I_Cant_Loop
I_Cant_Loop
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I want to give BHVR the benefit of the doubt that they are actually really trying to have effective quality control, but it’s extremely difficult to do so when time after time after time we see game-breaking things get shoved out into the live game. The only two possibilities are 1) they are not catching these things in testing, or 2) they are catching them but releasing the patches anyway, knowing that most people will keep playing regardless of the pain.
I suspect it’s probably some of both, but leaning towards #2. Push the patch so the money can start rolling in, clean up the mess later. They are perfectly entitled to do this, but I find it incredibly off-putting and it’s the main reason I’ve only spent like $10 of actual money on DLC content since I started playing in 2018. It’s also the reason they get completely flamed every year during the “Labor of Love” Steam awards voting. All businesses are a balance between revenue and customer experience, but with BHVR I feel like they prioritize the former far more than the latter. -
@AmpersandUnderscore said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3973059#Comment_3973059
Here's the only feedback they need to hear. And it's basically universal among the community:
This system is awful. It's irredeemable. You can't make a system that tries to "guess" player intent without punishing people who did nothing wrong (and in many cases, because of the decisions of their opponents).
It can't be fixed, stop wasting your time on it.
Burn every copy of this code, drill holes in the hard drives it was stored on, lock the ashes in a sealed chest, and drop it all into a volcano. We'll all just pretend it never happened.
Fully agree, but there are some things that BHVR will figuratively die on a hill to defend, no matter how non-sensical. See: kills/escapes-based MMR system. Seems like the go-next system might be another example of this.
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@TheGoone said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3973047#Comment_3973047
Seems there trying to make it work a mod was asking for feedback
I like how instead of thoroughly checking to make sure that the problem was fully resolved before reactivating the feature, they just threw it back out there, crossing their fingers that it would work this time, and “asking for feedback” again. I guess we shouldn’t be surprised given the game-breaking stuff that somehow made it through the QA process with this latest patch.
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Killer players are just going to go back to disconnecting in loading screen if original map offerings come back. The game is much healthier without them.
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Yes. None of them of worth running in their current state. Whenever a solo queue teammate starts a match by blessing a totem instead of working on gens, I know the match is basically over already.
They could all use buffs to some degree, but it is a delicate balance since some of them could become easily overpowered (see: original Circle of Healing). Maybe something like a very slow passive heal whenever you’re in the aura of the totem? Something that could be useful enough to actually put in your load out but also waste a lot of survivor time if they want to get a full heal. -
Clown = new Skull Merchant?
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@Brimp said:
Yeah don't play any killers without anti loop right now. If you get a disturbed ward game might as well just never chase main and hope the survivors never run to it because that god awful window can easily be an infinite if the chase bug happens.
Agree. I’m done trying to “just deal with it” while BHVR takes what will likely be weeks at minimum to disable or even attempt to fix the issue. I have plenty of other things to do where I don’t feel like I need to force myself to play a broken game.
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@DBD78 said:
I love that BHVR inform more and listen much more to the playerbase than before. I just don't understand why they did not listen this time.
Clown was mostly FINE before this update. Now he's not.
One of the many, many changes that nobody asked for but were prioritized for inexplicable reasons
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It is mind-blowing how much game-breaking stuff gets through the QA process. How the “no chase bug” made it through to the live launch is insane. Either QA testing just didn’t get done at all, or someone said “this is fine” and pushed it through. Either way, it’s a horrible, horrible reflection on BHVR’s QA process.
Apparently it’s not affecting the player count much. They can get away with non-existent quality control when there is no competition.
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You’re risking yourself getting banned on the forum too by continuing to break forum rules (no discussing bans). There is a formal process to request an appeal for a ban and the is the only way you can potentially have a ban appealed.
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@tjt85 said:
With respect, to quite a few Survivor players Spirit is a Killer that has virtually no counter play at all. Lots of us play in front of a TV screen without headphones. If I get a Spirit, I'm just guessing and hoping that when I throw the pallet at a loop, I'm on the right of it or I get the stun. It's just pure luck. Sure, you can say it's my choice not to play with headphones, but what about the players that are hard of hearing who don't even have that option?
