CheyeneKL
CheyeneKL
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- CheyeneKL
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A flashlight clicker has a limited amount of time that they can click a flashlight LMAO. Flashlights have, like, what? 20 seconds max on a purple double battery? That can be extended pretty far but not nearly as long as old moris could be, considering it takes about 4 minutes to bleed out and AFAIK, old moris paused the bleed out timer when you started to mori and then stopped.
In any case, a flashlight clicking survivor doesn't have a power role in the situation compared to the killer who is mori cancelling. You can choose to chase or not when someone flashlight clicks, but a survivor only has the option of sitting there or DC'ing/AFK'ing. I don't think that had anything to do with the change, but thought it was something worth pointing out if you were wanting to compare the two.
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@MadLordJack said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1655937#Comment_1655937
He specifically said that it should only deactivate from locker grabs, because let's face it: Locker DS is absolutely dumb. As for the rest, there's nothing unreasonable about it. If you had time to work on a gen, you weren't getting tunneled. If you're getting tunneled, don't tap a gen in the first place. If you heal or get healed, once again you clearly weren't being tunneled. Sure, I can see some problems specifically with Second Wind, but nothing else. Not even an autoheal. Although he clearly didn't mean to implement everything he said, just some of the suggestions. I rewatched the clip to fact check it.
And please stop with the "you killers," I'm a survivor as well. I want the perk to fill it's clearly intended function: protecting the survivor post-unhook.
I can totally get behind DS deactivating after working on a gen for more than 1-2 seconds (just to prevent it from deactivating upon accidental gen taps that happen on controller or set ups that have multiple actions bound to the same button/key) but I definitely don't agree with the locker change.
If I hop into a locker with DS, it's because the killer is tunneling me. I do it because he came right back to the hook to shamble me and leave me slugged on the ground, mori me, or cage me as PH if I'm tormented. Lockers are the counter to the slug counterplay (and first hook moris) and they're not even always immediately available. Being slugged is THE most boring part of the game and I don't blame survivors for wanting to avoid it if possible. And I personally have had plenty of killers slug me for DS, and then without wasting any of their time, patrol my slug + nearby gens while giving nobody a chance to pick me up unless they want to get clapped, still effectively "tunneling" without the worry of getting stunned or losing me on the ground. It's not the most common occurence but it's happened to me more often than I've ever jumped in a locker with DS LMAO
Most killers respect DS and slug without intention to re-hook, rather to waste survivor's time, but I'm not bringing DS for these killers. I respect y'all and appreciate that you're not trying to ruin my game by making it last a fifth of the time I spent waiting in queue. I'm bringing it for the killers that don't care about anyone's experience but their own and are totally fine with tunneling you to death.
I totally understand the annoyance with locker DS. You either eat the stun or leave the person alone instead of still getting to down them. But I think it's one of those things that the good outweighs the bad. Survivors can abuse it but the majority of times I've seen it done or done it myself, it was to get a killer to bug off and go chase someone else. And again, it's still situational as you are not always able to get to a locker before the killer downs you.
Killers want perfect counter play to DS (slugging) but I think it's fair for survivors to have a bit of counter play to their counter play if they dedicated a whole perk slot to something that only has 2 times per match that it can even be used.
I'd much rather see a smol pp build nerf than see locker DS go tbh
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I'm a survivor main and I have 0 issue with this perk build. If anything, you should be happy that you have ammo for when a killer complains about your "meta build" in the post game chat, cause that's a pot calling the kettle black.
Ruin+Undying is REALLY good and annoying on maps that have good totem spawns. But how often is that??? Most maps have easily discovered totems.
I've definitely had games where the killer was 100% carried by this build. But that's the point of running perks. Totem perks feel pretty cheesy but IMO that's offset by the ability to cleanse them.
I also don't think that the aura reveal on Undying is an issue. Undying is meant to be a totem that defends other totems (like the Thrill of the Hunt perk) and NOT having a way to know that someone is on your totem would make it much weaker. You can literally use the perk to your advantage. If I'm having trouble getting a totem cleansed because the killer keeps coming after me for it, I'll wait to start cleansing when the killer is deep in a chase. He either commits to the chase and loses the totem, or leaves the chase and begins a new one/loses both me and the other person he was chasing (if I sneak away before he gets to me)
I'll actually be disturbed about it if Ruin or Undying ever get nerfed. PLEASE don't give killers mains another reason to complain. Ruin and Undying are fine as they are and quite balanced in my opinion. I'd rather go against this build than Corrupt and Pop PLS
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That's a family with a nasty bloodline LMAO
I'm just waiting for it to be revealed that Rin's grandma wants a piece of everyone or something like that LOL
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@ChiSoxFan11 said:
Tonight, my friend and I played against a Spirit who refused to hook anyone until the very end of the match. Whenever they downed someone, they'd leave them slugged. No matter what the circumstance was, they refused to pick anyone up. We kept picking each other up and doing gens, but eventually the Feng and the Claudette both bled out from being on the ground so many times. I ended up going down, and the Spirit carried me to the hatch and dropped me on it. They found my friend, chased him down, and then finally hooked them just as I bled out on top of the hatch. One hook the entire game for this Spirit. One of the worst, if not the worst, experiences I've had in the game.
That must have been what this PC Pyramid Head was trying to do against my SWF and I; perhaps he was also mad that he got Haddonfield (without a map offering).
We were all on the switch except for my boyfriend (on PC). My two friends were pretty new to the game (so not good) and they were struggling even on Haddonfield and were slugged a lot of the game hahaha
Even with every survivor being tormented (except for me, I think), he didn't hook or cage anyone until the very end after all the gens were done. Just slugged over and over again. He caught my bf, put him in the basement, and tried to camp him down there. I made a BT save and went down near an exit gate. As PH picked me up, my bf flashlight saved me and the PH dc'd and then told my bf to go die in a hole LMFAO
IDK what was going on because he was good enough to win the game just by tunneling the two very weak players on our SWF.
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This may well get changed with the upcoming mid chapter patch, no? They say they're adding a new scoring event for using FTP :)
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I'm dying to know how fast you could heal with We'll Make It+Botany Knowledge+Desperate Measures+Resilience after unhooking a teammate with Leader while being the obsession under the effects of Dying Light LMAO
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Is it not a ping related issue? I myself have gotten grabbed off gens/unhooking survivors when I have clearly reacted in time to let go before I get grabbed and I've always attributed it to laggy/high ping killers.
