Blueberry
Blueberry
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Of all the maps that need changes (and there are a ton), both those maps are a couple of the good ones that are overall fine.
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@Kaitsja said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3475938#Comment_3475938
Deep Wounds doesn't need a buff.
I think it does.
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While in Deep Wounds you are Deafened. This makes it way more scary as you really need to make sure you’re safe when you’re doing it. Also works as a buff/nerf to some other killers/perks/addons that could use them.
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It’s totally balanced, just very unhealthy design. It artificially inflates kill rates and gives kills that weren’t earned.
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Similar problem that most killers face which is survivors control too much of their power. More about how good they are instead of how good you are. Pretty disappointed personally.
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We hope. There’s a very long list of other killers we were waiting on that never happened as well though. My personal disappointment was Knight, he has a lot of potential that just hasn’t been fixed yet.
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It’s hard to balance an asymmetrical game as there’s a lot of people that only play one side and will always mass complain if their side gets changed even if it’s for the better. This makes it very hard for the devs to actually commit to strong game changes on either side. So we’re left with just small tweaks that never actually fix the core issues.
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We don’t factually know. People just self proclaim using incomplete Nightlight data or using specific people who play in comp. There’s lots of good players that don’t care about comp or not in Nightlights data we’d never even know about. So until we get actual leaderboards it’s impossible to know who’s the best objectively.
Now you can obviously use those things to find players that are extremely good at those killers, but to say best or “#1 xxxx” is impossible to know.
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Solo queues only real problem and why it feels so bad is matchmaking. The game is balanced around around solo queue, not swf. The bad experiences people have in solo queue are all related to either getting bad teammates or playing bad themselves. There is no balance issues with solo queue. The number one advantage with swf isn’t even comms, it’s getting guaranteed good teammates.
Here’s the problem though. We can’t necessarily just improve the matchmaking for a couple reasons.
Firstly it’s bad in order to speed up matchmaking as they prioritize fast queues over balanced matches. If they made it more accurate you’d be waiting much longer and they won’t do that.
Secondly the matchmaking needs to be bad as it covers up the games balance problems. The game is balanced around having weak links that make mistakes. This is why people hated mmr even more near it’s earlier release as it was a much smaller matchmaking net and made way sweatier games. If they made it more accurate matchmaking they’d have to buff killer a lot and people obviously don’t want that, so bad matchmaking allows them to stay in the state they are.
I play almost strictly solo queue and 99% of the time I lose it’s either bad teammates or me making mistakes myself. There are no balance issues with solo queue, it’s skill issues, but that’s a hard pill for people to swallow and own up to.
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@Nihlus said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3408010#Comment_3408010
I'm glad you agree that all gen regression perks are a problem... because why wouldn't you run them?
To your surprise I actually do agree they are a problem as well.
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It either shouldn’t be a hex anymore or it stays a hex and goes back to 200%. It’s current form is trash and not worth running.
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Probably the only solution is going to be separate queues ranked/casual.
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@Peanits said:
Just to chime in real quick, both the Killer perks and Survivor perks that we've toned down in the past few updates have seen a decline in usage rate, as intended. It's not just Killers who stop using a perk when it's nerfed, Survivors do the same. It might be harder to tell since you're the only Killer in your match, but there are still many who continue running those perks.
Beyond that, I will just say that you haven't explained why you consider them a problem (or why they will always be a problem), so it's very difficult to have any sort of constructive conversation about it.
To your final point. When would you ever not run an exhaustion perk if your goal was to win? The answer is never, you would always run an exhaustion perk. That in and of itself tells you there’s a problem. There should never be perks that are an automatic auto lock in every single game with zero thought of not running them, that’s inherently a sign of a flaw in design. You should always be considering pros and cons of if anything is worth running. There is literally only up side on exhaustion perks as a category. Exhaustion perks as a category and level of power far, far exceed all other perks in the game they would consider as alternatives, hence why they’d never not be ran. That’s why they’re a problem.
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You’re getting these conflicting opinions because of both swf vs solo and high mmr vs low mmr matches.
“Most” people generally agree in one direction if all those said people are talking about the same type of match.
IE both people are talking about high mmr players on both sides or both people are talking about low mmr players on both sides ect ect
Most people just say x side is overpowered for example while not specifying solo, swf, high mmr, low mmr, ect
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@ProudRinMain said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3402765#Comment_3402765
It’s really baffling how many rate Spirit as easy. ESPECIALLY after her nerf. Oh well 🤷🏼♀️
It’s just because people get salty when they lose to Spirit and it’s easier to make excuses than take accountability for getting outplayed.
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Yeah she's like a stealth killer that isn't actually stealthed.
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Why run any of this though? Just run 1 CoH for the entire team and run all the same perks as before.
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Maps need to be shrunk substantially.
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I mean while it rarely works what other option is there? Nothing. That's why they at least try it.
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@Phasmamain said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3402765#Comment_3402765
Depends on add-ons used. Dried cherry blossom MDR is probably the easiest a killer can be
I agree about cherry blossom but that would be silly to rank an entire killer based on 1 addon. Most spirits I see don’t even use it.
