a mori to every game, because it's ######### unbearable to keep playing a 30 minute slugging match, where no one dares to do generators, just for one guy to DC in the end, and give the last person hatch.
I think it has been more than 15 games in a row now, where someone has DC'ed, essentially ruining the challenge.
Please don't include challenges like this in the future. With the current hatch mechanics (which i generally don't mind), the game is clearly not meant for them.
This is just a function of your current Rank I suspect. The behaviors you describe are most common to new Players (sometimes called potatoes). You will see less and less of that as you advance to play against those with more skills. The 4K will come, trust me, you are about to hit the "sweet spot" for the 4K where it will be easy, and never be so easy again. I treasure the odd 4K now that I am fighting mostly Red and/or Purples. These guys don't screw around.
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@ScienceGirl said:
So first off let me start by saying that I understand that when you play with other people you pose a risk of running into frustrating scenarios; but with that being said, I still have to have this little rant lol.
I always use Botany Knowledge, it’s just something that never leaves my loadout as I love being able to constantly heal my teammates faster and I also love being able to do the same to myself. During each trial I always designate myself as the person who will go for hook saves, pick up slugged teammates and heal people. It’s just how my play style is, I like keeping people alive as long as possible.
The problem I face is that I will go out of my way to make sure people survivor as long as possible but I feel like I don’t get the same love in return. I had a match last night where I wasn’t downed or hooked all game, but I got caught trying to open an exit gate and hooked. The killer didn’t camp me in the slightest but still the entire team stood on the opposite side of the map teabagging with each other; up until I eventually died, keeping in mind that this was my first hook. The killer didn’t go over to them until after I died and at that point they opened the exit gate, taunted the killer inside and then proceeded to leave.
The most frustrating thing is that they all knew nobody was coming to save me as they were all sat together. There was no NOED or anything else to keep them from coming over to at least TRY to save me. Nobody even came to check if the killer was camping. So it’s okay for me to save them all from hooks, pick them up from being slugged, continuously heal them, fix 3 generators (you’re welcome guys) but as soon as I get hooked, it’s okay for me to just be left to die? It just really got under my skin. It wouldn’t bother me as much if this wasn’t a common occurrence, but I feel like it happens way more than it should.
I just can’t stand selfish people and that’s what it comes down to. People are completely fine with being saved but as soon as the shoe is on the other foot they couldn’t give a damn. I suppose this is just one of the many perils of playing in solo lobbies.
I’ve also noticed similar scenarios when I’m playing as killer. I quite often see somebody being left on a hook to die when I’m nowhere near it. I sometimes wish I could take the survivor back off lol.
Sorry for the essay, I just had to vent. 😌
It is as so-called "Red Shirt" situation with SWF. You were not part of their group. They didn't care about you. It is another reason I think that Groups will have to be in a different Que than Solos.
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@Rainbo911 said:
Hi all, 1st post here.
I just came up against a 4 SWF team, as a killer, and I found it futile to even attempt to stop them as they just control the game so well.
I know they were a team as I was on the temple of purgation map and one of them kept standing on the ruins between the last 2 gens available so Im assuming he was on comms with his team as before I could get to a gen they were 20 meters off in the opposite direction, I didnt manage to kill 1 survivor.
Does anyone have any tips on how to beat this? As this has happened a few times now and feel as if killers are completely outmatched against a try hard team with comms and items.
Thanks
- Avoid them. In general, if you are in a Lobby and all the players appear at the same time, it is usually a good indication they were in their own group room first. If you don't want to fight a SWF, leave the Lobby and start over.
- If you have a surplus of Red and Green Mori, bring one every time. If you end up fighting a SWF, use it. Drop it to 3v1 to try to reset the balance as quickly as possible. At that point you re just fighting not to lose a Pip or do whatever you can.
- SWF are often slightly (if not a lot) more altruistic than other groups because they are close friends in many cases. This means they will come out to help their buddies. If your Killer has Add-Ons or methods to get Insta-Down or fancy Mori, get one of them on a hook (or slug) and terminate with extreme prejudice anyone and everyone that comes to help.
- You have to take oppressive Perks that slow down the Gen Rush. You have to buy that time to kill some of them.
- Focus on that 3-Gen nearest the basement. A basement and three generators close to it in a defensible patrol is your best option. If the map is too big and I know I'm facing a SWF I just start getting my goalie situation set around the basement. Combine this with the other comments I said above.
- SWF tend to choose the Perks we all know all to well now. That means you should keep careful watch on the time, slug when possible, and invalidate these Perks by not getting pulled by them. Likewise, go for GRABS when they are unhooking rather than hits. This works particularly well in the basement.
- Do NOT feel guilty about camping, tunneling, slugging, or the Mori. Members of a SWF are using a MEGA-PERK which is outside the game and provides more info than any combination of Perks inside the game. It is a problem, but all we can do is adapt. That means you can't pretend to be a nice guy and avoid those things people have worked hard to shame you into thinking are the so-called toxic. You do what you have to do to put them away.
- Don't get frantic. If you start to feel impotent and overwhelmed, the situation will only get worse. If you know you are going to lose the game, try to learn from it. Get experimental. Earn the points you can to try and avoid losing a Pip (if you care about Rank) and just try to study how they work together. Learn how to spot who is the weakest link in a SWF. Even good ones, well-coordinated, have some Players that lead and are proactive and some that are less so. Knowing how to spot the best ones, help you in the future, so you know who to MORI first. Learning to understand who is the best, gives you better opportunities to cut the head off the snake.
- As with any game, know your maps. This only comes with time. They are going to coordinate and keep eyes on you. They are going to share this information. Intimate knowledge of the maps makes it better for you to cut corners, and hopefully fool one, so they give bad information to the others, and you have to be ready to take advantage.
- Be gracious in defeat. No Salt. Learn from the rough game and get better. There is no point in getting salty with them because HALF of them are Trolls who want it. They get a perverse thrill out of upsetting you which is why the did it in the first place, and HALF are just entirely focused on the win and don't care if you are salty or not. Do you see my point? No reason to destroy your own blood pressure and reputation over it. The creeps will be annoyed they didn't upset you. And the cold fish will respect you for being stoic or cool about it.
Eventually, this shall pass. The current situation is detrimental and everyone knows it on some level. Put your head down, do the best you can, learn what you can from it, and when it is dealt with, you will be even stronger.
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@BaroneMaximus said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1597503#Comment_1597503
You see, i didn't know about this thing, and honestly #########?? you are literally gaining resources that you can never get back from people, why in the world would you just get it as if it was just from one??
Well you gain resources, but it divides up the pull so it is the same amount, just a little bit from each. So you don't really lose it, but getting a whole bunch of them in front of you doesn't speed you up.