LustForBP
LustForBP
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@SpaceCoconut said:
It depends on which role you're playing
Gen-rush is a killer concern.
Tunneling is a survivor concern.
Yes, they’re obvious concerns for one another.
Which is worse?
Both can end the game for an individual.
Survivors gen-rush, the killer suffers.
Killer tunnels, one survivor suffers.
However, a killer can prevent gen-rushing with a decent build or map pressure. Most survivors cannot prevent tunneling.
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@SpaceCoconut said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/945925#Comment_945925
The point is also over your head apparently.
Don't get mad at me and my opinion. Get mad at the devs who have implemented this system that punishes survivors for being tunneled lol
Far from mad at you. Is that the only thing people can come up with? Construct a critical argument rather than just spewing out that “because it’s in the game, it’s in the game”. I believe you only commented on the thread to advertise your YouTube. I’m not opposing that perspective on tunneling. I do, however, oppose your view that survivors deserve to be penalized if they didn’t help with the objective despite being targeted til they die.
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So, most of you think “gen-rush” is worse? How so? Explain.
Perks to aid in this “gen rush”:
corrupt intervention, discordance,fire up ,franklins demise ,huntress lullaby ,NoED ,Ruin, Mind breaker ,overcharge,pop goes the weasel ,rancor ,surveillance ,tinkerer , Thanatophobia, thrilling tremors, unnerving presence.
Perks to aid in tunneling:
crickets
because most perks result in exhaustion or are one and done perks.
The killer also has perks to aid against looping as well.
I just do not understand why “tunneling” is the go to for most killers. We literally have perks and add-ons to helps us with loopers and gen rushing.
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@leyzyman said:
Ok, I tried to read every post to get caught up, bit I couldn't do it. So if something is repeated, I am sorry. Also typing on phone.
Skip to paragraph 5 if you want to read my thoughts on the matter
So, @LustForBP, this post is about how some killers tunnel and camp survivors. Now, from what I read, there were some people who were getting mad about your ideas, and I will try to be neutral.
As of right now, before we actually get started, let me explain where I am coming from. I am currently a rank 11 survivor and a rank 13 killer, mainly because I havent played as much recently. Been enjoying GTA and Persona5. But, i have gotten both survivor and killer to rank 7. If i could have afforded more time, i feel like i could have gotten survivor to red ranks, and killer to lower purple ranks. Although, because matchmaking sucks, I have faced quite a few 4 man swf, with at least 2 red ranks, that knew how to play at green ranks. So I guess what I am saying is that rank doesn't matter to me at this point. I admit though, I play more survivor than killer, because I am usually stressed while playing killer, but as a solo survivor, I feel like I am less stressed. I used be be a claudette, but moved to jake as a survivor, and mainly play GF and Demo as killer, but like to dabble in other killers from time to time.
Alright, my argument...
So you say that you think it is unfair that killers tunnel and camp. The main issue between my ideas and your ideas is that you define tunneling as someone who chases you for a long time and after hooks. The after hooks part I agree, but I define the other part as committing to a chase. I am going to be using my terms for my explanation.
Like I said earlier, I do agree with your definition of camping.
I do agree that camping and tunneling isnt exactly the fairest thing to do. Being chased off hook and having the killed around you till you are struggling or even dead. But, this does punish the killer in 2 ways.
1. Killer will lose BP and will get less on the emblem ranking system for this.
2. The rest of the survivors are free to do as they want.
The feel of the post is that you are talking about a 1v1 scenario. Lots of people do it. Yeah, I agree that tunneling and camping is abused against 1 survivor. The rest of your team, however, could abuse this to finish every generator and escape. This is a team-oriented game after all. What are the other survivors doing during the time you are camped?
Another question is proxy camping. What if 2 other survivors are close by, and the killer has bbq? If the killer knows that most of the team is nearby, wouldn't s/he want to deal with 3 survivors not doing anything, or get the 1 doing something, and having the rest quickly back in the game?
Also, isn't it a good thing to be chased for a while? Like I said a couple paragraphs ago, if you can chase a killer for 5 minutes, and then he camps you, the rest of your team should be guaranteed an escape. Idk how you de-pip from that, as you should be rewarded for that. Unless the team is not doing any gens period.
Now at the end of the game, if the killer doesn't have any kills, or only 1 kill, i could see the idea for trying to confirm a kill. At that point, you just want to safety. At this point, all of the other survivors would probably pip, so unless they decided to not do generators.
I know there were other things said between you and others, but I am just focusing on the main topic.
TL;DR
Is tunneling and camping justified at the beginning of the match?: I think so.
Is tunneling justified?: only if it is the end of the game, I understand.
Is camping justified?: yes in circumstances.
Is tunneling and camping unpunished?: only if the team isn't doing the objective.
This is my opinion. Feel free to rebuttle.
You make fair points, but it’s still not my point.
Yes, if you’re teammates are in the proximity then it’s their fault you’re being camped.
Pips/Rank are not team-based. it’s how you perform individually.
Yes, your team benefits from a killer tunneling you. Yes, the killer is penalized for tunneling you, if your team escapes.
However, you are penalized for being tunneled.
