AChaoticKiller
AChaoticKiller
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play both roles, red ranks each reset for both, looping is easy as survivor get good.
edit: O yea i also solo so.....
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you know just because we play on a different platform it doesn't mean we play that much different from you. im sure there are just as many players on pc doing exactly what your telling console players not to do.
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NGL I camp every OoO user i see especially if i play hag, the perk is not fun to go against and literally gives a swf info on where the killer is at nearly all times.
Running that perk in your swf is worse than the killer running NOED, you guys hate that clutch perk yet you use a perk that gives you constant info for your whole team which can completely destroy certain killers.
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well for the most part any survivor not in at least purple ranks are generally not the best since it's fairly easy to pip if you play well enough. Not saying that they suck but they are less than average in a chase usually so you being a rank 20 which will be matched with fellow low rank players in an area of rank that's easy as hell to pip in doesn't say much. I could probably get to purple or red rank as trapper from 20 in less than 3 days so what does that say about a killer WAY stronger than trapper.
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his addons need looking into since the only ones worth using are the ones that affect shred and the rat tail to speed up portal placement. The best buff would be to make rat liver base kit since good demos usually use it anyway. shred btw is actually a great chase tool and i really hope that they leave it alone for the most part and demo's who say shred sucks or is meh they suck at demo especially if they are missing most of their shreds.
edit: another really good buff would to be to fix his loud ass footsteps and maybe getting ride of the map wide sound when he uses the portals.
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@Onyx_Blue said:
His add-ons do need looking into and adjusting. But to those saying Rat Liver should be base-kit: @Golden_spider @AChaoticKiller @MojoTheFabulous @OldHunterLight you have no idea what you're asking for. Rat Liver allows Demo to gain ground in chases he would never normally be able to make without good movement and knowing how to play the tile properly as well as manupulate his power too. If that were to be base-kit it would lower his skill-cap tremendously. Loops would feel oppressive, it would remove a lot of fun from interacting with him, players would have their hand held, essentially. I'm a Demo main whom never uses this add-on (for the reason above) and suffer no struggles or feelings of lackluster chase play towards Demo on my end. So, if Devs read these comments, DO NOT put Rat Liver as base-kit...
its a brown addon... I can literally use it every game out of 4 other addons that affect shred and i do. if your not using it there are certain small to medium loops you can barely get the shred hit on that you otherwise wouldn't hit. I really dont think it will tremendously lower his skill cap his skill cap itself is knowing when or when not to use/fake shred as well as how it can be used at loops and jungle gyms.
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I play a TON of demo to the point where i'd say i main him and I agree since his only good addons are brown and 1 yellow one. I would like them to make the rats liver base kit as they look into him but i would rather the brown addons and the 1 yellow addon that gets you a portal and decreases recovery time not increase in rarity.
also who else thinks demo is underrated? Most players dont play him well and some dont even loop the right way to use shred. I can land nearly 1 shred almost every chase in a match but then i get another p3 demo and he misses like 3 shreds he shouldn't have done and im like tf you doing? hes a boss at vaults since you just have to wait to see the animation to shred or shred the vault when their item disappears but so many demo players are way too hasty and they miss hits from that.
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i never use mori's unless its for a daily, idk about others but what i do know is that its not just console players doing this.
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@WalkedMoss92 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1581538#Comment_1581538
PC already has it though?
no that was the ptb which already ended. PC does get to test out the update but it goes live for all platforms at the same time.
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keys should take 12 or more seconds to open the hatch and give a directional sound as it opens at like 40m and opening the hatch doesn't save progress if you stop/get interrupted, this is what a thought out idea is and not a half ass one. of course time and distance you can hear the hatch being opened can be changed to be more balanced but its a lot better than instead of 2 or 3 instant escapes you get 1... if there is only 1 key.
that has counter play and interaction with the killer which is what it needs, ESCAPES SHOULD NOT BE INSTANT AND SAFE which is the MAIN problem with keys.
Mori's should get a rework but i think a better mori idea can be presented but if it came to it sure i'd accept that rework. but i would like it to activate mid match and you can only mori hooked survivors. say like at 5 minutes the survivors get notified that they can be mori'd if they have been hooked, hell it can be a new status effect.
noed is fine and that change is just a worse devour hope, sure 2 hooks you get 1 insta down but at 3 hooks with devour you get it as long as the totem is alive and you can get devour to activate really early and has an amazing last effect when you get to 5 tokens, you can even get to 4 or if your really lucky 5 tokens before the survivors even know you have it. plus that noed idea sounds like it encourages tunneling since you get more tokens from already hooked survivors.
