ChaosWam
ChaosWam
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@Firellius said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3689142#Comment_3689142
You joined March 2023, well after the DS nerf. How do you know?
I started the game when Sadako came out. You really think I joined the forums at the same time?
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@Nazzzak said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3689164#Comment_3689164
And yet this weaponising hasn't happened. There's nothing stopping survivors from doing this now, you think a couple extra seconds is suddenly gonna turn the entire survivor base into bodyblocking sweat squads? This playerbase blowing up imaginary scenarios in their heads is my favourite thing, I swear lol if someone is trying to "force" you to tunnel, then I dunno, grant their wish? All the complaints tell me is that current DS is at best a mild inconvenience to killers and at worst useless, and killers dont want that to change. Which tells me this buff is needed.
I literally did it yesterday and have seen many survivors running DS try to get value from it by bodyblocking.
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@MaTtRoSiTy said:
You know you could yah know… not tunnel?
I never got hit with old DS and I never get hit with current DS because I never tunnel, so its a wasted perk slot for the survivor versing me
Most of the arguments aren't for tunneling, it's for survivors weaponizing it to force the killer to tunnel. Especially M1 killers trying to do a chase and end up having someone bodyblock with OTR/DS/UB ready.
Tunneling needed basekit mechanics put in place, or at least force the unhooked survivor to have no collision post-unhook until they do a conspicuous action to counter this behavior.
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@JeanGreyarea said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3689142#Comment_3689142
nah the part that was complained was its use in the endgame
I actually saw fewer complaints about that than I did the stun duration, being that the duration felt miserable to sit through every time a bully squad forced you to tunnel them via bodyblocks or CJ techs.
Though the #1 complaint was being able to pop a gen in the killers face after they ate a DS because inconspicuous actions weren't a thing.
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@Hexling said:
Nice now unbreakable will definitely get some use its like every time I bring it I just get insta picked. I find it so funny how killers are over reacting that survivors are going to be harder to tunnel. They already can do all the body blocking otr etc stuff anyways.
The issue is it's going to get worse for killers who don't tunnel because bodyblocking with OTR/DS/UB will be much more appealing with a 5 second stun if the killer falls for the pickup.
Heck even the mindgame of it could be a problem eventually. If DS ends up as bad as I predict, survivors could just bodyblock without it and make the killer think they have DS when they just wanted to go after the unhooker or another survivor. I even did it in a match against a Billy in Midwich today, despite the 3 second stun and got a 4 man escape buying enough time.
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@TheDavidKingMain said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3689138#Comment_3689138
It was complained about BEFORE they made it remove on conspicuous actions. After that everybody pretty much agreed the perk was a balanced anti-tunneling perk. Then they nerfed it to 3 seconds which most people at the time agreed was not necessary.
Why are people trying to rewrite the story now? lol
I seem to recall people complain about the length of the stun, especially killers who mained M1 killers with no chase power. Meanwhile, killers like Nurse, Blight, Huntress etc didn't really get effected as hard because they could catch up with their power.
If anything, I'm starting to feel gaslighted by this community over DS.
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It was complained about, everyone collectively forgot after the nerf.
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Hopefully my theory about DS/OTR/Unbreakable bodyblocks doesn't come true, with it becoming a meta strat, but I can't blame other killers for worrying about playing fair and having to deal with survivors trying to get tunneled to get as much value out of it.
And survivors should also agree. Unless the ones in question have builds as explained above made to stall time for chases by weaponizing it, you're gonna have the other end of the spectrum of survivors not using it defensively and going offensive and getting slugged for no reason if they decide to not bring Unbreakable or some way to pick back up.
Tunneling still needs other ways to help mitigate it. Perks can only do so much on their own and end up just being a band-aid or a problem for low-end killers.
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That's because it's anti-FACEcamp, not anti-camp.