Example: I played a game where I was tunneled as soon as the match started. I tapped a gen and the killer came to me. Me and my teammate both split. The killer came to me. (killer has ruin and Thanatophobia so progression is slowed already) I mistakenly hit a tree, I got hit. I manage to get distance thanks to the boost. The killer catches up, I DH. Exhausted. I manage to put distance on me and the killer. He catches up, downs me. Hooks me. He leaves. I get unhooked, killer immediately comes back, hits me. BT kicks in. My teammate tries to body block. He hits my teammate so my teammate scurries away. He tunnels me. Bam, 1 gen pops, 2 pops (maybe). Hooks me. I’m now on Struggle with maybe 2-3 minutes into the game. Killer leaves again. My teammate unhooks me, killer immediately comes back, downs me again. 3-4 gens popped. I get hooked, dead. Post-game award? No. I get de-pipped and awarded maybe 5k BP.
Now, tell me where that’s fair? I was innocent. Didn’t troll the killer, never had a chance to work on a gen, rescue a teammate, break totems, heal teammates etc. so it resorts in the game thinking I was not helping my team.
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@Ratatosk said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/945954#Comment_945954
Yeah I actually was just reading through your thread and was seeing all of the arguments about "counter/punish gen-rushing myeh myeh" so I figured I should make this to allow people that agree with me to voice that they agree with a person that agrees with them. That's a lot of agreement lmao.
Yeah, my argument was it’s unfair for survivors to de-pip for being tunneled early-game.
Gen-rush is a terrible excuse.
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Yeah, I got attacked in my thread “Killers and Tunneling”.
I play both sides, mostly a killer main.
I don’t believe in “gen-rushing” because that’s literally the objective for survivors. Killers have counters to it. My post was about killers tunneling survivors from the start of a game til they died without being able to properly play and end up losing a pip. The argument was, tunneling is an effective strategy because survivors can “gen-rush”.
The term is loosely used by killers with poor pressure or that strictly focus on tunneling.
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@SpaceCoconut said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/945899#Comment_945899
According to the devs rules, if you didn't unhook survivors, fix gens, or heal survivors... yes, you deserve to lose a pip regardless of the reason. You'll get a lot of boldness though :)
Regardless of the length of this thread, you're asking the devs to change something... something they might change by the end of 2020, but probably won't.
For now, suck it up buttercup. We're all stuck with the systems they have in place. Many of which many others before you have brought up over and over again which the devs have continued to ignore.
/thread
The point just went over your head, didn’t it? You have a terrible mindset if you think a survivor deserves to penalized for not having an opportunity to play.
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@NEVELEVEN11 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/945894#Comment_945894
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/945894#Comment_945894
No. I find a survivor and strike him the furst time. I then pursue him.right as i get close enough, im body blocked and thus stalled by a survivor. Or a survivor will crouch under a hook potentially helping a teammate struggle and escape. Body blocking or hook blocking will getyou tunneled by me.
Then you’re toxic. Unless it’s end game or you’re in a gen crisis where they’ve completed 3 or more. Being petty because survivors are playing as a team is honestly pathetic. I could understand if you’ve been trolled, as in, flashlighted, stunned at pallets where you didn’t know a survivor was there, etc. but tunneling because the survivors are playing as a team to prevent you tunneling is toxic.
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@SpaceCoconut said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/945887#Comment_945887
So blame the devs who make it possible to penalize a tunneled survivor. Don't ask killers to not use a tactic available.
Killers can't ask survivors to not loop.
the post isn’t asking anyone to not do anything. It’s asking for some sort of penalty deduction or induction. Why’s it fair to reward a killer who tunneled one survivor at the beginning and penalize that survivor? Do you seriously deserve to lose a pip because 2 minutes in you spent running from a killer tunneling you?
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@NEVELEVEN11 said:
While being killer, i only tunnel a player if theyve body blocked me from getting another survivor. You do that, im tunneling.
That’s a toxic tactic. Most survivors body block because you’ve been tunneling. So, you’re already playing toxic and now you make it worse by tunneling the helping hand? I do not understand it. Sure, if you’re down 2 gens or so or it’s EGC tunnel but if it’s at the start with 4-5 gens and you’re tunneling because someone bodyblocked for a teammate? That’s petty. Hit them and down them, hook them, go find the other guy or another survivor.
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@douggie123 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/115364/killers-and-tunneling
So want to make your toxic loops even more beneficial for you and screw the killers
Never said that. I’m a killer main and I drop a loop once I realize I’ve lost or they’re better than me. Simple as that. If a survivor can loop me very well, kudos to them. If as a killer, I get mad because of it and resort to tunneling only them, I’m pathetic.
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@SpaceCoconut said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/945869#Comment_945869
If a killer chooses to tunnel from start to finish... oh well. Die on the hook and move on to the next match.
MCote himself said that DbD is designed to be frustrating which makes it good gameplay apparently.
Don't get mad at the killers, get mad at the people who make it possible.
still not my point. Yeah, the game is based around frustrating each side. However, don’t penalize a survivor for a toxic tactic.
Tunneling is necessary per your videos example.
It’s unfair to penalize a survivors rank because they didn’t have an opportunity to play.
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Your video does not support an opposition to my discussion. I favor what you did. My opposition is survivors being penalized for being tunneled from the start to death. As in, match starts, killer tunnels you, you never have an opportunity to do anything else, dead. Lose pip, possibly rank, and no BP.