I don't think it's such a bad thing that Survivor can now bring an item to somewhat counter her power.
Maybe I’m just bad at Spirit, but I disagree. I don’t play her often, but when I do, survivors have no problem countering my power and it often takes multiple phases for me to get the hit around loops/pallets.
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@TimberGoingDown said:
You guys can downvote me all you want, but I notice that NONE of you have a counter argument. This item MURDERS Spirit.
I have a lot more respect for those who actually reply, even if they have terrible arguments and I fully disagree with them. At least they have the guts to respond, unlike the anonymous bomb-throwers. None of them will ever explain how you are wrong or offer any evidence that they themselves can deal with this issue.
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I can understand the rationale behind not having voice chat (impossible to police/punish all the chat abuse), but it seems like a double-standard when there is apparently no punishment for post-game text chat abuse. I’ve reported people many times for death wishes, threats, slurs, etc and as far as I know, no action has ever been taken.
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It’s a 100% dead perk now. Completely useless and zero reason to ever use it. I agree that the old version was annoying, but new version should have at least some impact on reducing item charges. Nobody should be surprised that it got the classic BHVR treatment of nuking into oblivion instead of minor and sensible adjustment.
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@Vaimore said:
Let me get this straight. Stop me if you've heard this one:
Super fast gens, instant healing ( while running ), second chance perks and built in borrowed time, pallets and windows around every single corner, faster survivors at running, I am not allowed to tunnel, camp, or slug,(perks and built in resistance to the acts), They can give a hook state back to a survivor so you are FORCED to hook them 4 times now instead of 3, for a 13 or 14 hook state game vs 5 little gens that will fly to completion during only 2 chases, and now they give them stunning you through windows, rebuilding broken pallets that you had to get looped painfully through to even break, SMOKE BOMBS?!?! and you can no longer punish the survivors for putting themselves in the situation of having 3 gens close together, because there are diminishing returns on kicking gens now. #########!?
Secondly if you happen to pull off a win, the toxic, entitled jerky survivors don't even have to face their defeat now. They can simply DC for free so all you get at the end of your strife are bots. ######### happened to this game?!
For those who will comment on it being a skill issue, the answer is this; there is no skill anymore. No skill on survivor side and no meta human killer players who can withstand all of this at the MMR a veteran like me is faced with. No more gas-lighting.
This game is a joke now. A laughable shadow duplicate of its former self. Killer players are NOT allowed to win, and the devs make it blatantly clear. I have played since beta, and I am a very skilled player. I have forced myself to adapt to all of the changes over the years and gotten better with each update, but this… this is likely going to be my breaking point. Nerf all killers, buff all survivors. Empower the entitled. -End of line-
What’s your average kill rate? Was this post triggered by one bad match, or are you consistently getting lower than the average 60% kill rate? If you’re at 60% or higher and still feel like the game is unfair for killers, just my opinion but I think you may be the entitled one.
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@jedimaster505 said:
killer mains are overdosing on copium after this update…relax, the devs still inflate your kill rates to ensure you win more by design. you're gonna be okay learning to overcome a little challenge once in a while.
I don’t agree at all with the OP, but what are you taking about with “devs inflate your kill rates to ensure you win more by design?” Are you implying that you think the average kill rate of 60% is too high? If so, fair enough, you're entitled to your opinion, but I could see things flipping very quickly from “too many people don’t want to play survivor” to “too many people don’t want to play killer” very quickly if the devs attempt to shift that average kill rate down closer to 50%. We’ve seen it happen before. I remember how long survivor queues were before the infamous 6.1 patch.
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@Chiky said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3971763#Comment_3971763
you're 200% missing my point, but it's ok :)
Also, I never said I personally play like that. My MMR is so f#cked up that I only get paired with new players, I normally get a 4K under 1 minute with my main... It's annoying tbh ahhaha With the other killers probably under 3 mins...? But that's not the point either.