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I play Feng and have just about every cosmetic for her. I use her brightly colored fun outfits when I play in a 4 man SWF, because I feel less pressured to hide (I tend to have a more immersive playstyle and enjoy disappearing in the middle of a chase if possible), and her duller outfits when I'm playing solo or duo queue. I often am the last man standing if 3 people on the team get hooked or slugged so I'm often hesitant to wear bright clothes even in a 4 man SWF, since being a bit harder to spot is often an advantage.
I don't have Feng on my PC account so I've been playing a lot of Blendette lately and... I've seen the light LMFAO, I really am shook by how I hide in plain view as her. I'm getting addicted 😩😩😩
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@burt0r said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1658642#Comment_1658642
Well i think that would be the sole exception then.
Also doesn't fortnite have buyable skins? And what progress is there even in that game (Edit: Except their version of season pass)?
I never played any battle royale except one round pubg and a few rounds battlefield firestorm.
Fortnite doesn't have the same sort of progress that DBD has as far as "devotion" levels, characters levels and whatnot, but there constantly is a battle pass going on and your XP levels for that season always matter when you play so that you can level up to the next part of the battle pass. Plus, Fortnite overall has a ton more "stuff" than DBD to carry over on different platforms on a single account. I'm not sure how often people switch around on what platform they play the game on, though- I went from Switch to PC as soon as I was able to and never once looked back.
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Nah, switch players are definitely taking advantage of it. I know several players who are eager for cross platform progression to hurry tf up LOL
I've been waiting MONTHS since the announcement for it to come out and I'm TIGHT that I have to wait even longer than I was originally under the impression of LOL
I'd rather have all the possible data bugs worked out first, though, before my switch account accidentally gets wiped lmfao
Even so, I'll still probably take screenshots of my progress on switch juuuust in case.
Also, Sony historically has been difficult to work with when it comes to letting players have their accounts on other platforms. I remember how hard it seemed for Fortnite to get them to agree to even just crossplay for Fortnite on PS4. My boyfriend had to start a new account just to play Fortnite with me when I first got a switch before I ever had a PC. BHVR might be having difficulty getting a good agreement with them at this point, especially with new consoles coming out (that will almost certainly have much improved performance in DBD over their current consoles)
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@Zozzy said:
Why? the survivors already lost the game., they failed to get the pity win hatch and now they should just get an easy escape out the door?
Why don't we just get rid of the doors and hatch and just end the game when 3 survivors die?
I'm assuming you're heavy trolling in your second paragraph. Regardless, it's not the best comparison/made up scenario equivalent
I'm personally not interested in having an automatic loss in a game where I happened to be the MVP (sometimes without even going down) but my team made horrible decisions/there was one game ruining DC by a player. End game stuff like that is the final chance for a player who gets screwed over by their team to possibly make an escape. Escaping through the doors as a single person left is infinitely more rewarding than a hatch escape, as a gate escape is definitely more skillful than just getting lucky with finding the hatch first IMO
I don't see a HUGE problem with door spawns (most games seem to have a reasonable amount of distance between the doors) BUT I would like to see the RNG where the doors spawn literally right next to each other in the corner of the outer walls be tweaked. I've had several games where the killer could have just stood in one single spot and swivel their camera to see both gates (it's usually on Gas Heaven btw). 100% impossible in EGC as a solo, and would even be somewhat difficult for a full team trying to open the gates (depending on the killer)
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@DetailedDetriment said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1653906#Comment_1653906
Undying will get nerfed anyways. Too many survs are complaining about it.
Is that so? I don't mind Undying at all, but I've always been a totem cleansing fiend. It's annoying, sure, but seems extremely balanced (considering it is a hex perk that can be destroyed, sometimes within seconds of trial starting) I haven't heard a single survivor main complain about Undying so far, but maybe your post game chats are very different haha
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On main topic, Mindbreaker seems like it could go really well with Ruin/Undying/Tinkerer (or even just Mindbreaker/Ruin). Ruin discourages you from waiting out the remaining cooldown time on your exhaustion perk (because that lets the gen regress a lot), and Tinkerer has obvious advantages paired with Mindbreaker with how you can pull up on them before they have much time to counter Mindbreaker's effects.
Those 3 gen, late game scenarios seem like they'd get some use out of Mindbreaker, too, at least against SB users. You'll actually be able to commit to at least a small chase since they won't be able to run far enough from the 3 gen to be helpful to themselves/their team as a distraction to drag the killer across the map LOL
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Oh geez, that makes it sound like it will work REALLY well with Tinkerer.
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@ClickyClicky said:
The ones that make me laugh are the ones that say “iM nOt jUsT gOnNa lEt U unHoOk iN fRoNt of My fAce”
They say this as they spend 40 seconds roaming the hook within a 12m radius even though there has been no indication a survivor is there.
So tell me when did you plan on leaving so we could get the unhook?
LITERALLYYYY like I see SO many killers complain about "unhooking in my face" when the majority of players in this game seem to be HEAVY proximity campers, even at red rank. They either never leave the immediate area or they constantly come back to the hook, giving you no chance to safely unhook. It's why Borrowed Time is a perk I NEVER take off in any of my builds.
I get that it's lowkey optimal for the killer to play this way. But it's incredibly annoying to rarely be given a chance to go for a normal unhook and then also see killers harp on how much they hate BT/survivors unhooking so close to them/etc. You're not helping your case for how "toxic" BT is if you're constantly giving survivors the need to bring it LOL
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Oh hell no 😤
Super thankful that this will NEVER happen to the game. I'm 100% not interested in being forced to play an ugly character just cause I like their perk. I like Borrowed Time but Bill is hideous compared to Feng and Laurie. BHVR will never do this because cosmetic sales would sharply drop off, too
Being able to play any survivor perk on any survivor is one of the best parts of the game imo and I'd be DISTURBEDDDDDD if it ever changed LOL
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@ZCerebrate said:
" I definitely don't see the raging epidemic of every game having multiple DS/UB survivors. 250 games at r1/r2 is a pretty okay sample size."
@CheyeneKL - It happens when you get a rare 4 stack with mirrored builds but coordinated teams usually only around 2~ Unbreakables because thats all you really need. The "constant" encounters with SWAT SWFs is also greatly exaggerated on the forums but it does in fact exist which might be the point of those concerns to begin with.
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1648462#Comment_1648462
No idea what you were attempting to show as significant with that % here.. It's very likely a more popular perk at red ranks because the people who gravitate there are more likely to be the type "trying to win" by their various definitions and use of the meta at the top of the meta influences that in one way or another.