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@EnderloganYT said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/945850#Comment_945850
I mentioned the slugging lol. yeah it's less a cure and more akin to a painkiller. Won't end the problem, but might stop it for like one match.
Yeah, I just sort of reiterated it into my post haha. Every now and then it will work. But if the killer is really out to get you, what help is it? Lol
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@28_stabs said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/945805#Comment_945805
I told you what to do with tunneling. Now you ask me how to max bp???
You really have comprehension issues, don’t you? He didn’t ask how to Max BP. He was being a smart ass to the “point” you tried to make.
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@EnderloganYT said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/945839#Comment_945839
really? I guess there's naught we can do. decisive's really the only thing I can think of to stop it, and then you get slugged. oof.
Nope. You think DS is a cure all til you get slugged out of it or you miss a skill check. Not only that, it’s a literal one and done perk. Game over.
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@Ace_Of_Spades said:
Dude you're here trying to shame people for playing a certain way. Trying to punish aka "penalize" is shaming just in a sanctimonious fashion. Let alone all the other ######### you're spewing. Boo hoo you got tunnelled and think it's unfair. Now you can go back to whatever point you are trying to make. And I know people who are quitting because of the battle pass. So if you're telling me the player base is fine then how do we both know people quitting because of the direction the games going? Anyway you have a bone up your ass over this so just keep whining. I'mma let you go.
Lmao now who’s using an ad hominem? I could care less if killers are punished. I’m talking about NOT PENALIZING SURVIVORS who never had a fighting chance because of tunneling. Open your eyes and read instead of trying to sound like you have a bigger brain than me.
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@EnderloganYT said:
both often will keep the killer at lower ranks (15-16) so you need to get out of there. it'll certainly be a painful process, but eventually when you get to like green or something camping/tunneling should be down
I’m red rank survivor and killer. Tunneling is actually more often in Red/Purple than I find it elsewhere.
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@Waldorf_2R3 said:
Not that this comment is really for this thread, but I think this is something that should be said. Can the devs make using the hatch to escape the same kind of scoring that they use for Mori's. i understand that the hatch is a last ditch effort for the remaining survivor, but they shouldn't get more points for escaping through the hatch than they would with the exit gates. It would be a deterrent from using keys as often as they have been. Killer mains wouldn't be as upset about hatch escapes knowing this. Plus you won't have that one team mate that hides all game and waits for the hatch. I am a survivor main and I approve this message.
Please, create your own thread for this. I understand the motive behind it, but you’re hijacking the topic at hand.
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@thrawn3054 said:
While tunneling sucks it exists for a reason. There are the people that cling to the excuse of it being efficient. But there will be times where it is the right thing to do. If the survivor has been toxic. By which I mean actually toxic. Not using loops or perks. Or the game is over. Gates are open, and someone is on the hook. But I do agree that tunneling of the hook is, generally speaking, a cowards play.
I definitely know it exists for a reason. I’ve continuously explain that this post is about tunneling one survivor from the start. Not during end game or when most gens are repaired.
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@Scootermarrrr said:
Holy #########. No wonder the developers ignore you whiney babies. Every post on this forum is a whooooole lot of bitching. Y'all need to grow the ef up. Holy hell.
good one. Maybe you need to grow up and learn to construct a proper argument. Nobody is “bitching”. I’ve laid out a debate.
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@CrispyChestnuts said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/945474#Comment_945474
If you don't believe we can comprehend, why waste your breath? I know that you know that we get it and you are just using an attack ad hominem to marginalize your dissenters.
I am far from using an ad hominem to marginalize anything. Each and every killer that has posted in this discussion has been extremely bias towards tunneling. The discussion wasn’t about tunneling during EGC or if gens are being popped left and right. It’s about a survivor being penalized because he was tunneled from start to death. Even if teammates assisted by attempting to body block, take a hit, etc. the killer still tunnels that one person. It’s not about the other survivors winning or hiding more, it’s about not penalizing a survivor that never had a chance to play properly.
But good one, the only one attempting ad hominem has been the individual personally blaming me when I play survivor for being tunneled.
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@28_stabs said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/945725#Comment_945725
If nobody go down for you, you dont go down for them. As simple as that. Do generators or other actions when its safe.
If killer allow you to heal yourself.. well, heal and take more hits. As simple as that. :D You can waste all of killers time by bodyblocking and healing multiple times. You can block windows, doors, pallets and narrow ways. There are more than enough places block killer.
Jesus. You are outstandingly biased towards killers tunneling. You completely ignore the statement we’ve both made about killers ignoring those that bodyblock or assist the survivor being tunneled.
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@Ace_Of_Spades said:
Yada yada yada. This game has aspects no one likes. Every tactic that didn't abuse a glitch or bug is valid. Let's not pretend rank means anything. I've camped and tunnelled before. I would bet at least 95% of players have done it and the other 5% are liars. Sure it sucks but the survivors have all the tools they need to make it suck for killer. Can't we all just admit this game sucks sometimes and try our best to change our reactions to it? Shaming others for how they play isn't gonna solve these problems. In fact it'll just make them double down and maybe even stop playing. "Well it's fine if they stop they're baby killers who camp." This game has a declining player base and we need all the killers we can get. Campers or not. Campers turn into non campers once they notice the point difference. Tunneling is just gonna keep happening. Too many factors go into play when it comes to it.
