Cymer
Cymer
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- Cymer
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I just recently had a game as a survivor vs a huntress.
Two of my teammates killed themselves on the first hook and afterwards the other survivor just camped the hatch and I was alone trying to do gens. I got 3 gens done, 2 to go, but with the huntress at my heels I went to the Nea to force to play something else than hatch queen.
For sure I went down, but so did the Nea. Then the huntress hooked her first, gave me a helicopter on her shoulders and let me take the hatch, because she understood, the Nea was just camping there.
After the match I gave the huntress a big thumbs up and a big thank you.
I do similar thing when I play killer and someone really did amazing and deserves a win or in 1v3/2 I help the survivors go to the next match with some fun.
Are there jerks in the game? On this world? Yes, 100%
But you decide for yourself if you want to be a jerk or make a difference.
There are some amazing players in DBD on both sides, some great community members and even great devs!
I really pit us, that we don't have a chance to interact more during a game and maximize the fun and enjoyment for all.
Sadly SWFs tend to he one-sided and exclude the killer of the fun and some perks enable toxic behavior and it is sad that those kind of perks still get interduced to DBD, especially so short after DS finally got adjusted after 2 years. It's like some person at BHVR are doing this on purpose (MoM).
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Did OP ever played AS the nurse and saw for himself how difficult the nurse is and that by equipping addons you have to relearn the blink ranges?
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Translation: He would like to have a queue for players like him who prefers to play solo instead to get screwed over by a team of SWFs.
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@Peanits can we get a statement from the devs what is their optimal vision of the way a killer should behave and act inside the game?
I know, you cannot force someone to play like the devs wish for and we know things like 360 was not intended by the devs but still a fun expression of skill inside the game.
It would be helpful to understand with what concept in mind the devs are creating and balancing the game so we, the community, can better understand your intend and give relevant feedback.
Yes we understand there are plenty of different play-styles and with less points for close proximity to hooks the devs do try to incentivize the players to play a certain way.
So for clarification what would be the desired play-style, the one that would resemble the original idea of the devs. How should the killers behave?
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@Acromio said:
JuSt AdApT lOLololoLOLololOL11!11!!
We do with camping and Mori, but most survivors seam not particularly found of it.
The contrary. They get salty in the endgame chat.
Oh no, I couldn't troll you with my OP, pay to win perk...you bad bad killer!
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I really don't no and none of the devs answerd my question in this regard, why would the prefer to nerf Remember Me over buffing Wake Up!
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@DemonDaddy said:
So basically leave the meta for perk selection and dump all the information we can get on us for free. I find survivor easy and relaxing, but if my hud starts over filling with info its just going to get annoying.
Well maybe we could add a HUD customization where you can check what kind of information you do want. So you can adjust your difficulty by adding a self chosen handicap vs voice users. So no one will be forced to use voice and those who think that it's unfair to gain these advantages can use them too.
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@Raptorrotas said:
The thing closest to voice comms in terms of strenght would be either predetermined messages or a ping tool.
Adding aira reading etc will only buff swfs more.
It will make the usage of the information more casual. Hardcore SWF can achieve all of this and even more right now on live.
A ping system like a simple action wheel would be great.
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@Delfador said:
IMO, if they really want to balance the game around voice comms, then they should introduce them with the muting option.
This is too complicated and still wouldn't solve coordinated SWF group issues since they can also plan what they are going to do. Perks themselves won't help people that much.
Also after this, it will still be difficult to buff every killer to top tier.
I never asked to buff killers.
Yes coordinated SWF are even stronger. I agree with you.
This would only bring solos to the level of voice users.
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@PeepingPeacock said:
Bait.
Anyone being serious about this would just say suvivors should have all the information available to them that other survivors know. Not list random ass perks that have nothing to do with the advantages SWF gives you.
@Cymer said:
My thought were:
-Bond SWF can tell each other where they are at all times
-Dark Sense Hey the killer is near X
-Deja Vu the gens are near X
-Empathy hey I am hurt near X please I need healing
-Windows Of Opportunity go to the gym X there is a pallet left to use
-Spine Chill Careful killer is coming towards you
-Open Handed Voice knows no limit
-Aftercare you know where your SWF buddy is heading who unhooked you
-Small Game Traps at X, I saw totems at Y
-Object of Obsession the killer is at X
-Plunderer's Instinct there is a chest near X
-Detective's Hunch Hey gens, chest, totems at XYZ
-Kindred Killer is face-camping me do stuff
-Premonition Careful killer is coming towards you
-Alert SWF Hey the killer is breaking pallet x or is kicking that gen
-Wake Up! Hey come to that exit gate it's already open
Read my explanation. It's not bait.