Also who else thinks king is annoying.
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I play on xbox and noticed some fps issues since the mid chapter patch but my main issue is how easy it is for a survivor to do a quick turn on PC and cancel my lunge. im sure some people know what im talking about as its not even a juke it just barely goes into the hit detection cone and they move out of it as you auto hit/miss them even tho you weren't moving anywhere other than forward and would have hit them and no its not them actually juking it literally cancels your lunge mid way.
edit: I'm not sure if every platform has it happen and it probably does but its mainly due to how fast a survivor can turn (and PC can do it best) and it should be looked into. having my lunged canceled and the chase lasting an extra 30 seconds is extremely annoying.
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Hag if mastered is third best fight me
billy which is considered 3rd or 4th by many can be looped, freddy is the same if your paying attentiont for snare placement and playing a little more safe.
Hag? a proper trap and fast reactions get you hits unless they have dead hard, even if they have a OoO you can put traps a little more far from pallets or vaults so if its triggered you get the hit and flashlights are never a problem unless there are like 3 and in a normal match most i see is 1 and sometimes 2.
sure a meta running swf with OoO(with a flashlight) can beat her a lot easier than other killers but that generally beats everyone other than the top 2 spirit and nurse.
also urban destroys her is total bs, at best it gets you saves faster.
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No pls no more tokens, also she is fine as she is.
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key time for opening hatch should be 12 seconds base, also this is very similar to a rework idea i posted awhile ago but mine was more in depth and included some addon rework ideas along with some changes to the keys themselves like the purple key breaking if you stop opening the hatch but its aura reading time was buffed. I didn't think about a different animation but i think the current 'jump in' one is fine and also killers shouldn't be able to do hatch grabs anymore since it leads to hatch camping.
the key only doors would be a cool idea, they could replace one of the new blocked doors on the new spring wood map with one but i think it should cost a lot of charges otherwise keys will be a lot more common and can be used on multiple doors and hatch. I dont think they should open chests faster tho that doesn't make a lot of sense when the chests are not locked, maybe as an addon?.
for those interested since this is about keys heres mine, i try to fully rework each key function and go more indepth but i do really like the op's key door idea tho.
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/132937/my-full-hatch-and-key-rework-idea/p1?new=1
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@BaldursGate2 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1575685#Comment_1575685
I just looked at the perks for 30 games in red ranks and ds + unbreakable is not a common combination. Unbreakable is not even in the top 5 used perks.
combine it with gen rush and dont bother healing unless you go against a strong killer like spirit or nurse. the point is you get unhooked and just focus on gens the killer can't touch you for 1 minute besides making you waste ds or unbreakable which is fine when you and your team are going to finish gens in under like 6 minutes. the perks combined with gen rush makes it so you dont get punished for focusing on gens instead of backing off and healing/ not working on a gen or taking a risk.
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i think ds is fine the problem is if you run it with unbreakable and just gen rush. a whole team with ds, unbreakable, exhaustion perk, and BT with gen rushing isn't beatable especially if the survivors are good.
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If you slugged i think you could have won? Im not going to watch since i can already see how that game would go but with no unbreakable you could have tried to snowball. Unless you thought they might be running that perk and tried to avoid slugging to get more hooks either way you have a valid point. Besides in a normal game you have to assume the worst and with gen rushing with meta and playing safely against the killer(besides nurse) you cant realistically win especially if you going for a normal 10+ hooks game. Against that you have to get everybody downed and hooked while no ones dead to win because unbreakable and ds will prevent you from tunneling and your definitely not going to kill someone before gens get done unless your satisfied with 1 or 2 kills.
I did a kyf with a group of r1's using coms, meta perks, rushing, and they played safe and i went demo and hag. They were only average in a chase and as demo non lasted longer than 40 second. I couldn't snowball and only got 1 kill but about 7 or 8 hooks.. As hag same situation but i got all but 1 down but 1 had unbreakable and i lost from that with 1 kill o and they all had DH. Hag suffers similarly to nurse against DH so i barely got downs after that in that game, i think i got about 4 hooks.