The game is actually dying, some people pretend to be blind so they dont see it :)
You 4K in under 1 minute? Man, I would love to see some video of this. Even in 3 minutes with your other “non-main” killers is incredibly impressive. The best pro streamers in the world can’t even do that, so we would all love to see how it’s possible for you.
Also, if the game is “dying”, BHVR is loving it and probably wants it to die even more because player counts are at all-time highs.
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The explanation for why Ghoul hasn’t been nerfed yet is very simple: selling DLC’s
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Incentives have been broken forever and apparently aren’t going to get fixed
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Totally agree, but if this map deserves a rework then so does Badham, Eyrie and Garden of Joy.
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@Shroompy said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3970938#Comment_3970938
thought Discordance was a killer perk?
I think he’s referring to comms 😉
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When will Sadako be reworked? Well let’s do the math: there are now 40 killers in the game. Seems like we get a killer rework about twice per year. So, you can expect one sometime in the next 20 years, and that’s not accounting for the other new killers who will be added and reworked (maybe multiple times) in the future (see: Skull Merchant). So maybe in about 20 years if you’re really lucky.
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Hillbilly’s add-ons are still pretty terrible even after getting a pass not too long ago. I only run two or three and even those I feel aren’t that good.
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@Brokenbones said:
Nemesis BADLY needs a Pyramid Head style addon pass/rework
They changed his addons to try and make marvin's blood and the coin less appealing… And now it's marvin's blood and licker's tongue instead.
The zombie addons are almost all terrible and a waste. Zombies moving slower is actually more beneficial because it takes survivors longer to lead them away/lead them to pallets etc. The tentacle is the main part of nemesis and the zombies are just an RNG aspect that can either do nothing or stall survivors quite well.
Agree. There are really only two add-ons worth running on him and I never unequip them. That’s a tell-tale sign that the killer badly needs a full rework of add-ons.
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@cogsturning said:
It's fun if you don't take it serious. Though I do better as killer and think it's easier, I find the role more fustrating. I like survivor because it's harder but it's also as silly as I want it to be. I'm usually laughing at everything, especially when I bring meme perks. And honestly, when you land a good team in soloq and you mesh amazingly with each other, it's the best feeling. Killer victories are too lonely.
But yeah, the MMR is trash. I played a killer for the first time as a trial recently, I didn't even have them unlocked, and the whole lobby was high prestigers. I didn't stand a chance. My killer lobbies tend to be high performers, despite me being a merciful killer with an average kill rate. My soloq survivor lobbies are wildly uneven but usually full of low-performers who hide in lockers and behind rocks. I'll be the p100 and they're all p1-5. It's not uncommon for me to have games were only 2 gens get done and I did both of them alone.
very similar experience here. Many of my survivor lobbies have literal brand new players. Just in the past week I’ve seen at least a dozen with less than 50 hours, and it was not due to lobby backfills. When survivor queue times are instant there is zero excuse for the matchmaking to be this bad. I would gladly wait a minute or two in a survivor lobby to get matched with players closer to my skill/experience level.
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No. I assume by your sarcastic response that you can list plenty of nerfs that survivors have received recently. Please inform me. And don’t list things without also noting changes on the killer side. This has to be in the context of net overall nerfs/buffs to either side. Please explain how survivors have received a net nerf vs killer side any time in the recent past.
Or just downvote with no response - that’s the best way to win the argument. -
@Deathstroke said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3970472#Comment_3970472
Remember how the game was before 6.1?
I was talking about recent nerfs (past year). The comment was about popularity decreasing due to “survivor nerfs”, so I assumed we were talking about changes that have happened recently. If we’re talking about all changes that have happened since the game was released, that’s going to be a lot of nerfs and buffs on both sides.
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@Amanova said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3970670#Comment_3970670
Honestly, no one likes to vs Spirit, do you like looping an invisible killer? I believe not. We don't even get points for the chase because Spirit just drops it with her power.
I like going against Spirit. She’s slow when out of her power and easy to mind game when she’s in her power.