But for @Justalittlepeeck and any who may or may not have been confused by how the spreadsheet is setup, it's just simply perk usage / total number of tracked perks. Then since any one survivor can't run multiples of the same perk that number is then multiplied by 4 for percentage of use.
DS is definitely the most popular perk over hundreds of matches that I play but it's also not uncommon to see plenty of survivors who don't run it by personal principle, lack of access (maybe not even having the teachable) or because they value something else higher in their builds.
I'm not denying the existence of sweaty SWAT SWF squads- it's natural for very good players to congregate to play together and try to win. And it's normal for players (killers and survivors) to run the best perks for their win attempts. DS/UB is obviously a very strong combo when it is used together, even if it isn't actually as common as many forum posters here had me believing it was.
By your data, at maximum there are 9%-10% of survivors running DS/UB, since the highest number of UB usage you have is at 96 instances of it equipped. That's around 39% of games with at least one person who could be running that perk combo. If the majority of DS/UB perk combo users are concentrated into tryhard SWFs with two DS/UB users, that's 19%-20% of games with the combo... right? Ugh my brain can only take so many numbers LOL so please do correct me if I'm wrong with any of this! Also, I'm ignoring the existence of a possible rise of DS/SG users (or even DS/SG/UB) since that's newer to the meta and the perk combos aren't included in your data. If SG is paired with DS that obviously raises the number of anti slug + anti-tunnel (or anti-momentum, however you choose to view the perk) builds. Regardless, the possibility of there being 19%-39% of games with at least one DS/UB perk combo user is nothing to sneeze at, but I truly did expect to see something closer to 60%-80%, if I'm being completely honest
As for what I was saying with my reply to the other guy- he was talking about the Ruin nerf and how some people believe that it was nerfed due to its high usage rate (80% at red ranks according to dev statistics). I made the point that DS usage does not quite get close to that level of usage. Points can be made that multiple DS procs per game can be devastating to a killer trying to win a game, but all I was showing him is that by your data, DS doesn't get close to being used as much as Ruin was at red ranks pre-nerf. If I misunderstood how you present your data, then I of course would have gotten my math wrong- but to my understanding it did look like only 31% of survivors ran DS (which of course means that there could have been a 100% chance to have at least one DS per every single game, but information like that was not included in your data, so I couldn't make any venture about that with certainty)
The rest of my reply to him was to show that even if you took the 281 non-red rank survivors out of the equation, the percentage of DS users at red ranks doesn't go past 45%.
None of my reply was saying whether or not the DS/UB perk combo is overpowered or not, it was merely an attempt to compare numbers from your data on survivor perks to the pre-nerf Ruin data from the devs. Nothing more, nothing less :)
Again, if I misunderstood your data and was totally off on any points I tried to draw from your numbers, feel free to correct me haha, math has never been my best skill!
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@Justalittlepeeck said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1648444#Comment_1648444
Bother to enlighten me how 719/1000 survivors bringing DS equals 43% of usage?
314 instances of DS
719 red rank survivors (out of 1000 survivors total)
314 DS perks/1000 survivors= 31.4% of survivors using DS.
314 DS perks/719 red rank survivors= 43.7% of red rank survivors using DS
Sorry if my comment wasn't super clear- his data makes it clear though so I presumed it could easily be checked against that if there was any confusion :) The part that is probably slightly confusing is how I decided to make a scenario where I ignored the non-red rank survivors but kept every instance of DS. Like I said in my comment, I'm positive not every DS was used solely by red rank survivors, but it was for the sake of my hypothetical scenario where his data on DS only was from red ranks. Hopefully this explanation clears up what I meant for you.
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@Justalittlepeeck said:
DS is the most used perk as I can see from these stats, 314 times this perk was brought by survivors in 250 games, then comes Dead Hard with 299 uses.
This is certainly not a reason to nerf or rework that perk like it was did to some other perk
Compare it to the CONFIRMED stats from the devs- Ruin was used at 45% across all ranks, and an astonishing 80% at red ranks. And contrary to popular belief, the high usage of Ruin was NOT the reason for it's nerf. But if that's what people want to believe, we can play that game here with OP's data.
Even if you took OP's data and pretended that all 314 instances of DS were brought solely by the red ranks in his data (719/1000 survivors), that just barely reaches 44% usage in red ranks. And I guarantee you that the DS usage was across the board and not only concentrated in red ranks, bringing it closer to the score of 31% in his data overall. Even accounting for the DS stun bug (many survivors brought it anyways despite it being virtually useless against many killers while it was bugged), OP said it was decreased in use by 10%- a decently large percentage number, but still doesn't bring the perk usage up past pre-nerf Ruin numbers.
I actually was surprised by the lack of DS (and the notorious DS+UB perk combo, only being about 9-10%)- for how much I see it get talked about, it's not quite as prevalent as I was made to believe, at least by his data.
I'm sure BHVR has even better and more clear and accurate data that pinpoints the usage of "crutch" perks across ranks and at high ranks. But if I go by OP's data I definitely don't see the raging epidemic of every game having multiple DS/UB survivors. 250 games at r1/r2 is a pretty okay sample size.
Like I said, 250 games is a nice sample size. But it doesn't account for all regions and all players, of course. I would actually love to see BHVR release something like what ZCerebrate did, maybe not with numbers but at least showing percentages of perk usages. I would 100% wager that DS would be the most highly used perk (because it is, without a doubt, the BEST survivor perk in the game), but it would be nice to see their data on it.
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Thank you for putting the time and effort into these information sheets! I always enjoy reading them.
Maybe I'm a little new, but I'm surprised to see OoO so often- I rarely play killer anymore (as it SUCKS on the Switch, especially with crosssplay) so it's not unexpected for me to have only run into it literally once ever since I started playing back in January, but my boyfriend who plays a LOT of killer at rank 1 also rarely runs into it. Idk what part of the world you are (we are southeast) but maybe that's the difference. Is OoO usage up or down based on your older information charts?
I also expected to see a lot more Unbreakable paired with DS (for how often I see people talking or complaining about it) but I also assume that there was a decent amount of people who ran UB paired with SG instead of having DS, yeah? But that leaves an absolute maximum of 9%-ish of people who could run the DS-UB combo for this set of data, yeah? (Unless I'm completely stupid. Math was always my worst subject in school LMAO)
I would be interested in seeing if there was a large difference in data between crossplay on vs crossplay off, if you ever wanted to do something like that.
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DS and Pop are just totally different. Killer has complete freedom to choose what he does after hooking someone and gaining access to Pop. Survivor has much less choice in what they choose to do after getting unhooked. They can't choose whether or not they get tunneled (I mean, I guess some survivors DO run in the killer's face with DS, but that's not my point here.) whereas a killer has free agency to gain access to Pop, and then either pick a gen to use it on, or chase and down another survivor and still have Pop up and able to use before he hooks for another Pop.