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it could stop your timer as long as the killer is within 16 meters and still no one will run it. it doesn't help unless you get to EGC and are getting camped or if the killer just decides to camp you. because you dont get camped every game it wont matter if this perk got the best buff to punish camping because it won't have a affect in most of your games.
edit: now if it could allow you to stun the killer for a save it would be a lot better but i doubt the dev's would do that as it could be very abused in coordinated teams.
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im sure that the other posts will talk about tips for playing plague but for your perks make sure they will work wither or not survivors cleanse. example pgtw, infectious fright, bbq, and blood echo. that build works no matter what survivors do so if they dont cleanse you get blood echo to get rid of the exhaustion perks and you can easily find them and if they cleanse you can try to snowball with your corrupt purge.
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yea i also find it annoying i hope they make it so it detects if your holding the power button at the end of a saw charge so you dont have to time it.
edit: i know im lazy but cmon having to look at your power bar and the survivor is pretty annoying.
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most of the time killers mains are right and one of the reasons why is because most of us play both sides unlike a good chunk of the survivor community so we know this game the best. Is there biased people out there? of course there are that doesn't change and the nerf ds posts show that.
Like most times a good killer complains about a map or gen rushing or both they have a point. I got lerrys as legion earlier today and even tho i ended chases quickly i couldn't apply pressure with frenzy because of lerrys layout and because they were not healing and focused on gens so i lost. most killers would fail to beat that and if it was against some survivors who could do good in a chase almost all killers would lose because lerrys is a horrible map for killer. Is that me or anyone being biased? no thats just the horrible balanced state of this game.
Go play a lot of killer, get to high ranks or face good survivors with the new mmr or whatever it is and when you go against that one team who knows what they are doing try and say survivors need help because they really dont. is camping and tunneling(the only issues you can complain about) toxic and a little unfair of course it is but what should the devs do to fix it without it being abused?
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@mydogmax19 said:
Her ambush attack are best at loops with pallets. Also for sneak attacks. Her power has potential when utilized correctly, I'd say. I have no problem with how she is currently as far as effectiveness with the ambush thing.
than you haven't gone against competent survivors because unless its on the side of a building and the survivor hesitates to leave the loop your not getting that hit with ambush. you can never land ambush at loops if survivors instantly leaves the loop or get if they get on the opposite side of you and make it to the pallet when they hear you go into crouch and you try to ambush.
as for the basic attack it seems controversial and while I personally would like to see it as one it seems that the best way to balance it would to make it more different than the m1. This can be done by either giving it the deep wounds affect as someone said earlier which i actually really like however it may be too strong with RBT's. I also like making it longer by another second or two since the main problem with ambush is you can out run it if you leave the loop on the opposite side of the of the pig and she can't hit you.
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@Tactless_Ninja said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1470340#Comment_1470340
Because they actively found the totem at the beginning of the match.
not even that they could just hit the skill checks
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@Flarefire_Xx said:
Make her end game traps work, that’s tpwhere she could truly shine and she could punish doing gens with traps on
this idea is a very debatable one because you could get 1 or 2 survivors and trap them and then just patrol your box's. if no one is downed or hooked the survivors are not only on a death timer from the traps but also from end game collapse and if your just chasing them off the box's it will be next to impossible for them to escape especially if you see them try a box and it being the wrong one because then you have less boxs to patrol. it just wouldn't be fair.
edit: of course you can do this currently if someone has a trap on and the last gen gets powered all you have to do is open a gate and then stop them from using the boxs and they will more than likely die.
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or they could just make the useless perks have a use, no reason to nerf overused perks that are balanced and happen to fit the meta like pgtw, nurses, dead hard, self care, unbreakable, ect.
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she is pretty weak unless you use one of two builds which is extreme anti gen or chase focused, both of which have to work whether the survivors choose to cleanse or not. she is also kind of addon reliant which makes a lot of players stop playing her when they run out of good addons.
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cool take away the only good indicator of where a survivor is... no
all killers should have the upper hand in a chase, taking away the sound's while phasing would kill spirit since you will miss too many of your phases and lose because you wasted you own time.
think of it like this what if nurse couldn't see survivors and tried to use her power to teleport on top of them, yea there's not much skill there and your mostly relying on the survivor to be predictable and luck both of which are horrible for the killer to rely on.
@not_Queef said:
A better change would be that she can hear survivors effects on the environment (footsteps, rustling grass, etc) but not their grunts of pain or breath while phasing.
