Moundshroud
Moundshroud
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@BaroneMaximus said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1597467#Comment_1597467
And that's what i really wanted him to be able too... Like when he is done stalking someone and you can no more stalk him, that's something i would gladly get rid of. this is why i wanted him to have a mechanic that gives you the ability to stalk people on the entire match without abusing on one person out of 4. Same as for the aura, i think you should see the auras of survivors AT BASE when you are T1 since you are freaking slow and 0 lunge, you are literally harmless :\
You mean build the wall hack in for all Tier-1 Myers? That is an interesting idea, but it would have to be the crappy Vanity Mirror version I think, and leave the Spooky Myers version to be possible with Add-Ons. I think an easier fix for Myers would be the ability to pull more evil when he is around multiple Survivors. Right now he always pulls the same evil no matter how many are being stalked.
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@Pipefish said:
You think hex perks will become more viable when this perk comes out or will killers stick with the same old pop, corrupt, and BBQ ?
Everything is theoretical at this point, but I believe Hex: Undying, Hex: Thrill of the Hunt, and Hex: Ruin (leaving two dull Totems) will be pretty effective at slowing the Gen-Rush down. I play Myers so that leaves me a slot for something else like Pop Goes The Weasel, PWYF, or Sloppy Butcher. It really depends on how effective I find Undying in the mix.
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@BaroneMaximus said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1597369#Comment_1597369
I never said that you are not qualified, i'm literally looking for people like you that know this character better then i do. This is why i want YOU to say where i'm wrong and why, i can only give ideas and tell how i personally feel when i play against him cause when i play him i really don't feel any challenge or fun (this doesn't mean he isn't fun and challenging, i just pref different characters like doc and huntress) So please, let's just forget about the first bad impressions. Do you have any idea for addons that would make him better or interesting to play?
And don't worry, I didn't take it that way. I merely gave my context, so you would know what I'm basing my opinions on. Ghostface is a very different animal from Myers. He stays the same pretty much all the way through the game. Like a Hex, Myers is a slow burn with high risk and high reward. If you go for Builds which Hulk out at Tier-3, you can slug like nobody's business. You are fast, insta-down, and have a mean lunge. If you go for Spooky Myers you are challenging yourself and the Survivors who are used to the advance warning of the Red Stain, Terror Radius, or at least some auras. Only Spine Chill (and your own noisy breathing) gives you away. *The "Wishy-Washy Myers"... i.e. the Vanity Mirror... is not my favorite. It attempts to bridge the gap between Spooky and Maniac. As a result, it does NEITHER well. I just don't play it. If there were additional tweaks to Myers, I would say that middle of the road version with a limited Wall Hack but no ability to get to Tier-3 would be a place to look. Right now with Myers, you want to be all in... all Spooky or all Maniac.
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@Maperson said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1597320#Comment_1597320
Umm that is personal preference but if you feel like that ok. Why I would want it, it's bcs killer starts the game with 0 pressure, he is very slow, no other killer has that kind of restricting of using they're power expect maybe Oni, but he is different story bcs we all know how good he is. So he needs to work for his power to become normal m1 killers at the start of the game, which is very important part, and then he needs to work for his real power which sometime can take a while, on the other hand we have Oni who can get his power twice of fast and is much more stronger, you see the point? I think he needs some help bcs IMO he is outdated..
I used to feel this way, but not anymore. I've been playing a LOT of Spooky Myers. I've been able to 4K now on Cold Wind Farm, McMillian, Midwich, the Swamps, and the smaller maps of course. Oddly enough Spooky Myers is an absolute TERROR in Haddonfield which is normally a terrible map for Killers. Spooky Myers loves it. He can, literally move along the center of the main street just a short distance each way centered on the Myer's House and get a rid on every single Generator. This allows him to never waste time and keep up tremendous Gen. pressure. Spooky Myers can get a 3-Gen on that map as a lock very easily and the basement (always in the Myer's house) is right in the center. I have to say, after horrible experiences with other Myers builds in Haddonfield, this took me ENTIRELY by surprise. I've been playing some seriously good Survivors too. Heck, it is hard but I've even won a few at Ormond.
My point is Spooky Myers is actually viable (granted I've been putting in an insane amount of practice) in many maps people write him off on. He is slow, absolutely, but there are ways around that and the lack of a Red Stain and Terror Radius do make up for it. Granted, I would love for him to be 110% rather than 105%. That would, I believe deal with his issues in the loops a bit better, but since I am winning games with him as he stands now, it would be hard to second-guess the DEV on their final call. The only maps I absolutely hate getting with him are Rotten Field (the one Cold Wind variant I can't win in), and the McMillian one called the "Woods Something"... don't know why I have trouble there, but I do.
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@BaroneMaximus said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1597351#Comment_1597351
Again, assumption that there is no "we", i talk for many because i have a community that makes my "we" viable. If YOU don't know my community, it doesn't mean you have the right to disprove it. Also, by rules of this forum: "only constructive and on topic comments are accepted" So, if you have to say something about my thread on: Myers, you are free to keep commenting. Otherwise, you are pleased to stay out of it and let room for people really interested on making this game better for everyone, thanks.
That isn't how this works. You put up a post, other people answer it. Some of them will disagree with you. They also might feel that their input is about making the game better for everyone (which I do). I think your ideas are ill-advised in regards to Myers. Since I play him exclusively as my Killer until I can consistently hit Rank-1 with him (my goal) I've had a great deal of time with him so far. I feel qualified, at list minimally, to comment on his abilities and builds. Does he needs some tweaks? Yes. Does he need a massive rework? Absolutely not. Don't fix what isn't broken. His Add-Ons need work, tweaking the unused ones. That's about it.
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@BaroneMaximus said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1597320#Comment_1597320
if you had the decency to read my thred, you would have known i hadn't got rid of t1 jump scare myers. I said i had more ideas for addons and in what i had in mind includes scratch mirror builds too.
I did read your suggestions, closely. I just don't agree with them. I think Myers is pretty solid as he is now. What mainly needs attention when it comes to him is his Add-Ons. The vast majority of them are terrible and simply not used at all. He even has an Ultra Rare that I have like sixty of so far. :) I think Myers could do with perhaps being a 110% Killer at Tier-1 rather than 105%, but I'm getting by with him as he stands now. I just think he needs some of his Add-Ons adjusted to help him more toward the mid-game, things which might help delay the Gen-Rush that aren't Perks.
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@BaroneMaximus said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1596525#Comment_1596525
If YOU don't want it, it doesn't mean there is not a WE ;) You come here and say that YOU don't want it, without being a toxic person. Otherwise just don't answer, thanks :)
The convention is that if YOU post you speak for YOU. You don't imply "we" unless you are the Queen of England perhaps? I know Emma Watson plays; I suppose her Majesty could be getting down to some DbD. If there is a "we" the other people can also jump on and add their two cents. It is really bad form to act like you speak for many on the internet because it is just an idle boast. If we were in the real world, and you were on stage surrounded by the "we" you are talking about, that would be different.
