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Damarus

Damarus

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Damarus
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  • @Saltjar34 said:

    https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1862723#Comment_1862723

    First of all, don't say that to Pharmacy. It's basically Self-Care without being a detriment to my team or having to run Botany plus nobody in high ranks searches chests anyway. That perk and brown medkits are forever glued to my build. Second, have you seen Infectious Fright on Oni or Nurse? It's pretty terrifying and that's mainly the reason why Calm Spirit is there. Better Together is great because it tells 2 things, 1. I have Prove Thyself, help me or 2. This gen has ToT on, go away, both of which are good outcomes and it tells the God loopers of my team to stay very far away from the gen I'm working on. It also screw over the backpack build (Agitation, Iron Grasp, Mad Grit, Forced Penance). The reason I put the Houdini build here is because it screws over Spirit if you combine it with Iron Will and that itself makes it viable and amazing.

    Even if the meta gets nerfed, there are still survivor perks with very powerful effects even if they'll cost you more and that's the problem, the meta just doesn't give room for high risk high reward. Seriously, DS invalidates the existence of Power Struggle and Flip Flop while Unbreakable makes Tenacity have no purpose whatsoever. Lithe and Head On are fun perks but because Dead Hard is so effective you're better off not running both of them. I genuinely wish the meta gets nerfed so that I get to at least see something new. I mean, nerfing Undying made Devour Hope sort of viable, right?

    And nobody searchimg chests is exactly the reason why pretty much nobody runs Pharmacy, unless he chooses to use a build focused on that. I know Calm Spirit is useful against Doctor and an Infectious Fright Oni, but that's about it. It is pretty useless. Why? While Iron Will is a counter to that cheap killer called Spirit, it at least becomes useful against any killer. Calm Spirit, instead, is highly situational at best, as it will be completely useless against other killers that are not the few mentioned. And please, don't be that guy. If you are going to claim "but it also makes it so you don't scare crows". Oh wow, so that's about it? If you run, the killer is gonna see your scratchmarks anyway. If you don't do that until you are healed, you are gifting the killer enough time to cook himself dinner. Power Struggle looked like a good perk, but it really wasn't, even before PTB, and any player experienced enough knew that. You're not gonna make any use of it, unless the killer is stupid enough to bring you through a pallet, which nobody ever did even before this perk was a thing. And if you happen to be already where a pallet is, you won't be able to use instantly on pick up, not even with Flip Flop. I just wish people would use real things as their points, instead of saying stuff just so they can talk. Better Together great? If so, that must mean I am Santa. Any player will try to keep the killer away from gens, but sometimes you have to go there to save yourself. In those cases, the killer will perhaps stop to kick the gen, then keep chasing the injured guy. And I don't really see how Better Together would impede a Mad Grit killer to hit you. "It screws over the backpack build" that's a bit of an overstatement.

    in "We don't actively seek to tear down perks just because they are used a lot" Comment by Damarus

  • @Devil_hit11 said:

    https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1862869#Comment_1862869

    you realize that Undying is hex? right? The purpose of undying was to created secondary objective in cleansing totems dull or lit and to defend other hex in being removed early in the match. New version Undying is abysmal. first of all, if it gets cleansed first, the perk is dead slot, not only that, it does not even give you information to defend lit totems, it only gives random aura reading on dull totems and if your other hex is cleansed, Undying disappears so basically, when Undying got cleansed first, ruin was going to disappear shortly after, now its like that every single game. Completely dead perk. you might as well run haunted grounds or another hex perk over Undying or just never use hex perks in general. No point in using half a build on Hex perks if they are not even rewarding and get disabled in first minute of the match by spawning on them.

    Even if people hypothetically find another set of meta perks and it ends up being powerful... like who knows Devour hope+Undying, they'll remove from the game after survivor complain about it and if its bad than nobody will use it so whats the point even?

    Killers are like bosses in MMO's, Bosses in MMO without buffs are really easy to take down. Killers have add-on and perks which considerably make them stronger. Survivors on other hand only need good chases, teamplay and fast generators and you do not need any perks to achieve these metrics. Survivor perks just make them that much powerful and more difficult to beat but a lot of survivor's strength come within base game, not really their perks. Its not really true for killer, a killer that is perkless and add-on less is very easy to beat, Just look at perk less and add-on less Wraith or any killer really.

    Well, that depends on the fact that survivors don't have powers or anything that makes them differ one from another. Killers, on the other hand, have powers and add-ons that can make a huge difference. Of course they NEED not to be equally strong without add-ons as they would be with them. If you take something strong enough and make it even stronger, you are basically just giving that side a free win. I am not one to advocate for SWF either, in that regard. And yes, I do realize that Undying is a Hex. Do you, instead, realize that Hexes are meant to be TEMPORARY, and not last a whole game like it used to be on many cases? It works on token totems now, so that is a buff. And as much as it giving auras of survivors near dull totems instead of hexes doesn't really make much sense, nobody wants to play a game with a killer that will drop a chase and camp the totem as soon as he learns that one survivor is cleansing the only way he heas to play the game. Again, if you really struggle without Ruin, you can play with PGTW too, it's not that big of a deal. You wil just need to learn how to play properly, instead of overrelying on another perk that was doing the work for the killer. I mean, if you look at that, many killer perks basically play the game in the killer's stead. BBQ and Nurse's find survivors before YOU have to, Ruin kicks gens for you, Corrupt Intervention blocks gens for you, Infectious Fright makes survivors scream to find them before you do, Spirit's Fury breaks pallets for you. And this is just objectively true. Sad truth is there aren't many killer perks, like PGTW, that actually require the killer to be good. Most perks are centered around making the game much easier, and that's it. Killers want it to become way easier than it should be for them. I am not saying SWF is ok, nor am I saying that DS+UB is ok, but still. DS isn't even close to that big of a deal killers want it to look like. You don't want to take DS? Slug them, 60 seconds isn't much, and it won't really be 60 seconds if you were not camping/soft camping in the first place. If you don't camp, next time you find that survivor who still has DS, the duration will probably have expired when you down him, or he won't have enough time to revive himself with UB before the duration expires and you pick him up. Better yet, even SWF survivors are still gonna try to have their precious little friend not waste UB, which means they are going to try and revive him. Which means, pretty much nobody is gonna be working on gens. Stop pretending like survivors have all the power, when it all really comes on you not knowing what choices to make and when.

    in "We don't actively seek to tear down perks just because they are used a lot" Comment by Damarus

  • @TheBus4K said:

    Changes to killers:

    • The change to the Clown is fine, although new players can increase the speed of survivors by misusing it (even simply without being a new player, not knowing how to use that "Antidote" well).
    • The change to the Wraith seems kind of sad to me, I thought we would have true invisibility all the time.
    • Changing the Trapper works for the first few attempts (for Trappers who were unlucky), but with more attempts it is worse for Trappers who were lucky and forced survivors to make many attempts.
    • Deep Wound is still stupid, even if the time is shortened, there are still too many ways to stop the counter.
    • A "buff" to Iron Maiden that I doubt makes it a good perk.
    • Destroyed the combo of Undying and Ruin. Maybe now that it saves tokens it works with other perks, but it only keeps the totem once when you break it (like when they now break Undying first).

    Changes to survivors:

    • Buffed 5 perks. Only buffs, not changes like Undying. Pure buffs.
    • No nerfs to DS / Unbreakable (almost the equivalent of Undying / Ruin).

    TL;DR: Killers have one less perk combo, a buff to a useless perk, and killer changes that don't seem like buffs to me.

    Survivors have 5 new perk buffs to make new combos with and are freed from the "Undying / Ruin" combo.

    And we still haven't changes to the keys 😂

    Gotta agree on key changes, they should have been part of this mid-chapter patch. But you can't really rely on those "buffed" survivor perks to say what you are saying. Diversion is getting buffed, but it still is a perk that nobody will ever by using, unless he's trolling. Fixated is getting a small buff, but it still isn't definable as a good perk. Second Wind could be useful, but I don't see it as something that can go even close from becoming meta. The only true buff is Open Handed, but it isn't stackable anymore. All of these perks are perks that are almost never used anyway, so no, this isn't survivor sided in that regard. Again, Open Handed is the only perk that could actually see any use.

    in Maybe I'm wrong, but is this update survivor side? Comment by Damarus

  • @Devil_hit11 said:

    https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1862491#Comment_1862491

    i like you said that most of survivor perks are situational at best while listing perks like... Lightborn, Blood echo, Franklin demise and than there's list of perks that are like... Remember me, Iron maiden, Dying light??, thrilling tremors... like nobody uses this stuff for good reason. you do not need perks like Lightborn for example to counter flashlights.

    I'd say 15 most used perks for killer are

    BBQ,Discordance,Infectious fright

    Corrupt intervention,Sloppy butcher, Ruin+Undying

    Brutal strength,Bamboozle,STBFL

    Nurse calling, Monitor, Make your choice, NOED,Tinkerer

    and than there are perks that people use to overdose a particular strength such as... Enduring Spirit fury, Nemesis+PWYF for chase oriented builds or Whispers on information heavy builds, Pop goes weasel on heavy defense builds or Devour hope+Haunted grounds for wildcard but I wouldn't consider these perks meta exactly. While it look impressive that killers have maybe 20 perks that do something... however there are 22 playable killers.... that means there are less viable perks than there are total playable killers despite most of them having somewhat unique powers where all survivors all play the same way. With Undying becoming dead perk, Ruin will surely likely to be used less.

    Likely to see more people use Corrupt intervention+Sloppy butcher until we return next year with another developer update that will read something along lines: We heard that corrupt intervention lasts too long and mangled status effect is too impactful so we reducing the duration from 2 minutes to 45 seconds and changing sloppy from 20%->15% with max duration of 1 minute instead of indefinite with a bunch more "identified" problems. I can't wait for Freddy list of identified problems.

    I never specifically said those perks are god tier, I just listed perks that are actually good/usable, depending on the situation. I wouldn't be using Franklin's Demise, for instance, unless I get a group of sweaty survivors with 2-3 flashlights. Or I can use Lightborn, instead. Both of those perks make it so survivors waste their time doing something instead of healing or going for gens. There is not a single survivor who brings an item from outside the match that is not going to try to get it back asap, if you have Franklin's. You just take advantage of that, since killers can also see the items survivors will have before the match starts. And saying that nobody uses those perks is very far from being true. BBQ coupled with Iron Maiden can make a pretty frustrating combo, especially now that Iron Maiden will be getting double the duration. Dying Light is perfect to slow the game down even more, especially on some killers like Plague. Remember Me is an end game perk, but still pretty useful if you know you're not gonna be able to prevent them from getting at that point. All you have to do is hit the obsession. If you also happen to kill the obsession, nobody is gonna be able to bypass that interaction speed slowdown on exit gates. Thrilling Tremors, as much as it is not often used, is a good perk to gather intel on survivors' location and which gens could need to be defended in the immediate future. Blood Echo? You saying that having the ability to completely deny exhaustion perks, which most survivors are gonna have, is not good?