Making her completely deaf would be stupid.
that would actually be a buff since most spirits including myself use footsteps to track survivors because it's more accurate and the grunts are not very reliable for telling distance. Getting ride of grunts will make the footsteps sound a lot clearer and make it easier to pinpoint survivors.
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@ClickyClicky said:
Love how the gen speed videos have 200 replies and this has none. Nobody complains when a killer wrecks a team in a few minutes. Its just gonna be the “bad survivors” excuse.
Really shows the bias in the community. Both sides have the potential to quickly defeat the other side.
To be fair the killer can only do that if the survivors are all near each other and out positioned so "bad survivors" is a excuse because they were not spread out doing gens like good survivors do. Even if you spawn with your team and decide to do the nearby gen when the killer shows up it's basic knowledge to leave that area and do other gens or if the killer lacks a means to down you quickly you can try to finish the gen.
In the case of gens being done in 3 or 4 minutes it's the exact same thing, survivors spreed out and focused on gens. while whoever is being chased tries their best to play it safe and waste time.
in both cases the most important thing is positioning in the beginning of the game and repositioning and responding properly to the killer is what separates good and bad survivors. If your team dies 3 minutes into the game it just means that you all failed to respond properly to whatever the killer was doing and you all were out positioned which should never be the case if your team is in critical condition (2 or more survivors hooked or downed)
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no one complained about legion being gutted,? dude like all of the community complained and they did for months until he became "ok" to use.
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actually you get a notification of where they got saved like a hook. so you do know where they are after the save.
Sorry you lot that think their useless because you guys are probably the ones that tunneled them out of cages or camped them.
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- hag 5/5 (mained her before she was even buffed)
- wraith 5/5
- plague 5/5
- legion 4/5
- oni 4/5
- billy 4/5
- doc 4/5
- freddy 4/5
- demo 3.5/5 (i still make stupid mistakes but i understand when to use his power and am better than most demo's who i would rate at a 2 or 1)
- nurse 3/5
- spirit 3/5
- huntress 3/5
- trapper 3/5
- myers 3/5
- leather face 3/5
- pig 3/5
- ghost face 3/5
- clown 3/5
- ph 2/5
- death slinger 2/5
I have been playing this game for a long time and play most of the killers to where I main about 4 or 5 of them. I rate most of my killers at 3 because i understand how to play all of them even nurse and can do good with them even if i have to push through with skill alone.
there are only two killers i dont have a good grasp on as you can see and that is ph because he is too new and im still getting used to but with death slinger since i play on console and the hit box is small for his spear i dont bother playing him most of the time.
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@RakimSockem said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/169950/first-impressions-of-the-ptb-killer-changes
I think just like you mentioned with "the Nurse treatment", players who have actual skill with the character will adjust and still get easy 4ks. Even with the Nurse changes, I've seen Nurse's go perkless and get 4ks. And it's simply because she still has mechanics that can end chases really quickly.
Likewise, I don't think really good Billy players are going to be all that much affected by this. Billy was the only character who had an instadown AND an easy way to cross just about any outdoor map in a matter of seconds. He shouldn't have access to both at all times so I see an overheat mechanic to be fair.
When I think about the other super strong characters, Nurse, Spirit, and Freddy can get across a map very quickly but none of them have an instadown. Oni has to put in some work to get his and it's time limited. Like.... everyone had some kind of limit to keep them from being broken but Billy players could just be anywhere they wanted, had an instadown, AND I forgot a pallet deleting chainsaw like Demo's Shred. There has to be some downside.
Now maybe they can change up the numbers when it comes to map transversal and some other things, but the mechanic itself is fair
yea thats how i viewed billy and why i stopped playing him, the devs said that the player with more skill will come out on top in a chase but if your just extremely skilled and get 1 or 2 mediocre survivors you often just win so it was only really equal if both sides are good. I like the overheat for your reasoning but i feel like his saw should be usable at least 3 times before overheating.
As for nurse they did go too fair to the point where only players that were skilled with her before her rework can really use her, she is just too frustrating and difficult to play for the average player and no one wants to try to learn her. IF you are really good with her then yea she's pretty balanced now but thats only for those really skilled players and getting to that point takes a long time playing nurse which many players wont do now.