In short, using the term "we" in this context and format seems to infer you are speaking for the majority. I doubt that.
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@Maperson said:
I think he just needs some buffs, he is like in the movies, they couldn't do it better.. Maybe get rid of T1, in T3 they could make him a bit faster in everything.. I don't know
Hell no! If they got rid of Tier-1 I'd lose Spooky Myers (or Jumpscare Myers if you prefer) and he is the most fun to play and play against.
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@SquirrelKnight said:
If we are talking about toxic behaviour, the death threats and comments to kill myself are unwarranted
Yeah. If I had a nickel for every time I've gotten one of those... I wouldn't be rich but I'd be enjoying a very expensive meal.
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@RakimSockem said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1597268#Comment_1597268
There's a reason I chose my wording carefully and said "considered to be toxic by their opponents".
I agree that most (because slugging someone and letting them bleed out with no one else to chase isn't a "strategy") of what I said isn't ACTUALLY toxic. But those things are perceived to be toxic by the community and by players.
I also agree and said at the end of my post that we should never defend and should go after people who say harmful things or make threats (however empty they may be) in post game chat
Fair enough, and that is why I didn't go after you with a rhetorical sledgehammer. But even having this discussion perpetuates the notion (the perception as you call it) that these behaviors are somehow "bad" and that the focus should be on them. What happens in the game should only get answered in the game. I'm merely pointing out that the emphasis of your post was on play style choices, with an after thought to pre-game and post-game chatter. That shapes the argument; do you see what I mean.
I'm a pretty vocal guy, someone who is an opinionated ass. I try to remain civil and ethical at all times. We all fail in what we try to do now and then. I've kind of made it my personal mission to put the emphasis back where it belongs, i.e. the pre-game, post-game, and posts on the Forum. That is what is damaging the community, creating memes, and a perception that one thing is broken or that a behavior is only done by toxic Players. All of that is garbage. This is a full contact sport, albeit virtually. If it is legal in the game, there is no reason anyone should be commenting on it other than to offer advice. I will step in anytime someone start spewing this garbage and I will take out the rhetorical sledgehammer.
I like this game. I like this community. I believe, based on my experience so far, that most of the community is made up of good people. Most of them are not jerks pre-game or post-game, and most play for the love of the game. I despise the vocal minority born of entitlement and internet trollishness who seem to make it their mission in life to make others miserable and tear things down. That is a windmill that I will gladly tilt against.
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@RakimSockem said:
Everyone (or at least everyone who is rational) knows that toxicity happens on both sides of the game. However, I hardly think the two sides are comparable or equal and here's what I mean by that.
What are some typical things that survivors do that are considered toxic by their opponents? Click flashlights, t-bag, vault spam over pallets and windows....
What are some typical things killers do that are considered toxic by their opponents? Face camping, hard tunneling, tunneled and morid off of 1st hook, slugging and making someone bleedout for 4 minutes. body blocking someone in a corner as the wraith for 5 gens (happened to me twice)
Notice the difference? Not the size of the list because I'm sure someone will come in here and bring up something else on the survivor end. But the main difference is that a "toxic" survivor is annoying. That's it. They're an auditory or visual nuisance. A "toxic" killer literally stops one or more people from being able to play the game.
A person spamming the crouch button may be toxic but you can still play the game and go about your business. A person camping and tunneling you immediately off hook gives you absolutely no options.
I think this also explains why there's more post game survivor salt than post game killer salt (well that and because there's more survivors in sheer number). A killer deals with a team of jerks spamming the crouch button and clicking flashlights, sure they might be annoyed a little. A survivor gets face camped and doesn't get to even play the game, that's actually frustrating. (Note: This is NOT a defense for people who tell you to ######### or hope you get cancer or anything like that in post game chat. I will never defend that)
Anyway, that's just my observation and my opinion. Knowing these forums, I'm sure many will disagree
Correction. NONE of those things you list are the so-called "toxic." Those are play style tactics and strategies on both sides of the coin. The term "toxic" needs to be purged from our collective vocabulary because it means whatever anyone wants it to mean. The only damaging behavior, to the community, is being a bad sport (or person) in the pre-game and post-game chatter. Caveat, the endless whining, shaming, and rants about "toxic" behavior over here on the Forum is also bad.
What happens in the game, stays in the game. Those things you describe are choices and can be answered by other choices in the game. Too much energy is wasted on them. Your bait to try and weigh in on what behaviors you PREFER is just another version of shaming and wasting our time. What we need to be tackling are people who disconnect and ruin games for other players, people who insult, threaten, shame, and say creepy crud like "I hope your cat dies... you camper!" Those things are bad and worthy of discussion. The stuff you are talking about should only be discussed in posts that offer suggestions and advice on how to counter play it.
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@Mushwin said:
So up is point. Down is a wave.
What about left and right? Would you like to see new emotes on DBD in game? if so what would they be and for what reason? :)
I wouldn't mind a Killer emote where they make the gesture that indicates I'm going to cut your throat. A second Killer gesture I would like to see is the SLOW wave, palm up and side to side. Creepy.
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Again, I think we would all be better off if we deleted the word "toxic" from our mutual vocabularies. It is a meaningless word. Right now people use it to describe WHATEVER behavior they happen to personally dislike. Nothing we do in the game, within the rules, should ever get shamed or complained about. The only behavior in the game that is worthy of mention or reporting is hacking, using a lag switch, or perhaps abusing a bug. Play style is up to the Killer and Survivors. They should do them. People in glass houses you know? Bad behavior before or after the game is the only thing that really qualifies as bad for the community. It in includes passive-aggressive Salt, profanity, threats, insults, and really creepy comments about hoping people (their family or pets) die. Shaming the Player's behavior in the game (when it is perfectly legal) also falls under this heading. All of this should be reported, without exception.
So, I don't care if someone clicks their damn flashlights at me for the entire match. It might be annoying, but it isn't worth reporting and isn't a violation. It isn't "toxic" in the least. Tea-bagging is extremely annoying, disrespectful and shows the person to be a bad sport (particularly when the game has animations already for us to call each other out) but it isn't "toxic," worthy of a report, or a violation. It is something that happens inside the game and you can respond to it inside the game. What happens in the game stays in the game. Think about it this way, in Norse Mythology, worthy warriors are transported to Valhalla. They spend their nights feasting and partying, and their days going out to battle one another to the death. It is no holds barred, painful, full contact fights which result in them being cut to pieces. After the battles, they get put back together, laugh about it, and go to eat and party. That should ALWAYS be us. Play HARD. Give it all you got every time in. But when we leave the game, we are friends who share a mutual hobby. Humble in victory and gracious in defeat.
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@Slashstreetboy said:
A common issue that arises while discussing balance is the tremendous difference in tools given to SWF compared to solo. A suggested solution that seems to be quite common is to buff solo Survivors closer to the power level of SWF to make changes to Killers more applicable across the board.