    And well, talking about overgeneralizing stuff, people are dishing out opinions on an Undying nerf that was well-deserved and not that horrible as killers are making it look like. It was meant to keep Ruin active for longer, not forever. I mean, if you need to rely on having Ruin active for the whole duration of the match, it can't be said you are a very good player, tbh. Oh, and I also forgot about NoeD. That perk disgusts me, so I didn't even take that into consideration (and before someone starts calling names, I used to be disgusted by DS too and refused to use it. But nowadays the unending tunneling makes it mandatory, if you want to, you know, PLAY a videogame).

    in "We don't actively seek to tear down perks just because they are used a lot" Comment by Damarus

  • @VSchmitt said:

    https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1862728#Comment_1862728

    Quite difficult to argue when someone presents evidence in their alegations right? 2/3 of the perks you've listed are actual garbage while the remaining 1/3 can be divided in situational or applicable in specific killers.

    Nah, it's quite difficult to argue with someone who already decided he's not gonna listen because that's how he wants things to be. Hence, I'm not gonna waste my time, since trying to reason with a killer main is pretty much like trying to convince someone that you can travel from one point of the globe to another while riding a pink flying unicorn that leaves a rainbow trail and eats cotton candy. Got the picture now? ;) But hey, who knows, maybe one day I will wake up wanting to waste some of my time. I'll let you know, if that is the case. Until that moment, I'd rather hit myself in the balls with a burning sledgehammer than try to reason with someone like you. Been through that too many times already, even on different subjects. Adios, sayonara, auf wiedersehen.

    in "We don't actively seek to tear down perks just because they are used a lot" Comment by Damarus

  • @VSchmitt said:

    https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1862491#Comment_1862491

    Ur joking right?

    • Spirit Fury (situational, most usable when combining with enduring);
    • Nurse's Calling (reliable in some killers, not so great on others);
    • Franklin's Demise (really? A perk with the ONLY purpose is to make survivors drop items AND they just can come back to it before the time expires or you'll lose the game for "camping" an item);
    • Play With Your Food (situational as a F and only works with some DEDICATED buids since every M1 or power usage detracts one token);
    • Save The Best For Last (good for m1 based killers, just that);
    • Blood Echo (R-E-A-L-L-Y????);
    • Thanatophobia (can be good, but the effects are neglectable, when I'm facing thantophobia as survivor I never give a single F);
    • Monitor & Abuse (can be good in slinger since his TR is BS and Oni for a cheap 1st hit and comboing with Infectious snowball potential);
    • Lightborn (REALLY? A perk that you use to counter the weakest survivor item in the game? Just look around you before picking someone up and look down if someone's trying to blind you 4head);
    • Enduring (situational, most usable when combining with spirit Fury);
    • Haunted Grounds (really? RnG based perk that if survivors have 2 brain cells will never be broken);
    • Coup de Grace (THAT MUST BE A JOKE);
    • Oppression (THAT MUST BE A JOKE part 2);
    • Thrilling Tremors (poors man BBQ);
    • Bamboozle (oh yah, block ONE window in a loop, get little faster vaults, SO OP);
    • Surveillance (situational, better paired with other gen regressing perks);
    • Stridor (only usable on spirit, and a scummy spirit);
    • Dying Light (That's Freddy's favorite perk. Only Freddy);
    • Corrupt Intervention (yeah, this one can be situtational as a F in some killers and really good on others)
    • Discordance (it's most personal taste, most survivors will figure it out and spread in gens, wich is BAD for killers);
    • Iron Maiden (WHY?);
    • Make Your Choice (RnG based since you need to drop everything you're doing to actively go after the unhooker wich you don't know who it is, unless you're running GF's perk);
    • Infectious Fright (good for snowball, situational on low lethality killers);
    • Remember Me (THAT MUST BE A JOKE part 3).

    Well, you killer mains are always gonna find excuses, guess I don't need to spend any more time arguing with you. Have a good one, champ.

    in "We don't actively seek to tear down perks just because they are used a lot" Comment by Damarus

  • @Saltjar34 said:

    https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1862491#Comment_1862491

    Indeed. The reason is because all killers have different powers that allows some perks to be more useful to some. Still though, not all survivor perks are bad. Here's the most useful of the bunch besides the usual DS Unbreakable, DH, and BT

    Pharmacy

    For the People

    Detective's Hunch

    Small Game

    Repressed Alliance

    Deliverance

    Aftercare

    Calm Spirit

    Bond

    Empathy

    Better Together

    Resilience

    Spine Chill

    Soul Guard

    Kindred

    Don't get me started on specific builds like Dance with Me, Quick and Quiet, Lithe. Survivors have lots of options too which often have very powerful effects, it's just that the meta perks has fewer downsides when compared to the other perks.

    Well, as I already said, exhaustion perks that are not DH are really inconsistent. I never said survivors don't have other perks, it's just that many are highly situational and many are just there to give a new survivor 3 perks instead of 2 or 1. Pharmacy isn't really a good perk, it's gimmicky. For The People is situational, and has a big downside. Not a bad perk tho, but you will rarely be using it in solo queue. Detective's Hunch and Small Game are there for people who still need to learn the game, so they really should not be taken into account (Small Game especially), unless you wanna dedicate yourself to totems above everything else. Repressed Alliance is another perk I had considered, but it is again situational. Deliverance can be good, but it's a use it or lose it perk, and it also depends on whether or not you were able to pull a safe rescue before your first hook. So, again, situational. Aftercare is for solo queue, and not really a good perk after all. Calm Spirit is something that pretty much nobody runs. It is only useful against Doctor and Infectious Fright. Let's be honest, you added some perks just to give substance to your point. Bond is something you run if you know you're gonna have no means of healing yourself alone, and a newcomer perk too. Empathy can be a good team perk, but again, you rarely use it in solo queue and SWFs have no need for it. Better Together is straight out a horrible perk that nobody has ever used other than to get Adept Nancy. Resilience and Spine Chill are good enough, but you'll never see one of them without the other, which means that it's gonna be a specific vault speed build. Soul Guard isn't used very much, and it still depends on whether or not the killer has any hexes and for how long they are going to be in the match. Kindred is solo queue only. Dance With Me is pretty much just a bothersome perk, it won't really make it so the killer isn't going to hook you, especially with how many hooks and how close they spawn on each map. And, to end this, Quick and Quiet is only useful if you manage to NEVER be found by the killer. Killers who lose survivors because they got into lockers after a corner are just dumb, as you would check them first if you lost line of sight and the survivor you were chasing suddenly disappeared.

    I don't mean to offend, of course, and sorry if it might seem like I am being rude (I don't even know if I am being so).

    in "We don't actively seek to tear down perks just because they are used a lot" Comment by Damarus

  • @VSchmitt said:

    https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/217739/we-dont-actively-seek-to-tear-down-perks-just-because-they-are-used-a-lot

    The thing is, if Almo, the lead in the balancing team, don't know how to counter one thing, this will be nerfed. Even Huntres Lullaby got gutted, Undying lived a long life, now it may rest in peace with old ruin and 15s taken from Pop, god fobid killers having any kind of good perks.

    Killers not having good perks? You're kidding, right? As much as survivors can have broken combos that, luckily, only work once, killers are nowhere near having bad perks. There are WAY more useful killer perks than there are for survivors. Aside from gimmicky builds, survivors have DS, Unbreakable, Dead Hard, Borrowed Time, Iron Will and We'll Make It. Every other perk is highly situational at best. Adrenalin works only if they manage to get to the end game (being a wasted perk slot otherwise), pretty much every exhaustion perk will never be more useful than Dead Hard, which only works when it wants to work anyway, Inner Strenght will be useful IF you manage to find and cleanse totems and IF those totems were not cleansed already (and it isn't even stackable, which means that you cannot destroy two totems and have two activations ready), Distortion had the potential to be a useful perk, but it really isn't, since you have tokens for it and only 3 of them.

    Killer perks that are useful, instead, are:

    • Ruin;
    • Undying;
    • Spirit's Fury;
    • Nurse's Calling;
    • Franklin's Demise;
    • BBQ & Chilli;
    • Play With Your Food;
    • Save The Best For Last;
    • Pop Goes The Weasel;
    • Blood Echo;
    • Thanatophobia;
    • Monitor & Abuse;
    • Lightborn;
    • Enduring;
    • Haunted Grounds;
    • Coup de Grace;
    • Oppression;
    • Thrilling Tremors;
    • Bamboozle;
    • Surveillance;
    • Stridor;
    • Dying Light;
    • Corrupt Intervention
    • Discordance;
    • Iron Maiden;
    • Make Your Choice;
    • Infectious Fright;
    • Remember Me.

    And I could still go on. The list will probably get longer with upcoming chapters. I'm not saying all of these perks are equally useful, nor that they are equally strong on every killer, luckily. But still, as you can see, killers have WAY more perks that they can use and put to good use. Without even mentioning the fact that Bloodlust, as much as it should not be a thing anymore, isn't even a perk. And before you argue about Undying, it will still make it so your Ruin survives longer, and that is IF survivors are able to find the totem/actively search for it and IF it doesn't get placed in spawns where survivors cannot cleanse them, as it has already happened on reworked maps.

    in "We don't actively seek to tear down perks just because they are used a lot" Comment by Damarus

  • @SilentHillOnDvD said:

    I just took a spirit on a 4 gen chase on shelter woods and when she finally caught me, she face camped and slapped me on hook.My teammates didn't even bother saving me btw, they just did the last gen and left even though it was clear she only wanted me.

    Those matches suck. I've been through the same thing multiple times. It especially happens with players that use meta, easy killers (Spirit, Freddy) and aren't capable enough to predict what you are going to do or just cut your path. Last time this happened to me, I kept a Billy busy for an eternity and when he finally caught me (never tried to hit me without the chainsaw, of course, as a proper noob), he facecamped me to death on my first hook. Oh, did I also mention that he hit me through a corner that he shouldn't have been able to bypass? Anyway, that is the reason why so many people want camping to be heavily punished, but you are going to find killers who advocate for it, sadly. Truth is, most players don't care at all about being skilled, they just want an easy game.