Honestly, it's sort of a weird change to me. But I guess I understand that it seems like a reasonable change for devs trying to force PGTW to be less of a leisurely "I have this perk to use, but let me take my time- I'll see if I can down another survivor real quick" instead of "I got Pop active, let me use it on this gen and THEN chase another survivor". You still have the option to do either, but using PGTW will now have a little bit more of a feeling of urgency.
I also get the feeling that their "PGTW counter perk", Repressed Alliance, has a part to play in the 15s nerf. At this point, RA is only about 30s long. And that's a good length for it to be. Any longer and it would basically be a killer perk for how much survivor time it wastes if the killer doesn't even bother the gen/you get to go back and work on it much sooner than expected LMAO
But it didn't really counter PGTW that well- if your gen was near the recently hooked person, the killer could be over there within seconds and even if you hit the gen with RA, all the killer had to do was chase you for a bit, then return very shortly and still have about 20ish seconds left on his PGTW timer while RA was already up and gone. With an active duration nerf to PGTW, RA is indirectly buffed and becomes a viable perk for countering it, while still having a bit of counterplay if the killer plays his cards right.
I personally feel that the 15s nerf won't be super noticeable- a lot of killers waste their Pop on a gen that's barely pumping, or choose to chase a survivor instead of popping a gen, anyways. Very rarely do I see killers wait more than even just 30-40 seconds before using their PGTW, but maybe y'all are built different
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I believe it is a glitch! And it hopefully gets fixed soon. I was honestly surprised that it wasn't fixed with the last patch, considering it's a fairly big deal that you aren't able to finish a heal with your item anymore (unless you have an extra charge medkit, which in that case you still are missing out slightly on charges). You're forced to hit a great to get a full heal, it seems, which is fine on PC but problematic on console (as frame drops and lag make it very difficult to hit greats). And that's if a skill check even shows up while you're healing.
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@Aven_Fallen said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1644597#Comment_1644597
Currently they give Tokens, but apparently (this was written on the Forums, so take it with a graint of salt), this was not intended and was patched out at some point. I would be really disappointed if they only add Flashlight- and Pallet-Saves for Tokens, since they would only turn a Bug into a Feature at this point and BBQ would still be laughable easy to get stacks, while you would either still need to rush for Unhooks or take dumb protection Hits for WGLF-Stacks.
(like, how often does a Flashlight- or Pallet-Save occur? Almost never)
The fact that it will now include flashlight saves and pallet saves is LOWKEYYYY a nerf LMFAO
This perk was already annoying as hell as it is with how it unfortuately inadvertently encourages farming (I don't WANT to get unhooked as soon as the killer turns around just because you have I'm Gonna Farm Forever and you want a hook save+protection hit, Jake), now we're gonna have bots wasting pallets in an almost-guaranteed-to-fail attempt to save you from the killer's grasp.
I'm mostly jk but... like kinda not LOL
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I feel ya, but if the slugged survivor pick up speed is decently increased, that alone is a great buff to the perk.
Although it kind of sucks they're giving that to this perk instead of, say, an Ash perk (considering he has two slug related perks). They murdered MoM (as it may well have deserved), the least they could do is give his other $#!%%¥ perks some love. Buckle Up would have been a good one to receive this buff tbh. With how prevalent slugging can be, I'd also be interested in seeing Flip Flop get a buff along similar lines- maybe YOU don't recover faster, but it has the effect of allowing other survivors to recover you much faster from the dying state. That would actually ALMOST make the perk worth taking sometimes- even if they don't get to finish the pickup, you still get to use the main point of the perk- converting your recovery bar to wiggle progression.
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Tunneling is really annoying but I don't mind it THAT much as long as I have DS. I feel bad for survivors who aren't as good at looping or aren't playing with a helpful friend who can take the killer off of you because it's basically GG at the point of your first hook if you can't get the killer off of you.
I wish killers would stop saying "it's your team's fault for the unsafe unhook" when a good portion of the time, the killer WON'T give anyone a chance to unhook. I've had killers roast for unsafe unhooks or not getting teammates when they literally did not give anyone a chance to safely get them, even after waiting to the very last second before the next hook phase to attempt to grab them. It's a valid strategy to heavy proxy camp or straight up face camp at times, but killers don't get to say "why didn't you get your teammate!" or "not my fault for unsafe unhook" when other things are going on in the match at 3-4 gens left with all survivors still alive while they patrol the hook endlessly for no reason. The prevalence of killers like that is why I don't support a nerf to BT or DS. I actually PREFER to unhook in the killer's terror radius in some games, based on how they either refuse to leave, or immediately return to the hook single time a survivor gets rescued. At least the unhooked survivor gets a BT hit at that point instead of otherwise only having a few extra seconds of distance before they're smacked to the ground again.
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@Hopesfall said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1641546#Comment_1641546
that's like telling a survivor to mute their sound
be realistic
Not even close ######### LOL
Moon walking to a gen or making your FOV point flicker will 100% be useful and it isn't that hard. Most survivors stay on their objective until they get a long SC activation. And the ones who run as soon as they get a flicker won't be causing anyone trouble because they're probably rank 15 LMAO
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@StarLost said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/193997/keys-vs-moris
Woof, where to start here.
Firstly, this should be called 'Whataboutism: A Thread'.
Secondly, survivors that use keys generally grab them the second the game is about to start, so forget Franklins.
Thirdly, killers are absolutely not in the power role. Unless they are a 1000+ hour monster with all the meta perks unlocked, the killer is going to struggle if even one survivor is decked out. And that's taking SWF out of the equation.
Fourthly: Highly skilled...whaaa?
Finally: Strongest killer vs strongest survivors...give some tourneys a watch and get back to me.
How is his own thread that he started, titled "keys vs moris", "whataboutism"? I think you misunderstand the definition of the word because it definitely doesn't fit here
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@Pipefish said:
Pig's traps are fine, doing a gen with a trap on your head risks you dying early. I just wished they worked in endgame like they used too. :(
It makes sense that they don't, though, considering we have EGC and it would be easily abusable for Pig to open the gate so that the EGC timer goes down while she makes sure that anyone with a trap is unable to remove it. Even if the timer for the trap doesnt go down in a chase, the EGC timer still is and they're not often able to get it off their head in time.