In the video there were a few times your survivor allies could have unhooked and didn't. Sure Blight didn't go far, but he also probably knew everyone was in that area and didn't have a reason to go anywhere else for very long. It's an unfortunate position to be in, but could have been an easy save when he was chasing the Zarina at 0:22. The Sable had plenty of time to get that unhook but didn't and ended up staying in the area when Blight returned.
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Okay but why are we wanting perks to cover a problem that effects everyone? Why not something mechanically changed to make it not as easy to do and can't be weaponized by survivors against the low tier killers that are going to be effected by it even worse? Kinda getting tired of the band-aid fixes on both sides.
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I think you're close, but not quite.
I started the game as killer. And while it was fine at first once you hit the point where it's nonstop toxicity and BMing for bringing builds that are more fun and not meta you eventually start adding meta to your kits to catch up. And on survivor side you get hit with said meta, so you play meta on survivor and create the feedback loop of sweating.
Meanwhile, core game issues aren't being addressed fast enough and perks get weird changes. Either minuscule or insanely demolished way beyond what should have been done. BHVR has gotten better about things, like with the anti-facecamp and anti-3 gen but there's still a reliance on perks fixing other core issues and end up becoming the new meta, so now the other side has to create a new meta to counter the other side's new meta and the cycle continues.
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Serious answer is it's a visual interpretation of her curse injuring the survivors.
Joke answer is a placeholder for modders to replace it with emojis. If only visual mods were allowed…
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I'm also on the boat that it doesn't need a nerf, but I would have another way it functions.
Basically, the perk would have a 20 second timer. The time recharges when not in chase. When in a chase, see the auras of pallets/windows for the duration of the perk.
I say 20 seconds as a starting point, could be tuned for whatever balance required, but it would make the perk not as long lasting and still be useful for new players who may not know if there's a safe spot nearby while veterans can't just use it to autopilot the entire time.
That said, and again, I don't think the current needs to be nerfed.
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Let me think off the top of my head…
Killer:
- Sadako
- Deathslinger
- Pyramid Head
- Dredge
- Knight
- Skull Merchant (stealth over drones I pinkie promise)
- Artist
- Legion
- Doctor
- Trapper
For Survivor:
- Yoichi
- Vittorio
- Nic Cage
- Jeff
- Yui
- Cheryl
Can't think of the other 4 survivors.
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Honestly, might be their best move long term.
I know I've been mad about depiping from things I had no control over as survivor. This is good.
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It's great in theory until you spend most of your time trying to follow said code and receive BM and insults regardless of the outcome.
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5 seconds is plenty of time to get somewhere safe, disabling the power would make it horrible for killer powers that don't have an effect on chase.
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@Dream_Whisper said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3686381#Comment_3686381
I disagree, this perk was among the niche to most useless perks, that only gives information. No one even bother with it, when so any meta survivor perks offer much more benefits and viability uses, then limited time gen aura perk that only tells the gens that need to be worked on.
I used to use it a lot with other gen repair perks. It was perfectly fine to let you know where the 3 gen was before the change. 9% nearly gives it the same repair time before the gens took 90 charges as well. It doesn't need to be limitless when it's real power is to break gen stalemates early.
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I know a lot of people defend Deja Vu, but it's true it was given an infinite amount of time to fix the 3-Gen issue until we got our proper fix.
It should go back to what it was before the change, at the very least. It wasn't a bad perk before.
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I haven't seen this one yet, but I'd believe some script abusers would try to get away with this. I think you did the right thing in this case. Other than that, unless you can somehow make a ticket on their report page with a video on it I'm not sure what else could be done.
I will say, I think if anyone comes across a script like this, DC immediately before that survivor gets sacrificed. Don't risk it.
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Making it clear you want to farm/dropping an item/doing the beckon emote out in the open.
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@Pulsar said:
Honestly would rather them kill off both perks so I can stop listening to people say it's the only reason they're losing games. I understand that isn't what you are saying, but I'd really rather get it over with.