    Still, if you kept that player busy for long enough, you still did your thing. Just remember this, whenever a survivor is hooked and you have the chance of escaping. Sometimes it just isn't worth it to risk your escape for people who did nothing to help you the whole game.

    in Why am I punished for being good? Comment by Damarus

  • @Crazewtboy said:

    https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1855568#Comment_1855568

    The way my luck seems to go in games like this is I can get everything except what I'm looking for. I can get purple add-ons galore which I don't want but go 20 bloodwebs at level 50 without a single ebony mori or iridescent add-on

    Ah, that always seems to be the case. To be honest, I have plenty of Ebony Moris in pretty much every killer, but I don't even want them.

    in Something should be done about suiciding to avoid a mori Comment by Damarus

  • @Crazewtboy said:

    https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1855380#Comment_1855380

    You must have better luck than me. I got about as much chance of getting a mori as I do winning the lottery

    Is that so? That happens to my friends as well, so I really didn't think it was a thing just for me.

    in Something should be done about suiciding to avoid a mori Comment by Damarus

  • @Crazewtboy said:

    I see this way too often and I've had it done to me quite a bit. The mori has since been adjusted and is no longer problematic to play against. You would be dead anyway by the time the killer can use a mori now. That being said, it isn't right to have killers waste ultra rare offerings just because a survivor is too salty to play the game out and possibly escape. Especially considering the amount of points and RNG it takes to get one in the first place. When all four survivors do this (which is fairly frequently) it takes that ultra rare offering and gives it the finger. The problem is you can't give it back if the killer doesn't get to use it, because that could just reward the killer for playing bad. That doesn't mean some solution can't be found though

    As much as I don't condone that behavior, Ebony Moris are "ultra rare" just as a form of classification. They are next to brown add-ons as odds of appearing.

    in Something should be done about suiciding to avoid a mori Comment by Damarus

  • @EvilJoshy said:

    https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1853197#Comment_1853197

    Face camping only works if the survivors allow it. 1 death for 3-4 gens is not a fair trade. I feel the issue is the survivors and killers are both inexperienced. Most survivors don't understand when to stop waiting for the killer to leave the hook and do gens. Killers don't realize it is better to hook and go hunting instead of staying at that one hook waiting for them to die. There are killers that face camp to be ######### but I believe the majority of face camping killers are newbs. If more survivors did gens and escaped eventually the newb killers will learn. The killer isn't getting any bp or pips. Provided face camping is countered. If the killer ends up getting 4k because of over altruism then they assume "This seems to be working. I'll keep doing it"

    Well, I totally agree with you. But I must say, I recently had the misfortune of running into a facecamping Leatherface. The first hooked survivor (who died on his first hook, ofc) had Kindred, so we all knew we had to leave him (he was in the basement, and the killer was hiding where the chest usually spawns) and kept working on gens. In the end, I completed the last gen, while the other survivor was downed. The killer came after me and, guess what? He had NoeD. I died on my first hook, without ever being hit other than in that occasion. (Map was Lery's, not very clear for totem spawns).The thing is, such things should not have a reason not to do them, as someone else suggests. Those things should be punished, outside of certain instances. You are effectively cutting out a player from a match, much sooner than it should happen. It literally means that you are helding the game hostage for that player, until he dies.

    @SpaghettiYOLOKing said:

    https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1853197#Comment_1853197

    That's still abusable. Say you're hooking someone, see another survivor nearby, your Whispers is active, so you search the area. Some survivors are very good at sneaking around. So while the killer searches the area for the survivor they KNOW is there somewhere, a chase isn't active and the timer on hook isn't progressing. That's BS, plain and simple. Killers still get penalized for doing exactly this because they're close to the hooked survivor, but they're searching for one they saw nearby just a moment before. They get penalized if they're in chase around a hooked survivor. That's too much power in a survivor's hands and if you add in a SWF? Why even play any more?

    People who are half decent at playing don't usually run Whispers, though. And even if that is a thing, I don't really see the issue. What a killer should be doing is stopping gens from being repaired. To do that, he wants to have as few survs on gens as possible. If he doesn't manage to find said survivor in a short time (which is already kinda ridiculous, since this game is not really built around stealth. Although it is possible, it is never gonna fully work) he should move onto some gens. That means there will be one hooked survivor + at least a rescuer = 2 people not working on gens, for the time it takes to unhook + heal. As much as SWF is concerned, I always wanted to see it reduced to a max of 2 people, but still. SWF and camping are different things. SWF is hard to face (although not always), more challenging and sometimes frustrating. Camping is just cheap and toxic. SWF is making things hard for the killer, not having him in a corner, unable to move. If that was a thing, you could get away with the comparison. But it really isn't. There is a reason why one of the categories killers get points for is called "Hunting" and not "Staring at a survivor you hooked until he dies, because you know you won't be able to get a kill otherwise".

    Of course, EGC camping is another thing. Still kinda cheap, but not the same thing.

    in The facecamping is getting really tiring now... Comment by Damarus

  • @Animal_Mother said:

    https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1852495#Comment_1852495

    This. People call anything camping if they get downed shortly after leaving the hook. I've been playing spirit and usually will leave the area after hooking and try to pressure all the nearest gens. If survivors get unhooked quickly while you're in the area, you can often phase-walk back, see the scratches, and down them again. Survivors shouldn't have the expectation that killers will see an easy target and pass up a free hook just because the person has already been hooked. The objective is to kill and win, not ensure some random survivor has a good time.

    If survivors are so worried about being "tunneled", isn't that what DS is for? Why not practice and get better at looping? Why not just take one for the team, let your buddies finish the gens while you are getting camped or whatever? Some survivors have this cognitive distortion in their head of how the game should play out, and when they don't get what they want, they experience this big negative emotion and blame shift.

    As much as something of what you are saying is actually true, you can only do so much with looping. Cheesy killers like Spirit, for instance, will get you even easier than other killers, who most of the time rely on bloodlust to catch you, refusing to destroy pallets to get more speed. You can be good at looping, it won't matter. Sooner or later, even because of bloodlust alone, the killer will get you. And if he took enough time to get you, he'll probably be so pissed that he will facecamp you. Happened to me a lot, I've recently been facecamped to death on first hook, by a Billy, for instance. Why? Just because it took him longer than it took for dinosaurs to be extinct. Sure, if I see a killer facecamping me I will try to give other survivors (I mostly play solo) more time to work on gens. But what do I get out of it? Videogames are meant to be played and playable, not something where you stare at a jack*ss who is so unskilled he will pick the easy way out.

    in The facecamping is getting really tiring now... Comment by Damarus

  • @EvilJoshy said:

    I believe if more survivors ran kindred and learned how to do gens then there would be less killers face camping.

    I believe that survivors doing gens has nothing to do with a killer deciding that facecamping is the way. It has to do with the fact that he wants to have it easy, killing a survivor on the first hook, much like having old Mori available.

    @bingbongboi90 said:

    https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1852082#Comment_1852082

    Devs tried this concept once, and Just like always survivors can abuse it. So the devs deleted the concept.

    The easy solution would be to have the timer stop if the killer is in a certain range and not in chase. I can't see how that would be severely abusable. If the survivor being chased keeps looping close the the hooked guy, the timer will still go on (as I said, timer does not stop if in chase). If the killer chooses to stay there, he will gain nothing, as the timer will stop. If the survivor keeps going back and forth, not only will he be wasting time, he will also start a chase, and then another, and then another. This way, survivors will not get camped as easily, but killer who have to rely on camping because they aren't able to keep up can still do it.

    in The facecamping is getting really tiring now... Comment by Damarus

  • @DemonDaddy said:

    @Damarus

    Yeah if the killer is locked on you it will be difficult, but still you can break chase without the killer giving up. Just because they want to tunnel a target doesn't mean they are gonna get them.

    I know, I never said it is completely impossible, but still. It is something that revolves more around the killer making mistakes than on the survivor being able to do something or have perks to do that something. And then, of course, maps also do the trick. It will be much easier for a survivor in Lery than it is in Azarov's.

    @JigsawPiggy said:

    https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1836798#Comment_1836798

    When I don't get a single kill because I've wasted my time hunting three healthy loopers instead of just downing the lame one, that's not fun for me either.

    Do I camp the hook? No. But if some cocky survivor rushes to unhook before I've walked five feet from the hook, if I'm not running Make Your Choice, I'm going to go for the injured player, because the sooner the game goes from four handed to three, it improves my odds. Even then, it's hardly a failsafe.

    That's a mistake. Not only do you prevent an injured player from having to heal himself (not working on a gen) or having another player heal him (2-3 people not working on gens), you also purposedly go into DS (to then possibly whine about it) AND make them hate the game, which means they can consider to stop playing it, if all killers play like that. Which means, that killers could be left with nobody to kill (hence, the game won't start). Of course, this is more solo-oriented talk. Both sides should really start thinking about what THEY can do to not be toxic, instead of only on what they want for themselves.

    in Should DS be basekit? Comment by Damarus

  • @Killing_Time said:

    https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1840856#Comment_1840856

    Freddy is fine. Survivors can't loop EVERYBODY!

    Spirit is fine. She's been nerfed ENOUGH.

    Deathslinger doesn't need that nerf. He's already 110% and all his add-on are useless except reload.

    Ghost face... I get what you're saying, but let's settle on they can reveal you if you're within view for a certain time. I personally think they can't since their head is down on hook.

    Twins... I like my changes more, but we can agree then.

    Plague keeps my changes but it don't stack with ruin. Fair?

    Clown is fine with my changes. It'll require a different playstyle. He still lacks map pressure do the usual gen rush will stop him.

    Pig... Don't even care lol.

    Leatherface is fine as is. He does NOT need nerfs at all.

    Nurse can only do that when used by the best of the best killers. The way she is now dudes away new players and that is distantly what the devs don't want.

    Billy is not fine... He sucks and you know it. He's not fun to play at all and I'm a Billy main. He's my only p3.

    Wraith I can agree with you on that. I still like my changes but we can agree.

    PH needs the nerfs reverted. Play more unpredictable and you'll be fine.

    Hag don't need that as an add-on, it should be made.

    Trapper needs all his traps at minimum and the reason I added darkening is because on certain Maps it's useless. On laboratory, the traps stand out too much. They need to match the terrain.

    Docktah is better with my changes. At minimum shock delay base.

    Oni is better with my changes. He doesn't need to lose all rage when picking you up. That's disastrous.

    Legion is better with my changes

    Demo... Don't even care. Hate the character...

    Myers is better with my changes

    So, all you can say to "justify" your proposed changes is that those killers are "better with your changes". Even though pretty much everybody is disagreeing with you. I guess I don't need to spend any more time in this thread.

    in Every Killer Balanced to Actually Be Threatening... Comment by Damarus

  • @Callmehandsome said:

    https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1841497#Comment_1841497

    People always argue which side has stronger perks, but survivors always had stronger more impact full perks to a point they were more like skills than perks. This is why i said no perk mode for either side would really solve it. Obviously survivors still could vault windows faster, have pallets so i don't see how you can claim they have "Nothing" going on for them.

    Nothing going on for them, precisely means what I said. Perks are complementary, but also are something that allows survivors to do something they would not be able to do, otherwise. All a survivor becomes after level 40 is a skin, which means they are all equal. Without perks, the only thing they could do to fight the killer would be baseline, mostly running until Bloodlust will favor the killer enough. That's what I mean. Of course, this stems from the argument of whether or not certain perks are balanced, but some, frustrating as they are, become necessary. At least, until the game is left in its current state.

    @DemonDaddy said:

    @Damarus

    You just have to try and shake the killer. As great as holding the killer's attention is for the team, your not obligated to do it until your downed. Perk choice is a help but not even necessary to break a chase or evade the killer.

    That is only partially true. Someone with decent enough game awareness will hardly lose the survivor he is chasing. And since the vast majority of killers usually chase the same survivor until he would be dead anyway, because he turned 90, that is hardly ever achievable. Of course, if the killer is bad, than anything goes. But mid-tier players will be able to get at least 2 kills, just by tunneling and bloodlust alone.

    in Should DS be basekit? Comment by Damarus

  • @Callmehandsome said:

    https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1840914#Comment_1840914

    I'm talking abaut perks, but now you bring killer power into it. You do understand killer has his power for a reason right? it's 1v4 game, so obviously killer is supposed to have upper hand in chase mechanic. What you are saying it would be "equal" if killer was just 5% faster movement speed, while survivors still would have faster window vaulting, pallets.. it wouldn't be equal at all. It's like me saying ok fine, killer has no power, but survivors cannot vault windows faster nor drop pallets at all, now we are equal?