These thing can be accomplished by using voice and to this day is getting used by all voice users. This is the gap between solos and voice.
It doesn't matter if you chose NOT to use the information given but these information is available to voice users.
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@brokedownpalace said:
That's absurd. To compensate for this they would need to buff all killers to top tier.
Every team with voice has access to these perks in one way or another.
It is in the game for a selected majority. All Voice users.
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My thought were:
-Bond SWF can tell each other where they are at all times
-Dark Sense Hey the killer is near X
-Deja Vu the gens are near X
-Empathy hey I am hurt near X please I need healing
-Windows Of Opportunity go to the gym X there is a pallet left to use
-Spine Chill Careful killer is coming towards you
-Open Handed Voice knows no limit
-Aftercare you know where your SWF buddy is heading who unhooked you
-Small Game Traps at X, I saw totems at Y
-Object of Obsession the killer is at X
-Plunderer's Instinct there is a chest near X
-Detective's Hunch Hey gens, chest, totems at XYZ
-Kindred Killer is face-camping me do stuff
-Premonition Careful killer is coming towards you
-Alert SWF Hey the killer is breaking pallet x or is kicking that gen
-Wake Up! Hey come to that exit gate it's already open
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Then please list all the advantages a full SWF squad is getting from voice.
What perks would represent the help and information voice CAN offer.
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@GodDamn_Angela said:
No. Holy fck.
Why not? All SWF current live are playing with this advantage and everyone using voice.
Just even the field.
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In one form or another.
Everything that could be replicated with voice usage.
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@[Deleted User] said:
@Cymer if you were the survivor and dropped it from the middle. you'll be teleported back to the location u will drop the pallet from and perform the drop action. if the killer didn't swing or swung but entered the pallet's stun radius. it's basically a no no for him. enduring can help you counter it. because you'll be recovering from the stun in a very fast time. you'll even have time to hit the survivor if he tried to vault the pallet. anyway it's very rare to happen.
No I was still on the side with the killer.
I dropped the pallet in front of me with the killer behind me and managed to stun him behind me.
After that I tested it with some friends in KYF and you can stun a killer behind you with the pallet infront of you
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Can I get an answer to this bug?
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One thing I never understood about the Legions FF, so you run around the map and put everyone in deepwound. Congratulation, what now? By the time you tag the last survivor you almost can start with the first survivor again...so you just run around and tickle the survivors until they manage to finish the gens, open a gate and tbag at the exit?
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The only "rule" I have abusing voice is cheating.
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It's funny how missing attacks with a shorter cooldown once was a selling point for legion and currently live on their trailer.
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It's simple, would the data debunk most allegations they would release them.
If the data would support them it is better to withhold them.
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@Delfador said:
Also where did you hear that from?
Go to the official DBD/BHVR Discord and look for yourself.
There you can use the voice function.
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the devs feared that IF a someone is playing pig and after all the gens are powered and the endgame collapse is initiated aka the gates are open the pig COULD chase a survivor for a minute and put a bear trap IF she has any left, the survivor IF they manage to get up/unhook needs to have a chance to escape without wasting their time on searching boxes, avoid the piggy and take the gates/hatch.
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BTW when the devs are concerned about Remember Me become too powerful why don't they just buff Wake Up for survivors?
So if you are concerned to be the last survivor facing a killer with Remember Me then just use Wake Up and you be fine.
But No. They prefer to nerf killers over buffing survivors. But then the survivor has to sacrifice a perkslot to counter something another perk could potentially do...
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The entire point of the egc is that killers can give up the game without DC because the survivors, mostly in voice using SWFs, are bullying the killer to the point he gives up or taking the game hostage.
There is and was never a ingame mechanic that would have or is helping the killer win the game. Everything the killers are doing towards achieving their win is based on decisions the player had made so far. There is no, if x survivors are alive when the gens are popping or all are done the survivors get the exposed status, the similar in game effect of the hatch for survivors. No you have to equip a perk, play the game with 3 perks and hope they neither cleanse all totems or don't immediately find the lit NOED.
By your own logic and argumentation there should be some ingame mechanic, not specific perks, that would enable the killers to win the game or autowin in the hatch's chase. But there is non.
Only survivors get freebies and and since SWFs are interduced to the game no balance measure has been taken to counter voice.
In League of Legends as example, if you play with a friend you get slightly tougher opponents to compensate your advantage of voice and coordination. In DBD, the veteran survivor gets to bully a low to mid rank killer, in the worst chase a new player facing now an experienced survivor way out of their league and there enjoyment gets ruined.
These are the chases that's get remembered and these experiences are leading to the periodical outcry against SWFs. Because to them it feels like cheating (and technically we can argue if it is or not ad nauseum) and then they feel hopeless because there is no ingame counter to voice.