I had a Pig hook me near the gate after she downed me and placed the trap on my head seconds before the very last gen was done by another survivor. She opened the gate before hooking me and it was quite an effective strategy as I did NOT survive that game, even with all 3 other survivors alive and it being my first hook LMAO
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@Moundshroud said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1639022#Comment_1639022
True... finding the sweet spot is a problem. It isn't enough now... and that might be too much. But right now, the only people who REALLY do a lot of Bone ARE the SWF. :)
I play SWF more often than solo, and you're pretty correct about that. In solo everyone seems a little more focused on at least trying to get gens pumped out so that they have SOME chance of escape, whereas in SWF my teammates and I often feel like we have at least a little bit more time to do secondary objectives, like search chests and cleanse totems.
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@Moundshroud said:
I do wish it were a bit stronger, say it extends the normal time to cleanse by 25% per Totem left, and thus is by +125% at the start of the game.
While I can support a slightly stronger effect on how long it takes to cleanse, I think that 25% would be WAY too much tbh- it works for some large maps, but it would be nigh impossible to cleanse totems on smaller maps against high mobility killers, unless you picked to cleanse it at a time when they were deep in a chase and about to down and then hook and they didn't want to lose their prey. The first totem would take about... 32 seconds to cleanse if my math is correct, which is plenty of time for a killer to book it towards you even at 110% speed on the largest map, if they're not occupied at the moment.
So a decently coordinated SWF could probably handle it, but it would just be another rough thing for solo queues to deal with.
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One of my baby level friends has an uncanny ability to Kobe. And get this... he also loves to tbag LOL
Every time he DS's the killer... tbag... wiggles out of the grasp before he can get hooked... tbag... gets flashlight saved... tbag...
It's kind of funny to watch (considering his skill level... the killer usually gets the last laugh on him LMAO) and I guess I know now why he gets off the hook so often!
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@GoodBoyKaru said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1638650#Comment_1638650
So we gonna have a list of things killers want nerfed from survivors too or not?
Spirit, Slinger, and PH need changes to make their 1v1 weaker and 1v4 stronger. Doctor is just annoying because of the constant screaming but also, not the best 1v1 unless you're a god and not a good 1v4 either. Freddy is overall an amazing killer but just wake up and he's fine lol. Finally, Hag, ensure she can't place traps DIRECTLY under a hooked survivor, and then another 5 around them, to make sure they can be saved and actually play the game, and we good (at least imo). She has counterplay, though it takes coordination to do.
I personally don't think Spirit of all killers would need a buff to make her 1v4 stronger even if she got a 1v1 nerf. DS and PH, yeah, because they have literally nothing else but their chase powers (I guess DS has "hit you and yank you from far away [and be able to injure for free even with an early pallet throw]" which helps sliiiiightly with [literally] pulling people off gens, but eh), but as far as I can tell, Spirit has it all even with being 110%. She still has great mobility with her phase walk and is considered top 2 for a reason. Doesn't feel quite as oppressive as Nurse but it is a little annoying that she can get really oppressive with half the effort.
Hag IS incredibly obnoxious to go against sometimes, although I enjoy running willy nilly through a trap as soon as she's stuck in an animation or through her entire web after she picks a survivor up. Basement Hag is so awful to go against, though. Really not a fun killer to go against if they're good or LAGGY! Laggy Hags have to be the most infuriating killers to go against and for some reason, people with bad internet love to play her LOL
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I like it ok (as a survivor main) but I do honestly find it slightly boring, too. Probably the easiest map for me to escape on, even if it seems to be rare on the rotation. Visually, I'd love to see it get reworked a bit. It feels like it could be so much cooler than it is. It does capture a very snowy day quite well, though, which I do like.
Sometimes you get a really good killer who can still shamble you there despite it definitely being one of THE survivor sided maps, but if they win, a lot of them are unreasonably snotty to you in the post game chat as if you had anything to do with the map you got. So it's actually kind of a 50/50 on how enjoyable playing on the map is- on one hand, I can relax a little bit while playing because even if I have rotten potato teammates I STILL have a chance without us all sweating to get out (in solo queue; in SWF it's almost always a wrap) but I also run the chance of the killer playing like an a-hole just for the reason that it's Ormond (heavy proxy camping into attempted tunneling off hook, abuse in the chat, etc)
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Honestly can't say that I've run into TOO many tunneling Pigs... I run into more farming Pigs than normal Pigs, not even joking or exaggerating. Even if a Pig starts a match out normally, it always devolves into farming for some reason and I truly don't understand it LMAO
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@Orion said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1637427#Comment_1637427
I'm not sure either, I'm just estimating.
How many blinds can you realistically get from a single flashlight, though?
Judging by some of the streamers I've watched, a lot! 😅
I'm actually not sure, though, but upon googling it looks like it takes at LEAST 1 second (which probably ends up being closer to 1.5/2 seconds of battery life depending on your skill level). I read that pre-nerf OB made the blind effect take place within .5 seconds, so perhaps it is a little longer than a second?
If it's 1 second exactly, that means you get 8 blinds out of a yellow flashlight if you're PERFECT with it, and 7 if you have OB equipped. But probably closer to 5-6 max if you're just decent and not perfect with flashlight blinds, idk
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@Orion said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1637397#Comment_1637397
If I'm not mistaken, a flashlight blind lasts for 2 seconds. 25% more is an additional half a second, which, if you know DbD, is a lot.
I wasn't sure how long flashlight blinds lasted, thank you. It still doesn't seem quite worth the trade off to me (as an ultra rare item) to have a blind last 0.5 seconds longer while also reducing your flashlight life by 12%.
Maybe it's something I have to play around with (I am newer to trying to use flashlights) but my flashlight fiend friends don't seem to care for OB and ALWAYS opt for battery add ons instead. It's not a BAD add on, per se, just doesn't seem to fit the rarity anymore to me. BNP is much more fitting as an Ultra Rare even after it's severe (and justified) nerf IMO
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@De_Deltin2 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1636093#Comment_1636093
Reminds me of when "Instant Blind" was changed after Mathew Cote Versed a swf of Koren's using the old "odd bulb", the very next update they were changed xD
On the topic of the Odd Bulb nerf, I feel like it's completely pointless to take an OB on a flashlight. All it does is waste 12% more of your flashlight while using, and if you get the blind it only blinds for 25% longer. Doesn't seem worth the trade off when in many cases you are able to double blind and prolong the blind duration just as well (unless I misunderstand how it works).