    There is a reason why wraith is considered worst killer in high ranks, because he has nothing going on for him in chase. Survivors always had overall much stronger perks, to a point they weren't perks, but actual powers/ skills. Like 25 second sprint burst, We will make it 300% healing speed for 2 minutes, including yourself.. these weren't perks but actual powers lol

    I never said killers should have no powers, I said that it's obvious there would be no survivors playing a mode like the one you suggested, as they wouldn't have anything going for them. As much as there would be no killers, if they were obliged to play without perks or powers. I was just replying to what you said which, again, was kinda obvious. Pretty much like saying that if you take someone's food from his hands, he's not going to eat.

    @DemonDaddy said:

    No, survivors just need to get better at avoiding the killer. If you feel the need to be sheltered from the only opposition, maybe play something solo with adjustable difficulty.

    As much as that CAN be true, there is little you can do against tunneling and bloodlust, unless you find a god loop. And even there, the killer will get you, sooner or later. This has nothing to do with getting better, it has to do with flawed game mechanics.

    in Should DS be basekit? Comment by Damarus

  • @Callmehandsome said:

    https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1840523#Comment_1840523

    Killers have more somewhat usefull perks, but survivors have stronger more game changing perks overall. If devs added no perk mode, there would be more killers playing it than survivor.

    Of course, and no wonder that would happen. Kinda stating the obvious here. Without perks, on an individual basis, there is not much survivors can do. Killers, on the other hand, still have their unique powers, different move speed, height and TR. Have a gamemode where there are no perks on either side, nor do killers have the ability to use their powers. It would be equally played by both sides or, much more probably, remain untouched forever.


    Then again, survivors have more game changing perks? DS, Dead Hard and Unbreakable. That's it. Borrowed Time doesn't change a thing, unless you tunnel. Or unless you can't resist the urge to smack those who try to bodyblock and take the hit, but it falls on you alone. Killers have Ruin, Nurse's, Infectious Fright and BBQ that do half the work for them, Undying to have that Ruin doing work fro them even longer, Corrupt to block gens at the start for a sizable amount of time. Can't really say that perks like PGTW, Ruin, Undying, Spirit Fury, Enduring, Lightborn, Tinkerer, NoeD and BBQ aren't game changers. Some matches can be won because of PGTW alone. Not to mention that BLOODLUST isn't a perk at all.

    I'm not saying survs don't have anything going for them, I am just arguing that saying killers don't have game changers, and even more of them + more useful perks is baffling.

    in Should DS be basekit? Comment by Damarus

  • @Killing_Time said:

    With this post, I'm going to attempt to put every character on a tier to where they are actually threatening. Let's start...

    Trapper... Start with all traps, traps darken to the terrain by default (no addon needed), and trap set time sped up.

    Wraith... True invisibility until 8m, NO SLOWDOWN ON UNCLOAK, and Windstorm add-ons basekit while cloaked.

    Hillbilly... Overheat mechanic removed, add-ons reverted, charges do not stack, and he keeps need add-on to go through pallets with chainsaw BUT it one hit downs regardless.

    Nurse... Basekit nerfs reverted.

    Hag... She can transport to any trap on the map.

    Myers... 115% tier 1, multi-stalk works again, add-ons somehow buffed to modernize. He keeps tombstone piece, tombstone, & tuft hair. He keeps spooky myers build.

    Docktah... Tier 3 madness bar resets on interrupts, iridescent queen possibly basekit, and shock delay basekit. (It makes no sense for this to be an addon.)

    Huntress... Give her a new red add-on (she's fine otherwise. Yes I'm keeping iridescent head. It's rarely used and makes her a threat. It's already been nerfed.)

    Leatherface... Perfectly balanced.

    Freddy... Rework the blocks (they're literally useless and never picked. Freddy is fine!

    Pig... No idea. Didn't buy any I hate her.

    Clown... Can't drop pallets while gassed (similar to doctor shock). PGTW nerfs reverted.

    Spirit... Remove window animation, make purple phasing add-on basekit. She's fine as is really.

    Legion... Can see progress of mend bar again, miss frenzy cancel removed, cold dirt nerfs etc reverted, terror radius deep wound removed, frenzy ending cool down reverted.

    Plague... Fountains remain corrupted and don't automatically cleanse themselves if all used, vomit regresses Gens at the same rate of Tier 3 Ruin, full sickness reduces gen repair speeds 10%. (Yes it stacks with THANA)

    Ghost face... Hooked survivors can't reveal you, downed survivors can't reveal you, and given a 3 sec dash out of stalking. (😎 OP?)

    DEMO... Sucks... Didn't buy. Not interested whatsoever in the killer. Community decides.

    Oni... Survivors drop more orbs the longer they stay injured, does not lose rage on dash hit, and actions injured double orbs dropped.

    Deathslinger... Didn't buy, so limited knowledge, but total add-on rework, 115%, reload speed add-ons basekit.

    Pyramid Head... All nerfs reverted.

    Blight... Perfectly balanced.

    Twins... Survivors pounced by victor can't vault, do gens, heal, and victor makes it harder to move. (Similar to boil over perk). Victor can 1 hit down if not removed in 20 secs, bigger killer moves 116.5% WITHOUT Victor and possible add-on buffs. Transition time between victor and main killer instant. (😎 OP? Didn't buy so I don't know.)

    What do you guys think? Did I go too far?

    So, basically, you want survivors to not stand a chance no matter what killer they are facing. How about survivors also start the game injured and there are neither exit gates nor a hatch?

    In all seriousness, not a single one of the things you asked for are balanced, nor are some of them as they are right now (Blight being the only exception).

    • Freddy needs a nerf that makes him less of a mindless spammer and more of a strategical placement killer. He would need to have 5-6 snares or 4-5 pallets. Also, he should receive a slight movement penalty everytime he sets something up, until he is done placing. And don't get me started on his hitboxes.
    • Spirit should become partially visibile/appear and disappear if she is in a certain range of survivors.
    • Deathslinger would actually need to lose fast reload add-ons, so he can become something different than a spam spam killer.
    • Ghostface: As much as I think hooked survivors should not be able to reveal him, that would also encourage camping, which should not be a thing.
    • Twins are kinda ok, though they could use some adjustements. Victor should be recalled when you want to, instead of only after some idle time.
    • Plague could use that vomit regressing, but it should be less than Tier 1 Ruin, as it would be demolishing if paired with Ruin.
    • Clown should receive some buffs (which he appears to be receveing in some time) but be unable to spam as much as he does now. Spamming should not be a thing on any killer. No idea about how to buff him, though.
    • Pig is ok, maybe give her some more traps or allow her to teleport between lockers.
    • Leatherface should lose a charge.
    • Huntress should receive new add-ons and lose Iridescent Head. Also, her hitboxes should become more consistent. She tends to hit when she should not and miss when she should have hit.
    • Nurse can still wreck as she is right now, don't see any reason to give her that much power back.
    • Billy is ok as he is now.
    • Wraith could use that true invisibility until a certain radius from survivors, and if you want him to have no slowdown on uncloak, he should not get a boost after that.
    • Pyramid Head is kinda ok-ish.
    • Hag can already do that, with an add-on.
    • Trapper could use a buff that lets him start with 2 traps.
    • Doctor is ok as he is, he already spams too much.
    • Oni is ok as he is, perhaps he should actually have his power meter completely depleted after picking a survivor up if he still is in Yamaoka's Wrath.
    • Legion is ok, they do what they are designed for, slowing the game down.
    • Demo needs a slight buff, no idea what to do for him though.
    • Myers could maybe have the ability to reset stalk level on individual survivors, but that's it. Going against someone who downs you in one hit for a whole match, while also doing most things faster and having a bigger lunge is already tedious enough as it is.
    in Every Killer Balanced to Actually Be Threatening... Comment by Damarus

  • @RamblinRango said:

    https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1839226#Comment_1839226

    You lost me at nobody plays with self care anymore ngl lol, I dunno what games you've had but that is just incorrect.

    If you're telling me all the perks I listed are useless because they're situational then okay, every killer perk is useless now too for the same reason. Perks aren't meant to win you the game, they offer a slight advantage/new mechanic and how you use it is up to you. It costs you one perk slot to bring DS, it should not be basekit.

    I like someone else's idea here though, DS can be basekit when NOED is basekit

    I said nobody plays with Self Care, unless they don't have anything worthwhile to take its place, which is very farm from being incorrect. The drastic drop of Self Care users has been a thing since it was nerfed, which I think was like over 2 years ago. Of all the games I have as both killer and survivor, I find pink flying unicorns to be less rare than a Self Care player is. I would completely erase DS and NoeD from the game, tbh, as well as bloodlust and infinites.

    And no, killers actually have more useful perks than survivors do. Truly useful survivor perks are limited to the same 5-6 choices: Dead Hard, Borrowed Time, Decisive Strike, Unbreakable, Iron Will and, occasionally, We'll Make It. Other perks like Prove Thyself can be there, but they are far from being truly useful or as much used as any of the above.

    Killers, on the other hand, have Nurse's Calling, BBQ, PGTW, Ruin, Undying, Corrupt Intervention, Tinkerer, Haunted Grounds, Franklin's Demise, Lightborn, Spirit Fury, Enduring, Dying Light, Blood Echo and Oppression. And this only covers the perks that are useful and strong on every single killer. Were we to add perks that are also good, but do wonders on specific killers, then we would also have STBFL, PWYF, Infectious Fright, Thanatophobia, Stridor, Unnerving Presence, Distressing, Monitor & Abuse, Make Your Choice, Bamboozle, Iron Maiden, Discordance, Coup de Grace.

    I don't see how that counts as not having anything to work with or useless perks. Survivors have very few tools at their disposal (and I am talking about solo), which can be ok, since they also (sadly) have 4-men SWF. But still, you can't really complain about them always doing the same things if

    A) Killers almost always tunnel;

    B) Those are the only good perks they have.

    in Should DS be basekit? Comment by Damarus

  • @RamblinRango said:

    There's like 700 anti-tunnel perks, having anything like this would make them all garbage. Why run Borrowed Time, Breakout, Boil Over, Dead Hard or DS when the game will protect you from everything the killer can do besides slug?

    Oh wait Unbreakable, Tenacity, Flip Flop..

    Well at least he can injure survivors and get them eventually

    Damn forgot about Self Care, Mette of Man, Adrenaline and Soul Guard..

    There's perks to reset pallets and block generator kicks. I mean at this point we really just need a perk to make the killer DC when we feel like it

    Well, neither Dead Hard nor Boil Over are anti tunneling. Dead Hard is just something to prolong a chase and maybe allow you to get to a pallet/window. Boil Over is to try and waste some more of the killer's time to a hook, but it almost never becomes relevant. Flip Flop is just a troll perk, it rarely gets any value at all (and that is IF someone runs it). Nobody plays with Self Care anymore, unless they don't have anything better to replace it with. Mettle of Man WAS OP, now it just a trash perk, and it also rarely sees any use. Soul Guard works until you have a hex totem up. If you bring Undying, you can't really whine about that. And let's be serious, I have never seen anyone using Any Means Necessary (pallet reset), and even if they did, very few killers will not break a pallet. Repressed Alliance (Gen blocking) is also rarely used, even though it sees somewhat more use than other perks. But still, killers like to claim that by tunneling and camping they are doing their objective, so they should not be blamed for it. With that perk, survivors are rewarded for doing their objective, too, so why should it not work the same way for them? There really aren't many anti-tunneling perks, tbh, just a couple of them, or it wouldn't be a thing anymore.

    in Should DS be basekit? Comment by Damarus

  • @HowsMars said:

    https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1838353#Comment_1838353

    You atleast admit your bias but still didn't make an attempt to be unbiased or civil so let's go through your feedble attempts to argue what I said.