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Players like you are the reason the DC penalty needs to exist
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Yeah, imagine if there was a punishment system for people who disconnect 🤔
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No - I hate it. My typical (solo queue) experience against Singularity is he sets up cameras by gens and nobody bothers disabling them so it ends up as a hit and run snoozefest where it’s just impossible to get gens done. A horribly designed killer that is easy for SWF to handle but stomps solo queue due to inability to communicate/coordinate.
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@Marc_123 said:
Great for you!
Someday i want to learn the trick how you gain so much BP to get this as most normal players are nowhere near that amount.
I got around more or less 200k BP most matches and played so 3-4 per hour.
I haven´t counted but overall i may have like 500 or so.
Got like 1 cake for 50.000 BP - at the end i tried the bulk spending an it seems you got more with it. One time 1 got 11 cakes for 250k.
The “trick” is playing the game 18 hours a day and I don’t know why anyone would be proud of this
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@Langweilig said:
I‘m playing on ps5 and I really don‘t understand why the devs make such a big drama out of the chat function for console.
https://us.v-cdn.net/6030815/uploads/BOV3IZ9JMSHC/image.jpeg
I just want to be able to communicate! There is nothing wrong to take a bit longer to write out stuff. If people don‘t want to wait, so be it, but it is actually manageable to write on the console TV keyboard thing. Apex, Minecraft, Texas and other games have it and I can write what I want just fine.
I don‘t need any improvements or anything fancy. I just want to get the ability to write and interact with people in the post/pre game and in the lobby. After all it still is not possible to contact someone you found in game to maybe play with them.
What are your thoughts?💭
98% of post-game chat interactions are toxic, including death threats, racial slurs, and references to some of the most disgusting human behavior imaginable. Consoles not having it is a blessing, and chat should be eliminated for the PC players. There are zero good reasons to have it and a million good reasons to not have it.
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Solo queue can be frustrating at times. For example, yesterday I played about 10 matches and escaped 2 out of 10. Teammates were absolutely atrocious - I literally had <100 hour players in about a third of my lobbies.
The non-functional matchmaking system is by far the biggest reason for frustrating solo queue experience. There is zero reason whatsoever that a player like me, with about 2,500 hours in the game and no problem escaping with competent teammates, should be getting matched with literal brand new players. Blame BHVR’s garbage matchmaking system. When I get experienced teammates who know how to play, it’s usually fun and competitive even in solo queue. -
@Deathstroke said:
I think it's gonna stay alive but sometimes I wonder will the game popularity decrease given all the nerfs to survivor side. You still need 4 survivors agains't one killer so if the game becomes too much in favour of one side it's not probably good for longevity.
But at least few things will always keep survivor side alive. It's nice side to take break from killer if you don't play competively. It's the only side you can play with friends apart from 2vs8 gamemode. SoloQ is bad but there are still some good matches which make you go back.
what nerfs did survivor side get?
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@PlotTwister said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3969599#Comment_3969599
I think something more like basekit endurance for both people on pickup could be a potential solution like with WGLF/Made for this. It drastically reduces snowball potential and excessive slugging. If three people are downed and a single survivor can sorta gaurentee that you can get people up semi safely it could work.
Why is the solution always giving survivors more free basekit perks? I play survivor half the time and even I think this is ridiculous. This whole thing about slugging being a major problem is also ridiculous.
If you get slugged and nobody comes to pick you up, that’s a problem with your teammates, not the killer. If two or three people are getting slugged at a time because they are getting downed immediately in chase, that’s a skill issue on the survivor team. Pick up your teammates when they are down and last more than 5 seconds in chase. Problem solved. -
@R2k said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3969730#Comment_3969730
You are wrong. Casual players are core and majority in every game. And I mean literally. People in majority don't tend to improve or play for competitive level. They play for emotions.
Also you can check steamchart . Biggest player income is during events. The moment event ends, they go away.
I agree with you that the majority in terms of pure numbers are “causal” players, but that doesn’t mean that this is a game that those casual players are going to enjoy. That was my point. Just look at the constant complaining on this forum about how one side or the other is too difficult and no fun to play.