Not a fan of this line of thinking, especially as someone who enjoys using Deadman's Switch by itself and seeing people say the same thing because of it's synergies.
Perks should be good without being part of a busted combination or busted themselves, what matters is if it goes too far like Buckle Up+For The People.
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Yes, ESPECIALLY when I'm playing nice, spreading hooks and trying to grind BP for the event
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That would require gen progression and toolboxes to be nerfed.
I play with only Surge and Deadman's Switch on Onryo and manage pretty normalized games. If I were to swap to something that had no regression it wouldn't be possible to keep up, especially on larger maps against teams who are coordinated and manage both gens and tapes (which the tape part is more rare considering I still average at least 1 mori across all my matches with the new version of Sadako)
That, or all the lesser M1 killers magically get something that puts them in the same playing field as Blight or Huntress, or at least halfway to them.
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@VomitMommy said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3649025#Comment_3649025
She definetly needs haste.
Hindered is not really needed, but there should be something so drones can't be simply ignored when injured.
EDIT: lol, didn't notice it's old post. It makes sense why I was having a Déjà vu moment :D
I mean, I do say it a lot to be fair lmao.
But I agree, she should have one or the other, but both feels a bit much even when I play her. I also do think deep wounds is a good enough threat, but I'd also need to test that more by itself. Perhaps resetting the time a clawtrap is on you would be good?
On the subject of clawtraps I also agree there should be an easier way to have them removed or some kind cooldown on the marks. Though I don't agree with what others think that disabling drones gets rid of them, since survivors could just facetank a mark and then remove the drone to remove the mark it gave them.
Really SM is in such a weird spot right now.
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Make it 8 hooks so survivors think you're spreading hooks to be nice.
The ultimate betrayal.
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Personally I don't believe in removing any content and want to be good against as many elements as I can.
That said, I agree with @Hexling only because Nurse's existence does drag down some perk potential.
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The only thing I despise about Wraith is his uncloak animation is deceptive. I'll wait at a pallet for them to uncloak, they stand there for a good second and if I drop pallet they cloak, if I don't drop pallet I get hit. I still for the life of me don't understand why his uncloak is visually off like this.
I also suppose his haste is kind of oppressive depending on the map now that lightburn is gone as well.
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@Yharwick said:
Don't play her myself but from what I can tell it's two camps
- Having survivors instantly give up against you all the time is a feature not a bug
- They genuinely find her kit interesting and sees complexities in it other people either don't or refuse to see.
For me personally it's been months since I've seen a SM so all the topics are her are confusing to me because I can't believe other people are seeing her all that much.
Being in camp #2, this is accurate. I can't help but appreciate the stealth and chase potential she has with different builds. I'd be even happier if she was better for players to go against as well. (Also her base design and lore changed but I can only ask for so much...)
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I was thinking of making a killer perk post similar to this, actually. Lemme read through yours.
- Technician: Seems like a fair change.
- Corrective Action: Honestly I don't think it needs a big change, but yours is a decent one.
- Hyperfocus: Reducing the speed of rotation is a bad idea, as someone who runs this perk religiously. When I hit all my stacks and get great skill checks constantly, I can tear through a gen insanely fast as is. The rotation speed helps mitigate that.
- Stake Out: Does not need changed. It's incredibly strong with Hyperfocus as well.
- Boil Over: Actually, I like this change. Good idea.
- Camaraderie: I'm not too keen on this change. I don't think any perk should increase hook times without another survivor's help. I'd be willing to accept if IF it was only on stage 2 though.
- Deliverance: Absolutely agreed.
- Babysitter: Agreed.
- Breakdown: Kind of on the fence with this one, considering all 4 survivors could run it and have every hook in a corner broken for way too long. That said, limiting how many can be broken is a good idea, but with the previous scenario in mind even 1 per survivor is a problem.
- Borrowed Time: I approve, but maybe deactivate the haste at endgame? I'm not entirely sure.