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Spirit should be up to very difficult imo. I know it’s the cool thing to call Spirit easy but she still has more skill ceiling than most the killer roster.
Onryo should be down to easy.
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@Ricardo170373 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3401236#Comment_3401236
Exactly like Trickster. He is so weak and has the worst kill rate in this game, but, if you simply buff him, He will be OP broken. Trickster needs love too.
Yeah Tricksters design is a mess too.
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They pulled back on the changes so far that nearly nothing is changing meta wise other than a few dead killer perks, a few less DHs, and less perks overall in the meta. The whole anti heal perks and heal perks thing isn’t happening anymore since they pulled back so far. CoH is still gonna be hard meta.
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This actually sounds like a great prime reward this month.
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Solo queue is fine. It’s only issue is how bad the matchmaking is but that’s required to be bad because of how unbalanced the game is as it covers up the problems.
Spirit takes more skill than 3/4 the killer roster.
We should be able to see our own MMRs and in post game lobby of others.
SWF should be visible in post game lobby.
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They’ll be no reason to run any other healing perks with CoH giving 8 second heals. Also, those two perks have negative synergy, Autodidact is good when heals actually take a long time.
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@VikingDragonXii said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3401611#Comment_3401611
The Devs have already proved they don't like Gens slowed down and games taking too long hence why a second round of regression nerfs without any look at Gen speed perks, Tool boxes, and BNP.
If DL gains popularity as the next Gen Regression perk it will get nerfed like all the others. BHVR needs to come out and say HOW they want the game to be played because obviously how players are playing it now is not what they want.
True. They keep nerfing regression without giving killers another way to slow them down or fixing their speed in the first place. Hince why as they nerf them tunneling just keeps getting more and more prevalent as the last resort.
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DL is by far the best gen slow down in the game. It’s lowest value point (everyone on one gen) is quite rare as that’s non efficient, it’s mid point of at least one person getting blocked is extremely common and already makes it the best slow down in the game, and it’s best scenario of blocking a gen with 2 people on it is not that uncommon and makes the perk definitely blow the rest out in comparison. It’s also one of the few perks that is giving you value regardless of what you do. This makes it one of the only counters to the squads that just pre drop every single pallet since that prevents the value of other gen regression perks.
Honestly if you were to ever only run 1 gen slow down perk DL is almost always the objectively best choice, it’s not even close.
That all said should it be nerfed? Well it is very good as I went over, but the problem is like I said earlier, it’s nearly the only counter to just pre dropping pallets. So until that’s fixed I don’t think DL should be touched as it’s currently necessary with those groups.
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@Jangles said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3401378#Comment_3401378
I don't see how I'm wrong. It has the highest killrate of any map.
Does highest kill rate make a map comparably killer sided or objectively killer sided?
In other words, what if all the other maps had a kill rate of 5% hypothetically but Midwhich had a kill rate of 7%. Is Midwhich by your rational still “killer sided” because it has the highest kill rate even though it’s only 7%? Or would this actually mean it’s still survivor sided but it is simply comparably better than the other ones?
My point being that just because a map has the highest kill rate doesn’t make it objectively killer sided, just simply better than the other maps.
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While she is extremely weak and needs buffs they just can’t. She’s flawed in core design. She needs a heavy rework to how she work’s fundamentally.
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I actually feel it’s one of his bad maps. I’d love to face a blight on RPD.
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@Shroompy said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3401064#Comment_3401064
I'm well aware that this is over-complicating things, but that's kind of the point. I wanted to fantasize about what it would be like if I myself were able to create the Pig from the ground up while staying faithful to the SAW franchise but also make something thats enjoyable to play as and against, while also feeling rewarding. To me a good character design is something that's easy to grasp for a new player, but still provides a challenge to master for experienced players which this rework also achieves.
Simply doing a few number tweaks wouldn't necessarily fix her without just making her frustrating to go against. Doing all the changes to her crouch/ambush that you listed simply encourages to use her Ambush at loops and for a Survivor to just run away from it (more than they are already). Not to mention that removing her sheathing sound removes feedback which might not be OP per say, but just makes it feel unfair. This is perfectly shown with Hag and Rusty Shackles.
If it’s just for fun/fantasy that makes sense, I just don’t see it in terms of practicality.
I disagree, number tweaks would fix her and that would not be remotely frustrating to go against. It would be a mind game of if she was going to ambush or go for the m1 and trying to time the crouch during a line of sight loss to catch them off guard from running. Removing sheathing sound actually adds skilled interaction instead of spoon feeding it to the survivor. They would have to watch her and be weary of a LoS break crouch. I actually don’t see an issue with Rusty Shackles. Hags issues are more in her base design.
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Actually better than people think.
If you’re in chase with the obsession when it activates you get a quick Mori and a chance to down someone else before the gates are open securing another kill.
Even if it’s not the obsession you’ve now knocked an entire person out of the hook rescue attempt making it almost a guaranteed kill or a much more likely multi kill if they go for the save anyway while down a person.