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BHVR should just get rid of the chat altogether. 95% of the time people use it to be toxic to each other. The common response to this is “just turn it off”, but many (most?) players do not have the discipline to do this and will be tempted to keep it on and then get sucked into the toxicity.
BHVR says that they ban people who say especially nasty or threatening things in chat, but I’ve never seen any action taken against people I’ve reported for chat abuse - examples include racial slurs and death wishes against myself or family.Endgame chat has a microscopic amount of upside benefit and and infinitely huge amount of downside. There is no good reason whatsoever for it to exist. If BHVR was serious about minimizing toxicity in its game, end-game chat would have been removed long ago.
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@PigWithTvs said:
im talking about the bugs not the balance
so many killers are bugged its borderline unappealing to play not to mention the horrible rubberbanding that has been going on lately
from the fact that sadako has been legally blind and has buggy tv icons for i think months now? to vector bouncing off to the fact pig traps literally refuse to trigger because a survivor is searching the box (yes that's a bug) to wesker getting denied grabs with his power and so many more
i know im a nobody and me simply quitting won't effect the game but tbh the fact dbd is in the 8th spot in steam charts and a buggy mess along with the rise of cheaters again is just a shame…
also not sure if this is the rubberbanding or something else but u can miss a survivor while u are literally right behind them or while vaulting even tho it should have hit
ngl…call me bais but why do i feel like bugs that effect the survivors negatively always get fixed instantly while killers always takes months (nemi was able to hit survivor inside lockers with his power was almost instantly patched, while wesker was still able to softlock himself using his power in 2 v 8, meanwhile finess is still bugged )
its feels unfair sometimes….
not to mention some of you side with cheaters because someone DARED to play a killer u dislike
like dude…i understand u hate the killer but siding with a loser that payed for cheats its just another whole level of idioticty and u will get banned since u are helping a cheater
Some questions:
What killers have significant bugs now? I see you mentioned some examples, but I haven’t seen any of those in my gameplay nor have I heard about those anywhere else.
Who is siding with cheaters?
I guess I just don’t see anything that you’re referring to as a problem on the killer side. I play killer and it’s felt pretty ok to me with the exception of occasionally getting matched against SWF teams on comms that play super efficiently and get all the gens done in like 5 minutes.
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DbD simply is not a game for “casual” players. You either have to have been playing for a very long time or, if you’re new now, you have to dedicate your life to learning how to play for it to be enjoyable (and that applies to both sides). I would consider myself a “casual” player (less than 10 hours per week), but I have been playing for a very long time and I also spend time watching videos to learn more about how to improve my gameplay when I’m not actually playing. And even after playing since 2018 I still am not very good.
I think most people who pick up this game with the expectation that they are going to be good at it and have fun by playing a few hours a week are going to be sorely disappointed and most will quit. Only those who are dedicated to playing full-time will stick with it. -
@Aven_Fallen said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3969415#Comment_3969415
You can make it possible for Survivors to recover fully from the Dying State if at least 3 Survivors are in the Dying State. I think slugging one person can happen and is fine and regular gameplay. Two can happen as well, if they make a mistake (e.g. unhooking against a Bubba) or the Killer is running Infectious Fright.
But once you reach 3 Survivors in the Dying state, we are at the point beyond the Killer slugging for a bit of pressure or to avoid a Flashlight Save.
As someone who plays both sides, this seems reasonable to me. Anything more than this and killer side would need to be adjusted to compensate for the fact that survivors would never need to leave gens to pick up slugged teammates.
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@thrawn3054 said:
I would guess length of time slugged and number of survivors slugged. Something like after 90 seconds of being slugged you can pick yourself up.
If that’s the case then that’s a huge buff for survivors in general because now if someone gets slugged there is no reason for the other survivors to leave gens to pick them up.
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@HeroLives said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3969416#Comment_3969416
I’m going to crawl away if you down me and chase someone else, why would I stay where you left me if I know you’re trying to snowball and put the team in a near if not impossible position to recover from? The killer gets so much pressure from having two people hooked at the same time, it’s almost impossible to fumble as killer at that point.