- Reassurance: I'm fine with the range increase, but the time increase would need to be tested.
- Breakout: Cool idea, good tradeoff.
- Power Struggle: Interesting tradeoff, but I will do you one better: Same as you said, 1 token max, and tokens replenish everytime you're unhooked or every time you stun the killer with another pallet, either way.
- Decisive Strike: I'm still worried about it being back to 5 seconds personally, but as long as it can't be weaponized by survivors intentionally bodyblocking with it I'm cool.
- Wake Up: Is the blindness immunity at endgame only? Blindness is already kinda weak as far as debuffs go.
- Vigil: I'm not a fan of it being mapwide.
- Left Behind: Great change!
- Sole Survivor: Keep in mind of smaller maps like Midwich.
- No One Left Behind: Just the aura read would be strong enough, increasing the unhook speed would kinda make it insane with other unhook speed perks.
- Fast Track: Sounds fine.
- Red Herring: Interesting change, I'd like to see that tested out in real time.
- Diversion: I like it.
- Deception: Good change, though I feel the blood pools are a good counter to it since the perk can be used while healthy too.
- Self-Preservation: Interesting changes, can't really think if it's too strong or not.
- Dance With Me: I think if it hides blood pools then the cooldown should stay the same. I also have the same problem as Deception where it can be used while healthy so being injured is the counterplay to it. Possible increase the time it hides your marks by 2 seconds instead?
- Poised: Not a fan of it staying active longer when you're away from the killer, due to a secondary effect of knowing if the killer is near you (stealth killers or undetectable perks) but the rest sounds reasonable.
- Parental Guidance: I agree on this one.
- Light-Footed: Agreed.
- Cut Loose: Agreed.
- Calm Spirit: Interesting change. I don't think it should apply to repair and healing though, that's far too busted for genrush builds. Keep it for cleansing and opening chests though.
- Small Game: Decent change.
- Plunderer's Instinct: Decent change.
- Pharmacy: Decent change.
- Appraisal: I don't think this perk needs that big of a change, personally.
- Ace In The Hole: Doesn't need the extra chest spawn. That's why coin offerings exist.
- Counterforce: I think it's fine the way it is, it's a good anti-hex perk right now.
- Streetwise: DEFINITELY DOES NOT NEED BUFFED.
- Residual Manifest: No thanks, I think it's fine the way it is.
- Leader: Again, fine the way it is.
- Any Means Necessary: Doesn't need a change.
- Repressed Alliance: Is this after the damage is dealt? Wouldn't that make it a killer perk? I think it's fine the way it is, pair it with Wiretap and it's guaranteed aura read for the duration of both.
- Potential Energy: I don't agree on a few things here. First, it should allow you to do it immediately if the generator has more than 10 charges, and getting hit removing tokens is a good tradeoff but if I were to throw a bone here maybe keep 1/4th of your stacks? Cancelling the token gains is a good idea though.
- Quick Gambit: God no.
- Premonition: I would need to think this one over a bit more.
- Spine Chill: Maybe too much of a bonus but good idea.
- Inner Focus: Too much aura read in my opinion. If it activates for each of those actions, it should be 1-2 seconds. Also, remove it aura reading if the killer enters the boon radius.
- Object of Obsession: I don't like these changes because, well, it's Object of Obsession.
- Scene Partner: Nah, it's strong enough as is. I use it with Blood Amber keys, Alert and Lithe and it's kinda crazy.
- Fogwise: Doesn't need change because of Hyperfocus, Stake Out and Deadline, as well as toolboxes giving more skillchecks.
- Dark Sense: Sure, why not.
- Wiretap: Sounds reasonable.
- Blast Mine: Doesn't need this change.
- Chemical Trap: I like it, but there should be a limit to how many pallets you can place one on. Think if 4 survivors run it.
- Flashbang: Doesn't need this change.
- Rookie Spirit: Doesn't need this change, but blocked gens sounds good.