From that point on they either start to hate SWFs or assume that every game are against SWFs and this alone forces you to play certain killers, with certain perks, because some playstyles and perks is getting nullified by voice.
What are the devs doing there to even the playing field?
Even for solo survivors vs trolling SWFs?
In the end, when a killer manages to outplay the survivors with skill and smart plays, why do you devs think it is justified to punish their effort and work by simply alter the game in the favor of the survivor so they get a chance of escape, even if that survivor was a potato the entire game and did nothing to support the team?
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Leatherface for BBQ if you missed it in the last shrine.
Pig for Surveillance and MYC.
Myers is a solid killer with a variety of playstyle and some strong perks.
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This is exactly why I am opposed to Voice.
It's misleading and give new players the impression of cheating survivors.
If a solo player first learn the game and the rules and suddenly they encounter SWFs or voice in general they feel cheated because all of a sudden all their previous experience in the game and effort put in is devalued and there is nothing they can do to successfully counter this with in game mechanic alone.
Against good SWFs you need certain perks and killers to be viable and these restrictions frustrates player who just want to have a fun game with their favorite killer and load out.
It ruins the enjoyment of the game for others!
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The survivors reward tunneling and camping.
If the survivors stop rewarding camping and tunneling by applying pressure elsewhere they not only would win the game and escape, but also discourage the killer to camp and tunnel.
If one survivor is and to occupy the killer for 2 min, either by being chased or locking down the killer at the hook, this is a amazing feat in my book and the team should capitalize on this team play and not throwing themselves at the killer.
Blame the other survivors for not understanding the game and making the wrong decisions and not the killer, who capitalize on their over altruistic behavior, misjudgement of the situation and their mistakes!
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What Ethan missed to understand, getting a survivor out of play is the fastest and best way to slow down the game.
@AlwaysInAGoodShape stated in his Death Spiral thread.
Mending alone doesn't alter the game as much as a killer that can reliably chase down and hook/kill a survivor. That's why Nurse and Billy are top tier.
The way mending works right now it's just another m1 simulator and a nuisance for the survivors. No survivor ever will cheer to has to mend himself.
I never understood why they chose deep wound as Legions power.
I would give them 4 different powers. With m2 you cycle through the 4 masks and depending on who you chose the legion gets different options.
Like Frank is a sadist so his attack would apply the mangled effect like Sloppy.
Susie could give reduced hit animations like STBFL (dancing to the fast beat)
Julie could be better at hiding and or masking the terrorradius. Like the pig or the shape in ewi1.
Joey could have a massive terrorradius to help track down survivors.
These would make the Legion a true unique killer and everyone could play him according to his favorite playstyle with a high skill ceiling for players who manages to change to the best mask/persona needed in the current game situation.
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2th of May?
Nice Birthday Present =)
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Hag and David
Blendette for tryharding and Bubba to upset toxic SWFs.
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You have 2 min time to u hook someone. Just do gens and wait until someone is in the chase with the killer if you cannot be sure!
How do you know the killer is in a chase?
Either use your eyes or look on the mini survivor icon. If one survivor gets injured he is probably in a chase...
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@artist stop being in denial. You either really don't can understand the topic or you just don't want to for some reason.
If you are saying voice in DBD is fine, fair and balanced you are delusional.
Why are you not promoting OoO, Bound, Empathy ect. became base perks for all survivors as well as the map item?
In the end this would be the same as to state that voice is fair because the powers of voice can be replicated by perks and therefore legitimate without altering or breaking the game and there is no gap between the voice users and solos.
Everything is fine and some people just like to whine.
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If you are entertaining to watch just stream the games on twitch for a year and aim for 5.48/a day in donations.
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My issue with SWFs is not, that they cannot be dealt with.
My issue is, with their voice they outright disable certain perks and playstyles and their choice to use/abuse voice for ingame benefits forces me to play a certain way against them, not talking about all the bonus perks they get for free as some stated.
Voice alters the rules of the game.
If you play vs solo survivors or with solo survivors they will play and act differently and knowing that, using it to your advantage to create synergies or mindgame them as the killer is a major fun factor and the selling argument for DBD for me.
Voice takes all this away, nullifies all that skill and forces me to bend my playstyle to the will of some 3th party users.
It ruins my enjoyment of the game.
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It is absurd why such a feature isn't in the game.
You can check the profile of the survivors in the lobby and if the are all in the friends list, guess what, almost certainly SWF.
This feature would just remove the extra step to check the profile.
The real issue with SWFs wouldn't be fixed this way...
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"Ruin needs a Nerf"
Translates to: "cannot hit great skill checks and can be bother looking for the totem"
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As Freddy after hooking a noobish Billy, first down of the game, I got a 4 man SWF DC.