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I actually like the overheat idea but i agree they took it too far. They need to either increase the cooling of the chainsaw, reward you for landing a hit with the saw by cooling it down like maybe 20%, or reduce the total amount of charges you use so that you can at least use the saw 3 times in secession.
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I'm cool with this list but Hag is diffidently at the top of a tier here's why
- with her power you can make looping nearly impossible to pull off if a trap is at the pallet
- she has the best snowball potential in the game as well as the best way to defend large area's
- she is barely affected by the map since she can just compromise and put traps at loops if you get say a farm map.
- this one is more of a counter augment to why people who think she is bad but FL's and urban evasion dont destroy her unless there are more than 2 FL's or if the whole team is using urban. Both of which are rare or easy to avoid.
When comparing that with the other killers she is tied or depending on the map better than huntress since huntress is heavily map reliant. She is tied with hillbilly but has better potential at ending the chase faster since a good survivor will get to a loop at least once before you are in range to saw them. As for freddy she is just better then him with snowballing and the potential to quickly end chases, the only thing he has over her is his gen teleport but while playing hag you dont let them separate gens that far to be a problem.
she has the potential to do better than any killer in terms of snowballing and quickly ending chases and that potential is extremely high as in it's common to snowball due to the survivors triggering traps trying to save their friend and it's common to have a trap go off and hit an already injured survivor. so while i do throw the word potential around a lot thats just what it is and for hag the word potential is just a matter of when in the match will this happen.
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i use it as survivor to stop tunneling yes but does that mean i wont use it when i get the chance? no of course not.
that's like saying you use devour hope for its insta down effect but when you get to five tokens are you not going to mori survivors? Of course you will because you can.
Also DS doesn't do much unless you let it, if it's early to mid game to the mid you can or just slug them and go after another survivor. in late game slugging is the best thing to do. Hell when i play killer and this is in red ranks i never tunnel and usually win before gates get powered and if they do get powered i go after a survivor that cant have DS or wont have it active. If they get unhooked i have probably hit another survivor and will instead go for them and if i can't i slug the one who got unhooked.
Its reallllllly not that hard to deal with DS unless you tunnel and even then slugging exists. you either deal with it sooner rather than later or you wait it out and go after someone else.
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i only use ruin on pig and legion, Imo pgtw is better if you yourself are a good killer and since i consider myself pretty good since i can down survivors quickly i find that the perk is better than ruin at least on killers that have something to help them end chases or if they have a power that helps traverse the map or stall the game.
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@Alpha8512_Xbox said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1370765#Comment_1370765
I see your point. I guess I've yet to verse a good demo
I have literally only gone against one demo who knew what he was doing and it was a week after this youtuber posted a demo shred guide. I have also tried to get better at him and it really is just knowing when you can use shred or not. One thing i have got down tho is shack and any window vault when im in range, a lack of patience is what i was missing along with my shreds of course when i first played him up till i watched that guide.
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demo's shred is actually better then PH's ranged attack imo
Demogorgon's Shred
pro's
- Is faster and has a longer range
- isn't react-able because of it's speed, activation time, and lack of warning since the sound he makes already means he pounced and your not going to dodge it on reaction because it has a wide range and it's speed it too great.
- breaks pallets and it's faster then a normal break animation
- has more loops that you can always land shred and you can get hits in on short distances to pallets because of its activation speed.
- Is very easy to fake and the speed loss is not noticeable maybe even non existent unless you charge it too long.
con's
- hitting an object stuns you
- without knowing when to use shred it hurts you more then helps
Pyramid heads ranged attack
pro's
- goes through objects
- creates 50/50 scenarios at certain loops by using and holding his power
- can hit multiple survivors
- can be in his power and still be faster than the survivors but at 110% speed instead of 115%
con's
- Cant be used on uneven terrain such as stairs, hills, ect
- IS VERY react-able to where faking it out in the open wont work since the ranged attack can be dodged
- using it to get a hit after the pallet is down can cause you to lose a massive amount of distance which can be even worse if you miss
- It's default range sucks to the point where addons are needed or you can't grantee hits on windows
This is just looking at both of their attacks that help in a chase, now i know a lot of people are skeptical of demo but it really is just a case of do you know how to use him or not and as you can see demo has a lot more going for it.
Really the only thing PH has going for him are his cages since they can kill survivors very quickly but in order to do so you have to tunnel sooooooooooooooooo thanks devs for encouraging that.