I´m curious, what are your suggested buffs to soloq?
I wouldn't. It is too complex a system to ever reach an equitable balance. The two ques have to be separated. That way the SWF que can have its 5th Perk (Comms) balanced by requiring them an extra generator to power the gates, and/or a 5th Perk unlocked for the Killer. This problem will NEVER be fixed by power creep. Increasing the Solos to try and make them as strong as the already overpowered SWF is the opposite of a solution.
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@deadbybums said:
I agree that its boring seeing it every game. Before cross play I maybe encountered it 2 or 3 times a month. Now its almost every game.
And all these arguments come back to gen speeds but gen speeds aren't the problem. A solo queue team struggles with gen speeds a lot of the time but a well greased swf doesn't. Thats not a bad design flaw as such, its an overly big skill gap between highly skilled communicating players and solo queue users who likely haven't brought any items to trial and have no idea about each others playstyles.
The problem will only be addressed when SWF and Solo players are separated. That is the long and the short of it. What we need are the following options:
- Solo Que: No identifying information about the Players is given, period. This prevents people from quickly setting up communications in the lobby through Discord or some other engine. Basically nobody knows the identity of those they are playing with until the end of the game stats. The Solo Que will not allow people to join as a group, or at most as a group of (2).
- League Play: This is the Que for people who want to enter a Lobby as a group. Minimum group size would be (3) and you would play the game as a three. Maximum is as (4). The Killer will have a 5th Perk Slot unlocked and the Survivors will require one additional Generator to power the gates. Thus, a team of three will need (5) and a team of four will need (6). *This is done to equalize the advantage SWF have. Killers will be more than happy to fight them on fair terms.
- Custom Game: This is what we have now. You ALREADY have an option to play with your friends. You get however many of your friends to be Survivors, and get one to be the Killer.
This is the only logistical way of solving the problem. As long as Solos continue to pay the price for trying to balance SWF in the game, there is going to be a growing issue. Perks which slow down the Gen Rush (aimed at the SWF) will hurt Solos twice as much, if not more. Everyone says this will slow dow Ques. We don't really know that. It might speed them up. Killers won't duck SWF Ques if they feel they are on even ground. Solos will be relieved to know they aren't the Red Shirt on the team. Moreover, if the balancing options I suggest for the groups is too strong or too weak, the DEV can adjust it without screwing over everyone else.
Do I think these things will eventually happen? Yes. Eventually what I outline above will happen because there is no other equitable way to fix the issue that doesn't create even more problems. Do I think it will be soon? No. I think the DEV and the Players will get dragged kicking and screaming to this resolution when it becomes clear nothing else is going to work. :) People tend to be reactive rather than proactive. It is human nature. So in the meantime, all of us must continue to adapt to an ever increasing number of Perks designed to slow down the Gen-Rush and force people to do bones. Get used to those Perks. They aren't OP; they are just unavoidable in the current Meta.
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@BaroneMaximus said:
Like, i really believe that the best Myers rework is... basically Ghostface!! :'D He covers all the weaknesses or the abusable points that Myers has and corrects them like a cherry on top of a cake! I'll explain better:
Myers is a stealth killer that needs to stalk people to be viable: It means that you are not meant to be seen, but he is tall like an old grandma wardrobe and he is LOUD!! It's like playing against Darth Vader... Ghostface is not that tall, he is skinny(ish) and he can LEAN behind corners!! He is PERFECT!! Also Ghostface has complete control on the undetectable status (and a perfect counter on the survivor side since they can just "spot" him), something that Myers completely lose after reaching EvilWithin 2.
The abusable part is about the "stalk" itself. You can actually just 99% your tier 3 on someone else and then tap it on someone you never met in ur life b4, and that's jsut CANCER. Even tho you end up having "no more stalk progression on that person", you can't just stalk to death someone and then tap it on others :\. Ghostface is perfect in that too! you have to stalk someone entirely before exposing him and completely lose the "stalk gauge" in case you hit him, he is PERFECT! But, he is not Myers.
For me, Myers needs a real warm rework. something that would make him viable and new, but still keeping him the good old and creepy jump scare Myers. My suggestions are:
1) You have singular levels of stalk on survivors, Ergo: you have to stalk someone to Evil within 2 and 3 before gettin any effect on him and also the stalk starts fast and slowly decays the more you stalk that person to avoid prolonged stalking till you can no more stalk him (it will gradually reset in time to be able to stalk him again)
2) When you are Evil Within 2, as surv you will occasionally scream when inside the terror radius of the killer and the chance of screaming should be very low (Slightly), when instead very high when Evil Within is tier 3. This will apply on actions too, because screaming will make you trigger very difficult skill check to avoid any progression penalty that otherwise would be applied to any action you are involved in.
3) When you are toward somoene who is tier 1, you should be able to see his aura when in chase with him, but no more able to see it in Tier 2 and 3 (unless via perks or addons). When toward someone with tier 2, you should move faster, but not necessarily instan. it could be something that comes with bloodlust, like you get it faster or it's a little stronger on you etc. With Tier 3 instead you get the good old insta down for a short period BUT: When you are on your T3 with someone you can ONLY insta down that person instead of anyone you come across and only apply an additional Deep wound on someone whos not on his T3 yet. Then the tier 3 will slowly decay while in chase or fastly decay while not in chase to tier 2 and so on.
4) When in T3 with someone you break pallets, vault windows and pick up survivors faster, but slightly slower then nowadays T3 speed so it won't be THAT MUCH oppressive toward survivors, but it will be still a strong addition to his kit.
I have more ideas for addons too, but this thread is too long already and i just wanted to give good ideas on how Myers could be great without being changed a lot or broken completely. I hope you will give me your replies on what you think about Myers in general and about my ideas around him. CHEERS!
What is this WE nonsense. If I want to play Ghostface, I'd play Ghostface. I'm sure Myers will get some tweaks, but I (and I do not presume to speak for everyone) do not want to lose what makes Myers distinct.
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@Guenther said:
Over weeks, maybe several month, I noticed that killers use Corrupt Intervention in average ~50% or more in the matches, I play. Mostly combined with Pop Goes the Weasel.
And I have to say, that it starts to gets annoying.. and boring to play against the same killer perks again and again. I am very happy to know that the devs track the perk ususage of all perks in the game (surv + killer) and that they might notice the overusuage of Corrupt Intervention in the near future.
I don't care about anyones opinion about genspeed. Because depending on which side you stand (surv, killer, both), you mostly will not argue rational, but rather shout out what you think.
I really hope that the devs react faster in the future when it comes to over but also underusuage of perks. We have so many different perks, but the most of them never get picked. That's sad.
Killers use the Perks they have to use to slow down the ever increasing speed of the Gen-Rush. If certain Perks (all for this purpose) seem in greater use, that illustrates a need or problem. If you want to see the usage of those Perks go down, you should be asking the DEV to reset the base level of regression in generators so they are less necessary. In other words, advocate for solutions to the actual problem, not balms for your personal inconvenience.