7k BPs cost, 12% reduction in battery life as a trade off for 25% longer blinds, and one of only two ultra rare items for survivors. I'm not sold on that tbh LOL
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@extonjonas said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1632028#Comment_1632028
Action speaks louder than words and he is just judging him on his actions
That doesn't mean he is correct on his judgment 🙂
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@TheButcher said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1635578#Comment_1635578
Your argument is that Killers are fine with the hatch. They are not. It was introduced to reward players that were taking the game hostage. It gets abused as an easier way to win then doing the objective, and makes the Killer lose fun and points as a result. Key's are no better. Makes 0 sense that you can find them in chests. Mori's have nothing to do with the hatch or key's - yet everyone seems to want to compare them when they are uncomparable.
Even after your long winded explaination, it doesn't change these simple facts. The Killer shouldn't be losing a single point when they are playing well because survivors just have a happenstance. My button idea is literally the existence of the hatch, but in the killers favor instead. It's completely unrelated to Mori's.
Mori's are broken, and were only intorduced in the game as a way to give killers a unique kill animation. It doesn't make sense that is off the first hook stage. When they could easily just have it as a 2 hook phase requirement, and then all the Killer gains by using one is the animation and not having to carry a body to a hook (Perk avoidance as well).
1. That's your opinion. Plenty of killers DGAF about the game mechanic of hatch opening for the last remaining survivor besides it being a slight annoyance here and there in some games. Neither you nor I can speak for how every killer feels about the hatch- the ACTUAL fact of the matter is that there are plenty of killers who hate it and plenty of killers who don't really care about hatch. If anything, I shouldn't have picked the word "most" when I said that a portion of killers still consider a game with a hatch escape as a win. But that still isn't me attempting to speak on behalf of every single killer main.
2. This is not about keys. It's about the hatch. We aren't talking about how fair or unfair it is to be able to open a closed hatch with an item you can equip or find in a trial, it's a totally different topic than the hatch automatically opening for the last remaining survivor. That's what we are focusing on.
3. Hatch has been in since the beginning of the game, the only thing that changed was hatch spawn requirements. Now there is no gen completion requirement for it to spawn once only a single survivor is left (it used to be that 2 finished gens were required for hatch to spawn, regardless of whether you were the last man alive or not). So it is easier to make an escape in a match where absolutely nothing was done, but ya know, killers still have the advantage of being able to close it and deny a hatch escape before a survivor finds it, outside of the luck aspect (which can randomly benefit either side, since it can spawn either closer to the killer or to the survivor). The killer has even more advantage if the hatch already became visible, even if both killer and survivor know where it is, as killer can shut it in the survivor's face before he has the option to jump in.
"Simple facts" are still largely your opinion, because you are saying things like "hatch takes away the fun for killers". That's not a fact, that's an opinion and not everyone shares it. And your button idea isn't even close to an equivalent to the hatch- because, let me reiterate once again, we are NOT talking about keys. That is a separate issue. Your button idea is not equal to the hatch opening for the last survivor, it's not even quite equal to a key hatch escape. Especially when you consider that a killer can move more quickly and freely about the map and thus has the advantage to find and shut an open hatch without worrying about being found first.
(And ok about moris, I only mentioned them in regards to your button idea, I'm not really trying to compare them to keys or anything else besides your button idea :) )
But you still didn't answer my question. What better mechanic is there other than hatch? You don't want to lose emblem points or blood points from a survivor making a hatch escape, but I'm sure you don't want to play a long game of hide and seek with a single survivor as he struggles to finish gens so that he can escape. Or do you think that every survivor should just wave a white flag and pop up out of nowhere once you've killed all his teammates, regardless of how well he played and if you've even been able to win a single chase against him the entire game? I'm genuinely interested in your idea for a better end game mechanic for the last survivor, because you obviously dislike the current one but seem to have no idea for what would be better as an end game mechanic.
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@chargernick85 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1635832#Comment_1635832
It about GREAT skill checks not skill checks in general. When I run the perk my great is maxed every time. No I can't hit a GREAT every time not going to pretend I can but I don't miss skill checks very often either. It works on healing to and great skill check advance the heal really quick which can come in handy with a tunneling killer and there is a marginal bonus to gens as well but there are no limit to the tokens you can get in a match.
I'm not saying you can't hit great skill checks, I just meant that it didn't seem TOO incredibly useful to a player who can consistently hit greats- what kind of bonus does it give to you if you do hit a great when you have tokens? I struggle to hit great skill checks on Switch (for obvious reasons) but have no trouble at all with them on PC unless I'm not paying much attention.
Free great skills checks are nice but I don't think that even buffing that perk will make it anything a lot of players look and think, wow, let me replace Spine Chill/Alert/Bond/etc., with this tbh
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@chargernick85 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1635804#Comment_1635804
I used it recently to knock out the 20 great skill check challenge quicker. Regardless it 2-4 FREE great skill checks with no risk of regression/alerting the killer. It also allows a missed skill check as long as the miss is before the skill check window if that makes sense. I have missed multiple skill checks entirely because of lag/killer perks but stakeout will grant a great anyhow but not if the cursor goes past the window.
Oh, that actually makes sense. I wonder if it works with DS that way LOL
I didn't actually know that it gave you a good skill check even if you missed before (trying to get a good skill check, I assume)
Sounds like a good perk for people who are bad at skill checks (so new players) and unfortunate console players (I ain't hitting a great skill check against Spirit on Léry's on the Switch 😩😩😩) but still not something I'd ever take over the likes of DS/BT/SB/etc. 😕
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An aura reveal aspect to the perk would be really nice. At this point I can't imagine ever taking this perk into a trial. I don't understand the point of it right now as it is but at least your idea would make it worth SOMETHING.
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@Rbree said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1635716#Comment_1635716
Discord is defintally just a stupid joke but I wouldn't be surprised. And oh I love getting the hatch when you know the useless teammate was waiting and hiding all game to get it. Karma is a b!tch ;) hope to see you in game !
LMFAOOO I was just dying imagine a discord like that existing, like that's just actual tears in my eyes kind of funny LMAOOO
Oh seeing teammates like that not get what they want... it's one of the most satisfying things that can happen in game. I once saw a Blendette bleed out on the ground after the killer decided to leave her slugged on hatch, even though she was the most USELESS teammate ever. He was booking it back to her when he realized she was gonna die before he finished hunting for the other guy... but it was too late and she died just as he got to her. Goodbye Claudette!