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This is way, way, way over complicating something with a simple solution. The devs typically don’t do changes this extensive either. These level of reworks are usually reserved for killers with fundamental flaws like Skull Merchant, Pig is not fundamentally flawed in design.
All she needs is her crouch move speed increased, increase the charge speed of her ambush and it’s move speed, remove the sheathing sound of her crouch, and finally move the roar to the end of the charge bar instead of the beginning.
That’s really it. If you wanna get extra snazzy she could use some addon changes. Her core issues are just how bad her crouch and ambush is.
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STBFL is fine.
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@GolbezGarlandGabrant said:
Making it so Archive challenges doesn't block the end game chat window and cause me to accidentally back out of the results screen trying to type in the chat window.
^ This is SO annoying. How was this not thought about in its original design?
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Still decent slowdown I’d put CI, DL, Jolt and NWO. That’s about it.
Slow down stacking is still pretty needed on most the killer roster with how weak they are and how poorly designed maps are. They just aren’t designed to have even the potential when played perfectly to slow down the survivors enough for a 12 hook game against actually good swf. Hopefully we can eventually get away from this.
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Not as in favor of the 115%.
However he is really bad and needs some buffs.
As you said allow him to hold his Main Event, I don’t know why it’s not already like that. You rarely even get to use it.
I’d improve his map pressure a bit by making knives stay stuck in the survivor. They can choose to either leave them in and be quicker to injure next time he finds them or spend an animation time based on the number of knives to pull them out. This gives him more map pressure by having a little built in slow down and gives value to hitting people with knives even if you don’t injure them.
Bouncing knives would be a nice base kit feature as well since it just increases his skill ceiling for some good players to make some crazy trick shots. Bad killers wouldn’t be able to utilize this well.
Trickster has a lot of unrealized potential with only some small tweaks to him.
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Nothing has changed about Victor, you may be experiencing bugs.
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I just want it to be shown in the post game lobby so we can gauge how well we should’ve done.
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Space ship, on a huge boat/cruise ship at sea, inside an old mansion.
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It’s killer sided if the survivors are bad, otherwise it’s extremely survivor sided.
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@Veinslay said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3396388#Comment_3396388
It's a good thing if they take Victor hostage, it makes it a 3v1 which massively favors the killer
3v1 as an m1 killer with no power..no..that doesn't favor the killer, not when the survivors are actually good.
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Yeah first step this to revert that horrible stun on successful Victor down they added. Makes them feel bad to play and was unwarranted. Then fix taking Victor hostage, that shouldn’t be a thing.
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I wouldn’t say it’s unnecessary, but maybe just a bit excessive and could have the time shortened some.
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Yeah for people complaining about a stale meta this patch is not only keeping the meta the same but decrease the pool of perks to use. The opposite of what they were intending. We essentially only lost things and gained nothing.
The shift to healing “was” going to in a roundabout way shake up the meta and bring a lot of new perks into it. However, after the healing revert now nothing is changing. There’s no point in running anti heal perks or healing perks now. One CoH covers all the healing needs for the entire team and even with out running it heals are only 16 seconds, so why bring anything? Healing before was more efficient than it will be now but ultimately the time spent is so short it defeats the point of running any anti healing perks.
So we’re ultimately not getting a meta shake up and just less perks to run.
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@KingFieldShipper said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3396131#Comment_3396131
Not remotely, it’s way more than that,
Most swfs are bad, and most players of this game are bad in general. For the record I agree completely with what edgarpoop said before me. It's all relative though and the overall experience of the game is subjective.
Also the difference in these games is the survivors losing because they played bad, as the side who plays bad should. That game the killer loses wasn’t playing bad, just bad balance.
I'm confused what you are trying to get at here, are you saying killers never lose because they are bad? Just because of bad balance? Or are you referring to only the op's examples?
It’s obviously to OP’s scenario, the other statement would be silly to make.
Saying swf doesn’t really matter is a very false statement.
Most players and swf in the game are bad, but much are significantly better on average at higher mmr. Swf gives so many advantages it significantly lowers the bar as far as how good you need to be in your swf to win as well. IE you don’t need to be that great of a swf to win through sheer balance issues. Just saying “bad swf” is a bit misleading.
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That’s actually not rank or used for matchmaking. It’s just time played. It’s just an old system left in that generally causes more harm than good and confuses new players. There’s a hidden mmr system that’s matching you, which is also confusing.
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Lol 10% of games are good swf?
Not remotely, it’s way more than that, and no good is not synonymous with a comp squad, just good. You don’t need to be that good to meet the requirements when the bar is so low.
Also the difference in these games is the survivors losing because they played bad, as the side who plays bad should. That game the killer loses wasn’t playing bad, just bad balance.
One of these scenarios a side has agency and the other does not. You should be balancing so both sides have agency, which is what you’re arguing against.
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I’m down for a rework to make it effect solo and swf equally but I’ve yet to hear a good idea of how to do that. It’s extremely difficult to only ever make changes that effect both groups equally.