You also talk about players quitting for being shamed for playstyle. Just imagine how many quit from being tunneled. I know quite a few people. I tried to get a friend into dbd and he was tunneled for 2-3 games and never touched the game again. Think about how toxic that seems to new players. Now please, back to the topic on hand.
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@Ace_Of_Spades said:
Yada yada yada. This game has aspects no one likes. Every tactic that didn't abuse a glitch or bug is valid. Let's not pretend rank means anything. I've camped and tunnelled before. I would bet at least 95% of players have done it and the other 5% are liars. Sure it sucks but the survivors have all the tools they need to make it suck for killer. Can't we all just admit this game sucks sometimes and try our best to change our reactions to it? Shaming others for how they play isn't gonna solve these problems. In fact it'll just make them double down and maybe even stop playing. "Well it's fine if they stop they're baby killers who camp." This game has a declining player base and we need all the killers we can get. Campers or not. Campers turn into non campers once they notice the point difference. Tunneling is just gonna keep happening. Too many factors go into play when it comes to it.
Player base is far from down on Xbox with GP. Nobody is shaming anyone except those in opposition to my disapproval of killers tunneling one survivor from the start til they die. My reaction will remain the same to that.
Mostly everyone that tunnels has admitted it and I admitted I’ve done it til i was on the receiving end and lost pips and rank because I never fully had a chance to play.
Plenty of survivors have come out and said its unjust especially when you try and assist the tunneled teammate and the killer persists for that one survivor.
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@KeepingItCooler said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/945665#Comment_945665
What happens when you only play solo queue, like myself, and don't have a SWF team that would go down for you? What do you suggest a survivor to do when they play solo and hook save someone and try to intentionally get hit for the unhooked person only for the killer to ignore my body blocking and go right for the unhooked person, or better yet they hit me and still go after the unhooked person with 5 gens still up at the beginning of the match? That's what this dude is talking about, not when there's two or three gens left and the killer needs to do something to apply more pressure, so they tunnel to get 1 kill.
Thank you. It seems the only people that understand this are ones that actually try and play fair.
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@dkyguy1995 said:
It comes down to the fact it's impossible to punish a killer for this without preventing him from playing the game normally. Name a restriction on the killer that doesn't actively punish them and make it very easy for survivors to exploit for easy hook saves constantly without borrowed time. If you don't want to be tunnled, hope your team runs BT and you should run DS. Seriously come up with a way the killer should be punished and I'll show you an easy way for the survivor to exploit the killers inability to punish that for fear of some kind of bloodpoint loss or something similar
As I mentioned, a timer before you can actually lose a pip or rank can be installed.
Everything is exploitable, but there needs to be a system in place to aid survivors that are on the receiving side of this flawed tactic.
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@28_stabs said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/945599#Comment_945599
Killers do not spawn on top of survivors. You are tunneled, because YOU dont hide.
Its OK that it is hard to get out of tunneling. Killer must be able to kill survivors, lol. What next - punish killers for hurting survivors?
If your life is so valuable, your teammates should go down for you before its too late. They should do it before you are at the death hook. If your teammates never really care about you, then you shouldnt play too careless. It all comes back to you, eventually. Think about it.
For some reason my post to this is under review lol.
Anyways, I’ll try and rewrite what I wrote.
Killers can spawn relatively close to survivors. As in, you bump each other within 10-20 seconds of match start.
Once again, this has nothing to do with HIDING. a survivors role is not to “hide”. It’s to complete gens and hopefully escape. I didn’t get red rank in survivor by hiding nor red in killer by tunneling.
Can you stay on point? You continuously throw me into the mix like I’m fighting for myself. This is for the community of survivors that are bullied from the get go.
Should a killer be able to tunnel in EGC or if gens are popped left and right? Yes, it helps the killer.
Should a survivor be penalized for dying in the first few minutes of the match because they were the only one targeted? No.
Should a killer be rewarded for eliminating a survivor without messing with the others? No.
Also, it’s hard for you teammates to take a hit when you’re the target. I’m not arguing in favor of survivors. I’m arguing in favor of not penalizing survivors that weren’t given an opportunity to play.
So, instead of telling ME to think about it, you think about it.
The post is about removing how harshly survivors are penalized if they get killed without being able to do anything. I’ve been on the receiving and I’ve done it to survivors. It’s unfair to say the least.
It has absolutely zilch to do with hiding or tunneling end game or trolling survivors.
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@28_stabs said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/945599#Comment_945599
Killers do not spawn on top of survivors. You are tunneled, because YOU dont hide.
Its OK that it is hard to get out of tunneling. Killer must be able to kill survivors, lol. What next - punish killers for hurting survivors?
If your life is so valuable, your teammates should go down for you before its too late. They should do it before you are at the death hook. If your teammates never really care about you, then you shouldnt play too careless. It all comes back to you, eventually. Think about it.
Do you ever stay on point? Killers can spawn relatively close to survivors. I’ve had plenty of games where we spawn in and the killer is on me in less than 20 seconds and same when I’m playing killer.
Your teammates can’t go down for you, if the killer is purposely tunneling you. Once again, it has NOTHING to do with hiding.