And I sure hope so! Claudette extermination task force LMAO
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@Rbree said:
Oh man. This. I can't even begin to explain my horrid experiences surviving along p3 claudettes. I'd have to say the worst experience is me being alturistic to this blendette saving her twice off the hook. She did no gens the entire game. She farmed a couple people to get her bonus for we are going to live forever and then literally just sat in a locker the rest of the game. After me and the rest of team completed the gens we all worked together to get the exit gates opened. The entire time the Claudette was in a locker (probably in some blendette screw everyone over discord server). The killer had noed and manages to down all 3 of us because the rest of my team had the no one left behind mentality. Long story short I died on my first hook and the only one who escaped was you guessed it BLENDETTE. I went and spectated her to see if she made it out (hoping she would die to be honest) nope she sat at the exit gates tea bagging the killer and escaped. Don't get me wrong though alot of claudettes are helpful, but for some reason the most toxic survivors I meet are blendettes. I just don't get it.
Omg... is the discord server you mentioned real??? That's lowkey hilariously disturbing if so. And if you made that up on your own you have a sick mind LOOOOL
My most recent Evil Claudette experience was with a Claudette on Lery's against a Deathslinger with a mori. We already knew he had a mori because the offering didn't flip and it wasn't a shroud, and she ran and farmed my boyfriend off hook literally within 2 meters of the killer. So of course he dies, all within the first 2 minutes of the game as he was the first one chased and hooked. I. Was. DISTURBEDDDDD. I saw that she was carrying a key, too, so as soon as she got hooked (right after the mori, as she was slugged), I started tbagging and pointing in the distance behind a wall. ZERO intention to get her and I just accepted that we weren't making it out through the gates. Within seconds of her being hooked, DS found the Zarina, and she suicided on hook. I planned on getting her, but it happened so fast (all while DS was still in the area) that there was nothing I could do except stay behind my wall as she suicided... still tbagging and pointing at the Claudette. Finally, Claudette died. I went over to attempt to bum the key off her body and got pulled up on by DS before I could even grab it. The good news is that I ran right over the (open) hatch as I was being chased... so I hope that Miss Farming Claudette was spectating and jealous that I was the one who got the hatch instead of her.
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I don't think it will ever change- if you prefer one side in game more so than the other side, then you naturally will sympathize with that side more. And this game has both sides COMPLETELY opposed to each other- it is the very nature of the game to be us vs them, especially with it being asymmetrical.
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@TsukiYurei said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1635626#Comment_1635626
Ah I see.
Well my point still stands, anyways I just hope all these bugs get patched on all versions of DBD.
We just want to have fun after all.
Yeah, he was talking from a killer standpoint and towards someone else
Killer on switch is literally UNPLAYABLE rn, I'm PRAYING that they either fix it ASAP or bring out cross platform progression so I can get the hell out of dodge LMAO
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@TsukiYurei said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1635568#Comment_1635568
Firstly cute.
I have never DC in DBD I only revived errors in game.
I make people DC as killer coz there like you, Second chance reliant and abuse it.
I enjoy both roles but shows what kind of person you are.
(Because you can’t loop or mind game)
So you rely on your cute second chance perks. People like you can’t learn and adapt.
Your the part of the community that ruins DBD so go play your fortnite ok and bag to get comfort.
And lastly go find your validation somewhere else you have to bag to feel good about yourself.
How pathetic.
He's not talking to you LOL, he's talking to the person he quoted
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@TheButcher said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1635262#Comment_1635262
Most killers consider a hatch escape an oppressive win
That's where you're wrong. Most killers consider a hatch escape as having the win taken from them (because it is). The Dev's try to push that getting two sacrifices should feel like a win, but the game itself and the community all will tear a killer apart for even considering it. The point system itself tells you "Entity Displeased", and the embless will barely get golds. Same with only 3 sacrifices in many situations. It's the most detrimental aspect of the game. There should not be a mechanic in any game that is simply a free win mechanic, especially that is against the side that has less players. It's like ltierally telling your player base that the singled out player doesn't matter in every match, and the dev's only care about the fun of the 4 people pitted against them.
Playing Killer is stressful, it's hard, and most times not even fun to play when you get into higher tier play. All of that and then to put the icing on top that survivors are just going to abuse a free win mechanic. Talk about dumb. What if there was a mechanic in the game where a secret button spawned on the map when there 2 or less gens left, and if the Killer finds it first - all survivors get claimed by the entity and the game ends giving the Killer "Entity pleased". I'm sure the survivors would love that. I'm sure no one would complain. I'm absolutely certain that the survivors would just go "it is what it is, but at least we got 3 gens". /s
- The hatch was introduced to give players that were taking the game hostage a free win mechanic to deter them from taking the game hostage.
- It deny's the killers of point and gratification for their skill, and takes away the fun from the game.
- Survivors delibertally focus around the hatch in dire situations refusing to do objectives
- Survivors will DC to give hatch, denying killer not only of another hook/sacrifice, but giving another survivor a free win.
- Survivors will take the game hostage to hide out for hatch against other survivors.
Is the fact that it ruins the games for Killer's in every unfair aspect possible not good enough for you?
- The existence of the hatch encourages other survivors to sabotage other players to force the hatch to spawn and open
- The exitence of the hatch encourages survivors to take the game hostage to get the free win mechanic than finishing the objective.
- The hatch is easier to use to win the game than the actual objective of the game.
Plenty of killers feel the way you do, and plenty of killers feel the way I described. It's not a universal sort of sentiment either way. It's very hard to pin down what is considered a win for either side- a SWF may consider only a 4 man escape a win, some may consider a 2 or 3 man escape a win, and some consider a lucky hatch escape a win for the whole team. A solo may consider most of the team escaping a win even if they die, and most would definitely consider a hatch escape a personal win, if not a win overall for the team. Killers have a bit more of a difference- some consider only absolute 4ks a win, others are happy with a 3k+hatch escape, others go by the devs' apparent definition of a win (2k and anything other than an Entity Displeased), and some consider their wins by the emblem system+kills. I would assume most killers base a win on how many kills they got.
And you DON'T get Entity Displeased for one single survivor escaping out the hatch. This argument isn't about keys- I assume you already know that but I'm just making sure. As far as I know, we are discussing the existence of hatch, not the fact that you can skip a gen or two to escape with one or more survivors.
Iridescent isn't SUPPOSED to be a free and easy emblem to gain. It isn't a super close comparison, but I'd compare it to the Unbroken emblem for survivors- you only gain Iridescent in that category by not being downed a single time in the trial, otherwise the best emblem you can get is Gold.