    So your first point is the hatch isn't RNG?, damn you really needed something to come up with to argue for it i guess. Hatch is not RNG, this is because there is a 100% chance for it to spawn every match given the match gets to that stage, if you think the fact its spawn is random makes it a RNG mechanic then you should start paying attention more in matches and maybe you could get it more often. The hatch is an easy escape if you know where it is, but if the killer gets to it first the game hands you 3rd chance to escape since you couldn't do the first 2 and let's you unlock the exit gates. But I bet that you still have trouble finding those on your own too.

    I never said to remove perks from survivors or even lower the amount they have, you just struggled to read or understand what I said and thats ok il try to explain it without hurting your brain. Survivor perks offer massive amounts of information, deception, and escape opportunities. Not to mention alot of them hold your hand if you make mistakes. Killer perks offer advantage based off what you do in the match being either a reward for doing something or requiring you to build it up (unlike survivor perks most of the time) and most of the ones people complain about have disadvantages or ways to remove them permanently. I hope that explain it well enough for you to understand without hurting yourself so let's move on

    Spinchill: this perk offers information of if the killers direct line of sight is on you and can be used mid chase to outsmart the killer in loops and lose them fast, but that may be to advanced for you.

    Lithe: this is an exhaustion perk that let's you gain a considerable amount of speed to either lose a killer or gain a advantageous position to try and lose them once again. The amount of window in maps is extensive and offers alot of areas to use this perk especially at loops and jungle gyms. If you struggle to use the perk don't blame me, best part about it is there's no downside to use it and the perk will be usable again after a small amount of time. But that doesn't matter right?

    Bloodwarden: get past green rank (if you even play killer at all) and this perk becomes almost useless, at high rank people 99% gates so that EGC doesn't start before all remaining survivors are safe to exit (dont worry you will get there one day). If survivors open the gate and let someone get down AND hooked then they need to deal with the consequences of their greed for not having already taken the exit and instead going back for the hook, even though the chance the killer has this perk would be extremely low.

    STBFL: this perk is strong but inconsistent, reason I say that is because that once your obsession knows you have it they will likely use your hesitancy to hit them to their advantage and let the perk punish you for chosing to hit them anyway. This perk falls in the niche only because it offers alot to only a few killers and remains a quality of life change to others.

    Ruin: its a hex perk dude, go do totems once you figure out its in the match thats not hard, oh boo hoo if they have Undying its not as if that means you won't get lucky on getting that totem first go anyway. The perk remains inconsistent because it can be removed early game (unlike deadhard, DS, UB, BT, Object of obsession, etc.) unless the survivors are bad or the killer gets lucky with Undying. Gen defense perks are just about a requirement to have a chance against good survivors but you wouldn't know that would you?.

    Devour hope: oh boy another hex perk that can be destroyed immediately because hex spawns are garbage and can even be infont of survivor spawns or gens oh no thats unfair nerf Devour hope guys. Seriously? The advantage it offers you is miniscule until after the survivors will already know you have, but oh boy does a perk that requires a build up and can be removed from the game make all the difference in every match I play right?.

    Dying light: this is a joke right? If it isn't just take what I said about hexs from above, and add in a buff to the the obsessions

    PWYF: another perk that is Niche because although it offers a benefit it ONCE AGAIN comes with a downside (I dont need to redo the amount of survivor perks that offer more with no reprocession right?). Its a build up that you lose with each and every hit, big sad that it gives killer a speed boost for one hit and takes a stack from them, not to mention its 2 hits to down a survivor and missed attacks remove stacks (but lets act like you dont bring deadhard). I'm not going to go on because I would hope you see where I'm going.

    Nice job showing the 1 of 2 examples in dbd that breakable walls burden survivors instead of the killers, the addition of these walls offers no tactical advantage 95% of the time since they exist in doorways that once where once again UNBLOCKED before, but thats tactics right? Yeah I didnt think so. Next time atleast try not to sound like you scrambling to make a point out of little to no fact.

    So, you clearly cannot read through sarcasm, and you appear to be a tiny little kid. The amount of baseless assumptions I see in your posts is just baffling, the typical killer main who thinks so highly of himself. Of course I never got to red ranks, right? Cause you know me so well. Stop behaving like a child, if you can. Or, you know, go on and keep bragging about stuff that you are SUPPOSEDLY able to do in a video-game (even though you are crying about the hatch, so I doubt that). I mean, your parents are proud of you when you tell them that you had a good game, right? I don't see a reason to keep going with this argument, as I feel you wouldn't understand even if I posted letter by letter. Some people are just like that, I guess. Last post, try to follow me, as I can't really draw it for you. You ready? I'll go slowly.

    The RNG part in the hatch is not only where it will spawn, but also who will get it first. A killer may have already found it before the survivors do, before it even opens for the last survivor. At that point, especially if the killer is a fast moving one, a survivor will have very narrow chances of escaping. And I am talking from a general perspective, I never really need the hatch, at least when my teammates are half decent. And I lose, whatever, I'll move onto the next game. I don't need to survive every game, nor will I cry because a survivor got the hatch boo-hoo (most of the time I can't even be bothered slugging, unless the survs were toxic).

    Going too fast? Take your time, the post isn't moving.

    • About SpinEchill (can't understand how you keep missing the E), you literally wrote what I just said. It warns you when the killer is coming, which by itself means he is looking in your direction. Or do you generally chase survivors while walking backwards? Who knows, maybe you use Slinger's power to try and shoot your feet.
    • Lithe: I already explained how the speed boost you get with any of the three exhaustion perks that work that way is just ridiculous. It is the same speed as you get when the killer hits you, which has never been enough to lose the killer or to avoid the tunneling, unless the killer is so bad he can't look around after the hit and loses track of you. But that is a mistake on the killer's part, not a well-played thing from a survivor. There is a reason almost 99% of the players favor Dead Hard, you know? Or don't you? Oh, and also, it takes a full minute of NOT running to have exhaustion perks, that aren't Dead Hard, available again. Not really a small amount of time, especially if you are still getting chased. Unless you walk while the killer is in front of you, anyway.
    • Bloodwarden: Someone doesn't know that he can open exit gates as a killer, it seems, as you can just down a survivor and open the exit gate before hooking them? Or you know, but you never had the chance to try to make use of the perk, since survivors escape easily when you are the killer? Is that why you cry about the hatch? Oh, I have an idea, let's make it so exit gates need 10 gens to be opened, give gens double the amount of time to get repaired and have it so, if and when all 10 gens are repaired, exit gates don't even spawn. I'll give you a simple suggestion: find a survivor, down them, open the exit gate, hook them. And before you say anything that isn't worthwhile, if they managed to get both exit gates at 99, that is on you, it means you did not apply enough pressure, or none at all.
    • SBTFL: At least you start to have some proper reasoning here, but still. You forget to mention how you keep the stacks you had forever, after the obsession dies. And again, killers who use it most will have a way to kill the obsession without losing stacks. If, on the other hand, you refuse to hit the obsession, negating a free hit, just because of that perk, then it's you being stupid. As much as survivors with Object of Obsession WANT you to see and chase them, giving them the advantage if you choose to commit to them, you are doing the same thing by not hitting the obsession. It's the difference between stupid and strategical choices, between experienced players and casuals who can just work with what they see on the screen, with no ability whatsoever of thinking ahead.
    • Not gonna say anything more on Ruin or Devour Hope, as you clearly never even knew of the times when totems were bugged on many maps, which lead to them not being cleansable at all. And someone didn't even bother to notice that devs are trying to have totems more hidden than they were, but you need to be playing both sides to know that. so I can understand.
    • Dying Light: Oh wow, the obession can unhook and heal somewhat faster, while ALL survivors will take longer to do gens because of a single perk that works with hooks. Nah, let's move on to another perk, that's just too difficult. What kind of reasoning is that? Do you want to have PGTW remove 100% of gen progression, and have the perk active by just looking at a gen for 2 seconds, instead of hooking?

    Those walls WERE unblocked, that is they key word, my not intelligent non- friend. They WERE unblocked, now they are not. Which means that the ability to grant survivors another escape route or to negate it falls under the killer's possibilities. As much as people use Corrupt Intervention to slow the game down, having one less perk after it expires, having doors blocked means survivors won't have a way of escaping through them. And having destroyable walls to cut the time it takes to catch a survivor in the shack, as in Glenvale, means you are taking away the best loop and pallet survivors have.

    This is the end of the discussion for me, write all the "know-it-all" comments you like, I'm not gonna bother reading them again, nor provide you with unnecessary and undeserved attention. Have a good day, and try not to cry too much because you can't kill survivors, aye? Oh, and about that, in F13 you can play against bots who almost don't move, give that a try, it might suit you better. Adios.

    in Put the "power" back in "power role" Comment by Damarus

  • @HowsMars said:

    https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1837397#Comment_1837397

    I Have to say I dont see that much support in your points but I respect your opinion of mine nonetheless so let me try to see if I can explain some things you thought I explained poorly.

    1. I completely disagree with your view on the survivor perks, most of the perks I mentioned I.E. spin chill, and lithe are powerful and constant use perks offering use in escape and information, something that provides a massive advantage ( imagine if killers had a perk that told you if you were looking at a survivor within a certain distance and never shut off ). Alot of the killer perks you mention fall under the "situational" or "Niche" such as blood warden, remember me, and make your choice, and alot of the other perks as I mentioned already have draw backs or even flat out ways to remove them I.E. STBFL, ruin, Devour hope, Dying light, PWYF. I don't want to kill the experience of solo survivors, I dont see how a review of survivor perks for balance would kill their experience, it is instead meant to give the killer a chance to fight teams of good survivors who have almost no difficulty facing the killer with their plethora of perks to escape the killer regardless of how well the killer plays against them I.E. Deadhard,and Lithe.

    2. I once again disagree with your view of the breakable walls, half if the walls added in recently are in doorways previously unblocked and requires the killer to either lose distance on the survivor by breaking them or get infinite looped by vaulting the window. Pallets are a resource in maps and should be used with that in mind, just because there aren't many pallets doesn't mean there aren't windows to loop with (also the amount of pallets on each map is random so blame the RNG for that not the maps themselves).

    3. i don't play for a 4k every game the point of the hatch subject is that the mechanic is blatantly survivor sided, and even if the killer closes the hatch the survivor still has the exit gates to use which can be opened with very little time at all. Once again you complain about RNG and blame a killer for using their advantage by the map spawning the gates close with a point of elevation, its obvious your biased for survivor. I have once again tried to be as unbiased as I can but you didn't even make an attempt. All I have seen here is survivor sided views but I am open to discussion about the points I have listed but try to keep it civil.

    I am biased for survivors, ok. Ah man. So I "talk about RNG and blame a killer for using their advantage", which you make look like a completely ok thing, yet survivors getting the hatch is not RNG nor is it considered as "exploiting their advantage". Who's biased now, I wonder?