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Getting gens done still gives you the best escape chance.
If all survivors soon only play for the hatch, that means a 3k every game without a key, so you get a 1/4 chance to not die and you still have to face a killer that can hunt you while you try to open an exit gate in under 3 min or get lucky and find the hatch before the killer.
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I could see the entity as a fun game mode. Where the goal would be to survive as long as possible and try to take the hatch.
A bit of a Battle Royale against the entity.
Truly monstrous and powerful.
The entity on itself has no active powers or perks.
She just has all the entity helping perks as base:
Bamboozle
BBQ
Blood Warden
Corrupt Intervention
Monstrous Shrine
Spies from the Shadows
Spirit Fury
Whispers
Ruin and all Obsession perks can be arguable, but even without them it would make a terrific m1 killer.
Survivors get BP for how long they survive, how many gens they manage to do and a massive bonus if the manage to escape. Maybe something between 20-30k total.
For the entity hook twice then absolutely brutal and cool Mori them. Survivors cannot die on the hook and the entity can Mori the last survivor.
But you would get more BP if you manage to hook every survivor twice before devouring their hope.
Edit: if the entity Moris the second last survivor before they could unhook the other, all the hooks automatically breaks/drop the survivor who can run for the hatch.
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A skill check should always be attached to game benefit.
Every skill check you do as a survivor gives you some advantage to progress in your task.
More gen repair, more healing ect by closing the hatch the killer just alters the game and not gain an advantage. Hitting that skill check would result in a zero sum play, even negative, so why bother?
Think as a game dev.
Why implement a skill check that does nothing but using up recourses?
There is no gain only pain and waste of time/money.
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I think the math experiment still is valid without BL. Yes, in a straight line with no LOS loss you would get into BL2 then reset after hit.
But we also didn't take any hit boxes, windows, pallets ect. into account as well as SB, Lithe and other MS buffing perks.
We all know that a usual chase is around 80s = gens are popping. 1-3 if the survivors are no potatoes.
Gen rush is the best option for survivors to end the game.
All start on separate gens.
Chase for 80s, chill on the hook for 2 min or 120s that's plenty of time for the other 3 to finish at least 2 gens while one is in an other 80s chase.
Finding survivors and gen should take about the same amount of time.
After all gens are done just unhook if reasonable.
BT, MoM, Adrenaline helps a lot.
Run to the gates and escape.
At this stage 2 survivors weren't even hooked and 2 are on there first hook. Plenty of time for survivors if not played as potatoes vs same skill killer.
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But why?
What would be different?
Let the killer close the hatch and end the hatch standoff and give a 50/50 chance to get to a exit gate and power it.
This way it is faster to end the game.
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Do I miss the counterplay besides not hitting a bodyblocker?
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If you run self care you can heal yourself after a hit and successful escape without searching for another survivor and take them off the gen. It's more efficient in gen repair/genrushing.
If the perk would not exist survivors waste time finding each other and heal, preferably not in the open or next to a gen or the killer get a easy two for when they patrol the gens.
One survivor SC while 3 survivors can potentially do gens vs 2 healing and 2 doing gens.
If 1 SC and another loop the killer, 2 gens can be done vs one gen can be done.
1 hooked, one SC, one rescue and one on a gen vs no one on gens.
Yes SC takes longer, but still you can get so much more gen pressure and combined with MoM you can 99%, take a hit, complete the heal and take 2 more hits until down. Like a item independent instaheal.
Either I am totally playing and understanding the game wrong or you missed something.
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@fluffybunny said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/433870#Comment_433870
That's entirely subjective. @Cymer
Agree, I don't enjoy free victories or potatoes as teammates and I don't enjoy having a hard time because the other side takes advantage of 3th party software.
Better?
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MoM is incredible strong if used right and the more survivors is using it, the stronger it gets.
Besides the 6 hit in one chase fantasy, MoM usually adds one hit to the game. Have 4 of them is the equal to having a 5th phantom survivor to chase down.
What would you say about a perk that would increase the numbers of gens to be done by one or removes a hook state?
MoM is even better than DS because in injured state you can block everything for your teammates or yourself. Even tank chainsaws!
The only universal counter usable by all killers is camping the first hook to prevent MoM to take effect.
M2 killers can deny stacks, that's all.
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Why not?
All survivors can leave through the hatch. Should he just stand by and wave?
Even if some try to abuse this by triggering the collapse the rest of the survivors still can open the gates and escape. The only downside is, they cannot repair gens anymore and depending how the endgame collapse influence pips and points they will lose some meaningless numbers.
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And yet none is really fun for the killer.
The first one hands you the victory and you maybe pip and the last one kills you...no pip or even if you pip or win...it was a hellish game.