The maximum amount of points a hatch escapee can deny you is 4, which would still be a Silver emblem, and that's only if you didn't hook him once already/he would have been your 9th hook. The minimum is 2, which still leaves room for a Gold Devout emblem. You can't gain an Iridescent Devout emblem from a game where someone escapes through the hatch (but that does not prevent you from gaining a Merciless victory) but you can easily gain a Gold just from killing 3 survivors, hooking everyone at least once, and having at least 9 out of 12 hooks throughout the trial.
If you get Entity Displeased at that point, it's not the fault of the survivor for escaping through the hatch- it's because you didn't get enough points throughout the rest of the trial.
The only other points you could possibly lose out on from a hatch escape would be Chaser and Malicious category points, which can be (and often is) denied anyway as the survivor can simply hide until he dies to EGC, so that is not entirely relevant.
Regardless, as far as Sacrifice/Devout emblems go, the game leaves you room to get Gold in that category even with just a 3k, which doesn't deny a Merciless victory as long as you did well in other categories.
And one other note- a survivor DC'ing for hatch still gives you 2 points for their DC. Slugging for the 4k is incredibly annoying for survivors so I personally don't blame them if someone does that if the killer takes forever to find the last person. I myself have never DC'd for hatch but I've experienced the 4k slug many a time and it truly gets old. Hook the person and have it over and done with. If neither of you know where the hatch is, killer inherently has an advantage (outside of it being purely luck based on whether hatch will spawn nearer to the killer or the survivor) because he can move freely about the map looking for the hatch without worrying about hiding. And if he already knows where the hatch is, great! He has priority when it comes to closing it as long as he is there first.
Your button idea isn't too far off from moris- at least survivors have a chance to gain points before they're offed by the killer with the 2-gens-are-left button. So that's a moot point. It sounds like you're talking about key escapes through the hatch, anyway- which I just mentioned earlier in this reply that we are not specifically discussing. We are solely focusing on open hatch escapes in end game as the last survivor, which in that case your button idea isn't comparable, anyways.
Now, as far as other survivor behavior goes regarding the hatch, some players are just extremely selfish and I don't really know how much hatch actually affects their behavior. Getting rid of hatch might stop some people from playing selfishly... but I honestly don't expect it. Some players play like jerks because it's fun for them. As someone who does main survivor, though, I haven't noticed enough jerk behavior based around the hatch to warrant a desire to remove it. It's once in a blue moon where I see someone who is deliberately and clearing sabotaging to get hatch because we either need a certain number of gens already done relative to how many survivors are alive (most jerk survivors are usually sacrificed at that point, in my own experience) or they're insane and willing to throw the whole game just to see if they can beat the killer to the random unknown hatch spawn location by being the last man standing. Most survivors already know that killers usually slug for the 4k, though, which renders it difficult to employ that little endeavor. I can't speak for your experience and I can't speak for a more killer sided experience. But again, I will reiterate, this isn't about keys- this is about the last survivor escaping from an already open hatch. I DO see selfish behavior from survivors with keys. But that's not part of this- keys are a different issue even with being related to the hatch.
Anyways, my question to you is, what would you replace the hatch mechanic with??? How is the game supposed to end after you kill the third person? Are the gates supposed to be powered automatically (regardless of how impossible it usually is to open them?) or do you have another idea? Hatch was the best solution for an annoying problem- survivors had to play very carefully, slowly, and immersively to have a chance of escaping in the past. Even if they weren't deliberately holding the game hostage, they were forced to drag it out if they were seriously trying to escape by finishing gens.
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@Slashstreetboy said:
They will never implement an indication of SWF. Many people claim SWF is not a balance issue, or not a huge one, despite being convinced that if given the chance basically every Killer would dodge them. Can´t be much of an issue if everyone wants to avoid it, can it? /s
It can be a nonissue and still have loads of delusional killers who think that it IS an issue and that every loss is due to the DBD boogeyman, SWF. The amount of times a red ranked killer has gotten stomped out by a group of SOLO queue survivors and instantly blamed SWF is hilarious. I don't get the mentality. You DO miss a lot of things when you can't communicate with other survivors but it's not that hard for good players to have some sort of coordination with each other.
I play SWF with my boyfriend and two players who have around 150 hours each in the game. We lose WAY more than my boyfriend and I would lose if we just duo queued with two randoms at our rank level.
But most killers think "SWF = dodge at all costs", despite the fact that a majority of SWF groups are just a bunch of trash players or good players being held back by their trash friends. SWF still farm each other, give each other false/bad info, make HORRIBLE plays, etc. Maybe not so much at red rank... but it's not like SWF changes would only apply to one rank. And if it did, there would be nothing stopping survivors from purposely depipping to avoid any red rank SWF repercussions that could be introduced.
Anyways, I don't think that BHVR will ever, or should ever, punish friends for playing with each other. I think the best they can do is figure out match making so that it's easier for higher skilled survivors to be matched with higher skilled killers- but at the same time, I still think what they have now isn't too bad. You can be rank 1 as a killer and get sweaty squads, but it's not like it's constant- you still get plenty of lobbies with potatoes who are easy to defeat. At least, that's my boyfriend's experience as a rank 1 killer, I guess I can't assume it's universal.
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@TheButcher said:
Seriously the whole existence of the hatch doesn't make sense. The Hatch was added to the game because BHVR needed a way to deal with survivors taking the game hostage by hiding near the end of matches, so they responded by giving those survivors a free win mechanic.
In addition the way it's setup the Hatch only takes away from the points and fun for the Killer, and they expect players to just accept that, and take it lying down. If I won the game and there is still 2-3 gen's left. I expect to get my 4k. Not because I think I am entitled to it all the time, but because I beat 4 survivors and they still have to finish 2-3 gen's. A killer should not have to slug the last 2 survivors to avoid hatch, they should not have to runn through the whole map looking for one thing that will deny them the points they have already won, and they should not have the points that took their skill and work taken away from them because a survivor found a key in a chest. It's completely stupid. Completely and entitrely stupid, just how much detrimental affect the hatch has on the Killer, and all because SURVIVORS WERE TAKING THE GAME HOSTAGE.
Ok... so what do you think should happen after the third survivor is sacrificed? Should a beam of light illuminate the last survivor and give them the hindered status?
This game isn't a competitive game. You can get the extra points you missed out on the next game and it's not that big of a deal. Most killers consider a hatch escape an oppressive win, even though they technically didn't kill the last survivor. And the survivor who escaped through the hatch can feel happy about escaping. When I play killer I don't play "dirty" about the hatch unless I hated every single survivor on the team and wanted them DEAD. Otherwise I'm more than fine risking the last person escaping through hatch because I at least understand how nice it feels to find it, especially if you've been dying all night and haven't had an escape in ages.