    What you were saying was that survivors, be them solo or SWF, should not have access to 4 perks each. That looks like killing solo survivor's purpose to me, plain and simple. Anyway, about listed perks:

    • Spine Chill is just a warning, which is pretty much useless if the killer is not a stealth one. So that makes that aspect of it situational. Then you have increased vault speed, which is the actual important part, but that is nowhere near unbearable.
    • Lithe only works with windows, or with pallets killers are stupid enough not to destroy. If you don't find a window, you don't make use of it. Which, again, can make it situational. Not only that, but the speed boost you get is not such a big deal, at all. The killer will easily catch up, unless he bangs his head into a wall.
    • Blood Warden is not situational, but it depends on the killer's ability to hook survivors during EGC. It is an endgame perk.
    • STBFL situational/niche? Really? The ability to recover faster from hits and being able to hit again in a shorter time is niche? That is powerful, especially on some killers who can make the best use out of it, while also negating stacks losses.
    • Ruin. Do we even need to talk about how a perk that is in pretty much EVERY match is not situational nor niche? Yes, it can be broken at the start of the match. No, it won't matter, since 90% of players pair it with Undying.
    • Devour Hope. Most of the time, you'll get to enough stacks before the survivors can even realize you have this perk, Which means, you'll make use of it. Sure, it can go down at the start of the match, but as you said "if RNG makes it so survivors find it early, can you blame them for exploiting their advantage?".
    • Dying Light. A perk that literally only tasks you with hooking survivors, in order for it to slow gens, can be deemed as niche or situational? Come on man, be serious. The game is DbD, not the forums.
    • PWYF. You'll become faster for losing the obsessions, which you can do by simply starting a chase, turning around. Rinse and repeat, and you have 3-4 stacks. If you do that with killers like Wraith or stealth ones, it becomes even easier. Put that on Leatherface and there is almost no getting way from him. Infinite EW Myers? You got that.

    The addition of breakable walls doesn't only make killers end some loops easily, but those walls, being destructible by the killer alone, become somewhat strategical. If you never break the school walls in Springfield, for instance, survivors have very narrow escape chances.

    I guess this is all, enough said. Time to get serious again, shall we?

    in Put the "power" back in "power role" Comment by Damarus

  • @HowsMars said:

    The community has been split between the argument of which side is the stronger role, each side plagued by a bias of opinions, I am no exception to the bias but I do feel I can try to be as fair as I can be.

    In my experience playing DBD I have found that killers are for the most part alot more unbalanced than survivors.

    The balance of the game changes depending on the killer and their power. Playing a strong killer like spirit or nurse ( assuming you have the knowledge of how to play them ) is a different experience than playing wraith or pig. With this in mind il be basing my opinions on someone playing characters to be in the middle of the power scale.

    1. Perks are some of the biggest game changes in DBD, depending on the perks you take your game can either be a complete breeze or a frustrating waste of time. This applies to both survivors and killers however there is a massive oversight in the balancing between the 2 sides

    A. Survivors perks tend to have a direct impact on the experience for the most part, this isn't all but most perks available to them, certain perks a survivor takes can make an extremely impact on the game with 0 reprocession, and are usually re usable. Example of these super perks would be META perks and others like head on, lithe, spin chill, alert, power struggle.

    B. Killer perks are generally passive, very few actually have a massive impact on the game, perks like Ruin, pgtw, and undying are strong perks but very few live up to their standard. Killer perks tend to be very inconsistent constantly varying in value match to match because of the specific weaknesses that are paired with them. hex perks can be cleansed, pop requires a hook having a maximum of 12 possible uses, and most other perks require specific and niche situations.

    The difference between the perk strengths are massive causing a huge gap in balance depending on what you take. killers get a maximum of 4 perks, and those perks can be lost or useless making the choices you make for them difficult and could cost you the game no matter how META you build is. Survivors have 4 perks each ( a maximum of 16 perks ), if each survivor takes 2 meta perks and 2 random perks the changes they make with just 2 meta perks can cost a killer the game since they can be used multiple time ( excluding DS and UB ). Survivor perks need to be dialed back especially META perks with how powerful and plentiful they are for survivors. There is no reason for the 4 survivors to have stronger perks than the 1 killer.

    2. Certain maps tend to be absolute survivor havens (examples being the coldwin farm maps and Haddon field), offering escape or refuge around every corner and allowing for little to no mistakes on the killers part while protecting survivors for suffering from theirs. With the recent additions of breakable walls being put in place to force killers to open pathways that where previously open is even more ridiculous and wastes alot of the killers time for no reward.

    3. Gameplay mechanics that cater to survivors heavily are something that should be reworked to aid both sides. My first example is the hatch, if a killer gets 3 kill he's rewarded with a race to the hatch with the last survivor and hoping they aren't just hiding next to an exit gate holding the game hostage and forcing the killer to close hatch and hope that he can get to the gate in time (if he even chooses the right one). In my opinion once the third survivor is sacrificed the exit gates should power, the end game collapse start, and the hatch spawn closed, this doubles a rework for keys making them only usable by the person who takes them and making it a useful item in endgame.

    There are plenty of other issues in the game that I feel should be looked into and considered for balance or reworking. But I want to know the communitys opinion on the points provide or even for others to makes points of their own.

    All that i ask is before posting just considering trying to be as unbiased biased and possible since 100% isn't.

    1A) Of all the survivor perks you mentioned, the only one which COULD make a difference is Head On, and not even during a chase. Plus, to really make a difference with that perk, you would need to be SWF.

    1B) PGTW activates whenever you hook, and you have plenty of time to make us of the massive regression it provides. Ruin and Undying, paired with applying pressure, are one of the strongest combo at a killer's disposal, and that is a big time waster for survivors. After that, there are many other useful perks killers can use: PWYF, STBFL, Make Your Choice, Devour Hope, Blood Warden, Remember Me, Brutal Strenght, Agitation, Dying Light, Thanatophobia, Infectious Fright. Not to mention the fact that many perks, like BBQ and Nurse's Calling make the work YOU should be doing for you. Not all perks are supposed to be equally strong on every single killer. That adds some PRECIOUS variety to the game. (Have you ever played Rainbow Six? Every match the ops picked and banned are always the same, which makes it kinda tedious).

    I don't remember getting a single powerful survivor perk since Zarina's "For The People". And even then, it has a huge drawback. As for more recent perks, like Cheryl's, they are highly situational. What you are proposing is, in practice, to completely kill solo survivors' experience. The only thing that could be done would be to limit the amount of equal perks 4 survivors bring into the match, even tho not for every perk. Like no more than 2 UB, for instance, and perhaps show each survivor the perks their companions have equipped, while in lobby.

    2) A point with almost no mistakes, finally. Why almost? What you said is true about some maps (even though breaking walls is neither a time waster nor something that does not reward you, but whatever). You forgot to add that there are, and there were, maps that were a death sentence for survivors, one being Yamaoka's Estate, for instance. On some maps, the amount of pallets is just pathetically low, while on some other maps there are many more unsafe pallets then everything else. You want to talk about something, do it thoroughly.

    3) Jesus, another post about the hatch. How long is this thing going to be like that. Please, please, please, get that into your killer minds, hatch is not a free escape, killers do NOT have to get a 4k every single goddamn game. This is getting ridiculous now.

    Now, for off-topic points, should we talk about how often exit gates are close to each other, with a hill in between that the killer can sit on?

    Relly, dude. If you want to talk about BALANCE, it means you'll have to consider both sides in the same way. All I see is killer-sided points here. As much as something is true, doesn't mean all the rest is.

    in Put the "power" back in "power role" Comment by Damarus

  • @danielmaster87 said:

    https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1834750#Comment_1834750

    If you take away Bloodlust, normal loops become god loops. I've seen loops right now that are just a pallet and 2 long sides, and even with Bloodlust 3 it's unmindgameable once the pallet is down. I'm not even kidding. And I know tiles like killer shack are supposed to be that way, but that goes without saying. When all loops are god loops, no loops will be. In other words, any survivor will be able to take the killer on a long chase just by using a basic loop. And you may be asking, "Why not break the pallet?" because you do that 5 times and then the game is over. Breaking the pallet not only cancels 'the unbeatable Bloodlust' but also gives the survivor enough time to run to the next loop.

    I played mostly Hillbilly when Bloodlust was disabled and it was insufferable. I could never use my power. Multiple times I said, "Bloodlust would have gotten me that hit."

    That's why if Bloodlust gets taken away, loops need to become shorter.

    I am perfectly ok with that, as long as other things are solved, like exit gates being next to each other. Still, this shouldn't mean that every loop should be shortened. Not every single one at least. I would be ok with infinites being blocked, but with the amount of unsafe pallets this game already has on many maps... Or at the very least, if we want to keep the game in its current state (map-wise), Bloodlust should be reduced to tier 1 and activate after a longer period of time.

    Just not to be misunderstood: I used to consider myself as a 50/50 player (survivor/killer). Nowadays, when I play, I mostly play killer, so I am talking from that perspective, too. As much as some matches can be stressful, I like to kill survivors because of trap placement and thinking ahead, not having to rely on Bloodlust on every single chase. Though I can agree that is it needed sometimes, sometime does not equal everytime. Bloodlust is something that is just there too much.

    in Taking the DS early is not counterplay Comment by Damarus

  • What do you mean? As in Ellis' shirt? If so, Dwight already has it.

    But I guess it depends on what console you are referring to. I don't know if those things are on Switch already. They are on PS4, and XONE too, I'll assume.

    in Can the l4d shirt cosmetics come to console? Comment by Damarus

  • Well, here's my two cents on this:


    • Spirit: She should become partially visibile or have a way to counter her properly. There should not be the need for a perk to counter a killer, that should come from experience. As it is, you can't really know whether she is faking her power or not, nor do you know where she is (especially during chase, with that theme getting so high).
    • Freddy: Freddy is a one demon army, capable of doing everything by himself. He has slows, map pressure, fake pallets, spam-friendly power and his lullaby negates many perks. Not to mention the unexistant skill ceiling. I would have his lullaby considered as TR by perks and reduce his power charges. so he would have to actually THINK about placement.
    • Leatherface: Reduce his charges to 2.
    • Huntress: Rework Iridescent Head.
    • Myers: I'd go for the change the OP proposed, as long as he isn't using Infinite EW3.
    • Blight: Adjust turning speed on console, so he doesn't look like a killer designed with only PC in mind.
    • Hag: Have traps be somewhat away from the hook and also, possibly, from each other. Then, I don't see why she should be almost frozen solid while after teleporting.
    • Trapper: Spawn with 2 traps, even without add-ons.
    • Oni: Completely empty his power-meter when he picks someone up while in Yamaoka's Wrath. This would make it so he has to work for it again, instead of just having it ready again after hooking a guy.
    • Pig: I see her as a fun killer, though she could use some tweaks to make her somewhat stronger. I just have no idea where to go from there.
    • Deathslinger: I would personally remove his faster recharge add-ons, to make him somewhat of a less spam-spam killer. And I say that as a Slinger player myself.

    After that, I would limit every existing and future killer's ability to mindlessly spam, depending on circumstances (what I mean is that Clown and Billy's spamming is not the same as Blight's). Clown, for instance. Unless you have pallets back to back to back it is highly unlikely that you can negate a hit. As much as it is completely different from the Spirit, in a certain way, the Clown's bottles have no counterplay as well. What I mean is that if they hit you or around you, it's a hit. While you can avoid a Billy's Chainsaw Dash by changing direction, which you can also do against a Nurse, you can't do that against Clown. Since he doesn't get slowed down anymore, if you change direction, you are more than likely to come close to him anyway.