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@xMain said:
I feel like every other game as Killer I get flashlight clicked at, t bagged at pallets, and bullied in end chat by a SWF group telling me to die of cancer. I don't get as many toxic people as survivor, but why are people like this? This community can be so toxic and I don't get why. Entitlement? Maybe. Even when people get what they want I get insulted relentlessly. The community gets a bad rep from people like this. Idk, maybe its just me. Just tired of people feeling the need to be mean as hell. Every game has toxic people, but I see it especially here.
At the end game, if you get that garbage, just embrace it and make it clear you love the delicious taste of their salty tears. You can likewise just type GG before they get ot say anything and hit continue. Why listen to the end game chatter at all? Ignoring it is as effective as making it clear you know their salt is just whining. Good Sportsmanship doesn't seem to be the norm anymore, and the internet has spawned a legion of entitled, spoiled brats who cannot take ownership of the fact that they, themselves, are responsible for their own losses. Rather than accept reality and learn from it, they seek to make it subjective and delude themselves by coming up with excuses, somehow place the blame on others. So the Salt isn't really for your benefit; they are desperately trying to lie to themselves. It is kind of pathetic really. There is no shame in losing a game, but self-delusion and bad sportsmanship is the behavior cowards and fools.
I would also put in the caveat that we remember the negative experiences more than the positive ones. It creates a twisted view of the community. Overall, the community is NOT toxic. If you were to keep a little notepad on your desk and track the actual number of games where people are rude versus polite in the endgame, you will find that polite people who say GG and wish you good luck in the next match actually outnumber the creeps. Since that is the norm, i.e. the expected good behavior, it doesn't stand out to us as much as the bad. I noticed this when I started recording every game so I can report the human garbage. The number of videos I get to delete at the end (because nothing foul happened) far exceeds the ones I have to file and upload. My point is the community is NOT toxic. The sore thumbs just give us a false impression. Likewise, the number of people who feel compelled to come vent their spleen here, is not a good representation of the overall community. People who just play for the love of the game, and don't have a problem with things, don't bother to post. They also far outnumber the whiners that try to drown the forum in their tears.
So, my advice is keep this in perspective. The good eggs do outnumber the bad ones. Don't let the stink of the rotten eggs make you forget that.
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I just find all of these threads silly. They are whining screeds and no actual thought to overall game balance goes into them. They are all the product of tunnel vision. Let me demonstrate the ridiculous logic of how they interact.
1st Complaint: The Killer should NOT camp! Punish that behavior. How dare the Killer prevent us from unhooking someone!
Killer Response: Ok, well if I can't use commonsense and intercept you when you try to rescue the person I already caught, I guess I'll just hit that person again and put them back on the hook. Makes sense since they are already injured.
2nd Complaint: The Killer should NOT tunnel. Punish that behavior. How dare the Killer try to take advantage of an already injured Survivor!
Killer Response: Ummm ok. I guess if I can't use commonsense and go after a priority target without somehow offending everyone, I'll just hit everyone I can, and knock everyone down equally and then start hooking. That's fair right?
Third Complaint: The Killer should NOT be slugging. Punish that behavior. How dare the Killer do something that makes us have to wait and limited our options.
Killer Response: Seriously? Ok, should I just Mori you? I mean really, what do you expect me to do at this point?
I've commented on the self-centered, entitled nature of all these arguments before. To me at least, it seems to demonstrate that those arguing for all these artificial constraints and punishments haven't thought things through (or simply don't care). They don't want to have Player Killers; they want mindless Bots who can do nothing but run around in circles looping with them. This is a PVP game. Sometimes bad things happen to good people. That means sometimes the Killer will take advantage of someone on the hook to try and bait other people. It means that sometimes a person will get run down again and again because they are easier prey. It means that the Killer will sometimes take advantage of everyone being in proximity and knock you all down so you can't help each other. This freedom to act, apply logic and agency is what makes the game interesting. It is what separates a Bot and a sentient mind.
Does this mean that all of us will have to suffer indignities from time to time? Yes. Sometimes you are the person who is going to get camped, tunneled, slugged, and even die by the Mori. Sometimes you eat the bear, and sometimes the bear eats you. There will be games where our choices are limited because the Killer got the best of us. That is no different from the games where the Killer has a really bad day. Every Killer has games where the Generators pop like crazy, he can't close a deal and get Survivors on Hooks because they double or triple team him, sabotage hooks, and bully with saves. Just like Survivors, Killers have games where they simply go through long periods of being able to do nothing effective, are impotent, and know they are going to lose. In a PVP game, like any sport, that is how the cookie crumbles. If you don't enjoy competition and PVP why the hell are you playing Dead by Daylight?
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@Onyx_Blue said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1594761#Comment_1594761
If you want advantages just look at intel perks and TR perks.
Disadvantages are distance related. The perks I mentioned help reduce the issues involved due to them allowing for a nice rotation of add-on into perk vice versa.
They would, except that you can mindgame them into thinking you're using a Tier 3 related add-on such as Judith's Tombstone. The mindgame potential is strong with it
I wanted to talk about Haddonfield and Spooky Myers in its own post. I used to hate Haddonfield; for every other Myers build it is really a pain. The terrain is long and awkward, it is hard to track and prevent the generators, and it is largely Survivor friendly. Everything reverses when you play Spooky Myers. You can sweep every generator simply by a short strip of street and always know when and where you need to put pressure. The basement is ALWAYS in the Myers house which is in the center of the action. You can get a 3-Gen lock very easily.
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@Onyx_Blue said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1594802#Comment_1594802
I phrased it as 'potentially viable' for that very reason.
Also, what's your perk set-up with the Scratched Mirror? Because I never use slowdown perks on it, since they're boring.
Well I do use slowdown Perks. For Spooky Myers it is necessary; he is too slow himself. But they don't slow the game down THAT much, merely offset his weakness. I run:
Hex: Ruin
Hex: Thrill of the Hunt
Play With Your Food
Sloppy Butcher
*I may trade out Sloppy Butcher for Hex: Undying later (or Thrill of the Hunt). The current build slows down the Generators a bit if I keep constant pressure on them (which the Wall Hack allows me to do). Thrill of the Hunt ensures, usually within the first 15 seconds, someone touches a Totem and I get a notification of where I can find the survivors. This saves a lot of time and lets me reach them before the first Generator pops. I'm actually pretty good at grabbing them off Generators and Totems in that first minute.
The key to Spooky Myers is NEVER letting the Gen pressure up even for a minute. Always be chasing them and use your ability to see them all to make sure you chase them into each other. This in turns means you are pushing even more off the generators. No Red Stain and no Terror Radius means you have them paranoid. By heavy pressure they always feel you are right there (even when you are not).