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he is a tunneler tho i f***en tested it and if you get them in torment and proxy camp at hook they usually get saved and then you down them, send them to a cage, and go to the cage and proxy camp it if they haven't been saved when you go there.
I did this i think about 5 times in red ranks to see how effective it is and its very effective. i usually got a survivor killed in the first 2 minutes of the game if i found one early and in all my games i was able to get a 3rd survivor dead by tunneling before the last gen got down. It is complete BS that this is allowed and i only tested it so i didn't just talk about it without knowing how it worked.
It is just like camping but way quicker at killing your target, the worst that can happen is your target being saved as soon as you cage them and you dont find them but so what? they are now on death hook and can't make bold plays or get downed unless they want their team to be at a major disadvantage early in the game.
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@immortalls96 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1360699#Comment_1360699
Right..with 0 gen defence..great..thatll work against players with game sense..its no different than basement bubba..only at least he cant insta down multiple players at once..plus..all you have to do is see where your buddy was downed. And wait at where the cage spawns..I made a ph with mori rage quit ffs..that's why I'm brushing aside your argument because it solely implies bad play by survivors
omg you know what after this one im done responding because talking to idiots is frustrating.
- a good killer will down you if you dont loop so not stepping in torment isn't good advice or a strat because you will have to loop eventually.
- the speed at which he gets you killed is faster than camping and if you get someone right away and camp you can get 2 kills pretty much every time since you get the 2nd survivor when the gens are nearly finished if they have gen rushed you. SO WHAT DOES THAT SAY ABOUT THE SPEED AT WHICH YOU CAN KILL SURVIVORS BY TUNNELING WITH PH, USE YOUR BRAIN. BECAUSE WHEN I TESTED THIS AS PH I ALWAYS GOT A 3RD SURVIVOR BEFORE GENS GOT FINISHED.
- Because the strat involves proxy camping good survivors will try their luck or rely on BT to unhook the survivor getting proxy camped. your not camping at the hook so they will try at least once to do a save and thats how you get a fast kill. If they dont try to save then yea your not going to get more than two kills but in reality in almost all games they will try at least once to do a save.
- Even if he fails to kill you after he puts you in a cage if he did the strat then your on your death hook early in the game which puts that survivor and his/her team at a big disadvantage since they cant make bold plays without dying and dying early in the game is pretty much an instant lose for the survivors.
- Two meta perks being not very usable on PH because of the cages does not matter when they can be replaced by perks more suited to this play style and when this play style that involves the cages that you traded for those perks being extremely effective at killing survivors by tunneling so the trade is not fair.
- I'm aware that not everyone is doing this but that doesn't make it ok, this type of strat should not exist in the first place when it encourages a very toxic play style and is completely unfair to the survivor on the receiving end because it forces a depip, makes them gain barely anything in that match, and is a waste of their time. sounds familiar? Thats because its just like camping but worse because its faster at killing your target.
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@immortalls96 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1360591#Comment_1360591
You were with bad survivors...heck maybe it's because I learned to play without ds before its change because I refused to use it, but no they shouldnt work because then its favoritism..its making an exception where there should be none..if ph is tunneling to win you played poorly..its really that simple..if a perk is the difference between dying and escaping then thsts what is called a crutch
you literally have not listened to a single word have you? Otherwise you wouldn't have said that "if ph is tunneling to win you played poorly" especially when my point was he could tunnel to win since he kills you so quickly by doing so.
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@immortalls96 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1359953#Comment_1359953
Then people will be finally forced to learn something..dunno what else to say here..ds and borrowed time are perks..therefore they should have flaws..people need to learn to function without them
I love how you ignore why they should work and instead you just give a response with no points at all, just here's my statement and people should learn to not use ds. Even tho when a PH tunnels and they are a good killer like i described you will die no matter what you do and you die faster than if any other killer did this because of how the cages work.
Also im not overestimating this, I have already seen 3 PH's play like this in high rank and i have tried it a few times to see how effective it is and got 3 or 4 kills each time because only two people at most are working on a gen and im killing a survivor in under 2 minutes. Sure not everyone will play like this but the fact that you can play like this and do well is ridiculous.