- Background Player: Sounds reasonable. Would need to see it tested.
- Blood Rush: I don't think this is the right way to go with it, personally.
- Tenacity: Doesn't really need that change either.
- Urban Evasion: Unsure how I feel about this change.
- Buckle Up: VERY interesting change. Make it where you drop the survivor when damaged as well, I wanna see this!
- Better Together: Doesn't need this change.
- Visionary: I feel it needs more because it's outclassed by every other gen aura revealing perk, especially Deja Vu.
- Windows of Opportunity: Sure.
- Detective's Hunch: Good.
- Illumination: I dunno if it needs the range increased but seeing teammates is a good bonus.
- Exponential: No thanks, that's why Tenacity exists.
- Dark Theory: I'd rather avoid any more haste increases after the MFT debacle.
- Mettle of Man: Still not a fan of haste increases like this but I think it could be done right if the numbers are adjusted correctly.
- Hope: No. Doesn't need this change.
- Power of Two: No haste increases please.
- Made For This: Absolutely NOT.
- Better Than New: No haste increases!
- Blood Pact: Fine the way it is.
- Empathetic Connection: Doesn't need the killer aura reading.
- Bite The Bullet: Fine the way it is, personally speaking.
- Autodidact: Fine the way it is right now.
- Solidarity: Just add the other survivor knowing you have it.
- Self Care: Decent idea.
- Desperate Measures: Does not need changed.
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Can't, we have to watch if the Pig does better with her buffs. /s
Joking aside, I agree this combination needs to be looked at.
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It's because of his M2 and how fast he can be in a place at any given time.
Also remember, he has addons that extend the range of his rush.
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@Ilikechips said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3676887#Comment_3676887
It is disdain.
People have been talking about the gap between swf and solo since year 1. There have been tens of thousands of posts about it.
It took 8 years for a HUD to get added which allowed some form of teamwork information. The most basic form of gap closing between swf and solo. 8 years.
They obviously do not care about the solo experience. Comments from the video just confirm what I and alot of solo players already knew.
Disdain, please buy my skins though.
Again, you're misinterpreting their intention. Survivor was always meant to be about getting yourself out alive, which I still think is a bad idea in a 4v1, but just because that's their game design philosophy doesn't mean it's a personal vendetta against that entire aspect of the game.
It would be like if I decided to grow grain or some kind of feed in a chicken pen. I don't hate that grain, but I need something for the chickens, and getting rid of all that grain wouldn't be beneficial to me in the long run.
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I really think 'winning' is something the community has agreed upon more than the developers, looking at how they balance the game, their released stats revolve around kills and not wins.
I mean, escaping is a personal goal for survivors. Getting other survivors out isn't a scoring event, just bodyblocking is. There's no real incentive for sacrificing yourself to save your team, and there's no incentive to really assist your teammates aside possibly making some extra BP for yourself, or giving the killer other targets except you (as bad as that sounds.) Really it's up to survivors if it's worth helping your team, and naturally that extends to making SWF groups.
And killers get praised by the entity for more kills, sure, but there's no indicator saying "Congrats, you won!" because you took out 3 or 4 survivors. It's very straight forward about 'There are 4 targets, kill some" and not much else more. It's also why a coordinated SWF is going to survive more often because they do have the benefit of cooperating to deny the killer as many hooks as possible.
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@Ilikechips said:
Any solo players that think these devs don't have a disdain for you, we'll there you go.
I don't think this is disdain at all, this is their interpretation of how a horror game should be played. Agree or disagree.
That said, I don't agree that SoloQ is in a good spot either. Teammate loadout information and tweaks to perks to help show other survivors you have it active (being able to unhook yourself via Deliverance and Wicked, or highlighting your locker when Head On is ready for example) and some kind of anti-slug that survivors can't manipulate would help a bit.