If you can get anyone into the Basement, well Spooky Myers is a total nightmare. You can camp that basement from a long way off and see every attempt to rescue. You can be seen leaving and then time your return to come down the stairs and grab them as they try to unhook and put them up by their friends. The Meat Plant has a HORRIBLE basement which is way out of the way. Fortunately the rest of the map is very Spooky Myers friendly. The Swamp has excellent basements. Lerys is a coin toss. The basement spawning in the big medical theater area is awesome. Spawning off the office is terrible. Cold Wind Farms never has the basement in the center but you can always reach it by cutting the center. I like to chase or ambush my people in the center whenever possible for that basement. Also if you pull the map with the three story house, the hook at the top is even harder to rescue people from than a basement. And nine times out of ten the basement is in the same building.
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@[Deleted User] said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/188347/salt-is-fun
Sounds like you are salty you got called out for scummy tactics and you still didn't 4k while playing strongest killer/build, then came here for validation. To tell you truth, you'd have to be ######### killer to be proud of that "achievement". LOL, that's just silly :D
In fairness to the OP (if his information is correct) he earned great emblems in all his categories which means he was playing the game and there was no time for "scummy" tactics whatever those may be. Moreover, so now Freddy is the strongest Killer/Build? I thought that was Spirit judging by all the whining and whinging. Or was it Nurse? That was only like 2-3 weeks ago. I think it kind of undermines this argument that the OP was playing something broken when nobody seems to be able to decide which is the strongest build. As always, it seems to be whatever the Killer happened to be playing and won the game with.
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@Demonl3y said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/188264/camping-is-being-somewhat-punished
I dont care for pips and still dont camp.
But theres nothing wrong with camping anyway.
Its a really ineffective strat besides if its endgame.
This is a gross generalization. Camping is often a bad strategy, but every match is different. If I notice right away that I'm playing against super altruistic types, camping becomes a major and effective strategy. I usually learn their stripe from the very first hook and will adapt appropriately. The real test is when you put someone in the basement. If I find hooking someone brings not one but 2+ people running and prematurely (i.e. they don't get some stuff done and milk the hook time) I'm going to use that golden goose bait. It would be stupid NOT to do it.
Likewise the really altruistic types have a bad habit of hiding where you can still see them and so you know they are right at hand. They won't leave the area. You can't really camp when they have already come to you. Again, it would be stupid to walk away at that point. You adapt on the fly and you apply whatever tactics are going to work in a specific match.
Camping is only a bad strategy if you are facing people who milk that hook time to get as much done as possible, don't over commit to the rescue, and are clever enough to pick their Generators while you waste time to make sure there is no possibility of a 3-Gen. In that kind of match, which you learn with the first Hook, camping is a really bad idea. :) You adapt on the fly and work on pressure and sometimes slugging. I have found that groups that are deeply intent on Generators and milking that time are vulnerable to slugging. Just as they are trying to get as much done as they can while that 1st Hook is ongoing, if I run another down and slug them fast enough to down them I move on to another. Such folk tend to take a minute to switch gears and realize what you are doing. And if you do everything right, they shift into altruistic mode to try and turn the game back around and BINGO camping is back on the menu.
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@Clevite said:
"You didn't do that. You engaged in the same cringe worthy shaming behavior "
Kinda what you did with this quote.
Pot and kettle my friend.
Although I will not respect a forever freddy build, I will respect ones right to play it.
But is there a need to post it? The victory itself is win. If you need to reminisce with strangers it seems one is searching for more then they can ask from a video game.
Also why are we talking about this. It's OPs post. Let them defend themselves if they want.
You know why we are talking about it. And why are you trying to instigate a further fight with the OP. I think you made a solid point about him making the original post and why the intent of it was not a good idea. Likewise, I felt the need to point out that your taking potshots at anyone and everyone who ever decides to build this Forever Freddy thing, is likewise not exactly "cool and froody" as Zaphod would say. You made your point already. I made mine. The OP likely has read everything said here and decided that perhaps the manner in which he called out the Salt was ill-advised and doesn't have anything to add to it.
For my own part, if we are going to talk about Salt, I dislike it. I get my share of it, as I'm sure everyone who plays this game does. When I get it I tend to respond with something like, "Yes, let me taste the delicious salt of your tears." I don't even really like doing that as it isn't humble in victory. Of course, I'm not going to say anything so crass until I get the onslaught of tedious salt, profanity, racism, threats, or people telling me they hope I (or my family or pets) die. I choose that specific crass because it works and shuts them up.
Of course, I also record every single game now, and report (with video) any violation. If nothing salty happens, I can delete the file. This process is also tedious, but since only reports with video have teeth, it is the virtual world we live in. I'm not sure when good sportsmanship stopped being taught. I know it must have halted at some point, because the evidence is all around us. I'm old, and I've commented on this before. I've been around since the first real PVP game which was Pong. I was around before the consoles when all video games were in arcades. Those were wild times. The difference then, as opposed to now, is that nobody had any silly expectations or false notions of what PVP style games represent. They were a sport, full contact albeit virtually. Nobody played the much later Team Fortress and had rants about that Heavy Weapon Guy is OP and toxic riddling me with bullets. Do you see where I'm going with this?
Dead by Daylight is an unapologetic PVP game. One side is a serial Killer and the other is the potential victims who hope to exit the gate as Survivors. if this game had existed back in the day, NONE of this garbage talk would exist. It wouldn't even occur to us to whine about it. People who didn't like the game would find another. The people who did would put their heads down and charge forward. And we would laugh about it afterwards no matter how brutal the loss. Sometimes you eat the bear, and sometimes he eats you. We need that attitude to come back. We don't need shaming, people discussing what is "toxic" or any other subjective "out of game" garbage. You go into the game, you play hard, you come out and you make nice. It isn't that hard.
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@KrazyAce13 said:
So killers are forced to stay with who they choose once the lobby is found sooo.... why not the same for survivors? To me just seems like another biased limitation given to killers, and before anyone says something about killers powers, survivors that are played more often will most likely have more useful items (pretty much their “power”)so the quick change of survivors can potentially give them a big change on the outcome. For example a swf goes in and last second decides lets do a hatch play teammate a grab a key teammate b get the map or lets sabo squad this #########, or burn a map offering for haddonfield oh we need to change to so and so for that item/perk/offering... hey devs your bias is showing....
Well, technically you are not forced to do so. You can choose, prior to the start of the game, to leave the Lobby. After you leave, change to the Killer you want to play and get back into line and wait for the next Lobby. I don't really have an opinion on the Survivors swapping things around because 1) Survivors are just Skins anyway, and 2) They can't see the Killer.
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@Clevite said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1595318#Comment_1595318
Once again it's not really what you play. Like we have all seen every build imaginable.
It's the silly , come to the forum and post about it. Which opens you to others opinions and critiques. You must understand that when you make a post.
Sure I can play spirit and 4k every game. Do i think the people in the forums give a #########, No. Do i think anyone is surprised , No.
So, make a post to celebrate salt, well then expect some.