Why would anyone stay there? It’s better to crawl away and recover. It’s almost always the best option unless you got being a slug perks for that exact situation.
I completely agree and I do the same thing if I get slugged. I’m just saying that people shouldn’t complain about being slugged if they’re also going to intentionally make it more difficult for the killer to find and hook them.
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This seems like such an insanely impossible (and stupid) thing to define. I’ve had so many times where I’ve downed a survivor, noticed somebody nearby, chased them and decided to keep on going with the chase because I felt like it was the best way to apply the most slowdown pressure on the team. Once I finally down and hook the 2nd survivor, I go back to where I down the first survivor and they’re nowhere to be found because they crawled away the whole time I was chasing the other guy. The other two survivors for whatever reason decided not to pick them up, so am I going to get punished now for this “extreme slugging” situation? If you don’t want to be slugged forever, don’t crawl away so I can’t find you when I get back.
I know we shouldn’t draw conclusions without knowing exactly what this is going to be yet, but based on how big of a disaster the anti-go-next and anti-AFK systems have been, I’m fully expecting something insanely broken with the anti-slugging system as well. If there’s any lesson to learn, it’s to test and get feedback from actual players before implementing, but that often doesn’t happen. -
@Citizen58 said:
As a player of both roles I can talk about many things, but in particular I wonder why are some meta killer builds so horrible for survivors? Have the developers even tried playing constantly against those builds? Also, what is the need for some survivor perks to be disabled during game collapse? Do killers so desperately need help in getting kills? I can tell you, when I play killer, it is so easy to kill survivors with all the buffs I get that the game gets terribly boring (I mained killer for a long time and got to iridiscent I everytime, I dont find it fun anymore even with perkless builds). Why are some horrible mechanics not fixed or prevented, like slugging, killers "humping" surivivors while words like "damn" are banned in chat? Seriously BHVR, why? Do you need more killers than survivors or why do you keep turning a blind eye to surivors having fun? Why can't the last survivor get a buff instead of the killer getting them? Why must surivors hit a very tiny box to blind the killer (try aiming a flashlight with a controller) while ranged killers can hit huge hit boxes? Developing a game is not only about programming and debugging. It's about considering the gameplay and enjoyability of the game. Have some of your developers play solo queue and see how they do. And this is not a rant, these are real game mechanics that I consider deserve an answer.
Please - let us see some of your god-level killer gameplay. I often have to work pretty hard to win when I play killer, so it would be great if you could show me how to do it with no effort on workless low-tier killers.
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It’s been a little while since we had our last brand new account from someone claiming, without any evidence, that they are a god-level killer who regularly stomps survivor teams while using no perks, no sound, blindfolded, etc. and asking for killer nerfs/survivor buffs. I guess we were due for another one of these.
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Agree. There is zero reason that 2nd to last survivor shouldn’t be able to abandon in this scenario.
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Count me in for the “I hate playing against Ghoul” crowd. As others have said, it’s way too easy for him to get cheap, free hits. Maybe even more than my own dislike for him is the issue of how teammates react to Ghoul. Teammates either just give up immediately or they spend the whole match healing back to full health (same problem with teammates when going against Legion).
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Nobody is forcing you to play the event. I don’t like it either, but some people do. No event is ever going to make everyone happy. If the devs made the changes that you want, then some other people would inevitably be upset. You can’t please everyone.
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The problem is that there is too much content in the game now for BHVR to actively maintain with its limited resources. I suspect that a majority of their resources are dedicated to working on new content, while the remaining resources (a fixed amount or maybe even a shrinking amount) are left to tackle the ever-growing mountain of older content. This is why so many killers, perks, maps, items, add-ons etc have been tossed into the garbage bin and untouched for years.
The especially frustrating thing is when BHVR uses their limited resources on older content for things that seemingly nobody is asking for such as the recent Clown update, new colors for blood web items or the 10th Skull Merchant rework. Those things only benefit a very limited number of players, while things like map reworks benefit the entire player base.