It’s not ok to not be able to not get out of tunneling. What’s your basis for that ridiculous statement?
Penalize a survivor for terrible RNG? No.
Reward a killer for target tunneling? No.
is it ok for a killer to tunnel during EGC or if gens are popping left and right? Yes, because we deserve to save face.
Is it ok for a killer to tunnel a single survivor without ever attempting to catch others? Absolutely not.
Thats my argument. Are you going to counter-argue or just continue to try and attack me as a player?
A survivors role isn’t to “hide”. It’s to repair gens and escape.
Also, I didn’t get red rank by hiding and I didn’t get red rank by tunneling. I actually know how to play, without ever having a rank 50 character nor unlocking all teachables.
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@Raven014 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/945632#Comment_945632
It's more of a fact like: the survivor has wasted enough of the killers time, any more will punish you kind of mentality. The fact that a survivor could, in theory, loop a killer for 5 gens is a bit much. Survivors are supposed to be terrible in a 1v1 against a killer... that's why there are 4 of them.
Say you're chasing the last survivor and they extend it past 60 seconds (through their own skill). If the hatch is closed, it's a waste of their time, if it's open, it's a last desperate race to the hatch. It should feel desperate...
I think it's ludicrous how easy they are to use in comparison to other perks... especially that SB glitch where you can hold it for later. This prevents that.
It doesn't even have to be during a chase. It could be just running for one minute causes exhaustion. Wouldn't it cause it normally?
I would ask what rank you are at, since I think this change would be balanced at red. But, then again, people will argue because they can. I even suggested a huge change to the original concept that would make the concept way weaker. I would easy make it 45 or 30 if that makes it more ok in your eyes, but that would make it too strong.
It doesn’t matter. If you penalize a survivor for being able to loop a killer, how is that fair? If as a killer I get looped for all gens, who’s fault is that really?
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@kazzymoyashi said:
Well, all I can say, as someone who plays both sides (green/purple killer and purple/red survivor right now), as a survivor, camping and tunnelling is ridiculous. (I play on xbox.)
Survivor side:
Presuming I am solo queueing, it means being selfish and running bond in an attempt to get the killer on someone else by being an arse to my team to save myself. If I play with friends, it promotes gen rushing. It's not fun to be tunneled and camped, especially when I play as not toxically as possible - I honestly don't pay attention to 'god' loops. I run to wherever the next window/pallet is, so getting mad at survivors who 'choose' god loops isn't valid in this moment. Regardless, being camped and tunneled is frustrating.
Killer side:
I ONLY camp and tunnel if it's EGC or someone has been toxic first. For example, I had a survivor who decided to teabag at a pallet, simply because they slammed it on my face. So, ensue camping and tunnelling once I caught them. However, once they were dead, I went back to normal gameplay and had loads of fun. I stand by that if you are toxic first, I will not hesitate to be an arse right back. Now, if I had been camping/tunnelling right away, I could understand the teabag, but I didn't. I would rather depip and not get a single kill and just have fun with chases than camp/tunnel/slug. I don't mind staying at purple/green ranks as a killer - less toxicity, generally.
Ultimately, I think camping and tunnelling should be punished by a decrease in BP/emblems. But then, I also think deaths by EGC shouldn't count either and should be a penalty because the entity HAD to intervene on your behalf (makes sense from a more standpoint too.) But I also feel that gen rushing should be adjusted by making the time for gens to be completed an extra minute longer. Mind you, I've had games where the killer did amazing at keeping us from gens while knocking us down (a clown on Shelter Woods). I think he used overcharge, BBQ, Ruin, and agitation. We were a SWF of purple ranks with a rank 20 (he was new to the game and wanted friends to play with, killer was rank 11, so green), and he killed us all. He played smart for patrolling and worked hard. I will say he slugged a bit, which while annoying, worked in his favour during this match. But he never camped or intentionally tunneled, which was refreshing and amazing to face.
TL;DR: camping/tunnelling should be penalized by a decrease in emblems and BP. Gens should be increased by a solid minute each. This has been a post by someone who plays both sides (purple/red survivor, green/purple killer).
Great post!
Obviously, toxic survivors deserve it. I’ve been pallet stunned by survivors I didn’t know were there and proceeded to be blinded. Sure, tunnel them.
my only disagreement with you, gens do not need an increased repair time. Killers have perks to aid them against this and with good amp pressure you’d never complete gens if it takes 140 seconds to complete one gen solo.
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@DBDIT said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/945637#Comment_945637
"AFTER they continuously lobby dodged" - I included the entire message with a previous time stamp, which indicates that this isn't the first time it's happened with that person. Your comprehension skills are lacking my guy😂
No, yours are. It’s not your decision to make on whether that particular person wants to stay in the lobby. Get off your high horse.
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@TheDiz said:
I honestly don't know how people can do gens as fast as they do. I usually play survivor and gens are a grind but I played killer recently and they were finished so quickly? Even if I had ruin? Also the speed of the survivors and how well they can loop, not to mention the fact that M1 seems to just do what it wants lately? Swinging prematurely for no reason and not working when you want it to? Not sure if it's bugged or a bad connection but it's frustrating and almost makes you camp if the game is pretty much over and you finally get to hook someone. It's only with obvious SWF games though.