Yes and no. I don't make a habit of coming here and celebrating my victories. I have posted on people engaging in being bad sports when it was particularly vile because I think such behavior is bad for the community and demonstrates zero self respect. The only morals and morays I go by here are:
- Don't cheat with hacks or lag switches.
- Don't disconnect; if I start a game, I finish it.
- Be humble in victory and gracious in defeat.
That's it. So do I think the OP was out on a limb celebrating a victory? Sure. But at the same time, I also realize he was doing it to call out the Salt he experienced. If you had jumped into the thread and called him out for not being humble or tooting his own horn, I wouldn't have said a thing. You didn't do that. You engaged in the same cringe-worthy shaming behavior by attacking the OP for his choice of Build. That does, by the way, also attack every other Player who decides to play that Build. It is shaming, plain and simple. You seem like a smart guy, so I know you take my meaning here. I don't disagree with your intent to challenge the victory lap, but you tacked on something just as bad.
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I'm going to go out on the same limb. It is not my responsibility to make the game fun for other people. It is my job to play the game hard and to the best of my ability. I should:
- Not cheat with hacks or lag switches.
- Play the game to the end. If I start it; I will finish it.
- Be humble in victory and gracious in defeat.
In short, my ONLY responsibility is to be a good sport. This is a PVP game. I repeat, my job is to do my best to win within the rules. I am responsible for my own fun, just as other Players are responsible for their own fun. If someone doesn't enjoy PVP games, why they heck are they here? There are plenty of games that are not PVP. If your fun is depleted (mine isn't) by other people affecting your actions and/or beating you, this is not the hobby for you. Does this make sense?
You never get more out of a venture than you, yourself, put into it. That means it is your OWN attitude and competitive spirit which determines if you will have fun in a PVP game.
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@Clevite said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1595245#Comment_1595245
It's not shaming, it's what happens when you open a post exclaiming you love the salt and act like you accomplished something by using one of the strongest killers in the game with perhaps the most boring build out there.
If you want to play that way so be it. If you want to post about it on the forums, well then enjoy the salt he seemed so inclined to celebrate to begin with.
But let's not act like 4king with Forever Freddy is anything new.
Hrm. Given the fact that the META is all about the Gen-Rush and trying to make sure games end in five minutes by SWF, I can't imagine that there is anything unreasonable (or surprising) about taking Perks to slow things back down. Given the the upcoming Perks being released are also designed to slow down the Gen-Rush, I can only imagine the grief and shaming (and it is shaming) that some are going to engage in.
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I don't get the desire to shame any Player for choosing their favorite Killer. Seriously, those of you who felt the need to chime in and attack the guy simply because he plays Freddy, what's your problem? I'm sick of people attacking other Players for their choice of Killer, Perks, Survivor Perks, play style, and so on. If Killer, Perk, etc. is legal in the game, save your salt and personal attacks. I don't play Freddy because I don't like the style, not because I want to pretend I'm "too good" to choose a potent Killer. I don't sit around trying to shame Survivors at the end when all four of them have the exact same, predictable Perks. Power to them for making their own choices. If/when the problem becomes too much the DEV will handle it. Our fellow Players don't need us going around like crazed fanatics proselytizing their religion. I don't need people in the real world telling me what to believe, eat, who to date, and so on. I sure as heck don't need DBD version of the same insufferable people in here.
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@PassarinoT said:
Not to complain about slugging, I understand it can be needed sometimes as killer, but even as a killer main stuff like this is just so unnecessary and rude. I just played a round as survivor, didn't do anything toxic except be good at running away. No items brought into the round, no DS, no DH, nothing intense for perks. And then I'm the last survivor found and I get downed during EGC and slugged until I bleed out while the killer just stands on me the whole time. There were hooks nearby. There was no need to slug, I never teabagged or anything.
I thought maybe a nice counter to something so toxic and rude would be a soul guard-like effect after you reach less than 25% of your bleedout timer.
I understand slugging can be useful, but stuff like this just needs to stop.
What would y'all think? After you reach 25% bleedout timer, you can fully recover and gain an endurance status for 8 seconds after recovering.
Even as a diehard killer main, I don't see any issues with this because I never slug anybody past 75% bleedout.
The Killer has no idea if you have DS. These days I assume EVERYONE has it. Doing otherwise has cost me dearly. I'd have slugged you and started a timer. I have one on my desk now, so I can pick you up when the timer runs out. Depending on how far along the EGC is, however, you might end up on the ground till auto-sacrificed. Don't hate the Player, hate the game. Most of my games have groups where 3-4 of them have the same Perks and most of them (if not all) have DS.
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Interesting idea, but I'd rather see Teke Teke first: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Teke_Teke
Both of these run the risk of saturation of Japanese vengeful spirits, since we already have one. It might be prudent to look for such creatures from other parts of the world. A Lamia or Harpy come to mind.
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@Onyx_Blue said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1592852#Comment_1592852
I'm not saying you use it be 'viable'. Scratched Mirror is only potentially viable on Indoor Maps. Vanity does have potential to be viable on any map, with the right build to compliment it. Paired with either Mirror Shard or Jewelry Box; along with perks such as Whispers, Tinkerer, Enduring, Brutal Strength, Bamboozle/Fire Up, Nemesis, PWYF, STBFL, Dark Devotion, M&A, I'm All Ears, Surge, Ruin, Corrupt Intervention.
The reason why Pig and Wraith have access to their powers with their Letter and All Seeing add-on is because their powers have audio cues before they can attack. Plus their's is 12m. 16m for a killer that can attack whenever he wants is strong in it's own right.
This is a commonly held belief, but I'm challenging it. I've been playing Spooky Myers (Scratch Mirror + Boyfriend's Memo) almost constantly and trying it on an ever increasing number of maps. I've found it is not just "potentially" viable, but downright effective on:
Meatplant, Lerys, Swamp, Midwich, and Haddonfield
It can holds its own on all the Cold Wind Farm maps except Rotten Fields by careful use of the center for crossing and the terrain (of which there is plenty) for ambush. I have limited testing in on McMillian but I have found I can win there, just not enough games yet to give a confident answer.
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@Jake_FromStatefarm said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/188309/new-tournament-people-needed
By the way this tourney is based on Playstion!!
Rats. I'm a PC player so that leaves me out? I would think with Cross Play it wouldn't need to be limited to a specific type.
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@naitsirhC said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1594630#Comment_1594630
I'm talking about a competitive mode against other players not a custom game. I just use custom games to mess around with friends...
I understood what you were saying, but if we create a "Competitive" que that by default creates the so-called Casual Que by default. What I'm saying is it won't be casual at all. That can be done with Custom Games. The current META is already competitive, so you don't NEED to make something else for them.
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@Jake_FromStatefarm said:
Hello DBD community! Im Jake from statefarm and I have a spooky proposition for all of you! Starting September 20th there will be a laid back tournament for DBD! I am the co captain of Dwight Lives Matter (name change coming soon). We are in need of survivors and killers from any skill level! This Tourney is very laid back and flexible to most people's schedules so dont be worried about fitting into specific times and such! The majority of information for this comp is on facebook, however we have our own discord for the team! If you'd like to join or maybe try out a few practices with us please comment down below! If you have any questions don't be afraid to ask!