    All of this doesn't mean survivors wouldn't need work, of course. But this thread was about killers, so...

    in What killers need to be changed? Comment by Damarus

  • Another post on why DS is unfair for killers, huh? Well, you know, I have always despised that perk, and always refused to use it because I felt it was cheap, just like I still refuse to pick NoeD, for the same exact reason. But at least DS has a purpose, which still very rarely becomes a thing: "avoiding tunneling". As someone else already said, killers who get hit with a DS will almost always proceed to tunnel that same exact survivor, no matter what. It's just how things are, sadly. Still, there is a good solution to this. Remove DS from survivors and remove Bloodlust from killers. Done. No endless chases in which the killer gets you just because of Bloodlust. And if he gets to you, you will have wasted enough of his time (hopefully), but no DS will be there. Even tho I still think there should be a way to counter tunneling in some way, if it really needs to be a thing.

    in Taking the DS early is not counterplay Comment by Damarus

  • @pseudechis said:

    https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1831143#Comment_1831143

    Yeah I agree that's kind of my point too. The strive is for balance in order to create a game experience that's fun for all but that very element undermines what the game is about.

    The key problem with this game is that its pvp. In an effort to make an enjoyable game experience for both sides then the monster can't truly be a monster as that would be overpowered and no-one would play survivor.

    The catch 22 of trying to create a competitive survival horror is that you have to water down the horror so people can survive.

    The change to the MORI is a great example of this. A killer running a mori was the most intense threat that survivors would face. You could be killed at any moment really quickly, the cost of getting caught and hooked even once was huge. The tension was high because so much was at stake game wise with that mori in play.

    But its oppressive for one side of the community and the short game time coupled with long queue time isn't fun. So the mori in a pvp setting doesn't create fear and tension, it creates tantrums and resentment. The core problem with DBD is that its asymmetrical multiplayer and the theme is built on that asymmetry, more it gets balanced out the more the game experience gets watered down.

    I think you are kinda looking too much into the horror element and forgetting that people wouldn't use Mori because they enjoyed the horror element, but rather because they wanted to have an easy match and ease the pressure much earlier on. But there is possibly the best example of what any asymmetrical game would become, if you were to give too much power to one role. And that example is called F13: The Game. One of the least enjoyable videogames I have ever played. Jason was, and still is, too strong. I remember that, when the game came out, people rightfully complained about how OP Jason was. And the devs had the bright idea of replying with a: "He is Jason, he is supposed to be OP".

    That is a videogame you are talking about. Something where you want to have fun. Something where you can still live if they cut your head off and your friends place it back onto your body (Wolfenstein New Order). Something where you have chainsaws attached to your assault rifles (Gears of War). Videogames, unless they start from that idea (Battlefield) are not meant to be simulators of a real life situation.

    So this game will probably never have proper balancement, but there is still so much that CAN be done.

    in No killer or their perks are op Comment by Damarus

  • @pseudechis said:

    https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1830679#Comment_1830679

    The term is META, which is a euphemism for easier to use.

    But killers should be oppressive as there is no fear in playing survivor, which is kind of the point of a horror survival game.

    The problem is many people value winning over all else and their sense of self or ego is tied to winning, the very commonly found in online gaming "cry babies" of the world. So if they feel they can't win they won't play. (You ever notice how the guy who spams the PPSH is also the one who melts down the worst in chat).

    Game duration is tied to queue time and why wait 10mins to be killed in 30secs? but you can wait 30secs to be killed in 10mins. So again who would play survivor in that scenario?

    If killers were what they should be, to really encapsulate the theme of the game, then no-one would play survivor. As within the theme of the horror genre, no more than one survivor should survive any given game on average, hence the famous term "last girl".

    The strive shouldn't be for balance it should be for adequate levels of false hope. I know I can make it "get to the choppa!" kind of false hope, then splat, that is a true horror survival game.

    Well, games are meant to be fun. Why would I play something where I know I will not be able to survive? And the game is horror, but that is limited to the first times you play, when you still don't have a clue about what each killer does, how to loop, where your teammates are and if they are doing stuff and, most importantly, you fear missed skillchecks. After that, true jumpscares come from unexpected killers being there (stealth ones), since you do not hear their terror radius. Even then, if you are experienced enough, you will constantly be looking around while working on a gen. I don't know how the upcoming Outlast Trials will be, but I say you can't expect a multiplayer game to be truly horror. Not for long, at least. And not forever, of course.

    Since this is a videogame, balance is everything. But I fear there will never be proper balancement. For that to happen, tunneling and bloodlust (first and foremost), should not be a thing. But I feel like that would lead the kids out there to leave the game, implying queue times could take forever.

    in No killer or their perks are op Comment by Damarus

  • @DemonDaddy said:

    I just find it strange that in a game where the killer is supposed to be a powerful dangerous Force meant to be avoided, my fellow survivors want to complain about the danger. Iridescent add-ons, instant down attacks, moris, undying and ruined hex combo, etc. It's four survivors versus a monster, not four survivors versus their equivalent. Every survivor should expect the killer to decimate them without any Mercy and using every shortcut available. I firmly believe that if a killer seems too strong it's only because your survivor skills are too weak. The opposition is supposed to be oppressive otherwise it's not an obstacle to overcome. I just think we should stop with the cuddle requests to the devs and let them expand the danger not pull it back.

    I think the opposite. No killer is so bad to be rendered completely unplayable but, as with every game, there is cheesier, easier stuff. And like every game, people will always opt to make the game MUCH easier for them, by using those things. Examples?

    In CoD Black Ops 3, everyone used (and still uses) VMP or Vesper. In CoD WW2, everyone uses PPSH.

    In DbD? NoeD, DS, Dead Hard, Unbreakable, tunneling, camping, spamming, SWF, Spirit, Billy, PH, Freddy.

    As I said, the cheesier it is, the more you'll see it around.

    in No killer or their perks are op Comment by Damarus

  • @Yamaoka said:

    You created this thread way too early. Should have waited for his upcoming rework.

    Maybe he will become the strongest 1v1-M1-chase focused killer? Who knows. I'm excited for the midchapter anyways.

    Hope the rework will make him more enjoyable for both sides. Right now, Clown is the definition of a spamfest. He and Freddy.

    in Controversial opinion: Clown is really good, you are just playing him wrong. Comment by Damarus

  • @JimboMason said:

    https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1824431#Comment_1824431

    Great point! I honestly did not think of the impact on other survivors.

    Thanks! Honestly, I was quite unsure if I managed to explain myself clearly, but I guess I did haha.

    Don't get me wrong tho, I would like to see such a thing, it would add more diversity. But with the immense work this game already needs, proven by the recent bug fixes and the still ongoing issues, I see that as a very difficult task. Not to mention the fact that it would also be less intuitive for newcomers.

    in Cheryl (Not Survivor) Change Comment by Damarus

  • @JimboMason said:

    Alright, hear me out.

    When playing Cheryl, the player should be hearing static noises instead of a heartbeat. As the killer gets closer, the static could become louder, just as the heartbeat speeds up. I feel like this would fit Cheryl, since static noises are used to indicate when an enemy is nearby in the Silent Hill games.

    What do you guys think ?

    Well, don't think that will be a thing. It would involve a lot of work for existing and future killers, not even considering the fact that people might then begin asking for every licensed survivor to have his own personal theme. While a killer like PH or Myers only needs different work on himself, applying the same thing to every survivor, applying somethign different to a single survivor would mean that every single killer would then need to emit a different "heartbeat", from existing to future ones.

    in Cheryl (Not Survivor) Change Comment by Damarus

  • @SirAlan said:

    please catch up to us in terms of skill and game knowledge.

    -urban exasion is a rubbish perk. hiding gives 0 value to your team. You don't get bloodpoints for it so go figure. Thats why you have 5K at the end of a 20 minute game.

    -When you get hit by a killer. Sprinting towards a hooked survivor for a YOLO isnt smart play.

    -you could probably help save someone instead of insta running out the gate?

    KILLERS

    using broken ultra rare add ons doesnt make you a good killer, it just makes for a boring quick game on both sides.

    pigs- do you really need to tunnel trapped surviivors?

    wraiths - you know we can see you standing in the corner by hook?

    bubba's/trappers - there's more to life than basement builds.

    you guys are the worst for tunnel/camping. please learn some eticate.

    Help us make the game more enjoyable so we dont have to turn off cross-play all the time.

    You know, what would help into keeping the game enjoyable would be, first and foremost, to be on par in terms of system performance. The massive frame drops we can suffer on Playstation (and XBOX too, I'm willing to bet) are something you don't quite see on PC. I know highly optimized PCs are bound to have a better performance, of course. But that implies the fact that there should be no crossplay between different performing platforms. That alone is already a huge advantage for a PC playerbase, in a game where a single frame drop could mean you end up hitting air, when you should have hit a survivor, or find out that a skill check you didn't know was there has already failed.

    Anyway, I don't understand why people keep claiming, as if it was obvious, that bad players are on console. You PC players are not all godly, you know? As much as there are godly players on console as well. While you can almost cleary determine if a killer who uses, say Huntress, is playing from a PC, you can't do that with other sources. That just turns into an assumption, and a wrong one, most of the time.

    Oh, and if you want to know, the vast majority of the tunnelers I meet are from PC. How do I know that? Because I check their profiles on Steam. So that's not an assumption, that's a fact. Again, that does not mean console players do not tunnel, as well. But, you know, I like to talk when I know what I am talking about, before I do.

    in message to console players Comment by Damarus

  • @Botiz said:

    So much for TOO FAR? NO HIT.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OX7sWqlmeO0

    Literally the next ######### game too.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ELvj3Q7ZYOA

    Oh, don't worry. Two days ago I was hit by a Freddy (no surprise there, huh?) who hit in front of him, while I was 5 METRES behind him. And I have a 200MB internet, so...

    in Glad to see Hit Validation is working as intended! Comment by Damarus

  • @Dr_Loomis said:

    https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1822084#Comment_1822084

    https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1821991#Comment_1821991

    The Evil Incarnate trophy seems to be a thorn in the side for many players. I luckily got it on my third attempt. The first time one player d/c and the second they found the hatch. With these issues along with the highly irritating locker technique, I can see how some give up on the achievement out of pure frustration. You really need to get lucky with a team who don't d/c and hide. And that can be tough. Really, Myers needs an update whereabouts the Tombstone add-on gives him the ability to kill survivors straight from the locker. That would solve the issue and also be very cool. Maybe have Myers stab the survivor in the locker, and then slowly admire his work before retrieving his weapon.

    Where Did They Go? was and is a terrible trophy. It was my final trophy for the Platinum. I got it pure luck after I brought a key and the killer got caught in the pallet float glitch. You really need a SWF squad with keys, maps and also perks that compliment your quest.

    Well, that would kinda solve that, but I hardly think they will ever implement such a change just for the sake of an achievement. I got lucky with "Where did they go", too, and found a killer who wanted to farm. He let me and my 2 friends escape through the hatch, along with the random.

    in Which trophies did you find/are finding exceptionally annoying? Comment by Damarus

  • I don't think I'll ever be able to get "Evil Incarnate", tbh. And I'd rather hit my testicles with a sledgehammer than try that again.

    in Which trophies did you find/are finding exceptionally annoying? Comment by Damarus

  • @goatslinger said:

    I honestly think the hatch should just be removed. It's a really dumb mechanic imo.