That is what I would categorize as “situational tunneling” where you need to save face. My argument is against those that bully one survivor from the start. My team can never gen-rush either unless there’s no ruin or we pop it immediately. But we also play for enjoyment and we’re red/purples.
Also, ruin isn’t a cure all either to gen-rushing. Practice map pressure and possibly combine ruin with perks like corrupt intervention (limits gen-rush) or thrilling tremors (blocks gens when a survivor is picked up). Perks like Thanatophobia can help slow down progression. Surge and Overcharge are also anti-gen perks that can catch survivors off guard. There are options, people just want to ignore them.
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I said PMing them for “leaving BEFORE the match starts”.... can’t read much? 🤔
also, I don’t bully killers because I’m a killer main and know the pain (so please don’t make assumptions, right?). I play for enjoyment regardless of escaping. I like surprise moments from killers that make me jump. It’s not all about winning (also a red rank on both).
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@Raven014 said:
I think maybe if the chase goes on for 60 seconds, then 30 seconds of exhaustion should be applied, but nothing else. Exhaustion perks need a bit of a nerf.
So penalize the survivor because the killer can’t drop a pointless chase? Yeah, no. I’m a killer main and that’s ridiculous to do.
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Oof. I hate Freddy 😂
I don’t think he needs a nerf because it’s mostly his add-ons that help him win. He’s just INSANE to play against lol.
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@Tr0g said:
Have you ever played green/purple/red rank killer on console?
Killers are gimped and SWF is so OP on console, tunneling and hook camping is often the best way to earn blood points (with BBQ), no joke. Chasing survivors around while they teabag and taunt you, bodyblock etc only to barely earn any points is not fun.
Survivors VS killer? More like I'm the poor guy defending gens VS a SWAT team.
See my thread in the feedback and suggestions forum. DBD on console is balanced the same way as on PC, causing major issues.
Killers wouldn't tunnel and hook camp if there was a more fun way to play and not end with 0K.
I am a red killer on console.... I’ve stated this.
There are literal counters to SWF. I’ve mentioned this. A great killer can win without tunneling. I have already given examples of two games I had during opening this thread, with two separate killers, and different perks. I don’t even have a rank 50 killer nor all teachables and I steadily get 3-4ks without tunneling a single survivor.
We, as killers, have tools to not tunnel.
edit:
that’s also not the best way to earn BP. Most of my games I’m between 26-31k BP earned. Because I chase multiple survivors, hit gens, break pallets, hook survivors, etc. If your goal is BP, tunneling is not the way.
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@DBDIT said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/945573#Comment_945573
Everyone doesn't always play SWF nor is the game centered around it. You can call only playing maps that you tend to win on an advantage, right or wrong?
Have an open-mind before you start a discussion. I opened one on Killers and Tunneling and I’m a killer main against it.
Its entirely the players decision if they want to play on a certain map. I don’t lobby dodge because I enjoy being challenged and well-versed across the board. But PMing a player for leaving BEFORE the match starts is petty. Move on to the next.
Nobody is making excuses except for you. It seems you’re mad because you didn’t get the opportunity to attempt to bully a killer on a map they’re probably not good at.
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@ermsy said:
Sorry, I didn't find it very clear. So you mean to penalize them via emblem points like the camping penalty.
But your suggestions have loop holes in them, chasing a survivor too long doesn't neccesarily mean that they are tunneling them.
And multiple hooks could be more situational tunneling as you said you understood not to mention survivors could use it to their advantage.
I understand it sucks to get tunneled from start to finish but I don't see a way to punish killers for doing it without survivors abusing it. Maybe offer bonus bp for switching targets or something.
Bonus for switching, That’s a good one! I think my 2nd suggestion is a good one. As I haven’t thought of how it could be abused.
My issue is survivors are honestly penalized the most if they’re immediately washed from the game.
As in:
game starts
killer spots you
you run
caught
hooked
unhooked
chased
caught
hooked
rinse
repeat
No BP and de-pip
maybe the devs need to put a time-limit before BP is gained and Penalties or chances to lose pips can occur.
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@ThisLadyRightHere said:
I get tunneled majority of my games for just being able to run a killer for more than 10 seconds. That completely unfair to me as you hate me because I’m not a potato survivor. I don’t teabag to be cocky I don’t abuse “god loops”. because I don’t even know what “god loops” are on most maps. Sometimes the killer will remember me and later again that day they will bring a mori just for me to take me out as quick as possible which again that unfair for me. If you know that someone is capable of consuming your time. Just leave them alone. You will maybe eventually catch them and when you do that doesn’t give you a reason to camp or tunnel them to the ground.
I really appreciate Killers who can acknowledge a decent survivors and not be offended.
There too many killer that be like “even though I tunneled you into the ground and killed you and only got a 1k” apparently I’m better than you. When in reality the survivor just made you look like a butthurt idiot.
Thank you!! You are an example of who is penalized for a petty and toxic killer! I killer main and I used to do this to survivors til I was on the receiving end. I can definitely tell where it’s gamebreaking for you. It’s unfair.