I'm down. Send me the details!
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@Pryzm said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1594630#Comment_1594630
Competitive game does not really fit the mold well.
- You have to recruit players yourself as opposed to just readying-up. If they created a "lobby" of players for customized game.
- No growth or advancement - biggest issue
- Limited customization. If this was a fully developer-mode type of customized game it might make it better. As in, ability to eliminate perks or items, adjust gen speeds, etc.
You are missing the point. "Casual Game" is an entirely subjective term, like "toxic." They both mean whatever people want them to mean. If the so-called Casual Que is created, everyone is going to have a very different idea of that. Within one week you will be have people screaming about the toxic non-casual gamers, or people who want even another que for even MORE casual gamers. When you have a Que open up to the nameless faces of the internet, you cannot control how they define things, nor exclude them.
With a custom game, which is designed SPECIFICALLY for you and your friends to play together (and use any Add Ons or Perks you want) you small, cohesive group can DECIDE together what casual means. Logistically it is the ONLY way possible to achieve what is being talked about. The other way is simply a nightmare of epic proportions waiting to happen. Let's say Myers doesn't feel like dealing with those highly competitive SWF. He just wants what HE sees as a casual game, i.e. what he defines it as. He then proceeds to go on an epic rampage. I'm sure it will feel very relaxing and casual to him.
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@naitsirhC said:
I have an idea for a new mode in Dead by Daylight... Some of you may not like this, and if that's you, then just leave now. If you are interested and willing to leave feedback, go ahead and read.
Premise:
A new mode for Dead by Daylight; Competitive mode. Many players, including me, are complaining about those toxic survivors or sweaty killers when they just wanna have fun on the game. So, in competitive mode, ranks actually matter. It's just like any other game, ranks just show how good you are. Until there is a way for better matchmaking, it will basically just be how matchmaking is right now. Another mode will also be added; casual mode. This is for players who wanna play the game with no consequence; just to have fun.
Competitive Mode:
Every week, the perks that are available in the shrine are out of rotation for competitive mode. For those of you who do not know what this means, it essentially is just a ban of perks for the current week. So for example, if Adrenaline is in the shrine of secrets, it will be disabled while playing competitive mode. This effect only persists for the week until the shrine resets and we get our new set of perks that will be out of rotation. (Maybe they can also do the same for Killers and Items out of rotation, but that might be too difficult and not needed at all) This mode will also disable Moris and Keys from being used.
Casual mode:
This is just the game without a ranking system. The idea is that you still have a 'rank' but it is invisible to everyone, including you. This is just to have good matchmaking without the stress of losing your rank. (If you couldn't pick it up from the context, you can still pip up or down, but you will not be able to see it. This is just to have good matchmaking without making players sweat for the 4k or the escape) The competitive and causal rankings will be separate.
Season Rewards:
You know how BHVR is implementing rank reset rewards? Yeah, well it will basically be that. here's an idea, on the day of rank reset, the season ends. You will be rewarded with either cosmetics, charms, bloodpoints or shards based on what color rank you were. Ideally, you would get a cosmetic for landing at rank 1, because that is the most significant reward. You would also get all the rewards from the previous colors. For example, if gray ranks got rewarded with bloodpoints, you would get the cosmetic as well as bloodpoints. This gives players an incentive for getting to rank 1 other than the steam achievement. Casual play will not have any such rewards.
Rank Decay:
Every day that you don't play competitive mode, you will lose a pip. This is a simple way to prevent players from getting to rank 1 in competitive mode and then just not playing until the end of the season as to get the best rewards.
Welp, that's all I have for you. I think this would be a great addition to the game. What do you think?
Technically this already exists, it is called a CUSTOM GAME where you and your friends get together, fill out the Survivor side, and one person is the Killer. I'm not trying to be sarcastic; I'm just stating a fact. Your idea is fatally flawed, but not because you don't mean well.
What exactly would prevent the deranged, I just love tormenting people from pretending to want to play casual games so they can go in and slaughter you like lambs? :) What is a casual game? It is all subjective. You will have the SAME problems you have now (probably worse) and simply have created more Ques.
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Dead Men Walking?
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@mintchapstick said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1594395#Comment_1594395
I know what it means. It's taking the game hostage for one player by making them completely unable to play the game--and it's making the rest of the team unable to actually interact with the killer. It's pretty much a complete match killer and shouldn't be an acceptable strategy.
This is not the meaning of "holding the game hostage" and while I can understand your frustration, accuracy in terminology is paramount when making suggestions or filing a complaint. Camping is part of this game. It has always been part of this game. It will always be part of this game. Acceptance of that fact will cause you less stress than raging over something native to the process.
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@IIITweedleIII said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1594351#Comment_1594351
There's a difference between monitoring and facecamping. If a killer is across the entire map but still keeping an interest in the survivors they hooked and if say Nurse blinks as fast as she can to them, fine. But that still gives enough time a teammate can pull off a risky unhook. And still succeed. Perk or not. But likely it's a Face! Camping Bubba with his tantrums which he'll be right in their face. No such luck in pulling off teammates. That's the opportunity gap between the two.
Actually no. You have a BETTER chance against a Bubba than you do a Nurse, Hag, or even a clever Spirit or Demo. I can "assure" you that they can get into there almost instantly and you won't know they are coming. At least with the Bubba you know what you are getting into. As a Spooky Myers I can (and do) camp a basement (or hook) from well outside that zone, see all your movement and still get there the same time as you to grab you as you try to unhook. :)
Long story short, camping is a valid tactic. It isn't going anywhere. The time is better spent learning to play around it. Just be happy that Killers are paying a trade off in points for the tactic... well some of them are. :)
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@IIITweedleIII said:
Considering they actually have a system that detects camping. At the very least then combined it with the pallet Stun animation and Flashlight visual effect and give Camping Killers a 3s long Headache for camping near a recently hooked survivor 3m away. Make an initiative that causes a Camper to lose motivation to camp. 🤦♂️
If you say so. :) We have people who can camp the hook from the other side of the map. This stuff is just to placate people who complain endlessly.
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@OllieHellhunter said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1594299#Comment_1594299
In game hovering over the emblem itll say where you got the points for it, one of them had negative points for proximity to hooked survivors. It is also included on the wiki and I will provide a image to back up this part, as I need to get a new power supply for my PC before I can get anything in game as evidence.
https://us.v-cdn.net/6030815/uploads/VL8CEDBNKHGU/screenshot-20200903-154146-chrome.jpg
Thank you very much. Interesting stuff. I was certainly unaware of this myself. So it seems this is already accounted for, and the trade off seems more than fair to me.
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@OllieHellhunter said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1594241#Comment_1594241
Proximity to hooked survivors reduces points for one of the categories, I think its chaser, which a killer that was actually camping wouldn't have much of anyway.