However, saying the developers straight up hate a large portion of the community is just rage-baiting and makes 0 sense. They're clearly viewing things on the dread factor, not trying to make things easier to escape just because survivors don't like x killer. And one look at their cash shop should tell you that they definitely don't want to lose that revenue either. One of the biggest problems I have in SoloQ is survivors giving up, even if we're winning and get 3 gens popped before they go down, because the killer is Knight, Nurse or whoever they hate (Even Scratched Mirror Myers for crying out loud!)
As for Nurse herself, I do agree she's not as hard to master as Cote thinks and most Nurse players I face are very good. I do think she's hard to get into though, I myself took months of trying to really get into her because I first thought the teleport was disorienting, but once you know what you're doing she's pretty simple.
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Everytime I play Pig the survivors rush gens and pre-run to safe loops regardless if they see me or not. I've not once experienced the boop the snoot thing.
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I just want them to give me 1 iri shard back and force anyone who didn't get the last year's april fools glasses to suffer.
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Not really. I escape roughly 40% of the time, which is their goal anyway.
Otherwise, excluding the other survivors give up/mess up big time/troll, my experience as survivor has been positive.
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Daily Rituals should be divided by survivor and killer categories already.
3 for each side, so it incentivizes playing both roles for tons of BP.
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My killer games get a lot of these survivors too. I end up letting the last one go a LOT because I recognize they're just doing the gens. Meanwhile the other two or three attempt their boil over/unbreakable builds and flashlight/champion of light blinds while t-bagging and end up all getting slugged without even trying to get gens done. It gets annoying.
And on survivor side, they just make SoloQ that much worse when you see all three of them go down or drag their chases to your gen because you're trying to prevent a 3-gen scenario.
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Depends.
If it's a Hillbilly or Bubba, yes I will.
If the killer has NOED and the totem is next to the hooked survivor he nabbed, yes I will.
If the other survivors tried to get me killed all game and I somehow survived, absolutely.
Otherwise I do try to help the others.
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I'm sure plenty of people are testing to see how viable it is right now on live. No different than any other bad perk we've gotten in the past. It will even out eventually.
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I'm with what the others have said, he's not OP at all.
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@RpTheHotrod said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3674603#Comment_3674603
Not really that difficult. I go to basement all the time to try at a chance to get a medkit. Now I get a guaranteed heal an unlimited amount of times AND I don't even actually have to to into the basement since just the stairs is all that's needed. If the killer gets close, then I have an immediate window or pallet right next to me and I can loop the killer at the strongest looping area in the entire map (if basement is in shack, at least).
That's true if it's in shack. If it's in main, then it's a completely different set of circumstances depending on which main building you get. I suppose you could always run sprint burst as well to get out of basement quickly if needed once you hear the TR approach.
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@RpTheHotrod said:
I think the fact that BHVR realized that circle of healing was a problem...where someone just has to run to one location and get healed up to delete killer pressure...and then they add another perk that just brings it back into play again is just silly.
That's a fair argument. If I had to critique it further you should be in the bottom of basement, because as of now you can walk halfway down the stairs to heal.
That said, you're still injured in the basement so you need to be aware of what the killer is doing/who they're playing so you don't get followed in.
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I think he's weak in some ways, and very strong in others. And I'm okay with that. I do think the projectile is very easy to avoid though once you know how it works. Maybe more consistency with the bounces?
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The power bounces and explodes through walls, having more walls in a loop = more chances to hit with the power. Plus with wide open maps it's much easier to avoid the projectiles.
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The bigger problem is the power disparity between killers. These builds being basically required for Pig or Freddy, while as you said overwhelming as Wesker or Nurse is a huge problem for me and something that isn't easily fixed.
I still think at the very least there should be a cap on progression/regression speeds so that perks/items can be balanced on their own properly and not overwhelm the other side so easily. Unless there's something I'm missing, it seems like a decent idea for the pacing of a match.
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I'm not too keen on the weird shape of it, but it's definitely the better cousin of Garden of Joy.