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@DoomsdayDame said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/945540#Comment_945540
I absolutely read your entire post, but I disagree. 9/10 if you get tunneled its because you've looped me all game, which is you absolutely asking for me to follow you, or you were toxic. But also why wouldnt a killer tunnel? There are plenty of very useful anti-tunneling perks. You expect me to give a single one of you a second to breathe? My job is in my name- KILLER. Not PLAY-NICER. Not SURVIVOR-FRIENDLY. Not PLAY-BY-SURVIVORS-RULE-BOOKER. No. Survivors dont have a single shred of respect for killers, they click flashlights all game, vault windows from across the map, teabag all over the place.. so why do we have to play nice? I don't agree with camping unless it's to secure a 1k at the endgame. And I, personally, dont tunnel unless you deserve it. But why do you guys have to ######### the second the killer so much as breathes in your direction? Dont wanna be tunneled? Bring DS. Bring self care or a medkit or adrenaline. Or dead hard. Or lythe. Have your team mates run BT. Get away and get healed. But dont complain about tunneling if you just said you looped him all game, some killers will absolutely "tunnel" you if you've looped them for more than 1 gen. You want my attention? You got it.
You obviously didn’t read the post. I’m a KILLER MAIN.
if you can’t catch a survivor and you choose to tunnel out of pettiness, then you’re a terrible killer. Drop the chase, find someone else. PLENTY of top YTers that play DBD do that and do it well as do I.
anti-tunneling perks? You’re kidding right? Go back and read the discussion.
BT - have to be in killers radius and can still be tunneled.
DS - one and done perk.
Self-care - Nurses Calling
adrenaline - we’re talking about start not end game
any speed boost perk - exhausted.
EVERY single one of you killers on this thread have ignored the topic at hand. It’s about killers tunneling an innocent survivor from the start of a match. The survivor is penalized, not the killer. If you play a toxic 4-man, do what you must.
Tunneling because you were looped? You were stupid to be looped for that long. You should more so respect that player than waste your time, probably angry already, to tunnel.
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@ermsy said:
How would you penalize tunnelling?
Not to be rude, but did you read my opening discussion?
Since there are mechanics to penalize for remaining to close to hooks, penalize a killer that stays in a chase too long. It honestly makes sense.
Time is of the essence in this game, if a killer wastes his/her time in a chase, penalize them for not intelligently playing.
OR
penalize a killer for hooking the same survivor consecutive amounts of time when there is ‘X’ amount of survivors remaining OR if ‘X’amount of gens remain.
Survivors are penalized harshly for being tunneled. If you get eliminated right away, no BP and possible de-pip. I’m talking about unfairness not “effective strategies”. It boggles me how nobody sees that it’s unfair to the survivor that’s tunneled.
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@ermsy said:
There are plenty of scenarios where tunnelling is justified at least imo. Majority of killers are reactive in nature and due to the state of that game or the attitudes of survivors will choose to tunnel one out the game, I don't believe many killers start the game with the intention of tunnelling.
Below is a list of a few scenarios where I would tunnel a survivor as in hook them twice in a row:
- game is going very badly, probably 1 gen left and I need to take somebody out of the game to stabilize.
- a survivor prioritizes doing a gen rather than healing themselves. These guys are fair game imo
- a survivor triggering my traps as hag...you are literally summoning me to you.
If a survivor is abusing God loops as they know it's an instant loss if I commit to them, I do the opposite. Mostly ignore them and focus the other 3. If two abuse the God loops I focus on the two that don't. It's unfair on those survivors but like I said earlier, killers are mostly reactive, we don't choose the scenarios.
Not the type of tunneling I’m referring to. I have stated I understand situational tunneling.
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@Chaubin said:
Tunneling and face camping *should* be punished by the survivors. If I find someone doing that, I wander off and do gens. As long as survivors dont act dumb, most gens would be done in one hook. The survivor gets hosed, but the other 3 get out.
The problem is that people prioritize unhooking higher than escaping.
Without a doubt survivors shouldn’t act dumb when this happens. I’m talking about killers that intentionally tunnel to death hook 1by1. I’m not talking about end game nor talking about who wins. Individually it ruins the game for a survivor that never had the opportunity to get going. Causes loss of pip, no BP, waste of time.
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@hammertime said:
Have you ever watched a horror movie where the killer just lets the survivor go? Didnt think so. Tunneling isnt a thing its just the killer playing the game. Get over yourself and learn how to hide better instead of being annoying and running in loops. If anything running in infinite loops should be penalized. Also, if I play against someone who i can tell is an infinite looper i purposefully "tunnel" and camp them just to piss them off often letting their teammates go free. I hope i see you in the fog so i can collect your snowflake tears.
Formulate a better insult than one that’s nowhere near my political views. Then come back and debate. You are a petty individual as you’ve expressed 👍🏽
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@DoomsdayDame said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/944951#Comment_944951
I'm glad I'm not the only one who reminds players of this. I have a sneaking suspicion that the definition of "tunneling" in this case may be coming from a survivor main type mentality..
Why is it that killers are always the problem? Have you ever played killer? Have you ever ran against a SWF? That is why we HAVE to camp and tunnel SOMETIMES.
Yes and yes. I’m a killer main, if half of you would for once read an ounce of what I’ve laid out. I’ve played. Playing an SWF doesn’t mean you need to camp or tunnel. Just get better at pressure. I have one specific class built for when I notice a full squad of toolboxes.