Again, where did you get this information? Is this posted somewhere? It is true that someone who is camping a hook is "not" by default out chasing people, and that would have the effect of decreasing the said points they earn in that category, but you seem to be inferring that proximity to the hook is applying an extra penalty, i.e. reduction in said points. I don't think that is correct, and would very much like to know if that is what you are saying, and where you are finding this information?
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@Erk said:
To explain, if you stand near a survivor for a long time, the game doesn't give you a pip (you lose points cause of that) !
Now, what about killers that don't care about ranks, you might say. There is nothing being done about that since no matter what you do, people are going to exploit tricks/glitches/bugs.
Where did you get this idea? :) Is this posted somewhere? Or are you referring to the fact that someone camping isn't out earning other emblems?
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@BaldursGate2 said:
The first 40 games i wrote down every perk, but it was pretty clear, that only 9 perks were used the majority of time.
So, 400 survivors.
Rankings:
- DS - 174 - 44%
- Iron Will - 130 - 33%
- Borrowed Time - 129 - 32%
- Dead Hard - 127 - 32%
- Selfcare - 119 - 30%
- Adrenalin - 95 - 24%
- Sprintburst - 80 - 20%
- Spinechill - 70 - 18%
- Unbreakable - 66 - 17%
= 990 of 1600 (every survivor used 4 perks) are by just 9 perks - 62%.
The DS + Unbreakable Combo was used by 40 survivors. 37 games by one, 2 games by two and 1 game by three.
I am not surprised. I don't think the data will change much by 1000 games, maybe 1-3% variable.
All other perks where used <30 times. I only have the old data from the devs in mind for DS, where it was around 43%.
What I would suggest is that there isn't a necessarily a problem with all those other unused Perks, but rather that these few are SO GOOD that all the others suffer by comparison. That means one would either have to improve all the others to the point where they look palatable (HUGE JOB AND RISK) or tweak these back down to where they are not auto-include.
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I should, ethically, be crystal clear about my own bias and conflict of interest here. I like to play Spooky Myers Builds (also known as Jump Scare Myers). That means I'm SLOW but I can wall hack. I love the basement because it offsets my greatest weakness while playing into my greatest strength. I can camp the Basement without even being in it, the building, or that close. I can appear to leave and watch people head for the rescue. I can usually time my entrance to make a successful grab and put the would be rescuer on their own hook.
If I get two people on the hooks in the basement at the same time, the game is usually over. The others either come try to rescue too and get nailed, or they realize the situation and try to do Generators but with their reduced numbers (and by the time they make the choice to write their pals off) I can safely leave the Basement and keep the pressure I need up without too much trouble. All that being said, it is possible to get people out of the Basement from me and from those crazy Bubba builds too. It isn't easy but it is doable. It requires coordination and timing. And if it were easy, there wouldn't be much point to the game.
My helpful tip is to stay away from the darn basement. Survivors seem to have a strange obsession with running toward its vicinity in chases, wanting to poke around down there early when they assume the Killer isn't watching to check out the chests, and for some reason fixate on any Generator nearest to the Basement. And if there is a Totem spawned near it, Christmas has come early. They will come back again and again. Like I said, I only need two on hooks in there at the same time and the game is usually over. So, as a Survivor it behooves you to figure out where the Basement is and take that into account when you choose your Generators as well as the direction you are running. Most Basement Dweller Builds can be severely curtailed simply by avoiding that area of the map.
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@BaconyToast said:
The Hatch punishes Killers for doing their job while rewarding Survivors for NOT doing their job.
Survivors don't work together? They don't complete generators? Don't heal each other? Don't Unhook? Rewarded with Hatch
Killer maxes out literally everything, sacrifices 3 people? Punished with Survivor free Hatch Escape
And please, The Killer closing the Hatch isn't even a death sentence, The Survivor can STILL escape by opening the doors because most of the time the doors are so far apart a survivor can open one before the killer even gets to them.
If the Hatch remains RNG: After 3 survivors are Sacrificed all generators are blocked, doors are revealed to all indefinitely, The Hatch spawns Closed and must be opened to work. The Hatch plays the same sound as a Door when it's being opened for the same radius as a Door. Door Opening perks apply and it takes the same time to open as a door.
If it becomes stationary for all maps: Spawns opened, cannot be closed, both players no longer have collision within 10 meters of The Hatch, The Hatch closes after 1 minute, starting End Game Collapse.
By Collision I mean with each other, not Noclipping through objects
Edit: Tbh you're all making good points. Although I think Keys should not open the hatch ever and The Pig's traps should kill or have some sort of effect when on the head of a survivor when they jump in the hatch. Even if it's like "-1000 points"
Meh. I don't see anymore problem with the Hatch than I do with NOED. The game has to keep moving. The Hatch is thematically appropriate to the genre, i.e. a last ditch attempt to escape as a sole survivor. Have I lost Survivors to a Hatch escape? Sure. It is just part of the game.
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@Pulsar said:
Meh, I just had a Tapp DC so Meg could get hatch when I was about to get a 4-man Devour
feelsbadfortapp
That isn't a problem with the Hatch; that is a problem with the SWF 5th Perk (Comms) wherein they had to both KNOW that the other knew where the Hatch was, time it appropriately, and so on.
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@TheClownIsKing said:
Just why?
I had this friend who couldn't maintain a relationship. Every woman he dated, all very different, ended up breaking up with him. It would always end in acrimony. My friend would complain endlessly about how horrible women are, rant about their supposed feminine crazy, and on and on. After years of listening to this garbage, I finally had to say, "Look... buddy... the only thing all these women... all these relationships... have in common is YOU. What are the odds that these 30+ women are ALL defective and the source of the problem? Or could it be that this mystery is solved by the only common denominator?"
You sound like my friend. What are the odds "so many" of the Wraiths YOU encounter play like scumbags? Could it be that perhaps you are the one looking at things through scumbag-tinted glasses? Let's play Devil's Advocate here and consider the mere possibility that "so many" of the Wraith Players you run into play normally; that would mean it is you that sucks. Crazy theory huh?
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While I have seen the occasional commentaries on the Hatch, I haven't seen an endless wave of screeds and complaints about them. Mostly I see people trying to use the hatch as sort of a rhetorical trick, like bargaining, to try and get rid of the Mori. The two things are always kind of lumped together, a weird whataboutism. I don't care about the hatch; I repeat, I don't complain about the hatch. More power to the Survivors who manage to get away however they manage it.
I would make the same fun and sarcastic remarks about people whining and whinging about the Hatch as I would people crying about NOED. I just don't see it come up that often. Or perhaps I'm mired in all the idiotic "toxic" threads that I'm overlooking these other rants? Who knows. The Hatch is fine. The Mori is fine. The Perks are fine. Camping, tunneling, slugging, and body blocking are fine. I'm starting to think that some people enjoy complaining about games more than actually playing them.