    I think killers should not be able to hit survivors. It's really dumb that they can do that.

    The hatch exists for a reason, which is to give at least a single survivor, who may have been the best of the team, or the one who hid in lockers and Urban Evaded around the walls of the map, a chance to escape, even when their team performed really badly. Who gets the hatch is RNG.

    in How should the key be changed ? Comment by Damarus

  • @Sonzaishinai said:

    https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1820571#Comment_1820571

    How would that make it impossible?

    Once all gens are done the hatch spawns as normal and if everyone is still alive they can escape together

    It would be exactly the same as it is now actually which is the nice part

    Yeah, because even the weakest killer is going to have all 4 survivors alive, by the end of the game. Come on. I mean, it doesn't bug me, really, as I already have that achievement. Found a killer who was farming once and he let us all escape that way. But I like being objective when I propose something.

    Plus, I say it would end up being the biggest part of the problem, was it to be that way. If hatch spawned as usable when all 5 gens were done, there would be no need for survivors to A) look for exit gates, B) Reach them, C) Open them.

    in How should the key be changed ? Comment by Damarus

  • @Leachy_Jr said:

    (Inb4 "Just bring franklins 4head")

    Been a lot of key gamers recently since the mori nerf, probably since they know keys will be nerfed soon and that the mori nerf was a massive red flag. Maybe they should've been changed at the same time to avoid this exact issue happening.

    Anyway, I've seen quite the varying playstyles with them. I've seen people get a 3 man escape out of a 3 gen with a key they've got from a chest with NO chest perks.

    I've seen somebody literally let their 2 teammates die on hook for BOTH stages and get out for free with a key.

    And finally I've seen the people who are so bad at the game that they don't even get to use the key in the first place.

    So, this begs the question, when keys are changed, are they going to be changed correctly?

    The current rework people want which is letting only 1 person escape with them does NOT fix the core issue with the item - getting effortless, undeserved escapes after a bad game. As long as people bring one or more key then it's just as BS as before.

    Will keys be removed from chests? I don't run chest builds myself, but my friend who runs them got a key in 4 of the 6 survivor games he had. If keys are still going to appear out of pure luck they shouldn't be strong, at all.

    Idk, I just really don't have faith that keys are going to be changed in a good way.

    As much as I am not a key user myself, I find it hard to believe that every single key carrier is bad at the game, some people just like to bring it as a wildcard, in case their teammates are trash/trolls (and trust me, I've seen quite a lot of those). Still, someone escaping through a hatch is not, by any means, bound to an "undeserved" escape. I mean, sure, I'd rather walk out the gates as a survivor, and not get a hatch escape as a killer, but still.

    Moris, on the other hand, were quite the opposite. And they changed them in a good way, they balanced them. It took them a long while, but they did. I'm going to trust the same will apply to keys, as in those will be nerfed, but not become completely worthless.I suggested removing keys from chests if one is equipped before the trial starts, and only having the key carrier escape through an hatch opened that way.

    You can't really remove that aspect from keys, tbh, as that is pretty much the only reason why keys are used, to begin with. Some people use aura reading add-ons on them, but ultimately they serve the purpose of hatch opening. So I guess that one survivor, at the very least, will always be able to use a key to escape. Personally, I don't have much of an issue with that. I can live without a kill, which is something that most killer mains on these forums seem not to be able to do.

    in ngl I'm getting pretty tilted with the amount of keys recently. Comment by Damarus

  • @Sonzaishinai said:

    Make it so the hatch only spawns when there is one survivor left or the gens are done.

    Problem solved. Still is an easy escape after the killer closed the hatch and no more matches where 1-3 survivors suddenly just dissapear even though they didn't do their objectives.

    Also easy to implent

    What you are missing on that, tho, is that such a change would make the "Where have they gone" achievement impossible to get. And I don't think devs can touch already established achievements.

    in How should the key be changed ? Comment by Damarus

  • @rafajsp said:

    I really don't get yet the nerf on keys.

    What's going to happen ? Do 5 gens, gate and then scape and use key ? (Joke)

    Really what is your opinion because i never care about keys and i completely don't understand the rages.

    @TragicSolitude said:

    There are multiple changes the devs could make to keys.

    What I personally want is for a key to only allow the survivor using it to escape.

    Another possible change to keys would be creating an unlock animation, so the escape is no longer instant and the killer actually has a chance to interrupt/stop it.

    Keys could also be changed so that they can only be used by the final survivor to open the hatch after the killer has closed it.

    Well, what @TragicSolitude suggested would be a possible change. I say it could be made so hatch-unlocking keys can only be brought by a single survivor in the lobby, no matter if solo or SWF. If one survivor has it, the other 3 cannot equip one, unless it is the Broken Key (Green).

    I'd say that it can also be made so, if the system detects that a key was brought into the trial from the start (a player equipping it), it drops down to a 0% spawn chance in chests.

    in How should the key be changed ? Comment by Damarus

  • @savevatznick said:

    https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1818024#Comment_1818024

    I don't know if you've been playing killer up at red ranks, but pipping feels more like an exercise in entertaining the survivors than it is about being an effective killer. I already let people off of the hook for rank- no free unhooks but I let them get off - right now I can run an 10 or 11 hook game and still depip as trapper or plague. I can win every loop and play "fair" and still depip because some stupid a-hole gets a free hatch.

    Oh trust me, I know red ranks. Still, this doesn't really invalidate all of what I have already said. Unless you are just playing as an M1 killer, without survivors walking into your traps (which means there is some poor placement), without damaging gens and breaking pallets, there really is no way for you to be black pipping. And one survivor gone through the hatch does not prevent you from racking up points during the match, you are just using that as an excuse, I fear, to validate your point. Again, survivors escaping through the hatch has never prevented me from pipping. To be fair, I just double pipped, and the last survivor escaped through the hatch. As you can see, it all comes down to how you play. If you play poorly, the hatch is not a part of your endgame results, friend. Enough said.

    in Killer is about being robbed. Comment by Damarus

  • @savevatznick said:

    https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1818009#Comment_1818009

    This is my point. The devs are not looking into the underlying mechanics of the hatch and what makes it so, quite frankley, brainless.

    Killers just have to slug for the 4k - no one likes this. No one likes key escapes except terrible key surviviors. So why does the hatch still exist?

    God, people still don't get this in 2020, do they?

    Killers are NOT entitled to get a 4K every match. Get out of that mentality that is more braindead than Freddy is, please.

    Survivors are NOT entitled to escape every match.

    Of course, sadly, nobody can stop you from slugging because you feel like "Me want 4 kills, me good boy". But this is a VIDEOGAME. Videogames are meant to be FUN, to have you SPEND time without THINKING too much into it. Getting all sweaty because you feel like you deserve 4 kills for the sole reason that you think you do, is quite the opposite.

    in Killer is about being robbed. Comment by Damarus

  • @savevatznick said:

    >Be killer

    >9 hook game, kill 3 survivors

    >Hatch spawns

    >black pip

    Is the hatch really necessary? It's a terrible band-aid fix. When will we hold BHVR accountable for the absolutely abysmal "Stalemate-breaker" they have spawned? Are they even looking for a better solution?

    I HIGHLY doubt you got black pip, if you really hooked 9 times and got 3 kills. Black pip, or even Entity Displeased is something that occurs to me only on two occasions: I play as Myers with both Iri add-ons, to try and get that stupidly difficult "Evil Incarnate" achievement or I destroy survivors in the first few minutes, without a single gen getting to 50%, so I end up scoring too few points. Other than that, it is extremely easy to rack up some points to at least net you the first pip. Hatch isn't a problem, really. Sure, when I play killer I'd like a 4k too. But that doesn't mean I'm going to cry in a corner, trying some vodoo cursing because I didn't get a 4k.

    And about things being really necessary, I ask you this: Is it really necessary to have exit gates spawn next to each other, possibily with a hill in between, so the killer can camp doors too, on top of hooks? Killers always whine about what is "unfair" for them, yet nobody ever points out how exit gates are broken. And what does that mean? It means you don't want survivors to have the hatch, but it also means you don't want them to stand a chance at escaping = I want a 4k every game.

    in Killer is about being robbed. Comment by Damarus

  • The thing is, Freddy is a one "demon" army. He can do everything for himself. He has map pressure, spamfest ability (which should not be a thing on any given killer), infinite uses with no reloads needed, no slowdowns, he can fake his teleport to apply pressure before he even gets there, his lullaby prevents terror-radius perks from being used, broken lunge, normal move speed, slowdowns while survivors are in the dream state and interactions to slow the game down (getting out of the dream world). As much as for killers like Spirit it is true that no killer power should be countered by perks (every power should have a way of countering it without a single perk equipped, or it means there is close to no counterplay for that), it is also true that Freddy has got it all. As he is now, he doesn't require minimal skill. As he was before, he was redundant and way too slow in his ttk.

    What I would do, is to cut his charges in half. 6 snares and 4-5 pallets. That way he would actually have to be strategical on where he places stuff, without just going spamfest on everything he sees. He would then need a slowdown while placing snares/pallets. Teleport can stay as it is. Then, ofc, I would work on his lullaby denying TR perks, which is bs. Other than that, I don't see any more changes, really.

    in Freddy is B tier at best and doesn't need nerfs. Comment by Damarus

  • @TicTac said:

    https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1816563#Comment_1816563

    Hoping that player would choose not to be toxic (against the fun of other player) instead of encouraging them is just naive. You could die of old ages before that happens.

    Sorry but this doesnt work and is not realistic.

    For example do you know how the usage of some op weapons in shooter got solved? This weapons got the noob-stigma of the community and everyone flamed the user. Fighting toxicity with toxicity. Great.

    And dbd is asymmetrical, where you cannot use the same things as your enemy. This make the cycle of toxicity worse.

    Then theres the point that losing isnt fun, so maybe tunneling creates more fun then it hinders? Of course you need the killer fun x4. Otherwise you could argue that survivor fun is more important and the killer has always get the short end of the stick.

    So why should we try the hard, unrealistic solution, when we could just solve it with an easy solution?

    Yeah, I'm not saying we should just have hope on that happening. But the mindset is just wrong, and there is really no denying that. The thing is, having to provide rewards to someone, to pat his back and say "you've been a good boy, now fetch" just NOT to make him play in a toxic way, baffles me. I think the other way around should be the actual improvement, but it has to be done in a substantial and well thought way. For instance, when the Emblem penalty for camping was introduced, did that stop people who wanted to camp and play cheesily by doing so, without losing their points? Absolutely not. I have been camped from a Billy (way before his rebalancement) who stood away from me, enough so he could still see me and anybody who would eventually come save me, but not to lose any points, with his chainsaw revved. The point I am trying to make is that if you try to be good and reward people for "behaving" without instead choosing to punish them when they don't, they will always find a way to exploit both things. If you are not willing to punish unnecessary camping in a strong way, people will still keep camping, one way or another. That's way only rewarding will never work.


    To be absolutely honest, I dream of a version of DbD where there is no tunneling, no camping, no DS, 2-3 players SWFs, gens take longer, doors don't spawn next to each other and no Bloodlust.

    in Do you want 12-hooks-games? Comment by Damarus
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