Plague:
corrupt intervention, ruin, pop, and whatever else.
Every single one of you make a petty argument for tunneling. My basis is around killers that tunnel from start til they kill one individual without going for others.
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@james93 said:
It should be a penalty to camp. It hurts the overall score of the survivor. Survivors get penalized for not saving each other so why shouldn't the killer get penalized for hooking and forcing survivors to come to them.
BINGO! Another individual that understands the penalty induced on survivors for killers tunneling or camping hooks.
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i honestly don’t believe a single one of you arguing in the killers favor can comprehend what I’ve laid out. AThiccOni is the only one with sense.
I made the discussion talking about killers that tunnel from start to finish. I can loop well actually, which ends up in me being tunneled and camped by angry killers. The majority of you on here are pathetic. I enjoy the people calling me a salty killer main when I’ve reiterated that I’m a killer main. Ignorance is bliss.
Instead of choosing to only see it from your perspective, open your eyes. Killers can counter a gen-rush as I’ve said multiple times. You can’t penalize a survivor for doing the objective. There are perks to slow this down or block it for a time limit.
You choose to tunnel because you choose to be a toxic player. The only time tunneling is necessary is when gens have been rushed and you’re trying to save tail.
Also, to whomever said “try tunneling/facecamping and check your stats” I have. It’s very simple to get a 4K tunneling or facecamping. You set the team into panic mode the majority of the time causing them to try and Bodyblock for their tunneled teammate. Thus, few or no gens get repaired.
but all of you, have a great day/night, whatever it may be for you. You’re a very toxic community with a one-dimensional perspective on killers. The excuse that you play both and see no issue in tunneling is ridiculous. No, I wasn’t the worst of the 4 in those games, I was with my group and the killer chose to tunnel me because he was too ignorant to drop a chase after an extended time and finally caught me. 👍🏽
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@SquirrelKnight said:
Can i just say this one thing? If you are a survivor and get tunneled, its tike to use that to draw the killer away from your team so you cam be accomplishing something instead of crying that its happening. And likewise for killers if you are being looped then leave and dont chase that person anymore, all they are doing is wasting your time. I know people are upset that killers have all these killing and tough perks, but so do survivors. Could you imagine is survivors had hex style perks that a killer could remove? The killer is the power role and has to kill to win and the survivors have to survive to win. Stop complaining about how it isnt fair that the killer has to tunnel someone sometimes and make use of it. Or go piss off and let the rest of your team lose cause you go full moron
Go and read the full discussion. I’m a killer main. The point is, killers abuse tunneling. I played 4 straight matches where I died within 5 minutes and was the only survivor hooked. My team attempted body blocks, crossing paths, etc and I was tunneled. It has nothing to do with complaining and more so bringing awareness to how abusive it is. You can only run from a killer so much before you’re caught. On console, you get hit when you really shouldn’t have. I don’t care about perks that was never my argument. I said killers have perks to be viable without tunneling. Survivors have perks to be viable without trolling s killer. However, killers are vastly above survivors in viability for gameplay. Tunnel and you win regardless of getting a 4K. Survivors are solo when it comes to rank, I lost 4 pips because I was tunneled from start til I died in 4 games straight, without a single other survivor being touched. 3 gens eliminated. I don’t care cause it’s simple to regain rank, but I try to enjoy the game and it takes away from the enjoyment. From a killers perspective, tunneling is unnecessary to win.
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@Sonzaishinai said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/945074#Comment_945074
Ok i was not that helpfull with that last post
I'm sorry
I play both sides too and i get it, getting tunneled sucks, same as getting genrushed sucks
But it's a strategy in the game and like (most) strategy's there a counter strategy
There are 2 ways to get chased as a survivor, you can chase to stall for time for your teammates and you can chase to try an lose the killer
While the latter is harder that's the one you want to do to counter tunneling
If you find you get tunneled a lot try running more anti-tunnel perks
While DS+unbreakable is the most popular it's not really that effective in terms of losing the killer, that's more of a stall chase perk combo
A combo that really helps me against tunnelers is Lithe+Dance with Me. Just vault a window and dissapear
Iron will also really helps
Try and get in the mindset of if he can't find you he can't tunnel you
Perks like We'll make it, borrowed time, MoM also help to prevent your teammates getting tunneled, same with bodyblocking, and medkits to give the unhooked person another healthstate, wich doesn't make them such an appealing target
This all assumes ofcourse that the killer wasen't right there when you got unhooked, if thet were then you should blame the teammate that unhooked you, not the killer who took the most effecient way out
No problem. In order for BT to work, you have to be within the killers radius. We’ll make it is good, but it doesn’t prevent tunneling. Bodyblocking doesn’t either. I’ve played killers that legit tunnel one survivor. Which is my point, I understand tunneling to an extent, as in, you’ve hooked everyone once or twice and now want to eliminate survivors. I’m not for 3 hooking one person right away. Also, lithe works to an extent as it knocks you in exhausted.
Anyways, I’ve yet to get reason why killers tunnel besides “i can do what I want” “the survivor looped me” or “don’t get caught”. It’s just a toxic tactic and I’ll leave it at that. There’s nothing more that I can say that i haven’t. This community is obviously filled with toxic killers that have no reasoning.