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@MadLordJack said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1358332#Comment_1358332
Like it or not, that was 3-4 gens worth of repair time depending on spawns. Which means that PH was not focused on actually winning, just on being an arsehole. Which means you can punish it by doing gens and leaving them with their petty kill, or 2 petty kills if you get unlucky. Not saying it's not a problem... But it's really in the same camp as a facecamp from bubba.
not with proxy camping and even if they focus on gen rushing if even one person goes for the save the guy being saved is screwed and there will be a kill early in the game which means if the killer is good the survivors are pretty screwed especially if they didn't do the proper gens.
remember he isn't camping at the hook he will be proxy camping and a lot of players will go for the save because of that and with his power if he sees a save being done he can use the ranged attack to hit both survivors so unless BT is being used and even if it is he will still most likely get the survivor being saved.
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@immortalls96 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1359656#Comment_1359656
It's a team based game..if you dont work together you fail
O yea forgot about to mention this part, doesn't matter how well you play as a team if he just proxy camps and uses his power to hit both of you during the save.
Also this implies that unless you do swf your gunna fail against him if he does this since proper team play with solos is hard and most wont even try if they see a camper.
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@immortalls96 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1358328#Comment_1358328
It's very much a fair trade..killer cant use the meta perks as effectively and neither can survivors..plus..getting tormented is their own fault
omg no its not XD, you can replace those perks for others and the only perk there that makes a major difference in the match is pgtw which can be replaced for say ruin which works pretty well on him.
Also NO PERK in the game can be traded with how fast you can kill someone by tunneling because guess what? those perks are to help you slow the game or directly help you kill survivors but when your power already helps you by bypassing what stops you from killing survivors too quickly then no perk can compete with that not even the meta perks which there are only two of.
so if you want to argue get a better argument because the rate at which he kills survivors by tunneling WELL makes up for not being able to use two meta perks which can be replaced for perks more suited for his play style.
lastly unless you want to be an easy down you have to loop and PH can simply put a trail through the pallet so that argument is also pretty bad to use since you are basically saying to be an easy down.
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usually i would think survivors would be the ones wanting whatever broken thing they abuse to stay in the game but MY GOD there are so many people who want this broken play style to stay when it is probably one of the most toxic things a killer has been able to do since leather face came out.
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For those unaware this is how effective he is at tunneling
He gets someone in torment before or after their first hook which is easy unless that person wants to run away from every loop and after he hooks them he proxy camps, Then once they get saved and he downs them he sends them to a cage, finally once they get saved again he just kills them because for some dumb reason DS doesn't proc on cages. The only way this doesn't happen is if the survivor is saved instantly but so what? they are now on death hook.
I have literally seen a PH kill someone by proxy camping them and then tunneling them after they got unhooked and that killer killed them in under 2 minutes. Hell I tried it out to see if i could win a game like that and guess what? 2 gens done and I already killed half the survivors and the last two stopped trying to do gens.
You can effectively kill survivors by doing what i said and it' way better and faster then camping even tho it's basically the same thing in which you just going after one survivor. IT IS PURE BS.
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@Flyguy115 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1358328#Comment_1358328
funny because I havent had to tunnel while using him 🤔🤔 maybe just maybe.... the few people tunneling dont represent the majority of players? just like the few toxic survivors abusing DS dont represent the majority of survivors .... but that's just my thought
Good for you then, and if they did something about it then it shouldn't affect you. However there is a problem here that is more game impacting then abusing DS because for one it gets around DS and two it kills people too quickly. If you hook someone and then send them to a cage right after sure maybe the rescuer should have been more careful but getting downed and hooked right out of a cage even with DS is a problem especially since it allows you to do what i described before.
The problem here is how effective it is and how the only counter play is either avoiding getting into torment in case someone is doing this even if it makes you an easy down or you have to rely on your teammates not making a dumb save which might not be possible is the killer proxy camps.
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Also heres what tunnelers do for those unaware
they get the survivor in torment, hook them, find them right after being unhooked and send them to a cage, and lastly find them one more time and they are on death hook. I have literally played against a PH that did this and he killed someone in the first 2 minutes of the game since he was only focused on getting them.
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@dhealy646 said:
Sacrifice pop and bbq for ds and BT. Eh seems fair to me
not really, those perks slow the game and for tunnelers it's actually better to hook them first before using a cage since that way there is no chance of getting hit by ds so pgtw is still usable and bbq isn't useful for him since he lacks fast movement. Therefor the ability to quickly kill someone by tunneling while still having hooking perks be usable is not a fair trade for getting a survivor dead quickly.